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Xbox Kinect was never designed for the 'hardcore' gamer

Microsoft explains the Kinect's original goal was for gamers to share their passion with their families

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fluffydelusions2511d ago

Well we know this know but long before it's actual release MS and their preview videos would want you to believe otherwise.

Colwyn2511d ago

xbox 360 was never designed for the casual gamers

SKUD2511d ago (Edited 2511d ago )

Agree with colwyn. I've always seen it as:

Nintendo (current state): Casual. Games for kids.

XBOX: Hardcore console games. Not apologizing for it. I was ok with this.

Sony: The perfect blend of both. Always taking a chance on the unknown.

Everything is all mixed up now. There all fighting to be the same.

Mustang300C20122511d ago (Edited 2511d ago )

It isn't for the core or causals or hardcore. It is simply for gamers. Time for people to let go of the labels that marketing folks made of gamers. We are all gamers. No one here can give an official defintion on what an actual casual or hardcore gamer is. Just their own opinion.

lifesanrpg2511d ago

@RedHemi300c

I disagree with you 100%. There is a difference between a "hardcore" gamer and a "casual" gamer...

I'd hardly consider someone who plays bejeweled blitz on Facebook to be in the same marketing category as someone who plays CoD religiously.

They may both play games, but they are too totally different markets. Hence the need to distinguish.

What you are referring to is when someone says "hardcore" is better than "casual".

Hufandpuf2511d ago

@that_whore

The Xbox is the mix of both, Nintendo is casual, and ps3 is hardcore. There are more casual games on Xbox than ps3. When families go out to buy a console they usually go for Nintendo or MS. when ps3 come to mind its usually metal gear solid, god of war, dark souls, and uncharted, hardly casual games.

2511d ago
Why o why2511d ago (Edited 2511d ago )

RedHemi300c

http://en.wikipedia.org/wik...

Even without that link should be able to tell there's a difference between a casual gamer that would never be on a site like this debating all things gaming to us. Core gamers also play casual games but its not their bread and butter or main gaming preference. Its almost like you cant acknowledge the difference between those who drive Subarus vs those who drive Prius's ...yeah they're all drivers but they're different just like a casual gamer from a core gamer

http://www.computerandvideo...

notice what games he refers to as 'core', notice that he differentiates between core and casual even though I personally believe that some games blur the lines

Ill throw a question out to n4g...Is Super Puzzle Fighter II core or casual....I think its core because of its complexity and learning curve even though on the surface it seems casual...Just a question.

@ gamingdroid.. Definitely.. anybody who says they haven't been a casual or dabbled in casual gaming is deluded BUT the point is people like us on n4g are definitely NOT in the same gaming category as soccer moms who couldnt tell and MMO from an M16

gamingdroid2511d ago (Edited 2511d ago )

@lifesanrpg

So what would you call a gamer like me, that plays Angry Bird and Fruit Ninja on my phone?

Enjoys an occasional Mario Party or Kinect Sports, but also plays a lot of Gears of War, Mass Effect, CoD and so on.

We all aren't younger than tweenies and only play "hardcore" games. Some of us also loves to play in a social setting and others have families, that they would like to game with.

Gamer-Z2511d ago

@gamingdroid

I would say your "hardcore" you enjoy all types of games and not just the mass marketed pop games. Its funny how people on this site get insecure about their hardcoreness to the point where they have to ask Lol

+ Show (6) more repliesLast reply 2511d ago
MariaHelFutura2511d ago (Edited 2511d ago )

Uhhh. I'm pretty sure they said that Kinect would do games for the hardcore.

Pew.Pew.Pew. Comes to mind.

-ducks behind couch-

jimbobwahey2511d ago

I'll never understand why people are shocked when Microsoft lie to their customers.

smashcrashbash2511d ago

Yeah that's what they said. That is what all of Microsoft's flunkies said. Remember how many people said Child of Eden would be THE game that would attract hardcore and almost no one brought it? But now most hardcore have shown they don't give a $hit it's backpedaling and damage control time

SilentNegotiator2510d ago

Plus, they're trying to market their "hardcore" games as the "best version" because they paid* devs/pubs for exclusive voice control. As if yelling at the TV is a better solution than to clicking the right bumper for the next gun setup, or memorizing commands to yell instead of holding a button and selecting it.

*(ps2 games and older had no issue with voice control, and with no compromises (see SOCOM, which had plenty of fairly opened up levels), and the ps3 has its own simple set for implementing voice control, so don't tell me that the reason for the exclusivity is Kinect's "powerful" application chip or setup for adding voice control)

FunkMacNasty2510d ago

Yea they did say that. And what exactly did they deliver for the "hardcore" crowd.. like some silly hack n' slash that was allegedly a survival horror game (was it called "Rise of the Nightmare" or something?? I cant exaclty remember), but it got terrible reviews. Then between 20 releases of cute and cuddly Kinect Shovelware, they release that Blackwater game, which also recieved abhorrent scores.

The closest they've come to so far to a hardcore Kinect-tion (excuse the pun, i couldn't resist) was head-tracking on Forza Motorsport 4, which is unncessary and I'd doubt any serious Forza competitor uses it.

So yea.. thanks for finally telling the truth, Microsoft. I guess I won't keep my hopes up for any cool peripherals that would make a hardcore game worth playing with Kinect integration.

+ Show (1) more replyLast reply 2510d ago
Asgaro2510d ago

Hahaha.
Did anyone seriously expect they will make hardcore games for Kinect?

I thought after the Wii, people would know better.
Guess not...

NYC_Gamer2511d ago

only an idiot expected kinect to be hardcore focused

Godmars2902511d ago

You mean like the idiots in the MS PR department who kept saying it?

That MS as a whole is giving up on the *con*cept even though their Panzer Dragoon and Steel Battalion titles aren't out yet? Not to mention getting EA to attach voice command to ME3 instead of using a headset.

YodaCracker2510d ago

Headsets don't have built-in voice recognition software like Kinect offers...

2511d ago Replies(3)
kaveti66162511d ago (Edited 2511d ago )

Microsoft's PR said Kinect would have hardcore games.

Edit: And down below PamPoovey, who joined 13 days ago, is saying, "Really.....because when Kinct was revealed all you guys have been saying is that it's for the core and always was...how we all love it and how it's already aimed at us"

"All you guys were saying...."

Joined 13 days ago?

13?

Why hasn't PamPoovey been banned yet?

Hicken2510d ago

Because people visit sites before they join them. I haven't been commenting on this site for a year, but I've been using it since about October 2010. My coworkers have been visiting the site for longer and have yet to make an account.

I don't generally agree with Pam Poovey, but in this case, she's right. Far too many people were all over the Kinect bandwagon. And yet, after all this time, that view has not been vindicated.

Magnus2511d ago

Microsoft really screwed up the marketing instead of just family fun they should have also incorporated the hardcore gamer as well. Support of two fields brings in more money and sells more product. The Kinnect is alright great technology but marketed poorly its not family fun that has supported the Xbox but the harcoregamer is what made the Xbox what it is today.

Mustang300C20122511d ago

Oh shut up. Kinect is used for more than games yet it has sold over 18 million and a year later we got folks like you whining about who it is for? Grow up. LMAO how you claim it is marketed poorly yet it has sold as many as it has. Tell me what is the offical definition of a hardcore gamer?

DeathAvengers2511d ago

Yeah I don't really understand why people keep saying that. It seems like nothing can be "family fun" anymore and recieves hate for little or no reason. I mean, I've noticed that people are hating on MS for marketing THEIR product the way they wanted to and probably the way that would get them the most successful results. Seems like everyone wants a product that shows off gritty, gore-crazy games. This is what gaming has been reduced to.

2511d ago
PamPoovey2511d ago (Edited 2511d ago )

Really.....because when Kinct was revealed all you guys have been saying is that it's for the core and always was...how we all love it and how it's already aimed at us

It's only recently they've admitted the truth and thats because they know they've sold enough to make a profit now....the core suckers served their purpose.

http://www.technobuffalo.co...

http://www.computerandvideo...

http://www.vg247.com/2011/0...

GribbleGrunger2511d ago

a little harsh but difficult to disagree with. have any of you seen the latest Starwars promotion? here, take a look at the future:

http://www.youtube.com/watc...

PirateThom2511d ago

"A controller... not as clumsy or random as a Kinect. An elegant input device, for a more civilized age."

LackTrue4K2510d ago

all they need to do is, replace the audio with Gilligan's Island theme song playing. That way an Xbox owner will feel no shame JUMPING OUT THE BOAT!

EVILDEAD3602510d ago

'Really.....because when Kinct was revealed all you guys have been saying is that it's for the core and always was...how we all love it and how it's already aimed at us'

LOL @ that not even being CLOSE to what happened when Kinect was revealed.

The best part is the fact that NONE of your article links come close to saying it either.

The truth is when Kinect was revealed all of the media said it would fail because they said the 360 'core' gamer wouldn't buy one and the casuals were owned by 'nintendo' who wouldn't trade in theor Wiis for a 360 and Kinect.

Fast forward and the millions and millions of Kinect owners are made up of ALL types of gamers, just like the Wii.

Kinect is a hands down success because these internet ducktales simply don't represent reality when you log off.

Some of the biggest Kinect heads I know still spend a gazillion hours on Liver working on their 4th prestige in COD.

Both Micrsoft and Sony created their niche in the motion control space.

Kinect has or will be implemented in some way into almost every hardcore game genre there is by the end of this year.

At the end of the day, those games as well as Kinect are still optional.

Evil

2504d ago
PirateThom2511d ago

http://news.softpedia.com/n...

""There are many [hardcore games] coming," he said to CVG. "This is sort of scratching the surface of what's happening, but we've got Child of Eden here today, we've got Twisted Pixel's Gunstringer... and certainly you're going to see more. We're not even a hundred days since we launched Kinect yet. It was very intentional with Kinect to go out and deliver blockbusters like Kinect Sports and Dance Central - games that resonated with a broader audience.""

http://www.g4tv.com/thefeed...

"According to Microsoft's UK marketing boss Stephen McGill, hardcore Kinect games will be shown off in 2011."

http://www.industrygamers.c...

"Kinect isn't designed to alienate the hardcore gamers who've put Xbox in the position it's in today, however. Microsoft still hopes to create games for the core gaming crowd on Kinect, Albert Penello, senior director of global marketing for Xbox 360 told IndustryGamers."

Odd statements to make previously then.

Why o why2511d ago (Edited 2511d ago )

Thom...Its not nice to play with shotguns and its never fair to pont them at peoples faces...lol

Pr is just that...Pr Many fans believed the 'kinect can do core hype' but the demos the fake shows and the tech itself made the skeptics sound like haters when they were mostly just saying what they saw NOT and believing what they were told like the kinect defenders. Couple years later and the best game ive played on kinect is fruit ninja....no sign of anything core...that has been replaced by intergration which many people predicted from the bloody get go (also called haters)

Worst thing is people will STILL label people who have stated things similar to what Microsoft are now saying as haters or whatever.

Peeeep Peeeep Peeeep

PirateThom2511d ago

Everyone but the diehards prediected the "you are the controller" nonsense was never going to apply to core games. I'm not even sure what the point of the integration is for the most part but Kinect does what we all knew it would do well. Dance Central, Kinectimals, Disneyland and Seasame Street.

Panaru2511d ago

Eesh, man, straight for the jugular. Have a "well said" bubble vote.

GribbleGrunger2511d ago (Edited 2511d ago )

@piratethom: but will those statements register with MS fans? you know the answer

EVILDEAD3602510d ago (Edited 2510d ago )

Where did they lie in ANY statement made about hardcore games?

Article #1: Came out last March. Just like the article said Micrsoft's intention all along was to initially capture what made Nintendo a hit with games like K.Sports and Dance Central. They then talked about how 'Eden' came first with Ginslinger and more coming. The article then talks about how they gave more tools to 3rd party such as facial recognition and voice control in hopes it would lend to more creative games in the hardcore space.

Article 2: LOL @ you going back to November 2010 for that one. In the article they were talking about 2 of the Japanses hardcore games that are still coming Steel Batallion and Suda 51's 'Codename D'.

Wow Pirate Thom..you completely missed what Microsoft said in the 3rd article..let me help.

'Regarding core gaming on Kinect, he elaborated, "Core gamers will say to me, 'What is Kinect going to do for me?' Well, you probably have a girlfriend, or you have a sister, or a brother, or a niece, or a nephew, or a wife, or a mom, or an aunt who you’ve probably wanted to have experience, you know, the kind of stuff that you enjoy. And oh, by the way, we're doing some really cool stuff with dash navigation and the people who experience it really get a kick out of the sort of virtual reality/Minority Report style. And oh by the way, we just launched the thing. At no point have we ever said, 'I don’t have any interest in having core games come out on Kinect.' We wanted to come out and make a statement that said, 'We want to try and do something different than the Wii, different than wands and hands, something that’s magical, that takes away the abstraction, and I want a bunch of new types of games created.'

Again, they have been up front about Kinect from Day one.

They never needed Kinect to control shooters as the 360 controller is perfection for Shooters.

Bottomline Kinect topped the motion control experiences that Nintendo Wii had a monopoly on.

They led with a few core type experiences in it's first year, but we are now in year two and we see what's on deck.

Sports games ARE core games and Fifa, Madden, and Tiger Woods are the biggest core sports games on earth..all will use Kinect to control them this year. (See Tiger Woods impressions of Kinect after hw played for the first time)

You have Mass Effect 3, Ghost Recon, Rainbow Six etc.

Plus you have Project Draco, Steel Batallion, and Fable: The Journey.

It's all still apart of the 360 experience. The controller isn't going anywhere for core period, but when you want different experiences that you and your family can enjoy then Kinect provides that option.

If not you can simply not play or own one and whine on the internet about how no one should enjoy it because you don't.

Millions chose option 1...we know where to find who chose option 2

Evil

PirateThom2510d ago

I'm glad you're able to clear up these PR statements... even though they're completely contradictory to what Microsoft are now saying.

EVILDEAD3602510d ago

Who has to clear them up? Simply read them. Since day one they have been saying who they were targeting Kinect to. But when the hardcore question kept coming out they have always said they wanted the implementation to make sense. They have been all about game experienced geared toward what Kinect does best.

The strategy has clearly worked thus far if it didn't there would be a thousand articles exclaiming it failed.

Evil

Why o why2510d ago (Edited 2510d ago )

Evil, you may feel they came good on their claims but thats if you blur the lines between core and casual games. A sports game is core but that same sports game with limited application of kinect is not. That is not core gaming on kinect as you know as well as most of us do that complex hair trigger inputs that make sports games core cannot be achieved and the proof is the fact there are no complex sports games available. Try not to take what im saying the wrong way but telling me how well kinect is doing is irrelavant here. MS and many members here on n4g were telling us kinect could do core and will produce core games...Everybody knew who kinects target audience were so mentioning that is a moot point, anybody who feels it wasnt primarily aimed at the casual market and is now accusing ms of foul play is playing dumb or truly ignorant.

"I think we know that hard-core gamers will be the first to go out and buy it, as they are with any product," Moore told CVG. "So we know we have to have a wide range of experiences, from things like [an] animals game to games that are more geared towards the core."

MS have stated (please google) that it can do core but we are still waiting. Not saying kinect isnt fun or successful im just saying it cant do core gaming by itself.

Heres an article that feels some games will address a perception some feel doesnt really exist and that is that their is a core game expectation for kinect

http://www.nowgamer.com/fea...

On paper some of those games do seem to be more on the core end than casual BUT judgements will have to be made after playing these titles. Ill also say that core is different for each person but according to greenbergs definition core games are the games like crackdown, gears, forza and any other game he states are core in the interview i posted earlier. That fable is a core game dumbed down and the closest to core gaming kinect will probably ever have is something that requires an additional input device be it pad stearing wheel or wand. Ive no personal issue with that as I predicted that well over a year ago but what i do have an issue is calling forzas kinect intergration core gaming thus saying kinect has core games when that clearly isnt the case. Can you play forza with kinect alone......exactly

EVILDEAD3602510d ago (Edited 2510d ago )

This is pure entertainment. Look this isn't rocket science we definately get where Pirate Thom and of course we know where Why o Why stands.

But, once again, Pirate Thom used 3 article links that literally showed that Microsoft has done exactly what they claimed.

Why O why will jump in multiple articles claiming that soccer moms are the ones who buy Kinect, but then NOW he's pretending that he's some avid Kinect player.

'Couple years later and the best game ive played on kinect is fruit ninja....no sign of anything core'

LMFAO @ the best game YOUVE played. You don't own or play Kinect you freely admit it why claim Fruit Ninja now because you read what ACTUAL Kinect owners say they enjoy.

Here's the bottomline, no matter how Why o Why or any of the Kinect detractors have to downplay EVERY Kinect game as dumbed down or not hardcore, but that's his opinion and he's not the audience that is interested in what Kinect has to offer.

For instance Game Informer reviewed 'The Gunstringer' and said this:

'The Gunstringer proves that Kinect can appeal to hardcore gamers looking for fast-paced action and a great story.'

The Wii mainly won last gen on the strength of Wii Sports and later Wii Fit. Now we see that Just Dance is the game that sells more Wiis than Zelda.

Right out of the gate, Kinect matched and topped all 3 of those experiences with Kinect Sports, Dance Central, and Fitness Evolved.

Sony's strategy with Move has been to market it mainly as an alternate controller with existing hardcore games.

Kinect is adapting that approach with the 'Better' motto. Kinect has now been used in core games such as Forza 4, Halo Anniversary, and Child of Eden.

Now this year it will continue with Fifa, Madden, and of course the upcoming Mass Effect 3.

Nobody is claiming that games like Fable:The Journey and Sorcery are on the level as Fable, Elder Scrolls or Final Fantasy. But what it is is a hardcore franchise built up from the ground with Kinect in mind and that's all you can ask.

If people havent figured out that Micrsofts hardcore gamers already play Gear 3, Halo Reach, Call of Duty: MW3, Black Ops, and Elder Scrolls by the millions as it is. They never need Kinect to compete with those franchises. Wghat it does is allow those gamers that want to play fun experiences with family and friends and have an alternate in the mutli-media space as well..they have an option.

And like I've said millions have chosen that option in only a year and a few months since launch.

Evil

+ Show (1) more replyLast reply 2510d ago
Oner2510d ago (Edited 2510d ago )

PirateThom with the undisputed facts & links (though it's clear there are those who will try no matter what)...

But is anyone else <reading or hearing> a sheep's "Baaaah...Baaaah..." when it comes to some of the statements/excuses being said in some of these comments?

Or is it just me? LoL! >_<

Anyway, great post Thom!

+ Show (2) more repliesLast reply 2510d ago