cgoodno (User)

  • Admin
  • 10 bubbles
  • 8 in CRank
  • Score: 304820
"We just can't have nice things."

Operation Boycott Sony? Really?

cgoodno | 1240d ago
User blog

So, found this on the the, supposed, new blog of our favorite hacker, GeoHot.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-W...

I wanted to address a few things here, specifically each of the "Why?" items. So, without much fanfare, here we go.

===

Quoted: "Sony continually removes features from the Playstation 3 hardware that were a major ADVERTISED selling point for the system. This is a form of false advertisement and it is ILLEGAL."

Response: The _only_ feature Sony has ever removed from an advertised item is OtherOS, something they confirmed as being used than not even close to one half the percent of people and done because hackers found a way to use it to hack the software.

Removal of BC, extra USB ports, and similar in later models wasn't illegal as those models were updates and were not advertised as having those features.

So, the statement of "continually removes" is completely false. I will grant that there was the removal of OtherOS, but it wasn't a focus of advertising, used by even half a percent of the current users, and was removed because of the attempt for users to obtain data that is reliant on ensuring the security of every PS3 out there.

===

Quotes: "Sony places customer's security at risk by allowing credit card information to be transmitted over the internet in plain text every time someone signs into the Playstation network."

Response: Actually, all they know is that the information is stored in plain text. They still have not been able to detect how it is sent. It's far from unusual to store items in a text format on the client's end and then send it as a package of bits via the Internet.

While I agree it could be more secure, the information being sent isn't insecure. It's pointless information that does nothing to identify the person on the account or anything worthwhile that could be used to collect and use the CC data for fraudulent purposes.

===

Quoted: "Sony permanently bans Playstation 3 hardware from accessing the PlayStation Network for suspected (not proven) custom firmware."

Response: Actually, they can confirm exactly if you are running CFW or not. From comparing the local XML/text files (such as the ToS text file), to checking the digital signatures of installed software to make sure it's not running any that aren't found on their end, to even just detecting if the account has enabled previously disabled features, such as OtherOS. No one has been banned that hasn't run CFW. It's very easy to tell who is running CFW and who isn't, since if you're not, everything would match up exactly with what the latest FW put out. Any changes to this requires that you had installed or otherwise hacked your PS3.

As far as the leap that they are taking in saying that "hackers found a way to change the hardware id of the Playstation 3 hardware" in order to ban an honest user. Total pablum and a pipe dream. The exact same thing could have been done with the 360 by now since Microsoft utilizes the exact same method of banning accounts/consoles. The reality is that knowing that information is sent isn't the same as being able to properly spoof the necessary information being sent; which includes decrypting it, generating a method for creating new valid keys, and then re-encrypting the data to be sent; and then sending it to Sony via a PSN connection without it being recognized as spoofed data by their Intrusion Detection/Prevention Systems. So far, this is just fear mongering. An attempt to get legitimate PS3 users scared and angry at Sony by saying it's possible without even attempting it.

===

Quoted: "Sony secretly sends micro updates to the Playstation 3 firmware without the user's knowledge anytime a user connects to the internet in order to prevent the installing of customer firmware."

Response: Completely false. Like all things, Sony validates the access a console and account has upon each attempt to connect to PSN and updates any cached data used for validating this information on the PS3. This is the exact same as N4G validating you being logged in and updating a cookie in your temporary internet files to mark your last visit and that you are still logged in.

In order to install any new code onto your system, they must halt you from using the OS. The newly compiled code cannot just be placed on your system without having to restart the OS as well. This isn't taking a PHP or similar page and overwriting the new one. The C++ code that is used on the PS3 requires that it be compiled and that the necessary configuration and relative files be compiled with it and updated at once.

Again, more fear mongering to get legitimate users worried and angry at Sony without any substance to it.

===

Quoted: "Jailbreaking or custom firmware are legal and completely within your rights to use."

Response: Jailbreaking a phone is completely legal if used for custom programs and opening them up to use with different providers; jailbreaking is not legal for illegally obtaining the IP of others or adjusting any software that isn't related to allowing custom programs or unlocking the phone for use with a different service provider.

What is not legal at this time is jailbreaking a console nor taking Sony code (firmware) and modifying it as your own custom firmware. The reason behind this is that the CFW modifications made aren't illegal because they can run homebrew, they're illegal because they allow a person to bypass the security protocols and limitations set by Sony with the PSN code, which is illegal to modify.

Unlike phones, the firmware for the PS3 and similar consoles contains specific data for processing sensitive data and purchases on the provided network (XBL/PSN). The modification of this code is akin to customizing a credit card processing machine to send the person's personal information to a source not specified for the machine's design.

Furthermore, this isn't about allowing people to run homebrew, it's about A) the sharing of sensivite and secure information that is integral to Sony's ability to provide a secure environment for their business and therefore each of their users (metldr key data); and B) the modification of Sony IP, specifically the firmware code which also acts as the framework for PSN.

===

Conclusion: I'm not one to stop someone from boycotting. Go right at it, it's your right. But this stuff kind of pisses me off only because it's riddled with a lot of misinformation. It's fear mongering at its worst, knowing that the general public doesn't know enough to question what they're being told and immediately worrying if Sony is keeping their purchase and personal information safe.

The people who are spreading this information are liars or some of the most ignorant people I've yet to see on the Internet. I find it hard to believe that they don't know that what they are saying is false. I do know that they are, unfortunately, getting the attention they want, and this will only force Sony to have to work harder to fight against the poor publicity.

All of this because Sony needs to protect their business from people who didn't care how their actions would affect them or the legitimate customers of their hardware. And as gamers, we tell people every day to support the people who make the games we like. Looking at 2011 and what Sony is doing for the gamers, I wonder where people's heads are at the moment.

« 1 2 »
Tachyon_Nova  +   1240d ago
You owned him 5 times in a row
#1 (Edited 1240d ago ) | Agree(31) | Disagree(3) | Report | Reply
GenoZStriker  +   1239d ago
Well written. I was also reading through it the whole Boycott Sony thing and my reactions were somewhat the same as yours. GeoHotz might be extremely intelligent to be able to hack the iPhone and the PS3 but sometimes he can be just as retarded and spur bullshit like average N4G member. Like most online petitions, this will not work.
#2 (Edited 1239d ago ) | Agree(10) | Disagree(1) | Report | Reply
sdtarm  +   1239d ago
is this guy for real??

"I Dont Support Piracy"

"I didnt know Modern Warfare Would get hacked, its not my fault BUT GO SONY BAN THOSE HACKERS"

so what happens when somebody else manage to integrate any piracy gadget into CFW? Go Sony ban those Pirates?

GTFO GEOHOT!
paradiselost93  +   1239d ago
Well said!
Octo1  +   1239d ago
Was it not already noted that the credit card security risk was only in fact an issue IF you were using a PS3 with a CFW?
Awesome read cgodno
GenoZStriker  +   1239d ago
Yes, but he seems to purposely ignore that fact to use it as an excuse.
Bloodyghost  +   1239d ago
Geohot is a hot head.

He is showing weakness. I once thought this person was skilled and very good at his profession. But after this boycott, I am done.

Xbots will call the boycott something worthy just because they hate Sony and the PS3.

Geohot showed weakness with his rap video which was entertaining because he is goof. Now he is just showing more of it.

If he has ANY kind of real sense then he would cut the shit and go back to what he does best.
Rage_S90  +   1239d ago
good read
darkpower  +   1239d ago
I think that while you make good points, you might be missing some of the points.

The OtherOS thing might've been the only real feature they've removed and was trivial to complain about, the cover story about the security when we all KNEW the real reason (to free up PS3 memory for developers) was lame. The fact that the .txt file is not encrypted in the first place doesn't sit right with me. We can claim all day that only someone with CFW could have access, but I have a hard time believing that. If Sony really can see what I'm doing, even PMs, then I would sleep easier knowing that such a file was encrypted like Amazon would do.

The suspected stuff IS going on. There have been reports of what are called rollbacks, where people are banned for ever running CFW on their consoles during their PS3 lifetime, regardless of if they did at the time they got banned.

Finally, we all get that the iPhone and the PS3 are two different machines that serve two different purposes. Thing is, everything we're scared of with the PS3 jailbreak was things we could've been scared of with the iPhone break. Did that give hackers any unneeded access? We won't ever know because it never needed to get that far (because the whole AT&T exclusivity was under fire anyway, so most people were on Geohot's side enough to not care about any dangers. The fact that he mentioned that he wanted to create a way to not allow the CFW to be used for the cheating and the seeing of personal info when Sony sued him rings dividends (if he was going to, then why keep him from doing that? Let him do that and prove that he means what he says!).

I think the hatred for him now resides because of the key thing (just a bit more extreme and it's up in the air as to whether he should've gone that far) and the normal way that most fanboys on N4G act (you can be angry at him without wishing physical harm on him). I think Sony's issue is that he hacked the PS3 at all and revealed a hole that Sony knew about but didn't want to have to fix (seriously, if they really WERE that concerned about the security of the PS3, they would've fixed this hole a while back and that file would've been encrypted by now).

That I think his intentions are sincere (though they'll always be people who will try to use anything to do something bad). While there's no outstanding homebrew app yet, the question is if Sony should allow you to be able to play and run such apps on your PS3. While I think Sony should ban the people who cheat with it and pirate PS3 games with it, I think that would be an open and shut case if Sony would just stop there. But it does seem as though Sony is pulling the Apple here and saying that if it's not licensed or made by Sony, Sony doesn't want you using it or playing it on your PS3, period. THAT'S the part that Geo is claiming and why I can't exactly support Sony in this. It seems more of Sony trying to keep the system completely under their control than them worried about cheaters.
cgoodno  +   1239d ago
I addressed this above, but there are technical aspects here that you don't understand.

To address the text file storing of data:

1. It's not data that gives anyone access to the user's personal information (no names, account names, login credentials, address,etc.) or enough credit card information to do anything with it (full CC#, expiry date, security code, zip code, etc.).

2. Storing data on the the console in plain text (we call it "clear text") does not mean that the information is at all sent across the Web but could mean it is merely being used to fill in quick validation form elements, similar to saving your username and password on a site. This data isn't stored on the Web, it's in a file on your PC.. and, btw, it is stored as plain text on your PC.

3. If the data _is_ sent over the Web, we know it is already encrypted prior to being sent since the hackers currently are unable to detect what is sent to Sony. They know data is being sent, but they don't know what. If they did, then they would have already have done all the stuff they have mentioned as them being capable to do.

***Thing is, everything we're scared of with the PS3 jailbreak was things we could've been scared of with the iPhone break.***

Incorrect. Editing one's service provider did not remove Apple's ability to ban an iPhone from their iTunes service and updates. Meaning, the massive difference here is that CFW enables users to completely bypass Sony's ability to manage the PSN. As iOS and the iTunes store application are completely different, it's very different here. PSN is a part of the core XMB OS concepts, though, and CFW has been proven to allow people illegal access to the PSN even though it is not within the requirements specified by Sony, which is fully within the company's rights to restrict.
darkpower  +   1239d ago
But you never got into the core of what I'm trying to say, which is if it's right for Sony to go after everyone that ever uses CFW, or if they should just go after those that use CFW for the cheating and the pirating? If they never use CFW for any of the latter purposes but still have it, should they be deemed "guilty until proven innocent" because they have the possibility of committing such acts? Should there be a way that we can have our cake and eat it, too? I think Geohot was looking at the way when Sony sued him and confiscated his stuff.

The issue with your post is that if they don't know that it's encrypted when it is sent to Sony, then how would YOU know that it IS? It sounds like you're saying that you know something about this file that none of us don't yet. And plus, why is it even in a .txt file to begin with? It should've been encrypted from the start. Why have that risk there to begin with unless Sony thought no one would find out? Basically put, I would rest easier knowing that Sony encrypted that file to begin with. They know it's there, they know that people can get to it, but yet, the only thing that they can think of to rectify the issue is to sue whoever actually DOES go into that data? Are you kidding me?

Plus, if the hackers are only able to get into their own data, but anyone else's data on any other PS3, when sent through the interwebs, IS encrypted, then what danger is there if they would not able to see anyone else's .txt file? I don't understand how the hackers can do anything to you if all they have is access to where their OWN CC INFO IS STORED (which is what the stories were about)?! Is there something ELSE they can do to be able to get into another's PS3 files that we haven't heard about yet?

Yeah, I think we're not looking at this from a clear mind here.
#8.1.1 (Edited 1239d ago ) | Agree(1) | Disagree(12) | Report
cgoodno  +   1239d ago
***which is if it's right for Sony to go after everyone that ever uses CFW***

I did, you're just not reading it.

From above, and what has been said many times: "Meaning, the massive difference here is that CFW enables users to completely bypass Sony's ability to manage the PSN."

CFW is a massive security issue on any user that utilizes it. As it is Sony's business and infrastructure, they have all the right to ban your console from using PSN if you choose to use CFW.

Note that banning a console or account doesn't mean the user can't continue to use CFW. Just means they can't use PSN. So, as long as CFW is always updated, the user can still play single-player games. But, Sony has every right to protect the PSN considering the level of security needed to ensure that a person's information and the transactions they make are done with a level of security that ensures that their information won't be illegally obtained and used.

***The issue with your post is that if they don't know that it's encrypted when it is sent to Sony, then how would YOU know that it IS?***

Because the hackers have told us it was encrypted and they haven't figured out what exactly is being sent. Like anyone else, you can see what is being sent from your system with the right program. In using this, the hackers have confirmed that data is being sent out, but since they can't "read" the data, it means it's encrypted.

*** I don't understand how the hackers can do anything to you if all they have is access to where their OWN CC INFO IS STORED (which is what the stories were about)?!***

The issue here is in someone distributing CFW that has extra code in it that would send this sort of data to a hacker's database without the user knowing. Meaning, someone could use CFW for collecting any information about your system and everything you do.

This is why this is only an issue if you use CFW, because there is nothing on the standard FW that would allow someone to obtain this information. Only way it is possible is if you install CFW that had a trojan on it to collect this information.

===

Conclusion: Not to be rude, but you seem extremely ignorant about technology in general. I know you say that there are "problems" with my post, but the problem here is that you don't understand how sensitive data is sent via the Web on a daily basis as well as what people can do with CFW to obtain someone's personal information.

I'm not sure anything I say here can truly explain to you how it works since you have yet to understand the difference between sending plain text data and encrypted data as well as how you can tell data is encrypted. On top of that, you don't understand that CFW is much like many of the custom cracks for video games, wherein people can include trojans with the purpose of installing them on a user's computer without them knowing and collecting personal data.
#8.1.2 (Edited 1239d ago ) | Agree(8) | Disagree(0) | Report
darkpower  +   1239d ago
Assuming you're right, and you make it sound like we've had a massive outbreak of people who have been hacked because of this thing (which we haven't heard of yet, in case anyone's keeping score), then why hasn't Sony came out with any sort of fix to plug the hole in the first place? See, this is what I'm NOT getting! Sony KNOWS the hole is there, they "KNOW" people are using it online, etc. But yet, there have been no hotfixes that would prevent anyone who is using CFW at the time of them running their PS3 from going online while letting them continue their online ways when they DON'T use it. Why is Sony not fixing the holes that allow us to do these things in the first place? Do they really think suing anyone that exposed that this hole EXISTED in the first damn place is going to prevent ANYTHING? Where's the logic in that? It wasn't the hackers' fault that the hole existed, yet we seem to be blaming someone for something that Sony should've done something about rather than suing everyone in sight if they just brought up that the damn things existed. Like I said, sounds like to me Sony just wanted to be lazy and didn't want to have to worry about fixing it...either that or they are looking at this as a cash grab opportunity.

Now, assuming it's NOT what you said initially, and that other people are doing something evil to something that was already created in the CFW, then why doesn't Sony work with Geohot to see how they can capitalize on a given opportunity to where additional freedoms can be given to a user without the detrimental effect that would be given to either Sony or the user if it were implemented. Give a compromise or something. Again, should it be legal to jailbreak the PS3 period?

And why are we, again, using the exact same arguments? We're assuming that everyone is a cheat, pirate, whatever, if they even USE the damn thing? Why? How do you know what they use it for, and why they use it? I'm glad we're just assuming why people do things, like people assume that because I'm not for Sony in this suit that I'm all for people cheating in games, which ignorance is bliss. 26 years I've been playing and following the game industry, and for the life of me, I've never been questioned about me being a gamer as much as I have been with this one issue. I've never had that happen. Why? All my PS3 games I have bought, and I would continue to buy. I don't have to prove my support to the games industry to anyone because I've done that quite well in the 26 years I've been a gamer (and I'm 28, so please STFU if you think for a second I'm not). And yet, here I am, saying that I'm sympathizing with both parties here, because they are both right and both have some points that I think are correct. You SHOULDN'T be able to cheat on the PS3, but you SHOULD be able to play HB games on it, and Sony should not be the control hounds.

Disagree with me if you want (at least you're backing them up...more than what I've seen out of SOME people on N4G...seriously, mods, clean up this damn site of the comments that want physical harm done to Geohot...those are not necessary, PERIOD!), but I stand by my opinions.
jadenkorri  +   1239d ago
@ darkpower
ok, so if geohot hacked a bank website, didn't steal anything, but posted the flaw/glitch on the internet. Then someone uses that information to steal/drain peoples account before the bank could fix the flaw/glitch. SO who's fault is it. Blames gotta go somewhere, and do you honestly believe that a corporation of any kind gonna hire someone who has cost them millions. No, there gonna sue and get there money back.
cgoodno  +   1238d ago
***then why hasn't Sony came out with any sort of fix to plug the hole in the first place?***

Because there is no fix. Much like the 360, the system is blown wide open. The _only_ thing Sony can do is ban those who use CFW, take people to court for violating their IP, and change the metldr key info in future systems produced. There is absolutely nothing Sony can do to prevent people from using CFW right now.

There is absolutely nothing Sony can do to prevent anyone from using CFW other than the measure they have taken so far. Nothing.

This is why the actions they take now are so important to the security of legit users. If they don't ban consoles, someone will eventually find a way to send a PM to a regular user with an application file that will install and copy their personal information.

***then why doesn't Sony work with Geohot to see how they can capitalize on a given opportunity to where additional freedoms can be given to a user****

Because we don't live in an ideal world. As I've said before, you give a pirate an inch, they'll take the circumference of the world. To allow people to create custom code and distribute it that does not go through Sony's credentialing process is tantamount to giving not only pirates the ability to do whatever they want but also to enabling people to distribute harmful code.

***We're assuming that everyone is a cheat, pirate, whatever, if they even USE the damn thing?***

Because there's no way to detect how you use the code, but we know there are people who will use it to pirate, cheat, and/or adversely affect how others use their PS3.

Sony isn't stopping people from using CFW, they're stopping people who use CFW from connecting to the PSN. That is all. Banning a console is a preventive measure to maintain the security of "legit" users, which is what Sony is supposed to be doing.

***Why? How do you know what they use it for, and why they use it?***

It doesn't matter how they use it. It specifically states in the ToS/EULA that a user may only connect to the PSN through Sony-controlled code (whether FW on the PS3, iPhone app, or Web sites). Using CFW is not Sony-controlled code.

***I'm glad we're just assuming why people do things,***

Where in any of my statements have I called any of these "hackers" a pirate or cheater? You seem to be acting like, while responding to my specific comments, that I think everyone is pirating or cheating. I know they're not, but they are still using modified Sony code that is impossible for Sony to detect if it is being just used for homebrew or could be used for piracy or worse.

As a paying customer, I except Sony to protect me when I use their system and software to access my purchases and play online. In banning those accounts/consoles that have used CFW, they are doing just that.

===

You asked earlier why Sony wouldn't just work with GeoHot and others to allow homebrew? They already do with indie development kits. If GeoHot just wanted to code some code for distribution on the PS3, he would have bought one for $1k and created legit code that wouldn't be used for piracy and would have gone through Sony certification. That's how Sony currently works with legitimate programming teams.
EskiJoe  +   1238d ago
Was about to write a response to darkpower... but seems like cgoodno already has that under control.

The hole cannot be fixed =(

And well said cgoodno!
Ah it eases my mind that there are people who are aware of the situation with sony/geohot.
NeloAnjelo  +   1237d ago
@darkpower

There is no fix once the private key has been uncovered. Hackers can write codes and software that the PS3 will think is signed by Sony. That's why this hack is so significant and could potentially be crippling to Sony.

The only true fix is new Hardware and all the other games released before this would not work on a system with a new key, because they were previouly signed with the now hacked key. Simply put nrew hardware with a new private key would not recognise previous software.
#8.2 (Edited 1237d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
audiojet  +   1239d ago
A very good read that spells out the whole situation without bias.
blackburn5  +   1239d ago
@ darkpower if he was so sincere how come he tried to use the Other OS to hack the system, stole the keys from Sony, advertised the flaw, tried to exploit Sony for a job, sent the keys to everyone and now continues to act like an attention whore with childish raps and begging for money? People like him are smart with technology but have zero common sense. He and his friends could have gone to Sony showed them the flaw and talked them about allowing legal apps and homebrew. But instead they stir up trouble and leave the PS3 open to any thief or dishonest person to cause problems.

I think it's crap when people stir up trouble then point fingers at the person who is trying to defend themselves. Sony would never have done the things they did if the hackers had left well enough alone and it's their fault that Sony is constantly on the offensive but yet you blame them instead of the hackers. This nonsense just is more proof of how unstable he is and I rather trust my system to 'evil' Sony then this crazy fool.
#10 (Edited 1239d ago ) | Agree(10) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
daaddoo  +   1239d ago
Point of information:
Hotz didn't start Operation Boycott Sony or create the pic. If you go to the actual blog (geohotgotsued.blogspot.com) the post is titled "Found this while reading /b/".

The picture comes from the Facebook community organization, Operation Boycott Sony. The picture was originally posted by Jared Hiramoto on the facebook page. It's also his profile pic.
cgoodno  +   1239d ago
I hope it's apparent in my blog that this isn't directed at Hotz specifically, but at those who are starting this boycott and provided the text provided in the boycott image I found on Hotz' new blog site.
daaddoo  +   1238d ago
The way the post starts out seems to have focused the everyone on Hotz. The conversation immediately drifted from your post to a love/hatefest focused on Hotz. The sony boycott thing quickly became a stick to beat him with or defend him from.

I thought pointing out the original source would add some clarity.
MrBeatdown  +   1239d ago
This Hotz guy really is something else. I didn't waste my time reading his supposed blog, but if he's actually saying those things, it just goes to show what an idiot he is. The very fact that someone can say OtherOS was a major advertised feature, or that multiple features have been removed from the PS3 just proves that he is desperate for any kind of sympathy he can muster, and is more than happy to bend the truth to make himself appear right.
andron666  +   1239d ago
Well, Sony haven't given me any reasons to boycott them.

I guess Gehot and co. are getting desperate now, maybe they should find themselves another hobby...
#13 (Edited 1239d ago ) | Agree(3) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
RockmanII7  +   1239d ago
I think Geohot is a successful troll.
KwietStorm  +   1239d ago
Boycott? LOL WHAT? How many people do these hackers think are angry with Sony? It's like they're just trying to rally support from anywhere they can get it in some sad attempt to build a team of asshats. Back when geohotz first jailbroke the iPhone, I just said ok some young kid did something nobody else could figure out, he must be intelligent, and that was that. Of course, to be a hacker, you do have to be intelligent in what you're doing, but this kid just keeps showing his lack of intelligence in many other facets of his life. Just the whole way he is presenting himself is an embarrassment, and as cgoodno has pointed out, this becomes dangerous when those ignorant of the situation (or topic at hand) show their gullibility as they jump to his defense. What the hell was he thinking making that corny ass rap and daring Sony to use it in court. Does he think this is a joke? Does he think a judge will look at that video and think he is dealing with a respectful and mature individual? Inconceivable.
#15 (Edited 1239d ago ) | Agree(2) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
WitWolfy  +   1239d ago
First amendment... 'nough said
cgoodno  +   1238d ago
Modifying Sony's IP is not a sign of Freedom of Speech.
blizzard_cool  +   1238d ago
1. It's not a form of free speech
2. The whole world ain't America ;)
nskrishna2  +   1238d ago
ya know, there is a whole wide out there..and where I live 25% kids are merit students..that is more than kids in America...
Mmmkay  +   1238d ago
wtf is the 1st amendment? we don't have that shit outside the US...
starcb26  +   1238d ago
That's right, you have communism instead. JK :D
stephmhishot  +   1238d ago
Question to game pirates, boycotting something usually implies you stop buying or supporting products from a company, since you are already stealing the games, aren't you already technically in the midst of a boycott?
jrummer  +   1238d ago
I’ve been following this story for a few weeks now and I think there is a major point that continues to be missed. Its called perspective.
What do I mean by this. Well. Geohot goes to buy a PS3 for, let’s say, 3 reasons. 1. To play games. 2. To have a Bluray player. 3. For OtherOS. After time passes Sony decides to remove the OtherOS. If my calculations serve me correctly, Sony has removed 33% of the reason George bought a PS3, and that’s assuming all things equally desired. That may differ for other people, but this whole issue really isn’t about other people, this is about one particular user. Let’s say I sold you a Ford Escape with 4x4 and a ski rack. The next morning you come out and I’ve swapped it for a Ford Focus. It’s still a Ford, it’s still a car, still have 4 seats and 4 wheels. But now you can’t go skiing as easily or off-road or whatever. Would that piss you off? I think it would.
The nitpicking over minute details is clouding the issue. The issue that a company sells a product and then changes the product midstream.
I agree that if someone uses the jailbreak to cheat or hack the PSN, then they should be banned, but if they are playing by all the rules and just want to do homebrew, then you can’t justify Sony’s actions. In terms of the personal info being transmitted, Sony can easily deal with that issue. And had they allowed OtherOS to continue and embraced that community the way HP and WebOS does, maybe they wouldn’t be in this mess.
If I were Microsoft, I would be dropping my price, giving away bluray players and opening the device to homebrew with all the needed safeguards. Fighting the hacking community is an utter waste of time and resources that Sony could be investing in other system features.
stephmhishot  +   1238d ago
What is supposed to do, if it becomes a plague amongst gamers where they opt to download games illegally, then their platform suffers and developers will abandon it. Sony saw what happened to the PSP's software sales, are you saying that should let that happen to the PS3? If they "embrace" the community, let's face it, I'm sure there are some paragons of virtue out there who have no intent to pirate games, but unfortunately the other %98 will be drooling in anticipation while watching their game torrents download.

This douche says he doesn't approve of pirating games, but he's giving every other jerk the option to, which they will gladly take advantage of.

What if I found out where this guy lived, and unlocked his door when he wasn't home. Now, I don't condone robbing someone's house, I'm just unlocking his front door. If someone happens to come along and steal everything that isn't bolted down, well, not my fault. I didnt' tell someone to rob his house.

F this guy.
cgoodno  +   1237d ago
***I agree that if someone uses the jailbreak to cheat or hack the PSN, then they should be banned, but if they are playing by all the rules and just want to do homebrew, then you can’t justify Sony’s actions.***

As I said above, Sony is fully justified in banning _anyone_ who is using CFW. Your PS3 and PSN are two entirely different things. You have every right to modify your PS3 for your own personal needs. You do not, however, have any rights to modify or connect to the PSN unless it is completely within Sony's terms.

CFW is a modification of the PSN code. In order to maintain the complete security of all legit users, Sony must prevent any code that is not theirs from connecting to their secure PSN environment(s).

Sony is not preventing users from using CFW, but it is clearly stated in the ToS and EULA that access to the PSN is under Sony's control and they have every right to ban someone for various reasons (cheating, hacking, attempting to bypass security protocols, etc.), of which using customized PSN code is a part.

So, in the end, you have a choice -- CFW or PSN. Many hackers have already two PS3s, many having bought an additional refurbished phat PS3, one for CFW and one for PSN.

There is no law out there that will prevent Sony from banning consoles in this way. And, this court case against GeoHot has nothing to do with banning those who use CFW but in GeoHot's distribution of modified CFW (it's Sony's IP that he modified; same as if I had modified Windows 7 and distributed it as my own) and the distribution of the metldr key data.
shaundbstn  +   1238d ago
This idiot needs to receive a back breaker and a body slam back to primary school.
nskrishna2  +   1238d ago
good read buddy. Ownage
9thWonder  +   1238d ago
Dude you need to spread this so people can get it through their thick skulls that Geohotz is no good and is just a hacker trying to deceive people into thinking he has done no wrong
Parapraxis  +   1238d ago
As usual the assclowns at 4chan haven't a friggen clue what they are talking about.
DJMarty  +   1238d ago
good read

And if you read the PS3 box is clearly states 'hardware may change without pior notice'.

But why would anyone boycott Sony, they made the awesome piece of hardware(PS3), that they like to tinker with.

Without support where would PS3 be.
#23 (Edited 1238d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
Scottyabanks  +   1238d ago
I think Goehotz is a sad pathetic sore loser. Tell him to design, build, manufacture, promote and sell his own next gen console. Then he can legally build all the custom firmware he wants.
Jiggady  +   1234d ago
Excuse me sir are you sure you know what you have just said, One Man rattled the bones of a mega corporation, they had hundreds of men and hundreds of millions, he had 10 fingers, two hands and one head. This guy is your future console you nitwit, he could have contributed to the security, instead Sony choose to sue him.

He also has all the NPDRM keys to make piracy even easier but he witholds them as he is affraid of the damage it will do once realeased, he could have easily done it BUT DIDN'T!!! He probably will soon though if they keep going. Don't forget your talking about a 20 wizkid with the brain of a hundred men.

But Sony's problem in the future will be weather these brainy bunch of Trojan Horses ever accept to work for Pony. Someone who get's paid to do something has less passion than someone who spends months doing There Hobby for free, and to finish on this note, if i brag my house is like Fort Knox and you will never break into my house, then when someone finally does we wimp,moan,terrorise,bankrupt 1 poor man who took up the challenge. sad
#24.1 (Edited 1234d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(1) | Report | Reply
EskiJoe  +   1238d ago
Good read. Very good

I just wanted to add, that the supporters of Geohot, seems do it simply because he is the 'underdog' and Sony is 'the man'. It seems to me that most of the people who support him are oblivious to what's happening.

So I'll say it again, it feels good that somebody at least have an overview over the situation.

EDIT: My comment is about the blog and the comments made by cgoodno
#25 (Edited 1238d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
NeloAnjelo  +   1237d ago
Great Read. Factual points on all the false claims.

By the Way... GET THIS ON THE N4G's NEWS PAGE.
#26 (Edited 1237d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
Jiggady  +   1234d ago
I know FULL well what is going on with Geohot and i donated to his cause, Call me oblivious, what planet are you on pal. This isn't about "Piracy" what Sony claim, this is what they are telling everyone, that they are loosing so much money a year due to piracy while if you look at a game like GTA 4 (information obtained from Wikipedia) it broke industry records with sales of around 3.7 million units on its first day of release and grossing more than $500 million in revenue in the first week, selling an estimated 6 million units worldwide.

As of 9 June 2010, the game had sold over 17 million copies.
Reverse engineers are fighting against OUR consumer rights, they aren't in it for piracy. What this whole story is about is that we as a CONSUMER have the sole right to do what the hell we want with our TAXED/PAID/OWNED PS3. And as you say that only people with CUSTOM firmware got banned, where did you get that info from (know your story before you tell it, this misinformation of yours is WRONG) people who have had their Hard-Disk updated as for 1. Their old one might have broke or 2. They may have some other hardware updated, which is perfectly legal. These people also got a ban and are now suing Sony for it.
Oh and just incase you people believe these stories you read about and are incapable of searching for the truth, WE PS3 owners have to update to 3.56 to be able to play new games, which blocks my USB Ports and install's a Rootkey(suppose you don't know what THIS is lmao)ERM Sony didn't take anything off me??????? Not just that, say for instance Pony think i may be doing something ILLEGAL, i had to give conscent so they can spy on me to see what i'm doing at what time, with whomever, and the worrying thing is there's me standing infront of my Eye Cam, playin "The Fight" they can log on and watch me play, even be able to hear what i'm saying, oh wait my girlfriend just walked in and want's to make love, ERMM My EYE CAM IS STILL ON. Where is our privacy, what they do is instead of spend money and make sure there equipment is SAFE, they take away options that were PAID for, What gives you the right to say only 1% use it ANY PROOF???? Unless Sony was already taking information from people before hand, you will never find out. I have PS3 Slim(no OtherOS) i have no right to demand it, it was never on there in the first place. I paid for it!!! I own it!!!! THIS IS WHAT IS AT STAKE!!! For the Americans who still pay income tax read this: http://www.givemeliberty.or... You thought you knew it all, wake up people....... See how long it takes for them to delete post XD
newzy32  +   1234d ago
I'd just like to say. While this article provides suitable counterpoints to thing not actually posted by geohot but by someone else equally excitable and easily prone to flights of fancy, I feel you are missing the main issue.

Everyone was sorry to hear of Sony's fatal security flaw and like many people I said "well thats the end of the PS3" and sighed to myself that the rampant piracy would consign my ps3 to cupboard with my psp. That sad fact aside, the problem isn't the dent to sony's profits and the loss of confidence in their product (and nobody cried when toyota had to recall millions of cars at huge loss on profits and stock prices due to a flaw in their product) but their responses and their subsequent violations of civil rights and freedoms by a large corporation. And the fact that it's not a social responsibility to protect private interests.

fair enough they are within their right to try and sue people who enable piracy or distribute piracy but geohot's work, which has been shown in the case he won against apple, does not in itself enable piracy. A lot of Sony's early products, such as betamax for example were actually more guilty of being piracy devices than anything geohot has done and Sony have managed to create a huge corporation of the back of products such as these. They were even taken taken to court in the 1970's by universal studios and walt disney for the exact crimes they claim against themselves.

here is an interesting alternative article about SONY's progression -> http://blog.makezine.com/ar...

secondly, in the last few days SONY have started using the police in germany to raid the house of another hacker (graf_chokolo) who, not only has not released anything in near the magnitude of damage that team failOverfl0w/geohot did, but could in no way be accused of creating circumvention devices, especially in the pursuit of profit. they have also been sending DMCA takedown notices to websites in countries where the DMCA does not apply and succeeding. All of these actions are being obeyed because sony has the money to circumvent due process. It should not be able to obtain a warrant without a body evidence first and in the case of piracy, it only becomes criminal when a cease and desist or temporary restraining order has been violated. Not raid the house first and then serve papers afterwards like they did to graf_chokolo.

I just think you should be aware of Sony's double standards (such as the products they have made in the past) and their abuse of the legal system before you write off the importance of this situation. Whether or not you agree with the actions that led to it. I will certainly think twice before I buy another Sony product just because there are companies who are thriving with out the need for these extreme measures and they have more respect for the law and rights of the individual over the right for them to maximize profit.
Jiggady  +   1234d ago
Just to prove a point

Geohot Gets Offered Free Windows Phone 7 From Microsoft [Microsoft's Developer Liaison Offers Geohot Of PS3 & iPhone Jailbreaking Fame A Free WP7 Phone - Smart Move?]

Read More: http://nexus404.com/Blog/20...
kingcoolryan  +   1233d ago
You do know that this isnt from geohot, it is from Anonymous.... Completely different
« 1 2 »

Add comment

You need to be registered to add comments. Register here or login
Remember