Financial analysis of the Big Three in videogames posted by a contributor to VG Chartz. Note that this article is based on data provided by each respective company's financial earnings reports and is through September 30, 2007.
VG Chartz takes a lot of heat at times for their numbers but this is through September 30, 2007 and is based on the manufacturers reported data. In addition, VG Chartz "corrects" their numbers in arrears as they get public information from sources such as NPD, Media Create, Famitsu, and so on.
Ja. Thankfully, some of this info really IS direct from Sony and MS and Nintendo.
The really telling bits actually from the companies:
-[The game division of] Sony posted a loss of 96.7 billion yen ($841 million), more than double their losses from the same quarter last year
-[Microsoft's similar division] posted an operating profit of $165 million for the quarter, as opposed to the $1.2 billion loss last quarter and the $992 million lost a year ago.
-Nintendo [as a company] made 132 billion yen from April to September this year, a 144% increase (more than doubling) over the same period last year.
One of these things is not like the other.
I see the PS3 selling similarly to the 360. I dont think the 360 is selling poorly, and they are both selling about the same, so why is the ps3 a sinking ship again?
Its not that its sinking its just below expectations. Kind of like if you were to watch a professional bowler get a say 280 score. By no means is that bad, but people expect them to get at least 290 so when you don't you get some flack. Kind of the same with Sony, since they did so well last gen people excepted them to do the same this time around.
In the words of well somebody, "Expectations are the mother of all F ups."
What're doing making such a well thought out and balanced post?
Have a bubble.
Agreed sales of the 360 and PS3 are pretty close most months with the 360 mostly leading the PS3 by 20k or more. This is the problem as I keep stating and why the PS3 is viewed as a sinking ship. Every month they don’t sale the same or more that the 360 the install base lead of the 360 widens. The fact that the 360 month for month continues to out due the PS3 even slightly grows the install base lead for the 360. This is the same situation Microsoft ran into with the original Xbox. While many of the developers are hoping for the best for PS3 it gets to a point where there shareholders want to see more of a return on profit; at that point they have to go where the larger install base is. This will hurt the PS3 as it hurt the Xbox because this means less overall games and exclusives. A huge game library means a bigger chunk of the gamer community. Look at last gen PS2 over 3 times the available games in its library compared to the Xbox, no doubt it made it very attractive with the large install base to get developers to develop on the console.
You also have to account how companys report sales. Sometimes companys report the systems that they sell to retail as moving consoles, this is true but not what most of us consider actual sales. I'm very glad they posted both of these numbers here to give a better perspective. A console could have a huge leap in sales but it not make a dent in the overall systems sold category because those systems were already accounted for when they were shipped to retail. Just a few tricks of the trade to keep your stock holders happy is all, I'm just glad that anyone who wants a console can go to the store and pick it up now without having to go through Ebay...
well put jaja, well put
An interesting thread, seems like it makes sense.
But I wonder how accurate it really is?
I think the 360 will manage to stay in the black thru the holidays after that. Who knows?
you here that sony MADE 73.7 billion yen ($641 million) and microsoft $1.2 billion loss last quarter and the $992 million lost a year ago. now thats funny LMAO there is no hope for you xfags microsoft is losing billions this just futher more proves that microsoft sucks cuz there not making money so what are they in this business for?? so they can misslead there retarded fanbase and destroy this industry something that sony built. these numbers are an embarrassment and microsoft is a jokehow could you love something which is failing so miserably why? because you lack the intelligence TO UNDERSTAND what a true failuar means XLOSERS
u make us playstation fans look bad, please die.
did you not see that Microsoft as a WHOLE made a PROFIT of over $4 BILLION dollars in one QUARTER and the Entertainment & Devices division did NOT drag down the quarter for the first time? Sony as a WHOLE made $641 MILLION for the quarter...do I have to explain to you the difference between millions and billions? and I'm very happy that the Entertainment & Devices division are actually in the black for a change considering all the software and accessories that I and fellow 360 owners BUY...can the DIVISION stay in the black and profitable is another question...are they and MS going anywhere? HECK NO! I really don't like when people SPIN FACTS...and there has NEVER been a time when Microsoft wasn't making money...MS makes more money in a quarter than most companies make in a...why am I still talking to you?...I probably wasted my time, seeing that you obviously believe only what you want to anyway...
"The big news is Sony losing so much money on the PS3 this quarter, right when they were making claims 6 months ago about making the hardware profitable this year..." Yeah, read that paragraph...or do you just skip around reading what you want to?
*this is for doomsonyman only...I know there are good and intelligent GAMERS on all sides of N4G: Sony, MS, and Nintendo included... and don't agree with him, and others like him, that make such lackluster statements...*
Sony built this industry?
Try Nintendo took the foundation that Atari laid down and built this industry.
Yes, I see you are frustrated, but trust me, your pubic hair will grow sooner or later.
Haha, good one Saint. Bubble for you, sir.
"this industry something that sony built" <-- LOL
My laughs for the day. Thanks guys.
@Doom: I'm tempted to give you a bubble just because you're so stupid and amusing to read, but ehh. It's hard enough to sift through the fanboy posts for the intelligent ones.
you are funny! hardyharhar!
Sony has 248 Billion in gaming inventory -- up 10% from the prior quarter -- primarily due to stockpiling PS3s. That is a LOT of inventory... about $2.2 billion at today's exchange rate. Since we don't know the ratio of PS3 to PS2 to software and other gaming-related inventory, it's hard to tell but regarless, Sony has a LOT of PS3s stocked and ready to go for the holidays by the end of September...
...Stocking up on PS3s to meet consumer demand is one thing but why are people buying the PS3? just because it it less expensive than it used to be 6 months ago?
For me the PS3 does not (yet) have that big holiday release that will sell systems. R&C is a AAA but its not a system seller, not in huge volumes anyway - not like a GTA or MGS.
How much money is Sony going to lose with high sales of its new 40GB model? I'm still wondering what else was sacrificed other than BC and a couple of ports. It does not equate to such a significant drop in price so Sony must be taking a big hit on each unit sold.
Seem like Both Sony and M$ are risking to take the lost of both the 360 and Ps3 to be able to gain a profit in the near future
The PS2 made it back in the long run because of huge game sales. If the 360 continues to be a robust competitor, it's possible that neither the 360 or PS3 will ever move to a point where they make any (significant) money this generation. What percent "loss" is Sony taking on the 40 gig and what are they still taking on the 80? I suspect next quarter will look a lot like this one with them beginning to turn the corner in the quarter after that. They won't be too far behind MS at that point, though, as Sony will be about $4B in the hole on the PS3...
Or didn't read the thread... The numbers are directly from the makers financial statements and not "guesstimates". I would not have posted it otherwise.
I should hope that the Playstation 3 can get itself out of this one, this is REALLY bad news for Sony:
http://jbooth.blogspot.com/... Is the "PHONY" PLAYSTATION 3 ON ITS LAST LEGS? WILL IT BE PULLED FROM NORTH AMERICA?
No, but its a bad situation even worse than the first Xbox. It really sucks for them.
They need to be more competitive quickly, the only problem is: THEIR CONSOLE IS THE HARDEST TO DEVELOP GAMES FOR.
Oops. That means the exclusives it has are small, and 2008 is already looking hotter than ever with CONDEMNED 2, TOO HUMAN, SPLINTER CELL5 EXCLUSIVE, and GEARS OF WAR 2 plus FABLE 2 and NINJA GAIDEN 2.
Playstation 3 was a big mistake full of mistakes, I'll still have one anyway but they are really in last place for exclusives.
Both consoles have their exclusives. But the point is... both consoles have completely different types of gamers and games. Sales will probably be lower for Sony this Generation, but I doubt that it will be pulled out of America, I really doubt it.
GO NINTENDO GO! can the Wii atleast get some better games maybe
I'm going to leave Sony fans alone on this one, the numbers say everything and they have alot of spinning to do.
this holiday will it be the price drop or games that sell the hardware?
with Nintendo they already win with their price and some top franchises.
with the xbox 360 they might have another price drop and already have a good size library with AAA titles.
with sony, the games are starting to roll out but noting in terms of system sellers ala Mgs, GTA and games like that.
word is out that the consensus is a lot of gamers will stay clear of the 40 gig ps3 just because of the BC issue. Mark my words, that console will sell but for the wrong reasons. I have been scanning all types of forums and people are really disgusted about the BC issue.
this will backfire, but many might buy that version and have it as a movie player. I guess that was the hidden agenda anyways. If you wanna push sales of PS3 software you do not cut you cash cow. Especially when there are so many great games to be enjoyed by the masses that are on the PS2 and especially newcomers.
what people want is a 60 gig Ps3 that is cheap or cheaper, like the 40 gig. that's sony...that's it.
the most important season for console makers is under way.
I mean that in terms of being the most reliable. Granted I am sure that there are a few errors within these numbers but so far from the ones that I have seen on this site they seem to be the closest to accurate. That being said, the guys at Nintendo must be having a great time while others might be feeling the heat.
It looks like Sony is still falling behind each month to X-box, even though things seem to be improving in the house of Sony. I think right now the biggest problem they are having is attracting developers to their system. They just aren't putting up enough numbers for people to really flock to their camp. I was reading an article the other day I think it was from this site where a person said I can take the team that is working on a PS3 title and split them up and produce four Wii titles. With the technology being so new it seems it takes more people to work on it. Now if you look at it like that it takes more people to make a game on the PS3 and their aren't as many PS3's as their are anything else. To me that says more money in, less money out. I think the best thing they can do is produce some in house titles, like the Wii is doing, and maybe get more exclusives.
The Wii side of things is looking great as always, I don't think they will hit any bumps in the road until way way way down the line. Though most people do seem to view the Wii as a novelty and not so much as a true game system. When most people think of the Wii it's more good times and playing with friends, with a few spots of getting tough like, Zelda and Metroid. Otherwise it's Wii sports and collective Mario and friends titles.
The 360 does seem to have done well with the Halo 3 release and I don't know what in the black means but it seems to be a good thing. I really don't see why they would have a problem staying on the positive side of the budget sheet but my knowledge of business is limited. Their console seems to be selling just fine, and better quality games keep coming out for it. I really don't see how they will suddenly fall back into a funk.
Overall it appears that all three systems are on the rise and each is going stronger than they were before. Good more competition between them means better things for us consumers.
but the fact still remains that the PS3 has sold absolutely swimmingly from a November 2006 (U.S.) release date and a March release date for the EU respectively. With nearly 5 million units *sold on a console that allegedly was (((overpriced))) and lacking (((games))) that's pretty damn good if you ask me. Now let's not be to quick to forget that MS had Gears, Bioshock, and Halo a **year** (or more) after it's release and developers have had an easier time dealing with its simplified architecture. Lest we forget about the 1 bilion dollars set aside for failures? With all of the setback involved for both companies the numbers can be a bit deceiving. I think both are doing well and that people are overreacting to small drops of water in an ocean of factors and variables.
We're talking about the first 11 months or 6 months in the EU for a console that seems like it's going head on against the architects of the Crusades when speaking of adversity. It think it's done very well, and that's also in the face of high laser diode costs which they have seemed to get a handle on, and managed to throw in a few pricedrops along the way at the behest of wile consumers longing for a "good" PS3 console. These costs and losses in the first year, essentially for a new franchise is normal and expected and Sony hasn't even had their Gears, Halo3, or Bioshock moments yet, so let's look at the big picture -- look at where SNE and MSFT are today and see the numbers for what they really are which is a great testament to the strength of the video game industry and how far the Tokyo based company has come since it launched the 3rd Playstation just a short while ago. People thought SNE would be nowhere near the numbers they have sold already going into the Christmas 2007 season and the target numbers they set for the company.
Remember it's a marathon and the PS3 has battled some tough inclines in 100 degree heat, but Fall is here and the road seems to be flattening a bit. I like the future I see for the PS3 and that goes for the 360 as well as this will only help fuel better games and innovations for all, but to say that this is somehow "bad news" for the PS3 is a little ludicrous to say the least.
actually the cash cow is getting fatter as more consumers embrace Bdhidef video. Through American sales or worldwide sales.People miss the simple logic.Sony has its hands in the movie biz, so great relations and exclusivity go hand in hand. lying about sales numbers and denying large margin of hw malfunction, uhhhhhh....i wont point any fingers. LIke it or not, dvd will go the way of the vhs. People will embrace hdtvs and its even lower pricepoint, this year.
Ps3 is a value at 400,and In comparison to the wii the ps3 has a $150 bdplayer. The new pricepoint will put the pressure on both of the consoles AROUND the world. Not in just 1 market, AND for many reasons which are argued everyday on this site.
Wii had a great start and is doing well but those sales are dropping due to lack of software for like 3-4 months. I guess its aimed at the kids...... again. i feel cheated, though its totally disposable.
no matter what these charts say, go out and buy/rent games, play games, and enjoy gaming( i don't care what platform). WE are GAMERS! Support the gaming industry!
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