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Submitted by MaideninBlack 2010d ago | news

Bethesda: Western RPG “More Realistic” Than JRPGs

It’s east versus west again in the showdown between western developed rpgs and their Japanese counterparts. Recently, Bioware co-founder Greg Zeschuk shared his views on why he believe jrps have become stagnant and have lost their appeal. Now Bethesda has tossed their 2 cents into the debate. (Bethesda Softworks, PS3, Xbox 360)

Optical_Matrix  +   2010d ago
No shit?
Cloudberry  +   2010d ago
I kinda thinking about this for awhile...
Bioware co-founder Greg Zeschuk "JRPGs have become stagnant and have lost their appeal" & Betheseda's "WRPGs more realistic than JRPGs".

In my opinion...

How about Bioware and / or Betheseda make a.........
Wait for it...
JRPG of their own?

And make it better than Square-Enix, Mistwalker, Namco-Bandai, ATLUS, etc.
#1.1 (Edited 2010d ago ) | Agree(16) | Disagree(4) | Report | Reply
BeaArthur  +   2010d ago
I've wondered that for years. You would have thought with all the popularity of the JRPG's that a western studio would have tried to make one by now.
Alos88  +   2010d ago
It would be the most realistic stagnant RPG of our time!
MaxOpower  +   2010d ago
Na.. forget it
#1.1.3 (Edited 2010d ago ) | Agree(1) | Disagree(0) | Report
Trroy  +   2010d ago
Japanese retail wouldn't buy a RPG from Western devs, even if it was JRPG-styled.

Old school Japanese business won't support western game development if it competes with something Japanese. And without Japanese retailers, there's no serious market for JRPGs, really.

Its not logic that drives this behavior. Its cultural bias. Take it or leave it as you will.
#1.1.4 (Edited 2010d ago ) | Agree(3) | Disagree(6) | Report
guzman  +   2010d ago
Bioware did do a Jrpg, that Sonic DS rpg. It was the biggest pos joke of a game in awhile.
Simon_Brezhnev  +   2010d ago
so i guess sci-fi space marines or post apocalyptic makes it more realistic.
HelghastKid  +   2010d ago
Haha of course Sci-fi space marine tops 12 year old amnesia boy in the reality scale xD.

Seriously, who cares? both genres are great and my fave out of all genres. Just keep doing what makes the fans happy
sack_boi  +   2010d ago
They're also less gay
HelghastKid  +   2010d ago
The game is only as gay as you think about it.
pixelsword  +   2010d ago
"More realistic"? Which one, Mass Effect, or Dragon Age?
raztad  +   2010d ago
Actually a good question. Perhaps the witcher or Oblivion :D

This Bethesda guy probably is talking about games like Fallout, ie RPG with guns.
TROLL EATER  +   2010d ago
oh final FANTASY didnt give it away?
tinybigman  +   2010d ago
i'd take JRPGs over WRPGs. the only western one i liked this gen is Mass Effect; neither Oblivion, or Fallout 3 was interesting enough for me to continue playing. my favorite RPG this gen in Valkyria Chronicles.
gravemaker  +   2010d ago
Captain obvious
NYC_Gamer  +   2010d ago
wrpgs are way more serious than typical jrpgs..story and gameplay wise
Sprud  +   2010d ago
Is that a good thing or a bad thing?
Lucreto  +   2010d ago
It depends on what games you like. JRPGs has some completely off the wall fantasy and WRPGs keeps to the LotR type realism. If that makes any sence.
SOAD  +   2010d ago
I hope everybody reads what the guy said instead of jumping into the discussion section to post a hateful comment.

"I’ve never been one to draw lines, though I think it’s easier in this case to say, “these are the western and these are the eastern ones.” I think, by and large, if you look at Japanese games, overall their mindset is way more fantastical, even if it’s not an RPG.

Personally for me, sometimes I like that and sometimes I have a hard time wrapping my hands around it. A western game… again I’m generalizing, they’re more realistic.

Even if it’s post-apocalyptic America Fallout, there’s this filter on it: well, this could really be happening. It’s got this somewhat of a suspension of disbelief, even when we do fantasy stuff.

If you compare the sci-fi in Mass Effect to the science fiction in a million Japanese games, it just gets really, really out there. I think the two sensibilities break down more like that."

He even admits he's making a generalization for the sake of being able to answer the question briefly.

The guy who wrote up his share of the article is quick to judge the Bethesda guy with this.

"..Because flaming dogs falling from the sky ( a quest found in Fallout 2) and giant ants that breathe fire by expelling flammable venom from their venom sacks, then igniting it with a spark made by clicking their mandibles( also in Fallout 2) is ultra-realistic, isn’t it?"

Yes, you're so fucking clever. /s

The guy said that overall Western RPGs are more realistic. That is to say they are grounded in realistic times or cultures. Take Oblivion for example. Although it has magical elements and orcs and elves, the realism of the game comes from the Medieval culture, dress, architecture and so on.

Japanese RPGs have much more fantastical elements, but the guy doesn't say anything negative about the genre. He was merely trying to find a distinction between the two, even though there is some overlap in terms of silly shit happening.
ranmafandude  +   2010d ago
are you done talking cause i got to go play more jrpgs lol.
#5.1 (Edited 2010d ago ) | Agree(8) | Disagree(4) | Report | Reply
Baka-akaB  +   2010d ago
except quite a few of those games are grounded in element of medieval japan , korea or china . Sometimes even early 19 century with the likes of kuzonoha raidoh ,and shadow hearts

If that was the main criteria anyway , then persona games and a few megami tensei are even more realisttic , with their urban and modern era setting ...
Ashriel  +   2010d ago
duh, but he said he was generalising, of course there are exceptions
ChickeyCantor  +   2010d ago
I guess that sums up why i'm not into WRPGs.
Still waiting for a new rig so i can play MassEffect 1 and 2.
#6 (Edited 2010d ago ) | Agree(5) | Disagree(5) | Report | Reply
TheColbertinator  +   2010d ago
If you get a decent rig,check out The Witcher too.Excellent RPG
ChickeyCantor  +   2010d ago
uhmm...i like sci-fi more though but ill give it a ago once i have a chance
Enate  +   2010d ago
If you did try something with the Witcher I would probable wait for number two. I loved ME1 and 2 played em both to death. An I to heard the recommendation of the Witcher and videos looked enticing. Though after spending 40 bucks on steam for it I was bored and couldn't play past 5 hours. I'm not saying its a bad game you might like it I'm just saying it wasn't for me.
#6.2 (Edited 2010d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
Lord_Doggington  +   2010d ago
JRPGs are more Japanese then Western RPGs
PS360PCROCKS  +   2010d ago
That's a lie! I have chocobo in my afro!
TheColbertinator  +   2010d ago
Shut up bethesda and make Elder Scrolls 5 already.
Jack-Pyro  +   2010d ago
alphakennybody  +   2010d ago
Have they played Demon's souls? That thing feel more real than fallout3
#10 (Edited 2010d ago ) | Agree(5) | Disagree(1) | Report | Reply
GigaGaia  +   2010d ago
jRPG > Western RPG
ranmafandude  +   2010d ago
it's more like jrpg>wrpg and wrpg<jrpg damn two sided ownage lol.
#11.1 (Edited 2010d ago ) | Agree(5) | Disagree(1) | Report | Reply
Akagi   2010d ago | Offensive
XmnMetal  +   2010d ago
Aside from demon's souls and valkyria chronicles I agree with this statement. I still wonder what western game square enix was looking at when making FFXIII. Theres to much hand holding and the level design is uninspired. I loved Fallout 3 and looking forward to New Vegas.
starmin76  +   2010d ago
Everybody is looking at this qoute the wrong way. It's not flamebait
If you click on the link and read the full quote, you'll see that he's not at all saying that WRPG's are better than JRPGS. He's simply commenting on the way that cultural differences flesh themselves out in the two genres, and how JRPG's tend to go much more far-out and over the top and their levels of fantasy, where as WRPG's, even when they do have fantastical settings and unrealistic situations, still feel grounded in very real, human emotions.

He's not saying one is better or has more artistic value than the other, he's just saying their different. Which is true.
Tex117  +   2010d ago
I think he was merely saying that WRPG's aren't inspired by Anime and that crazy stuff that goes into it.
dizzleK  +   2010d ago
the author simply has an agenda.

i like bioware and bethesda because of the attention to detail they put into their games, the fiction has a sense of plausibility. they create living, breathing worlds filled with situations i can generally identify with. "game" or not, i simply can't take airships or guys with birds in their hair seriously. i need the grounding of reality in my games because it makes them believable and it's easier for me to get absorbed into things if i believe in the universe they portray.
GenoZStriker  +   2010d ago
Because I play games for realism

O Wait? No
Crossifixxo  +   2010d ago
Trend setter!!
JRPGs are awesome with their Epic Bosses and break my heart stories, but what is the actual problem? What more can you do to the formula, to make sure the next generation would want to play it? What are the people actually buying, do you want to make a game becuase it has a group of followers or would you rather make a game that even if is over hyped sells like shit loads? I'm not a very big fan of MW2, I mean I like the game the online is good, but why did people just go crazy over it? IMO everything has it's time, right now the industry is in a Epic this Epic that, blow this blow that trend, it's in a place where people don't want to play a 60 hour game and a lot of dialogue and large cut scenes, the problem is I love RPGs, and I love JRPGs becuase I grew up on them, but I wasn't always into it, there are times in my life where all I want to play is an FPS and not an RPG, and vice-versa on all genres, then came games like Elder Scrolls Morrowin, Oblivion, Fallout 3, Mass Effect, etc, it changed my attitudes, it's not that I do not enjoy JRPGS but If I had a choice between the same game in JRPG or Western RPG, I'd prefer the western solely on the feeling of immersion more than anything, it's that gameplay has me into it than JRPGS, just like I like JRPGs cut scenes more than any other genres. I mean there are tons of people that will buy a FF game but in todays world there are even more who don't, it's because of Western RPGs that the like of me have turned preferances, I still believe that there will be a strong following for JRPGs, and I will always be a part of it(only for the really good games). To conclude todays trend is action oriented that people want to be in control of, and a lot of people just misunderstand JRPGs
ZeroX9876  +   2010d ago
I like my game to be unrealistic a lot! I'm enjoying my Real Life very much, so when I'm gaming, I prefer fantastic storys, not real ones or even worse, based on a true story!

I don't freaking care about a real story that already happened or can happen, show me something that I can't see in my real life!

now, I'm not saying that JRPGs are better than WRPGs, but I like my games to have some unreal not happening until a long time story. That's why games like Mass effect is the kind of game I like from Western Dev. Fallout 3 was awesome too, but I couldn't play 6 games like fallout 3. The story would still be on real Earth with some big disaster. Nah, I want something so obviously not possible that the first thing you say in your mind is : "wouldn't it be awesome to be in this place and be able to do that?!?!?". I can still kill a deer with my 30,06 caliber, but I'm pretty sure I can't shoot fire out of my freaking hands!( already tried, doesn't work! :D).

So a bit of reality in games is nice every now and then, but so is the unrealism that fantasy games of japanese Games delivers to us. I still love my mass effect and my tales of the abyss!
Panzerkanzler  +   2010d ago
I've always hated JRPGs with a passion. They simply are not my cup of tea in any way, shape or form. I'm glad some people like them though, playing a fun game is pretty damn nice! But I stick with what I personally like, the WRPG. There's so often controversy when it comes to western and Asian games, people get touchy and so on. What counts is that people play what they enjoy.
blodulv  +   2010d ago
For ages 12 and under.

*EDIT* minus Demons Souls
#20 (Edited 2010d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(11) | Report | Reply
Chris399  +   2010d ago
Nier had one of the most unique, adult story-lines that I've seen in ages.
Better than Dragon Age's coining of Tolkien's lore or ME's take on the old "sentient machines Hell bent on annihilating all life".

Just saying. And Eternal Sonata was pretty out there too. An RPG based around the final dream/ reality/ delusion of a dying man. That's pretty fresh, far as I can tell. I'd wager that on average, JRPGs are far more exotic and risky (sometimes MAXIMUM RISKY :P) in their themes and imagery than any WRPG. It's this creativity and just plain weirdness that makes me tend to favour them more than Western RPGs.

I like both flavours of RPG - Western and Eastern. But your statement isn't grounded in reality. It's true that a large portion of JRPGs are geared toward 15-17 year old males, but that can be said of video games in general. There is very little adult content out there. And throwing in space marines, sex or blood, doesn't necessarily make something "adult", merely scandalous.
blodulv  +   2010d ago
I'm sorry... but it doesn't matter how "deep" the story is.

Nearly all JRPG stories are told through the eyes of an immature pre-pubescent teeny bopper, or at least one that acts as such.

Now for example, if more JRPG's were based on some anime type characters like D from Vampire Hunter... I'd be more interested.

Until this happens, you can keep 'em.
Baka-akaB  +   2010d ago
yeah dragon age's blood splatters and flirty wenches were cleared designed for a mature audience

#20.2 (Edited 2010d ago ) | Agree(2) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
Phazonmasher  +   2010d ago
Even if the intent was just to point out the stylistic differences, the way he worded out was derogatory. Besides, it's cool to pick on the JRPG in America today, what with the same kids who say JRPGs are for kids are playing Halo and Call of Duty. America is shootan territory now and everything else is incessantly mocked by those who started gaming maybe 8 years ago. At least Europe can appreciate anything with the tiniest bit of art in it. America is totally fine with just blood, guns and tits. Simple minded fools.
Chris399  +   2010d ago
This was my comment of the day.
Trophy unlocked.

"Kick in the balls to JRPG haters."

It must be something in the air, but the JRPG hate on N4G is fierce today! Fight the good fight! Back to platinuming Nier!
Jack-Pyro  +   2010d ago
While I agree with you to a certain point...your hatred of the United States, (don't say America....there's 2 of those you know,) is kinda unneeded.

Besides...last I checked the US was just as artistically inclined as Europe....
Chris399  +   2010d ago
Yeah, the last sentence was a bit harsh.
The general "gist" of the comment was pretty good though. A little less bile next time, maybe? :)
madjedi  +   2010d ago
And alot of us gamers from the us, that started gaming back when it was only for nerds or outcasts( the unpopular people)look at the some of the newer gamers and just role our eyes in annoyance. I know generalising is convenient, but it is also stupid at times, because there are always exceptions to the rule.

Next time keep to the discussion at hand without going on a rant about 1 specific countries citizens debatable shortcomings, while boasting about your cultures supposedly more refined tastes in a very subjective subject, it makes you seem less like a pompous ass.
#21.3 (Edited 2010d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
TheBand1t  +   2010d ago
I tend to lean towards WRPGs, though I do love certain JRPGs like Demon's Souls, Dark Cloud, and Valkyria Chronicles, among others.
Bloodyghost  +   2010d ago dogs
Western Retailers barely see the light of JRPGS

as for Eastern Retailers barely see the light of stocking shelves with WRPGS.

what a fucked up world.
djfullshred  +   2010d ago
If people don't understand the huge influence of manga & anime in Japanese pop culture, then they may not get the appeal of JPRGs, and say they are stale and "not realistic".

Personally, I am a big fan of Japanese anime. I see many Japanese games as being an extension to that entertainment, just like many western games try to emulate Hollywood movies.
#24 (Edited 2010d ago ) | Agree(3) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
blodulv  +   2010d ago
This is a good point...
My main problem though is that there are too few JRPG's that have an adult character as it's protagonist that you can relate to.
#24.1 (Edited 2010d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
USEYOURFIST  +   2010d ago
bethseda need to stop talking crap about other genres and make a game for ps3 that dont crash or freeze every five minuets.

i hate how companys this gen like to moan about stuff they have no experience in

JRPG FTW i want fantasy storys with bright vibrant visuals and imaginative story.
John Kratos  +   2010d ago
I play more WRPGs than JRPgs but I don't hate JRPGS or anything. Now what Bethesda said here really isn't an insult just more of an observation or something like that. Now Bioware has had more direct insults to the JRPG genre with the whole you can put J in front of it and the JRPGS being stagnant comments made by them. But personally I think developers should kind of keep quite regarding other developers work generally.
Edito  +   2010d ago
Who wants realistic RPGs???
Whe Bethesda or Bioware games become real ill stop playing games cause i want to live my fantasy in games they are talking about hings they don't really understand its all about culture differences what matters in the end is the story and the feel and to be real Oblivion and Fallout sucks for me...
Redempteur  +   2010d ago
realistic ? i don't care .. i want a fun world to explore that stay logical from start to finish ..i don't care about realism ...i'm playing to have fun
#28 (Edited 2010d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
midgard227  +   2010d ago
real life is more realistic than fiction.....

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