180°
Submitted by milf_sex 1346d ago | opinion piece

Why it is so easy to blame VGChartz

An article by VGChartz explaining the methodology behind the sales numbers they report and the hardships they face when they are reported. (Aaron Greenberg, Industry, Kinect, Playstation Move, Tag Invalid)

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bmw69  +   1346d ago
Great article
MeatPopsicle  +   1346d ago
Vgchartz is the fake sales number site of a twenty something year old Xbox fanboy.

The kid use to post fake sales numbers on the neogaf forums under the handle ioi trying to make Xbox 360 sales look higher than they really were and PS3 sales lower than they really were. The mods finally got so sick of his lies that they banned him permanently from the site.

His lies about sales were so bad that his name and site and now banned words on the forum and you will get banned for even trying to refer to the site and its fake sales numbers.

After getting banned for his lies about sales he ran off and created his crappy little fake sales number site vgchartz so no one could stop him from spreading fabricated sales numbers.

It really is amazing to see just how far certain console's fans are will to believe something absurdly and manifestly fake as long as it tells them what they desperately want to hear.

You just have to laugh at the absurdity that anyone fell for vgchartz's lies about sales and that some little kid is able to:

* Track not just one country, but three entire market around the globe

* Provide weekly sales numbers for both hardware and software across all three major console sales regions

* Do all of this for free

Retail tracking firms are huge companies that game developers and publishers pay a good deal of money for their accurate sales numbers. They have been doing so for many, many years.

Vgchartz is a shit stain on the gaming world. The last thing gamers need is some little fanboy putting out fake sales numbers. There are enough lies already gamers have to put up already.
#1.1 (Edited 1346d ago ) | Agree(56) | Disagree(25) | Report | Reply
ct03  +   1346d ago
At least read the article. Their methodology for estimating sales numbers is described very well and makes a lot of sense.

Of course these estimates differ from actual tracking data. That's why they're estimates.
Biggest  +   1346d ago
What are they being blamed for? Inaccuracy? They're estimates. Don't be sad that estimates aren't accurate, VGChartz people. Why people are sad to be what they are is beyond me. If you don't like how people perceive you. . . STOP DOING WHAT YOU'RE DOING! Don't expect sympathy for continuing to do what you're known and disliked for doing.
WaggleLOL  +   1346d ago
Estimates? No...

Vgchartz pathetic fanboy game is:

* Leverage Microsoft being the only console maker that still uses shipment numbers instead of actual console sales.

* Use the extra 2-3 million shipment numbers for 360 consoles to pad out 360 sales. Usually in Europe because that is the region with the least amount of reliable sales data

* Inflate 360 sales numbers as far as the kid making them up thinks he can get away with. Often this has him making up 360 sales that are higher than the actual known shipment numbers for the 360

* Do the opposite for PS3 sales. As low as he thinks he can get away with. Even if the numbers are lower than months old legitimate sales data

* As soon as real sales numbers come out he rushes back to his numbers and silently changes them to avoid getting caught by his lies
#1.1.3 (Edited 1346d ago ) | Agree(22) | Disagree(13) | Report
WaggleLOL  +   1346d ago
"Of course these estimates differ from actual tracking data. That's why they're estimates."

Random numbers are different from actual tracking data too. That doesn't make them 'estimates'.

Vgchartz is a site that puts out deliberate lies to support its own fanboy agenda.

You really have to boggle that the idiot behind vghchartz fake sales numbers has spent some 4 years of his sad little life playing fanboy games day after day making up fraudulent sales numbers.

Honestly dude, everyone knows you're posting here. Get a life. You're an embarrassedly to gamers of all platforms.
Seferoth75  +   1345d ago
It is funny that fanboys want to claim the guy is an xbox fan yet they clearly show Wii in the lead and have for years.

We get it kids, without VGChartz you kids could use false numbers that you made up. SO of course you cant stand them.

Just because a site is honest about the place Sony is in doesnt mean they do not count.

Would love for someone to explain to me how their estimates are completely wrong but NPD estimates are completely okay with getting into some pathetic fanboy debate.

Also please do so without owning a PS3. Since owning an xbox makes him a fanboy and gives him an agenda I will assume that anyone that owns a PS3 must also be a fanboy wit their own agenda.
Knushwood Butt  +   1345d ago
That's pathetic if the bmw account is the guy behind VGC.

Still, it would not surprise me one bit.

Dire site, and for the record they are far more pro Nintendo than MS. Sony gets it the worst.

The Source is a raging Nintendo fanboy and he plays a large part in things.

Crap site. Do not click and read their article.
ComboBreaker  +   1345d ago
While the article is a very well written one,
in the end, their methods for estimating the sales is the same as the following:

1. Make up a good number for the 360. Add millions to it.

2. Make up a bad number for the PS3. Subtract millions from it.

3. Claim hardships.
#1.1.7 (Edited 1345d ago ) | Agree(2) | Disagree(0) | Report
bmw69  +   1346d ago
Again, you didn't read the article? Go back and read it all and see how stupid what you just posted now sounds.
#1.2 (Edited 1346d ago ) | Agree(13) | Disagree(29) | Report | Reply
ryuzu  +   1346d ago
Not going to give hits to the site, given this is VGChartz begging people to play nice lol.

Even MS can't support your numbers hehe.

Stop spamming gaming sites with junk and maybe people will go easy.

r.
#1.2.1 (Edited 1346d ago ) | Agree(23) | Disagree(8) | Report
Brutallyhonest  +   1346d ago
ryuzu
bwm69 is VGChartz
He probably wrote the article. This guy most likely has several accounts that he uses to submit and approve his own crap and then he comes here and defends them.

Sorry but ALL VGChartz articles should be marked as rumor. It's a shame N4G doesn't have a source called "tabloid nonsense looking for attention". < - that would be a better description than marking it as a rumor.
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Brutallyhonest  +   1346d ago
bmw69 is without shame.
He is VGChartz
#1.3 (Edited 1346d ago ) | Agree(14) | Disagree(4) | Report | Reply
acere  +   1346d ago
Even Greenberg ripped on VGchartz on twitter yesterday. No one in the industry uses them, no one quotes their numbers, no one takes them seriously. It's a fan run site. Get over it.
TechnicalBS  +   1345d ago
It might only be estimates, but it'll be the closest thing you'll get until official numbers are released from the official company themselves.

Personally I couldn't careless about numbers. I'd rather there be a single console where all publishers including Sony, Nintendo and Microsoft have their teams develop games for this single console. That would be the end of fanboyism and I'd save money in the process.

Eh, only in my dreams.
Zeevious  +   1345d ago | Intelligent
Brian Walton - BMW69 - bwalton@vgchartz.com - you REALLY where STUPID ENOUGH
to state your own VGChartZ article that YOU WROTE YOURSLEF to defend your fake VGChartZ is a "Great article" ?

REALLY? This puts you beyond a total loser -- A fake -- A flake.

It only confirms EVERYTHING ever said about you, your "site" and why you deserve no respect and to be permanently banned here!

What exactly does it take to get some fake-a*s trash-site like this banned for good on N4G?

You're article title is the most telling of all...It's not a title...it's a question:

Why it is so easy to blame VGChartz .?.?.
Because VGChartz is guilty and should be blamed!

- You, Brian are entirely responsible for the fake sh*t you built an entire site around.
- You, Brian deserve to be blamed, because you are guilty.
- You are trying, even now to pull the same VGChartZ-class scams, by approving and claiming your own FAKE article is great!

WILL SOME MOD PLEASE BAN THIS A*SHOLE
and this A*SHOLES SITE FROM N4G - FINALLY!

How much longer are Mods here going to feed this industry-blight hits?

Please -- Take action Mods and DO SOMETHING!

This abuse of N4G is deserving of nothing less than a BAN! - Please!
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Zeevious  +   1345d ago
My Mistake - this Fake's name is BRETT WALTON
not Brian Walton.

There's enough fake info on his site to wade through, we don't need his name to be wrong too...

BRETT WALTON - For afflicting N4G with your constant stream of fake 'estimates' (read outright lies) for nothing but site hits...
http://www.youtube.com/watc...

Enjoy the truth.
mandf  +   1346d ago
Because they make up numbers. They have no partnership with retailers for what they sold. Just because you make a website on the internet does not make you a legitimate player in the video game industry. Calling retailers all across the globe requires a large dedicated staff. Just because you have an understanding of how things are tracked does not mean you are an honest and reputable site. Npd was accurate and involved with retailers that is what made them reliable. Nobody in the industry has ever acknowledged VG chartz for being reputable. How you do you make a site and put a Z at the end of your name expect to be respected. You can't even use proper english.
#2 (Edited 1346d ago ) | Agree(21) | Disagree(12) | Report | Reply
bmw69  +   1346d ago
Didn't read the article?
Mr_Bun  +   1346d ago
What are you, the "didn't read the article" nazi?

Weird, partner site of VGChartz actually defends VGChartz? You'd be foolish not to read this article /s
#2.1.1 (Edited 1346d ago ) | Agree(23) | Disagree(8) | Report
mandf  +   1346d ago
I read the article. They have knowledge of how to track but aren't a real business in the sense of working working with retailers or the industy. They make up numbers based off speculation. Nobody in the industry recognizes VG charts because they are nobodies. They track for no one. They have no partnerships. Go ahead and call up your local gamestop, wallmart or any other retailer and they won't tell you shit because they only answer to higher ups. Call the higher ups and they will tell you they only answer to the stock holders. VG chartz are nobodies in the industry. Basically they are playing house on the internet.
ryuzu  +   1346d ago
So what's happened here? BMW and Milf and prolly some others are VGChartz account to try and spam for hits on N4G?

That's pretty lame dont'cha think? It's worked though, now I suddendly believe Vgc made up numbers - wow. What next, Santa Claus?

r.
#2.1.3 (Edited 1346d ago ) | Agree(15) | Disagree(1) | Report
Zeevious  +   1346d ago
I agree -- These guys are just planted accounts...
...to support and approve VGCharts news...just look at their comment and approval histories. That's all the fakes do!

...and you mean the article that first goes to a 30 second AD to get you site hits? Wow, really professional, and not confirming all you are doing is making up controversial numbers to rake in the ad-cash. The ad's plastering both the left-and right and all over your pages in every spare-space also don't admit, in all their flash-glory that you're nothing but an phony-excuse for hits and ad-revenue.

Guess what, I DID read the article, AFTER ad-blocking your a** so you didn't get one single penny of ad-revenue from me.

Given your past history of guesstimates, you claim to call 200 stores for your number...meaning you call at the most 20. Of those stores, you extrapolate whatever numbers you pull out of your a** and that's why they stink.

Brian Walton - Mw69 - bwalton@vgchartz.com - You'r 'estimates' are nothing but fake 'guestimates'

Fake numbers. Making up Fake totals. Fake charts.
Fake totally made-up comparisons. Caught fixing Fake numbers. Pretending it's all someone elses fault. Called a Fake by Microsoft and deemed without credibility by EVERYONE in the industry.

Y O U A R E A F A K E

Why you are still allowed to have anything from your site posted here...only the administration here knows.

Oh, and Ryuzu -- Don't drag Santa into this...or you'll get a lump of coal in your stocking.

I know that's what everyone at VGChartZ gets.

In "fact" according to VGChartZ, lumpz of coal have gone up, with a 27% rize in coal-ztocking additionz, with a ztocking attach rate that's 9:1 since the release of Kinect-Ztocking Ztuffer in the pazt 10 days.

Theze numberz are abzolutely accurate...until I change them late tonight, when no ones watching.
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milf_sex  +   1346d ago
Its a good idea to read the article before spreading mindless propoganda originated from Gaf..... They don't make up numbers...they estimate 'em.
Sure, it may not be 100% accurate....but its not completely wrong...its not like they report that complete flops sold millions and hits sold a few thousand units.
Its the closest thing we've got to sales numbers (since we may never know how much a certain game has sold worldwide at a certain point in time).
So yeah...in short - Vgchartz may not be 100% accurate...but they are usually within a 10% margin of the actual sales.
Also - note that they got Black Ops first day numbers correct. Even before Activision reported them.
I don't think they're planning to be a legitimate "player" in the industry. It seems to me that they are just trying to report sales numbers via estimates. Its better than sites with attention whore reviewers who give shitty scores to great games (Destructoid) and sites who review every game a 10/10.
Oh and, VGchartz has a much better community than N4G. Fact. No butthurt fanboys or major trolls there.
mandf  +   1346d ago
Milf sex you think they have a better community go there. Do not stick up for made up speculation. Your name is not appropriate for someone that says they have a reputable website. It leads me to believe you are still a child. Don't come to this website and spew your crap articles then ridicule it's community. VG chartz are not reliable. FACT. It may have been a well written article but it fails once you a apply it. Even it you had the staff to do this. These businesses are not paying there employees on the clock to report there numbers to you and pay for it. You can recite how npd reports there numbers but you don,t have access to that information. The leading fact against your website is you don't work with any retailers and they are not beholden to you.
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Biggest  +   1346d ago
Estimates aren't made up? And here I thought they were fact.
Pennywise  +   1346d ago
They are not accurate numbers. They are GUestimates. Give me a damn break about your woes me BS.

10% of 1 million is 100,000. You don't see the as a problem of a represented install base of 30mil?

Just because Michael Patcher is right half the time doesn't make him reliable in any way. VGCHartz is the same.

The stubborn fanboy running the site doesn't even fix his 3million off PS3 numbers when SONY TELLS US HOW MANY CONSOLES THEY HAVE SOLD. I see a problem with this AND anyone who doesn't see a problem with this. Piss off.
mac_sparrow  +   1346d ago
"They don't make up numbers...they estimate 'em. "

Made
My
Mother
Funking
Day

Oh, but apart from that I despair at the bastardisation of the English language.
jahcure  +   1346d ago
@ pennywise
I agree totally. The article is well written..not taking that away..but in there they say that they correct wrongs..

why then, have they not corrected the ps3 sales numbers as reported by sony themselves..very good catch
Brutallyhonest  +   1346d ago
I think it's safe to say milf_sex
is one of bmw69's (VGChartz) many multiple accounts.
Yet here you are saying N4G and it's members are lame? Without N4G nobody would know your lame site exist.
darkride66  +   1346d ago
Pennywise is spot on.
We know they are estimates, but they're bad estimates. Calling retailers to do a "survey" isn't scientific in any way, shape or form. So how does it work when they guess at Japan, or Europe? Do they call 200 stores across Germany and try to get accurate numbers? Do they have a lot of Japanese speaking people working for to get a sample size of Japanese retailers? And how many of those 200 stores they contacted give them accurate figures and not just ball parked figures?

This article doesn't make me feel better about VGChartz guesstimates, it actually just confirms what I decided years ago, that VGChartz figures are loose guesses, based on god knows what that usually aren't even in the ballpark of the actual data. If they get their figures within 15-20% of the real data, that's a good day for VGChartz.

Microsoft recently issued two statements clearly bashing VGChartz. It's not surprising that they're in damage control mode. "Bu-bu-but they're just estimates!"

Yeah, and they're bad estimates. That's why no one takes your site seriously. Time to wise up, put that university degree to work and get a real job instead of thinking you can make a living making up sales figures for website hits. Just because I couple of news sources quoted your comments doesn't suddenly make you legitimate.
#2.2.7 (Edited 1346d ago ) | Agree(11) | Disagree(1) | Report
Zeevious  +   1345d ago
You guess long enough...you'll get something right
by sheer coincidence.

VGChartZ has a long, and well-known history as the fake flake "estimate" site where the numbers are pulled out of some guys a**.

Following Pachter would be more accurate!

If they aren't a "legitimate player" -- By your own words..why in the HELL are their numbers still reported here, as nothing but an excuse to grab hits?

That site needs to be BANNED because it is nothing but a blight on the industry being used to manipulate and incite fanbrats to bite at each others throats....while the guy running it, and his supports laugh with the ad-money you rake in all the way to the bank.

...but if your looking for a "butthurt" fanboy, I'd look for the guy pulling these numbers from an abacus out of his a*s.

So yeah...not 100% accurate, but after faking the numbers, and stealth-editing them when no ones looking, then claiming nothing happened...they're within 10% of the real numbers...real companies know aren't faked.

I see now...every reason to NOT support this trash. Thanks for making my point.
.

Everyone above gets a +1 from me...

VGChartZ needs to be BANNED!
#2.2.8 (Edited 1345d ago ) | Agree(7) | Disagree(2) | Report
visualb  +   1345d ago
"Oh and, VGchartz has a much better community than N4G. Fact. No butthurt fanboys or major trolls there."

so...you are what?

=P and if thats so...
what the hell are you doing here?

wow...this "article" is hilarious =P milf_sex and bmw69, you two have made me laugh =D

what ever, in the end, VGCharts isn't taken seriously by anyone except its tiny community =| stop trying to justify failure
#2.2.9 (Edited 1345d ago ) | Agree(7) | Disagree(1) | Report
NYC_Gamer  +   1346d ago
pulling a lot of numbers out the air
The Wood  +   1346d ago
err no
out of the place where the sun don't shine my friend
ethomaz  +   1346d ago
Guys please read the article... explains some things.
milf_sex   1346d ago | Personal attack | show | Replies(5)
cmrbe   1346d ago | Immature | show
jahcure  +   1346d ago
While the article was VERY WELL WRITTEN..
quit spreading propaganda BMW and Milf_sex. You BOTH originate from vgchartz and BMW is an editor there...

On topic...the article is well written and worth a read. It does raise a good point about coorperations *coughmscoughgreenburg* flipflopping when they want information in their favour. Greenburg snuffed VGchartz's ESTIMATE...again ESTIMATE..for a mere 75k units...

I think he needs to make the difference seem as significant as possible for the grossly underwhelming Kinect sales.

As long as VGchartz are taken for what they are worth (ESTIMATES) i have no issues with their numbers. There's no such thing as a "fake estimate"
#7 (Edited 1346d ago ) | Agree(13) | Disagree(3) | Report | Reply
WaggleLOL  +   1346d ago
No vgchartz fake sales numbers aren't 'estimates'.

Estimates are something someone does in good faith trying to arrive at a yet unknown result.

Vghchartz is nothing more than deliberate lies.
jahcure  +   1346d ago
So if VGchartz..
calls their own numbers "Estimates" should we all take your word for it that it isn't an estimate?

How about explaining Patcher's 'PREDICTIONS' those are done in good faith...or are they? It usually depends on who is on the good side of his prediction.

Just like there cant be a FAKE ESTIMATE...likewise there cannot be a FAKE PREDICTION

Both are based on assumtions which may or may not materialize.

"Estimation is the calculated approximation of a result which is usable even if input data may be incomplete or uncertain."

"A prediction or forecast is a statement about the way things will happen in the future, often but not always based on experience or knowledge. While there is much overlap between prediction and forecast, a prediction may be a statement that some outcome is expected, while a forecast may cover a range of possible outcomes.

Although guaranteed information about the information is in many cases impossible, prediction is necessary to allow plans to be made about possible developments"

You speak english well...now learn what the words actually mean.
WaggleLOL  +   1346d ago
It's Pachter, not Patcher.

Lie
http://www.google.com/dicti...

Estimate
http://www.google.com/dicti...

That wasn't so hard to understand, now was it?
gamingdroid  +   1345d ago
I don't know, the site just told you how they arrive at their numbers. Which clearly fits in this category:

"An approximate calculation or judgment of the value, number, quantity, or extent of something"

From your google dictionary.

Besides VGChartz seem to be never off more than 20% of the actual value. If you are making things up you are likely to get it a lot more wrong than right. VGChartz seems to be the opposite to me, but I haven't scrutinized their numbers.

Either way, as jahcure briefly touches on, why do people pay gazillion amount of money to analyst that often gets it wrong?

There-in lies your answer, estimation is not 100% accurate and is never intended to be.
BeardedGamerShow  +   1346d ago
@jahcure - Nail on head, right there.
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milf_sex  +   1346d ago
I'm just a member at VGC...the forums there are the best.

@ This dude

Mr Bun + 1m ago
What are you, the "didn't read the article" nazi?

What are you, just another idiot who comments on an article without reading it even though it might make you think twice about what you were about to comment ?
Biggest  +   1346d ago
So could you like. . . Go back to them and GTFO of here? That would be awesome.
Simco876  +   1346d ago
"Every piece of data we report is an estimate."
joeorc  +   1346d ago
An yet they still claim they can track world wide! sales data
ioi

ioi
1 hour ago

@kowenicki - this isn't aimed just at Greenberg, it is a general piece aimed at the hundreds of instances over the last 3 years where people have tried to find reason to discredit the work we do and something I have been planning on writing for a while now. I wanted a specific example where we could reveal how the figures are calculated without giving too much away and this Kinect "situation" happened to fit. I certainly don't see it as a cheap shot or retaliation in any way.

this is by the very same site owner:

who now wrote this as part of their methods:

So what was the science behind Kinect estimates? Where does the 475,000 figure come from? We arrived at the figure via four distinct routes:

* A telephone survey of retailers across America. We called over 200 retailers (distributed across the country and across different chains in a proportion representitive of marketshare) and asked how many Kinect units they had in and how many they had sold. Now 200 retailers from 30,000 isn't a lot, but one GameStop will sell similar amounts to another - each new store you call follows the law of diminishing returns in terms of accuracy improvement. Then, on a retailer by retailer basis, we take an average per store and multiply by the number of stores. Then scale this with any missing retailers to match the overall
marketshare. This gives one estimate of Kinect sell-through.

* A pre-order analysis using a typical pre-order to week-one ratio for a casual Xbox360 title to arrive at a second estimate. An explanation of where our pre-order data comes from can form it's own editorial but a combination of retail pre-order info from best-seller lists at various stores and user pre-order data (purchase intent) via trawls of major sites like GameSpot, IGN, Eurogamer etc are the two main contributors.

* Contact a small retail panel who provide regular data for VGChartz and weigh and scale that data to provide a third estimate. We have a lot of experience with this data so while it isn't particularly representitive we have a lookup table of scaling factors and adjustment for different types of game / hardware.
* A gamercard analysis of more than 5 million gamercards to calculate the proportion of players playing Kinect games (specifically Kinect Adventures) and from the raw figures we can scale up to produce a fourth estimate of sales via an analysis of gamercard to sales ratios for different types of game.

an yet you have Brett claim World Wide tracking DATA!

something is not even honest about that claim because there is no way they can do it no one tracking service can.

they can claim it's an ESTIMATE of World wide but that is a far cry from doing the real tracking yourself.

they are a Guide line no where near being accurate for World wide

why claim world wide if you cannot do it!
Halo_Reach  +   1346d ago
If u dont like VGC dont read it
Thats simples , they guys do this for the community , if they like what they do let them alone... Getting ajob u like its the best thing in the world.
Biggest  +   1346d ago
Don't you get it? They submitted an article and NO ONE IS READING IT! We don't want to read it. They are begging us to read it and sadding because we aren't. I would prefer to leave them alone. But they keep popping up begging for attention.
Masterchef2007  +   1346d ago
I still dont trust there numbers for anything

PS I read the article. Telephone surveys
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joeorc  +   1346d ago
@Halo_Reach

as a matter of fact , it's not that i do not like the site, that's not the point, the point is the site is claiming something they know they could not do, that's what i have a problem with they are not being honest about it.

Why claim "WORLD WIDE" number's when they do not have the capability to Track world Wide Data.

it's dishonest and that's the truth of the matter!

the site can claim this Tag line all they want"

"The most comprehensive videogame charts and industry analysis in the world"

that does not make it True
#12 (Edited 1346d ago ) | Agree(10) | Disagree(1) | Report | Reply
TheoreticalParticle  +   1346d ago
That's the entire fucking problem I have with the site. Them and their site spambots go around to places like N4G and broadcast this stuff like it's news. They send out press releases with their fake numbers, and NOWHERE IN THEM is the word "Estimate".

Did you see, "Day 1 Worldwide Sales ESTIMATES For Call of Duty: Black Ops is 7 million Units"? No, it was "Day 1 Worldwide Sales". That's not up-front. That's not honest. You're hoping to trick some news organization into giving your bullshit hits. Start being upfront about the fact that you have no more fucking clue about how is being sold than I do, and maybe I'll stop giving you shit every time you try and invent a story.
Baka-akaB  +   1346d ago
Blame them ? for what ?

I dont trust them that's all . Even without accounting the constant 360/ps3 sales feud , they can't even bother to update sales for old titles .

Go and try tracking sales for an old ps1 or ps2 game , often you'll find nothing useful , at least even less useful than wikipedia .
Zinc  +   1346d ago
They just told everybody how they come up with their figures. If they are telling us all the truth, there should be no more problem. Either use them as a means to understand what is going on in the industry, sales-wise, or not. The end.

They are a free service that does the best they can. While I don't inherently trust anybody or thing, I have no reason to think they are not doing what they claim.

If you want actual final numbers, wait until they come in and are confirmed by multiple sources, otherwise, enjoy the estimates that services like VGChartz gives us... or don't enjoy them.

Much of this vitriol comes from fanboism and the need to one-up the competition (which doesn't even exist, because you as an individual have nothing to do with company A, B or C)

Screw that noise.

Take estimates, forecasts, predictions, and projections for what they are worth and give your cardiovascular system a break, you'll live longer.

Also, I don't give a shit about numbers, I give a shit about experiencing great games.
TheoreticalParticle  +   1346d ago
While I agree with some of what you wrote, I cannot agree with the "let the slide" bit, until VGBullshitChartz and their spambots post the word "ESTIMATE" in every single news item they post. Just because they tell the internet that they're making up their numbers doesn't mean that people who just blindly pull headlines from news feeds won't just run the story thinking they have actual numbers.

You can't play the "Everyone knows we're not supposed to be taken seriously" card if you're actively trying to make everyone believe that they're supposed to take you seriously.
#14.1 (Edited 1346d ago ) | Agree(9) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
Zinc  +   1346d ago
Fair enough.
phntom  +   1346d ago
Estimates are never solid, hence can not be taken seriously.

And that's it for today.
bananlol  +   1346d ago
I dont blame vgchartz, only people who try to pass their numbers off as fact. At best its a guess regarding console sales in a single region, at worst its some sad peoples pathetic attempt at manipulating the console market.
TheoreticalParticle  +   1346d ago
I blame VGChartz for not labeling their charts as estimates and instead just calling them "Sales Figures". If they were accurately labeled before they got disseminated, then, I'd place the blame on the puppets for taking them as fact.
saumer  +   1346d ago
Kinect sold 12 million units!!!!!!
Move Sold 11 million units!!!!
WII 2 was released and sold 45 million units!!!!

I should start my own site. My numbers are fucking awesome and WAY higher than VGcharts.
TheoreticalParticle  +   1346d ago
My methodology involves rolling 200 d 10s, and then averaging them out to find out the numbers for a given title.
alphakennybody  +   1346d ago
VGCHARTZ
made by fanboys for fanboys, serioulsy these sale wars are ridiculous.
#18 (Edited 1346d ago ) | Agree(6) | Disagree(1) | Report | Reply
joeorc  +   1346d ago
claim world wide !
when you post a statment like this Brett, make sure you remember what you write"

ioi
"Sell in - the number of units sold by a company to retail = what companies report.

Sell through - the number of units sold by retail to consumers = what VGChartz reports.

It really isn't that difficult.

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz...

if that's true than how do you explain this ioi:

http://www.microsoft.com/in...

gee what do we have here LTD # and their of course Shipped Number's. but yet there you are using shipped+sold through number!, but only for Microsoft right, why not Sony's an Nintendo 3rd Quarter's shipped number's added to their sold through huh?

an with Sony:

"We calculate our install base by 'sell through' and have done for the last four years I believe", we asked for a little additional clarification...

"We classify 'sell through' as the number of units consumers have actually purchased from retail. 'Sell in' is the number of units we've sold to retail."

http://www.scei.co.jp/corpo...

If so than that puts the PS3 to within less than 400,000

since ioi you yourself said

"Sell through - the number of units sold by retail to consumers = what VGChartz reports."

It really isn't that difficult.

both Sony and Microsoft did give their exact Sell through Number's..

41.8 for Microsoft

41.6 for Sony

but of course ioi ignored that!
#19 (Edited 1346d ago ) | Agree(8) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
joeorc  +   1346d ago
claim world wide !
when you post a statment like this Brett, make sure you remember what you write"

ioi
"Sell in - the number of units sold by a company to retail = what companies report.

Sell through - the number of units sold by retail to consumers = what VGChartz reports.

It really isn't that difficult.

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz...

well if that's also true why are you claiming World Wide tracking?

Sale through world Wide tracking data..i would like to see that..lol
#20 (Edited 1346d ago ) | Agree(6) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
Orochi   1346d ago | Spam
DarkFantasy  +   1346d ago
don't blame Vgcharts...BLAME CANADA!! :)lmao

Related video
Orochi   1345d ago | Spam
Trroy  +   1345d ago
VGChartz has VERY consistent bias in their data -- specifically they overtrack the Wii and 360, and undertrack the PS3. This applies to both HW and SW.

I don't think this is necessarily due to fanboy bias or something dumb like that. I think this is due to their source info being slanted toward American numbers, where the Wii and 360 are more popular. They don't like to guess, despite the consistent over/undertracking they always see (and adjust for, eventually), so their numbers are consistently off.

Really their numbers are often fairly close, over time. They're not off by a ton... just enough to upset the fanboys during this competitive point in the "console war", as it were.
#23 (Edited 1345d ago ) | Agree(2) | Disagree(2) | Report | Reply
AllyOmega  +   1345d ago
Come on guys...
VGChartz is just trying to defend themselves and gave a real argument and explanation about how they get these numbers. If you're going to comment, comment something constructive. I have no problem with negative comments as long as they try to prove a point, but if it's just "VGCHARTZ ARE FANBOISS THAT IS TEH SUCKKS LOL!!!!" that benefits noone and makes you look foolish. At least give an argument or a point as to why they're fanboys. I love a good internet argument, but when it gets to the point to where I have to sift through 60+ comments to find one or two intelligent comments, it's ridiculous.

EDIT: Hah, I got a disagree for telling people to post intelligently... I love you guys. The world wouldn't be the same without ya.
#24 (Edited 1345d ago ) | Agree(2) | Disagree(7) | Report | Reply
Chaos Striker  +   1345d ago
vgchartz are fanboiss that is teh suckks lol!!! (just kidding)

Honestly AllyOmega, I wouldn't bother. You're comment is just going to get ripped to shreds because people don't have the IQ or business intelligence to understand the methodology being presented by Vgchartz. I've tried to explain it in the past, but people refuse to listen.
AllyOmega  +   1345d ago
Hah,
You forgot to put it in all caps... The true sign of a troll. lol.
Chromer  +   1345d ago
Post something constructive.
Okay I will. Tell VGChartz to stop pretending that their site is the end all, be all for hardware and software sales and everything will be fine. If VGC somehow had actual access to the information then no one would have a problem. It's the problem of them taking ESTIMATES and making them sound as if it is truth. Apparently, all of the VGC fans from the site rushing to defend their kingdom can't understand that.
Seferoth75  +   1345d ago
Take away VGcahrtz, and Sony is in last place. Notice how it is mainly PS3 fanboys here crying. Why? They'd like to use fake sales numbers to show Move is a success and some how PS3 over took 360 while 360 sold more world wide.

FOr a group who claims sales mean nothing, you sure get your panties in a bunch over them.. Oh but that was a load of BS from the start. when you guys thought PS3 over took 360 you all suddenly cared about sales. Pathetic

Just another example of why Sony fanboys are pathetic and most of the gaming community looks down on them. I guess that is what happens when they only people to buy your console are the bottom feeders of the world and 12 year old brats.
AllyOmega  +   1345d ago
All fanboys are pathetic.
Dont pretend Sony fanboys are the only ones that are stupid. That's just unfair.
blackburn5  +   1345d ago
@Seferoth75. I also noticed that 360 people nearly wet their pants when they found out the PS3 might of passed the 360. It is so pathetic that people like you try so hard to keep the PS3 in 'third place' Your systems are ahead and you still seem to fear that PS3 might catch up. It's only this generation where people wish for your systems and games to fail miserably. VGC is crap and we all agree. The fact that you are scrambling to protect them despite their inaccuracy is pointless. No one asked you to defend them.BTW people who boast that one fanboy is better then another is as pathetic as the fanboys themselves. All fanboys are bad. I for one don't support an ignorant fanboys no matter which system he roots for. I have seen ignorance and stupidity coming from all sides.
#26 (Edited 1345d ago ) | Agree(6) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
sashimi  +   1345d ago
I find this really funny...because VGChartz just comes off as cry babies trying to defend their fanboy ways when multibillion dollar companies discredit them. Trying to fool people into thinking they actually know anything or even a hint of what goes on into tracking sales of anything internationally. Only the stupid and the hardcore fanboys will believe the crap this site spews out daily.
simcloutier  +   1345d ago
GO VGCHARTZ!
The best video game website on the net!
Rocket Sauce  +   1345d ago
Why it iz zo eazy to blame VGChartz
It's probably because they replace S's with Z's.
#29 (Edited 1345d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
bviperz  +   1345d ago
Funny, couple of years ago it was the gospel. Now it's all estimates.
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