Ninja Theory: designing games purely for fans "will kill a series"

Capcom "felt Devil May Cry was a little stuck in its ways", according to Tameem Antoniades.

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Snookies122186d ago

They're exactly right... You know what else will kill a series? Changing the main character.

Snookies122186d ago

That's MEANT to have different characters man, it's totally different than a series who's based on one single character and has been since its beginning. Sure DMC4 went with another character, but they still had the original Dante in it as he was supposed to be.

dirigiblebill2186d ago

OK, how about Assassin's Creed 2? Sure, Desmond's still there but he's never been the focus. Or Halo: Reach? Or Black Ops? Make of DMC what you will, but there's no inherent reason a changed lead character should spell doom for a series. It's all about the execution.

360GamerFG2186d ago

diri, what you don't understand is that none of that games changed the personality of the main characters. All they did was switch them.
DmC's Dante is like turning Master Chief into a loud mouthed, wise cracking wise guy like Dan from Street Fighter.
Or turning Kratos into a happy go lucky woohoo-yelling idiot like Mario
Or turning Nathan Drake into an emo androgynous teen like all final fantasy game characters.
It just doesn't feel right.

dirigiblebill2186d ago


A fast-paced gun/sword-based action game with Resident Evil's camera angles, set in a world that's equal parts Rocky Horror Show and Lovecraft, "doesn't feel right" - but here we are 11 years and 10 million plus sales later. New ideas have to start somewhere.

Personally, I think the idea of a Kratos who isn't a deluded body-builder with anger management issues sounds terrific.

xtreampro2185d ago (Edited 2185d ago )

Having different characters in Assassins Creed is part of the story, seriously what kind of stupid argument is that?

NT are just doing damage control because they know exactly what's going to happen when this releases, the franchise will either become average or it'll just die out and eventually be abandoned.

"with Resident Evil's camera angles" WOW did you just classify third person camera angles as "resident Evil camera angles" LOL!

So I guess there's First person, Second person and then Resident Evil camera angles LMAO!

dirigiblebill2185d ago

@ xsteampro

(Sigh) Yes, dear, I'm aware that Devil May Cry can be loosely defined as a third-person game, but the particulars of the camera-work (e.g. when framing interactive objects or text) recall Resident Evil. And as regards the Assassin's Creed comparison being "ridiculous" - give me one utterly incontrovertible plot-related reason you can't have a Devil May Cry game without Dante (not that this is a Devil May Cry game without Dante, exactly).

The degree of bile and bad noise this so-called "travesty" has attracted makes me want to punch kittens. Hardcore gamers snivel about "iterative" design elsewhere, but when developers actually take risks (and there are definitely risks, I'll agree) everybody screams "blasphemy". It's like when taxpayers agitate for tax cuts, but can't stomach the idea of reduced public spending.

We've had four Devil May Cry games in the previous style. Four. And you know what? There's absolutely no reason we won't see Devil May Cry games in that style again, once Ninja Theory's done rebooting. People need to relax.

Outside_ofthe_Box2185d ago (Edited 2185d ago )

"Personally, I think the idea of a Kratos who isn't a deluded body-builder with anger management issues sounds terrific."

This shows that you are missing the point. If you don't like the way Kratos is currently, obviously you are going to think a happy go lucky Kratos sounds terrrrrrryyyyyyfffic!!! :D

You know there are a lot of people that are clamoring of an FF7 remake? Well how do you think the fans would respond if SE were to change every personality of every character if they made the remake? Someone who isn't a die hard fan of FF7 might not give a hoot, but the people begging for the remake definitely do.

In my opinion anyone that attacks DMC fans for not liking the direction of the DMC reboot isn't a huge DMC fan to begin with. Personally I'm not a fan of DMC so I'm actually don't mind the new approach of DMC, but I'm not going to pretend that I don't understand why people are upset.

"The degree of bile and bad noise this so-called "travesty" has attracted makes me want to punch kittens. Hardcore gamers snivel about "iterative" design elsewhere, but when developers actually take risks (and there are definitely risks, I'll agree) everybody screams "blasphemy". It's like when taxpayers agitate for tax cuts, but can't stomach the idea of reduced public spending."

If you want to take risks do it with a new IP lol. Why do it with an established franchise? It makes no sense IMO. Do you really think this game would be getting scrutiny had it been a new IP instead of a reboot? They should have made this game a spin-off at most instead of redoing the entire franchise. And it would take another reboot after the reboot to go back to that style... unless NT doesn't give a hoot about story.

gamingdroid2185d ago

Ninja Gaiden 3 says hi!

Now that is a game created without the fans approval and see that metacritic score sitting at less than 60%...


"I'm not trying to design around what I think people will want. That's where you get into creative bankruptcy. That, more than anything, will kill a series."

Will also bankrupt you... A middle ground please!

Nitrowolf22185d ago


Assassins Creed: It's expected to have different characters after the first title explained what was going on with the whole animus and peering back into his ancestor past memories.

Final Fantasy: A game that has stayed different from one another.

Black Ops: Really? Call of duty takes place throughout different history. BTW Modern Warfare followed the same characters.

Halo: never played anything after 2, but aren't they kind of based on the books???? IDK mybe it's the other way around.

Devil May Cry is a series of FOUR TITLES. FOUR TITLES BASED AROUND DANTE (Of course DMC4 had Nero).
If someone took Nathan Drake out of Uncharted the world would be ticked.

When they changed Cole from Infamous 2 people were raging.

BTW the character look isn't the only issue that people are having with the game. Lower FPS and the fact that they took DMC and rebooted it, when it didn't need a rebooting.

dirigiblebill2184d ago

"This shows that you are missing the point. If you don't like the way Kratos is currently"

I do like the way Kratos is currently. But that doesn't mean I don't welcome the thought of change too.

"If you want to take risks do it with a new IP lol. Why do it with an established franchise?"

Because the "established franchise" is sorely in need of a fresh direction? You'll never hear them admit it, but Devil May Cry 4 didn't sell nearly what Capcom wanted it to.

"They should have made this game a spin-off at most instead of redoing the entire franchise."

How does making a reboot mean "redoing the entire franchise"? Will every single copy of the original DMC erase itself once Ninja Theory's game hits shelves?

"And it would take another reboot after the reboot to go back to that style..."

Perhaps, but what does that matter? Aren't we quibbling over definitions here?

+ Show (8) more repliesLast reply 2184d ago
ritsuka6662186d ago

Man,Crapcom has been making some terrible decisions.... I still feel this was a poor choice on Capcom let ninja theory make Devil may cry game.

Outside_ofthe_Box2185d ago (Edited 2185d ago )

If I were a DMC fan I definitely would not buy this reboot after this statement.

Obviously you shouldn't make a game 100% for the fans, but what they are currently doing is making a game *"PURELY"* for a different demographic which you shouldn't do either.

I really wonder how NT and Capcom will feel if DMC bombs in sales after making bold statement after bold statement.

thaking1552185d ago (Edited 2185d ago )

You know the crazy thing is they say they were alarmed by how Devil may Cry 4 was received. Well the fans were mad because they secretly tried rebooting with Nero, when all the fans wanted was a sequel with Dante. Then the copy and paste formula of Nero going one way and Dante going back and finishing the job was dumb.

Make a Devil may Cry game that pertains to driving the story forward. Not prequels or reboots or trying to introduce new characters into the story so they can eventually reboot the story with that character. Make a sequel about Dante (Original Dante not Crazy hobo in a tank top Dante that was raised and tortured by demons) bring back Virgil, Sparda, and heck do something with Mundus and have a freaking remnant of him or something! Anything that drives the story forward, they haven't even tried since Devil May Cry 2, I say give it a shot that's all I ask for in a Devil may Cry game (Story Development) not this steaming pile of dung that is called DMC.

NT sucks because they think that fans don't know what they are talking about and that is why they have such a bad rep with alot of fans and Crapcom..... Well we all know what their deal is and why people don't like them!

hay2185d ago

I'm surprised how disconnected execs at Capcom are. They received backslash with Nero in DMC4, they're receiving backslash with this nonsense.
They're literally dropping the core fanbase 'cause they're too stupid to come up with something that will make fans happy with setting that will attract new people.

Instead, they do this.
One would say "I don't want to live on this planet anymore", but I'd rather see them being launched into the sun, 'cause if Earth would had hands, it'd facepalm.

fei-hung2185d ago

Noteable points:

1) NT has already begun shifting the responsibilty to Crapcom in case it fails.
2) has indirectly stated it is for newcomers not original fans.
3) they are not competing with bayonetta combat mechanics since it isnt realistic enough and they want something more believable.
4) they are aiming at creating the best combat mechanics (yet ignoring Bayonetta)
5) misunderstood what Jaffe said about stories in games
6) creating the game for a western audience not the Japanese
7) making the game more movie like for the western audience
8) trying to make the best game according to what is best for them not the gamers, in which case why are you trying to convince us its good?!
9) dont care about sales as long as it is a creative success, sales flop is good enough for them.

This game reaks of $hit and fail through and throughout. The living world story sounds boring compared to the story of Mundus or Virgil. The combat now sounds worse than it ever was and Tameem wont stop contradicting himself. What makes things even more screwed up is Crapcom the publisher and NT the dev are not on the same frigging page anymore. This seems to be getting messier with every instance Tameem opens his mouth :s

OmegaSlayer2185d ago

I think Devil May Cry should organize like Mass Effect fans did and clearly tell Capcom that we don't want this direction.

And that it has been proved that Capcom franchises handed to Western developers sink
Bionic Commando
Dead Rising 2 (good but worse than the first)
Resident Evil Operation Raccoon City
And DmC will obviously be the next one.

It's so messed up and worse than that is a coward game
They're so afraid of Bayonetta quality that decided to run away from it with their tail between their legs.
This alone make it look insignificant.
The game is not ambitious, is just...shameful

If people scared EA/Bioware we can scare Capcom enough.

Hawkhunter122185d ago (Edited 2185d ago )

I personally think Ninja Theory wants to pertain towards the Twilight fans too. Why do you think this new Dante looks so emo and somewhat resembles Edward Cullen? Oh wait. Thus, another reason why this future DmC is receiving negative comments.

ziggurcat2185d ago

@ omegaslayer:

it's not up to the fans to decide the direction of any game.

i'm so sick and tired of hearing gamers whine, and their bloated sense of entitlement.

instead of crying like babies, speak with your wallet. that'll send a better message to the devs rather than acting like spoiled brats.

OmegaSlayer2185d ago

Messing a great and loved character kills the devs.

ziggurcat2185d ago (Edited 2185d ago )

christ, if it's not ME3 gamers are whining about like little children, it's this nonsense...

you've not seen any gameplay or other footage, nor have you even played the game, so saying that a change in the way the character looks "ruins" the series is a little silly.

Nitrowolf22184d ago

There has been tons of gameplay footage

Resistance_lord2185d ago

My Mom Said Hi.but then she went to the store

Ashunderfire862185d ago

Especially if the main character looks like the game developer himself.

Statix2184d ago

You know what will kill a videogame series? Changing it beyond all recognition.

+ Show (6) more repliesLast reply 2184d ago
MariaHelFutura2186d ago

These guys/girls say the wrong things and cross the line.....habitually. They're habitual line steppers....

Chitown712912185d ago

Ever gonna learn to shut the f*ck up? Mannnn!!! You made one decent game this generation (Heavenly Sword) , one multi platform game that had potential but didn't live up to it (Enslaved) and now you have the balls to feel like you can do whatever you want and people will buy it? Please shut up, and develop the game and put your money where your mouth is. Cuz if the game looked decent, you wouldn't hear any complaints. DMC was my favorite series last generation , minus 2. I agree it needed a reboot, but not a complete makeover and screw-up like you guys are doing. A reboot doesn't need the main character design to be drastically changed, in order to realize its a reboot. Make subtle changes, but still have characteristics of the icon its portraying. Ninja Theory your cockiness will be your downfall, believe me.

MeatAbstract2185d ago

From the article and quoted from Ninja Theory:

"The decision as to whether DMC needed a reboot or not: it's irrelevant what my opinion is because that decision was Capcom's. They felt it needed something, which is why they not only decided to take a bold step and reinvent it, but to give it to a non-Japanese dev.

"They had their reasons and that was our mandate. They wanted a reinvention - a reinterpretation - and that's what we went ahead and did."

Capcom chose this and passed it on. There is nothing wrong with the 'designing games purely for fans will kill a series' infact it can be quite a true statement. They need fan input but relaly, they should just be going with their gut, which they are.

JoySticksFTW2185d ago

Charlie Murphy!!!!


Cold Bloooded... :D

NegativeCreep4272184d ago (Edited 2184d ago )

"Casual" gamers may be more of a marketable segment of the video game market audience now than in past gaming generations, but that doesn't mean it clouds and rules over the Hardcore segment.

If the title statement from Ninja Theory were true, then how do you explain the continued proliferation of Metal Gear/Metal Gear Solid, Final Fantasy, God of War, Castlevania, Street Fighter, and many others? All of which are hardly focused primarily on the "Casual" segment of the gaming market audience.

Frankfurt2186d ago

They're 100% right.

Doesn't mean changing the main character so drasticly and his (already known) past is a good idea, though. Not to mention making a 60fps ACTION GAME into a 30fps "action game".

metsgaming2186d ago

Sell outs, plain and simple. They hust run towards where they think the money is. Btw im not even a fan of this series but it seems everyone is ruining their games.

Summons752185d ago

Yeah heaven forbid you have a well designed char. and world where he lives in with stories that connect to each games should just let you run around with no reason at all killing everything you see. go away ninja theory nobody cares about you and your massive ego