Do passes and premium-tier services threaten Sony's network?
No. If it didnt years ago when all this started, it won't now.
Nope. Unless you buy new it's still free. Plus not all games use it yet. Also doesn't the xbox 360 have online passes to? http://www.ea.com/1/ds2-onl... Online passes are still a terrible idea.
Well I hope it remains free. I don't wanna pay 50-60$ for online play and then additional 50$ for some type of premium service like COD Elite (like X360 owners do). It's just too much, so keep online play free Sony!
cod elite is free i think but the premium elite cost like 50 bucks but u can play online with the free one.
'Online passes are still a terrible idea.' I disagree, if you worked as a developer you'd be thinking differently. Why is it okay for consumers to pay less than half for a used game but still have access to everything that people who pay $60 have? Surely you agree that it's unfair considering these people spend years developing a game, spending millions of dollars and having to pay for the upkeep of servers. They have to make they money back somehow, it's only fair for them to implement an online pass. Otherwise what's the incentive to keep making games?
"Why is it okay for consumers to pay less than half for a used game but still have access to everything that people who pay $60 have? " Why is it okay for consumers to pay less than half for a used car but still have access to everything that people who pay $20k+ have?
Sorry, CynicalVision, one cannot be so flippant when considering the repercussions that services and restrictions like these have on the entire concept of ownership.
Well both iTunes and Valves Steam is free - so, do I think free access to online markets is dead... that's a big fat NO.
@jaosobno PSN will remain free. The basic services will not change. Sony may put the focus now on Plus with any new services but the core ability to play online will continue to be free on the Playstation 3. Sony will toy with the idea of keeping that core experience free on the Playstation 4 so it will be interesting if it remains free. Right now there is a shift happening testing the market with things like the Elite service for Call of Duty, online passes and other revenue based services like Plus. @Eromu Bad analogy. A car depreciates over time and costs money to keep up the maintenance. So in my view it is only right for those hosting the online services to be funded some way and buying used means no money is going to the publishers who run the matchmaking services and everything else needed to host the games online.
Here's the problem with ownership of software. Quite simply, you don't. You own a licence to use the software, which the publisher can revoke at any time (in fact if your account is blocked on PSN, XBox Live or Steam you lose access to any downloaded content and the only reason this wouldn't hold true for a disc is because it's physical, doesn't mean they can't block access to portions of it though). I, honestly, have no real issue with it, because I only buy games new HOWEVER and this is the big problem, this needs to extend to cover more than one system and user account because I have no doubt there's people with multiple PS3s and PS3 users in the same household it should be like PSN content, ability to activate on 5 systems, covers all users on that system.
@CynicalVision: Why should developers get paid twice for the same game they already got paid for? They sell all their copies to a retailer, thus get paid for each and every copy. Why then should they get paid again because someone decides to return a copy that the RETAILER paid for (and sold to the consumer) and decides to resell? The developer relinquishes their right to additional profit once they sell the physical copy to the retailer. It would be different if their game was DL only but that isn't the case. If I sell someone a tv, I don't have the right to demand that they give me the full value cost of the tv if they decide to then sell it to someone else.
the basis of PSN is free online play which the 360 doesn't have! online pass and such has nothing to do with free PSN. it's just a way devs recouping profit from 2nd hand markets. what Sony is and will be doing for PS+ is totally up to them as they have to keep they paying gamers happy by adding more stuff to the service. but as long as the online play stays free, why complaint? want more services? pay for PS+, end of story!
@CynicalVision Technically Retailers bought the games. We are not buying games directly from them (Devs) unless of course it's their own shop. And are you guys forgetting something? This isn't just for online. RAGE will be having an online pass for single player content. So the matter for running matchmaking and such isn't even a reason why they do it. I understand developers want more money, but if they are going to start charging for Online then at least do this. Offer a trail before you make anyone purchase the dam thing. Like what Homefront does where you can only reach a certain level and then you can't progress anymore. If they are going to offer and online pass then give me a reason to buy it instead of having me go in blind without knowing whether I want the online or not. Also why should they be charging for the game online? As much as I like dislike COD for being the same at least they aren't making you pay online. Why? Because the support is there. You know whats even worse? the fact that most developers today has paid DLC on launch day of games. If I am going to pay for Online pass at least have the game packed with all this content cause DLC isn't a thing they make in a day and in most cases is thought up before the game is even released.
They are a great idea. Gamestop and used sales are to blame. Devs and Publishers now get a piece of used games sales.
if 360 still has online passes........thats just reaaaaaaally bad. in regards to online passes i believe that the online pass should register to your serial number on the ps3, not just the username, but at the same time should register to your username aswell incase you have another ps3. its the most logical and fair thing to do
fear mongering at it's worst.
EA, THQ, Disney Interactive, Sony and Ubisoft are the publishers that i know of that implement the online pass. Ubisoft being the latest about a month or so ago
I don't think online pass is a bad idea because it's good against pre-owned games. What is really bad is DRM. And how can online pass go against free psn? If you buy new games you won't have any problems.
I too think online passes are a good idea. Everyone saying it screws with the idea of ownership is missing the point I think. Pre-owned games do nothing to pay for the upkeep of the multiplayer infrastructure, matchmaking servers etc. If you want to play on their systems using their bandwidth it's fair you pay a little. You don't *own* online functionality.
Agreed. Online passes don't have anything to do with "free PSN." These are just a way for developers to recoup some revenue from the used game market. Those of us who are buying our games new still aren't paying a penny for online play.
Technically, online passes are DRM. It's "Digital Rights Management", and by definition it's simply a term to describe access control technologies. Online passes ARE access control technology.
@CynicalVision I see where you;re coming from, but let's be real. When you buy a used game, you're not paying less than half of what the game was shipped for....let's say gamestop for an example, if you buy a used game that's a month old, you'd have to pay 53$ still. That's not even including the tax.
That is Gamestop's problem. n used games nothing goes back to the developer. Gamestop gets all $53. They are protecting their investment of a game they made and stopping gamestop from making a major profit. It has nothing to do with paying less than half. Its about them making money of games that cost millions to make. I think I am one of few who actually sees what the online pass is. It may not be good for us but what is £5 here or there. If you want to support gamestop and not the developer fine but then do not play online which has running costs
Again, the developer got all the support they technically deserve when they sold the game to retailers. Why should developers get that $53 when a second disk isn't being sold? It's the same disk that was originally bought. It's the same disk that the devs sold to the retailer and were paid for. So why should they get paid twice, thrice, or 4 times for the same copy? They didn't put any effort into putting the game on the damn disk too did they? There isn't any new content being added to a used game is there? So explain it to me?
@dragonknight. Its not just that. Why should gamestop get hude profit from a game they could have originaly sold. It is very profitable the re sale market for places like gamestop. With online, which cost money and man power to run expanding a game people are enjoying the on line experience without paying to the developers. This is more of a problem with online games being improved
You're not understanding something here. Used game sales DO NOT impact online because there is NOT an additional user, it is merely a transference. If I traded my game in to gamestop, they have my copy. They then sell that copy to another person. I can't use that copy anymore, but someone is in my place. This has no burden on the online infrastructure as no additional member has been added, and the developer has already been paid for the game with their original sale to gamestop. This is purely based on greed. Developers want to be paid more than once for one copy of a game. Used game sales in no way hurt them in any arena. Not additional users, not loss of revenue, nothing.
Well said, Dragon Knight. Bubbles up. I've been trying to explain that to people since I joined this site; they just can't seem to wrap their heads around it, though. They want to believe it hurts developers, but what it REALLY does it hurt ownership rights: no matter what you paid, you only own HALF the game until you pay the developers. Even though they've already been paid for the copy of the game you own- including the half they won't let you play- you have to pay them again to play the whole thing. And at any time, they can choose to no longer support that game, thus meaning your payment grants you nothing.
Nope. Mine's still free
One word. NO.
agreed. or they will be sued again. because when they advertised the console it was with free online play. now they taking away an advertised feature which is why most of ps3 gamers went with sonys console. i think even sony know this.
I really do not get what this article is trying to say. Surely extra paid services is a plus for the PSN because unlike its competitor the user doesn't all ready have to pay for a subscription. The PSN has that option to play free online which is always attractive to a consumer I can see a tier system in the future. Basic online free option extra cost money
Believe it or not, Sony has a premium-tier service too... Plus I don't know many that'd take a premium paying service over a free one that works just as well. Free, well to me, is attractive. If I looked at PS3 and knew I had to pay so much every year just to talk to my friends or play games I want, then I wouldn't be so happy with the service.
Next Gen who knows...but not this consoles lifecycle
Actually yeah I suppose it is, if you buy all your games 2nd hand. If not though, it remains free.
I still use free PSN. Still havent found the right motivation for getting PSN+
Cloud Saving, Automatic Updates (makes firmware updates marginally less anoying) and free games is worth it to me, Ive had mine for over a year now. You get free games (mostly minis and PS1 games) that you most likely would not have bought earlier and play them for the duration of your PS+-ness. Gaming discounts every now and then are awesome as well (Scott Pilgram and Castlecrashers for half price) and dont expire with your PS+ All in all, PS+ has paid for itself 3 times over, but the inclusion of Sam and Max ($35 value) helped that number out.
Its nice to have the option
They've always said playing online will be free and that is all that matters to me. All the "bells and whistles" they can do with as they like for all I care.
Sort of. I'm really worried about Resistance 3's PSN Pass, though, as it literally makes a large percentage of PSN subscribers pay for a service that's supposed to be free. I'm actually surprised that more people weren't up in arms or even boycotting it. Still, it's a great game. :P Here's hoping that future first party PS3 exclusives will focus on PSN+ features rather than the online pass. EDIT: I'm also surprised that so many people keep spouting the party line of "Online Passes Benefit Developers." They do, it has to be said, but it primarily benefits the publishers and shareholders first. It's up to them whether the hardworking devs actually receive a penny of this increased revenue.
'EDIT: I'm also surprised that so many people keep spouting the party line of "Online Passes Benefit Developers." They do, it has to be said, but it primarily benefits the publishers and shareholders first.' Someone who can actually see whats going on, have a bubble. When the publisher ships its product to say Gamestop for example they have already sold the product. If i go instore and buy that game pre-owned it makes little to no difference, the publisher has already sold it to Gamestop so they need to sell it to make a profit from it. Beside, if i'm buying pre-owned chances are I never intended to buy it brand new so no one makes any money from me at all if these online passes become widespread.
Does anyone know if you can use the PSN pass on multiple accounts and on different PS3's?
Yes, you can on multiple accounts on one PS3. I bought Resistance 3, and DL'd the online pass and pre-order bonus through my main account. I then had access to both MP and the pre-order bonus through my main account and a sub account on my system. Don't know about multiple systems, haven't had a chance to try that yet.
What? How? When this happened? I was playing for free yesterday.
Please. Oh god no!
The real issue with online passes is that it attaches the game to one user account. In the past anyone in your household could pick up the game and play it freely. But more recent changes in some online passes have made it so that the only person able to play the game online or with some functions has to be the sole person who bought the game. No more loaning your games out to your friends. No more anyone in the frat house being able to play. No more of brother Timmy and Bobby being able to share their games... one is going to have to be sharing his account information in some way for the other to be playing online. Yes, companies are trying to get their monies worth out of the games. Trying to make money off of second hand sales by forcing online pass purchases. But they are trying to make money were they aren't deserved money. It's not like they are having an extra person on their servers playing that shouldn't be. They still have the same amount of people on the servers as they sold games. But with the online pass they still get the money of the person that originally bought the game. And they also get the money of the new person having to pay an online pass price, and reap the reward of not having to provide any new resources for that new player. Their claim is they aren't getting the money deserved of someone buying their game new, when it is sold used. Just an idea, make a game good enough that people want to keep their copy of the game. And if needed give incentives to those that buy new with maybe added DLC, but don't gimp online playability just to turn a profit.
Any account using the station the account activated on can play online. Tested that already
What game pass add on are you referring too? I know that Mass Effect 2 pass does not allow just anyone signed on to access the pass items. As the same with many EA passes. They are specific to only the one account ID. I am not talking about PSN here.(which we know is free) We are talking about online passes which can possibly lead to online restrictions to games that will need online passes for online multiplayer in the future. Currently if I download an add on for my account my daughter can't access the same add on items when she plays a game using her account. Are you saying this is different? If so please specify all the online passes that you are referring to so we can know. Thanks.
resistance 3. Its the only online pass I own. It worked on an account from a different region too
@Legion Any passes redeemed through PSN follow the same rules as other PSN content. It can be downloaded on up to five PS3s and any account on those systems can access the content, assuming it is downloaded through the content owner's account. Basically, if there is an online pass file on the system, anyone can use it. I'm not sure if you are talking about the 360 or PS3 version, but the case of Mass Effect 2 on PS3, I redeemed the Cerberus code on my account and my brother was able to use Zaeed on his own PS3 once I logged in on his PS3 and downloaded the online pass file. Medal of Honor's online pass worked the same way. The only pass I've known of that was any different was the Bad Company 2 VIP pass since that didn't use PSN. It worked for the account it was redeemed on, and all accounts on the PS3 it was redeemed on could use the VIP content, but unlike other PSN content, outside of the account it was originally redeemed on, no account on other PS3s could use it.
Legion, I have personally tried the Resistance 3 pass and pre-order bonus material, and both are active on my main and a sub account on my PS3. So, specifically, I know it works on multiple accounts on the same console. I'll have to see how it works on multiple consoles when I get the chance. What system are you buying things on that your daughter can't access? I never had that problem with a PSN purchase. XBL seems a little more restrictive, but their pre-purchase info is clear. It will tell you if one or multiple accounts can access it. I was able to buy the Halo 3 map packs, and DL them on my nephew's system by migrating my Gamertag and we both have access.
Not familiar with the Resistance 3 pass bonus material. But that is good if they allow anyone on the system to access the items. As for the Halo 3... I have not played Halo 3 online in awhile but my DLC maps for Halo:Reach are only playable by my daughter if she is playing with me. I can sign into her system and download the DLC again and she is still only able to play on those maps if I am logged on. Same goes for the Fable 2 DLC. I downloaded the DLC and she did not have access to it when logged under her account. But she could download a patch to allow her to play co-op with my account when we were both online together. As mentioned before... different companies are doing different things with DLC options. EA has always been the leader in screwing over their customers and I think are leading the idea of pay to play for online multiplayer.
This article looks like it had been written by a slave that accept his condition. Very funny.
Oh god, this again?
Seem to forget that online play still remains free :)
the online is free , the pass is for more content , that's what i understand just press circule when it ask you to put pass code and you will play online ....
im wrong , i just bought resistance 3 , i wanted to enter the multiplayer and it says to me i can't enter it until i activate the code , so it's possable
this article is trash,not gonna waste my time readng it..Free psn forever
Why would they give up the only thing that may convine people to actually buy a ps3 over a 360? If they started a pay to play service than everyone would get a 360 because its cheaper to buy! Plus im sure all their loyal fans would go Apeshit!!
This is an industry initiative to combat used games regardless of platform. Until games become more of a services based/ digital format this trend will only increase.
Sorry we talked about this before. PSN is still free. The pass is only for those who buy the game second hand and PSN plus is an option.
This article fails. I can't believe I read this garbage. What does PS PLUS and HOME have to do with online play again? You don't have to subscribe to PS PLUS or buy things in HOME if you don't want to! The online pass? Once again, nothing to do with the PSN. Just buy the game brand new, or purchase the online pass on the PS Store.
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