Cliff Bleszinski of Epic Games says that he fully supports Ubisoft's decision of removing paper manuals in their game packages.
Gaming companies are getting so greedy now they want to make little cut backs even though their profit margin is vast. I like to read my paper manual while travelling home after just buying my game. £40-45 for a game isn't cheap,I just feel gaming companies are taking the piss it maybe trivial to some but not to me
On the job training is usually enough for me.
I understand your point about the manuals, but I think that some people are so used to getting one with every new game, that, when it's not included, people obsess over it so much that it's almost as important as the game itself! Maybe they should replace the physical game manual with something that I can atually use, like free dlc or xbox live gold trials or Wait nevermind...
digital manual = cheaper game right? riiight :)
You could also look at it from the stand point of using less resources. While Im not overly environment conscious that seems to me like a good thing. But then again I also don't care about manuals so its easy for me to find a positive in this.
Some people obviously care about game manuals, however, how many games have you played recently that didn't have an in game tutorial? Its much easier to learn from example/step by step instruction than reading a manual. Game manuals have only shrunk with time. It's one thing to not include a game manual in a very complex game (rpg maybe), but another for "most" games. If you take into consideration that there are FREE game walkthroughs with all the basics covered, is there really reason for a manual? Throw in an Eco/earth friendly argument and I can't disagree with Ubisoft's decision.
Why are people debating whether or not game manuals are needed, that is not the real motivation behind this, Ubisoft are greedy a-holes, that is their only motivation behind this, if they really cared about the environment all Ubisoft employees would remove their cancerous presence from the earth by killing themselves....a boy can dream anyway.
when the manual isn't in color, and now they are taking it out completely...GAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHH HH! Well, maybe I'm not that mad, but I still like to read the manual before I play the game. Not for the tutorials, but for the other information about the game (characters, plot, enemies, etc) and now that little bit will be removed.
Paper manuals are a relic of the past. But Ubisoft's green approach is still a load of BS. whatever saves these people a couple pennies is what motivates them.
"1.1 - i pay £40 for a game,and im sorry since my snes days ive loved paper manuals Gaming companies are getting so greedy now they want to make little cut backs even though their profit margin is vast. I like to read my paper manual while travelling home after just buying my game. £40-45 for a game isn't cheap,I just feel gaming companies are taking the piss it maybe trivial to some but not to me " i wouldnt call gaming companies expecially the developers greedy if anything they need to cut cost and get more revenue for their gaming. if u need to knw how the 60 dollars came about watching this > http://www.gametrailers.com... so the removal of gaming manuals if more or less a good thing coz realistically speaking hardly anyone really looks are that manual they just learn on the fly i have played well over 300 games and i dout i have looked up to 5 maunals @evrfighter a couple of pennies... OH REALLY?.. sell 5 million copies of that game and the multiply it not so penny looking is it?
Thanks for that tid bit of information. As it would seem, today is a slow day for real news...
They need to use the manuals for more than just redundant information presentation. Make it something interesting like with what Metal Gear did. As it stands the game manuals are redundant and unnecessary. Either incorporate them into the immersion of the game, or just get rid of them.
What, so the publisher can save 10 cents? Pfft.
Removal of game manuals should also bring down the price but there's no way that's happening.
Full of tutorials not even related to the game i.e. stylus use, seizures and crap like that...
This guy is an asshole. Sorry but he is.. Instruction Manuals are a part of a video game.. & is considered as part of the overall purchase.. well for me, anyway. It's like, how you say it? ... Aha! .. The Icing on the cake. :) P.s. Also, Ubisoft are even bigger idiots for even bringing up the stupid idea in the first place. Forget about it, drop the idea! -.-
Feel exactly the same. I love reading manuals. I know most people don't but I do. I read them for almost every game except the ones that tells me nothing with a few pages. Good bathroom material also. I love MGS4's manual, LBP's manual was nice also. I remember the pokemon manuals were great but not sure about them now since I haven't bought a pokemon game in ages.
I kind of agree with 1.1. I have some weird thing about collecting stuff like that. That's why sometimes I buy the collectors editions. I just like to have it for some strange reason. Now if there supposed to be saving trees or whatever, I guess that's good. But what about all the poor graphic designers that are going to get laid off because they will no longer be needed to produce the art work, layout, and composition. If they save money by not printing them and getting rid of designers, shouldn't we pay less for the games?
This has everything to do with control...What's that, need HELP...well just fill out this on-line questionnaire...you know...E-mail address, last known address, male or female, employer, last time you went to the bathroom...EA and ubi as well as everyone else want all the info they can get on you...You can't even ask those questions for a job interview where I live...don't believe me, check out ubireg.com...EA wouldn't let you play their on-line demo without signing in first....Paper is a problem...so is game discs, plastic covers, paper inserts...Computers are some of the most toxic things in the world....Watch, soon you won't be able to play there games without signing up.....
Games these days aren't that complex anymore, it's all too piss easy to play win what ever. I still have my collectors Falcon 4.0 manual that manual is 380+ pages held with-in a binder. These days games hold your hand for just about everything. The one problem about this is, if you have no manual then how do you shows any sort of stats on items in a game or what it's meant to be used for etc.
We see they will cut box and media costs by removing manuals. Can't wait to see what they do with the games.
I think it's a good thing, and I hope more devs do it. Save some trees, and all. I personally don't need the manuals anyway.
@1.10: The fact that publishers screw the developers does not give the industry the right to in turn rape the consumers. The majority of Devs will ALWAYS be paid peanuts. They have a "game job" they're trading their $$ income potential for more rewarding work, studios and publshers know this when they set salaries it doesn't matter how big their profits are, devs will always be paid the going rate. This has NOTHING to do with them. Ubi is not a dev they are a publisher. This move is bullsh*t. $60 is almost too damn much for a game. It IS too much for many of the games I've bought. It's why the used market exists. I like paper manuals, I've been p*ssed for years that pubs keep cutting costs/quality on them and, now, they just say "F- it" but WE still pay $60? If you're a gamer, this sucks. The fact is the publishers (Ubi, EA, Activision, et al) are for the most part just like the middle men in the other media industries (movies, music, etc): They are money grubbing assh*les who will charge as much as they think the market will bear and they'll do ANYTHING to increase profit margins even by the slightest amount. They will not pass savings on to you, the developers, or the retailers, they will not use it to improve product quality, they will not use it to help the environment or to better the customer experience. They will use it increase their profit margins so they can fund their executive bonuses. This is not about being green, this will not go developers, this is not better for consumers, it WILL ever so slightly increase Ubi's revenue per unit. That's what it's all about. These guys are world class d*ckweeds, along with EA and Activision. They are what is wrong with this industry in particular and the American corporate structure in general.
One more reason to avoid Ubisoft games in the future.
Going 'green' is better, but my problem is that companies are only going 'green' if it means they can save money. In this case, they don't need to print out manuals for each game package but they're not going to give us anything extra or more due to that money being saved. Same thing with all these commercials saying that if we all went paperless with our bills, it would be enough money to feed all the homeless or whatever. Yeah, sorry, but the only thing that's happening is that the fat cats are taking home more money. If companies really want to go green, they need to do it where it matters the most and not just where they can save a few cents here and there. The funny thing is that these companies, at least in the U.S., also get tax credits/cuts for going 'green' on top of the money they save by not producing extra materials. Personally, this just tells me I'm going to have to print out on regular paper and put my needed manuals in some sort of binder or something instead of having an easily stored and accessible manual provided for me. So, I'll be wasting my own paper and saving them money. Edit: Oh, and why the heck aren't there laws in place for all the crap ad mail I get every day that I don't ask for? Want to save trees, make unsolicited mailing of that crap illegal, especially CC and loan offers. That's where tons of waste goes to nowadays considering most people throw that crap right in the garbage as soon as they get it.
The only people who would miss them are obsessive nerds. Oh, and anything that youd need to look up in this important manual would probably be alot easier to just google. Every game starts out with a tutorial and shows you the controls in the start menu. What kind of idiot needs more?
It's bad enough that games don't explain themselves when they do have manuals, but some of us like to look at the book just in case one of those "what button do I use to do this so I don't do that and waste my whatever" moments come up.
Isn't it weird that even though video games are pretty much the newest and most progressive form of media, many of you are still being very conservative, especially about this? It's an obvious, yet minor, evolution and whatever is in the manual will be incorporated into the game.
whinny little girls own a publishing company and game developing studio and give away money to complaining gamers that want free games. Create the games with the latest technology and charge $40 for it. I am sure you'll be successful. Morons You should read half the stuff you nerds type. Imagine paying salaries for 3 years with no product to show for it. Even when it's done you have to pay for marketing and packaging before a copy is sold. Let's see how long your company stays profitable
anything in a manual can be put in the actual game, so i dont get what the big deal is.
LOL game manuals cost 20-30 dollar a pop. You know the guides. Who still buys those?
God, the last couple of games I bought minus GOWIII had horrible manuals; for example: MW2.
"whinny little girls own a publishing company and game developing studio and give away money to complaining gamers that want free games. Create the games with the latest technology and charge $40 for it. I am sure you'll be successful. Morons You should read half the stuff you nerds type. Imagine paying salaries for 3 years with no product to show for it. Even when it's done you have to pay for marketing and packaging before a copy is sold. Let's see how long your company stays profitable" The publishing company pays for everything, the game dev come up with the idea and makes the product, . The Dev would get their money via royalties once they have paid the publisher back for all costs. They have tried the $40 dollar on PC games a few years back and sales did go up but the publishers said it wasn't enough so up went to price of games again. The real problem isn't what your paying to get by it's the share holders who are expecting higher returns... which means shares go up and they can say they have more pretend money in the bank. Take direct downloads there's no media what so ever, yet the product still costs $60USD and all you have is a server saying you've paid for it, if that server loses your data then you own nothing, even if you paid hundreds of dollars for said software. Steam doesn't send you any keys it only displays them so you don't even have any sort of proof to say you paid, the email receipts they send you wouldn't hold up in a court of law as they have no letter head and don't have a time or date or address of company or who served you. As for the no product, BS. There's always a product. you'd have design documents and then code bases and GFX bases to show the publisher's, that's the same deal for everyone across the board in all sectors of work.
I like manuals and i dont buy anything from ubisoft anyway. So wayne?
...it's the truth.
^ amen to that
...paper manuals these days are rather sucky. All they seem to do is remind you how to turn on your system properly, which face up to insert the disc and remind you of the controls (which i'm just assuming are things we all already know, or will find out in the course of the game). If manuals were all like, say, Metal Gear's comic-style manuals then I'd be sad to see them go. Otherwise I can't say I'm bothered.
well I haven't read a manual since pokemon yellow I think so either way I wouldn't miss them, always been more a jump into the game and learn from your mistakes person haha
Yeah paper manuals aren't what they used to be. I loved reading my paper manual for Command & Conquer back in the day but they're so crap now that I rarely look in them any more.
i like my paper manuals.
While I do to, I thought that having a manual inside the game disc would be cool. Similar to how when you download a Ps1 classic game from PSN you get the digital manuals too. Have them inside the game rather than nothing at all b/c not all games have great tutorials. I still remember the FF7 manual back in the day, that thing was huge lol.
i dont mind the story being put on cd but for control scheme i need a paper reference.
You know you can just Pause > Options > Controls and check without having to get up and find the freaking box. Think about it.
It isn't already included in every OPTIONS menu. You have to be a real retard to open the booklet to see a controller layout. Manuals are like 6 pages now. I barely keep cases anymore. They get discarded like anything else as they sit in CD Booklets. Why do I want to keep boxes of games laying around when I can place the game in a nice sleeved carrying case and place it out of the way? I bet you lil boys have the binders facing out on a bookshelf like books as if it's impressive to look at. Grow up
So we will pay the same amount of money and get even less?
Pretty much. As far as they can cut, they will. Prepare for caseless games, they will come in a paper/plastic sleeve, just like the ones Gamestop uses to sell used games as new ones without boxes. /sarcasm.
Do you remember how much games cost in the 80's? I remember shelling over 50 bucks for a cheap ass nintendo game. And don't forget $80 N64 games and $200 Neo Geo games. The fact that games really haven't increased in price in 30 years despite inflation is astounding. It's quite easy to argue that you get a hell of a lot more game now for your money than you ever have before. Let the manual go, waste of paper for the massive majority of 'em.
paper manuals should equal cheaper games then since it would save them some money for printing the booklet, but knowing the gaming industry i bet we get charged even more saying now its digital it takes more coding greedy Ba*ds
How much of a discount are you expecting because this only saves them a tiny amount of money (per game).
@ GameOn That's not entirely true. How much an hour do you think they had to pay the graphic designer to put it together? Plus the software like Quark, Photoshop, and the computers to put it together. Also the cost of printing and paper. It adds up Bud. This really applies to the games made in the US, because of the higher wage than out sourcing to some third world country. Just my thought on it.
Don't forget that this lighten up their shipments. So they are also saving on shipping.
Make a good tutorial and manuals aren't needed. Save some trees while they're at it.
I'm a biologist and I should say now that the amount of crap tree huggers can say never cease to impress me. Save some trees? You know what they use to make paper? That's harvested Eucalyptus, which is only useful to make either paper or fire. "Save" this piece of wood is not an option, since it's an alien species to anywhere but Australia. Give the allelopathic effect of Eucalyptus it should be no surprise it's already out of control in many regions around the world, replacing native plants. What's the next big idea? Let's paint baby seals so we stop the hunt for pelt and give polar bears a good meal?
Not sure where you live and why biologists make paper, but around here an awful lot of paper is made from pine trees, not eucalyptus. I see train cars full of chipped pine pulling into the paper mill every week. Pine is also used as one of the main building materials for new houses here. As far as manuals, they've been so reduced in quality over the years it probably wouldn't hurt to dump them. I like having one, but in some of my games they're little more than legal notices and credits. I even have one or two that don't even show the control scheme. I'd hate to see them go for nostalgia's sake, though.
lol, for a biologist you're pretty stupid, paper is not made solely from gum trees ( which is what produces eucalyptus ).
Actually, Eucalpytus is useful for more than paper and burning. Ever heard of essential oils? Eucalyptus oil has many beneficial properties, but I guess you wouldn't know that or else you would've mentioned it, Mr. Biologist.
Highly doubt you're a biologist if you against using less paper. Here is a dose reality for you: LESS PAPER = LESS TREES BEING CUT. There is no way around that fact and you can try spouting all bull you want, but its still not gonna help.
they grow back. My patience won't.
@ReBurn My bad, I should have made it clear as "most used wood for paper". I live in Brazil, since most native paper wood is protected here, wood have to be farmed to make paper, hence the high usage of eucalyptus, that's the same case for many paper and cellulose producer regions around the world. In north hemisphere (or any temperate region) pinus (and many other conifers) is abundant, so there is the possibility to extract some amount of native wood (saved for some reserves where there isn’t any extraction). What you are missing is that the amount permitted is not even close to the demand. Not coincidentally this region is the one with fewer forests, less farming and highest paper demand (more developed countries are on North Hemisphere). Ends up most paper and cellulose for paper is imported from big producers like Australia, Brazil, Colombia, Morocco, Portugal, South Africa, Spain, Israel, Chile (just to name some big paper and cellulose exportation markets) all of which basically farm Eucalyptus. Those manuals in question have a little chance of have being made of Pinus. As for biologists, they don't 'make' paper, but we have agronomics notions and are overall are inserted in the context of environmental crime laws, deforestation, natural resources and what not. At least in Brazil (which is aligned with UN directives) you can't cause any environmental harm legally without a proper description of the harm and projects to nullify, lower or compensate the harm, all signed by a biologist or similar professional. If there isn’t a biologist signing the project, it doesn’t even make it to the supervisory responsible. And if the supervisory responsible didn’t authorized and the firm proceed to deforest, that’s a 100 million R$ fine (a little more than 50 million US$, per day), can be multiplied to up to 3 times (still, per day), you can get arrested to up to 5 years and your firm can get closed as part of the payment if you don’t have the money. @dchalfont For someone trying to call people out you aren't that smart too. When I say Eucalyptus I'm not referring to the product of Gum trees, but to many species of Gum trees themselves, since Eucalyptus is the genus for those. And I know other woods can be used to make paper, the fact is that it isn't used to large extent. @ElementX No it isn't. Almost all Eucalyptol (the medicinal, flavoring, fragrance and repellent chem basis, which is the cineole part of Eucalyptus Oil) is made from synthetic Camphor Oil. Besides it can be extracted from leaves of many other trees (as Tea for example). Not to mention that natural Eucalyptol is toxic at a considerable small quantity if ingested. Eucalyptus is considered worldwide to be the base of pulp (paper) and charcoal industries. Any other wood is complementary is accessible in a regional basis. If I remember right, something like 80% of the Eucalyptus produced in the world is used for paper, a smaller part for firewood and to even smaller extent as ornamental tree (which particularly I consider a glorified term for introduction of species). Other uses are probably not even in industrial level. @fullmetal Cutting a tree is a bad thing? You even know why vegetation is considered RENEWABLE RESOURCE? Paper is mostly made of eucalyptus which is raised for chop crop. It's not like most paper wood comes from illegal irresponsible deforestation. It's a concern indeed (specially because of the past of the paper industry), but just so you know it's cheaper and safer (even for poor countries) to invest in farming Eucalyptus than for the population to go into the trouble of illegally cutting trees that may or may not get access to paper industry, that was the case in countries like Ethiopia and Uganda, since this practice also enjoy funding and partial tax discount from government. Have you any idea of how strong is the supervision of industrial paper production worldwide at this time anyway? @all of you guys I'm in the last college year to have a Biology degree (like only more 6~7 months), I'm not trying to play environmentalists down just for fun neither saying I'm better than anyone else here. It's not like I have not committed many of the environmentalists’ errors before. I’m also not saying “hey, let’s use more paper!” The thing is, from where I stand NOW, I got a more professional view on the entire subject... What I'm trying to point is that environmentalists keep saying stupid things missing the point of environmental problems. Want to say something smart about consuming less paper? It's sure as hell not because paper use wood, it could use electricity (ePaper anyone?) and still be a problem. If anything less paper consumption is good because paper production spawn a lot of NO2, SO2 and CO2 into atmosphere which contribute to Oceanic Acidification, Acid Rains and Global Warming... But thinking again, producing energy for us to play video games does the same thing. Anyone wants to quit? Or argue that paper wood monoculture take native forest space (although, at least around here, it have to be regularized deforestation), but so does most common agriculture activities and still the first thing environmentalists does to become “eco-friendly” is turn vegan! Environmental problems are hugely surrounded by clueless people, hypo criticism, huge economical interests and few technical capable people trying to do something useful about it. @everyone else Sorry for the wall of text.
Lets move on to digital downloads then, i dont see the point to pay for physical media either, considering its all about the games itself.
And if you have no/slow Internet? Swap/ lend/borrow games with friends? Like to trade in/sell games when you finished with them? Yeah, DD doesn't have a single disadvantage that I can see...
Not taking sides, but I bet that publishers would absolutely love to move to digital distribution if they could. They don't want you swapping games with your friends and they don't want the cost of pressing discs and buying cases. Not to mention the nefarious DRM schemes we'd be subjected to. Sure, it isn't feasible right now and I think we all understand that. But I'm willing to bet that publishers really do want it and for a lot of reasons. It has disadvantages for the consumer, but not as many for the publisher.
alot of music now is coming in slim cardboard/paper sleeves rather than plastic cases,so i only imagine games will be next in line for it
If they cut the price for the game, then i'm ok with it.
...if that 'NOBODY' N0B-HEAD says we should not have them, then so be it... (i sound like a ChavBot&ModBot!!! ;-D i.e agreeing with everything M$ lovers say!!!) ;-D
He is one of the most reknowned developers. ''(i sound like a ChavBot&ModBot!!! ;-D i.e agreeing with everything M$ lovers say!!!) ;-D'' --80% of n4g says hi.
The manuals today are so useless anyways. I remember when you would buy a game and it would come with an actual book that detailed everything.
Yeah, I remember manuals for the Civilization games or any RTS. They were huge!
Some games have interesting manuals to look at but tbh I usually look at them once I finish the game. Most games nowadays have a basic tutorial in the beggining of a game anyways.