Battle Of The Online Networks.

The PlayStation Network, WiiConnect 24, and Xbox Live are up against each other in a battle for next-gen online supremacy. And so it begins. With this new group of next generation hardware on the horizon comes some more advanced online features. Not just online-supported gameplay, mind you, but communities that have been specifically built to appeal to all gamers- hardcore and casual. The Xbox Live Arcade service, for instance, has evolved over the past year into a full-blown service, complete with downloads of demos and new games aplenty. But that doesn't mean that Sony and Nintendo don't have something up their sleeves...

[Capt CHAOS]

PS3 get their act together with software licensing issues that plague xbox 360.. Try sending in your xbox 360 if it's faulty... You xbox live arcade cames will no longer work for everyone in your family on their live accounts once you receive a new HD replacement..

[Boink]

when you are buying an arcade game, you are buying it for your account, otherwise people would just make their profile on their friends computers and nobody would pay for the game(which was happening)...jees

as far as the online thing goes, sony and nintendo have quite a hill to climb. Live has set quite a high bar and is now at least what is expected of both of them.

[ASSASSYN 36o]

I betyou don`t even have xbox-live. It is obvious you don`t know what your talking about.

[The Snake]

I just sent in my 360 for repairs and they specifically told me NOT to send in my HD with it, so I'd like to know where you make up, I mean aquire, your information.

[Capt CHAOS]

They should have had the sense to return the original if this was going to be a problem. Check the web, it's not an isolated issue.

boink, not sure how many Arcade games you own or how many members you have in your family. If you buy an arcade game, anyone in your family can play that game using their online account... Unless you happen to have had your hard-drive replaced by MS.

ASSASSYN 36o - I presume your comment wasn't address to me.

The Snake - Yeah, that's probably after MS realised they made a ditch of the DRM issue.. Read the web and check it out.

http://blogs.msdn.com/xboxt... is an example. Doesn't give you an answer. If your HD crashed, you're in big trouble if you've paid for alot of Xbox live content.

[ASSASSYN 36o]

Where is the reply at? Then I must be!

[Captain Tuttle]

That Sony takes online play very seriously. They seem to want to let everyone make video blogs. Sure, that's cool and all but what about gameplay? It really seems like Sony considers online play a sideshow that they really don't want to commit too and that's a shame.

[lalaland]

They will have to work hard to catch up with XBL. But to say they don't care about live gameplay is silly... 40 people playing Resistance deathmatch is ok... Most games will have live content. A few won't (among those the famous couple of games from devs that haven't gotten sufficient info from Sony). But theese are first gen launch games for a console that will last for 7-10 years, and in this generation online really matters. Sony will deliver. Wether it will be up to XBL standard is another matter...

[nambo]

Online game play was an afterthought for Sony. That’s evident by the lack of details coming forth about their online service and developers removing online game play because Sony hasn’t even told them any details…more of Sony’s smoke up your asses. And their comment about the PS3 lasting 7-10 years is a joke. Maybe as a Blu-Ray player (if the format wins), but not as a game machine. 5 years tops.

[TheMART]

Sony cannot give the specs to dev's and games already are dropping PS3 online support.

That are the signs on the wall of more delay/cancelling stuff of Sony. Mark my words. They need the coming years to come up on the premium level of XBL but it won't be soon

[bizzy12]

the king of online xbox and its going to get better once the ps3 drop they have something new to add in nov via dl update once you turn your sytem on and boot it up

[Marty8370]

Mart,same thing happened to Xbox launch games,it common practise.Some Wii games won't have online play till 2007.It not happening to all games.

[USMChardcharger]

if you are talking about the first xbox...live kicked off after the launch...so that was an off statment you made. if you were talking about the 360...well we know no games dropped live so...what are you talking about?

[frostbite06]

Live kicked off 1 year exactly after the xbox launch to be exact. Unreal Championship Baby!!

[USMChardcharger]

i think i would title this as The PlayStation Network and WiiConnect 24 get ready to battle Xbox Live.

[FreeMonk]

Just remember that the X360 is built around it's Online Live! service. It's going to take some time for Sony and Nintendo to topple that, if ever they do.

[omansteveo]

Playstaion 3 has online?

[DC RID3R]

online community that is LIVE!!!!

nintendo's smart. they put mics in the ds so when online you can talk through it. and hopefully with the wii, they can further expand their game lobby systems.

as for sony, they seem LOST, like they've ran up a cul-de-sac and there's no reverse.

Xbox LIVE is THE PLACE TO BE, professional gamers(young and old) on a professional system, in a professional setup!!!!!

BEAT THAT

[D R Fz]

Does it make sense for you to give more praise to a mic in a wii controller over the blu-ray in the ps3? Aboslutely no reason to do so because you have to figure which one will benefit people more in the next generation of games? Why does my wii remote have to come with a mic in it? Why don't i have the option? PS3 and Microsoft both give me an add-on for the mic and headset. And sure you say that there's a classic controller if i dont want the wii controller, but then again the ps3 has complete backward comptability if i dont want to play any blu-ray games but yet people (xbox fanboys) still hate on sony for including blu-ray. Doesn't make much sense does it. Either some people are just confused or they just want to hate one system for no absolute reason. The ps3 packs so many innovations that very well out do the other consoles but yet fanboys hate them. Yet if another company decides to have a built in mic in there controller, the same fanboys yell wii360. Confusion and Ignorance go hand-in-hand because they lack the Understanding of true Wisdom. Ps3 will prove itself in everyway.

[Mikey_Gee]

..or not worth the anual fee. you sir, are a retard.

The 360 is the first console I have used with live (didn't with the original xbox) and I must say ... "LIVE IS FRIGGEN AWSOME"

Not only for demo's, but also for streaming media from the BIG NEWS shows (ie E3, TGS)

Live is what makes game play LAST FOREVER.

Anyone who saYS XBL sucks either

A) Is retarded
B) has never used the service

-=

I look foward to my PS3, BUT ... to day live is junk is just stupid on ALL LEVELS.

Stop being a Flammer fanboy and join the ranks of "GAMERS"

Console makers should me nothing really, it is all abut the games. And for me it is also about the ONLINE SERVICE.

I will get my PS3 day one, but if I see the LIVE stuff if being ignored, well, chances are my PS3 will get sold.

Having live is like having buds and family over for beers and games ....... EVERY NIGHT ... no matter where in the world they are.

[crazymad59]

Now i've read up quite a bit on the ps3 and i was just recently wondering if my ps2 games that have the online ability will be able to be played online with my ps3 when i get it. i'm assuming so, but no one has really addressed this yet. any thoughts?

[Captain Tuttle]

No one's addressed the question of whether you can play PS3 games with the PS3, let alone PS2 games...

[Microsoft Master]

Xbox Live can not be beaten. Microsoft have had 4 years of experience creating and crafting its premium online service into the beauty it is today. I'm not saying Xbox Live is perfect, but how is Sony (primarily hardware-focused corporation)going to equal or better the giant M.

[lalaland]

But Sony is a software company too. All electronics today needs software. And more people employed at Sony spend their time developing games for consoles than at MS -- a lot more actually.

Wether MS XBL can be beaten; one thing history has repeatedly taught us is that the market leader eventually will be beaten. Wether that will be PS3 being beaten by X360 or XBL being beaten by the PS3 equivalent remains to be seen. I personally believe in the PS3 this generation.

[DC RID3R]

i'd like to be able to assure you bro that you can play ps2 games online with the ps3, but the thing is, does sony even know!?!?!?

just as an example, at the tgs show sony arrogantly stated that megadrive games will be available for d/l, when in fact sega hadn't even confirmed anything to them(sony) at all!!

so, let's just hope and pray.

Sony's online service HAS to be at least half the quality level of XBL to stand a hope in hell. anything less, then the ps3 for All it's technical power, will look like the most outdated machine out of the 3 (wii/360/ps3)

say-la-vie

[kewlkat007]

What Can I say? I'm Addicted to that simple game UNO. Xbox live is Numero "UNO" when it comes to online gaming so far. That's the main reason I got one.

Anyhow there seems to be lots of peeps with Cams on XBLIVE lately. Some can be annoying. Is there anyway you can choose not to view other people's cams. I've had to sit througha long game of UNO and watch some stupidity.

Anyhow "theORACLE07" is my Tag if anyone wanna friend me.

[Sphinx]

...I've gone through the same stuff with stupid people and their cams on UNO... although sometimes it can be quite entertaining!
Anyway, my Live tag is "UnmaskedHero".

[SDS Overfiend]

MS has to compete with nobody as far as online gaming go.The stats say it all, Live is the only thing Running for 5 years now with online game services for a home console Second to none. Over 3 Million are hook up and when GOW,Halo 3, COD and Shadowrun Drop it going to go up.
PS3 and Nintendo has way to go against each other.
Also i highly doubt alot of you fanboys never experienced live. Boink you do Know that That you can Play any arcade games on the same HDD with different accounts right?

KewlKat i wish i could do the same cause the cam is annoying.

[THAMMER1]

XBL has a larger userbase and public awareness. Most PS3 buyers really do not care about the online srvice at all. The only people who care are the PS3 fan boys who want PS3 to own the 360. XBL has set the standard with demos, trailors, convention coverage, artist of the month,video messaging and video chat, 4 prson chat, live chat over evry thing from games to movies, member/friends moifications, game/achivement comparison, and on and on.

[D R Fz]

You say Xbox Live is going to win because "XBL has a larger userbase and public awareness." yet if someone was to say that PS3 was going to win this nextgen battle because of sony's fanbase and public awareness you would bring up hell to say how userbase does not matter. The fact is, you cannot declare the success or failure of a something thats not out yet. After the release of the consoles, give both ps3 and wii a year, and after that, we will see how close the network race is.

[lalaland]

According to Sony the PS2 has a bigger online userbase than the X360 or XBox even. This makes sense considering the larger installed userbase, though XBL percentage wise undeniably has a larger community. However it does cancel out that argument.

[Gamer13]

Simple as that.

IM OUT

[HyperBear]

Xbox Live is the best. It has been around since 2001, and continues to match up with PC online gaming. It is the only customized, unified online source and online gaming platform out of the gaming console market today. Sure PlayStation Network and WiiConnect24 sound great, but by no means will they ever get the fanbase and the support and the online service as Xbox Live has done for the Xbox ever since 2001 till today with the Xbox 360. Xbox Live wins, hands down. And if any of you think Xbox Live sucks, then you have got to get out more and try different things.

[BIadestarX]

Don't expect an XBox live killer from Nintendo or Sony. If stop being a fanboy for 1 minute you can easily see that Sony or Nintendo are not primarily focused on online networks; this is why we don't hear much about it from Nintendo or Sony, this is why GC had no online presence and the PS2 was very poor. XBox live is being Microsoft priority thing even before the original xbox was made. The 360 was built around XBox live hence why it is what it is today. To Microsoft XBox live is more important than XBox brand itself thats why you see them shifting it to other platforms (LiveAnywhere). On the other hand Nintendo is primarily focusing on game play and the wiimote, Sony is focusing on Media Format (blu-ray) and performance (The Cell). Now what make you guys think the wii or the PS3 will have a better online network than XBox live when their primary focus it's somewhere else? Need prove? What do you know about their networks? Now, compare that with how much you know about the wiimote or blu-ray.

[sparco]

Brilliantly said Bladestar!

[RuffRyder]

XBL is king.

[Donkey Slayer]

;)

$4 (can be less if you find a deal/ebay) a month for live is well worth it.

Sony and Nintendo can have a good online program as well. Time will tell how they execute.

[ghostface]

Finally somebody with some sence. Its glade to here somebody that uses there head instead of blabbing nonsence about how the 360 will always be better, when nobody can predicted the future.

[Donkey Slayer]

If Sony and Nintendo can match (which would more than make me happy) or exceed that is great for gamers but for now MS had lead the way in that area.

[drewdrakes]

Microsoft will always be greater then or equal to any online service. Look at it this way, Sony and Nintendo are more hardware companies, whereas Microsoft is a software company. Microsoft most likely developed the tools Sony and Nintendo are using to create their online services, well I wouldnt be surprised. If Microsoft can come anywhere close to them with the hardware (which the have done very well), it all comes down to software, which is Microsofts realm, and where it seems to dominate without issue. Did you know...Anti-Virus tools are better on windows then any other operating system? So why do they get all the viruses? They are the market leader, thats why. If Apply were to take over, their operating system would get ripped apart by hackers, so I dont see why everyone thinks Microsoft is so bad.

[lalaland]

But now you are being completely ignorant.

Apple has an installed marketshare of about 2-4%, OSX been on the market for more than five years, is one of the most prestigous systems to hack/create viruses for -- yet ZERO virusses has been discovered for OSX. Linux/Unix are the primary platform for webservers, yet very few viruses for the respective platforms are registered. A lot more than 100.000 viruses are registered on the Windows platform.

There have been a few cases of Trojans for OSX, but none in the wild that actually worked.

The primary reason for Windows getting all the viruses isn't marketshare, but the design concept of Windows itself. Some will call it bad software, others will call it naive design from an offline era.

[DC RID3R]

sony and nintendo to bring some BIG ammunition to their respected online services, because that would bring good competition to the gaming public. Thing is though, even if either sony or nintendo were to ever surpass XBL ( i doubt it), MS would just deliver everything BIGGER and BETTER.

money talks, bullsh*t walks

[DJ]

and by all accounts it looks like they will, Microsoft is going to lose a lot of customers. As much as some like to justify the price of Xbox Live Gold, if Sony offers better services free of charge a lot of gamers are going to tell Microsoft to shove it and just stick with Sony's online network. In fact, i only know one Xbox owner who actually pays for live. The rest all use XBConnect.

Developers like Insomniac and Sega have been using the Playstation network for months, and Sony gives devs the option of either maintaining their own servers or using Sony's internal network. The only thing holding some devs right now is that they can't get all the dev kits that they need due to the whole laser diode issue. But that'll be alleviated pretty soon.

[BIadestarX]

XBox live will continue to be what it is no matter what Sony does. Most people using XBox live are not using it because they hate Sony; but simply because they like XBox live and the comunity. What you say proves it, "The rest all use XBConnect". Eventhough you and everyone has the option of using XBConenct for free; some people are still willing to pay for xbox live. Ever wonder why? for the same reason I wouldn't get internet dial-up eventhough some companies offer it for free (remember even when dial-up was the only thing arround some companies would offer free internet, but it wouldn't perform as good). I'm not saying that the PS3 network will be inferior, but you can't simply think that a free service has more value than something you pay for. And if that's the case; how long do you think M$ will charge for xbox live, if Sony has a service that's better and free?

[ronscrote]

I agree with bladestar. There will always be plenty of people willing to pay for a premium service. By paying for Xbox Live we can demand a quality service and be confident that Microsoft will continue to invest in their network as new members join; I for one wouldn't be so confident in Microsoft's commitment to the network if they had to foot the bill themselves.

With regard to tunnelling software like XBConnect. Not only do you miss out on all the great features like game demos, Live Arcade, messaging, video chat and gamer profile comparisons, but you are also restricted to only several players per game because of the lack of a centralized server to handle all of the network communications. In fact, of the many people I know that owned the original Xbox, only the gamers with modded consoles used XBConnect because they had no choice. IMO, for £35 a year, Xbox Live is a bargain and I for one would be happy to pay twice that (hope MS don't read this!).

Finally, I hope Sony does succeed in delivering a excellent online service with the PS3; after all, it's healthy competition which drives innovation and ultimately benefits us all.

[LuminousAphid]

I'll bet the other (PS3 and Wii) online networks will have more subscribers by next year, though, considering they're supposed to be free, right? Not that it will mean anything about how good they are... Live will probably still be ahead of both of them a year from now.

P.S. Before you flame me, I don't own a single Sony product, and I fully support X360 as of now. That's just my prediction considering some people are too cheap to pay $5/month for Live service.

[D R Fz]

He does have a point. But the question i have is how long will they stay free. The wii online browser is only free until spring 2007. Now how long will the sony network be free until they start charging their customers?

[ElementX]

Live! costs less for one year than a 360 game. I don't see why some people are complaining about the price. If you can't afford $50 for an entire year, you should find a new hobby. Better yet, buy all your games used online and use the money you saved to get Live!

[ronscrote]

LOL. Well said ElementX!

[testerg35]

DJ.. I thought they've already said that online gaming for Sony will cost the player some $$$ and that it will be diff price per game.

[ACE]

U really r very simle in the head arnt u?

y do u still persist in BS on this site ?

everything u have said in the past till now is BS and proved BS .

as for the article on line play is where its at , u pay £30 for a years and u get so much over the year . dont be suprised if sony start charging for downloding demos/play on line etc.

bottom line is MS hase the $$$$ to build a very good network and that is LIVE as we now it now.

[Deceased]

That Sony or Nintendo can come up with a service like live? If they did it will be a direct copy and I hope Microsoft sues the crap out of them. Whats going to be next the Playstation 360?

[ApocalypseShadow]

is a joke.you mean to tell me that in 5 years microsoft can only scrounge up 3 million players?just 1 million more than the dreamcast?that's a joke to me.it tells me the same people that were playing sega net, xbox live,socom series and madden,moved over to 360 xbox live.and in 1 year we still don't have all the players in basketball,soccer,football being real people that practice and play real games against other people.they talked about this during dreamcast days.but we call this next gen online.no it's shoot hundreds of people then get shot in the head myself.then respawn."but online is the future".how much of this crap has people been swallowing?most people will still be playing with their friends or family at home.or playing single player games.if gamers are playing any multiplayer games too long, that means they aren't buying other games.everquest and wow still dominate consoles of how many are playing.that's sad when consoles have more penetration into homes.and why would i want to talk into a ds online?it's like talking into a bowling ball.both are stupid.microsoft is the leader for online but i don't see them leading.live arcade should be made up of classic games you can play together.like when namco and nintendo teamed up to do pac man for gamecube.one person was pac man.the others were ghosts.you can do it for dig dug,burger time,rally x,mouse trap or any classic multiplayer game.i don't see that either.i expect better.and that's from nintendo and sony.and i bet sony will have more people playing and downloading once those systems are out there.but they need to not follow microsoft.also,for those who used the eyetoy.sony should give you the option to use it for surfing online.similar in a small way to minority report.but something beyond the same oh crappy 20th century ways.it's the 21 century already.expect more.did anyone see sony's gui with the pictures laid out in real time.how about grabbing the picture with your hand and viewing it or grabbing a movie file and pressing play with big icons.the buttons hide but when you wave your hand over a corner of the screen,the icons pop back up on screen.stuff like that.EXPECT MORE!

[Deceased]

You are a joke for saying that. I think 3 million users paying $50 bucks a year is actually alot. Not all people are into online gaming anyway (weird people, just like you shadowgamer). Live is awesome, it is for gaming and that is it, we don't need downloadable music or movies. That is what a PC and an MP3 player are for. The arcade has classic games plus new arcade games, and yes they added online multiplayer to the original doom. Quit hatin, as far as you know the PS3 will be worse, and I and most people expect it to be. I think nintendo's will be better than sony's, but not as good as live.

[OC_MurphysLaw]

Live is not perfect, certainly there is plenty about it I would change or add to it, etc. And that my friends is part of what makes it so perfect. It is a constantly evolving system. One where implementation of changes is done well and done with user feedback in the fore front and not a secondary thought.

Live makes gaming online easy and fun for console gamers. It goes beyond just gaming online, it gives you a sense of being a part of the 360 community even when you aren't playing online. Live took the best parts of the PC world of gaming and then created a unified entry point that is ULTRA user friendly. That is what online should be....user friendly to the point that anyone turning on their system will feel comfortable in minutes to use the interface. MS has done it right. I hope Sony and Nintendo will try and achieve the same.

[Shadow Flare]

This only applies IF sony produce a decent online system....

To illustrate:

There are 2 shopping Malls (Playstation Network & Xbox Live)

One shopping mall (PS Network) has all the shops you want to use and everything you need to have a good shopping experience (Buddies List, Unified gamertag, matchmaking etc.)

The other shopping mall provides the same great shopping experience and has everything you require for a good shopping experience (Buddies List, Unified gamertag, matchmaking etc.) But this mall has a cafe, and an old timey retro arcade section (Xbox Live Marketplace and Live Arcade)

So which shopping mall do you go to? Both provide everything you need for that great shopping experience, but one also provides a cafe and a 70's arcade machine.

Now consider that you can only enter the (Xbox Live) mall, IF you pay an annual subscription of $50.

Both malls provide what you really want and need, but one makes you pay $50 a year (Xbox Live) to use the mall and the other is free (Playstation Network)

So which mall are you gonna use?

[OC_MurphysLaw]

Really to be truthful none of us can say what will be better until we find out just how robust Sony's online experience is...and to be frank how well it actually works.

I don't want to bash it, I have not played on it nor have I seen it actually working (demo's don't count). Until its up and running live we really can't debate how good it is compared to Live. That said, I think the minimum standard Sony should be shooting for is Live kind of experience...or better.

[sjappie]

I'm gonna go to the mall where all the cool people who aren't too cheap to pay $5 a month for a premium service hang out. Guess I won't be seeing you.

[Optimus Prime]

yea i am gunna go to the mall where people dont cry about paying money for having a great experience on live. sorry to dissapoint you

[BigPimpin]

I need to know more about the PS3's online. They say that the online service is free but will some companies charge a monthly fee for their games? Can someone help me out on this issue? Oh, by the way, I want someone that's not a fanboy of a particular system, to answer my question. Thank you. :)

[OC_MurphysLaw]

First off...I am a 360 backer. BUT...I will be honest and say that nobody really knows yet. I think some games will charge via micro-transactions like GTHD to get cars and tracks. Others will charge a monthly fee like an Everquest (note they charge a monthly for Final Fantasy Online for the 360). And then there will be others that don't charge at all...like from what I know ROFM is said to be totally free online. There are still many unknowns about the online. I have heard rumors (and from what i know they are just that "rumors") that playing demos of games will cost you a "micro-transaction".

Bottom line...its really too early to tell how Sony's service will be. It could be fantastic...it could be horrible..or it could be serviceable and most won't have an issue with it in the long run.

Time will tell.

[Shadow Flare]

I think Dlacy covered it well. I'm a PS3 backer but i'll tell what i know

Ken Kuturagi expressed that online play will be free but extra downloadable content and features will cost via microtransactions.

However i believe there will only be a few games that will charge for monthly online usage. BUT i don't think it will too many at all. Reasons for saying that are because the same thing happened with ps2 online. It was completely free and i heard a few games charged for online play, but i personally never saw it. So they were very few.

The main way these companies are making their money is through the downloadable content. Gran Turismo HD for example charges via microtransactions for cars and tracks, but as far as i know online play is free. Kazanoru Yamuechi even said he wanted to help build the online community so i dont think he would charge monthly

Point in case, Ken Kuturagi's statement about free online play would be a lie if the majority of companies charged monthly for their online gaming. It didn't happen with ps2, and unlike ps2, game companies have another means of making money through online gaming (by microtransactions of downloadable content). So i wouldn't worry. 95% of all online gaming should be completely free to play online

[ChickeyCantor]

"Does it make sense for you to give more praise to a mic in a wii controller over the blu-ray in the ps3?"........Wii mote will have a speaker not a mic........idiot.
and Wii supports GC games, all of them unlike sony some cant be played on them.
and to think of it.......from nes till n64 will be playable.....

you are a sony Ps3 fan....it seems you know nothing about the other system......first do some research before you start saying some BS
blind fool

[JIN KAZAMA]

I am so glad I have gotten away from this site. All you guys are complete and utter LOSERS. I cant believe I got caught up in these dumbass forums about GAME CONSOLES!!!!

By the way, I love the fact that DC rider has only one speech balloon, thats freakin HILLARIOUS!!!

Who gives a damn if 360 is better than the PS3, or PS3 is better than the 360, or Wii is better than both. WHO FREAKIN cares, cuz I sure as hell dont. Get over it people. Its extremely played out.

[Donkey Slayer]

lol

[JIN KAZAMA]

That was a good one, but I hope you know what I meant.
Meaning, all the dumb back and forth meaningless debates about which is better. That is very very played out. No matter what the subject will be. It always turns into 360 vs. PS3.
Nobody is going to change their minds.

[ApocalypseShadow]

sony,microsoft and nintendo aren't perfect.but some gamers defend them like it is their mom.xbox live isn't perfect but i already got an idiot named 420 defending "HIS" system like microsoft actually cares about him.i said it.i'll say it again.live is still a joke if they can only muster up 1 million more than dreamcast.sony's online service for ps2 was crap too.none of these systems are delivering next gen online.and most of us have been playing online stuff since SEGA CHANNEL.same racing,same fps,same rpg type online play.crap,crap,crap.these companies want more people to play arcade games online and play online,but can't come up with a mega hit beyond pac man or tetris.that's sad.and i've been playing since it all started.so I EXPECT MORE than most.making the back end more easy to use still don't hide the same gameplay online.it's like madden giving you all these options on the back end,but still can't come up with a game better than nfl 2k5.2k5's presentation,commentating,anim ation and online leagues was better.i expect more from these companies.all gamers should if you're going to be PAYING THEM MONEY.

[PS3n360]

People always throw this free sony online crap around. Its free for the basic service just like xboxlive silver is free. If you want to play your gonna have to pay. I worked out that playing on live costs me around 16 cents a night which is about 5 cents an hour. if thats gonna break your bank i suggest you put down your controller and get a job.

[BigPimpin]

I'm not defending any console, but to say Xbox live is a joke is not right. The Xbox 360 has been out for almost a year and to have 3million people on Live in a short period is very good. I believe at the end of next year, Xbox live will have over double that if not more so to me that's impressive. I want to thank Dlacy13g and Shadow flare for their information about the PS3 online network. I wish you guys could of gave me more but its O.K. I guess I'll have to wait and see what Sony is planning.

[ApocalypseShadow]

how many are just linked to live with silver and are just downloading demos and patches?how many are fully paying for xbox live gaming? just adding them together doesn't cut it for me.is 1 million more than dreamcast a success being that microsoft has better support for software and more money than most nations?same with sony.is playing 40 in resistance (fps again) change the fact that sports games don't allow all players to be controlled by human players?and this is YEARS after dreamcast.most people now have broadband and i'm one of those people that waited to get broadband.but it's the same gameplay,same people cussing,throwing racial comments,driving in the opposite direction,stealing items,cheating with hacks.it's not everbody.i know this.but what happens is people cut right back down to their friends and family on their list.which is almost like playing offline.so when people talk about live being great and the things above are happening,but they say it's the best there is is wrong.i'll admit i'm glad microsoft is kicking sony in the crown jewels to get hot on online.but it shouldn't be the same online,because the same things will occur.i love games as entertainment.and i met a lot of good gamers.but i expect more for my money if i'm going to be paying for it.sony says free,but you will still be paying for something.same with nintendo.don't settle with these companies.expect more.

[BigPimpin]

Right now, you are comparing a next-gen system that's been out almost a year with a system that had a life of 3-4 years (my guess). You cannot compare them yet because one system is just starting and the other has come and gone. If you want to compare them, wait until the 360 has a life equal to the Dreamcast. When you sit back and look at 3million connected to live in less than a year with only 6million (I think or 5million)units sold worldwide, you can't say that's not impressive. Now, I do not know if that's combining the Gold and Silver memberships or just Gold that's something only microsoft knows. Dreamcast in it's 3-4 year life had only 2million altogether connected to its online service. I think when the 360 equals the life of the Dreamcast, I believe their will be over 15million connected to live, and out of that 15 million, there will be at least 8-10 million on Xbox live gold membership. So, like I said, you cannot compare them yet.

P.S. I do see your point though, Shadowgamer. I understand where you are coming from.

[TheMART]

It's over 7 Million already.

At the end of June: 5 million sold
That was in 7 months time.
So little over 700.000 a month world wide

3 months x 700k at least = 2.1 Million.

5 + 2.1 = 7.1 million users.
The 3 Million Live users were reached @ E3. Next E3 they expected 6 Million. I bet even more

[LuminousAphid]

if this stuff really interests you and you want to change it, you should get going to do something about it. If there's still a possibility at your present life situation to choose whatever you'd like to do, maybe you could be the guy at MS or Sony that thinks these things up. some of them sound kind of interesting, and i see your point that online hasn't gone anywhere different yet, so maybe there needs to be more people like you at the top who care to change it. go yoU!

[The Milkman]

Lol well Sony trying to snatch ideas I wouldnt be trying a whole lot new for a while until they finnally put there eyes on there own papers.

[gsquad]

Not to start something new but are you implying that MS/Xbox never “borrowed/stole” and idea from someone else?

[SDS Overfiend]

He Said:"is a joke.you mean to tell me that in 5 years microsoft can only scrounge up 3 million players?just 1 million more than the dreamcast?that's a joke to me.it tells me the same people that were playing sega net, xbox live,socom series and madden,moved over to 360 xbox live.and in 1 year we still don't have all the players in basketball,soccer,football being real people that practice and play real games against other people.they talked about this during dreamcast days.but we call this next gen online.no it's shoot hundreds of people then get shot in the head myself.then respawn."but online is the future".how much of this crap has people been swallowing?most people will still be playing with their friends or family at home.or playing single player games.if gamers are playing any multiplayer games too long, that means they aren't buying other games.everquest and wow still dominate consoles of how many are playing.that's sad when consoles have more penetration into homes.and why would i want to talk into a ds online?it's like talking into a bowling ball.both are stupid.microsoft is the leader for online but i don't see them leading.live arcade should be made up of classic games you can play together.like when namco and nintendo teamed up to do pac man for gamecube.one person was pac man.the others were ghosts.you can do it for dig dug,burger time,rally x,mouse trap or any classic multiplayer game.i don't see that either.i expect better.and that's from nintendo and sony.and i bet sony will have more people playing and downloading once those systems are out there.but they need to not follow microsoft.also,for those who used the eyetoy.sony should give you the option to use it for surfing online.similar in a small way to minority report.but something beyond the same oh crappy 20th century ways.it's the 21 century already.expect more.did anyone see sony's gui with the pictures laid out in real time.how about grabbing the picture with your hand and viewing it or grabbing a movie file and pressing play with big icons.the buttons hide but when you wave your hand over a corner of the screen,the icons pop back up on screen.stuff like that.EXPECT MORE!"

Can i Ask you a couple of Questions?

1)How Many People have a High Speed Connection?

2)Is'nt 3 Million People More than 100,000+ People?

3)At 50$ Per year and 3 Million Customers how much money was made to go to servers being mantained and Updated dearly with plenty of change left over?

4)Is Your TV Touch Screen is any of our TV's Touch screen to the Point where you can Be Like Minority report?

5)Are you Mad Cause you keep Getting killed in Halo or any shoot for that matter? (To Quote Shadowgamers Line:"it's shoot hundreds of people then get shot in the head myself.then respawn.")

To quote you again You said:"if gamers are playing any multiplayer games too long, that means they aren't buying other games."
Has to Be the Dumbest thing anyone said up here in a While. With any system if a Video game is able to do that, Then its a good game with replay value But what make you think People aren't snatching thing up because of one game?
I see your Whole Though Process has been badly messed up do to the bad press and Disappointing things sony has shown and Giving you. It's allright cause while your home Playing with yourself i'll be interacting With my 3 Million plus Community Members(Even though some are @ssholes.)
Think about this one brother i'm Quite Sure your Familar With Basball right? 3 out of 10 hits is Batting 300 Right? which is considered excellent i mean look at Jeter, So if 10 Million own 360's and 3 Million signed on i Guess that's Excellennt Right? I Thought so atleast being that PS2 has 160 million plus with only and about a Generous 1 Million that Tried SOE (Sniff,Sniff i smell...i smell PWNAGE!).

Xbox 360, Get Down Or Lay Down.

Btw Since the Mods felt the need to Ban Real Deal and Give me and Jiggajayp 2 Bubbles for Schooling Fanboys. I Will be Monitoring to see if you Answer your Questions.

Support me I need Bubbles Fellow Xbox Truth Spitters.

[Gamer13]

With the online system.

[Pinecone]

The bottom line is...the more people with a certain system the more succesful the online community will be. The wii will win because most people will know 3 or 4 people at least that have a wii and that gives them incentive to buy one themselves and join in on the fun. While the PS3 is better, its so expensive that it will be very hard to find people to play with.

[Marriot VP]

your logic seriously needs refining. The wii's demographic is anything but online community. Now I'm sure it'll be fine and functional but how many people are gonna have a Wii and online.

The nintendo consoles are going to be bought by nostalgic old school consumers and kids. Those are what games the Wii delivers and those are it's customers. Alot of people on this site are nostalgic fans and will buy one, just that simple.

The wii is going to do just as good as the gamecube because of this. Nintendo refuses to make an up-to-par console so it's not taken seriously. Of course people will say, "it's new-gen not next-gen," well of course and it's gimmic isn't going to sustain more than a couple years. Having to hold your arms out for more than a half an hour is torture, try it.

[ApocalypseShadow]

at first i wasn't going to respond because you can't reply back.so i want you to listen and learn something.

1.millions of people have high speed connection.in multiple countries.in many cities.they don't have xbox live.why?because there is not one MEGAHIT game on live or on the system.same with sony.i lived through when pac man was hot.it had cartoons,songs,clothes,dances, games,lunch boxes.you name it,it almost had it.same with the russian made tetris.a simple game had millions playing it.MILLIONS.the only game series that comes close is...no not halo.POKEMON!sell out in the millions within days.sometimes hours.there's no excuse.microsoft sold as many xboxs as the..wait for it...atari 2600.yes the atari 2600.which i still have.your telling me a mega company like microsoft can't sell more systems than the old atari at 24 million?these are facts.go to wikipedia.course i already knew this.and only 1 million more people online than dreamcast.yes i know this is stunning.it should be.also that's a dumb question.is 3 million more than 100,000?yeah that's dumb.not you.the question.and that should anwer question 2.

3.the fact that microsoft is charging WAY less per year than msn per month is great.still doesn't change the fact that online play hasn't changed in years.YEARS.

4.question four is so badly written that i'm not fully getting it.but i would like to see some type of new user interface.companies say it's because of money that we don't have electric cars and such.it is a lie.they want to milk things like oil until it's gone.

5.killing hundreds of people then getting shot in the head in a game must mean i got some skills.i've probally been playing games before you were born.i've beaten too many games to count and on hard settings with weak characters and cars.but i don't need to prove myself to anybody beacuse when you beat someone,they never quit.they keep asking"one more game""one more game"it gets tiring.if i lose i'll congradulate anyone.i have no ego.if i win i don't rub it in.it's called sportsmanship.

real deal is called TOP GAMER.maybe you will run into him.the same guy who had multiple accounts to support his own views.he's still on this site.i only need one account.i have no loyalty to anyone company.i love games first.

[ChickeyCantor]

sooooo
Wii will take GCN path?

now lets look @ PSP and DS.......i wonder why ppl buy DS.........they must be oldschool gamers right? and not only gamers........even non gamers got a DS........sooooooo what about the Wii?....o yeah i forgat PS3 is way better so Wii wont have a chance.....right? what?....PSP was also better then DS?......yep that must be the reason why DS sold globaly more then the PSP.

really we know by now you like the Ps3.....but thats you and not me or anyone els.....

[Marriot VP]

what??? your comparing the DS to a Console, are you retarded.

I'd play mario kart on a DS over anything PSP has because you don't expect or usually want anything elaborate on a mobile device. Also the DS is 120 and PSP 200 or 300 (i forget). Also the Wii is 250 and isn't a next gen console, therefore not taken seriously by most people. You can call it new-gen or whatever btu it's still a gimmic that won't last more than a couple years of sore arms.

Seriously if your gonna make an argument do it with the Wii and not a completely different gaming application.

[slugg]

I got Live early as a beta tester, and then bought Mechassault and Unreal Championship when the system went "Live!" It wasn't necessarily "more" fun than single player, but man was it addictive. Brought back to my the glory days of Quake 3 on P.C. Then, when Halo 2 came out, holy crap. I couldn't hardly STOP playing on Live to finish the single player game. Forza, Rainbow Six, etc., the number of awesome Live enabled games grew to the point of ridiculousness. Now, with the 360, games like Project Gotham 3, Perfect Dark, Call of Duty 2, etc. are all awesome, but playing co-op GRAW is THE defining experience of next-gen gaming for me, so far. I was telling a co-worker how fun it was, and he kept talking how great SOCOM was online. I went to his house to play, ended up watching him mostly, and the lag, glitching, clipping, etc. was TERRIBLE. I had him come play GRAW, and the NEXT DAY he traded in his PS2 for a 360. Online play IS very important to a lot of gamers, and Microsoft has done everything they promised with Live and more. I would rather pay $50 a year to play GRAW than play SOCOM for free. Period. Sony, free or not, has a long way to go to catch up with Xbox Live. Nintendo's Online service, in my opinion, will be mostly people downloading old classics like Kid Icarus to play by themselves...

[Dusk]

Your logic is seriously flawed.

The atari 2600 did not have any competition. It was the first 'real' home game system, so of course it sold well. How did Atari's next console do, it bombed. How can you possibly compare the Xbox sales to the Atari 2600? When the Xbox entered the market, it was a market dominated by Sony specifically, and Japanese consoles in general. Nintendo, Sega, and Sony. That's what gamers knew. That was the market.

Enter Microsoft, a software company. They not only managed to defy odds and actually release a successful console on their first attempt, but they leap-frogged Nintendo into 2nd place. You have to compare the markets at the time of each console's release. There was no market when Atari entered as Atari started the market. Microsoft also revolutionized console gaming by introducing Live, HDDs, and HD display. HDDs and HD display were bound to happen anyway, so LIVE is the real innovation.

If you don't see online play as the way of the future, especially for Western gaming, then you really have no idea what you're talking about. Microsoft is leading the charge with a great service, a service which the other consoles (especially Sony) are mimicking.

Contrary to what someone said, LIVE Arcade is not just retro games, there are also brand new games. Nintendo is following suit with the retro part and Sony hopes to follow with both. Either way, both companies are 'following' MS's lead.

A unified gaming platform is something that PC gamers have been striving for for years with attempts such as Gamespy and Xfire. Microsoft nailed it perfectly with the 360, including extremely popular features such as 'Achievements'. Sony is copying this idea as well.

You say 3 million LIVE subscribers as of May 06 isn't a big deal, but that's a 60% attach rate. What's 60% of 10 million? 20? 30? That's a lot of subscribers and no one knows how much of a gain in market share MS will get this time around. Everyone agrees, however, that it will be significantly larger than last generation. Many also think it will be roughly equal to Sony's. There are a few who even think it will be more. Point is, MS will sell more 360s than Xbox's, with a higher attach rate of LIVE.

With Microsoft's idea of 'LIVE Anywhere', gamers from PCs and 360s will be united. The idea is that the splintered PC gaming factions from Xfire, Gamespy, etc, will be added to LIVE's pool of gamers started on the 360. This is extremely innovative, simultaneously increasing the available gaming pool for online games, while allowing gamers to play each other cross-platform.

To brush off LIVE as a joke is a really pathetic statement. You can prefer one platform over the other, but to brush off great ideas and innovations for gaming just because you don't prefer the system is the wrong idea, as you are not really supporting gaming as a whole.

[ZeroAlarm]

You can't judge right now, but it's obvious that MS have a stubstantial advantage. XBL is at the moment the only throroughly dedicated online serivce, not only for games but for content and it's had that advantage for the previous generation and for a year in this next gen. Time will tell if it stays the top online service, but Sony and Nintendo will have to work hard to catch up. Nothing is impossbile though.

[ChickeyCantor]

all im saying is dont say stuff you dont know about. if DS can beat PSP why cant Wii beat the Ps3? you just want the PS3 to win becozz you are ps3 fanboy.

you dont know how most ppl think.....even i dont know that.....PS3 can win but why cant Wii win ? becozz it has lower specs?( get my point now why i start talking about the DS and PSP?)

if you just be open you wouldnt post such bullsh^t like 43.1 .

[Marriot VP]

HAHAHAHAHA, you think I'm a PS3 fanboy, brilliant

I had a n64, snes, ps2, xbox1, and now 360. The PS3 is way too expensive for me to even consider even if I had the money it's not worth it. Wow, you throw around the word fanboy a lot don't you.

When you can't beat my argument you have to resort to calling me a fanboy because that's all you can say to make yourself feel better. Also I'm not a 360 fanboy, it's just that the 360 was the perfect fit for my next gen console. Online multiplayer was center, than halo, than many other games like graw, gow, SC, etc.

Man get your act together

[ApocalypseShadow]

go ahead and use this last bubble.dusk,your logic is flawed.and your obiviously a fanboy trying to defend his system without reading any of my previous comments.which is typical of a fanboy.i ripped not only into microsoft,but sony and nintendo for failing in online.i'm also a multisystem gamer.i careless who wins.as long as i get great games from each company.you can read ALL my last posts.from everthing i've typed from past to present.it's consistent.but YOUR LOGIC about microsoft and atari:nintendo sold more nes,snes,n64 and almost gamecube than microsoft and that's with competition in the past.sega sold more genesis.or if you would like to use the present.sony sold more ps1s and ps2s.both over 100 million each.and you tell me the biggest software company in america scrounges up 24 million?WEAK.sony was new at it.where's your logic there?attach rate means nothing if you don't grow the market past the same gamers from xbox.sega had 2 million for sega net world wide.and sega was not as big as microsoft.they made great software,but had a hard time selling hardware.look at it this way:BILL GATES-BILLIONS OF DOLLARS-WINDOWS IN ALMOST EVERY COMPUTER-...3 million xbox live?that's weak.microsoft is trying to cheat by using pc to add to their numbers.sony doesn't use online pc games they run to add to ps2.nintendo wouldn't add it.

i know what microsoft added to the gaming scene.i was there.i launched the xbox at EB years ago.i launched 360 and had great sales as manager at game crazy.i probally been playing games before you were born.

not having a killer app for any system is weak to me.not having a killer app for online is weak to me.doesn't matter if it is microsoft or sony or nintendo.name ONE,ONE killer app for online for 360?that matches pac man,tetris,pokemon,even sonic.you can't.you'll say call of duty or halo or socom from ps2.fps games and combat all around.not everone plays fps games or combat.to hit mass market you have to bring out something everyone likes.microsoft hasn't.they might in the future.i don't know.but it's already been a year.we had(i have an xbox.)4 years of xbox.where's that killer game for online? if they keep using racing,shooting and more shooting,they will not hit critical mass.that's fact.world of warcraft has more people.phantasy star online had more people.sims probally has more people.everquest or ashrons call had more people.so i give microsoft credit for the hard drive,custom sound tracks,better looking games on my xbox than ps2,the online push.it still doesn't change the fact that online is still the same online we have been always playing.easier to get online.but the SAME online play.if you keep feeding someone the same hamburger but you know that hamburger can be a cheeseburger or double cheesburger,you will become tired of that hamburger.i expect more.if they want me to pay,i want more.all the talk of the past about online gaming evolution and they still haven't produced it with a better online service and a more powerful systems.if sony and nintendo don't grow the market,i'm going to rag on them too.right now sony is being sloppy about online.nintendo..well..it's nintendo.what do you expect.they really don't care THAT MUCH about online.but in the end i'll be playing each system.even if it has to be offline.or just with friends.and looky here.all that talk and not once did i attack you.the sign of a real gamer.agreeing to disagree.play games.

[Dusk]

I attacked your logic. I still do. When Nintendo and Sega sold the systems you listed, they were only competing with each other. Two systems on the market is less crowded that three, hence more sales for each of them. Take the same two companies and look at what they did after Sony took over the market. The Dreamcast failed and nearly took Sega under, while the Gamecube got outsold by Microsoft, a rookie in the console market. Why? Because the market was more crowded than it ever was. More crowded when the NES was on the market, more crowded when the Genesis was on the market. With more players fighting for the same pie, there's less to go around for everyone. Plus, when MS entered, Sony was the 800 pound gorrilla. In fact, the only company that's really threatening Sony's dominance, is Microsoft.

I'm a fan of all systems. I grew up playing Texas Instruments, Atari, and Wolfenstein 3D on the PC, so throwing your age around is meaningless, as is throwing the word fanboy at me. I never said one system is better than the other, I'm merely pointing out where I disagree with your agrument.

You say the Xbox's sales are meaningless and pathetic. However, I disagree. In light of today's crowded market and going up against household console names, like Nintendo, Sega, and especially the most dominant force in console history, Sony, for MS to not only manage to be the 2nd place console, but to actually threaten Sony as much as they are this generation is an enormous feat. No matter what console you prefer.

As for the initial topic, LIVE, I started gaming online with the PC. Something that was sorely lacking was a unified service that allowed me to track my friends, what games they are playing, integrated voice chat, message board etc. Some companies, like Gamespy and Xfire tried to offer just that. Both were good tries, but neither are even close to what LIVE offers. The Dreamcast tried as well, but seeing as the system went under it's a moot point. Therefore, the Xbox was the first successful system to really bring the online world to consoles, and actually outdo its PC roots.

Now you seem to just not like online altogether. That's fine. You have a right to your opinion. It's foolish, however, to dismiss something as influencial to the console world as LIVE, just because you don't like online gaming. As an example, I'm not a big fan of JRPGs. However, for me to completely dismiss them as a joke would be just as foolish, seeing as how they helped solidify Sony's market dominence. Also, there are still millions of gamers who love them and JRPGs will still sell consoles. Therefore, I have to appreciate their influence, but I don't have to play them if I don't want to.

Whether you like it or not, online gaming is where things are going, at least in the west, with portables being the big thing in Japan. Online distribution, always being connected, chats, video, ranking, online gaming, etc. LIVE, at this point, has set the bar and you have to at least give credit where credit is due.

[DJ]

ever since the PS2 network adaptor was released, which was in 2002. That's 4 years of work, which is almost as long as Microsoft has been working on Xbox Live. Yet a lot of people somehow get the odd idea that Sony has no experience in online gaming and that Microsoft has done the best job possible, which is far from the truth. Microsoft did well, but they also could've done a lot better. Thus, it's up to Sony to deliver what Microsoft couldn't in terms of online services.

[FordGTGuy]

or they would have atleast released something or come up with something new xbox live doesn't have.

[andy capps]

Oh they will, downloadable movies and or exclusive peaks at new movies (can anyone say Spiderman 3?). Sony has vast amounts of entertainment content that they can tap into and distribute online. They have music as well of course.

[ChickeyCantor]

never knew you are such a stupid moron .......no really, ok i missjudged you from being a fanboy....but evrytime someone is telling you something you start saying : "my argument"

yet you couldnt answer my question !
if DS can beat PSP why cant Wii beat Ps3?
its just a normal question.

and you just keep ignoring it, becozz you tell ppl who will and who wont buy the wii but infact you dont know sh^t...you talk allot of Sh^t. you always search for those little things.....i called you a fanboy and you suddenly thought my comment was all about how much a fanboy you are. before you go "my argument" first read your own cozz they are LAME.... and never really answer to my argument or others arguments.

do yourself a favor.......and just dont comment on mine. you are just SAD.

[Marriot VP]

"why the Wii couldn't beat the PS3?"

The wii isn't next gen, the wii is NOT held in high regard to anyone outside their fanbase, and the wii is overpriced at 250 for what it delivers. The wii is a childs console if you look at the forerunner and majority of games it has.

A console is built for power, gameplay, and serious games. A Handheld is built for Nintendo styled games and it's also half the cost of a PSP. The PSP is hardly practical for the average consumer just looking for trivial fun riding in a car, so DS has the clear advantage for less.

The problem is you can't compare the two. If the Wii could beat the PS3, than why couldn't the gamecube beat the PS2. The Wii offers the same games, worse graphics, and a questionable controller. It's not built for the long hall.

Okay and to finally answer your question the Wii could beat the PS3, but the only possible way that could happen is if Blu-ray fails immediately and the PS3 has major manufacturing problems. Which probably won't happen, and when people look at the two consoles they don't look at them on the same level at all, because their not.

Consoles are made for serious games and performance

Handhelds are made for temporary childish fun, it has no place hooked up to the big screen.

.

Of course anythings possible but you have to realize that the Wii = Gamecube + remote. Is the exact same just with a different interface, but with 5 year old hardware that won't stand the test of time.

[ChickeyCantor]

"The wii isn't next gen"

sure it is.
nextgen just means next generation nothing less.

"The wii is a childs console"
no its designed so evryone can play on it including kids.

" A console is built for power, gameplay, and serious games."

serious gaming? in what sick world you live? games are made for FUN nothing more.

"than why couldn't the gamecube beat the PS2"

and again you are proving my point AGAIN.
gamecube its hardware is stronger and yet it failed, and with failed i mean support with developers.
PSP is also stronger then DS and yet the PSP failed with the support of developers.
Ps3 can be strong and the wii weaker......but if you still cant see what im trying to tell you you must be a 3 year old lost in your own world.
despite the STRONG hardware the weaker always seem to work

Ps2 won against XBOX and GCN( and both they wur stronger then the Ps2)
DS won against PSP
so why isnt there a chance that wii might win?

"Consoles are made for serious games and performance"

to you its porn to others its fun.
gaming is never meant for serious gaming and it never was there for performance it was made so ppl could have fun with friends and family, heck even ALONE .....

there is no such thing as serious gaming, its fun gaming.