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Submitted by primesuspect 1038d ago | article

Did Microsoft kill Xbox Live cross-platform because console players were too bad?

No one is saying that PC gamers are “better” than console gamers, just that maybe they have a higher developed skill-set thanks to a more precise input method and generally harder games. (Microsoft, PC, Xbox 360)

GWAVE  +   1038d ago
No, dummy. They killed it because Microsoft has the strictest network (Xbox Live) in the industry. It's also why they haven't allowed one of their key partners, Valve, to distribute content on the 360 via Steam.
Fishy Fingers  +   1038d ago
They have Live on the PC too, I'm sure if they wanted they could manage cross platform while maintaining their systems integrity. But there are plenty of other little problems, such as updates, the PC gets them quicker and more frequent in many cases, mods too, it would be difficult to keep them both on the same level in those respects, at least without holding one back.

But really, is there enough demand to warrant the effort. I dont know any PC gamers crying out to play against console gamers or visa versa. Each have decent communities, so really, why bother?
#1.1 (Edited 1038d ago ) | Agree(12) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
Cold 2000  +   1038d ago
Yeah dont see whats the fuss about. We already got millions of peeps online on both 360 and PS3
Legosz  +   1038d ago
Studies show that 61% of PC gamers use a microsoft xbox 360 usb controller to play games anyways, not counting World of Warcraft players. I myself use a xbox 360 usb controller when I play Blur and etc on my comp, it also works great on ZSNES.
darthv72  +   1038d ago
wont happen but i still like to think it could...
real cross platform play on ps3, 360 and pc.

ps3 and pc get the love and 360 just sits there and watches.

Like Ross in that episode of friends where he suggested a 3-way to his wife.

Ok not many will understand that reference...my bad.
Tehdaza  +   1038d ago
@Legosz

That's a joke, right? Where did this 'study' come from? Most of the most popular PC games don't even have native controller support.
eggbert  +   1037d ago
@legosz
lol, you joking right?

Only games that people would want a controller instead of keyboard/mouse would be racing or fighting games. Racing games could use a wheel, and people always complain about the d-pad on the 360 for fighting games. I wouldn't be surprised if most people just stuck with a keyboard for games like SFIV, seems like the arrow keys would input quite easily, don't know about using a,s,d,z,x,c though.

And as TehDaza said, most PC games don't even come with controller support.
fullmetal297  +   1037d ago
@Legosz
I myself use the controller for certain games but defiantly not for competitive online mutiplayer like css or bad company 2.
JsonHenry  +   1038d ago
While it is no secret a kid with a gamepad is gonna get his ass handed to him by another kid with a KB+M I don't think MS really cares if one was better than the other.
Spenok  +   1037d ago
Agreed, MANY companies said this is why it hasnt happened.
nickjkl  +   1037d ago
cant say something that never happened

i can guarantee you i can whoop anybody with a key board and mouse with a controller same in reverse with a keyboard and mous ei can whoop anyone with a controller
#1.3.1 (Edited 1037d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(5) | Report
DaCajun  +   1037d ago
This nick guy is on crack, thanks for the laughs wannabe.
I mostly play on the PS3 over the other platforms but when I do play on the PC especially shooters there is no way in hell I will use some crappy controller for a PC game. A mouse is by far more superior on PC games as far as accuracy goes. The little console only kids around here must not realize that console shooters always have some amount of aim assist to make up for the analog sticks lack of accuracy that a mouse gives you. With that being said I still prefer playing my PS3 with the aim assists anytime.

If games do go cross platform I think it will be all balanced out because PC users will have the accuracy the mouse but console gamers will have aim assists to balance that out but if they took away the aim assists for console analog controls, us console gamers would be screwed.
#1.3.2 (Edited 1037d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(0) | Report
nickjkl  +   1037d ago
as i said you think im on crack because i believe i can whoop anybody on anygame using anything i dont need auto aim developers put that in their for the kids that dont know how to aim

but i sware if they make a fps cross platform between consoles and pcs ill wipie away this delusion that keyboards and mouses are more accurate than controllers
Natsu X FairyTail  +   1038d ago
So when you read the Article they say that when playing a Shooter(example) on PC you have the advantage of having more accurate controls since you're using a Mouse and a Keyboard But in the title you say '' did microsoft kill xbox live cross-platform because console players were too bad ?''

Trying to get hits?
#2 (Edited 1038d ago ) | Agree(5) | Disagree(1) | Report | Reply
dizzleK  +   1038d ago
not to mention that the pc players are generally enjoying smoother gameplay overall. combine that with the kb&m and it spells doom for the console gamers.
Pandamobile  +   1038d ago
You know what would be an interesting match up? A professional console COD4 player (like those MLG people) vs. an average PC COD4 player (someone that just plays regularly in public servers).

My money would go on the the average PC player.
WLPowell  +   1038d ago
Noob tubes + akimbo + riot shield = imminent pro rage quit.
Pandamobile  +   1038d ago
Too bad two of the three things you listed aren't in COD4.
TheColbertinator  +   1037d ago
Hahaha good one Pandamobile
SOAD  +   1038d ago
Keyboard and mouse is easier. Some say it's too easy. I'd stick with a gamepad.
Pandamobile  +   1038d ago
Controllers are slower and less precise. Some say that they're gimped. I'd stick with a mouse and keyboard.
UnwanteDreamz  +   1038d ago
I agree with you Panda controllers are harder and require more skill. You better off with a k/m.
#3.2.2 (Edited 1038d ago ) | Agree(2) | Disagree(7) | Report
vickers500  +   1038d ago
Not to mention the lack of force feedback in a mouse. I know that you can buy mouses that have that kind of crap in it, but the general consensus on them are that they are complete crap.

Plus, using a mouse, I just feel like I'm plain cheating, so it doesn't really feel like a game. Also none of the pc gamers I know play anything beyond WoW, so there's no reason to play mp on pc for me.
Tehdaza  +   1037d ago
My sub woofer provides all the force feedback I could ever want :)
bjornbear  +   1037d ago
eh...
sorry you are both trying to outdo the other guy's different colour.

keyboard+mouse better for SOME games (FPS, RTS, RPG)

but gamepad is far superior for other games (Platformers, racing, sports, hack and slash, etc)

SO quite this elitism and just be logical here -_-

+ how would you bet PC and Console gamers on the same game use different strategies? I doubt you can put your money down for any side considering there is no proof of superiority what so ever (i mean study's and actual statistical evidence) - i don't disagree, but lets be objective here =|

if anything, I THINK IT SHOULD BE...oh wait PS3 / PC cross platform incoming =D lets do it! make a big test =D that would be great
#3.2.5 (Edited 1037d ago ) | Agree(5) | Disagree(0) | Report
mastiffchild  +   1037d ago
Well, it's a subject close to my heart as I struggled long and hard before ditching the PC as my online gaming choice for shooters. What made it doubly hard was the fact that TF2 is my favourite shooter and it's just better on PC so the fact I went to console to play with a pad must say something(maybe even that I'm a sadistic little gimp).

What I don't like about PC shooters is two things but MAINLY the mouse/keyboard set up. I was tired of wondering how much each persons tech and set up had top do with their kill/death ratio and so on. It just isn't anything LIKE as level a playing field as it is on consoles where most people have exactly the same tech, play exactly the same game with exactly the same pad(by and large)-I just think it's nearly something you can't argue against. It's a fairer test of skill playing on line on consoles.

The other issue I have with mouse/keyboard(apart from the way I, and my mates, always got sucked into buying a newer,better set up for fragging-we called it the arms race)is that it's a bit TOO easy, makes you unrealistically good even when playing SP campaigns that the immersion starts to go a bit. I can do things way faster than people could in real life let alone with a pad! It gets to the point where you're so good it doesn't FEEL like, to me, I'm even playing fairly-also aiming on a separate plane isn't conducive to immersion and I felt the main reason it had got this far was PC gamers like myself wanting better and better mouse set ups for their gaming and eventually, again only imho and only for me, it's gone a bit too far and I want to know that I killed someone because, on that occasion, I was playing better than he was-that it was skill and not my control system.

Having stopped using a mouse I found going fully ith a pad pretty humbling at first and it's entirely my belief that whatever platform the actual skill levels are pretty identical. I've got a killer set up on PC and honestly feel that that's why I have better ratios on PC than I do on console. Playing pad Vs mouse is unfair as anyone who ever fell into a mixed match of UT3 on PS3 can testify. Easy to spot the guy using the mouse! Hard to stop him though!

Whatever, there's no RIGHT way to go and lord knows why MS didn't go further with this but mixed games are pointless, really, as it's not a fair comparison between control methods. I maintain, though, that a console on lne FPS with pads is a fairer trest of someone's skill as there are way less variables and everyone, basically hasd the same tools. If the level playing field is important to you then pad and console it is as far as I'm concerned.
GIJeff  +   1037d ago
@bjorn
...I can always plug in a game pad.
PotatoClock  +   1037d ago
@mastiff
Mouse/Keyboard set up? In what way can that affect K/D? You could have the most expensive gear and still suck.
Using a Pad doesn't mean its more level, your just more likely to play against casuals like yourself on a console compared to a PC.
I can bet theres a fair group of people on N4G who can claim to being the better players in any match of an FPS they play alot. Theres no set-up beats everyone with lesser gear rule. Its only timeplayed(practice) = Better scores.

I've played on a mouse keyboard for a long time. Its not an "easy" control, your up against people who are just as good and quick.
I prefer the faster pace with FPS's.
vickers500  +   1037d ago
@Tehdaza
So do you hold your hands right next to your subwoofer when you play? Obviously not, I'm just trying to make the point that I prefer force feedback in my hands, because it feels similar to an actual gun.
evrfighter  +   1037d ago
it's easy to believe that the mouse and keyboard is easy to use and get used to if your a console player. That's exactly why the m/k is superior.

However

This doesn't just work one way. On the mouse You'll find that pc gamer reaction times are almost instantaneous. You'll find that pc gamers can instinctively without aiming fire off a single round right between your eyes in about .5 of a second and not have to fire another because he knows your dead.

this is where the term twitch shooter comes from. I won't explain it because I guarantee 90% of console gamers don't know what the heck I'm talking about. and even then just as much will never be that good to know what I'm talking about. It takes quite a bit of time to perfect that kinda skill and just as much time to maintain it.

I've since lost my twitch shot some time ago when I stopped playing fps games competitively. Cod4 promod was the competitive scenes last big hurrah. since then we've got p2p junk and locked down server files.
fullmetal297  +   1037d ago
Really, because I think the auto-aiming ruins the "challenge" in console FPS.
#3.2.11 (Edited 1037d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(0) | Report
HDgamer  +   1037d ago
Only noobs call them noob tubes. That's a fact because everyone knows n00bs have more excuses to what weapon killed them the most.
mcnablejr  +   1037d ago
AWFUL COMPARISON
In any case a mouse and keyboard SHOULD win.

thats is not to say that the pc gamer wouldnt be owned if he were to try and use the pad himself.
spooky205  +   1037d ago
lets also couple that
with older more mature players that dont cuss and scream out racist remarks for attention. Sometimes the kids just ruin the online experience for me.
Cueil  +   1037d ago
You'd be wrong
and this question has been answered already... there are cross platform games, but a expert at throwing a stone will beat the average guy throwing a blade...
xTHRASHx  +   1038d ago
Mouse
Anyone using a mouse in an FPS will always own somewith a controller. lol
tdogg06051991  +   1038d ago
PC= Point Click Dead
Console = slide shoot
PC gamers have it better
GIJeff  +   1037d ago
that said
it REALLY bothers me that the ps3 is plug n play with any usb mouse/keyboard combo and STILL the devs refuse to enable it.
eggbert  +   1037d ago
there is an unofficial
plug-in you can install to allow PS3 controllers to work on PC's via the USB cable.

I've used it for SFIV on the PC before, but I eventually just got the PS3 version of the game since everyone on the PC version just glitches/hacks.
WildArmed  +   1037d ago
UT3 had the implementation of kb/m

And actually there was a controller released for the ps3 that translates the DS3 into a mouse.
If you really want to use a mouse, you should look into that controller. It works with every game (it will replace ur DS3).
They calibrated the right joystick (aiming one) with the mouse sensors..
http://www.amazon.com/PS3-F...
pimpmaster  +   1038d ago
why would i wana play with pc player? i really dont understand why thats a good thing. pc/mouse owns controllers so i dont wana play with a handicapped controller.
marioPSUC  +   1038d ago
It would be really really interesting to see a game that allows Ps3 and 360 users to play together, I would love to see this.
BlackTar187  +   1038d ago
Final Fantasy
but i know what you meant. I would love to have a COD or BF or something cross platform like that . Only problem would maybe be creating a divide between the commnity
pimpmaster  +   1038d ago
that be dumb as hell, ps3 players dont have mics. id rather just play 360 only
bjornbear  +   1037d ago
your comment is dumb as hell
generalizing a whole set of people and assuming one thing.

by that logic (the stereotyping incorrect logic), 360 gamers are all racist bad mouthing kids!

I don't have a mic, so YOU must be one of those kids!!
Charmers  +   1038d ago
Ok this is getting scary now, another positive PC topic on N4G ?? I am going to check my DNS settings I am sure I am being misdirected to an alternate N4G site /sarcasm

I love keyboard and mouse it is probably one of the key features that keeps me a PC gamer. Although I don't really think it is fair to say Microsoft killed cross platform because console gamers were bad at games. It is more accurate to say that Microsoft killed cross platform because they didn't want to showcase the PC in any way that it might harm 360 sales.
mastiffchild  +   1037d ago
Yes, the ease is addictive. I'm also WAY better with k/m but don't you think that knowing everyone has the same stuff/tools as you on console makes THEM a fairer test of skill than PC gaming where things aren't anything like as equal even between gaming mouse/keyboard set ups?

I'd also argue that keyboard and mouse makes shooters, in SP a bit too easy and is just so quick at doing things games lose some sense of realism. Great control scheme, don't get me wrong, but I've just had enough of it these days as it really does feel a little too quick to be true! Totally get why you love it so much though-horses for courses and all that!
evrfighter  +   1037d ago
"I'm also WAY better with k/m but don't you think that knowing everyone has the same stuff/tools as you on console makes THEM a fairer test of skill than PC gaming where things aren't anything like as equal even between gaming mouse/keyboard set ups? "

Nope

Why?

Because I use my mouse/keyboard on my 360 via xim. It's a nifty piece of hardware worth its weight in gold if you got the money to burn. I'm not even close to how good I used to be. Even then I get messaged in the middle of rounds all the time from controller players tellin me to fuck off.

I easily break 35-40 kills in a tdm with around 10 deaths or less. The kicker is I never get to use my killstreaks because I'm not the camping type. I can pretty much spam UAV's the whole time though. So almost all of my kills are bullet kills.

I can't play it for very long because destroying controller users can get pretty boring. That said I can tell that as of late. I've been running into more and more xim users. They don't seem to be of pc gamer quality though. Just trash console gamers that believe that a xim will make them better. So it's no longer a level playing field.
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Iceman X  +   1038d ago
Live killed it
What they mean is yes Xbox Live is closed network, any game that's not using Xbox live can't connect. If you look at many games ANY game that connect PC and 360 MUST have Live. This is why FF14 is not on Xbox Live the reason FF11 was on Xbox Live is because Microsoft allowed Square to do this through a specail agreement. Which they will not allow this time for FF14, Microsoft wants FF14 players on Live to play alone on thier closed network, Square wanta every platform PS3, PC and 360 to play together, i mean this is a MMORPG. Any game that is Cross Platform must have Live to play with 360 players. Where PS3 dosn't have this problem PSN allow you to do whatever you want to do with YOUR game, Microsoft doesn't.
#9 (Edited 1038d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
Charmers  +   1038d ago
Microsoft has a PC service called GFWL it essentially uses the xbox live network. So there is no technical reason why Xbox 360 games and GFWL games could not have had cross platform play since they both use the same network.
Iceman X  +   1038d ago
True
They can connect to PC games, but Live can never connect to PSN or any PC game that's not using Live.
Cueil  +   1037d ago
@Iceman X
That's simply not true... there are ways to do this... tunneler programs have been around for consoles for a while now and a more robust version could allow for PSN vs XBL games... I'm all for it to... it would be sweet to have something like that. Larry Hyrb said that Microsoft is game if Sony is
Gollum  +   1038d ago
well..
they should allow cross platform with PS and Xbox first before talking PC.
Tehdaza  +   1038d ago
But there's already cross platform games where PC users can play with 360 users or PS3 users.

I don't think there are any games in which PS3 users can play with 360 users,
Iceman X  +   1038d ago
Also true
There are many game in which 360 play with Pc or PS3 play with PC but only 1 game ever where they all played together, Final Fantasy 11. Even when Phantasy Star Online came out, PS2 played with PC, but Xbox Live played alone.
TABSF  +   1037d ago
Shadowrun http://games.gearlive.com/b...

Is on both Games for Windows Live and Xbox Live and was crossplatform

They patched the PC version to slow the mouse sensitivity because PC gamers just destroyed Xbox 360 gamers. In the end it was not enough and the game just died

Valve has promised crossplatform gaming when Steamworks comes to PS3

I would expect all Valve games to come to PS3 and they will allow crosplatform gaming

Valve allows crossplatform with PC and Mac users so would imagine PS3 to be included
#11 (Edited 1037d ago ) | Agree(1) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
mastiffchild  +   1037d ago
Yeah, and as you're free to use K/M on PS3(dunno about 360 as I've never had the need/desire to use a mouse with my 360)it wouldn't HAVE to be unfair to anyone so no reason not to. Be interesting to see just how optimised for controllers the PS3 versions of games like DC Universe will be or whether we'll still be best off playing with a keyboard and mouse.
TABSF  +   1037d ago
I would think on DC Universe it would say on the first start up for PS3 users something like this "Best played with Mouse & Keyboard"
writersblock  +   1037d ago
Obviously
You cant compare pointer accuracy with that of a joystick, you can just twitch and spray on a PC
fatalred alarm  +   1037d ago
wait, dust 514 is kinda like crossplatform right? i mean, you actually get orders from pc players playing eve.
tdrules  +   1037d ago
If I wanted to take orders from a fat autistic dude I'd get a job at McDonalds
fatalred alarm  +   1037d ago
Dust 514:

The game features users fighting ground battles in wars on planets in the Eve Online universe.[3] According to a preview by Edge, the events that happen in this game will affect the EVE Online universe. Battles in this game can also determine who controls various planets in the EVE universe, and users in Dust 514 can interact with users from the EVE universe such as providing mercenary assistance.

This sounds intresting, doesn 't matter if you like it or not.
tdrules  +   1037d ago
Being told what to do by someone whose idea of fun is spending 4 hours transporting virtual goods across galaxies (i know people who play) does not sound that fun :/
fatalred alarm  +   1037d ago
i Don't know if that's meant to be serieus or not. There's huge battles involving hundreds of players, fleet tactics and there are almost no rules in eve, CCP just let's it all fly.

So when someone infiltrates the biggest Compagny in the game, gets one of the leader positions, steals everything that compagny has ( example, 50.000 real US dollars worth of ships ), they say, better luck next time.

This is what makes eve a good game.
And ofcours you got the trading ( you got autopilot..but whatever ) and mining and all that kind of stuff, but leave that too the bots.
GIJeff  +   1037d ago
PC gamers are better
its a fact. The faster you can get used to being under PC gamers, the faster you can learn to feel satisfied with your weak, pathetic attempts at gaming.
HaVoK308  +   1037d ago
Being an avid game of both PC and Consoles I can honestly say console gamers can not compete with the mouse and keyboard. Perhaps it could be done for COOP games alone but when it comes to FPS and RTS there is no comparison. It would be far too unbalanced.
kasasensei  +   1037d ago
Because of the high difference between controllers and precision AND mainly because, live GOLD on pc has failed miserably so it may BE a bigger pain in the ass to 360 live GOLD subscribers to play versus FREE live PC players!

XD
kraze07  +   1037d ago
If you pit two average gamers against each other, one with a g-pad the other with a m/kb, the one using the m/kb will almost always win. Microsoft killed cross-platform gaming off because they wanted more people to focus on the xbox360 and not gaming on the pc. This type of business is why there aren't many MMOs on consoles. I'm pretty sure the Xbox360 could be updated to support plug-n-play m/kb but M$ wont do this because they wouldn't make much money from it, but then again they do get a lot of people to buy those expensive wi-fi adapters when some cheaper non-micro$oft versions work just fine.

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