Mark Rein on UE3 and PS3 "Problems", UT3 Locked at 30fps, demo was possibly at 60fps

Mark Rein has responded to the recent rumors about UE3 on PS3 problems and UT3 running 60fps at GC in a forum post in which he states that, "Epic heard that same kind of silliness about UE3 on Xbox 360 before we shipped Gears of War and we all know how that turned out."

He continues to say that :

"The only way to silence the uninformed critics is to ship the games and let them play them for themselves. We're continually optimizing our engine on all supported platforms and we will continue to do so for several years into this generation. What we ship on PC and PS3 this fall will be considerably better than the builds we're showing here at Games Convention in every aspect."

[xhi4]

can't wait for this! PS3 Modding/Skinning/Mapping heavenn

[Blackfrican]

I think in unreal, you may move around a tad quicker then in gears. In a faster paced game, a higher frame-rate is required to make it look smooth.

[Lightning Mr Bubbles]

fanboys will pick up on this, like it's a bad thing that it's 30FPS. When the developer is saying otherwise. Gears of War is 30FPS. No one said anything about gears of war shuttering and slowdown. They just said it was the greatest game known to man. So Why is Madden such a problem at 30FPS?

I'm confused myself, maybe we're just stupid fanboys who don't undertsand sh*t. But in fanboy land this is our definition of frame rates ever since Madden populized it.

30 FPS = sh*t
60 FPS = godly

We need to get educated before this becomes an ugly trend. It would be sad if we don't know what the hell we're talking about and as soon as we hear 30 FPS we assume a game is crap.

Seriously, if Gears of War came out today, it would be crap because it runs at 30 FPS. That's enough to open my eyes on how blind this frame rates situation is getting. For all I know Madden 08 on PS3 was a choppy freezy mess for other reasons not the frame rates.

[bababrooks]

i was of the understanding that all ps3 games would run at 60fps with 1080p...........ken even said,

"Appearing at the Tokyo International Digital Conference on Thursday to talk about the technological capabilities of the PlayStation 3 and the Cell processor, Sony Computer Entertainment president Ken Kutaragi said he expects the PS3 to be capable of running games at a stunning 120fps, according to a report in The Nikkei BP."

do you think it will run 120fps?

bathyj.
when buying a ps3 i thought you got a system that ran its games at 60 fps plus 1080p due to comments made by sony eg the hd era starts with the ps3 which runs games at 1080p plus the comment about 120 fps.that was my understanding.

[Bathyj]

So where exactly does he say that all ps3 games would run at 60fps with 1080p?

It doesnt.

[Mucudadada]

Movies run at 24 frames per second so all of them must be awful...

[Sayai jin]

Yup, I personally think a game can look amazing running at 30FPS (Gears of War) and do not have a problem with it. I think the reason people are making a big deal about it is that Sony has been touting about the PS3's Power along with the fanboys saying they have the superior console and things like that.

[SlippyMadFrog]

The big issue is that Madden on Xbox360 has twice the amount of FPS than the PS3 version. 30fps for a game is fine but when the xbox360 can show the same graphics twice as fast, thats when people start making a big deal of it.

[WilliamRLBaker]

@bathy not in that article but others, Back then sony was all about how ps3 would be capable of 1080p all the time. back when 2 hdmi ports we're still on the system. and 120fps was promised pretty much on every thing.

[PS360PCROCKS]

I'm sorry but I have to completely disagree the difference between 30 FPS and 60 FPS is HUGE in games like Madden. FPS usually doesn't matter unless it's a fast action game. I.E. racing, sports etc. So while 60 is always the nicest form of FPS and 30 is usually just fine, 60 FPS is paramount in fast moving titles.

[Bathyj]

William and bababrooks.

I'm sorry but you're wrong. I hate to go on about this but people keep repeating it because they've heard it, and its not true.

Ken said PS3 was "capable" of running games at 120 fps even though TV's cant display them anyway. For all we know they can, but it wouldn't be a very graphically intense game would it.

http://au.gamespot.com/news...

Sony have NEVER said ALL games would be 120 fps. Nor have they EVER said ALL games would be 1080p. Thats up to the developer to decide. Its a balancing act between resolution, framerate and detail so Sony cant specify on individual games accept I'd guess 30 fps @ 720p would be the minimum accepted for qualities sake.

Now you know maybe you can help to correct the misconception. ;)
Cheers

PS, Glad you changed your avatar William, you look less angry.

[EZCheez]

Excellent post. You really put this framerate issue into a context that I think everyone can understand AND identify with.

[ErcsYou]

great comment .. the only time framerate should matter is when your game slows down to 10fps(ps3 fear) besides that..who cares as long as it plays good....

as for all the comments of what Ken( x sony employee) said in 2005..who cares..your tv probably couldnt even 120fps per second..i think(mathwise) modern tvs could only handle about 90fps...tvs cant refresh that fast...and if it could it might cause you to have seizures

how about this..blast factor...full NATIVE 1080p(not upconverted)..
or how about this...ps3eye,,120fps at 480i

[gunnar2906]

I like the point of many ppl ... you have been playing GoW for almost 1 year and all was great. After you were informed that it is only 30 fps it became "slideshow".
30/60 fps difference is only the matter of your imagination. Or schizofrenia.
NTSC TV sets support only 30 frames per sec and PAL ones - 24. All frames above this ration just "dropped". 30 fps is the most you are able to see on TV screen.
The reasonable question is - why they do 60 fps. The answer is pretty simple - when you use LCD monitor instead of TV set. LCD monitors has up to 60-70 Hz refreshment rate, that means they are able to display twice more frames then a TV set.

[ASSASSYN 36o]

I wonder what the 3-60 version frames per second will be...hmmmmmm. I wonder.

[Lightning Mr Bubbles]

did you read the guys posts?

[Mucudadada]

Most likely, 30 frames per second to answer the question. And if you read the article you know that that would be the same frame rate as the PS3 and PC one will run...

I envy your fanboyism, sir. It makes you very cool and educated.

[thetruthinator]

I don't think that anyone here can claim themselves to be experts on the subject. And its pretty unlikely that members of the Epic Development team are the ones making these comments.

So why are people guessing the Frames per second on such an involved and technical issue?

well just have to wait and see how the versions turn out.... but if i were a betting man i would say they are either the same framerate, or the 360 is slightly higher.

[Phantom_Lee]

gee...u guys approve this way to fast...I was going to approve it...now due to my slow reading...I cant do that now...

[Leogetz]

How long until it's "LOL PS3 SUXXORZ, 360 WILL HAVE 60FPS" before they read it. It shouldn't take too long

[SuperSaiyan4]

I read just today on N4G in an Interview with Mark Rein saying the game will be 60fps on the PS3 *scratches head* wtf?

[Ghoul]

stop beeing fortune tellers.

Rhein said it probably would be locked at 30 fps (wich is very likely) but until you got proof of it. STOP those flamewar news.

[nobizlikesnowbiz]

Pretty please with sugar on top.

[QuackPot]

developer says:

* 60 FPS is achievable

* if that were their goal

* but their goal is 30 FPS

* to achieve higher levels of gameplay & visuals

* which they also set as a goal for Gears of War

* which turned out spectacular.

-----------------------------

Epic knows their sh1t so everyone whorshipping 60 FPS can STFU as it all depends on the developer, their objective and their experience.

More time to create graphics > less time to create graphics

For the time being though until they get to grips with the hardware they're working on.

<NB>

Xbox 360 version of UT3 likely to be 60 FPS as Epic knows this system alot better than the Ps3.

Could this be another Madden situation? A developer not knowing a piece of h/w enough to do 60 FPS so settles for 30 FPS........OR......they could be just lazy ba$$tard$.

Not Epic but EA.

[Lightning Mr Bubbles]

Madden 08 on PS3 was just a sloppy rushed port from XBOX 360. If Gears of War runs at 30 Frames per second, I find it hard to believe that Madden 08 on PS3 at times visibly freezes for a whole second because it's running at 30 frames per second.

[PS360PCROCKS]

recap what I said above..."I'm sorry but I have to completely disagree the difference between 30 FPS and 60 FPS is HUGE in games like Madden. FPS usually doesn't matter unless it's a fast action game. I.E. racing, sports etc. So while 60 is always the nicest form of FPS and 30 is usually just fine, 60 FPS is paramount in fast moving titles."

basically 30 is manageable but 60 is pretty necessary for games like Madden so it looks more real.

[Mucudadada]

But Mark Rein is a great guy. I mean he answers all the questions unlike most devs who dodge them. For instance I recieved a personal e-mail back from him after I sent an e-mail to him a few weeks ago. I'm getting this game for 2 reasons. A) Looks hella awesome B) To give Mark Rein monies...

[deadeyes99]

PS3 AT 30 FPS, WHY DON'T I JUST DRAW MY SELF A GAME THATD BE SMOOTHER FRAMERATE WISE.

[NINJARIFIK]

please stop breathing my air.

[sonarus]

madden 09 will run at 60 fps its that simple. Ps3 architecture is difficult to understand but the games are getting better.

My question though is the demo ran at 60fps what about the final game?

[waldopepper]

Please tell me if I'm going mad but where does it say anything in the article (except the misleading headline) about PS3 and 360 framerates being potentially any different. He's talking about all versions being 30fps to not limit the action isn't he?

[pshizle]

UT = FIRST PERSON SHOOTER

GEARS = THIRD PERSON SHOOTER

omg playing counter strike at 30 fps is awful

im surprised that gears run on 30fps!

[Bullseye]

One reason why people may make sure a big deal out of the 30fps/60fps debate is because it represents not only noticeably smoother gameplay, but it also, like it or not, represents to some degree the relative 'graphics' power of the system.We all know that, so when a game on the 360 is released at 60fps , but the PS3 version is locked at 30fps, it gives the impression that the 360 is graphically superior to the Ps3.Now, you can't continually keep saying its because the dev's don't know how to use the system properly, can you? let's face it, setting 30 or 60 fps isn't something that needs intimate knowledge of a platform to achieve. It's either capable, in graphics power terms, or it isn't. Obviously there are trade offs, but pound for pound if one system does it an another doesn't with the same game, what are we to conclude? Remember, i'm commenting on relative graphics power and do appreciate some platforms may have more oomph in other departments.

[sheng long]

You guys also have to take into account what type of tv set you're using. Surely flat panel LCDs have come a long way, but they're still not desirable for fast moving images such as sports, videogames, etc.
let's suppose you have madden 08(360) running 60fps on an lcd, and next to it you have the same game running 30fps on a picture tube. which would you take? You really think that lcd is going to look better than the picture tube, or even plasma for that matter?

[xionpunk]

Does anyone really look at a game, and without anyone telling them, know its running at 30 fps? Look at metal gear solid 2 compared to MGS3. 30fps MGS3 looks much better (especially character models)than the 60fps MGS2. I dont remember having any stuttering while playing. If the developers do their job right (hint hint EA) then it shouldn't make an obvious difference.
-edit-
bullseye makes a great point above,but i think certain companies add problems (rushing sh*t) on top of the 30fps that makes the real difference.

[esemce]

UT running at 30fps is piss poor if you know anything about gaming then you will understand that the difference is HUGE, in the options menu for the 360 version of Bioshock turn off the frame limiter and you will see a vast improvement.
Imagine cross platform gaming online with PS3 vs PC (if that ever happens) most of the PS3 users would not stand a chance, if they are limiting the fps because of 1080p then I would have preffered 720p and 60fps.

[xionpunk]

I agree that cross platform is probably a bad idea, but ps3 vs ps3 noones going to notice the frame rate. Redfaction ran at 30fps and was an awesome game.

[Figboy]

so you're saying i'm *NOT the most smartest and handsomest guy in the world?

mama *LIED to me?

that *B*TCH!

[7ero H3LL]

is capable of running at 60 fps. But UT3 is locked at 30 fps. the 360 version mite just be locked at 30 fps as well. However Madden 08 on ps3 runs different than it's 360 counter part.

And the 360's version is months away from the ps3's version. at this point ANYTHING can be a possibility.

If the pc version dose not get this same problem (being locked at 30 fps ) than the 360 version mite have some luck.

[INehalemEXI]

What im getting from his interview is that a game may be 60 fps , Then you play it and at times it slows down below 30 fps and your like experiencing lag.

30 fps locked sounds like its gona run 30 fps at all times like Gears of war.

Someone trying to spin this article into a negative story for ps3 but if you read it you see theres nothing negative about the ps3 version.

[XxZxX]

Silly Rabbit, 60fps are for kids

[deadeyes99]

SO NOT FUNNY

[XxZxX]

yeah and I'm not here to entertainment you either.

[khellendros1]

Any one who says that 60 fps is paramount for football games does realize that all football games before 08 ran at 30 fps, right?

[7ero H3LL]

GOT 60 fps?

[s8anicslayer]

this just gives people something to talk about

[7ero H3LL]

Got Jade Raymond?

[gunnar2906]

fps affects on computer monitors and TVsets differently
If you have at least 60 Hz LCD monitor you are able to feel the difference between 30 and 60 fps
On TV it works quite different
PAL color system has only 25 fps and NTSC - 30.
That means that your eyes cannot notice any difference on TV at framee rates higher then 30 fps
As it was in Madden - the diff is noticable only at slow-mo

[rowdy 1]

decide whether or not to run agame a 60/30 frames per second, it is clearly their choice, in some cases it depends on how well they know the tech, in other cases it depends on how the game will run as a whole. The 360 has games that run at 30 & 60 as well as the PS3. 30 frames is not bad if the gameplay is there. I enjoy NCAA on the PS3, Jim owns 360 and does't notice the difference when he plays the PS3. This frame per sec talk is ree dam diculous. Get over it Jump in and Play Beyond.

[DuceWilly947]

yet when you play madden n ps3 it runs the same and we saw the vid, games like timesplitters run at 60fps, but gears runs at 30, doesn matter

[7ero H3LL]

it runs at 30 if you run it at 1080p (though most people play games these days at 1080p). and gears of war dose run at 1080p. THE GAME RUNS AT 30 fps at 1080p.

[7ero H3LL]

this image is no fake. I repeat everyone that on the screen was my refresh rate NOT frame rate. I know that be cause ITS RIGHT THERE.

thank you and it is ok for anyone to point that out but i know that already. : )

[gunnar2906]

Dear FabNMun
I'm absolutely sure that it is not fake.
But I guess you need some more knowlegde about fps and mrr
The number you showed at the pictures is your monitor refreshment rate. It is hardware. In other words all LCD monitors have this refreshment rate between 50-70 frames per second.
Unlike this fps is not linked with your monitor somehow - it is software one. FPS is the ability of a graphical program to render the sequence of frames per second.
That is all about I wrote above.
Modern color systems have 2 different types of a screen refresh rate - it is PAL with 24 frames per second and NTSC with 30 frames. All higher frame rates can be used at TV sets, but only 24/30 frames will be displayed. That means that 30/60 fps difference is not noticable at a TV set. 30/60 fps difference an be noticed only in your case - when one uses a LCD monitor instead of TV set. And this case is the only reason for devs to make 60 fps in games.

[UltimateTroll]

PS3 gets this like 6 months before the 360, so you Xbots can cry all you want untill then you wont see this game until like april next year lol.

[360_Rules]

Hahahahhahahaha the PS3 can only handle 30fps. Payback for all you Sony fanboys laughing at Gears for only being 30fps.

[ALIEN]

GOW running at 30 FPS on the 360, looked amazing, imagen UT3 running at 60 FPS on the PS3, It should look WOOOOO! Can't wait!

[Shaka2K6]

GOW was at 30FPS on the 360.
x360 to weak to handle more then 30fps what a piece of trash.

[Fux4Bux]

Gears was definitely not locked at 30fps people. That game dips into the teens regularly. Solid 30fps is perfectly fine and has been a standard for years. 60fps locked is just icing on the cake. And 30fps locked doesn't even mean it's not running much higher most of the time, just that it will never go below that at any point.

Christ you fanboys are pathetic I hate you all.... especially 360 fanboys.

[supnub5]

what's so bad with 30 fps, human eye can only see 24, the only reason why 60 fps is made is that if framerate drops, it would never drop to 24, but if they lock it good then 30 fps will be pretty good.

[daveman3]

the human eye can actually see see more than 60fps easily

[sheng long]

gears dropps FPS when you and your teamates are teabagging someone and you stick 'em with a smoke grenade. LOL, fun times but frame rate drops.

[mellowspaz]

With respect to both PS3 and 360 owners I think we can agree that Mark Rein is speaking out of his a$$. He's lost all credibility in my book, and has started to annoy me as much as EA. I am sick and tired that anything he says will get posted as news, he seems to be causing flame wars between the ps3 and 360 just to promote his products ... remember the days when he said "Gears of War cannot be accomplished on PS3." Now he's saying "PS3 version of UT3 is going to run better than GOW." The man is a hypocrite, the moment Epic receives money, he starts siding with that respective console. GOW's exclusivity had him singing praises for the 360. Now the tables have turned with Epic and Midway receiving a exclusive deal from Sony. Just shut the man up already, he's annoying and Epic needs to hire a real publicist.

[rev20]

Can talk as much crap as he wants aslong as he keeps bringing out these quality games.

I couldnt care less