Molyneux: 'I agree with core Kinect scepticism, but breakthrough will come'

CVG - Peter Molyneux says he agrees with criticism aimed at the Xbox 360's motion sensor by core gamers, explaining that "any invention as big as Kinect" will take time for developers to get their teeth into.

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Chaostar2709d ago

I think the majority of 'core' gamers have made up their minds by now. I shall remain skeptical until I see it for myself.

EVILDEAD3602709d ago

'I think the majority of 'core' gamers have made up their minds by now.'

Yup they did..which is why Kinect is already 10 million sold and its only been out 8 months.

The skeptics and the haters mean absolutely nothing to the gamers who bought and enjoy Kinect. They simply make headlines for a small miniscule segment of the media.

Micrsoft is in a great position with Kinect and just like new consoles in their first year, games will get better and better as developers get their hands around the system.

The core 360 gamer will be busy with the ridiculous amount of 'core' games from Gears of War in September to the BMW3/Battlefield war to Halo Anniversary in November.

Kinect has already proven it's a completely different experience from the other two motion control experiences. Round two of the software kicks in this fall and by next year you will see the big dogs like EA use Kinect in all it's major titles.

Kinect has no comp for two holidays straight. If Lionhead, Crytek, Ubisoft and all the other developers from the Japenese to the indie pus out quality titles Kinect could push Nintendo Wii numbers for the 360 before 720 and PS4 arrive to steal the thunder.

The core isn't pushing ANY OTHER Motion control game or system to great's ALL kinds of gamers that play these games..either way Peter is right..once you get your breakthrough title the sky is the limit..but so far Kinect is definately headed in the right direction


MintBerryCrunch2709d ago

the question is, do you own it?

just because it has sold 10 million units, doesn't mean that the majority of those purchases are coming from core gamers, plus the games that MS showed off this E3 is them getting prepared for the holidays hoping that parents buy games like Sesame Street, we will see how MS will market the kinect, if you think that they will show off games like Ghost Recon, Forza MORE than Dance Central 2 or the new Disney Game along side Kinect, then i'll be surprised and all for it

green2709d ago

@ MintBerryCrunch: I own Kinect and while i will not deny the fact that the core Kinect offering is lacking, i will admit to that Kinect is a great device with loads and loads of potential.

As EvilDead pointed out, most core gamers are to busy playing other games at the moment to even notice at the moment. I am currently playing catch up with the 360 library at the moment playing Splinter Cell Conviction and Torchlight. AFter i am done with those games, i have LA NOire and Crysis 2 to play.

Come fall, i bet you that Microsoft will indeed make a big deal about Autovista mode in Forza 4 (i personally think its one very amazing feature)and i am sure that Microsoft is in someway talking to BBC to show that mode on Top Gear. Same goes for Ghost Recon future soldier and Mass Effect 3.

You know how, achievements were a big factor in sales differences between 360 and PS3 software sales at the beginning of this gen, well Microsoft will be using the tagling "better with Kinect" to lure in the core gamers.

it may work, it may not but only time will tell.

Chaostar2709d ago (Edited 2709d ago )

Don't bunch skeptics in with haters it's a completely different point of view. It's OK to be skeptical of a product that has yet to provide you with enough evidence to formulate an adequate opinion.

Let's face it, your argument is nothing but a knee-jerk reaction to what you perceived as a negative opinion toward your console of choice. You can scream numbers at me until you're blue in the face but it means absolutely squat to a person basing their opinion on the games and experiences provided by the product.

The 'core' while obviously not the majority, is more important than you think. These are the people that have played games since they were <6. They are the people that talk about games, write about games, MAKE games. If Kinect fails to provide any full-blown, tailer-made 'core' experiences then it's a failure in the eyes of 'core' gamers, no matter how many it sells.

Let's give it time to prove itself before completely dismissing it or jumping on it's hype band-wagon. Also, please, let's put the Justin Bieber argument (sales=quality?) to rest, thanks.

EVILDEAD3602708d ago (Edited 2708d ago )

Actually YOUR comment was the knee-jerk reaction..I called it like it is.

If you want to pretend that 0% of the 10 million people who bought Kinect are simply casual gamers then please don't log off your computer. Because that is simply internet ducktales.

Again the whole 'core' argument was bogus from the beginning. If you were anywhere near the internet since E3 2010 the term was used by the 'skeptics' AND the haters who claimed that Kinect was dead on arrival..mainly because the casuals would not leave there Wii to buy it and the 'core' wouldn't be interested.

Fast forward and no matter if you want to believe or not the skeptics AND the haters were dead wrong.

I AM one of the 'core' 360 gamers. I've owned it from year one and own over 100+ games for it. The core 360 gamers are the reason for the continued success of Halo, Gears, Mass Effect, Fable, Call of Duty and many others on the consoles.

This has NOTHING to do with your definition that you have to start at 5 years old playing games to be a 'core' gamer. Because if THAT is the case..what are 5 year olds likely to play LA. Noire? Mass Effect 2? Halo Reach? Gears of War 3? The Airport scene in Modern Warfare 2?

Or are parents enjoying the OPTION for them to play family games that are on Kinect like Kinectimals? Why wouldn't Micrsoft be proud to put out a portfolio on the system that includes Sesame Street or Disney? The Wii did fact name a system that doesnt have casual games. Was Nintendo's Duck Hunt core? Was Pong Core? Show me 5 years olds that roamed the arcades back in the day.

I laugh at sites and fan bloggers that pop up on N4G who have no clue on who is playing Kinect. I say it all the time, I know the most hardcore people I know on Live with 5 prestiges per Call of Duty, well over a thousand games on Halo 3 and are untouchable in Reach who got more achievements in Dance Central and Kinect Sports than I'll EVER have.

This is the truth..I don't have to fake like the multi-accounts on this site. I bought Move and 5 games way before Kinect and own and played the hell out of Wii before that.

A 'core' gamer isn't boxed into some silly category just because it's convenient to someones biased argument against a system, gamers play games all shapes and sizes.

Who is claiming Kinect is for everybody. If you don't like it don't buy it. But, it's no secret which gamers are screaming the loudest and the longest about a system they don't and never will own.

On topic, Peter is right. The games need to keep coming and after Child of Eden I for one can't wait for Steel Batallion, Project Draco, and the implementation in Mass Effect 3, Madden, Fifa, and Forza 4.

So please stop pretending that ANYONE is arguing sales = quality. But, you can guarantee if Kinect was REALLY as bad as the haters claim..then believe me it would have done Tony Hawk Ride numbers. It isn't but just like anything else in the gaming industry it's got a long way to go in a short period of time to ultimately live up to it's potential.


Hicken2708d ago

You're right, "core" gamers DO come in all types.

But real skeptics- myself included- of Kinect tend to be core gamer. On the other hand, the haters are likely casual haters.

You may be a core gamers, but that doesn't automatically extend to your family. Do they play a variety of games/systems like you do, or is Kinect pretty much the only thing they get into? Will they go back a generation or three and play something old because it's a quality title, or are graphics and online multiplayer a must?

Your claim of "hardcore" people who play copious amounts of Halo and CoD don't add up; a hardcore FPS player isn't a "core" gamer. Someone who buys every game in one franchise is only a hardcore fan of that game. I used to be like that: I only played FFs for a long time. Then I branched out to other series, and then other genres. Yes, them branching out and trying something like Kinect goes a certain distance towards establishing themselves as core gamers, but the Kinect is (currently) a peripheral that is aimed at casual gamers, so don't go getting ahead of yourself.

Microsoft puts a serial number on every Kinect: they treat it like a system. Additionally, they bundle it together WITH the system it's intended to work with for less than it would cost to buy it as a standalone. When someone comes in thinking about buying a 360, I encourage them to buy either a 250GB system, or the same with Kinect, since those are the most economical options; I'm certain I'm not alone in this, nor are all consumers stupid enough to buy the two things separately. This means, numerically, that a good portion of Kinect sales are 360 sales as well.

You're wrong about "Tony Hawk Ride" numbers. Outside of the developer/publisher, what console maker was pushing that? Microsoft has spent millions in marketing on the Kinect, leagues more than Sony did with the Move. The sales had damn well better reflect that spending. What does it matter, you ask? A couple of years ago, when MW2 came out, I had dozens of people come into my store with NO CLUE that the game was even available on PS3. The reason: at the end of every commercial, a 360 popped up. Additionally, the number of sales may be high, but what are the numbers on used Kinect systems out there?

I think Molyneux is correct: when the Kinect proves to ME that it can support (adequately) a wide variety of core games, then I will support it. As it stands, though, Microsoft is in the Kinect's way by not even supporting the core gamers (no new IPs; sequels to existing franchises that will sell millions based almost on name alone honestly don't count).

EVILDEAD3602708d ago

Once again, people are proving the whole 'core' argument against Kinect is silly.

I will break it down once again for those who didn't read it the first time. The whole 'core' argument started and picked up steam after the big Kinect roll out at last year's E3.

When gthey announced the price the media and fan bloggers went ape (including Pachter) saying that there was NO audience for the device as the 360 'core' gamer wouldn't buy it and the casuals would still be too busy to buying Wiis. The all ate crow.

I could care less about these mythological definitions for what people believe constitutes a 'core' gamer. This is twisting the original context of the 'core' argument

Microsoft ALREADY had the core gamer by the millions. The CORE 360 gamer they were talking about were the gamers who made the Halo franchise a system seller and pushed Halo 3 to 11 million in sales. The millions of gamers who put Call of Duty, Gears of War, Forza, and Fable at the top of the 360 food chain.

Micrsoft sought to expand it's market and it was extremely successful. Again, you can pretend that marketing was the only reason Kinect did well. The fact is if tghe device sucked the word of mouth would have been catostrophic ala Tony Hawk Ride.

I'm laughing at your analogy pretending that 'dozens and dozens' of people came into to 'your store' that didn't know MW2 was not on the PS3. Well I guess your store is located under a rock. MW2 did 3 millon+ on the PS3 in the FIRST week. The 360 advertising did ZERO to deter PS3 fan knowledge of the game.

No matter how people spin it, advertising ALONE has and NEVER will sell any console or game.

Micrsoft has rolled out Kinect perfectly. The intitial line-up of games targeted what made the Wii so successful, but they are doing experiences that are unique to Kinect.

At the end of the day, the 'core' argument is internet ducktales. For instance, you look at what Move was able to accomplish with Killzone 3. Arguably, the only motion control peripheral to decently pull of an FPS. But it did nothing for the sales of the game, even with huge Move numbers out there.

Again, Micrsoft is in a incredible position. This holiday they can roll out better quality sequels of what made Kinect a success with Kinects Sports 2, Dance Central and Fitness Evolved. While rolling out a years worth of titles with Kinect implementation from Forza 4, Mass Effect 3, Madden , Fifa, Tiger Woods, Ghost Recon (+ all future Clancy games) etc.

They can keep expanding with Kinect Fun Labs and the indie market and the kid games like Seseame Street.

They still have a year and a half of development till Fable:Journey, Ryse, and Star Wars are even launched.

Until then we can enjoy gaming experiences right now like Child of Eden..again skeptics and haters will always exist..but they don't mean a thing to the bottomline.


Hicken2708d ago

You know what? We can disregard everything else you said and focus on just one thing, the only thing that matters to Microsoft:

"Until then we can enjoy gaming experiences right now like Child of Eden..again skeptics and haters will always exist..but they don't mean a thing to the bottomline."

You are absolutely right. So despite not treating the core gamers- those who would buy your system through thick and thin- to something nice like a new IP, MS will do what they want because these other things will add to the bottom line.

Remember what MS said after E3? That the core gamers will "come around." Not "We've got things for them, too." Not "We decided to stick with Kinect since we've invested so much, but we haven't forgotten about them."

"They'll come around."

No other company would dare do that. And only Microsoft fanboys would even argue against it. Core gamers don't matter to MS; money does. And the money is in the casual market. They believe it so much they spent- 50 or 500?- millions on marketing, which they must now get back somehow.

Guess how that is?

EVILDEAD3602708d ago (Edited 2708d ago )

LOL @ Hicken pulling out the old dinosaur..but Micrsoft doesn't care about the core..LMFAO...the WORST argument non-360 gamers have come out with in years.

Let's break it down to you..because clearly you had no idea about the 360 games you sold at your 'store'

The TOP 360 CORE franchises this gen are Halo, Gears, Forza, and Fable.

Last year Micrsoft released Halo Reach and Fable 3.

This year Microsoft is releasing Gears of War 3, Forza 4, and Halo Anniversary.

Next Holiday will see Halo 4

Nintendo and Sony both have handhelds..Micrsoft does not. It has Kinect and even though the fan kids always want to dismiss the games for it, they are supporting the customers who purchased the peripheral.

Kinect Sports, Dance Central, Kinect Adventures, Fitness Evolved etc. were all new IPs

Last Year Micrsoft released Splinter Cell Conviction and Alan Wake among the fray..with Ryse slated for the 360 next year.

Look at the numbers and the 360 core are playing all the big franchises..multi-plat or not.

There are so many games coming out from September on even guys like me who buy [email protected] near everything are going to be hard pressed to keep up.

Kinect didn't stop ONE hardcore game from being released. But, what it did do was sell systems and provide a shot in the arm to 360 sales.

The successful implementation of the early titles are leading to better Kinect games in the future. It is the successful work that Rare put in that led to the the sports gaming Icon EA to implement Kinect into it's biggest titles. It's the successful voice immersion that Kinectimals provided that led to the HUGE games like Mass Effect 3 and Ghost Recon to adapt it's use. Even AutoVista from Forza 4 led to a graphical leap from Turn 10.

Microsft are the ONLY company who is getting the hypocritical flack from the fan bloggers and fan kids out there. It's hilarious when people actually believe the internet ducktales they write. ALL companies want a bigger audience for their gaming systems and ALL companies like money. It's just some get a pass and some don't.

At the end of the day..Kinect is a successful side gig that is paying off for the 360 in spades. But, the heart of the 360 is the controller and it's franchises that 360 gamers love and support.


Hicken2708d ago

By the way, doubter, look me up. GameStop store #4863, District Manager Garett Gee, Store Manager Jeremy Riggins. I would be Associate Jacques Jones. Part-time working for two years next month. I close tomorrow and will likely be there Sunday, so feel free to call the store and back my story up.

Those are the only exclusive core franchises for 360, so of course they're the tops. All three of them, by the way, are from last generation, so they had a pretty good fanbase to work with. This year, Microsoft is giving you what they know you'll buy: stuff you've already bought.

Kinect is NOT Microsoft's equivalent to a handheld. It's their version of motion gaming; believe it or not, they're last to the party, doing an enhanced version of something Sony did last generation. Obviously, this peripheral requires new IPs, because playing Halo, Gears, Forza, or Fable on it is not feasible.

Ryse is next year, and I seem to recall that it's not for 360, but for Kinect. And yes, they ARE two different things.

The money spent on marketing for Kinect is money MANY gamers would rather have seen spent acquiring new developers to create new non-Kinect IPs. Oh, but that doesn't matter to you, it seems: a new IP is a new IP. Wii Sports carries the same weight as Mario.

The Big Four you named are it. What you ARE getting this year that are exclusive to 360: Gears- way in September- and Forza 4- in November, isn't it? Halo's a remake, but you can count that if you want.

EA put Kinect into their games for the same reason MS released Kinect: to get a piece of the casual gaming market. EA is only a software manufacturer, though; they have to work with what the hardware manufacturers give them, therefore your point about both them and Rare is effectively moot.

"Successful" is subjective when you speak of voice immersion. And voice recognition itself has been around since the days of the N64, and putting it in one or two games doesn't prove it's anything more than a gimmick.

Microsoft is NOT the only company getting flak:

Nintendo is catching serious hell for not releasing any concrete details about the WiiU, AND for not bringing over strongly desired games like The Last Story and Xenoblade. But they've at least SAID they want to recapture the core crowd they admittedly lost.

Sony is STILL working their way back from being hacked and all the negatives that came along with it. But their going a long way towards making their loyal fans feel deserved, with both new installments in existing IPs and a slew of altogether new IPs.

Microsoft is catching flak for their heavy support of Kinect (people don't care that they support it, only that it's their primary focus). Their response is "come around."

At the end of the day, Kinect has taken the central role in Microsoft's spotlight, and they're making money in spades. But the heart of the 360 is being largely left up to multiplatform titles and IPs that are established sellers.

Hell yes, they'll make money. But let me ask you this: from January 2011 to December 2011, how many non-Kinect 360 titles will you get to play?

There are more than 20 for the PS3, and about as many for the Wii. You tell me: if you had to choose between a company that wanted you to spend an extra hundred and fifty on top of the price of what may or may not be a quality game, and a company that wanted you to pay the price of what may or may not be a quality game, which would you choose?

I know where my money ISN'T going this year.

EVILDEAD3602708d ago (Edited 2708d ago )

Why would I call your store? To back up that over 'dozens and dozens' waked into your Gamestop store and had no idea that Modern Warfare 2 was on the PS3 as well? LMFAO..again maybe at YOUR gamestop..not the ones I frequent especially since MW2 did 3 milli on the PS3 alone in te first week. Thank god they all went to YOUR store and got the info..

Look..youve proven that all Gamestops aren't created equal. I'm a HUGE Gamestop fan and a celeb at the one I hang out at and all that fan kid stuff especially from employees will get you laughed out of the store. In fact, Garett Gee should rethink your part time position. Fan kids are HORRIBLE for business..

All jokes aside, I'll simply respond to some of this..bcause your all over the place. Which continues to prove that the hate Kinect has nothing to do with Kinect and EVERYTHING to do with it being from Microsoft.

your quotes..

Those are the only exclusive core franchises for 360, so of course they're the tops. All three of them, by the way, are from last generation, so they had a pretty good fanbase to work with.

LMFAO..I mentioned four and all you can respond with is what gen the games started in. Bu-bu-but they already had a fanbase to work with.
No duh..The CORE 360 gamers ARE the releasing those franchises DESTROYS the whole 'Microsoft abandoned the core' fake argument that fan kids come up with.

'This year, Microsoft is giving you what they know you'll buy: stuff you've already bought.' wait wait..are you saying that Micrsoft should release games that people DON'T want to buy? Are you trying to claim we already bought Gears of war 3 and Forza 4? Please tell us exactly when..

Oh I get it..Your trying to bash Microsft for releasing sequels to established franchises. Hmmm..let's see what Sony and Nintendo released since your praise them in your response..

Sony's year..
Little Big Planet 2
Killzone 3
Infamous 2
Resistance 3
Uncharted 3

I guess you didn't notice the little numbers next to the titles.because Sony is doing exactly the same thing. Nintendo is releasing another guess what ALL companies release new games in successful franchises EVERY year..just like they have EVERY gen..You probably didnt notice while working at Gamestop

As for the would honestly be too easy to pick the rest of your comment apart.

The bottomline is it's just filled with the same standard rhetoric from the fan kids and fan bloggers that we see ad nauseum. You do Gamestop no justice my would think that G.stop employees would have 8 bubbles..but it's clear why you don't..I think I'm going to Best Buy tommorow..LOL..


+ Show (7) more repliesLast reply 2708d ago
potedude2709d ago

In the words of Bart Simpson.
"I didn't think it was possible but this both sucks and blows at the same time".

Kinect sucks...

slavish32709d ago

kinect will not have a breakthrough with people like molyneux working on it. everygame he makes gets worst and worst

FlashXIII2709d ago

He agrees with people's skepticism regarding Kinect and publicly admits that many gamers just aren't buying into it? Microsoft gonna be mad that their little whipperboy developer bites the hand that feeds it.

Still if he agrees about the kinect skepticism, why is he creating a kinect orientated game? Freaking sellout.

tablav2709d ago

People said exactly the same thing about the Wii when it arrived, and yet it's the biggest casual system out there now. And considering the Wii makes up such a large percentage of actual sales, does that not make it 'core'?

The point is, Kinect is a good invention. It's just been poorly marketed and developed for. It's overpriced and has very little in the way of software.

As for Molyneux being a sellout, how exactly will Kinect ever progress if nobody makes anything for it?

I'm not a big fan of Kinect, but I don't think it's fair to write it off completely this early like most people (on N4G at least) want to do.

FlashXIII2708d ago

Wii might be the biggest selling console but last time I checked, the game sales don't match anywhere near the console sales.

a_bro2709d ago

"I agree with core Kinect scepticism, but breakthrough will come"

kinda reminds me of this:

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