David Jaffe has addressed the storytelling capabilities of videogames once again, stating that he’s unsure if games can ellicit certain emotions through play and developers should stop trying to force them through non-interactive means instead.
Someone tell Jaffe to play Kingdom Hearts 1 & 2
Who the hell disagreed? Those games had such beautiful storytelling and emotion.
I did. They were fun games, but I didn't feel much emotion during my playthroughs. Besides, I wouldn't call the storytelling "beautiful," not by a longshot.
Jaffe has a point (for those who actually read the article rather than glanced at the title). Games are capable of telling amazing emotional stories through cut-scenes and dialogue but it's hard to portray that in gameplay (and the majority of games fail at this). The only game that comes to mind that has succeeded in eliciting emotion by pressing a button is the Metal Gear Solid series, mainly MGS3... when you fight the Boss and eventually press the shoot button to kill her (which actually triggers a cutscene for more emotional story telling)... man that was rough, well done Kojima and co. probably the only time I hesitated to kill an NPC in a video game. One of, if not, the greatest game(s) of all time.
Shadow of the Colossus = Emotional Trill Ride :D
Holy hell...can't believe people disagree with those two.
Play the infamous ending of InFamous 2 without tearing up at the last part of gameplay. I dare ya. Games are CAPABLE to be sure. But games too often leave all of that in the cutscenes. I'd love to see more games that manage to get emotional stuff integrated in the gameplay like the ICO games, for example.
inFAMOUS 2 has unexpectedly great way of driving a story! the Good ending is 1 thing and the infamous path hurt so much! it was so emotional and any longer, I'll cry!
Kingdom hearts did a fantastic way of evoking emotion because every character introduced was likable. I was shock and gutted when sora killed Roxas in kingdom hearts 2 and the ending to that game is just amazing specially with the amazing soundtrack that it has.
Anything by Team Ico and their games barely have any speech/text either. But yeah, a lot of developers struggle w/ bringing emotion into their games. Which is what makes Team Ico so special, IMO.
I was just about to say that although Jaffe is right too. Some games do pull off good storytelling through actions too. Take both the endings to inFamous 2 very strong storytelling while playing the game. KH 1 & 2 were both beautiful in their storytelling and those games will always hold the top two endings in video games for me. The only two games to actually get me to tear up at the end of the game and leave me utterly speechless.
God I cannot agree more with you about Infamous 2... especially with the evil ending: *Spoiler* Having to kill Zeke in that mercy battle was seriously heartbreaking. *End Spoiler*
I could never get into the KH games... they just were not my thing. But what Jaffe is trying to say is that games can tell emotional stories... but only when they focus on cutscenes. In some cases I agree and in some I disagree. Some of the most powerful moments that I have "played" rather than viewed was the evil ending of Infamous 2 and the dessert scene in Uncharted 3. Both had this unique way of conveying the struggle of the main character, while maintaining involvement by the player. I mean, the evil ending made me feel so bad and the dessert scene made me feel sorry for Drake as he logged around in the dessert I actually had to stop and get water because I was feeling thirsty. What Jaffe is saying is that games should emotionally involve players with the gameplay rather than cut-scenes. Both Infamous and Uncharted had that emotional scene that involved the player, but the other scenes that got players teary (drake and elena at the airport) were cut-scenes. He wants gameplay to be more emotionally involving rather than just the cut-scenes
Yes. Those games are amazing. I have actually cried a couple of times during those games. There are plenty of emotional stories besides KH. FF7 Crisis Core's ending was really emotional. FF X too. A lot of times I am connected more to video game characters than to characters from a book, amovie, or a television show.
I thought Heavy Rain pulled it off rather well.
Came here to post that exact same thing. I actually just tweeted him asking him about heavy rain. Let's see if he responds.
He may say Heavy Rain is not a "game" in the traditional sense. In fact, I hear lots of fans say that it's a different experience, interactive storytelling, etc. People will tell you it's not for everyone, and it isn't. In terms of gameplay, it's not the deepest and that seems to be his criticism that gameplay should be built primarily before storytelling, and that storytelling/emotion should come from the gameplay itself, but it isn't done so well because most use cutscenes to do that. Isn't that what makes us different from movie watchers anyway? At least that's what I get, some of the article is a little confusing A better example IMO is Shadow of the Colossus. That's a game that had an emotional story and told it through the gameplay. That's the key here, telling a story through the gameplay, instead of having games "display" and tell you the story themselves. Sure, SoTC used some cutscenes, but those cutscenes only meant something to me because everything I played up to that point in the cutscene made me feel emotionally responsible. Other games may use cutscenes to feed you an emotion and may rely heavily on that, which takes you out of the experience of interaction. I wouldn't say that it is never the case though.
I was gonna say I thought Heavy Rain did a pretty good job of making you care, at the very least. I don't know if Jaffe is talking about rolling on the floor crying, but I think the most a developer can ask for is making you care about the characters and what happens to them.
I loved heavy rain because it made me feel so involved with it.... but I would argue that it is more an experience than a game.
I must give him Silent Hill 2
Def the most emotionally effecting game I ever played.
Metal Gear Solid 4?
I was just about to say that :)
Metal Gear Solid anything.
Pfft, he should go play Super Mario Bros. for the NES. I mean, all those castles poor Mario had to go thru just to be told, "Your princess is in another castle." I mean, how gut-wrenching!!!!
I agree but then I do not agree. I think games can give off and emotional experience. But not as immense as they have the potential to be. Saying this I think they show it but have so much more room for improvement.
A 10 hour game cannot tell a better story than a 1 1/2 hour movie. Okay then.
Well if its done badly, then length is irrelevant.
That's what she said.
Cyber, what are you doing commenting here at this time? These are school hours! Stop procrastinating!
its hes opinion which means he is the only one that belies that.
Lost Odyssey says hi. That game is one big story!
As mentioned earlier, Heavy Rain and Silent Hill 2 both have exceptionally great emotional stories. Uncharted, Alan Wake, Batman, and God of War III did a fair job at this as well. inFamous 2 was a nice surprise last year. Really though, this is just touching the surface. Ico, Shadow of the Colossus, Persona 3/4, Digital Devil Saga 1 & 2, Mass Effect, Knights of the Old Republic, Jade Empire, Xenosaga, Xenogears, Chrono Cross, and Final Fantasy VIII/X. All of these games offer emotionally resonant stories. I think Jaffe is full of shit, and he hasn't played enough games obviously. You can't tell me you didn't feel anything in the gameplay if you played those games. True, we haven't seen a huge evolution in "interactive" storytelling, as in be able to feel the emotion directly from the actions your doing in-game, but it's enough. It's just a little more subtle, which is a good thing in my opinion.
I think Jaffe is just one of those people that is hard to capture emotionally. He probably wants a game that can make even him sob. If so, imagine what that game could do for the rest of us.
And again, then he hasn't played enough games. I'd like to see him play Ico and Shadow of the Colossus without feeling anything.
Again, he is talking about telling a story THROUGH GAMEPLAY, not expositive cutscenes. And I absolutely agree with him.
Play Ico and Shadow of the Colossus, most of the emotion comes from the gameplay. In my original post, I did acknowledge his point, but I disagree. I provided examples to prove my point. So yes, I read and understood the article. It seems you didn't understand my comment.
Well the ending to Medal of Honor was certainly.... emotional.
Completely agree. That whole game had a very emotional story and the ending just topped it all.
Some games have emotion in the story. We're still getting there but I can name a few games that actually made me feel sad in certain parts.
Bioshock, Shadow of Colossus and MGS3. I played 2 of these games in middle school. Jaffe is sometimes full of shit, I understand he is going for fun with twisted metal, but cannot simply discredit what others have done.
MGS4 had me in tears in a few spots.
Most of the best game stories are on par with a good action movie. MGS4 is probably the only game that elicited deep emotions in me.
Can we just agree that Jaffe is a great gaming developer but not always on the smart side of things with his opinions?
Games just need better writing in general, and everything will be possible.
Everygame can't be based on some war either.
To everyone who commented and didn't read the article, do yourselves a favor and read it first. Hopefully you do it before your editing time expires on your comments. As always, when Jaffe talks, you CANNOT just read the title and form your opinion on his comment based on that. What he said is true for most games, and I think he's touched an important point. I personally hate it when cutscenes are completely different from the game I'm playing. I'd go through a gameplay segment, then it would cut to a cutscene to tell the story and my character, and the game, would suddenly be completely different from what I just played. His actions, words, and overall emotional tone of the game will be drastically different just because it's a cutscene. Then I go back to gameplay, and it's back to being emotionless, and my character moves nothing like he did in the CG. What Jaffe is saying, as usual, isn't for ALL developers to overnight stop trying to make emotional stories. He's just saying that if you're making a game, and you're not capable of conveying the emotions you want through gameplay rather than cutscenes, then either find a different medium or make a different game. And I totally agree with that. That is NOT to say others can't or haven't been able to marry gameplay and emotion. Shadow of the Colossus is a perfect example of that. But if your name's not Ueda, then there's a slim chance you're able to make gameplay-driven emotional games like he can!
People who only read the title seem to have translated it into something like: Your game of choice sucks!!!!!! Which of course this article isn't about individual titles as there are always exceptions to anything. This discussion is about how games as a whole could improve. For me, that is part of the reason that I gravitate towards games as a medium. There is almost always some sort of new way of storytelling or new gameplay aspects. This article(as I've already touched on) is about games lacking(more or less) as a whole. Not a slight against my favorite game that got me emotional. EDIT: I'm just grateful that somebody else actually read the article lol.
I cried when I finished Xenogears. If that's not emotion, then what is?
No wonder eat,sleep and play let him go. He's completely out of his mind. I think he's just saying those things for attention. Even God of War; the one he helped create had emotional stories which a lot of fans really liked. How a broken man seek vengeance to avenge his family.
Lol, they didn't let him go he was actually the one who decided to leave...
Mgs3 told it pretty well though. Best ending in any videogame.
I can remember A LOT of games that made me feel emotional, so I really dont get what this guy is saying. Did anyone here saw the ending from Professor Layton 3? Or the desolated world from the last week of TWEWY? Or the standard final from Chrno Trigger? This guy need to play some real games.
This is why I create films based on video games. Like this one:
MGS Series - Heavy Rain top of my mind. Jaffe is an idiot he thinks because his bloody and gory games ( GOW-TM) are popular then these are the games to make. Dikc head
Yeah Mr. Jaffe, Because Aeriths death, The moment we found out who the killer was in heavy rain, No Russian, the decision whether to save or leach a little sister, or your very own Kratos standing at the edge of a cliff ready to dive head first was completely unemotional....I love this guy but sometime he talks out of his A$$....really
Ffs, people take Jaffe's comments so personally. Did you even read the article? He did NOT say no games are emotional. That's not what he said at all. He said developers need to find ways to convey emotions through gameplay rather than custcenes. Aeris? Cutscene. Heavy Rain, No Russian, Bioshock? Gameplay. I'll take FFVII, since you brought it up: if a party member dying during battle had an impact on the overarching story, then that would be gameplay driving emotion. But instead, your party members can die an infinite number of times in battle and you can keep reviving them. But then one cutscene comes along and kills off Aeris (that's how her name was spelled in my version of the game...) and suddenly you can't give her a phoenix down. Was it emotional? You bet. Was it gameplay? No. That's all he's saying. He thinks the medium, to go forward, needs to tell stories in their gameplay rather than in cutscenes, or to just make movies instead.
But what he or you doesnt realize is that you cannot convey emotions through gameplay, only the player can do so, they have to give a fuk to do so. Its like if im playing call of duty, and i get killed, sure i can respawn, but i still get upset that i died or didnt kill. Some ppl may react differently though, some may cry, some may laugh, some may not even care. But in FF7, it gave you a crapload of hours with this girl, she fought by your side, you guys acted in a play together, took a skyline ride, etc. You damn near was in love with this girl, yet you were still trying to understand sephiroth, then BAM he kills her, so you went from falling in love with her, through gameplay the entire course of the game up to that point, to sad and shocked the way her life was taken right in front of you, to angry cuz the scumbag who did it was right in front of you, to tearing his mother a new asshole in a rage battle motivated by hate almost instantly.......thats alot of emotion in a greater span then just that cut scene....if Mr. Jaffe is looking for a way to create emotion out of every little death in a video game, it isnt going to happen, as humans we are insensitive to real life drama issues let alone virtual ones. Emotions have to be built over time and attachments have to be made before you get a true emotion like the one we got from Aerith, and yes, her name was aerith gainsborough in my copy, i know. Cuz i loved her ;)
MGS1 saving meryl.MGS4 Microwave oven scene & final boss battle. just to name a few. MGS series rules in that area, why didn't he try to do it then? instead of all the blood and violence ? this guy is a huge Dikc.
Uncharted 3, chapter 18. I felt like I was with Drake in the sand. His sense of helplessness was palpable. The best part about it was the fact it was out of cutscene.
You know recently Jaffe has been spewing a LOT of garbage. Maybe it's time he played RDR, MGD, FFs, etc. Seriously, what the hell do you play.
Jaffe is one of those who only plays games with nudity, gore and violence.
plays them? he bloody makes them.
hmmm....if you played squaresoft games during the ps1 era...yep...those are quality titles.Nothing beats those. Tell me if he has a game that has the same mindfuck level as xenogears!
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