Ultimately, it seems like the format war is going to come down to the fourth quarter.....
Have to give them credit for still trying i guess..
Fair enough Blu-Ray and HD players are coming down in price, but still the price of films compared to regular DVD will still put the vast majority of mass market people off, also bearing in mind they are still going to have to buy a HD tv to get the most from their purchase. A cheaper player from either format will not decide anything now or over the next few years..
As well as axe those stupid combo's that don't work half the time. Yeah, I really want to boil my disc before playing.
Whatever.. go watch your Blu-rays...
HD DVD players are not buggy and combos work just fine.
maybe just his was buggy. just like how some peoples xbox 360 get the ring of death but other people say that they have no problems....but i will go watch my blu-ray
16 blu-rays + PS3 = Great Entertainment!!
There is information about these models that won’t be talked about in the press, but may play a big part in the format war. First, these new models are smaller than any current Blu-ray or HD DVD players, they come close to regular DVD players in size. But the biggest thing is the cost of manufacturing is greatly reduced on these models, putting HD DVD in position to be the price leader and it will likely lead to $199 street prices, considered to be the “hot zone” for mass-market adoption.
Who really cares about a dying format,no movies,no support.
Guess what, they are still getting Killing in software sales.
I'm sure you will disagree again, and you will still be wrong again if you do. The players are buggy, the combo's have major issues. Go to any home theater forum and you'll find it to be true. Don't be an ignorant Toshiba/MS sheep.
"cdzie1 - 5 Minutes ago
HD DVD is a losing format? It has a bigger market-share than PS3. HD DVD players sell better than Blu-ray players. That's a losing format?
Not true in the slightest. The more you talk the more foolish you sound. You are pretty much the reason HD DVD is sucking ass, continual lies and mistruths.
i wanna know why the dvd combo disk are like $5 more that any other hddvd...do people really need those
because its like im buying this hddvd to by the movie in high definition, so why do i need the dvd version?
i guess i could take the movie over to my friends house who dosent have the kind of setup that i have...but do i have to pay $30??? i think it should be a bonus...like u get the dvd version as a bonus.....
the hardware might be getting cheaper but the software is high....even high than some blu-ray titles.
Because you might not have a HD DVD player in your desktop/laptop or on other tv's.
No portable HD DVD players either.
$5 bucks for the DVD ver is cheap considering most cost $19.99 on avg.
But who's going to invest into a loosing format? Just that BD has a better selction of movies.
HD DVD is a losing format? It has a bigger market-share than PS3. HD DVD players sell better than Blu-ray players. That's a losing format?
Counting PS3, there are 5 Blu-ray players for every 1 HD DVD player. The Blu-ray group outspends the HD DVD group 10 to 1.
And yet, Blu-ray only enjoys a 2 to 1 software lead? What does that tell us?
HD DVD is capturing the hardcore movie enthusiast, people who buy a lot of movies. Blu-ray is totally supported by PS3, and the sheer numbers are giving it an early advantage. But HD DVD is better setup for the mass market with cheaper players, the combo format and a completed standard that won’t make players obsolete like Blu-ray. But don't take my word for it, the head of Warner Bros said the same thing.
Sadly you probably don't even comprehend that you are contradicting yourself now.
Studios don't give a rats ass about attach rates, they care about the volume of movies they sale and that is it. Also, keep in mind Toshiba will be putting HD-DVD drives in their laptops, there goes your attach rate that you care about so much (studios don't). You do realize (well you probably don't, you are very ignorant of many other things, hence you contradicting yourself) Toshiba has significant market share in laptops.
Instead of confusing yourself further, read up before making a bigger fool of yourself.
I guess it's pointless. The format stores less data. The surface on disks scratches more easely. Maby HDDVD will win but it's a loss for the customers. I really don't care if I have to pay a little more for BlueRay, it's worth it for me.
For hddvd to succeed, there need to be other branded players available to consumers. This is beta and vhs all over again. Sony was the only one to make beta but there were more than one company that made vhs. Regardless of the fact that beta had better quality / less space (sounds familiar doesn't it???) HDDVD is just like beta and ironically it is sony with the licensed tech for blueray.
Toshiba needs to solicit companies like hitachi, sanyo, jvc and others in order to make a significant impact. Plus it really isnt that hard to add a protective layer to prevent scratching. In fact I think they are working on that for regular dvd as well so blueray wont be the only scratch resistant format.
The last numbers show:
blu-ray winning by 23.56% or blu-ray(61.78%) vs HD-DVD(38.22%).
To help you put it in perspective... If 10 people buy HD movies... 4/10 are buying HD DVD movies. That's very impresive if one take under consideration the amount of support blu-ray have in the movie industry, The most popular video game brand(Playstation) comes with one built in, and other variables.
Blu-ray is doing a lot better than HD DVD.. there is no doubt... but sadly... for those of us that want the format war to be over... HD-DVD sells % are pretty damn high...
Base only on the numbers.. it almost shows as if HD-DVD can still be profitable even if blu-ray becomes the dominant format. It would be a consumer nightmare... but... not a problem for hardware manufacturers and other companies supporting the format.
If betamax had almost 40% of the market back then... sony would continue to push it.
Currently the PS3 holds 16.6% marketshares on the video game industry with the XBox 360 holding 42.5% and the wii 40.9%. Should Sony pull out of the market? Ofcourse not! Sony believes that the PS3 has the potential to be profitable and have a large pie of the market...
Here is the interesting part... regarless of who gets more marketshares on the game industry.. they will all stay around.. specially if they are all profitable or have the potential of becoming profitable.
I know the movie industry is different... but I tell you want.. if people continue to support HD DVD the way they are with 38.22% marketshares.... and HD DVD partners continue to make money... we will stay on a multi-format situation for a long time.
Truth is HD DVD is doing horrible compared to blu-ray.
That isn't a great source to quote from considering the fact that DVD Empire states that those numbers reflect the items they alone have sold, and do not reflect the entire movie industry.
"Who's winning the Hi Def war? See for yourself. The information below reflects the percentage of OUR overall Hi Def items sold by format."
This is written over the percentages.
I am convinced cdzie1 works for MS...Either that he knows he's stuck with his 360 and accessories and is delusional. Also he might be Amish. Why do you think Xbox and it's partners (hd-dvd) is the next gen ? Please tell me your not a bitter former employee at sony that was canned or you just work for MS...Get a grip of yourself man and quit getting your hopes up for the xbox and hd-dvd...I swear Bill Gates can announce that they're pulling the plug on their gaming and guys like you would still be in denial. Enjoy the next gen bro...and quit sticking up for the xbox products like it's something great...Yes it's affordable...but it has it's flaws (a lot)...
I don't work for Microsoft, in fact I run my own business that is outside of the industry altogether. I have every system, including a PS3 & Wii. I just present the facts and it usually gets you Sony boys all riled up.
I got scammed with my PS3, you all did too. Sony used its loyal gamers to advance its Blu-ray agenda. The fact is: Sony left the DVD group because it wants to make more royalties with its own format. Sony’s greed is the reason for the format war.
Now Sony is falling way behind in the console race because its machine is so expensive, most cannot afford it.
And now Sony is using the press to try and convince everyone that HD DVD is dead because frankly: HD DVD is a better technology at a cheaper price. The Blu-ray spec can’t do picture-in-picture, nor can they do web features. And everyone that buys a Blu-ray player today is buying an obsolete technology because come November, the new Blu-ray spec requires hardware that they don’t have.
Sony is scamming you. Stop letting them.
All I am reading is Sony did this and Sony did that, but I think you are forgetting the vast amount of companies that are pushing the edge with Blu-Ray along with Sony. In case you forgot, here is the list.
That's A LOT of companies, and the Board of Directors list is full of big names and product manufacterers that we are all familiar with.
Blame Sony for all of Blu-Rays shortcoming, but if anything, Sony has been the whipping boy for this format by being an early supporter and pioneer of the technology.
who the hell got scammed by sony on blu-ray in PS3. No one ask you to buy PS3, like your avatar said you can easily bought XBOX 360 and HD-DVD.
Yes, They did put a blu-ray on PS3 and that's for both gaming and movies. I find it a great value at $499, because elite and HD-DVD add to be $600+. Why do you call this a scam.
If anything, it's not a scam, this is your excuse for blaming your favourite format being trash by Sony. You're sour over sony using PS3 to gain over HD-DVD. How is it a scam when PS3 can play both Blu-ray movies and games which it did what it suppose to do?? Scam??? You sir are a sour loser.
PS: If you want to diss sony about something, try not use your XBOX 360 and HD-DVD avatar. The moment people see it, nobody else gonna believe you. but I will give you +bubbles not because i agree with you, in fact I just want to see what you can come up with next.
Who can honestly say that HDDVD has higher quality? BlueRay does not have worse picturequality. It's the same or better. The obvious benefits of BlueRay is more datastorage. Harder surfacecoating and a better manufacturing standard. Customers have to go beyond the movie boundry. This is perhaps the way we will store backups and more in the future. I don't want to pay extra to have to buy two discs instead of one that holds the same amount. Just mentioning the data that is lost on the two set HDDVDdiscs will be larger as to formating issues. Really I don't dislike HDDVD, I just don't get it with the lesser storage capasity.
If someone is scamming anyone it's Microsoft. That company has always been horrible and it always will be. Not to say that Sony is the best in buissnes. However, do you really think that Sony can afford to scam their own customers or the new ones. What Microsoft has done to the gaming market is awful. Sony and Nintendo has the innovation, fantasy to deliver wonderful games and hardware, helping many small companies making games and creating jobs. Sony among others has really helpt the game industry grow. Microsoft has not helped anyone with the Xbox, not even themselves since all games for it should have or will be released on PC. It's not a win for any gamers. Microsoft cannot make good hardware. It's a proven fact. Microsoft makes great buissnes software, with a millon bugs. Now look at their hardware. And Microsoft does'nt care about HDDVD.
It's not even about being a Sony fan or whatever...I was trying to make my point that you obviously love hd-dvd and the xbox....For some reason someone has lied to you like that those are the better formats...which i can assure that they're not. Like i said, Bill Gates himself can come down and tell you that they were wrong on choosing those formats for the next gen and won't win and you'd still be in denial. I am willing to bet you HD-Dvd is not going to last...Also your xbox (if it's still even working) is not going to be the next gen console (not even close).
I think the community here has decided to bake some cookies and brownies and sell them door to door to raise enough funds to get you caught up with the next gen and help you go over this illness you have that makes you believe what you do (hd-dvd etc.) First, admitting your problem is the key...."Hello my name is CDzie1 and im a dooped consumer that is in denial"...believe me nobody is getting riled up...hahhahaa
For a format to be accepted it needs to have something that is a necessity that can't be found anywhere else. To speed along the adoption of CD, there were several artists that would not release their material on record or even cassette. Blueray or hddvd would need to have a movie with some clout to actually make it only available on their format. Not even making a version on std dvd. Take a movie like spiderman 3 and if sony chose, they would ONLY make a blueray version (not even dvd) and seeing as that is the only version available, and those who are diehard spiderman fans, people would be forced to purchase that format and the player capable of supporting it.
It has been done in the past and could be done again. It runs the risk of alienating the public but sometimes those kind of risks work. MS did this with the original xbox and let go of support in order to focus all its attention on the 360. By continuing to support an old format keeps you in the good view of the public that uses it but it also limits your focus on the future.
only make up 5% of total DVD sales. It will take years for a victor to emerge.
HDDVD was on the market an entire year before Blu ray.
So who really started this format war?
I am glad to see that Toshiba is already on there 3rd generation of players. That means that production costs will drop dramaticly.
I think the first player to reach a mass market $199 price will be the victor in the long run.
As it has been shown throughout history price can be a dominant driving force in most industries. Just look at PS2 and Wii.
Still that just shows how much more dominating blu-ray is.
As for your PS2/Wii comparions. That is apples to oranges.
FYI, the Dreamcast launched before the PS2 and at the time of the PS2 could be had for under $100. Also the gamecube was less than the PS2.
Hint: Content was a huge factor in the PS3's success, seeing the blu-ray has a majority of studio support and seeing that HD-DVD is already much less expensive than blu-ray and hd-dvd is still getting its ass handed to them. Clearly price isn't the end all be all.
I have to say that I am happy that the superior format is winning, blu-rays kick hd-dvd's ass in bandwidth, storage and durability. Hence why they score better on average for PQ and SQ. Plus titles that are multiplatform and use blu-ray's bandwidth do look better on blu-ray, do sound better on blu ray. Granted Warner has released a lot of crappy ports but the tide is changing. Look at future Paramount releases :)
FYI, blu-ray will have HD picture in picture which is swappable. HD-DVD will never have HD picture in picture.
"Despite price differences, high-definition stand-alone (PS3 not included)Blu-ray and HD DVD players are neck-and-neck in sales, according to the NPD Group."
Everything said here is 100% factual.
The more I think of it, Toshiba should definetly drop the deal with Microsoft. MS is really hurting Toshiba in this "war". This and many other discussions like this is proof enough. Don't forget that Microsoft is a huge competitor if they where to choose BlueRay all of a sudden. I think they will very soon because PC games will in a not to distant future store huge amaounts of data. Just wait untill Halo 3 is released on PC not far from now due to bad sales on the Xbox360, And just think about it, Sony producing Halo the movie;-)
For the longest time PC games were on CD. It hasn't been that long since PC DVD games have been out. I do not think we will be seeing to many games on a BR or HD DVD for the PC. PC game studios are going to put it the format that will have the most and that is going to be DVD for awhile.
What I find interesting is that the A35 is coming in at $499 and has some awesome features. Toshiba is being smart in getting these players lower and lower. It will be interesting to see if all of the A2 models also start dropping in price with these new players coming out. If the A2 models will be around during Christmas I imagine these will get some good mark down. Prices at $199 are not that bad for an impulse buy.
What will be interesting to see though is when the next set of Blu Ray players start coming out with the BD-J stuff included. There are going to be some pissed off people with Gen 1&2 players that can not watch the BD-J enabled movies. Extra features are hit and miss, but the 300 with the blu Screen PIP was pretty damn cool to see. I have to applaud Toshiba for specing HDi from the beginning.
Makes me wonder what New Line is going to include for the Lord of The Rings when they put those on HD. It is to bad they are only doing the Theatrical version first.
Blu-ray movies will have full 1080p PIP in the future compared to HD-DVD's 480p PIP. Most first gen Blu-ray players need the firmware update to watch BD-J movies so no one is getting ripped off in the Blu-ray camp.
To 16.1 can you please provide a link to your information? Everything I have read on this subject is the opposite. Believe I would love to see it happen especially for the PS3, but it doesn't sound likely.
"Blu-ray owners waiting for more Java features and highly interactive releases like the recently announced Matrix compilation on HD DVD could be due for a hardware upgrade this winter. VideoBusiness is reporting that the BDA has mandated all hardware launched after October 31 must support BD-J enabled picture-in-picture video playback, 256MB of persistent memory, and (for players with an internet connection) 1GB of memory for downloads. Currently these features aren't required and picture-in-picture support isn't in the PlayStation 3 or Sony's lower priced BDP-S300 that will debut this summer, ahead of the deadline."
The A35 going for $499 is a steal, because the second gen model went for $799!
Toshiba is rumored to have another promo deal going on for the next gen players as well.
Like before expect $100 drops on each model line.
Your right about the BDP-S300. I've had some BD customers tell me the exact same thing and they plan on waiting until after X'mas to upgrade their players.
Give it up already cdzie1...You have just been hammered into the ground by numerous people, don`t comment in this thread again unless you want to be knocked down further. You have been questioned many times before by people who know what they are talking about when it comes to blu ray/hd stories. You come across as an incredibly immature person, and not a very knowledgable one at that. And for one that "runs his own business" this is rather amusing.
his knowledge and attitude is fine for a person that sell only HD-DVD and XBOX 360. You know kinda like slimy sales person. Maybe that's his business over ebay.
most of the ppl bashing HD-DVD are PS3 owners not actual a Blu-ray stand alone owner, So Xbots do yourselves a favor and support the HD-DVD add-on.
Why support the add-on? I think it is a good way to get into HD movies cheap, but you would be better off getting a standalone HD DVD player! Better surround sound for one thing plus HDMI.
I'm tired of hearing that Sony had a hidden agenda and forced PS3 owners to except the Blu-ray format. Are you forgetting this is next-gen? Games are going to be bigger in size and someday may exceed a single Blu-ray disc. Enjoy your 360 DVD9s because Microsoft ripped off all you xbox owners by staying last gen in the storage format.
One can argue that games won't need a disc as a storage medium and can be downloaded instead. If that's true then why isn't Microsoft offering full games as downloads instead of offering them as retail in disc format?
Mini games like Super Stardust HD, calling all cars and geometry wars are alright for download but I prefer buying the disc of a full game rather than downloading it because it will fill my HDD too fast.
i guess hollywood and most retail chains were forced to blueray also.lol
But still no movies, so flop...
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