Submitted by BIoodmask 1947d ago | opinion piece

Natal: Why the Hardcore Should Be Excited

The current library of confirmed Natal games isn't garnering too much excitement from the hardcore demographic - and justifiably so. Although Joy Ride and the rumoured dance game being developed by Harmonix may turn out to be great, they're not likely to grab the attention of the dedicated Halo, Street Fighter or Forza player.

But that doesn't mean the hardcore gamer has nothing to get excited about. Sure, it's unreasonable to ask them to buy into Natal this early - but it may be that their enjoyment of Natal comes in a non-gaming capacity - at least initially. (Project Natal, Xbox 360)

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N4GAddict  +   1947d ago
I'm not sold until I see the hardcore games
Bobbykotickrulesz  +   1947d ago
Talk talk talk. I'm not judging Natal, I just need to see more videos of it in action.

At this point, Natal has just as much of a chance as Move in my opinion. But, that could either be right or wrong, depending on if they show off shitty, gimmick games.
#1.1 (Edited 1947d ago ) | Agree(15) | Disagree(15) | Report | Reply
Blaze929  +   1947d ago
I think the hardcore will be interested in Natal but not for it's games. Me personally, i consider myself a 'hardcore' gamer yet I could care less about Natal's games. I don't have the room for that anyway so that's already out of the question.

However, I'm more interested in the device itself and the option of controlling the UI of the xbox 360 with gestures and voice and even extending that to Windows PCs. If Microsoft opens up a SDK for maybe some Natal apps and indie games then I think it'll be very cool and that's how the hardcore will be interesting. Not by smacking red balls.
#1.1.1 (Edited 1947d ago ) | Agree(9) | Disagree(9) | Report
ReservoirDog316  +   1947d ago
Yeah, even if I was excited for Natal (I'm not), my 360 is in front of a bed. I'd have to rearrange my room completely to have any (like, any at all) room for natal.

So unless something so earth-shatteringly amazing is shown at E3 (something earth-shatteringly amazing enough to redecorate my entire set up), I don't care.
insomnium  +   1947d ago
Like I've said from the get go this thing should be made a windows Natal ie an OS. That's where the only potential for this device lies mainly due to lag. Maby casuals don't care for lag but I'm no casual. Lag destroys something like this. Same goes with the Move. Lag is fatal.
#1.1.3 (Edited 1947d ago ) | Agree(2) | Disagree(2) | Report
JonnyBadfinger  +   1947d ago
There is nothing that Natal or Move can bring to the table that the Wii has already not.

I give both of them about as much of a chance as anybody getting a head job from a lion.
HolyOrangeCows  +   1947d ago
"One of the most exciting aspects of Natal is the potential effect it could have on the user-interface of the Xbox 360 - in particular how the player interacts with the dashboard. The promise of a Minority Report-like gesture interface system coupled with voice and face recognition is something that is undeniably exciting"

I really don't get why that excites people. I'm not going to buy Natal so that I can over-complicate the way I use the dashboard. I'd rather tap my d-pad than wave at the screen and hope it registers correctly.
Conloles  +   1947d ago
There is no hardcore market with this or Move.
MasFlowKiller  +   1947d ago
I dont want to be that guy but
For the people that are getting this for controlling the UI, that would be such a waste of the hardware, getting it to wave your way around the UI and voice recognition. Hell the PSEye could probably do that if Sony wanted it to, if MS launches Natal as a new way to navigate the UI more then an extension to gaming i have a hard time seen much potential for this.

What people are forgetting is that at the end of the day the 360 is a GAMING CONSOLES, and if it doesn't add to its gaming goodness then whats the point?
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Xi  +   1947d ago
looks good,
but I'm glad natal doesn't require brightly lit bulbs, or paper tubes to do stuff like that.
V3N0M  +   1947d ago
Indeed,talk the talk but can't walk the walk.show us more games and let us see what natal is really about. don't fuck with us and just show us what we want to see.let natal speak for itself.
Sonyfanclubpresident  +   1947d ago
I want a natal game that can
play quarters with me.

My friends can't drink me off the table,
so I would like to see that idiot Milo try.
cryymoar  +   1947d ago
what hardcore games?
#1.5 (Edited 1947d ago ) | Agree(5) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
tinybigman  +   1947d ago
i have no interest
in either natal or move.
n4gno  +   1947d ago
Only move with 1:1, no lag, wireless and eyetoy/natal + controlers can do the thing for hardcore gamers.

lol@dumb and dumbers cez of rage and commodore "sony make thing that nobody wants" roflmao ...so nobody wants better hardware, better games, bluray, free online, wireless + battery included controlers, etc etc .....probably, in dumb land.
#1.7 (Edited 1947d ago ) | Agree(1) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
AAACE5  +   1947d ago
I don't think Natal will bring much for the hardcore gamer. But I do feel it's biggest selling point will be for weightloss. Unlike the others, Natal requires you to use your whole body. If the games are fun, you will get a good work out without thinking about how much you are moving.

The key with weightloss is moving the body, flexing the muscles, getting your heart rate up and getting your body temp up. What you eat is important, but moving the body is how you drop fat, tighten skin and tone muscle!

This is where Natal will find it's true calling! Sony will more than likely have games more targeted at the hardcore and will be competing more with Nintendo in that area. Then again, MS could have something in mind that we don't know about.
-Alpha  +   1947d ago
We honestly simply need to wait. People are quick to say Natal wont have any hardcore games and people are quick to say it will revolutionize gaming. People simply get their panties in a bunch for better or worse. I'm optimistic that Natal will succeed, however I am, right now, seeing it advertised to the casual audience. I don't doubt MS sees some benefits for hardcore audiences, but we need to wait and find out. I see Natal being much more effective towards casual gamers. That's not to say it wont appeal to hardcore gamers either. Really, when we look at even Move there is no telling what the developers will do. Look at how the Wii turned out. It's not so much that hardcore games are not possible, it's more about the fact that devs don't care to appeal to a limited crowd if the bigger crowd is more attainable. People saw something in the Wii we self-proclaimed "hardcore" gamers didn't see. We really do shape the effects of this industry.

This is why I think Sony's first party will be so great. I trust wholeheartedly they will not shortchange the games. Quality developers make quality "hardcore" games. The word hardcore is a hard word to use. Many casual games are fun too. Bottom line is that developers need to make good games. I trust in guys like Criterion, Bethesda, etc. but the problem simply is that we have to see these products first, and until then no one can be sure about anything. And unfortunately for someone like MS they have to rely on developers who they cannot control, I assume. Unless they make deals with them I suppose but largely the third party content is created by the developers and publishers. Natal and Move WILL be shaped by the developers imagination but the ace up Sony's sleeve is the First Party. MS does not have a strong one and I feel that this means Natal will be defined away from the hands of MS. And even then, will third parties even care for Natal or Move, especially the quality names like Bethesda, Rockstar, etc? But this is all speculation. Time will tell. I have no doubt that MS will push Natal hard and this means making business moves and what-have-you. I find though that it's like catching rain to take a drink. MS scrambles to catch it, while someone like Sony has water from a tap. I think this is my concern for Natal ultimately, MS doesn't have a First Party to rely on which means they need to find another way. Whether or not they can do it, that's the question.
#2 (Edited 1947d ago ) | Agree(11) | Disagree(13) | Report | Reply
DeepInterludium  +   1947d ago
Why the hardcore should not be excited about Natal

Natal just isn't precise enough to get excited for. Maybe you'll like it in the future but not now when the choice is, hey do I want to control a game where all my inputs will be received or do I wan to flail my arms around hoping the game will recognize something that results in a positive outcome.

But maybe CVG is right. Obviously the "hardcore" gamer has never picked up a controller before and would would rather use sweeping motions with a hand instead of just tapping one direction on the D-pad.
#2.1 (Edited 1947d ago ) | Agree(13) | Disagree(5) | Report | Reply
Inside_out  +   1947d ago
Natal is geared for the casual gamer...M$ should concentrate on casual gaming, if they do, they won't look dumb like Sony claiming it's for hard core gamers while showing ping pong...lol...Sony...making things nobdy wants...Found this hard hitting news piece on Sony...^^Deepinterdumb^^ should like it...check it out...

Related video
#2.1.1 (Edited 1947d ago ) | Agree(4) | Disagree(21) | Report
commodore64  +   1947d ago
@ cez of rage


Dude, that's the funniest video I have yet seen on n4g!
Thank you.
tinybigman  +   1947d ago
to the 2 above
I can see why you both have 1 bubble. Not the brightest bulbs in the pack and 2 of the biggest trolls on this site I've ever seen.

Anyway both move and natal suck I have all 3 consoles and I barely touch my Wii. I don't see either of these motion controls doing big things but I could be wrong just have to wait and see.
despair  +   1947d ago
I'll wait for E3, if MS doesn't show anything else but that damn ball game, i'm writing natal off as a failure, but i'm hoping for some kind of reveal.
JonnyBadfinger  +   1947d ago
I dont care which developers are behind it... you cant make joggin on the spot and flailing your arms above your head fun...

For this reason i refuse to play the Wii... i dont mind looking like an idiot but i am highly competitive with anything sport related... me and Wii tennis always ends in a fight.

The only function in which Natal is useful for is voice recognition. but then again i swear alot when playing games so everytime i get angry and shout "F*** OFF!" all the Natal will hear is OFF. then that will be followed but a white brick being piffed out the window.

Move as more of a chance at being successful simply because its a copy and paste version of the Wii-mote, which is already a proven working concept.

Natal is far to ambitious, and unnecessary when you can already turn the console on/off with the controllers any who.
Boody-Bandit  +   1947d ago
"People are quick to say Natal wont have any hardcore games and people are quick to say it will revolutionize gaming."

Okay AM22 I can honestly say Natal/Wave or what ever MS will name it, won't work for hardcore gaming with nearly 100% certainty. Why? Because Natal wont have the precision controls needed for hardcore games. Every single demo I have seen of Natal shows a delay. That and hardcore games have too many button controls, some games using multiple button presses at the same time, for movements and commands during games. How are you going to emulate that with just a motion camera?

It's not a matter of being a fanboy, ignorant or wanting this device to fail. It's simply a matter of common sense. You can see various forms of motion camera techonolgy all over the net and all of them have lag. Even Wii motion plus has lag. I own one and the delay drives me crazy on most games. Even table tennis doesn't make the shots of the motion I am doing with the controller.

These devices are fun to fool around with. I love technology and messing around with new toys and apps but just like Wii, is a novelty item and it wont sit well with hardcore gamers. I prefer to kick back on my recliner or chase lounge when I am playing my 360 or PS3. If I wanted exercise I would workout or go biking.

Just look at this "Cam Space"
Does that look hardcore to you? Do you see the lag? That lacks precision in a big way and it simply wont due for hardcore gamers.

Unless a company can come out with a motion control camera with zero lag that will work in any atmosphere (lighting, distance, clothing, depth perception, etc) these devices will be nothing but a novelty for casuals to play with. Even if it's an add on for hardcore gaming I personally would rather not use it. I bought a Wii only because I wanted to see what all the hype was about and that's exactly ALL that it is, hype.

There are a "few" good games on the Wii that make good use of the motion controls but they are few and very far between. I don't see MS being able to do better than Nintendo at their own game. Especially considering "most" the Wii's best games come from Nintendo themselves.
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ArmrdChaos  +   1947d ago
You are aware that developers will be able to use Natal and regular controllers at the same time correct? Just because MS is using this "you are the controller" crap to sell to the casual market does not mean that developers are restricted from developing hybrid games. The only question is what they will be able to come up with seeing how there is some overhead involved. We will just have to wait and see.
qface64  +   1947d ago
realisticly speaking the so called hardcore so far have nothing to be excited about
so why some people are so excited and defend natal like crazy i don't know

it doesn't matter if (insert name here) has the potential to be great, good or bad
it doesn't really matter if microsoft or (insert name here) says natal is and or will be amazing

until they actually show something for the so called hardcore to be excited about then no the hardcore should not be excited for natal
#3 (Edited 1947d ago ) | Agree(11) | Disagree(4) | Report | Reply
dizzleK  +   1947d ago
stop giving me bullshit hyperbole about why i should be excited about something. give me some concrete shit that'll excite me. i've been told for months that i should be excited but haven't been given one solid thing to be excited about. theoreticals and hyperbole aren't exciting.
Microsoft Xbox 360  +   1947d ago
x2. How is anybody supposed to be excited for Natal if all we see is nothing but mindless movement in front of a camera? Nothing remotely revolutionary about that. It takes no skill and the lag is still obvious. If you pay attention to the spectators in the recent Natal vids, they don't seem to be enthusiastic about it too. The only people even interested in Natal are the xbox loyalists.
#4.1 (Edited 1947d ago ) | Agree(7) | Disagree(5) | Report | Reply
ActionBastard  +   1947d ago
When they show something remotely "hardcore" using nothing but Natal, then I'll get excited. Until then...

Related video
nygamer28  +   1947d ago
Dude that video sucks,-bubbles
qface64  +   1947d ago
im giving you a bubble for that
#5.1.2 (Edited 1947d ago ) | Agree(3) | Disagree(2) | Report
Meryl  +   1947d ago
you beat me to it, it's exactly what i was thinking and it never get's old, ps move is the only way now, natal is just beyond a joke
nygamer28  +   1947d ago
Cant wait till monday!!! Natal judgement day!
Al Bundy  +   1947d ago
Hardcore? Natal? In the same sentence?
distorted_reality  +   1947d ago
I'm more excited with what Natal means for applications outside of games, and don't see it being a big influence on games any time soon.

Am very interested to see what they show at e3.
MELMAN26  +   1947d ago
I totally agree with you on that one and I have been saying this since the announcement in 09. I am as much of a video game fan as I am a technology fan. The fact that I may be able to walk into my living room and say xbox/tv ON or being able to swipe my way through menus and say "play move" will excite me in itself. Natal, with some cool games will be icing on the cake for me!
#8.1 (Edited 1947d ago ) | Agree(2) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
halojunkie  +   1947d ago
my take
1. lag
2. humiliating/
3.people who want to kick a ball go to the park.
4.peopel says it has issues ex: cute lil rrod.
5. who has a room big enough 4 it to work.
6. how in the world are you going to shoot a gun?
7. african american people have problems with the device.
8. no fighting games/just think: kicking your screen.
9. if it tracks all movement, how can u tell if ur pulling out a grenade or going for cover or giving a taunt?
10.the ps eye already exhists and is 15 bucks.
11. price is way too high.
12. they probably own a wii (potential customers.)
13. what other games will u play IF they can work? what? banjo? viva?
14. its bad for people in wheelchairs/disabilities.
15. if they make a basketball game what are you gonna do? put your tv 10 foot high on the cealing?
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30sec  +   1947d ago
#4 is such a stretch at failed humor, I'm embarrassed for you.
GenghisKhan  +   1947d ago
1 out of 15
that's a good batting average in my book.

oh yeah, there is no defending lagtal. xbots who says let's wait and see are just in denial. lagtal is casual BS just like the wii.. only problem is it won't sell as good.

LMAO @ reason #14.
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Microsoft Xbox 360  +   1947d ago
My neighbor downstairs would kill me if I started jumping around in front my TV.
niceguywii60  +   1947d ago
Ha hahahaha LMAO
GenghisKhan   1947d ago | Trolling | show | Replies(1)
tiamat5  +   1947d ago
Listen cut the BS and show me how you are going to hold a gun,open a door, run up or down stairs, look behind you or even run in the opposite direction. All Mircosoft and their supporters do is talk and talk some more, than hand you something that isn't even half of what they promised
Skynetone  +   1947d ago
im sold on natal
and i hate the 360 with a passion

ya know what would make a cool game, a dance music game when your backing dancers are coping your every move, that would be a drunken laugh
Godmars290  +   1947d ago
The thing that makes me hard to have any faith in Natal is that MS hasn't even shown it can cultivate a 1st party IP. If its going to have any real success, Natal is going to be depending on 2nd and 3rd party support.
stephmhishot  +   1947d ago
The Hate on Natal is MS' fault
They've done nothing but show the same game, with psuedo-celebrities, in controlled environments. Sony friggin toured the Move technology across the country and for better or worse let REGULAR PEOPLE have the opportunity to blog and talk to their friends about it. Does MS even acknowledge the existence of people who don't have mid to high six figure salaries?

Could MS blow away the Move with an incredible presentation at E3 with games that Nintendo and Sony could only dream of with their controller based motion tech? Absolutely, they certainly have the financial resources, but until they do, there's reasons to be skeptical.
gumgum99  +   1947d ago
I'm tempted to link to that overused meme from a few days ago, but I'm gonna sit this one out and see if something better shows up at E3 or not.
CaptainMarvelQ8  +   1947d ago
we haven't even
seen other arcade games in action other than the DAMNED RED BALL GAME and at that,it seems to have some lag going on

and now you're saying hardcore?
#17 (Edited 1947d ago ) | Agree(3) | Disagree(2) | Report | Reply
JonnyBigBoss  +   1947d ago
How would it even be possible? Remember, the second you say "you can just use a real controller with Natal" you're defeating the purpose. ALL of the big profile games on the 360 right now just simply don't WORK with such a concept...
Hallmark Moment  +   1947d ago
You ps3 fanboys will be sh1tting youselves when Microsoft drops the bomb because they will announce a Natal capatible wand that works in 3D space and works with full body motion. Microsoft will do this so that they can steal Wii fans faster killing PS Move. Please stop bashing Natal based on the full body tech demo. Microsoft will show games in plenty of genres and will show games using wand tech and full body motion and games that use both techs in the same games. This is why Natal needs a E3 show all by itself in a basket ball stadium. How in the hell do people even dare mention Move and Natal in a comparison context? Wii HD tracking balls on the end of a stick vs mo-cap tech on a console. Lol Love how the fanboys are starting to get nervous saying they have not shown anything a Week before the world premier. Why do ps3 fanboys seem to care more about Natal than they do Move? You do know Microsoft wants PS3 fanboys and haters to hype Natal for them and to speculate setting them up for shockers right?
#19 (Edited 1947d ago ) | Agree(5) | Disagree(17) | Report | Reply
JonnyBigBoss  +   1947d ago
That was one of the most fanboy-ridden paragraphs I've ever read in my life. Yeah, WE'LL see next week won't we?

Let me guess. You're going to say the casual front Microsoft is going to be directing toward is okay? Good luck competing on Gears of War 3 or Fable 3 with Natal...
kasasensei  +   1947d ago
You're definitely a fanatic person.
TheBand1t  +   1947d ago
But wouldn't a wand defeat the purpose of natal?

You are the controller?
Montrealien  +   1947d ago
You would know jleack. Only fanboys care about stupid comments like Hallmark`s comment.
keysy420  +   1947d ago
do you realize
that its about the games not selling us on some future technology that may not take off at all
on your back   1947d ago | Spam
Faztkiller  +   1947d ago
I'm not going say natal is good or bad but when a company shows very little to only select people and its the same thing over and over again that tells me they have little confidence it there product
Ronster316  +   1947d ago

Waggle and flailing your arms around is Wii's territory this gen, please both stick to making top tier HD AAA games.
Kos-Mos  +   1947d ago
Which they havent done yet.
Killzone3Helghast  +   1947d ago
No, only the Xbox360.
kasasensei  +   1947d ago
Absolutely none argument in this article to get excited about natal, from a gamer point of view.
This article is just empty of everything.
Senden  +   1947d ago
Lol saying hardcore gamers will get enjoyment from non gaming aspects of natal.. that's a pretty stupid statement right there. I'd consider myself as a hardcore gamer and quite frankly if there isn't any hardcore games which use natal as an integral part of the gameplay, I won't be interested at all.. why would a hardcore gamer buy a gaming enhancement add on if they don't like any of the games? Simply put they won't!
Senden  +   1947d ago
Actually to add on to that.. how effin stupid is this article writer.. he said the mass influx of casual family orientated games are a good thing because it will show publishers that natal is worth investing it.. does this writer even work in the gaming industry? Alls that would do is mean more publishers will release their shovelware crap on the 360.. take the wii for example.. 90% of it's games look just awful.. EA/Ubi I can think of who publish a lot of games aimed at children which look like nothing more than a cheap way to make money seeing as the games look so shallow.

To be honest, if microsoft don't find a reason for their current installbase to want to buy it, it's going to flop.. the price of a 360 plus natal might be a little too high for younger gamers and their console has too much of a hardcore reputation to appeal to families in the same way the wii does. However personally, I hope this fails and it costs M$ loads of money, it'll teach them for shunting their own fans in favour of making new ones.
krishnabloodsoul5  +   1947d ago
Dear Hallmark Moment
I pity you. Natal with a Wand will probably make it costiler, which in turn will make people screaming at Microsoft. Natal's full body tech can get really irritating..i mean..what happens when u scratch ur butt for a second? what if a grenade goes off if you do that? I hate the Wii and i hate motion controls...if it was up to me i wouldn't have let Sony come up with Move...but competition is the way of life in our industry
xc7x  +   1947d ago
so this article is basically saying the hardcore should wait after the casual crowd get their stuff and then you'll get your turn to get excited,not exactly assuring the hardcore too get excited as the headline suggests.
CaptainPunch  +   1947d ago
I'll just have to see some more games for Natal before I start judging.
Rashonality  +   1947d ago
oh come on.

we all know that natal is Microsoft's answer to the Wii.

nothing more nothing less.

so yeah natal never meant to be for the hardcore or "revolutionize gaming"

they're just trying to say it's for the hardcore so they can sell millions before we find out it's nothing but a web-cam with three lens
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