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High Horse: Broken PS3 Skyrim was inevitable, is inexcusable, and is probably your fault

David Houghton: I’m creating a clever (and marginally disgusting) allegory for Bethesda’s broken-as-all-hell PS3 version of Skyrim. It is you see, fundamentally messed up on a level that I view as patently unfit for release. And apparently Bethesda had no idea that the game it had spent years building and testing was so broken. I mean it can’t have known. Otherwise it’s quietly, knowingly released a busted product and cynically dicked over a large part of its fan-base. And the worst part? I saw this coming weeks ago. And it’s partly that very fan-base’s fault.

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DonaldBeck1712d ago (Edited 1712d ago )

i wonder if they will patch the game to where the ps3 version does not have these problems. anyways great game, but the title overdramatises it. if it looked like a ps2 game locked at 10 fps and it fan only at 480p then it would be broken. edited

aquamala1712d ago

They never fixed fallout 3 ps3, I had to reboot every coupl of hours near the end, and the last dlc is unplayable for me.

gameplayingfool1712d ago (Edited 1712d ago )

A bit over dramatic, I think.

There have been some issues on my PS3 playing Skyrim, BUT NONE HAVE RENDERED THE GAME UNPLAYABLE BY ANY STRETCH of the imagination. Others may have not been so lucky...

Still, I hope Bethesda does something about this.

8.5MB save, very few troubles.

DonaldBeck1712d ago

why? do you think bethesda knows about this stuff happening with the ps3 version? and if they do...wtf is wrong with them?

Fil1011712d ago

lol I played fallout NV couple of weeks ago now granted this dont happen to everyone but as soon as I left that house where the guy patches you up at the very start it froze thats when I decided not to carry on with it kind ov a shame but to me its a game braker there is nothing worse than having to reset your console.

DatNJDom811712d ago (Edited 1712d ago )

This is why I bought Dark Souls instead of a bethesda product. bethesda doesnt support PS3 like it does xbox because they prefer the easier to program xbox. dont support lazy devs and shit like this wont happen.

It isnt 2006 anymore. Sorry guys get your asses in gear.

Wait didnt Oblivion actually play better on PS3? If so why would they not put the same amount into this game?

lastdual1712d ago

@DatNJDom81 The PS3 port of Oblivion was outsourced to 4J Studios, who apparently were better at coding for Sony's platform than Bethesda themselves.

Once my Skyrim save file hit double digits, the game became unplayable. Seriously, I was getting 6-8 frames per second within 15 minutes of booting the game up. It's BROKEN and should never have been released in this state.

A patch may or may not fix the lag problem, but given Bethesda's poor support for the PS3 versions of Fallout 3 and New Vegas, I chose not to hold my breath for one. Returned the game last night and *if* I do rebuy, it will be for another platform.

kaveti66161712d ago

" dont support lazy devs and shit like this wont happen."

lazy developers. Do you have any idea how much stuff you have to learn to get to that position?

It's not about being lazy, it's about having a standard for workplace quality. When the console maker decides to stop thinking about its own pockets and about "extending the life of the console blah blah blah," and starts thinking about how it can make life easier for the developers, then Bethesda can start giving a crap about the PS3.

It wasn't Bethesda's fault to deliberately making the PS3 a difficult console to work with. That was Sony's volition. Bethesda does the best they can with the time, money, tools, and hardware they have to work with. If Sony can't respect that, then they're the ones to blame.

DragonKnight1712d ago

@kaveti: You'd have an argument 5 years ago, not today. Explain why practically every other developer can have a perfectly fine development process for the PS3 without the massive bugs that Bethesda's games have, but Bethesda can't? Because the PS3 is hard to program for? And yet no name studios can code better for it than Bethesda?

So, lazy developers is accurate when the evidence backs it up.

Jonah_Reese1712d ago

@Kaveti
That is a 5 or 6 year old comment, how many developers complain about the PS3 being difficult to develop for? Even Gabe Newell doesn't complain anymore, why? because he understands it. I'm not Calling Bethesda lazy because even the most crappy games take a lot of work. But if they would have paid as much to the PS3 version as they it's counter-parts, this would be a lesser issue. Get out of 2006 dude.

Personally I don't know if this is wide spread but it has me worried because I really wanted and Kinda still want Skyrim.

zag1712d ago

It won't be the saves.

It'll be people trying to play a game for 25 to 35+ hours straight.

You generally can't do that on any platform even on the PC games will fall apart at those lengths of time, simply because over time data becomes corrupt and if you save that corrupt data then it won't load up properly again there after and you lose all the data.

The devs will be expecting people to really only play the game for 2 to 8 hours max in a session.

But the kids and people with no jobs will be playing the game at stupid lengths of time.

That corrupt data over time happens on all platforms and all sorts of games, hearts of iron does it after so many hours as well.

It's also a problem of 32bit programs where you can only allocate 2gig max of memory in a block, and it becomes harder for the CPU to cache all this data properly as the cache will only hold say 512kb of cache per CPU and stuff.

it's just the limits of the tech not the program, you can't alter tech limits via software.

zag1712d ago

@DragonKnight

The main reason why you don't see it from many devs is that most consoles games are only FPSes and platformers and stuff nothing that would be trying to hit up a database and reading/writing data to all the time and using memory to hold the data.

In RPG games you'll be caching and reading/writing data you almost everything in-game, like a sword that could be a default one but changes when you add a gem needs to always kept in memory and when you hit up a NPC and then go and do a wuest you need to hold the quest objectives and then hold the data for the NPC you last hit up so the game can keep track of everything your doing in the game.

there's a huge difference between a FPS or plat former and only needing to know when something got hit and is dead and need to be removed in 5 seconds and a RPG trying to hold data for the whole of the USA and everything in that country, while also keeping a track of everything you do and touch with everything in that country.

Biggest1712d ago

I don't play for 25 hours straight and I still encounter the ridiculously low frame rate. Every zone, every camp, and every battle lowers the frame rate. As someone here stated before. . . When I first boot the game I get the frame rate problems. It's cool to find excuses for Bethesda's terrible PS3 coding. Extended play has nothing to do with this one.

MikEyG1711d ago

Damn right them fuckin lazy dicks cant release a glitch free game this gen.I'm glad I didn't waste my money I learned my lesson on fallout new vegas

DragonKnight1711d ago (Edited 1711d ago )

@zag: your comment is inaccurate and irrelevant. For one, most console games are NOT FPS'. That you think they are shows you're not paying attention. Two. There is not a complete drought of RPG's on the PS3 similar to Skyrim. Take a look at Demon's/Dark Souls. There is plenty of evidence to back up the statement that it is all Bethesda's fault that Skyrim on the PS3 has so many problems. Stop trying to defend them, and instead call them on their lazy coding because they are afraid of hard work.

Yes, Skyrim is large game. They chose to make it multiplat. You can't just phone in one version because you don't like the architecture. When even Gabe Newell stops complaining about the PS3's architecture, then you know that anyone else still whining about it is just spewing B.S. because they're lazy.

There's no excuse for a framerate of 6fps and continual freezing. There is no excuse for forcing the modding community for the PC version to fix the problems for free. Bethesda are lazy, and it's as simple as that. If they can't take the time to make sure this massive bugs are ironed out, they shouldn't even start making the game at all.

kaveti66161711d ago (Edited 1711d ago )

The argument is still valid. The PS3 is still harder to develop for than the 360 is.

The reason why other games don't have as many bugs or glitches is because most other multiplatform games are not open world games with a large scope.

Secondly, the PS3 is as hard to develop for today as it was 5 years ago. There are still 6 SPEs which have to be separately coded and complied for, which means Bethesda has to do 6 times the work to get things running on the PS3 than on the 360, because Microsoft made it so that the compiler for their 360 will automatically split up the work to the 3 cores.

Why is it that Microsoft thought of this but Sony didn't?

Why did Sony defend their stupid decision to make the PS3 harder to program for instead of manning up to their mistakes?

And what exactly has happened since 5 years ago that makes you think the PS3 is easier to develop for now?

You guys also make the mistake of assuming that most developers don't complain about PS3 development now.

That's an appeal to ignorance. "If I can't see it, then it's not happening."

It is not in the nature for a developer to be lazy. Being a developer means you worked your ass off to get to where you are.

Most of us couldn't program a simple calculator application, yet these people are creating massive, detailed environments populated with characters who behave in certain ways and react to the behavior of the player. That's not easy to do.

Bethesda optimized their engine to work well on PC and 360. Sony decided to make their console different.

Why? Don't blame Bethesda. Gabe Newell's statements were spot on 5 years ago. All the ass-kissing he's doing now stems from the fact that his company is in it for the money.

oldjadedgamer1711d ago

It's Bethesda. Anyone buying early should expect bugs. It's why I buy all their games in a game of the year version later.

It's like they've never heard of testers.

@kav, quit white knighting for the devs. They sold a broken product.

DragonKnight1711d ago

@kaveti: the argument is completely INvalid. You say the issue is that most multiplatform games aren't open world? What about Assassin's Creed? What about the Batman games? What about Dark Souls? If the PS3 is so hard to program for, why do these games work with far less problems than any one Bethesda game hmm? What about the first party open world games like Infamous?

When all the other devs have come to grips with the PS3's architecture, when the most vocal of naysayers have shut up or began praising the PS3, how can you sit there and defend Bethesda for releasing a p*ss poor port (aliteration for the win) full of bugs for the, what, 4th time now?

This is Bethesda's track record. They are lazy coders. Just because you are making a massive game, doesn't mean you aren't a lazy coder. They simply do not want to put in the work to make the game have minimal bugs. IT'S THEM! Not the PS3. Remember the saying, it is a poor craftsman who blames his tools.

How come there are many great 3rd party developers making exceptional PS3 versions of their multiplatform games, but yet Bethesda keeps bringing out the trash in terms of bugs? How is that the PS3's fault? It isn't. Simply put, the vast amount of excellent 3rd party games that don't have the issues that Bethesda games have on the PS3 more than refutes your argument.

Bethesda released a broken product, period. They're just lucky they have a free labor force on the PC that will fix their broken game without any compensation whatsoever. But to say that it's not a broken game, and that it's the consoles fault, is completely wrong. The PS3 didn't develop Skyrim, Bethesda did. You can sit there ignoring that fact all you want, doesn't make it go away.

vickers5001711d ago

"Explain why practically every other developer can have a perfectly fine development process for the PS3 without the massive bugs that Bethesda's games have, but Bethesda can't?"

Because no other developer has created a game as deep or content packed as Bethesda. The Uncharteds, Killzones, GTAs, (etc.) of the gaming industry can go on virtually bugless because they have NOWHERE NEAR the amount of content that a Bethesda game does. Those games run fine because they don't have to run very much or deal with very much, as they only really have to focus on running the graphics and the very simplistic gameplay.

"Take a look at Demon's/Dark Souls. There is plenty of evidence to back up the statement that it is all Bethesda's fault that Skyrim on the PS3 has so many problems."

Sorry, but if you think DS counts as evidence, then I feel sorry for you. Demon/Dark Souls runs fine because it's nowhere near as complex or deep as Skyrim.

Want to prove to me that Bethesda are lazy devs? Then show me a game that is as deep, complex, long, deep, well designed, while still managing to look as good as Skyrim and maybe I'll listen to you, but as long as you are still using your sorry ass argument by comparing other more primitive games like Dark/Demons Souls, then your claims are worthless.

hesido1711d ago

People who don't see this problem and indirectly defending Bethesda are not being reasonable at all.

Just because you do not have problems doesn't mean others don't, plus the fact that Skyrim is open-world and there are thousand ways to play it, the problem may not manifest in all play-throughs.

Now I know why play-tester were doing speed-runs :)
http://www.geek.com/article...

Sub4Dis1711d ago

i didn't read all the comments here, so my apologies if someone already mentioned this; but i remember when fallout 3 came out (i got it for PC), i began having issues with quality after a while which turned out to be directly caused by the total number of saves i had in the game. i went through and deleted all but 2 of my game saves and everything went back to normal. i don't know if this will resolve the issue for ps3...but it's worth a try for anyone who's desperate to continue playing but can't because of this awful flaw.

Army_of_Darkness1711d ago

Your PS3 game ports all suck donkey balls ever since your first game. fallout.
I did not buy any of your games ever since.

Bioware and mass effect 2 PS3 is an example of an excellent port.

AngryTypingGuy1711d ago

Apparently Bethesda is investigating this problem, and hopefully there will be a patch. They say it's only a portion of PS3 units experiencing to problems. Hopefully I'll be one of the lucky ones. I might start waiting a month or two after Bethesda releases a game so they'll have time for the inevitable patch.

http://www.gamepro.com/arti...

maxbox991711d ago

@DragonKnight
Bethesda afraid of hard work? I don't think we're talking about the same company. Do you have any idea how much work has to be put to make a game like skyrim?

Getowned1711d ago

" dont support lazy devs and shit like this wont happen."

You guys make it sound like making a game is so easy,codeing and making games can be really hard to do,it dosen't happen over night it is a long and tedious thing to make games for what you got in skyrim you should be really happy.No game is perfect but there are a lot of good games.

Bimkoblerutso1711d ago

@Kaveti

That is the most ridiculous argument I have ever heard. Blame should not fall on Sony for developers that are too inept to program for their system.

If Bethesda has trouble programming for the PS3, they should not still be releasing games for the PS3.

It is indisputably 100% Bethesda's fault. Sony did not force them to release a version for their system, and consumers are simply operating under the false pretense that Bethesda would not release a product that did not work. It is BETHESDA'S FAULT.

Love the game on my PC though, I gotta say...

kaveti66161711d ago

"That is the most ridiculous argument I have ever heard. Blame should not fall on Sony for developers that are too inept to program for their system."

The PS3 hardware was ineptly designed. Developers shouldn't have to drastically alter their coding to get things up and running on the PS3.

Considering their games sell more on 360 and PC, I can completely understand why Bethesda doesn't like coding for the PS3. What's the benefit?

"Hey, let's work 6 times harder and spend a ton more money to get less sales on this platform."

There's a dichotomy on this site.

You have people praising Sony for learning from their past mistakes with the PS Vita. Even Sony has said that they've made sure the developers have an easy time coding for the Vita.

And you have people on this site pretending like Sony didn't even make a mistake with the PS3. They spin it to make it sound like making the PS3 harder to code for was actually a good thing. It's not.

There is no excuse for it.

Bimkoblerutso1710d ago

Sweet Mother of Mary. It doesn't matter if Sony made a mistake or not. We're not talking about Sony's mistakes. If Bethesda was unable (for ANY reason) to program a game correctly for a specific system, then they should not have made and released a game on that system.

Even if I was willing to grant you that developers still haven't "figured out" the Sony architecture (which, I would think that Oblivion's optimization on the system would throw that theory out the window), it would still be Bethesda's fault for knowingly releasing a broken product.

+ Show (23) more repliesLast reply 1710d ago
raWfodog1712d ago

Now I'm starting to reconsider getting this for my PS3. I might just get it for my 360 like I did with Oblivion.

Sub4Dis1711d ago (Edited 1711d ago )

i have no idea why you wouldn't have decided this in the first place. i have both systems, deciding which one to get a bethesda game on was a no-brainer. bethesda can't even figure out how to get a game to run perfectly on a standard pc, it's pretty clear they aren't going to figure out how to master a more complex architecture like the cell.

raWfodog1709d ago

@ Sub4Dis

That's cause I like gaming on my PS3 more than my 360. Every time I play my 360, I keep waiting for it to crap out on me.

Persistantthug1712d ago

Until they start losing serious money, this "launch a broken game and fix it when we fix it" situation will continue to get worse.

Sub4Dis1711d ago

and who's gonna threaten to recall the product? the god of customer satisfaction?

if you have a problem with the way a company does business, just stop feeding them with your cash. it's a very simple solution. i don't understand why people have become such brainless consumers.

companies want money, if you stop giving it to them, they'll change their ways to bring back their customers. that's how a free-market works.

for example: activision is perfectly happy releasing the same boring, crappy looking COD game every year because 10-20 million of you people are idiot consumers. if you stopped buying, we'd probably have a new COD engine by now.

Philoctetes1712d ago

Hours played: 22
Save file: 6.1MB

Freezes: None. Not even one.
Framerate drops: Very occasionally. No big deal.
Overall experience: Nearly perfect.

Rage_S901712d ago

You have about 8 more hours til sh*t hits the fan

brodychet1712d ago

Save file: 12MB

Freezes: Extremely High.
Framerate drops: Extremely often, almost impossible to play.
Overall experience: It's really just damaging my outlook on skyrim. Love the game still, but I don't even feel like playing it. :|

MysticStrummer1712d ago (Edited 1712d ago )

I'm over 10mb with my save file now. Trust me, unless they patch it first you will see what everyone is talking about eventually but it's not that big a deal. When it starts to happen just save, quit, and reload. Not sure why that works but it fixes the problem temporarily. I quit the game entirely then restart but I'm not sure that's necessary. I also delete my autosaves when I restart but I'm not sure that's necessary either. I can play for ten hours a day and I'll have to do that three or four times because the framerate drops so dramatically, but it's not bothering me that much. I had a far worse experience with the Dead Island bugs than with Skyrim's. Hopefully the patch will come soon though.

MariaHelFutura1712d ago

I'm at 40-45hrs, I'm fine. Turn off the autosaves except the travel one.

BigBoss071712d ago

I agree that the PS3 version needs work to make it run better, but it is far from unplayable. Just look at it this way, Bethesda is promoting you resetting your game to get you out of your chair/couch and moving around some. Keep it positive.

As far as the graphics debate goes, if you want the stellar graphics on this game, start saving up for a gaming rig. Once you've got it running on PC in a couple of months, Mods will have fixed everything Bethesda "overlooked." Its what I'm saving up for. ;)

+ Show (2) more repliesLast reply 1712d ago
beavis4play1712d ago

i don't own the game (may get it some time) but i have many people on my friends list who do have it......they all send me messages every day saying how much fun it is - nobody has once told me the game is "broken".
take this for what it's worth.

kevnb1712d ago

Most people are used to these games running like crap in certain areas.

Gigglefist1712d ago (Edited 1712d ago )

^this

kevnb1712d ago

Both consoles suffer, and even some pcs. Its an old engine made for single core PC's pushed way further than it should ever be... what do you expect?

frostypants1712d ago (Edited 1712d ago )

This isn't just about the PS3...the issue is Bethesda in general. Every...single...game...they have ever made since the early 1990s has been a complete bug-fest on every single platform (which until this gen was pretty much just the PC). I don't know what their freaking problem is.

Yeah, the PS3 is the MOST buggy version of Skyrim, but all three are glitch-ridden messes.

Bethesda makes a fun game, but they somehow think that gives them carte blanche to skip the QA process.

artynerd1711d ago

Then go back to your beloved Uncharted games that are so extremely linear it's almost impossible to have bugs, since the game almost one big non-interactive QTE fest.

I typically am extremely against making excuses for devs, but here is the only excuse I'll make for a developer:

Bethesda makes BY FAR the most complex open-world games. PUHLEEEEZE don't even compare Dark Souls or Arkham City to Skyrim. Sure, both of those games are amazing in their own right, but the complexity and freedom of those two games doesn't even remotely come anywhere near Skyrim. That said, you just can't compare the amount of testing that needs to go into a game like Skyrim. Almost infinite combinations of glitch inducing scenarios exist, combined with 400-500 hours of gameplay. What does it take to beat Arkham City or Dark Souls? 40-80 hours? Both combined don't even come NEAR the amount of content in Skyrim.

If you can't see the insane complexity in a Bethesda game, you just don't have any grasp on how games are made.

Again, if you don't think one of the most interactive gaming masterpieces like Skyrim is worth a few bumps in the road, then sell it, pick up that new Uncharted rail shooter and enjoy a game that offers zero complexity and zero interactivity.

Pacman3211711d ago

@artynerd
I know you can't reply to this seeing as you have one bubble, but i thought i would reply to your comment anyway.
What is wrong with playing a linear game like Uncharted? I don't want all my games to be open world 200 hours story games. I do enjoy RPG games like Demon's Souls and Final Fantasy, but sometimes i feel like playing some brainless shooters like COD, or sometimes i want a cinematic experience like Dead Space or Uncharted.
Let me say this loud and clear.
NOT ALL GAMES HAVE TO BE OPEN WORLD RPGS.
I would reply to your comment of Uncharted being a rail shooter but that is perhaps the most retarded comment iv'e read on N4G.

AKS1711d ago

It's not just the PS3 version that has problems. The PC version has probably crashed to the desktop about 30 times on me.

Grip1711d ago

i have PC version not single Crash... check ur PC before Posting nonsense.

AKS1711d ago

Check my PC? There's no problems with other games. I've had problems with every recent Bethesda game. You can do a quick search and see that many are having these types of problems. Make sure you know what you're talking about before you speak to someone that way.

theDECAY1711d ago

@Grip

He wasn't talking about your PC asshole.

Hyperbomb691711d ago

Bethesda are lazy PC developers, its 2011 people everyone makes awesome games that work fine on PS3 stop blaming the PS3 for lazy developers if every game out there works fine but a bethesda games has bugs and freezes guess what? its not the PS3!
this is coming from someone thats played every bethesda game available on PS3. Its always them.

Alvadr1711d ago

I'm 26hours into skyrim on the PS3 and have yet to encounter a single crash or major bug. My save file is 6545kb.

360 and pc are also reporting bugs a plenty so don't let one persons rant put you off the PS3 version

+ Show (8) more repliesLast reply 1709d ago
execution171712d ago

70hrs of gameplay so far, and my only gripe is the framerate drops, other than that its an amazing game. only froze on me once so far, not as bad as fallout 3 (passed on new vegas).

DanSolo1711d ago

I have to say although I have not played Skyrim yet, when I played Fallout 3 and Oblivion I did not encounter as many bugs as some people seemed to.

The only thing with Fallout is I made a point of doing a manual save every 30 minutes or so just in case I froze at all.... and I had maybe 10 freezes during the whole play through.

bwazy1712d ago

Man, I'm only 12 or so hours into my playthrough... I'm not looking forward to this AT ALL. However, unlike other Bethesda games at least my PS3 hasn't crashed yet... Yet.

MysticStrummer1712d ago

See my above comment. Not sure why it works but it does.

frostypants1712d ago

I'm probably gonna just play BF3 and limit my Skyrim time a bit until the patch rolls around.

Tonester9251712d ago

I don't know why developers never max out the PS3. It has so much power going to waste. Is it more expensive or something?

NoSuchUserName1712d ago

It has got another architecture which makes it unsuitable for PC ports, unlike the 360. However, like the AAA exclusives show, it's more powerful when the games are developed natively for it.

kevnb1712d ago

Its better at certain things, but its not so black and white. The 360 has a better gpu and a more straight forward CPU, its much more flexible. Don't forget why uncharted 2/3 look so good, its 90 percent aesthetics, some nice for console texture and very good animation. Just think of how good skyward sword or Mario galaxy look, aesthetics are a big chunk of visual appeal and Sony invests big money into it.

theDECAY1711d ago (Edited 1711d ago )

@kevnb

Wow, this conversation was boring 5 years ago when I bought my PS3. No one cares.

Tony P1712d ago

"I don't know why developers never max out the PS3."

Probably because Skyrim sold over 3 million in a few days anyway.

Why do it if you don't have to?

That's not how I like to look at it, but I'm sure that's how they do.

Drekken1712d ago

Fallout 3 taught me never to buy Bugthesda games for my PS3. Period. I almost caved and bought Skyrim, but after reading all this nonsense, I really doubt I will buy it now.

Learn to code Bugthesda... it really is sad.

Fallout 3 froze my PS3 over 30 times. Most times I had to switch it off from the back. I do not doubt it lead to my consoles eventual death. Not even to mention the pop up notification freeze at the beginning. What a joke.

HSx91712d ago

I think they can code a lot better than you will ever code in your life.

brodychet1712d ago (Edited 1712d ago )

Yet he hasn't gone to school for coding im sure, it isn't his job, and doesn't have 170 workers on his side whom promised a playable game. But if we're on your level of logic; I'm sure you couldn't code better for your life either. <3

KonGreat1712d ago

So what? its probably not his job anyways.
It's their job, its a AAA title and they still fuck it up? What's up with that? Fallout 3 and NV AND Oblivion all froze on me too. On the Xbox. And NV was buggy as hell. Terrible. Don't get me wrong, I love their games, but it's ridiculous how games are made these days with fixing it later (if at all).

On the PC there are modders who took their own time (And they obviously dont get as much paid for it as bethesda's employees, if at all) and managed to fix up most of the bugs in NV. More than bethesda ever did.

scotchmouth1711d ago

HSx9,

That's pretty horrible logic.

iHEARTboobs1712d ago

I'm going to wait for a GOTY edition which will hopefully have most major problems ironed out. One can dream right?