How can Sony make the name PlayStation synonymous with quality game experiences in the minds of the millions of players that only started taking the hobby seriously within the last generation or two? They can't. The PlayStation brand needs to die.
I don't know, fortunes can always change. I mean, the PS2 was way more popular than the Xbox, and then the swapped places in the next cycle. Although people who owned an Xbox weren't held to as much ridicule as PS3 fans are today.
Just another lonely fanboy trying to get hits. Playstation brand is just fine. I own both systems and I use the ps3 way more then xbox it all come down to switch one u prefer. Both systems have there ups and downs
my bad, i accidentally disagreed. well said sir. i have both as well but much prefer my xbox. simply put,
i prefer the controller, user interface, and extra features far more, plus the majority of my buddies have 360.
playstations blue ray and internet are nice but not overly useful to me, internet for porn and blue rays are to expensive to use regularly.
as far as the games go, most of my favs are multiplats anyway so i always get them on 360. then when ps3 gets an exclusive i want to play or a fighting game, i get it for ps3.
overall, i have and always will, game on both. when the next systems drop, ill get sony's and ms's again cuase thats how i roll.
Article is really made to get attention, mision acomplished on that one, as for the title, another PS3-like console (pre-slim era) and he'd be probably right...
From release Nov 2005 - Feb 2011 360 WW 52.1m From release Nov 2006 - Feb 2012 PS3 WW 61.7m PS3 has sold better than the 360 since its release, Playstation brand is fine. These articles should not be approved.
^^^ Hmm, you've seemed to have forgotten to add another year to the Xbox numbers and the total along with it, lol. I must say, I would be intrigued to find out your reason, lol.
@ Wraith He just needs to edit his year numbers (2005, 2006), but he's still right about the PS3 outselling the 360 if you compared both without the year lead. Source: http://ps3.ign.com/articles...
the name itself was a key to the success of the PS2 because it was synonymous with the popularity of the original "playstation". Now maybe this guy is thinking that a reinvention of the name is needed. Meaning that to continue the trend of just adding a number denotes a lack of originality. We could look at sega and say that each platform they had was in and of itself its own name and identity. Similar to nintendo and how they changed from the first 3 platforms (nintendo, super nintendo and nintendo 64) to the gamecube and subsequently the wii. Although, when a brand has name recognition you dont really want to just cut ties with it right away. Playstation as a brand is very popular in today's culture. If sony were to be creative with their next console you can bet it would be playstation....something but they should drop the number system for the new model. MS has been using the windows brand since its creation but it was the consumer that would tend to drop that part of the name. Early versions were referred to as windows...(insert version). Then with windows 95 came the advent of simply calling it 95 and later 98 and ME, NT, 2000, XP, vista...etc. Yet they were all under the brand recognition of "Windows". Will MS all of a sudden change that and remove the key part of the name that people know most? Playstation brand does not need to die. It can be perfectly fine as the umbrella to which other sony platforms can derive their association to each other. We as the consumer can choose to drop it from the naming when discussing it but the brand will live on.
The PlayStation brand is arguably the best in gaming. I think they're having problems simply because the market has changed and Sony's still stuck with a 1990's or 2000's mentality. Times have changed and they need to get on board. 60+ million PS3's sold and continuing to sell is a success. That may be a large drop from 150+ million PS2's and 100+ million PS1's but neither of those consoles had as many problems as the PS3 has had, both just and unjust. An item sells if it's popular and affordable. Coming off the success of the PS2 the PS3 was considered to be the most anticipated console of all time. But then it launched with a $500 & $600 price tag and lacked a line-up of games and performance to backup that asking price. So off the bat Sony was in trouble, especially when you could pick up a 360 and a Wii at the time for about the same price. Being cheap and offering a new experience (gimmick or not) the Wii was the go to console for the casual audience that the PS2 once had, and the 360 being cheaper and dropping Gears of War showed that the Xbox 360 was possibly better than the PS3 since it had "the game" to show it, and it too was cheaper. Also with the 360 getting exclusive content, games, and DLC buying a PS3 at the time seemed like a bad investment. Fast forward 5+ years things are different, and the Wii has fizzled out, the 360 is still doing great in America, but the world has seen the true potential of the PS3 with a massive array of exclusives in multiple genres, and more features than any other console it's become the best selling console worldwide on a weekly basis. The PlayStation brand isn't bad, nor does it needs to die. It just needs re-branding.
Step 1. "Online" Sony needs to reconstruct their online network so that's it simple, intuitive, and screams connectivity. Establishing a network and community where gamers want to be is the most important thing Sony must accomplish next gen. The PS Vita has fixed some of these things and is headed in the right path, but the PS4 or whatever it's called needs to expand above and beyond what the Vita does. Step 2 "Innovate" Sony has stuck to what works and that's where the problem is. Yes they took a chance with a new processor, but gamers aren't concerned with what's running their console. Only what's playable on it, and what it looks like on screen. This is where PS Home comes in. IMO Home has the most potential in the world, but the ball has been dropped from the Empire State Building. Home should have a sports arena where you can play simple sports games like in Wii Sports all for free. They should have a track where you can play simple karting games for free. They should have arcades where you can play classics for free. They should integrate some games into apps like EyePet so you can have a virtual pet in your apartment/studio/whatever. Home has some of these things like the EEA sports complex, but it's just not to the level of what I'm talking about. Long loading needs to be cut down significantly, long downloads as well. Home should be the OS for the PS4 if they can make it run how I envision it. Step 3 "Price" The PS3 didn't pick up in sales until it hit $400, so don't make a console that cost over $400 to manufacturer. Step 4 "Games" Sony has the broadest array of games on consoles IMO, and that's their greatest strength. They have some of the best developers in the industry exclusive to them, so make sure everyone's on the same page and all produce the same quality that Naughty Dog and Sony Santa Monica are producing. Get the others caught up, although they're not far behind. Step 5 "Market" Get the news out there, get the games and consoles in people's hands, show commercials, get your games at competitive tournaments, have tours around the country or in Sony stores, Get a spokesperson who represents the gaming community, do whatever it takes to get your product known. Step 6 "Partners" Get Google on board since you guys seems to be in a serious relationship (Chrome web browser, Android apps, etc...), Make Crackle a dashboard app (free Sony movies is a +, and having it on the dashboard is a no duh), Get whoever else you can on board, you scratch my back I'll scratch yours. When you feel that you've got your money's worth you're more satisfied with your purchase, and those kinds of customers will spread the word about your item. If you re-brand the PlayStation make sure it's not just a simple name change, but a complete upgrade & update.
I argree 100% both has their own great exclusives.
I don't know about needing to die... But there is a level of ambiguity concerning marketing. Sony should have stomped Xbox into a mudhole all the way to China only a couple years after launch. They should have, but didn't.
I swear to god does litteratly EVERYONE here have beef with the 360. I own both but is it really so wrong to prefer the xbox experience over the ps3s or prefer gears and halo over uncharted and killzone. I LOVE rachet and clank and heavy rain and ive played all 3 uncharted, in fact my slim just got ylod and I still bought a uncharted 3 bundle instead of only having a 360. To me, the ps3 experince is basically loading, loading, syncing and "this action requires you leaving game". I love both I really do but why all the damn hate. Why?
"the PS2 was way more popular than the Xbox, and then the swapped places in the next cycle." PS2 - 150mil and counting XBOX - 25mil and dead! vs 360 - ~65mil and counting PS3 - 60mil and counting I can't see how's THAT considered as "swapped places" at all! yes, the 360 is dominant in the USA just like how most XBOX were sold there too back then but worldwide, it's too close to call for any dominance that most publishers especially the big ones are opting for their games to be multiplat rather than exclusive unlike last gen where PS2 dominated in terms of 3rd party exclusives! the abundance of exclusives on PS3 this gen is solely due to Sony producing many in-house games and MS too lazy to make any as they are more comfortable spending money on exclusive content/advertising/DLC for multiplats!
So the author's argument is that there aren't dedicated playstation fans because he had a conversation with some people? "If my coworkers are any indication" Bitmod is releasing some very pathetic anti-playstation articles lately.
@Wraith MrDread was pointing out that at the same time in their life cycle the PS3 had actually sold better. He doesn't need to update years just elaborate his logic a little better. As of right now the PS3 is selling the best week over week. I know that last comment is going to bring disagrees but the truth is the truth...can't ignore fact oh and by the way I'm not talking NPD I'm talking globally. Oh and don't give shit sites like Bitmob hits for trash articles...the only reason they posted this is because it's slow on real news and they don't want to do real journalistic work and create real content for real gamers not fan boys.
You are right. It sounds like a case of a bunch od cod players on xbox. That won't last forever. Though, i guess if cod caused millions to become xbox fans, it was worth it for microsoft to put a premium on online and the call of duty brand. Anyway, next gen I'll be judged by what it is...and isn't.
I think the sensationalist title is necessary to pull people into an article that may otherwise be overlooked. This is a valid viewpoint, and something that needs to be discussed and considered. I seriously doubt the impetus for this article was to generate hits.
Its always about hits when some one disagree's.
if he brushes his teeth and prays to tooth fairy every night.. he might get his wish.
does it really matter what anyone on this site really think of the 360. i mean as long as you enjoy it then it really doesn't matter if all the sonyfanboys on this site disagree with you.
i own both systems and a gaming pc. and besides my gaming pc (which i play more than anything) my 360 comes in a close second for my playing time. where as i don't even touch or buy any games for my ps3, which i haven't played since my friend let me hold uncharted 3 (which i've never been a fan of) and gave back after two days.
i have played most of what sony has to offer for the ps3 and I'm not impressed at all. but that's just me and my opinion. many of my friends don't touch their ps3 either but i'm sure they have their own reasons why not.
Didn't even give the site the hit.
What an ignorant attempt at flaming. This article is 4 years late and seems like it should have come during the start of this gen at the start of the Sony/MS "console war".
What a troll.
I get the impression that the majority of americans are pro 360 but over here in europe its a different story. I for one am all about nintendo and the sony playstation. I like my xbox but theres not enough variety in genres like the PS3 in my opinion. I wish some americans would get it out of their heads that america does not = the world. Just because japan doesn't like the 360 it hasnt stopped it from being succesfull. Same goes for playstation in america. Btw i am aware that some of you love your playstations =)
I own both but my ps3 gets used way more. right now my 360 has been a paperweight since gears 3. playstation has always been of variety for me and that's why its played more.
It is an american problem. If I go to a midnight launch in my town, I'm in the minority by far as a PS3 user, and the Gamestop here pushes 360 over PS3 in a blatant way. I've never been one to follow the crowd, so I buy quality hardware over popular hardware every time. Just like iPods and iPhones are inferior, yet popular in the US, so is the 360. I bought my PS3 in early 07 and have never regretted it. Meanwhile, every single person I know who bought a 360 because it launched first no longer has one. They traded up to PS3s and are all happy with that move. My money will go to the Playstation brand until they lose my interest, just like Nintendo before them and Atari before them. Based on PS1, PS2, and PS3, PS4 is where I will be.
Everyone I know except for like 3 or 4 people (who I actually successfully converted to playstation 3) plays Xbox 360. It's so frustrating hearing these idiots say things like "the ps3 doesn't have any games", and when I proceed to prove them wrong by listing them off and their reviews and awards (I know those aren't definitive proof by themselves, but they are proof that a console "has good games" if there are a ton of them), they just say they've "never heard of it" and shrug it off as if it's a crappy game JUST BECAUSE THEY'VE NEVER HEARD OF IT. I guess by their [email protected] I think the only way to counter these kinds of idiots, is for Sony to waste billions of money on marketing (that could go towards making a new game or two) so these name recognition whores will finally buy a ps3.
@ vickers500 Those types of people make me sick, and are probably the main reason why the PS3 has been so abused this generation. Similarly in other entertainment industries, these people are the reason why so much great content from amazingly talented people is being ignored in favour mass produced "popular" trite. It's the culmination of media propaganda, misinformation and the spreading of childish, ignorant BS over years, that these people have been led to believe. The youth of today are so much more ignorant than before because they have been force fed entertainment, latched on to their friends' interests and don't really make the effort to go and find things that they personally admire - rather, they just take in what the corporations feed them, rather than be forming healthy, individual tastes and expanding their mind to welcome great creative output. That is a huge problem, and you're right, the only way for this to change, is for Sony to waste their money trying to amend this appalling situation. Sadly, sheep will be sheep.
I'm American and partially agree with your point Harry (to an extent)...but I don't believe it's "just" Americans per se. I think it's more along the lines of the the American media bias that tries to portray us and the situation in that light because I have LOTS of friends and family (Americans) who contradict that "mind set" and actually prefer the PS brand over the others any day of the week!
Most store you go to in America have giant display of Kinect and TV showing MS stuff. That is marketing people. There is no giant cardboard character cut out of Resistance when it came out but they still had the giant master chief there. Sony has failed to get to that level in america. Ill be giving you a real life example here , My friend mom wanted a Kinect to get that Dance game but they have a PS3 at home. She was ready to dish out all that money just to play a Dance game. I hooked up a Move to their PS3( she never heard of "move" before ) and we rented Just Dance and guess what? she freaking loved it. < --- This my friend is why Sony is failing in North America. Now don't get me wrong i would rather them spend money on making good game and hardware but the problem here is that they could be making way more money just by advertising correctly. And the DudeBro syndrome is all too real. Talk to any of those cod360 sheep about Killzone and they never heard of it and would "not know how to play it" even if you tell them it is the exact same controls scheme. Some of them don't even believe that you get free online on ps3 to play teh COD
Well said...I myself am an american but i prefer my ps3 and wii...i have a 360 but not really played it to much because of payin online...thats really it.I never pc gamed because im not into any pc exclusives seein how the really good ones are a pay to play services
The only thing Sony doesn't know how to do is keep the momentum rolling......Im a PS3 fanboy , i'll admit it. But Sony has kept promising us things, and have failed to deliver on those promises. E3 2005 , the list of features that thing had was crazy. But they ended up cutting some of those features out....that was the start of their misery, and then the price.....and then they failed to deliver on Home. Now am I saying that all of this was a failure? No. Im saying they failed to deliver on their promises. But at the end of the day, I bought the PS3 to play some of the most cutting edge, media pushing games out. And they most definitely succeeded on that. MGS4 , Uncharted series, LittleBigPlanet, InFamous, Gran Turismo....I could go all day lol. But I see the tide turning in Sony's approach to things....When they released the Vita....they didn't promise you anything... They showed the console...showed what it could do, and let it speak for itself. I think that should be their approach from now. I love Sony and want to see the best for them in the future #SonyForLife.
But Sony also delivered more than promised: Killzone 2 looked better than 2005 trailer, which everyone thought was impossible to have on a console.
I dont see the tide turning in Sony's favor in regards to the vita. No Commercials No "try it out stands" in the gameshops No flagship game High price You do get alot of great tech for the price, but that dosn't matter for me, if someone wanted to sell me 100000$ worth of gold bars, for 50000$, thats great, but i still cant afford it. Now that example is greatly simplified but it's a strong analogy. On top of it all, they managed to make the Vita look so similar to the PSP, i bet most people walking into a gameshop wont know that it's a totally different beast. Turning tide you say....what tide, it's just the same stagnant water we've been seeing for a while now.
Dude.....thats so exaggerated . No one can afford $50000. But $250 for the Vita is a steal. Your a gamer I assume. And 9 times out of 10 , unless your a child that , every gamer has a smart phone. You know what a smart phone these days cost without a contract? 499-599 EASY! Your telling me that for a portable device, that cost as much as your phone does WITH a two year contract, that you can't afford it? No.....you can afford it, its just where you don't want to put your money right now. As of now, I would get a Vita solely because of its features , which I want Sony to get right this time, and which I feel they will. @GrandTheftZamboni: I know dude! I told you they delivered on the games front......I just wanted the features to be more awesome.......buts its all good, Because, i know Sony is gonna get it right with their next console. This is really their first time in the online arena, so tbh its not fair to put that against them. I think they did wonderful for their first time!
The author should ask his coworker friends how they feel come mid May or so.
I think it's more about them trying to get all multiplat games to utilise it in some way. Me3 did it pretty well so I didn't have to pause to use powers that weren't mapped. GRFS kinect gameplay is a joke but using it for gun smith is pretty cool.
Save your breath and efforts bro.....I know gimmick & worthless gaming bulls%!7 when I see it. My 1999 Samsung Cellphone had voice command (sch 3500).....( I think I paid $100 for it.)
@Persistantthug To some it is a gimmick, and to others it is a worthwhile feature. In fact, some would say video games are gimmicky considering how it all started and what it still lacks today!
Oh god... not Bitchmob again All they do is whine and complain, just dismiss this as nonsense. He wants Sony to kill the playstation brand... Why do so, when the playstation brand is so popular? And then he goes on to talk about the 360. I hope you guys can see this is flame bait, and do not try to look up what he is rambling on about
Sony isn't dumb enough to kill the Playstation brand. Its one of the few areas where Sony as a whole is doing well. I'm sure the the VPs at Sony are rolling their eyes at this flame bait like the rest of us
Articles & so called journalists/writers like this need to die.
sony is gaming !!! until this day Sony is the only company that have been giving gamers what they want and thats GAMES!! They off new and innovative IPs and they will most likely get the crown next gen. This gen they did a lot of mistakes and im sure they learned.
"How can Sony make the name PlayStation synonymous with quality game experiences in the minds of the millions of players that only started taking the hobby seriously within the last generation or two?" hmm because it's again the best brand for the last "generation, or two"...poor bitmob delusional fanboy :) "I don't know, fortunes can always change. I mean, the PS2 was way more popular than the Xbox, and then the swapped places in the next cycle. " hmm no, ps3 has better hardware and software (just facts), and really close (or even beyond) xbox in sales, so you can't compare with ps2/xbox generation.
The most flame bait troll article in history ever.
SO because he got made fun of, he thinks the Playstation brand should be killed? lol K.
Got a problem with our company brands? We are technically ahead of 360 in sales because we are like 3 million of and ccame out a year late. W easily get over 11 million on average each year. We arecatching up quickly :)
Wow....fanboyism so extreme that the user refers to the playstation brand as himself. And he gets agrees for it. Lol at the comment section of this site. SDF kids and their rants. Comedy gold.
The name was not the cause of sonys success or failure. Sony succeeded because of new media formats that gave them the lion share of developers. This is the one key reason for their success. The problem with blu ray is it was only needed for story based hd games which fell to the dominance of fps games with online. Another problem is price and the fact there are no Oscar worth video game stories. Then there is the empty hype... And promises. Multiplatform quality is the reason why America buys Xbox games. Many people in America do not like Sony exclusive games or their controller. Xbox had this problem and a new controller was made, Sony ignores this so America ignores them. Plus America has a long history of fps LAN parties, it's been in our culture since doom 1 dm. Back to the empty hype... Sure the cell was a great idea but we have too many pc gamers that know why multi core chips are good or bad. It's been agreed by professionals that this chip was more hype like intel cheating on benchmarks... If you do see it in software then it doesn't matter. It did not help that pc gpus passed the ps3 that same year in performance. Yet fans continue to say how powerful it is, maybe this could best be described as emotionally powerful since the specs where shockingly good till the bottlenecks where exposed. Unlike DVD blu ray is an elitist media similar to laser disk back in the day... Those guys almost hated video games thus they are not great evangelist. Lots of ps3 are only movie players because of this in the states. On top of it all Sony got to see how weak they are without third parties. The wii is the only exception to the third party rule... As it was only designed to prefect 3d game play ideas. The reason why you havnt seen most of this is because the media only likes to talk about flamebait ideas, there is no casual player only a skilled player and there are no loyal fans only consumers looking to be entertained. Their are graphic whores though lol yet plenty of people who enjoy cg art and creativity also. Ps3 does try to have original art yet they only really need better game play and controls and addictive games design. Sony is almost there but they will need to correct their studios more to succeed. The playstation brand is one of the coolest brands out. Yet so was Atari. It's not the brand it's the games. Plus more power may help Sony on the ps4 yet if that power doesn't get showcased with fun addicting and engaging games then they will fall flat and that power becomes a very expensive gimmick.
You are talking about the North Americas I presume. I only saw a lot of friends getting a PS3 this fall/winter, main reasons are still the strong brandname and the price. Those aren't people that check the gamesnews every day but just go to the local store to get a 'Playstation'.
It's that time of the month. the Xbots are on the rag. how else would explain all the miss directed anger.
with my only bubble:
who wrote this shit?? lonely fanboy trying to get hits??
Please report the person that posted this for posting flamebait articles to gain hits.
This site needed the hits, so i hope objective users didn't give this well known xbox fanboy site. the hits it was looking for. BTW these sites are increasingly putting out anti Sony articles again because the Xbox doesn't have anything to talk about gaming wise that PS3 doesn't have as well sighhhhhhhhhhh. Flame me if want i actively play both systems. Xbox gamertag: HueyNewton2010/ PSN spenn2008 When your too cheap or poor to purchase both systems and its games you become one sided and ignore the facts of quality. The only feature i prefer on xbox is the party chat and THATS it, oh i will be purchasing the Witcher 2 soon. That's the only unique game the 360 has to offer 360 only owners and its not even a system exclusive. If the Playstation dies, Hard core console gaming DIES its as simple as that.
I think the better idea would be to not release a console later than the competition and also costs more.
The problem isn't with the PlayStation brand, it's just Sony kinda screwing things up in general. They've been playing catchup ths whole generation, but like the comment above me said, the ps2 was the shit. It's not like people just got instantly sick of the brand.
this article speaks the truth. Even within the fighting community where 95% of the tournaments are held on PS3 consoles a 99.9%% of all the players only game on the Xbox just because they all think the PS3 is lame for no apparent reason at all. But it seems this brand problem is just in the US though....
I think your proportions are exaggerated a fair bit, there, old chap. I'd say about a 60/40 split is much more realistic. I mean the 99.9%. I mean, that'd mean there'd be 99.9 xbox fighting game players for every 0.1 ps3 fighting game player. How can anyone disagree with that?
Did you just state that ....... really
^Your comment was most helpful.
Yeah this "BRand" problem is clearly from a US perspective and even then the article goes over board a bit its not that bad.
I think the ps brand is sony's staple liek the walkman brand used to be before it and its the only one turning a profit atm.
As far as I know, tournament players, for some dumb reason, game on the Xbox(must be that lame "perfect flame" excuse or Cross game chat), yet, fighting games are sold & are played more on the PS3, knowing a great community of players in my area that are fighting game players, plus those in foreign countries, especially in my homeland Dominican Republic, & others like Peru & Ecuador(Some tournament players play Tekken on dualshocks BTW).... Out of all my fighting game friends, only 3 play on 360, & I whopped their asses with so much ease on their Xboxs, I don't think their claims on that "more responsive" or "perfect flaming" BS is any valid to be honest, as far as I can tell, it is totally the same on both systems, both systems play the games well, & are responsive!!!!! They might be totally tournament players, but anyone of us in N4G, no matter if we are PS3 or Xbox players, can whoop their asses for sure, because they're not athletes, & I already know friends of mines that can destroy them for sure, especially dumb-ass Justin Wong!!!!
This "article" is no different than when the Xbox 360 first came out. How does this kind of mentality persist?
Inbreeding is the answer to your question.
It's a shame most gamers new to this gen hate the PS3 for no reason, but because the 360 was cheaper, and still is, plus the fact most people choose the 360 because there friends do (and so on) because of social situations like how they don't want to miss out when they all talk on live and play COD...it's understandable why this has happened. The PS3 is great and the amount of love Sony shows for it and their fanbase is amazing....it makes me sad people nitpick at the smallest things Sony do even if other companies like Nintendo or MS do it. All I have to say though is if you play on your 360 because of those reasons, always play on FPS and have never played games like Heavy Rain, Uncharted, inFAMOUS, Metal Gear Solid 4 etc...then how can you call yourself a gamer. I mean I have a friend who hates the PS3 for a silly reason....he can't afford one.
It's funny how people say the ps3 is more expensive than the xbox when the xbox, after the cost of a hard drive and a year of gold, is more than a 160gb ps3.
Uninformed people, and "follow the leader" types don't see that; they buy into hype and what other people say rather than fact and taking the time to research.
Thats the thing though....people these days need things to be obvious It's all about common sense to be honest For example, if people saw two items for sale Item 1 = £300 Item 2 = £200 + £40 + £65 They would think straight away Item 1 was more expensive because it LOOKS more expensive at a first glance. It's silly people still say the PS3 is way more expensive when really, after you've worked it out, it's not.
PS3 is more expensive because the PS3 costs more. The xbox only gets more expensive once you add LIVE and all the extra bibs and bobs. PS3, £229.99 (cheapest I can find for 320gb). XBOX 360, £177.99 (cheapest I could find for 250gb) - NOT EBAY! This Ultimately means the PS3 is more expensive. Doesnt make it better or worse, just proves the PS3 is more expensive.
I don't think that most gamers hate the ps3. Its just more people like xbox better this gen than they did last gen. There is plenty room for both. Its a huge market.