Several months ago, in an interview with GamerZines, Patrick Bach eluded to the fact that Battlefield 3 will have an online pass-esqe system in place for used copies.
Justification by Mr. Kertz has been added to article.
While I don't like the concept of online passes, I see why they're doing it
The thing that sucked is that all my friends who bought BFBC2 later, used, didn't have any of the new maps since they didn't want to get the VIP pass. I don't blame them, but I couldn't play on any of the newer maps.
yeah that's one thing I hated, but at least the whole online wasn't restricted
Yeah, I think it was the case with MoH right?
What is even worse was these were restricted to one account. So you couldn't max out levels and switch and play on another account. My friends all have like 3 or 4 different accounts for COD.
Well, there goes my Gamefly rental. I'm definitely buying Arkham City and with Uncharted, Halo Anniversary and All for One in a few weeks, I'm definitely not buying this game at launch.
That has always been my point. Online passes actually degenerates a community and actively works against it. Not everyone will be willing to buy a pass, especially if they rarely play it, but if they did play it often and found they liked it, they might have just bought the next one.
Tell your friends to stop being cheap and buy the pass.
Funny how people won't buy an online pass, but they'll drop 10 bucks a week at the movie theater to watch every crappy 90 min. movie that comes out.
I had to log in just to tell you that your comment was retarded. Where the hell did you come up with people that don't want to buy online passes "drop 10 bucks a week at the movie theater to watch every crappy 90 min. movie that comes out."? I'm pretty sure there is zero link between the two and there may be about 7 people worldwide that fit into the category of regularly buying Used games, not wanting to pay for online passes, yet go to the movies every week to waste their money watching crappy movies.
@EelJP- I know the link between the two might sound odd(what MrTretton said), but I actually know people who buy games new and groan and moan when a game utilizes the pass feature. Those same people go and watch wank movies almost ever week. So, like I said, as odd as it might seem, there are any idiots like that. Plus, where I am, movies cost more than the pass. Go figure.
"I'm pretty sure there is zero link between the two" Zero? The link is pretty obvious, which is, how people spend their money. That was my point and comparison. People have strange ways of complaining about similar amounts of money they spend on certain things. Considering people spend dozens, if not hundreds of hours on MP games for their entertainment, and a 5-10 pass is too rich for their blood?
If the industry is hell bent on doing this then games should NOT cost $60 and should instead cost us $40. I don't care if you need the pass to even activate the Single Player campaign but the god damn cost of a game should not be $60 then! If you can reduce the price of video games then no one will go and buy a used copy. We all love brand new disks. We have a great case study. Remember Valkyria Chronicles on PS3? Well, even though it was a good game, it didn't do great when it was launched. Sega then decided to reduce the price and gamers responded and bought a lot of copies. I remember that there were reports that it was getting a bit difficult finding VC in different stores. If they want to charge us $60 then they should not mess with online pass thing. Or, they should simply charge $5 to buy one from PSN/XBL store.
Here is the position of Online Pass issue on N4G: If its any multi platform game its shunned upon If its a ps3 exclusive for example UC3 recently, its alright and accepted, "the game is about the SP anyways" or "was going to buy it day 1 new regardless" For the rest of the world, online passes are what will ruin the games industry and the MAJORITY of people dont like it.
Long as usual, so bear with me. In my opinion the whole argument is retarded. If you buy the game new, the developer, publisher and retailer all get a cut. If you buy it used, only the used retailer gets a cut and the developer and publisher lose a sale. To me it's only logical they the developer and publisher would want to keep the profits they enjoyed before used games became such a big deal in the industry. If you want to bitch at anyone, bitch at the retailers like Gameslop that charge only $5 less for a used game than they do for the retail copy, regardless of the fact that they game the gamer less than half that usually to trade it in. So who is the real crook here, the developer and publisher or the used game retailer? Who is really losing? The gamer who trades it in for half it's used value or the gamer who buys it used and has to give up $10 more to take full advantage of the game? The economy is bad everywhere, people want to save cash but in doing so they cost the developer and publisher sales. With used games becoming more popular with everyone trying to save a little cash, it's becoming a parasitic loss on the industry. Like it or not, as gamers, we depend on the developers and publishers to make the games we enjoy. I know everyone looks at them as these huge powerhouses with money to burn but they are a business like any other and when profits start falling, stockholders start griping and they have to cut corners. With all the development studios getting closed down and others in bad financial trouble, it should be obvious that not only the gamer is feeling the effects of the bad economy. So do we cheat the people we depend on out of sales or do we buy new? In my opinion, that's up to the individual but if you choose to save a few dollars and buy used, don't bitch about the fact that the developer and publisher are trying to recoup a little of their lost sale by adding a charge to unlock the full game with an Online Pass, bitch about the fact that you are paying some retailer almost full price for a used game. Now I know that not all used retailers are as scandalous as Gameslop, and not all price their used games $5 less than the new copy but let's face it, Gameslop is the face of the used game industry and seems to be the one raking in all the profits from it. From my background as a Parts Manager of an auto dealership that also had it's own salvage yard, we priced anything used at 50% of list or retail price. To me, paying 8.35% less than retail just to get a used product is insane. Add in the $10 that, in my opinion, the devs and pubs rightfully add on, paying $5 more than a new game for a used one doesn't seem like a good deal. Is this dirty to "force" you to buy a new game? Not really since everyone is getting paid and it's just immature to think that anyone should "go without" just because you want to pay less for your entertainment. So now you have a choice, buy the game new and completely ignore the Online Pass deal in it's entirety, or buy used somewhere and hopefully still pay less then retail in the end to play the full game. To me it would be foolish in the extreme to pay anywhere near the retail price for a used game, but even more so if you get less than the full game. Also, judging by the comments in the posted articles about the Online Pass, I can't help but think that many commenters do not yet grasp the fact that the Online Pass only applies to USED games. You don't have to pay $10 more to go online when buying the game new, only if you buy it used. Some still seem a bit confused on that point.
why need clarification? EA will stick with online pass from now on. I don't think we need an article for every single one of them!
Yeah to make money, despite the detriment it is to the online community. Only the biggest games can get away with it, the smaller ones will suffer an instant death.
I wonder, does the PC version have an online pass?
You can't buy second hand PC games, so no.
@Letros You can (ebay, amazon etc) but with disc installations, you are never guaranteed to have 100% access to the CD-Key that comes with the original game (mainly because the "seller" is a douche and keeps playing, even though he sold it).
well every PC game does have unique CD key so yeah I guess that counts as the online pass in retrospect.
Ya online passes actually give money to the people who deserve it and not the Gamestops of the world. I'd rather have more money given to developers than money given to stores who charge $10 more than every other store for new games just so you buy games used there.(at least in Canada)
Uhh EA doesn't do that anymore, they used to charge $69.99 for new games but I believe they stopped for ALL their titles.
I am all for the developer getting the money they deserve, however I unfortunately think online passes will also adversely affect the online community. If you have to pay to play when you buy it used, then many will likely pass on the game. In my eyes I think this will slowly push games to be more serialized as the servers will be killed off sooner due to lack of use. Online passes just look like something the publisher will abuse to fuel new iterations under the guise of "supporting the developers." I would like to know where the money goes when you pay for the online pass. Anybody have any thoughts?
I meant that some games are more expensive at eb games or gamestop than say walmart.
Because servers cost money. And yet EA has some of the worst servers I have come across. Even now wanting to jump back into some BFBC 2 after the BF# Beta is over... but the servers are all showing down for me. Reports are that other gmes are having similar issues. So if you buy that $10 cost for access to the servers they still have that clause were they have the right to shut the servers down whenever they want. And EA is bad at keeping servers running for their games past the initial period of sales. 2 year old games.... good luck, anyone?
Oh cut the s***, they have way more than enough money for decent servers..they just want to be cheap asses. Im sick of this pass so im not buying this game.
@_Aarix_ That was my point. EA says in the article that the money is for the servers. I pointed out their servers are crap and I even doubt that the true motive is server maintenance over actually just trying to make money. Because they don't actually keep their servers well maintained.
Online passes as they are today should be gone and should be replaced by full-experience passes: there should be a level cap for those people who buy second hand, if there needs to be a restriction at all. This way, there will be more players on server in the long run, and they would be selling more full-experience passes.
This sucks. But I guess that means the used copy will be that much cheaper then? So it will work out in the end? You get less for your trade but it costs less to buy used to make up for the pass needed to play?
BFBC2 & MOH both had it, so it was expected
BFBC2 had the VIP system, a bit more accessible in my opinion.
sigh... the true death of gaming
Give it a rest... Just so dramatic. If you want a game for online play - You buy new anyways the week its released. If not wait for the new price to drop and still buy it new at a discount. Its more like the true death of rentals and used games.
I bet in a couple of years this will be standardized in all games.
Death of gaming? the online pass?? The death of gaming is piracy and buying games USED! Whenever you buy a game used, you DON'T give the developer your money. You give Gamestop or whichever retailer you buy from.
Naive viewpoint, devs/publishers get the money the moment gamestop etc decide to buy stock from them. If they are willing to buy back pre-owned titles then sell them on thats a valid business model. Not like the games industry is the first to experience this. As for piracy being the 'death of gaming' the only people using pirated copies are the ones who never intended to buy the game to begin with. This ones been about for 30 years, old argument that falls flat on its face if you think about it.
Remember Sega Dreamcast? You know how it "disappeared" Piracy. Your argument is flawed. You think Jtaged xbox's can't play BF3? LOL! You think hacked PS3s can't? Maybe not the MP, but SP. Plus you ever walk into Gamestop? I don't even live in the US, but I know that 3/4 of the shelves are used games. If as a consumer I walk into GS and I see used games priced less than a new one, which you think I would likely buy? Hence the developer loses the sale.
Yeh but its a bit annoying that gaming is the only industry which penelizes u for buying it used.. Ford (Cars) dont get any money from used car sales however the car doesnt suddenly come missing a steering wheel lol... You could say the developer has already gotten a sale and in the era of DLC and bonus content u could argue thats where they get their money back if a person buys it used.
@ Avernus; I can tell you why the Dreamcast disappeared. Many people never bought one. Nor did I, or many of my other friends as we waited on the PS2. Sega didn't receive our money for their console or games, not because we pirated, but just because we didn't want it. Piracy was irrelevant to my decision because I didn't pirate games, nor did I buy the console. People who plan to buy something will buy it. That is why the 360 & Wii are still around. And as for what you said about Gamestop. There is no such thing as a developer losing a sale. You can't lose what you never had in the first place. You can't lose what you didn't earn. If a developer fails to interest me in their game, that doesn't mean they "lost" a sale. They just failed to earn it.
dlc say hi
Dreamcast failed because it didn't have the third party support from devs. A lot of devs felt burned by the Saturn. Not to mention the ps2 had DVD playback which the Dreamcast did not. Add that to the many more games on ps2 and a tad of the piracy issue and the Dreamcast was destined to fail. Again with the "give devs your money". How about devs give us free dlc or unlockable items like the good old days? Nope, they won't they will milk us as much as possible. But lord forbid we buy the game at lower price and better price.
caseh But when a retailer resells the same exact product back to their customers, they don't need to restock as much.
No, but it is the death of videogame rentals
They should hand out 7 day online vouchers for rentals.
I'm actually kind of surprised videogame rental companies haven't tried to sue/(whatever legal crap they can come up with) over this. Services like gamefly are gonna get F*** in the a$$ over this kinda stuff.
They could do what, i think, Mortal Kombat did and give u a small multiplayer trial :)
tick tick tick (dramatic) boom! :P nah it's fine, they are business first and foremost so that's what they are focusing on. If this doesn't work they will revert back to the old system
The true death of gaming would be a dark future of paying $120 USD (or 200+ in Australia) on games that have 2 hour SP campaigns tops with expensive day 1 DLC to unlock the full length story, 1 time use activation code for the entire game, and a requirement for a permanent internet connection. Online passes are terrible for obvious reasons, but things could be worse.
This makes me aggravated. So basically we would be getting a single player 6-7 hr game for the price of 55 dollars used if gamestop decides to sell at that price?
Yep. Unless you buy new, the devs don't see any of the money and actually have to pay for you to play their game.
"Unless you buy new, the devs don't see any of the money and actually have to pay for you to play their game." Not exactly true, I picked up NFS: Hot Pursuit on the weekend for £15. EA had already sold this game to the gamestore I bought it from. Chances are the game has been out ages, this was aging stock that has to be shifted so the gamestore take a hit and lower the retail price to shift it before the game is superceeded. Publisher actuallt made their money months back, gamestore loses out due to not being able to shift remaining stock.
I was lucky in the past by buying pre played games where the online passes were never used. doubt it will be so common now seeing that more people prefer gaming online now
It's dumbfounding how many people would pay $55 for a used game at gamestop when many of these games at new release, you could get away paying $45 on average through many other stores. Never had I've seen a discount or actual advantage of buying a game new around release at gamestop versus BB, Walmart, K-Mart, Target, Amazon, Newegg and so on.
And were could I get a game for 45 on release day?!
For BF3, go to Amazon, preorder it now for $42 or use the 25% off Birthday code on EA to get BF for about $46. Batman:AC is $60 with $30 coupon and a free tshirt on release at K-Mart. If you had preorder this way back with Newegg, it was 47 with free shipping. Still thinking about AC:AH? Go to K-mart to get the game with a $20 coupon. If you preordered this with Amazon back when they matched TRU's deal, it was $45 with a $10 coupon. I paid $15 at Best Buy for Ico/SoTC a week after release. $10 off instant coupon and it was on sale for $25.
I do think when Retailers such as gamestop etc catch on to this theyll just lower the resale price 6-7 dollars lower and give u less for trade-ins etc
Quit being so fucking cheap!!! Just buy the game new, I really don't get all this moaning about online passes, wtf is wrong with them?? And if you're buying a game used for $55 you should be punished!! Holy shit people are retarded these days...
Why do you have 5 bubbles?
@zero Why shouldn't I have 5?
I have a wild idea for some people out there...BUY THE GAME NEW. It supports the developer when you do, and not some retailer that's ripping you off on used games. If you buy it used, then get the online pass. Support this amazing dev company...they are certainly one of the few out there that care about what they put out.
I agree with you for the most part and refuse to pay a little bit less for a used game that they bought of some poor kid for $4.00. "there is a sucker born every day" is the saying and it seems there are many thousands. When you can get literally 7x more money on ebay or elsewhere and the person buying from you saves money as well, there are few excuses that justify not going this route.
And you're still restricted to how you can use it. Whether it's the amount of accounts or systems you can use it on. Buying new doesn't save you from this DRM's restrictions.
Avernus, thank you for supporting the fundamentals of any successful industry, something these complainers don't seem to get. If we don't buy, we don't get! We can't expect to receive the products we want if we aren't willing to pay for them. Simple economics and math people! 12
Do I get the DLC for free? Fucking hypocrites love to bitch about used game sales but have no problem leaving content out of a game I paid full price for so they can charge me for it later.
Bfbc2 kinda complicated things. There were 2 MASSIVE updates you had to install in order to play, and unless you bought it new, you couldn't play the majority of the maps. I bought it day 1 but I can see how hard it was for people that bought it later.
I got it used, and bought the online pass, still cheaper than new game. Also it was 100% worth it, becouse of the new maps, I take onlinepass over overpriced map-packs or similars anyday. People make this way too big number. It's well justified why devs do this, and you can get all games dirt cheap, atleast when used, anyway within few months. Few €'s more wont hurt.
It was a bit of a no brainer really considering about 90% of EA's recent titles have online passes...
I know why they are doing it.. In a quite old interview Bach said that they have to pay for each player slot because they have dedicated servers or something.. And if people buy second hand DICE has to pay for them while they havent bought the game, i thought they said something like this..