imtheman2013 (User)

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"Aspiring video games journalist. I like video games... A LOT."

Thoughts on GoW: Ascension Trophy, 'Bros Before Hos.'

imtheman2013 | 538d ago
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Before I start, let me point out that these are, very literally, my first thoughts on the topic. I am open to other points of view, and encourage them. So yeah, thanks and enjoy reading.

'Bros Before Hos.' The phrase often used to guilt a buddy into hanging in the man-cave, rather than going out to dinner with his girlfriend. To those who don't know, however, it is also the title of a Playstation 3 Trophy for God of War: Ascension. This particular trophy is awarded for brutally boot-stomping one of the Furies heads into a pulp. Apparently, it's one of the most graphic scenes in video games to-date, but with God of War, that's to be expected. GoW has always had this sense of grandeur, of epicness, of violence. But this one trophy, three simple words and a ding, awarded for committing an act of violence, pushed it over the edge for many people and loyal fans. I'm hear to share my immediate thoughts on the topic, and explain why, for me, it didn't cross the proverbial line.

Pure misogyny is probably the first phrase that comes to peoples' minds when they see this trophy or read about it. The simple, albeit brutal, act of bashing the Furies head in was completely transformed when the player saw the title of the trophy, into something nasty and evil. No longer were they simply killing a fictional beast, but they were murdering a woman. And not only were they murdering a woman, they were being rewarded for it with a ill-titled trophy. I'm sure a lot of people put the game down right then and there, just too appalled to continue.

What upsets me, however, isn't the gore for which the trophy is awarded, or even the title of the trophy. It makes me sick that so many people can be so hypocritical of what just happened when they got the trophy. Like all of the people playing it have never said anything that bashed someone in one way or another. It begs the question of how people would have reacted if that trophy would not have been in place. Would people still be appalled? Because obviously the tone changed immediately for people when they saw the title of the trophy, and not for the better. Would they still have ranted about how wrong the scene was? Getting a poorly titled trophy, seemingly, made everyone realize just how brutal and violent GoW can be. Why are they just now becoming concerned with what they see and do in a GoW title? In God of War 3, Kratos snaps Hera's neck like a twig and the Internet didn't explode over it. And finally, why is the phrase, 'Bros Before Hos,' cutting so deep, when most people have used it jokingly in regular conversation? It's a stretch, but maybe it's possible that Santa Monica Studios was also using it jokingly.

Now, I'm not condoning misogynistic behavior in the slightest. Woman are obviously equal to men and, often times, they surpass men. But I think people and gamers alike are taking this trophy a little too seriously. Yes, it is awarded right after the death of a woman. And yes it has a title that could be interpreted as woman-bashing and hateful. I think that gamers shouldn't take the news of this trophy as hurtful or wrongful, but simply as a game studio using a popular phrase as a joke. Now, if a person playing this game is upset with the content for which the trophy was given, I completely understand and they have the right to be upset (although, GoW is sort of know for violent content). But, honestly, if a gamer is only disgusted with the content after the trophy was awarded, then they should come down off their pedestal and be a little more reasonable. Everything is taken in context and people who are desperately looking for misogynistic behavior are, more than likely, going to find it.

Blastoise  +   538d ago
" But, honestly, if a gamer is only disgusted with the content after the trophy was awarded, then they should come down off their pedestal and be a little more reasonable"

Lol, yeah, I agree.

*Bashes the face of a woman into a bloody pulp*
Oh man! This game is so brutal! :D

*trophy pops up a moment later*
Now that's just sick!

Personally I imagine had I not read this blog or heard of the trophy, I'd have thought nothing of it and continued with the game. Maybe even would have gotten a slight laugh out of me. I don't know what that say's about me, maybe people view that as wrong, but that's probably what I'd do
KwietStorm  +   538d ago
We're desensitized. I agree with everything you said. Probably would have chuckled too.
zealot_x  +   537d ago
Derekvinyard13  +   538d ago
It depends on the person, for one it honestly pissed me off in DUKE NUKEM FOREVER when you hit the women in the cave level, he comes off as such a piece of shit when he does it, I agree with blastoise tho prolly would have just moved on.
majiebeast  +   538d ago
I thought women wanted to be treated equal so that also means getting ripped to shreds by Kratos lady´s.
MeatAbstract  +   538d ago
Is it true Santa Monica added the trophy in after feminists tried to force Santa Monica studio to remove female enemies from the game on the grounds of 'being sexist' and this was the developers way jokingly poking fun at them? I read a few user say this but couldn't find anywhere when Santa Monica have confirmed it.

Either way, I honestly don't see it as that big a-deal. It's tongue in cheek. What irked me more was Adam Sessler saying that the violence on a woman was 'borderline'. I don't get that. Why is it more shocking if its violence on a woman than on a man? Do we not live in a more equal time? Suddenly a big boss (that happens to be female) gets beaten to death and suddenly that's 'borderline' bad but crush Hercules' head until its mush, that's all gravy apparently.
imtheman2013  +   538d ago
The Adam Sessler review of this game is what inspired me to write this. Usually, I agree with most of what Sessler says, but the 'borderline' comment really got to me...

And I forgot about Hercules. Easily one of the most brutal deaths in any game. I agree with that 100%.
Ducky  +   538d ago
He also followed the 'borderline' comment by saying that it was still within the boundaries of the series.

His complaint wasn't really on the brutal nature of that scene, rather it was the developers throwing in a juvenile joke that soured the experience for him.
#3.2 (Edited 538d ago ) | Agree(1) | Disagree(1) | Report | Reply
imtheman2013  +   538d ago
Yes he did say that it barely stayed within the boundaries, but what are the boundaries? If games have set limits and boundaries, then all we end up with are politically correct pieces of a very boring pie.

And it bugs me that it affected his overall score... because it's really a subjective thing, when he's supposed to be as objective as possible with the review. Like, for me, that trophy isn't going to change how I look at the game at all. He has the right to gripe about the trophy, but to let it affect the review is going a little too far.
MeatAbstract  +   538d ago
I'm looking at it and he's saying 'it keeps it JUST inside a total context'. Why is it JUST inside though? It's obviously more violent to him because it's a woman. He does point out the lack of gender roles, which is true, but he's still saying that because it was a woman, it was barely acceptable to the series.

Think of some of the stuff you pull off in GoW 3, some of the violent stuff you do in that game and then consider those moments to what's being said here. They're ok though and aren't for discussion or are classed as 'borderline' and 'JUST inside a total context' because its men dying and that's ok. But women, WOAH, shcoking, thank god its fits in with the games dark nature otherwise I'd be over the borderline horrified'.

But yes, the trophy. We've seen these. GoW collection, climb the pillars of hades without falling. Trophy pops up 'Get me a beer, kid' pops up. It's not at all in the context of the game. It's a joke.

I do reckon this was one for the fans though, If you remember, SSM did say they were pulling back on the female violence because because of some feminist issues. Fans were annoyed at this as they felt outside parties were pressuring the studio to make changes to this game. This is almost a way of saying 'Hey, we didn't cave' and having a little joke.

Call it juvenile, call it silly or whatever. It's a silly joke. It's something that pops up on your screen for 3 seconds and disappears. I honestly don't see it as that big of an issue.
Ducky  +   538d ago
He did what any good reviewer should do. He pointed out the good and bad so that you, the viewer, can make up your own mind.
This is the part of a review that should be objective.

The final score is based on his own feelings about the game. To him, the trophy thing was a big deal and was 'irredeemably' bad.
This part is inherently subjective, so I don't get why you're expecting it to be objective.

As for the boundaries bit, that is set by the game itself. Seeing a character brutally rip an eyeball out of another living creature is within the boundaries of GoW, but would be out of place if SackBoy was doing it.

The brutality of the scene was within the boundaries of GoW, but the trophy felt out of place and ultimately hurt the tone of the game. Or at least, that's my interpretation of what Sessler was getting at.

I think you're reading too much into the "just" part. This isn't the first time that Kratos has attacked a female character. So it's not a Men vs Women violence thing.
#3.2.3 (Edited 538d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(0) | Report
imtheman2013  +   538d ago

I agree that at the beginning, he made valid points with his good bad criticisms. But some things in games are either objectively good, or objectively bad. Like smooth mechanics and technical performance.

Then he went on to label things that are good and bad in a compiled list. In that compiled list, he put those mechanical and technical things, but he also put in more subjective things that each player will interpret differently. Like the story and, in this case, trophy context.

A reviewer should attempt to tell the consumer the truth about the game, not just their feelings towards the game. And yes, I realize that the review needs some subjective thoughts in it, but they shouldn't reflect the final score given to the game. Because even though some games might be wonderful, they will still, unfairly, receive bad scores from critics that were just rubbed the wrong way by the game. When compared to a larger audience, that thing that turned the reviewer off to the game, might not have the same effect on the consumer.
And I completely see where you're coming from with the Sack Boy, GoW reference. That makes sense, I thought we were being general and talking about the gaming industry as a whole :P
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ZoyosJD  +   538d ago
The thing is, it's those words that set him off. He practically states that it's the trophy that crosses the line because everything before that was "borderline".

Sure, the trophy is juvinile in name, but if it takes a juvinile comment to make you realise how "horrific" the things you are virtually doing are, you need to take a look at what you consider to be too violent and reconsider your position on the subject as a whole.
jessupj  +   538d ago
Adam is just another mangina, aka white knight. A pussy whipped man that desperately needs female approval.

Mangina's annoying me even more than rabid feminists.

Apparently a woman's life is of much higher value than a man's.

"That woman was completely defenseless!", you say? You think a man is any more capable against Kratos? You think he feels any less pain? Of course not.

So, Adam, please stop throwing your gender under a bus and understand the simple concept that a man's life is just as equal as a woman's life.
Simon_Brezhnev  +   538d ago
I know right game sis for entertainment period. GOW isnt meant to be educational. He is a white knight and mad about a silly quote. All the damn quote means if he bothered to look it up is "don't stab any friend in the back over a woman."

Adam probably hates rap music with a passion.
TheComedian  +   538d ago
The social justice morons should just zip it. They cry misogyni and yadayadayada with the slightest provocation.
Would they have the same reaction if the roles where switched? What if Kratos was Kratina bashing a males head and the trophy was called "GIRL POWER"?
DO NOT try to tell me they would not be ok because we've seen their pure misandry,double standards,delusion and downright preteniousness with the new Tomb Raider.
Trophy/Achievement Widowmaker-kill 40 enemies with the shotgun...absolute silence from them.
So in short get your filthy power mongering hands of the video gaming scene. We do not care about your toxic ideology we do not want your toxic ideology we do not want to be shamed for our favourite past because you cannot get your heads out of your butts.
maniacmayhem  +   537d ago
It's funny that out of the whole series THIS gets the attention. Not the very many times Kratos goes b@lls d%%p on a woman/women in every game.
ZeroX9876  +   536d ago
so, by a lot of people standards, we`ve been killing male in video games time after time, but now that it`s a woman, in a video game by the way, it`s WAY different?

I like the line about if the trophy wasn`t there, would it be the same?

It`s resident evil 5 all over again guys!

I think we had enough of GTA to let this one pass.
Garuda  +   536d ago
All Hail Lord Kratos The GOD OF WAR!! When its violence against men its right and yet when its violence against women its wrong. In GOW 3 Kratos rips Helios' head off and yet no one complains? If u complain about women violence on video games then logically the same should apply to violence against men and therefore the would be no GOW. Kratos is violent to everyone and everything he doesn't like irrespective of its gender so let's stop acting like he leaves the males alone and preys on the women because that ladies and gentlemen would not be true
ShaunCameron  +   536d ago
I hate to break it to the author but women are NOT equal to men. Never was. Never have been and never will be. It's a biological reality. A biological reality that has been distorted in the name of equality by insecure women and opportunistic politicians both liberal and conservative alike desperate for power. The truth is you can't make equal what wasn't equal to begin with. You can't empower the weak by handicapping the strong.

With that said, the only people I think have a problem with the phrase "Bros Before Hos" are those lacking ethical backbone and don't stand for anything. I see it as Kratos refusing to compromise his ethics for riches. In other words, Kratos refusing to throw his own brothers under the bus just for the sake of female attention.
cpayne93  +   535d ago
I think that in terms of physical strength, it is undeniable that men are superior. A man will gain muscle much more quickly than a women, and it's how nature designed him, the man is designed by nature to be the primary protector of the family.

In terms of intelligence, I think each gender has it's own strengths and weaknesses. I think I heard that men are better at accomplishing one goal or project, while women are better at multitasking. There are other differences of course.

I think people need to stop acting like men and women are completely equal. They are equal in rights and dignity, but in just about every species nature gives different genders slightly different traits, it's just how they balance each other.

But I disagree when you say they never will be. Can't really predict what curves evolution may throw. Women may be physically stronger one day.

I don't know what you're talking about with Kratos though...ethics? Kratos has those? Did you read what you had to do to get the trophy?
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