710°
Submitted by DigitalAnalog 1557d ago | article

Alan Wake: the sub-HD debate (Eurogamer)

DigitalFoundry writes:

"Remedy has responded to online claims that upcoming Xbox 360 exclusive Alan Wake runs with a sub-HD resolution, releasing a statement saying that "modern renderers don't work by rendering everything to a certain final on-screen resolution".

Despite a review version of Alan Wake being sent out by Microsoft to the games media with a strict embargo that expires in early May, some websites have run videos and taken screenshots from which pixel counters reckon that the game's native resolution is 960x540. This appears to be a somewhat different state of affairs when compared with early Wake footage we took a look at back in August last year, which was definitely a native 720p." (Alan Wake, Xbox 360)

« 1 2 3 »
DigitalAnalog  +   1557d ago
"If, as the pixel counters say, Alan Wake is running at 960x540 with 4x multisampling anti-aliasing, we do have an existing example of how this looks. Sony's Siren Blood Curse remake on PS3 runs with exactly the same framebuffer set-up."

Interesting...... very interesting.....

-End statement
Rhythmattic  +   1557d ago
I bought Siren Blood Curse ( never played the original) and love it.

As for AW,

PS3 users put it down, & 360 Users Put it up. Ah, the way of Singularity.

Tech wise, thats where this game will most likely suffer.. Frame- this and that, Res- This and that.. But as a game, no one knows yet.

I'm sure I'm getting this title. If it gets 6 - 6.5 scores, I'll Wait, but I'm sure its going to be a very decent game.

For me call it Alan Want.
nix   1557d ago | Spam
darkride66  +   1557d ago
I don't know what all the debate is about.
I think Alan Wake looks great and I love the premise. There aren't enough of these types of games being made and I hope it does well. When I'm playing it the furthest thing from my mind is going to be "I wonder what resolution it's running at."
I've said it time and time again, are you here to play a game or count pixels?

The only people debating this are 360 fans who need to prove to the world that the 360 can match up to the PS3 graphically and PS3 fans who simply want to thumb their noses at 360 fans.

In the middle are actual gamers who are simply interested in playing the games and, thankfully, we're still the majority of gamers.
#1.3 (Edited 1557d ago ) | Agree(28) | Disagree(11) | Report | Reply
Varodor  +   1557d ago
miracle, low resolution doesn't matter
but what if alan wake have sh*t gameplay when gameplay will dont mater?
AAACE5  +   1557d ago
Move on people!
I don't know... I like great graphics and all, but I have kind of got past all this and am just looking for games that look good and are fun to play! It seems petty to judge every game that comes out based on graphics alone. There have recently been some sh***y games out on both sides with great graphics, but no one cares because they look good!

If Ps3 is the only console with HD graphics then so be it. I just want fun games that look good enough to see clearly in. Alan Wake looks to have fun gameplay and good graphics so that's all that matters to me!
nix  +   1557d ago
oh.. i'm waiting for "gameplay is more important than graphics" excuses now...
not when you play games like KZ2, UC2, Heavy Rain and God of War 3. 'real' gamers don't miss out on great games.
Inside_out  +   1557d ago
...Back peddling...
Wow, who are these clowns..."while we agree"...blah, blah, blah....Remedy is a class act...totally professional...listen to this idiot agree and disagree at the same time...lol...the game is in the review stages already...every person who has seen this game running have claimed this to be one of the best, if not the best looking game this gen...Remedy has bent over backwards, while most developers hide, to explain how this masterpiece was created, released a great in game trailer a couple wks back and blew everyone away....

Why Remedy waste there time with the haters who can't play this game anyways is beyond me...Remedy are amazing at what they do...make games that matter....He ends with, we will revisit AW when it releases....That what these morons should of said in the begging instead of trying to hurt the sales and reputation of Remedy BEFORE the game is even released....

Digitalfoundry caters to ignorant gamers out there...Remedy just schooled these losers on video gamming 101...Can't wait, big screen, big sound...one masterpiece...PS3 kids...back to your hole.....
#1.7 (Edited 1557d ago ) | Agree(7) | Disagree(50) | Report | Reply
AliTheBrit19  +   1557d ago
"real gamers dont miss on great games"

So I take it you have an Xbox 360 then to play its fantastic exclusives?
Method  +   1557d ago
Still doesn't change the fact that if the game was developed on the PC or PS3 it wouldn't have these poor limitations.

Remedy sacrificed their integrity as developers and gimped their game just for Microsoft's low standards.
nix  +   1557d ago
nope Ali, i'm interested in the game but to buy a fault-ridden-hardware for one game... i don't think it's worth it. i have commonsense too, you see.
#1.10 (Edited 1557d ago ) | Agree(12) | Disagree(5) | Report | Reply
nycredude  +   1557d ago
cez of rage

You need to either go back to school or something or lay of the sauce man. Also stop putting every Ps3 owners in one category. Only fools like you think that just because someone doesn't have both consoles that they CAN'T play some games. If someone wants to they can alway go and buy a 360. duh! You know there is no law against having both consoles. Only in your delusional fanboy world is it a sin to own both. I have both consoles and if Alan Wake is a decent game AND I have time for it then it's a definite buy.

I love how you fools come here and diss the "other side" thinking you are so smart and yet you are pretty much the same only on a "different" side. Next time do yourself a favor and just don't comment cause you sound like a fool.

While this doesn't really matter to me cause I can enjoy a good game no matter how it looks (hell MGS still is a great game to me), it's pretty clear that in order for the 360 to compete in the graphics department certain concessions are required. No biggie and the overall product still looks great. But let's not make Alan Wake out to be some kind of King of Graphics here, like alot of people are doing. It looks like a good game and let's leave it at that.
nix   1557d ago | Spam
sid4gamerfreak  +   1557d ago
half life 2 runs in 1080p while crysis runs in 720p. Hmmm, which one looks better??
raztad  +   1557d ago
It's funny how DF cant wait to do Damage Control. I cant imagine how their actual analysis of AW will be.

BTW, Siren looks good but it's not exactly pushing PS3 limits.

@sid4

Interesting question coming from someone with a PC as a avatar. PC gamers are always trying to get games running at the higher possible resolution, because 720p looks "blurry". I do agree somehow, 1080p is much sharper, but a 720p game with high quality assets looks wonderful as well.
#1.14 (Edited 1557d ago ) | Agree(13) | Disagree(11) | Report | Reply
DeepInterludium  +   1557d ago
Siren's a good game, graphics aren't it's strong suit. It's a PSN game that was a port of a PS2 game.

I don't remember anyone touting Siren's graphics, saying it's one of the best looking games or saying that it surpasses 360's graphics.

That is the problem with Alan Wake, they hyped up the graphics so much and failed so hard to match expectations. It's the same thing that happened to KZ2, it was the best looking game by far, but people still complained it didn't look as good as the 2005 trailer.

Alan Wake looks like a blurry mess and is far from taking the graphics crown on 360, let alone come close to the heavy hitters on PS3.
AnttiApina  +   1557d ago
"This appears to be a somewhat different state of affairs when compared with early Wake footage we took a look at back in August last year, which was definitely a native 720p."

The E3 version was native 720p?!
sikbeta  +   1557d ago
Sorry, but WTH Siren Blood Curse has to do with AW?

Comparison?

Survival Horror?, OK, so?

PSN Game vs Retail Game?

2 years old Game vs incoming (2010) Game?
Rhythmattic  +   1557d ago
Actually sikbeta

It was available on BR. I bought It on BR.

As DigitalAnalog said , Its doing the same things "Tech Wise" as AW, Thats the only reason I reiterated.

I'm not Bashing AW, I'm buying it.
AliTheBrit19  +   1557d ago
So who else is picking up the very cheap (for its contents) special limited edition of the game?
#1.19 (Edited 1557d ago ) | Agree(4) | Disagree(4) | Report | Reply
AliTheBrit19  +   1557d ago
I'm not going to get into the Xbox 360 hardware right now

But by your logic, and only your logic

You are not a real gamer, because as YOU put it, real gamers dont miss out on great games, which is what you are doing.

And how did I come to this conclusion? well, I have common sense ;)
#1.20 (Edited 1557d ago ) | Agree(2) | Disagree(13) | Report | Reply
Fanb0y  +   1557d ago
Resolution honestly does not matter too much during gameplay.

Heck, Halo 3 looks incredibly detailed running at 640p no AA.

Alan wake is 576p with 4xMSAA. That makes a huge difference. You won't see 'low quality' frames. The details will still be there.
sikbeta  +   1557d ago
@Rhythmattic

[1] The European version with Extra Content, making of and stuff? I Envy You lol

[2] I didn't think you were bashing AW, I thought people were going to compare AW vs S:BC, which is a game that didn't set any Graphic Bar [still So Damn Scary]...
Arnon  +   1557d ago
You guys realize that the resolution of a game is not entirely indicative of it's overall appearance, right? MGS4 was gorgeous, and won many "Best looking game of 2008" awards, and the game ran below 720p.

We've all seen Alan Wake gameplay. The game is gorgeous, no matter what resolution or upscale it goes through. Who honestly cares what resolution it runs at?
The Lazy One  +   1557d ago
I don't know why people think running at a lower resolution is that bad. The game looked fantastic in the gameplay videos. I'm sure remedy did plenty of experimentation on whether having a 50 buffer composite with a 540p opaque geometry map or a 20 buffer composite with a 720p opaque geometry map to see which looked best. I doubt they chose the worse looking one. If the game composites to 720p before any AA or post processing is applied (I'm guessing they do it this way as they said they output at 720p, and they could just output at 540 and let the 360 deal with it if they weren't doing something else), then I'd doubt anyone would realistically know the difference unless they were a pixel counter.
Xeoset  +   1557d ago
My lord...
Wow, what utter tools.

"All together the render targets take about 80 MB of memory, equivalent in size to over twenty 720p buffers."

"It isn't strictly 540p. But it isn't strictly 720p either."

"Alan Wake's renderer on the Xbox360 uses about 50 different intermediate render targets in different resolutions, color depths and anti-alias settings for different purposes."

""Modern renderers don't work by rendering everything to a certain final on-screen resolution, but use a combination of techniques and buffers to compose the final detail-rich frames, optimizing to improve the visual experience and game performance."

http://n4g.com/xbox360/News...

Anybody with a brain can see how this works, and why it makes for a better game. Think of it as the Xbox 360's RAM setup, 512MB it can throw into either the CPU or GPU, depending on the tasks, comapred to the PS3's 2x 256MB, which is dedicated, meaning that it has a cap. The prior is a better setup when considering demand/load.

With every Xbox 360 release we see this bull; thought those 3 shooters would keep the PS3 Fanboys at bay.
raztad  +   1557d ago
Please people stop acting like resolution doesnt matter. I dont know about you but I want my games to look as sharp as possible, otherwise I'd be playing PS2 games (in the best case) up to 480p.

Resolution matters big time, lower res means more blurrines. I was very disappointed when GoW3 was announced to be 720p instead of 1080p, and N4G exploded with fans arguing about it, if it was relevant to GoW3 how is not relevant to any other game.

What it's interesting is that probably Remedy decided to go lower res because it produces the best results in terms of overall image quality. Dont forget 4xMSAA is being applied and game is gonna be v-synced. As most of the game is under poor lightning blurriness is NOT big deal, fair trade off if you ask me.
#1.26 (Edited 1557d ago ) | Agree(13) | Disagree(4) | Report | Reply
nix  +   1557d ago
yawn...
wake me up when 360 gets great games i like. the only games i want from 360 are GeOW series and Alan Wake. so, don't tell me i'm missing out on ANY great games that i'm interested in.
Elwenil  +   1557d ago
Eh, who cares?
Honestly, who cares about the specs if it looks and plays great? How much to the specs really mean to the average gamer? Sure there are titles that have suffered graphically and should have been better considering the hype, but will any of this really matter when the game releases? Seriously, are you going to not buy this or any game because of it's specs even though it looks good regardless of the resolution and is fun to play? Admittedly I am not a 360 fan and I will not be buying Alan Wake or even a 360 in the near future but I seem to remember that same bellyaching about Uncharted 2's 720p resolution and 30 FPS and how that was such a raw deal. Did it matter? That was a fantastic game and looked stunning. In the end do specs really matter? Sure they do, but is it worth all of this constant debate for every game coming out in the near future? Probably not. Just my .02
xXRight3yeXx  +   1557d ago
360 fanboys bash GOW3 for being 720p. PS3 fanboys bash AW for being 540p. Do you see the difference in mentality?

I used to play my PS3 games n 576p on my HD monitor and i thought that it was HD. Turned out, 576p is not even near HD(SUB-HD). Then i switched my display settings and i found out about it and quickly changed it and the difference was HUGE. If you don't believe me, then try it yourself. 576p sucks.
KiRBY3000  +   1557d ago
@ 1.12
you are right except for one thing when you say

"It's the same thing that happened to KZ2, it was the best looking game by far, but people still complained it didn't look as good as the 2005 trailer"

KZ2 graphics ended up even better than the 2005 trailer. it was as impressive while much more polished. 1 year after its release, it's still the console king.

people who complained must be blind or something.
Triella  +   1557d ago
Oh yeah Siren
I remember this Alan Wake rip off vividly :
http://www.youtube.com/watc...

oh wait...
#1.31 (Edited 1557d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
-Alpha  +   1557d ago
Kirby is right about K2's final product looking better than the trailer.

Resolution REALLY doesn't matter. Resolution plays a minimal role in graphics, and for the love of god, games are about gameplay!

Real gamers should be hoping this game does great not hoping it fails. People love to complain about shooters on the market and then a game that does something neat like Alan Wake or Heavy Rain comes out and all anyone can talk about is how it's too different or graphically inferior.

People act as if Alan Wake looks like a horrible game as if resolution totally destroys its quality. 360 fanboys shouldn't be acting as AW is king of graphics and PS3 fans shouldn't be judging it for it.
#1.32 (Edited 1557d ago ) | Agree(5) | Disagree(8) | Report | Reply
Gue1   1557d ago | Spam
AliTheBrit19  +   1557d ago
Well now your getting illogical again

You've changed "great games" to "great games I'm interested in "

I am sure there is plenty of people who find the Xbox 360 has many great exclusives THEY'RE interested in, and that the PS3 has no great exclusives THEY'RE interested in.

So you went from defining a "real" gamer by one who doesn't miss out on great games, to making "great games" what one is interested in

So you can no longer say anyone is not a "real gamer" because they could just say they're not interested in those games.

Nix - You put forward an argument, and then knocked it down again with your own comment.
#1.34 (Edited 1557d ago ) | Agree(2) | Disagree(8) | Report | Reply
Elven6  +   1557d ago
Method: That makes no sense at all, the PS3 and Xbox 360 have games that run at 1080p and 720p, they also have games that run below 720p the article gives three examples (Tekken, parts of Killzone 2 and Siren).

More examples,

PS3

http://forum.beyond3d.com/s...

360

http://forum.beyond3d.com/s...

Why do you think Remedy sacrificed their standards in development solely because the game is on the Xbox 360? If you make such outrages statements it's good to give some sort of proof and simply saying "not everything is running at 720p" doesn't cut it.

If you're still going to argue Remedy sacrificed their integrity on resolution alone I guess developers like Free Radical (Haze), Factor 5 (Lair), Kojima Productions (Metal Gear), Rockstar (Midnight Club, GTA 4), Insomniac (Ratchet), IW/Treyarch (COD), etc have also sacrificed their integrity since they made games that didn't run natively at 720p too.

Resolution has little or nothing to do with what a developer is capable of or what they believe in. Some of those developers stated above have made some amazing games despite the resolution issues.
#1.35 (Edited 1557d ago ) | Agree(7) | Disagree(5) | Report | Reply
4Sh0w  +   1557d ago
Well the explanation was not needed, just like none was needed for COD4, MGS4, KZ2, MW2, etc, the dev's obviously chose what "tricks" mak...
No you're missing the point, what they are saying is that standard 720p with NO 4xMSAA would look worst than 540p WITH 4xMSAA. Now obviously 720p native WITH 4xMSAA would be the best of both worlds but these console do have limitations, I think its apparent this is what Remedy is getting at in their explanation, they want the best visuals and performance possible with this engine:

"a combination of techniques and buffers to compose the final detail-rich frames, optimising to improve the visual experience and game performance"

Looking at the game it seems they made the right choice to me, but of course I trust Remedy's knows better than the fanboys, which DF seems to agree with when they state:

"It's another example of how overall image quality still looks very good, and it's pretty impressive just how much the 4xMSAA contributes to reducing the scope of the edge-aliasing."

It's not surprising to me because theres plenty of 720p native games that look worst than some of lower resolution games, you simply can't say that game A is graphicaly superior to game B just because game A has a higher resolution, theres simply too many other factors that determines HOW THE GAME LOOKS VISUALLY ON SCREEN, in fact COD4 was is still well known for its superb visuals, was only 600p yet it looked better than every shooter releaed during the same timeframe which many of course were native 720p.

Again this whole issue is much to do about nothing, some people just hate to see anything on the other console recieve credit where credit is due, Alan Wake is visually damm impressive, I just hope the story and gameplay will be just as impressive, but I have faith that Remedy will deliver.
#1.36 (Edited 1557d ago ) | Agree(8) | Disagree(2) | Report | Reply
CrazzyMan  +   1557d ago
i hope This will end debates, which console is graphically superior
Because it`s clearly now(in 2010) that PS3 has superior graphics(KZ2,Un2,GoW3).

This should be NOT questioned ever again. We should end this here.

People are not against Alan Wake, they are against x360, which limits game resolution and space.

Anyway, enjoy GAMING, Alan Wake should be a great GAME, i would expect nothing less from Max Payne develeopers. BUT it`s just a FACT, x360 LIMITS today`s GAMING.
#1.37 (Edited 1557d ago ) | Agree(11) | Disagree(10) | Report | Reply
Gue1   1557d ago | Spam
Greywulf  +   1557d ago
MGS4 Was 1024.x768, not 960x540. Just FYI,
And thats the PS3's worst effort Res wise.
#1.39 (Edited 1557d ago ) | Agree(4) | Disagree(2) | Report | Reply
ThanatosDMC  +   1557d ago
Funny thing is... Siren looks like crap guess that means AW is going to look like crap on our hdtvs...

Play Siren and turn off the grainy effect. It looks terrible... gotta love having a gun in the game though it's always short lived. Nothing like a bullet to the head to "fix" a freak of nature.
Sarcasm  +   1557d ago
Who cares? The real news is "Conversely, some of the textures on Kratos in God of War III are 2048x2048 in size"

No wonder he looks so sharp and detailed without a single jaggy on him.
raztad  +   1557d ago
@sarcasm

No jaggies are due to the awesome AA tech SSM used (MLAA), but yeah Kratos looks sick. SSM incorporated a technique to reflect Kratos muscles stress.
Absolut_Turkey  +   1557d ago
A PS3 Owner's Look at Alan Wake
You know why I love owning a PS3? I no longer have to worry about the whole "graphics vs. gameplay" issue, because PS3 exclusives do a good job providing BOTH (i.e. UC2, GOW3, LBP, MLB: The Show, MGS4, Killzone2). And the people that keep saying graphics and frame-rate don't matter are either lying to themselves or die-hard Xbox fans.

OT: Alan Wake is going to be a damn fine game that everyone (regardless of console preference) should experience. I personally can't wait to give Alan a spin on my friend's Xbox (if I can convince him to buy it, he doesn't seem too interested in AW). That being said, Alan Wake WILL NOT be the graphical masterpiece many people here were trying to hype it up to be, period!

EDIT: BTW when I'm trying to convince my friend to buy this for his Xbox, the LAST THING I'm going to talk about are it's graphics.
#1.43 (Edited 1557d ago ) | Agree(6) | Disagree(6) | Report | Reply
Elven6  +   1557d ago
Greywulf: Not true at all, Ghostbusters before it was patched was 540p (960x540), Guitar Hero titles have also been between 570-580p.

http://forum.beyond3d.com/s...

Tech doesn't matter much, it's all down to what the developer wanted to accomplish and how far they can get without sacrificing overall quality. Resolution is usually the first thing to go when attempting to keep framerate, screen tearing down, etc.
vhero  +   1557d ago
Another article on this???? Can we please stop submitting these?? Do people really care enough for it to effect there purchase?
The_Zeitgeist  +   1557d ago
For example:
Congress used this in the 1960's to end
the discrimination of African Americans
by southern resturants.
Imalwaysright  +   1557d ago
@ Raztad I dont care about the resolution of games. If i did: the best game ive ever played wouldnt be MGS3, My favorite RPGs wouldnt be FFIX and Vagrant Story, I wouldnt bother buying Oddworld Abes oddyssey and MGS from the PSN and try to find great PS2 titles i hadnt the opportunity to play last generation like Okami, DMC and Resident Evil Code Veronica. I play all those games on my phat PS3 and guess what i have just as much fun playing those games as i have playing PS3 games. Just because you have more fun playing games in HD it doesnt mean that everybody has. Resolution and graphics, to me, will never make or break any game as long as i find it fun and has great gameplay.
raztad  +   1557d ago
@above

Well if you are fine playing blocky games, all the power to you.

MGS3 > MGS4 for me, but I played it when all I had was a PS2 and a crappy 480i TV. Give me a HD MGS3 and I'll be all over it. See I dont like the hypocrite stance (not saying it's from you) that now gameplay is the only thing that matters when articles about graphics comparison are the hottest in this site.

It's clear AW traded off resolution (as NG2 did and some other games) for more effects, more polygons on screen?, 4xMSAA and v-sync. The game is gonna be a looker, not doubts about it, but not the best looking game ever as many here were hyping to be, nor the "proof" the xbox is on par with the PS3.
#1.48 (Edited 1557d ago ) | Agree(6) | Disagree(2) | Report | Reply
THE BIAS  +   1557d ago
No Alan Wake not being in HD doesn't mean the game will be bad. All it simply means is that this is just another 360 game that isn't in HD. The xbox 360 is becoming a console that doesn't have HD games releasing on it anymore
pixelsword  +   1557d ago
Two facts need to be faced about this game
1. The game ain't HD

2. I don't care as long as it's a good game.

Everything else can be forgotten.

BUT

I would like to say people are banging this game not because it is a 360 game, but because it was supposed to be touted as a game with killer graphics. Other than that, I think this game may be a hit.
#1.50 (Edited 1557d ago ) | Agree(2) | Disagree(1) | Report | Reply
HolyOrangeCows  +   1557d ago
I thought we already had this figured out.
The display resolution is native 720p, but the textures and geometric res are sub-720p, which is why the game is blurry.
Ju  +   1557d ago
Oh, wait, now I get it. And GoW1&2 "Collectors Editions" PS3 is the exact same as the PS2 version. Hm, yes, thought so. Must be idiots they made it 720p and 2xMSAA. Waste of time, huh ?
MNicholas  +   1556d ago
Gee ... that's exactly what I said.
As I stated in my blog post

960x540 with 4xMSAA and upscaling to 720P or 1080P

is the best resolution for this game. It provides the optimum balance of shader quality, anti-aliasing, and resolution.

720P would have meant more jaggies (2x rather than 4x MSAA) and simpler shading.

No doubt I'll get a ton of disagrees (as usual) from people who never tire of being wrong.
MNicholas  +   1556d ago
Gee ... DF just repeated what I've been saying all along.
As I stated in my N4G blog post

960x540 with 4xMSAA and upscaling to 720P or 1080P

is the best resolution for this game. It provides the optimum balance of shader quality, anti-aliasing, and resolution.

720P would have meant more jaggies (2x rather than 4x MSAA) and simpler shading.

No doubt I'll get a ton of disagrees (as usual) from people who never tire of being wrong.
DaTruth   1556d ago | Spam
MNicholas  +   1556d ago
My Blog explains it
http://www.n4g.com/up/43757...
HolyOrangeCows  +   1556d ago
@MN
You know what would be even more optimal for the 720p TVs that the majority of HDTV owners have? A 720p resolution with 2xAA
MNicholas  +   1556d ago
@holyorangecows
720P w/2xMSAA would have been ugly on any TV.

Read my blog post for more info on why it was correct for the developers to choose 540P for this game.
HolyOrangeCows  +   1556d ago
"1) Rendering fewer pixels(about 44% less) frees up significant computational and bandwidth resourceswhich can be used to make the pixels that are rendered look that much better"
The screens we've seen sure don't have 'prettier pixels' than what we've seen in games from earlier this year. With the bandwidth available at 720p, games have still managed to look great (And a lot better than AW).

"2) 4xMSAA is noticably better than 2xMSAA in preventing "jaggies" fromappearing and, in conjunction with the 360's excellent scaling chip, canprovide a smoother, if softer, image"
You call it "softer", I call it more blurry.
When you have such a low resolution, and add such an amount of AA, you're left with a blurry image. I'd take the clearer picture with a few jaggies any day.

"3) 960x540 divides perfectly into 1080P (1920x1080) so scaling to 1080P is simple and doesn't introduce new artifacts."
But we can ignore the odd scaling to the more widely used 720p?

Conclusion:
So putting it at a lower resolution frees up more power and bandwidth (No ****, Sherlock), it gives it a chance to blur the picture to heck, and it benefits the least common 1080p resolution?
Awesome.
Those are some pretty weak arguments.
#1.59 (Edited 1556d ago ) | Agree(2) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
sid4gamerfreak  +   1556d ago
lol i got so many disagrees yet one person has only responded to why they agree/disagree with me. If u disagree with me, why dont u tell me WHY?? Pathetic...

Lol, 576p and 720p are last gen according to pc gamers atleast....
captain-obvious  +   1556d ago
sub-HD wont mean that the game wont look good in normal / SD TV's

but it DOSE mean that it WONT look good in HD / 1080P TV's
Chris_TC  +   1556d ago
New Statement from Remedy
"I'm sorry, but for the aforementioned reasons, I cannot confirm the exact native resolution either. But, on the other hand, you can rest quite assured that the graphics quality is good. Even after so many hours of staring at the game, people I asked could just say that "it looks like 720p", even though some remember that there had been discussions whether to render in 720p or less."

http://forum.alanwake.com/s...

They can't confirm the native resolution. If it were 720p you bet they'd confirm it.
PimpHandHappy  +   1557d ago
not sure why ppl are shocked by this
MS removed the requirement that games run in HD on the 360 well over a year ago
IHateYouFanboys  +   1557d ago
lets not use that as a point to criticize microsoft on, or as a reason why there have been more sub-720p games lately though. remember, Sony never even had a minimum resolution, meaning companies were always allowed to release sub-720p gams (ala ghostbusters, tekken, gta IV, MGS4, ratchet and clank, etc).

the 720p minimum was never something that microsoft enforced anyway, since as far back as first batch of games there were sub-720p ones.
Jamie Foxx  +   1557d ago
why did remedy state recently its 720p knowing they were lying?
Doing that they just made it a bigger issue than need be in all honesty,to me still looks like a good game regardless
#3 (Edited 1557d ago ) | Agree(18) | Disagree(5) | Report | Reply
Convas  +   1557d ago
They didn't lie Jamie.
They said it ran at 720p, not Native 720p. And before any Sony Zealots say that I'm just doing damage control. THINK AGAIN. Look through my Comment history. I wasn't one of the idiots praising AW as the Second Coming.
Jinxstar  +   1557d ago
But they did lie... It's like a sales man saying "Yes this golf runs on diesel" then you buy the car and find out the one he showed you ran on diesel but the one he sold you didn't. It runs on normal fuel... I see no difference...

Alan wake looks great and it kinda makes me think though. I am curious to know how much of the DVD they took up and if maybe the lower rez added more space and if so how much? I am curious still to hear about the games length... There are too many questions that need to be answered so I feel waiting for actual breakdowns from lens of truth or digital foundry would be better then speculation. Waiting for actual reviews to hear what the game is really like instead of the 360 vs PS3 black and white sides of the coin.

As a PS3/PC fan I can say this is the first game so far that makes me consider buying a new 360. I wont because I can play it at a friends house but my point is it's impressive. Looks good but at the same time if it is lacking in certain areas like game length... we'll see...
nycredude  +   1557d ago
At best it was misleading, which should be frowned upon.
The Lazy One  +   1557d ago
the golf thing is completely ludicrous.

It would be like if the salesman sold you a golf that he said ran on diesel, and OMG IT RUNS ON DIESEL! except it only has a standard FM radio instead of a satellite radio.
Biggest  +   1557d ago
Your analogy is even further off base. Remedy said their game runs at 720p. The truth is that there is something within the game that is 720p. But the game itself doesn't run at 720p. A thing within the game is 720p. They lied.
Elven6  +   1557d ago
They didn't state it was 720p persay, they simply said some elements of the game were being rendered at that resolution. It was also the Community Manager who said that and not a developer albeit the CM is usually supposed to act on behalf of the company.

Before this ordeal, I don't think they ever said anything about the resolution publicly?
Convas  +   1557d ago
You know, at this point, I really don't care
From what I've seen in the gameplay, AW is a game that I will enjoy, and I'm still on target to purchase it. As I said before, I'm a bit disappointed that it isn't 720p Native, but ultimately, I'll have to wait and see if Remedy made a good decision with the resolution. Until then, I will bide my time, waiting excitedly for reviews and ultimately the game.

Edit: Wait, so I'm not going to enjoy Alan Wake? OH NO!!! How'd you find this out!?!?! Please tell me, I'm desperate to know!! LMAO.
#4 (Edited 1557d ago ) | Agree(8) | Disagree(11) | Report | Reply
William Gates  +   1557d ago
Only The BABOON'S
Think this game looks good
It's Sub HD !!!!
Now get over it you Silly BABOON'S
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
caffman  +   1557d ago
so you had to make a new login
and got that down to one bubble as well! You really are a twat
meatnormous  +   1557d ago
He made an account cause he was down to 1 bubble? Isn't like no one else has ever done the same.
booni3  +   1557d ago
This is getting outrageous...
so theres going to be a new article about this games resolution everyday? i'm done discussing this.
BeaArthur  +   1557d ago
Agreed, everyone needs to move on. HD, sub HD, I care how it plays not how it looks. As long as it doesn't look like an original Xbox game I don't really care all that much.
nycredude  +   1557d ago
I agree this is getting out of hand but what happened the last time a Ps3 game was sub hd (however long ago). Problem is fanboys on both sides made their bed and now have to sleep in it.
sikbeta  +   1557d ago
Ah... guys get used to this, or at least wait for the next Multiplat Game that looks slightly better on x360 and see the same thing all over again...
Nathan Drake2  +   1557d ago
splinter cell conviction-576p,metacritic 85 bots thought it will be AAA
ff 13-576p,3 discs
metro "better graphics then KZ2 LOL" 2033-metacritic 77

and now alan wake-540p

when will it end?
ChrisW  +   1556d ago
Everybody with a PC knows that things can run smoother with graphics maxed out and set at a lower resolution. I'm going to assume the same goes for consoles.

Nonetheless, you can be certain that Xbots will be disappointed if it's running at 520p and less than 30fps.

As to when it will end? Hopefully with the next-gen consoles.
HungPHAT   1557d ago | Spam
Goldsack  +   1557d ago
It will end...
..when im bathing in their green blood!!!
BrutallyBlunt  +   1557d ago
I have one question
Who does this really matter too? Meaning does it matter more to those who wanted this game or more to those who didn't want this game to begin with?

It's pretty sad how things like this get blown out of proportion for all the wrong reasons.
Mc Fadge  +   1557d ago
I seem to remember
Playstation Lifestyle doing an article highlighting how other factors can more significantly contribute to the graphics of a game. I mean sure, the numbers are interesting, but it's how it looks in the end that realy matters.
#10.1 (Edited 1557d ago ) | Agree(2) | Disagree(1) | Report | Reply
DigitalAnalog  +   1557d ago
@LevelHead
The real reason why have so many articles like this is simply because there has been too much commotion between the console powers of both systems. Unlike the previous generation there hasn't been a total unanimous decision to determine which console can put out better performance - an issue that didn't exist previously. Alan Wake is unjustified being placed in the middle of such nonsense bickering just to downplay the PS3's system.

And until the day where it's readily accepted that one console IS better than the other when it comes to tech, articles like this would continue to exist.

-End statement
#11 (Edited 1557d ago ) | Agree(4) | Disagree(2) | Report | Reply
BrutallyBlunt  +   1557d ago
Wouldn't logic dictate that a game console that came out a year later and costs more money to produce would be more capable on a technical level?

I mean you have to hand it to Microsoft to create a game console that turned Playstation fans into tekkies where they now have to magnify in-game pictures by a 1000% to see which is better. What happened to the earlier days of being a Playstation owner and just enjoying your games? Now it seems some can't seem to enjoy them as much unless they know they are better or the system is better.

Same with Xbox 360 fans who love to gloat how multiplatform games look better on the 360.

I'll buy Alan Wake for the immersion and enjoyment it hopefully provides. Yes it would be nice if is true 720p all the time but then again it would have been nice to play MAG with Killzone 2 graphics. Didn't stop me from buying it though and putting countless hours into it.

I think a lot of people have forgotten the meaning of fun and have gotten themselves wrapped up in other things too much.
#11.1 (Edited 1557d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
DigitalAnalog  +   1556d ago
Blame it all on the fanboys who started this "PS3's hardware SUCKS" mantra in 2006. If that didn't happen no doubt we would be just simply be comparing game quality instead of how much pixels the console could push.

Multi-plat devs aren't helping either, especially from Crytek.

What happened to the good-ol days when nobody complained when the Xbox had the "better" looking port than the PS2?

-End statement
theunleashed64  +   1557d ago
dame! oh well bots enjoy more sub-HD games there's plenty more from where that came and it continues with halo rehash xD
mcnablejr  +   1557d ago
yup ''ENJOY'' is the word.
funny you say that.. i sold my copy of killzone 2.
ChrisW  +   1556d ago
To quote from the article:
"...to point out that individual elements of the image operate at their own individual resolutions, but in most cases the opaque geometry usually operates at 720p. Killzone 2 has a 640x360-sized buffer for particles, but is obviously 720p: no-one claims that this game is 360p."

And it's DAMN, not DAME! A dame is a matronly woman of advanced age...
Learn proper/correct English!
#12.2 (Edited 1556d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(2) | Report | Reply
Information Minister  +   1557d ago
Damage control from a supposedly independent reviewer!? Would we have a similar article if it was Heavy Rain in Alan Wake's shoes?

Can't wait for their review of Alan Wake. No bias in the media that's for sure./s
#13 (Edited 1557d ago ) | Agree(10) | Disagree(4) | Report | Reply
Consoldtobots  +   1557d ago
I think it's hilarious.
360 fanboys and their paid media cronies slung soooo much mud and fud at the PS3 that now when the shoe is on the other foot they can't take the heat. The irony is the PS3 has picked up momentum and respect with the titles it has produced while the 360 just shows more and more cracks in it's development armor. What's that they say about throwing stones when you live in a glass house?

Ultimately that's the moral of the story, don't come into a market, much less a generation picking a fight with the big dog and then cry when it bites you in the ass.
#13.1 (Edited 1557d ago ) | Agree(8) | Disagree(1) | Report | Reply
Information Minister  +   1557d ago
What's hilarious is that I lost 2 bubbles for exposing the media's double standards.

It really angers me to think of how differently the bad ports of Bayonetta and FFXIII were treated by the media. We just had an article here, not two days ago, arguing that Bayonetta was inferior on PS3 because of the system's "inferior hardware", but FFXII on 360 was inferior because of poor compression and not the hardware. WHY THE HELL DID THEY HAVE TO COMPRESS IT IN THE FIRST PLACE?!

If Alan Wake was running at 540p exclusively on the PS3, we would get gloom and doom articles for a month. But since it's doing so exclusively on the 360, then suddenly sub-HD isn't really sub-HD and the water isn't wet anymore.

But what's really hilarious is that the users who took my bubbles are the same ones who complain about this site being crowded with PS3 fanboys. Guess that's another myth busted.
AliTheBrit19  +   1557d ago
The game looks great, and sometimes that good enough

I couldnt care less what resolution a technical assessment would show, its just a number, if the visuals are impressive its all good :)
Rashonality   1557d ago | Off topic | show
NnT3291  +   1557d ago
im still confused. If the early footage was 720p, why are new videos on VGZ lower? Remedy lower the res or the VGZ videos are low quality ?
Biggest  +   1557d ago
The early build was on the PC.
Redempteur  +   1557d ago
Another reason why the pc version should still exist
NnT3291  +   1557d ago
Well, i will still wait for the final version analysis from DF.
bjornbear  +   1557d ago
who the hell cares if its sub HD
if its an awesome game, leave it alone damn it!
DigitalAnalog  +   1557d ago
Alan Wake is innocent in this fiasco...
We all know Alan Wake is just the cannon fodder here treated like the "main" topic. The real issue here is the argument "<insert console> is superior than your system"

-End statement
xg-ei8ht  +   1557d ago
sid4gamerfreak - 0 minutes ago
PM
Track
Ignore1.10 -
half life 2 runs in 1080p while crysis runs in 720p. Hmmm, which one looks better??

Difference is, they are both HD.

And unless your running a 1080p screen, would it matter.

But that is not the point.

And please look at the pics of sirens curse, and tekken 6. They are horrid. Blurred and awful texture's, low end stuff.

If you cannot see that, case closed.

And no i'm not talking about gameplay.

Thing is, this is a major title for the 360 and the pc version was dumped. One would have expected it to be 720p.
thief   1557d ago | Spam
the-warriors  +   1557d ago
Alan wake GOTY confirm
320p or 100p who cares????

the gameplay and graphics looks better than all games for this generation!!

and im happy for that
LTC  +   1557d ago
How can it look better when its only 540p
My cr@p has higher resolution
tudors  +   1557d ago
Reminds me of.......
.

Related video
zootang  +   1557d ago
Next case!
Domer25  +   1557d ago
*sigh*
Still on this topic I see. IMO alan wake is a game that i would definitely buy if i owned an xbox. And if RDR runs at a lower rez, i don't give two sh!ts cause i'm still buying it.

Happy 4/20 everyone------------be safe.
Biggest  +   1557d ago
I know it isn't just you doing this but. . . Why are all of you people in a HD topic when you don't care about game resolution? I believe this information was reserved for the "Alan Wake will set the bar for graphics on all console" crowd. That's awesome that you are buying RDR (I am as well). No one said it made Uncharted 2 look like a PS2 game. So no it is allowed to be a great game with no gripes about the graphics. Alan Wake was supposed to look better than Jesus Christ on Easter Sunday. That is why being SD is even mentioned.
lowcarb  +   1557d ago
And nobody is saying it's not's a graphics king other than a few PS3 fanboys. Sure it's not going to be as sharp as many had hoped but looking at the videos it surely will be the best looking massive world game on console in 540p or 720 for awhile. I think the people with common sense no that if the game were linear like UC2, KZ2 or GOW3 it would of ran 720 easily but Remedy didn't cut corners to deliver there game experience to it's fullest.
Biggest  +   1557d ago
Is lowcarb saying that Alan Wake is not a linear game? I'm not sure what he is trying to say here.
hamburgerhill  +   1557d ago
They did cut corners LowCarb but ultimately did so to do what was best for the game play experience. Now as far as linear goes we can't just say one is more then another. It will be interesting to see just how big the world is and if through episodic content will it somehow evolve the game into a bigger experience each month or so. This game has potential just like any but don't you guys think we should at least play it before passing judgment?
#23.4 (Edited 1557d ago ) | Agree(1) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
thief   1557d ago | Off topic | show
A7mad-92   1557d ago | Spam
teraclusterx   1557d ago | Spam
Jdoki  +   1557d ago
Big deal what res Alan Wake runs at, it looks decent, so who cares. I'm more interested to see what the story and game play are like rather than arguing over a few pixels here and there.

But I do like the way Eurogamer have come out with a defense article so fast, especially one with so many comparisons to PS3 games - this will do nothing to help their credibility as a non-biased website.
cjflora  +   1557d ago
To everyone who claim graphics don't matter...
I think we can all agree that gameplay is the most important thing in a game. So when you say "it's the gameplay that matter", we all know that.

While graphics aren't a final determination on how good a game will be, it does reflect how hard the devs worked on it. Graphics are like the whipped cream and cherry on a sundae. If you eat a sundae like that one day, and the next day you're served just ice cream, it makes you kind of sad. How come you didn't put whipped cream and a cherry on my sundae like the other guy did? How many people would accept a movie like Avatar being released on VHS only by saying "Hey, as long as it's a good movie I don't care."

The reason we all buy a new console every generation is so that we can get more advanced games, and with most previous generations that was a graphical upgrade. Now we have other factors, like the ability to play and store media, browse the web, socializing online, but graphics are still an important upgrade otherwise we would have all just kept out SNES's and Sega Genesis's and this would be a fight over Mario or Sonic being cooler.

So, my point is that while game play is most important in a game, let's not kid ourselves that graphics don't matter. A game not having the best graphics won't keep us from playing, but in the back of our minds we notice.
darkequitus  +   1557d ago
...Blah blah blah, Alan wake looks rubbish. /S
Jdoki  +   1557d ago
I agree with some of your sentiment, but the difference here is that people are not arguing about the graphics as a whole (such as art direction, textures, lighting, how immersive the graphics make the game etc), they are arguing about the difference between 540p and 720p - which to an average, non-fanboy gamer, is of no consequence at all.

IF Remedy have had to use techniques to produce the game they want which results in dropping overall res to 540p that's fair enough. In the same way that Bungie dropped Halo 3 to sub-HD res so they could incorporate a nice lighting system. I'm not a fan of the 'kiddie' graphics of Halo - but I can appreciate what Bungie did.

If people want to complain about the res of AW then at least have the balls to admit it's not about the game it's about 360 vs PS3.
Biggest  +   1557d ago
The difference between 540p and 720p is substantial and noticeable. There is a reason for people buying HDTVs. It isn't because the like the letters H and D.

The majority of the people "discussing" this topic are here for one of two reasons. They want to defend their 360's games. Or they want to LOL at the people that decided to prematurely crown their 360's games as the best looking games ever made. I fall into the second category. I have not and will not bash Alan Wake as a game. Yes, the story seems ridiculous and the first 22 minutes of script is extremely cheesy. But I enjoyed such Oscar worthy scripts as FFVII, Heavy Rain, and Metal Gear Solid. It's safe to say that Alan Wake won't be much worse or better than those. But I will bash the silly kids that thought Alan Wake was going to usher in a new era of graphical superiority for the 360. You guys were Pachter-esque with that prediction. The same thing happened to Metro 2033 and Splinter Cell. And it was funny then as well. Jdoki, it doesn't take me showing my balls to tell you and everyone else that I do not hate Alan Wake. I am here to talk about Alan Wake and its sub-HD resolution only because I enjoy making fun of 360 fanboys that don't understand how the world works right now.
Ju  +   1557d ago
In all honesty, and this has nothing to do with AW, if they'd make the next KZ3 540p "to make it look better" (lol) I will start my own blog b!tching about it.
Jdoki  +   1557d ago
Lol @ biggest

Yeah, I'm a fanboy for pointing out that 540p isn't a big deal. It wasn't a big deal for Halo 3 and isn't a big deal here. And it hasn't been a big deal in the multitude of other sub-HD games I have played on both PS3 and 360.

I agree with you about the idiot 360 fanboys claiming AW was ushering in a new level of graphical superiority - but then I also laughed at the idiot PS3 fanboys claiming Heavy Rain was ushering in a new level of story telling and mo-cap in gaming.
cjflora  +   1556d ago
All I know is...
I will find myself wondering in games why they didn't try harder. One of the best examples is that I played the God of War III demo, and a day later downloaded the Dante's Inferno demo. While the two play similarly, after playing the God of War WIII demo it made Dante's Inferno harder to swallow. The upside is that I made sure to play the full Dante's Inferno game BEFORE God of War III was released so I wouldn't notice as much.
zaz12  +   1557d ago
multiplat games may go the sub-hd way if games like alan wake and ssc sales are high.
MastermindPS360  +   1557d ago
im glad all the ps3 fans are talking about alan wake so much...non stop...they seem very interested.
Biggest  +   1557d ago
I think they call this deflection.
« 1 2 3 »

Add comment

You need to be registered to add comments. Register here or login
Remember
New stories
30°

The Daily Five: Great Video Game Remakes

10m ago - "While gamers will always desire new and innovative game franchises, sometimes we just have to re... | Culture
10°

For Your Amusement: Kim Kardashian: Hollywood

11m ago - Colm Ahern: "Recently, the video gaming public were up in arms over Kim Kardashian’s entry into t... | iPhone
10°

The Walking Dead: Amid the Ruins Review| GamesFiends

11m ago - "Hard to care for a character that you don't know well enough or the in-game cast ignore the pass... | PC
10°

Rise of Incarnates Beta Detailed, Sign-up Launched

11m ago - Hardcore Gamer: Bandai Namco Games has today detailed the upcoming closed beta for Rise of Incarn... | PC
Ad

Start Making Games for the PS4

Now - Want to design the next generation of video games? Start learning game design today. Click for more info on how to get started. | Promoted post
30°

4 Things You Need to Know About Sherlock Holmes on PS4

11m ago - Olga from Frogware: Fictional detectives rarely go gently into the night; devotees of the long-... | PS4
Related content from friends