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Tech Focus: MLAA heads for 360 and PC

The PS3 may lose one of its graphical advantages over the Xbox 360, with a team working on implementing a version of Sony’s MLAA anti-aliasing technique seen in such games as God of War 3 and Killzone 3 on Microsoft’s console – and they claim that they’ve “raised the quality bar considerably” over other versions.

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Convas1917d ago

Excellent news! Hopefully, we start hearing about more titles that take advantage of these technique.

I hear that Battlefield 3 for Xbox 360 will be using FXAA. Interesting stuff indeed!

SillySundae1917d ago TrollingShowReplies(12)
NewMonday1917d ago (Edited 1917d ago )

would like to see it, how much resource dose it take on the 360, how much would be left?

gamingdroid1917d ago (Edited 1917d ago )

They indicated a 2.47ms time compared to Sony's 3-4 ms (on five SPUs) which should give you an indication of resources needed, but more specific information would be nice.

I also would like to see why this is an issue. It's a freaken jagged line, that is already smoothed out as is. Can you even tell the difference?

marison1917d ago

They could and should use the Xenon GPU, unless some CPU resources area idle. With the MEMEXPORT feature the GPU could write on RAM and eat that again.

I see this as a very possible and useful bullet point on game engines.

Ju1917d ago (Edited 1917d ago )

This is using the 360's GPU (read the article). Not possible with the 360s CPU. It has been implemented before using ATIs chips on the PC running shaders. This is most likely a newer (better) implementation.

Arksine1917d ago (Edited 1917d ago )

Because it runs on the GPU it needs to be faster. Running MLAA on the CPU allows the GPU to render the next frame in parallel, whereas a GPU implementation must render then postprocess before the next frame can be rendered.

I'm a bit skeptical of some of their claims, because ATI's implementation of MLAA isn't very good. IIRC there was a Star Wars game that used a similar type of AA for the 360, and while it was ok, it wasn't on par with MLAA.

Pixel_Pusher1917d ago (Edited 1917d ago )

Yeah sorry but until I see proof of a game on the 360 that looks the same or better than GOW3 on the PS3 that's the day I'll concede. Until then it's nothing but hype.

SilentNegotiator1917d ago (Edited 1917d ago )

I'll believe it when I see it (on 360, I mean, not PC). Without the integration of CPU with GPU, I don't think the 360 has the power to use MLAA in a significant way, like PS3 with the massive GOW3 and Kz3.

With PC, I suppose it would make sense if you can effectively emulate higher MSAA without sacrificing as much power.

pixelsword1917d ago

Hey, I thought MLAA sucked, so why is this big news or good news?

Because it was on the...?

Brosy1917d ago (Edited 1917d ago )

The 360 can use MLAA as well as a few other lighting tricks that surpass the PS3. Until I see cross game chat and Viva pinata running on a PS3 I wont be impressed by it. PS3 doesnt have enough general purpose processing to run the a.i. on a game like Viva Pinata let along do cross game chat. Atleast the PS3 has enough fans in other countries outside the US to keep it moderately competitive, otherwise folks would take the obviously better built machine the 360.

BTW for all who dont know a.i. cant be run on the Cells SPEs it can only be run by the Cells PPU.

MaxXAttaxX1917d ago (Edited 1917d ago )

'"Until I see cross game chat and Viva pinata running on a PS3 I wont be impressed by it. PS3 doesnt have enough general purpose processing to run the a.i. on a game like Viva Pinata let along do cross game chat."'

You serious? LMFAO! Hahaha :D
Best joke I've seen here on N4G in a while lol

iagainsti1201917d ago

Brosy is an ignorant fool who dosen't know that he is talking about
1- "The 360 can use MLAA as well as a few other lighting tricks that surpass the PS3."
This part about the MLAA is true but if the game does not use the Cell for lighting then yes you are right but if the lighting is done on the cell then you are wrong as lighting is so much better when written for the Cell"

2- "PS3 doesnt have enough general purpose processing to run the a.i. on a game like Viva Pinata let along do cross game chat. Atleast the PS3 has enough fans in other countries outside the US to keep it moderately competitive, otherwise folks would take the obviously better built machine the 360."
Really? AI is up to the developer it runs just fine on 1ppu core the rest of this is just Face Plam.

3- "BTW for all who dont know a.i. cant be run on the Cells SPEs it can only be run by the Cells PPU."
Well where did you hear this the E3? source pls or im wait im just going to Face Palm this too i dont have time for you anymore.

RememberThe3571917d ago

Whether it blows our minds or not, the fact that they're experimenting with it and trying out new ways of AA is good news. The more people try new things the more solutions we find to prevalent issues.

Instead of being skeptical and negative how about being happy that developers are trying new things.

AAACE51917d ago

Console architecture is designed differently than PC's! PC is designed to do many different things and has to be powerful because other things are running while you are doing whatever.

Consoles are designed to focus on specific task without all the extra crap PC's do!

Consoles have custom hardware! So while the components seem similar to what you already recognize, you forget that each console maker got their CPU and GPU custom made to perform a certain way! Otherwise the consoles would have been cheaper because we would be getting the same thing off the shelf as PC gamers.

Judgment will be reserved for a later date!

sobekflakmonkey1917d ago

Brosy needs to GTFO.

@Brosy

Wow...I have never read such a ridiculous comment before...I'm sorry but games like Killzone 2 and 3 have AMAZING A.I., but you probably wouldn't know...would you? you know...being that you most likely haven't even touched a PS3...

+ Show (11) more repliesLast reply 1917d ago
r1sh121917d ago

Ive said it before:

The hardware will be hitting its max output some time soon, the software will need to improve is techniques to get more from it.
This could be one way (If it works), but its probably possible

Hayabusa 1171917d ago

I would like to point out that PS3's MLAA was also done through software. It was possible on PS3 because it has 3 SPUs but MLAA is software, not hardware.

When you see games that look better than it's precedessors or competition it's primary because of the techniques the graphics programmers use. It's not like the developers slowly turn the "awesome graphics" nob up over time :p

Ness-Psi1917d ago

@Hayabusa117

The Awesome graphics knob! it should implemeted in all PC's lol.

Gray-Fox-Type01917d ago (Edited 1917d ago )

this is great news , Xbox has much graphical capabilities and dominates for multiplatform reasons, but this new technique could rise the bar of the Xbox 360 exclusives and perhaps reach PS3 exlusives :D this articles makes it seem it well go beyond we will see how devs use this.

zinkabass1917d ago TrollingShow
BrutallyBlunt1917d ago

zinkabass, still standing by everything you say?

I have a Playstation 3 and a XBOX360, does that mean I am a 3-10 year old or does my age fluctuate pending on which system I am currently using?

You would think after 5 or 6 years these trolls would finally just give up.

M-A-R-S-H-A-L-L1917d ago

Someone has been misinformed and haven't done their research at all.

randomwiz1917d ago

Only one problem - you're using the gpu which is probably already pushed to the max when playing the game. If you're going to use the gpu, you're sacrifice pixel pushing power.

CrimsonEngage1917d ago TrollingShow
firemassacre1917d ago

gray fox

you cant be serious

Redgehammer1917d ago

Zinkabass, my father would have said you must talk out of your butt, because your mouth knows better.
I have 100 friends on my friends list, and the youngest is 10 (my son) and the oldest is 54 (13 years older than me). Your comments just have the distinct ring of bitter generalizations. Why do you even comment in a 360 article?

fr0sty1917d ago

Gray Fox, MLAA isn't the only thing that makes PS3 exclusives look better. Uncharted has never used it, for instance. Also, being that the GPU is what is handling this, it ties it up before it can render the next frame as well, so there is a performance hit vs. on PS3 where the CPU is able to do it while the GPU keeps on chugging along. Typically PS3 games are not CPU bound, so there are SPU's the can be freed up to do things like this with a minimal impact on performance.

strickers1917d ago

You actually believe that AA is the difference between PS3 exclusives and 360 ones?
It's not.

bunfighterii1916d ago

Now all 360 needs is exclusives to utilise the technique...

+ Show (7) more repliesLast reply 1916d ago
gapecanpie1917d ago (Edited 1917d ago )

So people actually like that blurry mess that is GOW 3 and just about every other ps3 game .... MLAA is a fking joke it does nothing then make a game a blurry mess.... This is one tech MS should skip on. One of the main reason I like 360 games gfx is because they aren't blurry....Oh well

knowledge4lfe1917d ago

really man? how old are you?? you sound like a little baby who didn't get his bottle. if you even played GOW 3 you'd sure as hell know its not bllurry. yet look at Halo Reach. has to be one of the blurriest games i've ever played. but i'm sure you won't admit that.

CernaML1917d ago

Like knowledge4lfe stated, Halo Reach is blurrier than all the PS3 games that use MLAA. Crysis 2 is especially blurry.

MLAA was one hell of a breakthrough. I'm surprised you are crying about such an amazing tech coming to the 360.

gapecanpie1917d ago (Edited 1917d ago )

Hmmmm well first of all I haven't played Halo Reach so I wouldn't know. I have played some 360 games and they weren't a blurry mess as compared to the majority of ps3 games... Also to me GOW 3 is a blurry mess maybe not to you but to me it is and thats a fact and unless you have my eyes you or any one else can't disprove other wise.

(Insert lame comment about me seeing a optometrist here)

The only two crying and sounding like a little baby is you two... you must be like 6 or something defending a piece of plastic like your lives depending on it...

Oh and yeah I did play that short blurry mess, I even got a platinum trophy for it :) but its not worth the $60 dollars I paid because its so d*mn short and blurry.

http://us.playstation.com/p...

Let me guess I'm trolling right just because I stated my opinion. I wouldn't be surprised if my comment get removed.

AshleyRiot1917d ago ImmatureShow
BlackTar1871917d ago (Edited 1917d ago )

Gape you really believe that anyone believes you don't own a 360? in the last 3 comments you have put down PS3 games you have made points about ps3 getting owned in certain territories. You think people believe yoU?

Everyone look at his last 10 comments they are so hate filled its ridiculous. Troll is all he is.

here guys look at my PSN account lol.

yingYangdragon1917d ago (Edited 1917d ago )

A lot of you guys are getting so b*tthurt over that one comment Gape made, I mean if it's not true then why get so b*tthurt over it??????

I never seen so many people get so passion over a gaming system before :O

fallingdove1917d ago

Glasses would help with your issue seeing in blur.

SilentNegotiator1917d ago (Edited 1917d ago )

MLAA....blurry? That's a good one, Mr. Troll.

GOW3 is vivid as can be. Compare that to ANY "360 games gfx". And I mean ANY. You'll find that GOW3 triumphs with the other game looking significantly more blurry.

ndl15311917d ago (Edited 1917d ago )

you know whats a joke ? microsofts lack of exclusives . atleast sony has games to implement MLAA on you idiot fanboy . doubt you even have a ps3 judging by your hate let alone played god of war 3. you probably game on a old a$$ 1980s tv thats why everything looks blurry to you haha time to upgrade man or your a$$ is blind one or the other

+ Show (6) more repliesLast reply 1917d ago
Crazyglues1917d ago (Edited 1917d ago )

Actually I'm a PS3 fan, but I think this is good news for Gamers.. Why?

It's good to see Microsoft raising the bar, competition is what makes the game companies try harder... -So if more companies start using this then they will make better games for 360 and PS3.. instead of ugly ports..

-and it means better games which is always good no matter what you play on.. We all want, just really good games..

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digoutyoursoul81917d ago

well said young man, well said.

sobekflakmonkey1917d ago (Edited 1917d ago )

Agreed.

Competition pushes the industry, it's an extremely important part of the gaming industry itself.

xAlmostPro1917d ago

This is awesome news.. but and im not trolling when i say this it doesn't fix the disc space issue -_-

you can make it look as pretty as you want but without the storage it's gonna be either really short or on multiple discs.. MD' isn't that much of an issue but it can be annoying..

anyways im excited to see what they do with this :)

bozebo1917d ago (Edited 1917d ago )

True.
MD is an issue if the game needs to be open world though.

JsonHenry1917d ago

My HD5870 already did this I thought?

Liquid_Ocelot1917d ago

Great news!!
Can't hate on this, it's always great to see that we keep moving forward. Great news for our Xbox brothers indeed. Rejoice!

Brosy1917d ago

NathanExplosion I cant help your ignorance as well as any of the other sony fanboys on this site, all I can do is try to educate you. And I think thats a useless endeavor.

50Terabytespersec1916d ago TrollingShow
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THC CELL1917d ago

U mean exclusives will look better on xbox that ps3, hm.............. Lol yea sure they will, sony will laugh there ass off at that one.. I garantee bf3 will be the worst in the consoles.

The Meerkat1917d ago

Can we all quote you on that one?

UltimateIdiot9111917d ago

I'll believe it when I see it until then it's just all mumble jumbo words.

WhiteLightning1917d ago (Edited 1917d ago )

Agreed...

We've been lied to before by Microsoft, I'm not falling for it again....."Theres hardcore games coming to Kinect", "Core gamers LOVE Kinect", "Core gamers are our main focus". Over and over again they say the same things and now they expect us to believe that they have done this for core gamers after yesterday in that article they said casual gamers were their main focus.

Not being fooled again

As you said....I'll beleive it when I see it.

kneon1917d ago

This isn't coming from Microsoft, it's from some graphics researchers. Microsoft had some involvement but they don't own it. The code is available under a BSD license which means anyone can use it.

So while it will benefit the XBox it may equally benefit PC, Wii U and even the PS3 as it's a more efficient way to implement MLAA.

UltimateIdiot9111917d ago

I do understand that it's coming from graphic researchers but again, there have been many researchers who claim many things but fail to come up with substantial results.

I don't doubt they are working on something of this sort but I don't know if it's as great as they say. It's dealing with graphics here and that requires us to look at it first. So while it may look good in their eyes, in reality, it could look meh.

MOTY1917d ago (Edited 1917d ago )

@ WhiteLightning

"Theres hardcore games coming to Kinect"

- Ryse - CORE
- Fable - CORE
- Child of Eden - CORE
- Haunt - CORE
- Star Wars - CORE
- Rise of Nightmares - CORE

Kinect implemented games

- Mass Effect 3
- Ghost Recon
- Halo CE Anniversary
- EA 2012 Sports Titles
- Forza 4

Doesn't look like MS lied.

"Core gamers LOVE Kinect"

I'm a core gamer and I love Kinect. Can't wait to play some of those listed core games as well as use my Kinect for games like ME3, Forza 4 and Ghost Recon.

MS didn't Lie again.

"Core gamers are our main focus"

XBOX 360 has a CORE library that far surpasses the Casual library. There are more games coming out each year on the XBOX360 that are core games than casual. If 3rd party support for Kinect games count as MS focusing on Casual, then 3rd party support for Core games also means that MS is focusing on Core as well.

Gears 3
Forza 4
The Whitcher 2
Halo CE Anniversary
CoD Timed exclusive DLC
The largest library of Indie and Arcade games

Seems to be a rather large focus. 1st and 3rd party support.

MS didn't lie again.

I fail to see where MS were lying.

I don't agree with you.

callahan091917d ago

@MOTY:
"- Ryse - CORE
- Fable - CORE
- Child of Eden - CORE
- Haunt - CORE
- Star Wars - CORE
- Rise of Nightmares - CORE "

So I take it that "CORE" to you is based entirely on theme?

fr0sty1917d ago (Edited 1917d ago )

um, half of those games are either on rails or only use kinect for non-gameplay purposes (forza 4's car view mode, ghost recon's weapon mod mode, neither are used while actually playing the game). then there's others that use nothing other than kinect's mic, which is a feature that is far from exclusive to kinect. all modern systems have a mic and can do voice recognition. hell, the n64 was doing voice recognition back in the day, so did dreamcast with seaman.

The only compelling use of kinect so far IN GAME that isn't another arcade on rails experience is forza's head tracking, but even GT5 had that.

Apophis1917d ago SpamShow
bozebo1917d ago (Edited 1917d ago )

"there's massive lag"

^ this, is why there can be no core kinect games.

+ Show (4) more repliesLast reply 1917d ago
TimeSkipLuffy1917d ago

I don't care! Just wanna play good games. There is not that much difference between those two consoles anyway. It's not like MS has NES and PS has GameCube graphics.

Anon19741917d ago TrollingShowReplies(1)
falout1917d ago

I agree..

This place with ppl like darkride always leave me scratching my head wonder if I got a ps3 knock off or something. They always make it seem as if the ps3 is leaps and abounds ahead of 360 graphics like if the ps3 is some super pc rig and the 360 is the original xbox.

Darkride cry all you want but every game you mentioned looks great be a gamer and stop with all this ms hat you spew on every 360 article. My goodness! You act as if ms raped your mom had you and never paid child support.

gamingdroid1917d ago (Edited 1917d ago )

I kind of agree with this. It's not like the PS3 is some graphical leap above anything else out there. In fact, the graphics is so similar to the Xbox 360 it is plain ridiculous. You want great looking games, go to PC and you will get full 1080p in all it's glory.

If you just want to game, then even the Wii will do!

pixelsword1917d ago

@ falout Darkride didn't say that any PS3 game looked like a high end PC rig...

A few other guys said it though, and I think I can trust the source...

http://www.gamespot.com/for...

starchild1917d ago

I completely agree with this.

I play on PC, PS3, and 360, and it's crazy how close the graphics are on PS3 and 360.

I have been playing the Uncharted 3 beta and I honestly think the Gears of War 3 beta looked a bit better. Overall, though, the best looking games on both consoles are at a similar level of graphics.

If you want a decent leap above that, you have to get a gaming PC.

falout1917d ago (Edited 1917d ago )

@pixlesword

He didn't say it out right in here but he sure as he'll acts like it is a high end pc rig in 99.9% of his posts.

+ Show (1) more replyLast reply 1917d ago
MASTER_RAIDEN1917d ago

AGREE! i first clicked on the article because i was wondering just what the hell MLAA was..then i see that it has a thing or two to do with graphics, and 160 comments from about 100 sweaty fanboys trying to downplay this achievement. get real guys..ps3s graphics are better than 360s. NOT by leaps n bounds, but its visuals are Superior in most ways. whatever upgrades the 360s visuals get due to MLAA will probably be very slight and more of the same. no need to get all defensive.

kudakadere1917d ago

If only they still put more investment into hardcore games as they used to.