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Submitted by MonkJammas 1006d ago | news

David Braben: ‘pre-owned has killed core games’

David Braben has attacked the used games market, lamenting the impact that it has on developers, claiming “pre-owned has really killed core games.” (David Braben, Industry)

MostJadedGamer  +   1006d ago
Well its develoers responsibility to make single player games with enough depth, length, and replay value so players keep them for a while.

If theie is no reason to keep playing then of course gamers are going to trade there game back in.
Ulf  +   1006d ago
Right... that's why everyone holds onto their paperback copy of War & Peace, so they can re-read it someday.

There are only a few genres that are truly replayable. Strategy, for example (like Civilization), or open ended sims like Pirates or The Sims. Sports and racing would qualify, if it weren't for the annual re-releases (which is a problem created by the publisher, not the consumer, IMO).

Ironically, Braben created another one of these replayable genres early on in his career -- the "space trader" genre. He co-authored Elite. Elite was one of the MOST replayable games ever to *exist*. If its co-creator says used copies were an issue, then they *were*.
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morganfell  +   1006d ago
I think it would do some good for some of the wild claims people to use Copyright Math. It will debunk their screaming to reveal the reason people aren't buying their products isn't piracy but rather they aren't being purchased because the truth is they are worthless pieces of crap.

I do not care how hard they worked on a product, crap is crap. Most people that pirate an item wouldn't have bought it legally anyway.

This TED video from Rob Reid shows you how something taken at face value due to remarks by the entertainment industry is actually a load of horse dump.

http://www.youtube.com/watc...
#1.1.1 (Edited 1006d ago ) | Agree(9) | Disagree(1) | Report
Kleptic  +   1006d ago
but it still undermines market saturation...imo price more than anything is the problem...In 'normal' markets, price is used to counter competition...and unlike 10 years ago...competition in gaming is higher than ever...

but price, just keeps going up?...EVERY game is $60 new (or at least major retail games)...which is the primary problem...game quality, replayability, amount of content, etc...is given no bearing on price...in other markets, the price is used to illustrate 'what you are getting'...the games industry has NEVER figured that out yet...

developers and publishers can whine all they want about used game sales...but until they start releasing titles with prices to justify what you are actually getting...used game sales will be a big part of purchasing decisions...

So instead of adjusting prices to a point where it makes sense for us (how about $40 for a single player only game?)...the industry is just trying to push out used sales entirely...

and guess what?...it won't work...and devs/publishers are still going to complain about below target sales...

'but making video games is expensive'...its a hell of a lot cheaper than making movies...and the movie industry has NO problem releasing new titles at different price points to illustrate the amount of content on the disc...for A LOT cheaper than a new video game...and still making A LOT more money?...

nothing hurts game sales more than near sighted and archaic price points and business models...its a 'young' entertainment division in that sense, is the only one using this structure, and even in 'hard times'...is the ONLY one struggling...
#1.1.2 (Edited 1006d ago ) | Agree(3) | Disagree(1) | Report
cgoodno  +   1006d ago
***It will debunk their screaming to reveal the reason people aren't buying their products isn't piracy but rather they aren't being purchased because the truth is they are worthless pieces of crap. ***

You're making the same generalized remarks as the companies.

I know a lot of people who pirated ME3, some of them on N4G. Based on the scores and sales, I would hardly call it a worthless piece of crap. But, they pirated it anyway.

The fact remains is that the reasons are many. For some, it's about not giving money to certain companies; others about getting the best price, free; and others it's about trying out games.

What can't be ever determined is how it affects sales. There is no way to determine it. But, that doesn't mean it should be ignored. Far from. Ignoring such a figure as a business will lead them to failing to develop the business to meet the demands of the gamers so they do buy their games.

Unfortunately, I would have to agree with what I assume will come along as a reply, and that is that the businesses have instead worked towards forcing gamers to buy new rather than meeting their demands for new games. I would have to say that in a lot of cases, some gamers demands can never be reached and they will always go the free route.
Smashbro29  +   1006d ago
Or fighting games.
Frankfurt  +   1006d ago
People aren't buying core titles because they are crap?

So games like Bayonetta, Killzone series, Resistance series, Vanquish, God Hand are all crap because they didn't sell?

LOL.

Newsflash: Games like Halo and Skyrim aside, most of the best-selling games are in the "average" end of the spectrum, and the really awesome titles struggle to sell even 1 million copies. Come back to the real world.
#1.1.5 (Edited 1006d ago ) | Agree(1) | Disagree(1) | Report
cyborg6971  +   1006d ago
Make a good product, and quit price gouging us at 60 bucks a game.
cgoodno  +   1006d ago
Even good products get pirated, though.

Pretty much the only way to not get your game pirated in this day and age is to either put it out on consoles only or make it so that the main element of gameplay is done online.

A developer can produce a 200+ hour game that gets high scores across the board, but hundreds of thousands of people will still pirate it if they can.

I'm not saying this to support methods that are supposed to prevent piracy (especially not DRM), but I'm just saying that it's not that simple. Far from, unfortunately.

As far as price, I haven't paid more than $50 for a game new in the last two years with game deals, and games tend to hit the $30 price range after a few months unless they're major releases that are still selling a few thousand each week. Perhaps people should just be more patient?
#1.2.1 (Edited 1006d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(4) | Report
Stealth2k  +   1006d ago
who is this guy? a nobody who is jealous that nobody remembers anything he ever did gamewise
Ulf  +   1006d ago
Wow.

As I stated above, the guy co-created Elite. If you don't know what Elite is, I can't help you. No one can.
Kleptic  +   1006d ago
that space trading thing?...how...is...that...at all relevant? 90% of people currently buying video games probably don't know what that is...and it doesn't matter...at all...
Alos88  +   1006d ago
You sounded pretty elitist there, Ulf.
StanSmith  +   1006d ago
Pre-owned has killed core games? Give me an effin break!

YOU developers and YOUR publishers are killing core games by your nickel and dime tactics. Tactics like locking content on discs until we pay for an unlock key. Tactics like Day 1 DLC! Tactics like rehashing sequel after sequel with very little improvement.

Lazy & Greedy developers/publishers are killing core titles. I'm sick of hearing developers playing the victim card. When they screw us, they don't give a damn but we should suddenly shed a tear for them. Give me a break!
#3 (Edited 1006d ago ) | Agree(10) | Disagree(2) | Report | Reply
Flavor  +   1006d ago
Hate them all you want, games are more popular than ever. They must be doing something right.
Farsendor1  +   1006d ago
i haven't bought one used game im a pc gamer.
T3MPL3TON  +   1006d ago
Waaaaaa, nobody wants to spend $60 on our shitty game! Waaaa!

Start making better games and we'll start buying them day one. Plain and simple.

The excuse of oh well we need day one purchases in order to do that doesn't apply, when every game out there has DLC.
lastdual  +   1006d ago
Yeah, core games are dead. That's why big games for the core market were so scarce last year, and in 2012 the market is really scaling back.

It's not like Halo 4, The Last of Us, Bioshock Infinite, Borderlands 2, Darksiders 2, Far Cry 3, Diablo 3, Assassin's Creed 3, Resident Evil 6, Aliens: Colonial Marines, Grand Theft Auto 5, Max Payne 3, Hitman Absolution, Black Ops 2 and at least a dozen other AAA core titles are hitting this year...

Clearly developers and publishers are just throwing in the towel. No money to be made here!

/s
#6 (Edited 1006d ago ) | Agree(3) | Disagree(1) | Report | Reply
SandwichHammock  +   1006d ago
example.

Lets take a fantasy multiplat: Assassins Creed 8: Robot Pants. Everyone wants this new title, regardless of what platform they are on. Ubimilk puts in a code with each new purchase that entitles customers to all the DLC that will be released throughout the year. And said DLC will be good, not some different coloured robot pants for your character, actual expansions.

Done, used sales problem eliminated. AND customer is happy. Wowie woweroo, what a concept.

edit: Quite a number of articles lately of Gamer Entitlement!! I really don't know where this shit started, but its like everyone that works in the industry wants their own version of Angry Birds, in the sense that it costs pennies to make in relation to the return. Spend a dollar and make billions?! Fook u!!!! Now the customer base is getting shit on because it ain't working out?!

Spin spin spin.
#7 (Edited 1006d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(1) | Report | Reply
Ulf  +   1006d ago
Braben puts his money where his mouth is, BTW.

His most recent notable efforts were some of the most popular downloadable games for the Wii -- Lost Winds, and its sequel. Download-only titles, obviously, cannot be sold used.

Since these were single-player, story-driven games, and thus exceptionally vulnerable to resale issues, that was probably a wise business decision.
#8 (Edited 1006d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(3) | Report | Reply
vortis  +   1006d ago
WHo cares?

The industry makes more money than you could bother to count to with all the time in the world.

Gaming will hit close to $100 billion in annual revenue by 2015.

WTF are people talking about used sales hurting the retail business when EA and Activision make more money than the movie and music industry? If you combined the profits from the top three gaming publishers they make more money than any other consumer media sector combined. WTF is with this corporate apologist thing?

These people are filthy rich, Nexon is worth almost as much as Hollywood made in its entirety throughout 2009. No, they don't need anymore more than they already have and used game sales aren't hurting them like they lead you to believe.
Ness-Psi  +   1006d ago
used games has been around for years why are they moaning about it now?
TheColbertinator  +   1006d ago
Sometimes it was only because of used games that I even knew your games existed.I got Grand Theft Auto 3 used and so did millions of other gamers.Now Grand Theft Auto is one of the biggest franchises in gaming history.
catfrog  +   1006d ago
i kept all my uncharted games, metal gear solid 4 and heavy rain for their stories, demons souls, killzone3 and gran turismo5 for the gameplay, boarderland and white knight chronicles to play with my friends.

then there are games like alpha protocol, darksiders and bulletstorm that i sold back after a week or two because i knew i wasnt going to want to replay them

then i also bought games like homefront, which didnt even spend the night at my house. bought it, beat it, tried the multiplayer, sold it all in the same day.

some games are better then others, so im just going to come out and say that pre owned hasnt killed games, bad developers who think that adding a multiplayer option onto a shooter will magically make me not want to sell the game back. every shooter has this, having a multiplayer in a shooter doesnt make you stand out. you cant copy what the past 10 games have done and expect me to keep yours when i already have the others that are the same thing.

so to fix that, bad developers have killed themselves by not creating compelling games.

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