Submitted by PLASTICA-MAN 2048d ago | news

Remedy confirms Alan Wake's resolution a composite between 720p and 540p

Remedy said today:

"Modern renderers don't work by rendering everything to a certain final on-screen resolution, but use a combination of techniques and buffers to compose the final detail-rich frames, optimizing to improve the visual experience and game performance.

Alan Wake's renderer on the Xbox360 uses about 50 different intermediate render targets in different resolutions, color depths and anti-alias settings for different purposes. These are used for example for cascaded shadow maps from sun & moon, shadow maps from flashlights, flares and street lights, z-prepass, tiled color buffers, light buffers for deferred rendering, vector blur, screen-space ambient occlusion, auto-exposure, HUD, video buffers, menus and so on. In the end all are combined to form one 720p image, with all intermediate buffer sizes selected to optimize image quality and GPU performance. All together the render targets take about 80 MB of memory, equivalent in size to over twenty 720p buffers."

Beyond3D appears to be somewhat confused as well. Most consider the opaque geometry framebuffer to be the "game resolution," which is 960x540 in the case of Alan Wake, but they do agree that there is more to Alan Wake than just that, which makes this entire situation sort of complicated... It isn't strictly 540p. But it isn't strictly 720p either. (Alan Wake, Xbox 360)

Alternative Sources
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FangBlade   2048d ago | Spam
champ21  +   2048d ago
and we thought 576p was bad enough.

next Xbox game will be 480p.
DatNJDom81   2048d ago | Off topic | show
Nathan123  +   2048d ago
Bots should be thankful that the game ditched it's open world or else it would have been rendered in SUB-SD iPhone resolution aka 320P
Mo0eY  +   2048d ago
I will enjoy this game on my Xbox 540p.

180p per year WOOT WOOT.
#2.4 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(4) | Disagree(2) | Report | Reply
Microsoft Xbox 360  +   2048d ago
Halo Reach won't be HD. LMAO.
avengers1978  +   2048d ago
game play 540, cut scenes in 720. All I can say is Buh ha ha ha.
Anon7349  +   2048d ago
"Modern renderers don't work by rendering everything to a certain final on-screen resolution, but use a combination of techniques and buffers to compose the final detail-rich frames, optimizing to improve the visual experience and game performance."

Modern Renders? Come'on guys, you guys used to be PC devs, you've already forgot what it was like to have resolutions higher than 1080p and 32x AA everywhere?

Yeah console scrubs, PCs can do that. You console scrubs are bragging about 60 extra pixels or so, while my PC can run games past 5000x5000 pixels.
AngryTypingGuy  +   2047d ago
Another case of you geeks making too big a deal of something. All I have to say is, just wait until the game comes out, and you'll see how incredible it looks :-)
coldfoot  +   2048d ago
Explanation for the layman
All games have multiple buffers for different effects and these are at different resolutions by default to be efficient. There is the main opaque geometry buffer where you have the polygons and textures, the lightmap, shadow buffer, alpha buffer for transparencies, particle buffer, etc. These are usually never the same size as each other.

The most important one is the main opaque geometry buffer since it countains the polygons and textures, and determines image and texture quality. If you choose your opaque geometry buffer too low resolution, things such as enemies far away will be smaller than one pixel and you won't be able to see them. Also the polygon edges will be rougher and will need more extensive (and expensive) anti-aliasing. Texture detail will also suffer.

What the developer said confirms MazingerDUDE and Quaz51's findings that the main opaque geometry buffer is indeed at 540p. The other effect buffers contribute much less to the overall image, for example many of Killzone 2's secondary buffers such as particle and alpha buffers are 1/4th resolution, at 360p, but you'd never notice it unless you were specifically looking for it. However the lower resolution opaque geometry buffer will have the side effect of making everything blurry, just like the PS3 version of GTA4, which was at 640p. 540p will be even worse.

You can combine a 720p HUD (text on screen, crosshair, etc.) buffer with a 540p opaque geometry buffer and end up with a 720p image that you achieved by "composing various size buffers", but that won't truly make your image 720p, just like watching DVD's on an HDTV won't make them 720p/1080p.

TL;DR: Alan Wake is 540p.
#3 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(89) | Disagree(18) | Report | Reply
FangBlade  +   2048d ago
This is pretty much confirms that the game is 540p. too bad lol.
Thanks for the clarification.
#3.1 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(76) | Disagree(22) | Report | Reply
Shaman  +   2048d ago
Why to bad?Like you are going to play it...
N4PS3G  +   2048d ago
lol lie to yourself man. The native resolution is not 540p neither is 720p

but why do i waste my time? lol It's obvious you rather take some random guy clarification instead of what Remedy really said.
#3.3 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(26) | Disagree(82) | Report | Reply
thor  +   2048d ago
I would suspect that the native resolution of the HUD is about the only thing that is 720p. What MATTERS is what resolution the polygons & textures are. That is 540p. It will LOOK like a 540p image, with all the associated LACK OF DETAIL. Lack of detail is what we are interested in, not numbers and waffle. And in Alan Wake, you will see texture and polygon detail equivalent to that of 540p.
Shaman   2048d ago | Spam
LostDjinn  +   2048d ago
I would like to say that I was in before the damage control got going...
but I guess I'm just not fast enough.

OT: Why the hell did Remedy lie about AW being a native 720p when they should of known that they'd get caught right before launch? This just doesn't make sense to me.
#3.6 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(34) | Disagree(5) | Report | Reply
cyborg6971  +   2048d ago
So after all of these years and taking away the sandbox element this is the best they could do. I was under the impression that it was easier to dev for the 360. I still wanna play this but what a disappointment. This and mw2 must be the main reasons for MS to drop the mandatory 720p standard.
Erotic Sheep  +   2048d ago
N4PS3G, quite frankly a lot of people made fun of GOW3 for being between 30 and 60 FPS and called the game 30 FPS. So, just saying, dont look too surprised when people start calling this 540p as well, but thats N4G lol..
REALgamer  +   2048d ago
It's not unusual at all
For example, both Killzone 2 and Infamous rendered certain effects at lower resolutions - namely explosions and certain particle effects. You can notice the pixelation around the effects, but thanks to some clever blurring in Killzone 2 it successfully hides it, much as I'm sure Alan Wake will.

It's just people see anything below 720p and start having panic attacks, which is why most developers won't talk about it at all.
talltony  +   2048d ago
This wont end well.
Alan wake still looks good but for the people that care about counting pixels this will not end well.
OpenGL  +   2048d ago
@ 2.3
You're right, it's 547p which is neither 540p or 720p. The talk about different buffers being different resolutions is simply being brought up to avoid the true issue at hand. Killzone 2(as many games do) on the PS3 used some lower resolution buffers for things like depth of field, but the actual render target was still 720p.

Alan Wake being sub-720p doesn't mean the game can't be good, or even great. It just means that it won't look quite as sharp as it could have. I personally am still excited about the game.
#3.11 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(27) | Disagree(8) | Report | Reply
hamoor  +   2048d ago
i love how people think that higher rez means MAGICALLY better graphics
sure it does makes a cleaner image but thats it
neither ps3 or xbox 360 are REAL hd consoles
they both have some sub-hd games like halo and mgs 4
only the pc that can do every game in 1080P and beyond that
ColdFire  +   2048d ago
" rendering everything to a certain final on-screen resolution"
They do on PC don't they?
fishd  +   2048d ago
Compared to 720P,540P means almost 50% less pixels on the screen

But at the end of the day,I think the game looks great,so yeah...no?...ok
thor  +   2048d ago
@Erotic Sheep
You haven't read what Remedy said.

It's not like Wipeout HD which ACTUALLY fluctuates resolution very occasionally.

In fact I've no idea where that word "fluctuation" in the title comes from.

What they mean is that they do various passes - let me give some examples:
Shadow maps
Volumetric lighting
3D geometry
Heads up Display

This is STANDARD for ALL GAMES. Now obviously, your shadow maps might be a different res from your particle effects and so on. But EVERY GAME DOES THIS. Nearly ALL sub-hd games have a 720p Heads up Display (since it takes very few resources to render). But what matters? It's the 3D geometry. Mountains in the distance. Alan himself. Cars, buildings and other foreground objects. In Alan Wake, those things are ALL rendered at 540p, ALWAYS - including their textures.

When we say that other games are 540p, it is a similar story. Their HUD may be 720p, they may use high-res shadow maps but the native resolution is that of the 3D geometry you can see. That's what makes the difference.
Hill_billy  +   2048d ago
Resolution be darned!
If the game plays great and is full of suspense then it's a win for me. I think the most damaging factor for Alan Wake is the hype they have been given since the game was first announced. The game looks good to me and that is what matters to me.
HolyOrangeCows  +   2048d ago
I knew it was more complicated than it was being said.
Alan Wake looks blurry, and that explains it; low geometry res.
#3.17 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(24) | Disagree(11) | Report | Reply
OpenGL  +   2048d ago
@ 2.15
Yeah, Wipeout HD's native resolution changes from 1280x1080 to 1920x1080 to maintain 60 frames per second. Alan Wake's resolution will probably be static throughout the entire game.
IdleLeeSiuLung  +   2048d ago
You know for a crowd that loves the Playstation brand, it is ironic that PS2 didn't dominate the console market because of it's graphical prowess last generation. Likewise, Crysis didn't isn't a great game because of it's heart pounding graphics! Heck, Crysis wasn't even a great game.

So why is it all of a sudden so important now? Art direction determines more of the aesthetics than resolution.
#3.19 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(11) | Disagree(24) | Report | Reply
Nihilism  +   2048d ago
HD generation y'all, i'm selling my PC, i mean it's not like the resolution i'm running now has 400% of the number of pixels that 540p is pushing....oh wait a minute...
lokiroo420  +   2048d ago
When were ps2 graphics touted as the best ever? try again idlelee, so much back peddling in this comment section. Is nobody going to say that alan wake is still the graphical beast that it was a week ago? LOL
#3.21 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(21) | Disagree(8) | Report | Reply
DatNJDom81   2048d ago | Spam
iFLOWLIKEWATER  +   2048d ago
@Real gamer...
thats why I never thought KZ2 nor Infamous looked amazing, and there is a lot more going on or should I say isn't going on with those games. But thats the norm of console games, I mean they look great for what type of power they're using. Its all trickery of the eyes. What ever is closer to the camera or screen is going to have WAY more polys and stuff further away...less. I thought this was already understood?!?!?
Noctis Aftermath  +   2048d ago
This is why you shouldn't believe community managers, wait for developers to comment themselves before you believe it(even then it's not certain).
lokiroo420   2048d ago | Spam
iFLOWLIKEWATER  +   2048d ago
If they were saying that, then they are fools just like anyone who hasn't played any game that hasn't came out yet. But I'll let you know my verdict when I play it on May 18th. I might even buy some motion capture stuff and nitpick every game in my collection and do the compare and contrasting thing, lol.
Anon1974  +   2048d ago
I'm not buying Alan Wake for it's graphics.
I'm buying Alan Wake because these types of "action thrillers" don't come around very often and it's a genre that we haven't seen enough of this gen. Frankly, I don't expect the game to have graphics as good or even close to Uncharted 2 or GOW3, and I'm fine with that. If I wanted graphics as good as Uncharted 2, I'd play Uncharted 2.
I came to the conclusion years ago that the 360 had hit it's ceiling. In 2006 Gears hit and looked awesome. I thought "Here we go. The bar has just been raised and now I can look forward to a flood of games looking as good or better."
Guess what? It didn't happen. Game after game was touted as the next big thing graphically and they all failed to deliver on the promise that Gears made, until Gears of War 2 came out setting the bar just a bit higher but again, nothing has matched it despite every second game being hyped as the next big graphical monster hit.
Well, I'm not holding my breath for that to happen anymore and haven't been for quite some time and you know why? Because the 360 is 5 years old running on older tech. It was bound to reach a ceiling with what it could do, I just didn't think it would happen so soon and there's nothing wrong with that. It's not like 360 games have suffered because of that fact.

If Alan Wake is the game that sets the new graphics bar, outstanding! If not, I'm not going to lose any sleep over it, I'm just going to enjoy the hell out of it.
Inside_out  +   2048d ago
...Alan AMAZING....
Can't wait for this title...360 keeps on delivering...PS3 fanboys reaching a feverish pitch...some are even game designers/developers now...LMAO...AW will be amazing...you PS3 guys can READ about it...
wicko  +   2048d ago
This isn't anything new, most likely every game this generation will render its effects at different resolutions from its native resolution (meaning the resolution at which the geometry is rendered). And it makes sense, if you can save some performance with nearly unnoticeable visual degredation, then you should do it, especially if it gives you more room for more important visual features. For example, have you noticed in some games the shadows are very blocky and rough? That's because the shadows are rendered at a different resolution, the developer felt that shadows were worth sacrificing (quality) for the improvement of another feature.

In Alan Wake's case, the native resolution was reduced to improve what the developers consider to be more important. Lighting and shadows seem to be a very important part of AW so perhaps they were able to improve those features with what they gained from a lower native res.
EvilBlackCat  +   2048d ago
A MISLEADING TITLE >>> Remedy confirms Alan Wake's resolution a composite between 720p and 540p <<<

Re: What is with this?
Guys, unfortunately Markus Mäki, Director of Development, has been grounded in southern Europe with family due to the volcanic ash. We are sorry you haven’t gotten an answer sooner. This is Markus’s reply to your questions.

"Modern renderers don't work by rendering everything to a certain final on-screen resolution, but use a combination of techniques and buffers to compose the final detail-rich frames, optimizing to improve the visual experience and game performance.

Alan Wake's renderer on the Xbox360 uses about 50 different intermediate render targets in different resolutions, color depths and anti-alias settings for different purposes. These are used for example for cascaded shadow maps from sun & moon, shadow maps from flashlights, flares and street lights, z-prepass, tiled color buffers, light buffers for deferred rendering, vector blur, screen-space ambient occlusion, auto-exposure, HUD, video buffers, menus and so on. In the end all are combined to form one 720p image, with all intermediate buffer sizes selected to optimize image quality and GPU performance. All together the render targets take about 80 MB of memory, equivalent in size to over twenty 720p buffers."

Ozz, posting on behalf of Markus


"In the end all are combined to form one 720p image, with all intermediate buffer sizes selected to optimize image quality and GPU performance. All together the render targets take about 80 MB of memory, equivalent in size to over twenty 720p buffers."

OMG you all loyalists are dumbed down by your xtreme fanboynism. Damn now is clear on N4G that you guys are the worst ever!
#3.30 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(5) | Disagree(6) | Report | Reply
TotalPS3Fanboy  +   2048d ago
Remedy's just trying to do damage control.
Obviously, it's 540P.

Remedy: But but but all these other buffers like the HUD...

That's like saying that if you take a 480P game and composite a 720P HUD onto it, somehow, it magically becomes 720P. In reality, it is only upscaled 720P, and not native 720P. And it will never look as good as native 720P.
#3.31 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(27) | Disagree(5) | Report | Reply
BannedForNineYears   2048d ago | Spam
archemides518  +   2048d ago
what it means even SIMPLER
game graphics are 540p

HUD is 720p
darthv72  +   2048d ago
whatever happened....
to just playing games because you liked to play games?
Chris_TC  +   2048d ago
Why do people keep saying "it looks good anyway"? Have you actually watched the gameplay footage full-screen or looked at the screenshots full-screen?

540p becomes blurry when it needs to be upscaled for a 1080p display. It's barely more than PAL SD.
boodybandit   2048d ago | Spam
Carlton Banks   2048d ago | Spam
ClownBelt   2048d ago | Spam
Christopher  +   2048d ago
Yeah, this is not good news. Essentially, if you have 20 different art assets of various size from 300p to 720p, lay them over top of each other in the appropriate order, what you end up with is a 720 sized image, but of various quality. That's why the light looks good and some textures stand out, but then that's also why we've been seeing lots of jaggies on environment elements, muddy textures, and blurring on edges when the light is overlayed.

This doesn't discount the gameplay, but it does speak ill towards what they've been saying about the graphics, and by 'they' I mean Microsoft.

@Greywulf below: ***Because this is literally the final nail in the coffin. ***

Gotta disagree. Look at the Halo: Reach screens and the recent 360 qt vid. It's possible to get some really nice graphics out of the 360. Even Red Dead Redemption looks very good on the 360, which is what's been used in many of the recent game movies on GameTrailers. And then there's Crysis 2.

Alan Wake may not win any rewards, but it's far from a nail in the coffin of what is possible on the 360.
#3.39 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(5) | Disagree(2) | Report | Reply
Greywulf  +   2048d ago
I see a ton of back pedaling from the 360/N4G community on this issue. First off, Resolution doesn't = Quality Title. EA games are 720p, as are mos...
The issue is that the 360 community has boosted Alan Wake to the level of showing off the 360's hardware. And its been the sole title that was/will do so. They removed the sandbox, the game is soft, and now its below MGS4's native resolution. When will the hype about its graphics stop, or the 360's hardware? Because this is literally the final nail in the coffin.

No one is saying Graphics is more important than gameplay. No. Once again, no. Stp.

The argument was made that the title will have better visuals than the top titles today, every single one of them mind you. Killzone2, Uncharted2, MGS4, everything.

With that argument out there, you have to back this up. Like Naughty Dog, or Santa Monica studios has done. Remedy hasn't done this, just as no 360 developer first or third has managed to do this & release a retail title. Now people are pointing fingers at the PS3 community trying to ignore the simple fact that none of this would even be here if it wasn't claimed in the first place? You can pretend its not, and

I can point to several articles claiming Alan Wakes graphical powerhouse abilities, based on flashlights in the dark, but even if it was. Its rendering at a sub MGS4 resolution. And even then, MGS4 ran cut-scenes with its game assets, not high resolution models. It did all of its effects realtime.

This is why the news of this game being below 600p was big news. Because its yet another case of a 360 title that can't compete with todays leading engines. Sure, MGS4 was some sort of 700p. Uncharted2 wasn't, neither was Killzone2. Which are all the current targets of next-gen hopefulls. These all stream load as well, not hide loading behind cut-scenes. Crytek isn't claiming their engine will top 360 exclusives as well.

You have people still trying to defend it claiming PSN or Retail titles switch from multiple forms of greater than 720p native resolutions. Yet, still not getting the fact that its greater than the 360's best efforts today.

There is this blame on the PS3/N4g community with the hate behind this. As if its just fanboy rage. Its not. Its just a case of told-you-so. And no one wants to hear it. Which is fine, but why does the community continue to do this? Every single title on the 360 is hyped to be a visual & technical masterpiece, then when it falls short, off to the next title. Just in the past few months we had to go over Splinter Cell, Metro2033, and now Alan Wake.

All great looking titles, but it takes more than that to be claimed as some technical masterpiece. Running a good looking game in subhd isn't raising the bar at all, its not remarkable. If thats the case, then why do PC/PS3/all other media strive for the current HD bar? Why is it that yet again, 360 gaming needs to redefine definitions of quality and the status-quo to support the 360's console life? High resolution in gaming has always been the target. Yet, like the word "exclusive", resolution importance is trying to be changed to no longer being important? Just like storage space was always the bigger-better deal, but nope. Not in 2010!

At the end of the day, resolution doesn't matter for a games enjoyment.

But no one was claiming Alan Wake wouldn't be enjoyable.

not for one second.
#3.40 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(22) | Disagree(10) | Report | Reply
Consoldtobots  +   2048d ago
guess this makes the fanboys here look pretty silly and DESPERATE for taking the word of a community manager over someone with a long reputation for getting these calls right. Then again I and many others DID WARN YOU in that thread that this would be the end result.

360 fanboys are wayyyyyyy too predictable and gullible.
y0haN  +   2048d ago
PS3's GTA 4 is 720p, confirmed by a R* dev. Video buffer output taken from both consoles before post-processing = 1280x720. You can't really tell a difference!


Just sayin'.
Oner  +   2048d ago
@ coldfoot & Greywulf ~

Absolutely great posts, comments and information. Agree + Bubbles.
#3.43 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(6) | Disagree(7) | Report | Reply
Shadow Flare   2048d ago | Spam
MNicholas  +   2048d ago
The text is 720P
The graphics are 540P.

Quaz51 didn't lie. Never has.

Images don't lie either.

-Sharp text and HUD
-Blurry graphics


It's not all bad. Water looks nice:


Overall lighting is nice:


Some really nice settings:


Remedy is finally starting to come clean but they're trying to muddy the water by using big words that regular gamers don't understand.

All this talk about "composite" resolution is just spin. Multiple render targets of varying resolution is pretty much standard practice.
#3.45 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(17) | Disagree(6) | Report | Reply
ClownBelt   2048d ago | Spam
LostDjinn  +   2048d ago
I'm sorry Greywolf.
That's complete BS.
MGS4 employs interlacing. So that's 1024x768 multiplied by two (1572864 pixels) to provide a 1080 res. Interlacing fills scan lines in two sweeps to fill the image. While the image is not 1920x1080 (2073600 pixels) it's still a lot better for definition than 720p (1280x720 is 921600 pixels) though 720p provides less noise and a smoother line. That said, lcd's are progressive in nature so the entire image gets de-interlaced anyway. This is why MGS4 show up as 1080p if you have an lcd that goes that high.

Before you explode with mirth let me also say that 1080i was touted as being the maximum native resolution for the 360 when it launched. So it's not like the 360 can't technically do it.
#3.47 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(11) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
xTruthx  +   2048d ago
For the people saying y some care so much about graphics. Well its because there was a lot of comments before about how amazing the game was going to look. It looks good theres no denying that but it doesn't look like many hoped for. ANYWAYS, this wont stop anyone from enjoying the game if its good. The reviews probably wont come after the game is released, just to save people from spoilers, I can be wrong but they should do that, We all say what happened with HR, SC & many others.
u got owned  +   2048d ago
And this is the reason why the xbox 360 needs BR disk.
ThanatosDMC  +   2048d ago
Did Natsu and Cold commit suicide when they read this? Those two defended that AW was 720p native yesterday so adamantly. Wonder how disappointed they are... oh well.
WildArmed  +   2048d ago
I was just talking about this.
When all the fanboys got all riled up yesterday.

Ofcourse it's not running natively @ 720p.

90% of the games released this gen dont run at that
pixelsword  +   2048d ago
@ ThanatosDMC;
One can only hope.

I'm just kidding.

I wish them well.
#3.52 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(1) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
wpggamer  +   2048d ago
You got all that from that little snippet of information? Either you are able to read between all the lines, or your poop shoot is flapping about a whole hell of a lot.
Sorry to say, but i'm leaning toward the latter. You kids just don't really know. But this is N4G, so I guess it must be true.
tplarkin7  +   2048d ago
I hope there's a good reason for 540p. It's a tough call between great special effects vs framerate/resolution. The frustrating part is that powerful hardware doesn't translate into solid framerates/resolutions.

Framerates and resolutions are fundamental requirements for the eye. Blurry and choppy images ruin the experience.
vhero  +   2047d ago
We all knew it would be native 540p with either buffers or up-scaling anyways but honestly like I always said if you don't buy a game because of resolution you don't deserve to play great games anyway either on PS3 or XBOX 360. I just wish people would stop going on about Alan Wake now until launch already..
MACADOODLE  +   2047d ago
The funny thing to me is 95% of the post above me the posters have absolutly no idea what they are talking about.
sid4gamerfreak  +   2047d ago
lol i knew this would get a lot of degrees...

To PC gamers: Lets sit down eat popcorn and see who wins the fight whether it is 540p or 720p. (LOL)

I bet on the ps3 fanboys...
mythamp  +   2047d ago
"Alan will KILL uncharted 2 graphics, just watch!!!!"
Ohh its only 547p, damn, there will be poor textures, i have to change to defense mode. Next-Gen - HD era, 3D is on its way, damn, moving to last resort...
"Bu Buh But its the GAMEPLAY which matters you pathetic PS3 owners, gameplay is da KEY!"

As if UC2/KillZone2/GOW3/HeavyRain/L BP/MGS4/ didnt have good "gameplay"
washingmachine  +   2048d ago
WTF,fluctuate.ROFL makes me wonder if any games on 360 are real 720p lol
Shaman  +   2048d ago
You would be surprised to see that ps3 has more sub hd games than 360 and it was touted to be REAL HD system,funny isnt it?
SPACEBALL 1  +   2048d ago
most bluray movies arent even full hd, and no one can tell the difference. these arguments are stupid...
#4.2 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(9) | Disagree(28) | Report | Reply
Dance  +   2048d ago
xbox 360 isnt the one with that problem

OpenGL  +   2048d ago
This is just silly; there are plenty of games on both the PS3 and 360 that are native 720p. Really though, up until recently there were quite a few multi-platform games that actually ran in a sub-720p resolution on the PS3 while they were 720p on the 360.
#4.4 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(7) | Disagree(14) | Report | Reply
theEnemy  +   2048d ago
so much for
"Confirmed 720p".
HolyOrangeCows  +   2048d ago
It's easy to list a bunch of trashy games and try to use it as basis of the console's power.
#4.6 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(9) | Disagree(4) | Report | Reply
thewhoopimen  +   2048d ago
i think what's being thrown around
I think what's being argued in the end isn't that multiplat games showcase sub-HD resolutions but rather that a console 1ST party exclusive shouldn't.

You guys can josh and manipulate the argument all you want all day about this or that game on the ps3 or 360 having sub-HD resolution. But at the end of the day, Remedy, Bungie, etc, all considered FIRST PARTY studios have released sub-HD titles. None of Sony's 1st party have this syndrome. And considering that even MGS4 (released in 2008) ridiculed for its 1024 x 768 has a higher resolution...

That's the bottom line and this should quantitatively end any arguments of which console having more horsepower.
#4.7 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(12) | Disagree(4) | Report | Reply
Pennywise  +   2048d ago
These guys are all delusional as usual.(I'm really not a poet)

For graphics to improve on PC tech that is 5 years old, something has to be sacrificed. It's obvious that the sacrifice these developers have to make is to the resolution of the game.

You can keep blaming devs all you want, Dance. I think its pretty obvious the 360's tech is aging poorly. I have said it before, and I will say it again: My old PC parts were used to make the 360... my old PC had to be upgraded to keep up with graphics... why would the 360 be immune to this?
DatNJDom81  +   2048d ago
"You would be surprised to see that ps3 has more sub hd games than 360 and it was touted to be REAL HD system,funny isnt it?"

I wouldn't doubt that at all. We all know Sony suffered (and still does) from what is known as "Lazy Developer Syndrome." I admit at the beginning I questioned the PS3 power claims. All the multiplats I had were a little worse on the PS3. That is until Uncharted, Heaven Sword, Resistance, Ratchet and Clank: TOD, and of course the almighty Metal Gear Solid 4. Then I saw the reality of the situation.
IHateYouFanboys  +   2048d ago
remember how Sony said that the PS3 would be able to output DUAL 1080p displays, and run all games at 200fps in 1080p?

if theres ever been a company telling lies about how powerful their console is, its sony - not microsoft.
IdleLeeSiuLung  +   2048d ago

I think they all are liars, because some schmock will say something... that is why blind fanboyism is so bad for the industry.
vhero  +   2047d ago
@shamen your wrong in fact PS3 has the most 720p exclusives of the 2 machines look at the link another user provided above even uncharted 2 is 720p and thats more graphically intense than Alan Wake. Look nothing against the 360 its a great machine but MS took a gamble with it to release it cheaper and earlier than PS3 they had to cut costs on hardware and games are suffering later in it's life for it but only slightly.
The end of the day though you can get a console for £100 cheaper with extremely good graphics so you can't grumble too much. If you want slightly better graphics you pay the extra.. It's like with graphics cards with PCs you pay extra for a better graphics card don't you??
OpiZA  +   2048d ago
Makes sense, I'm sure all console games use multiple renderers. Very interesting, there is just so much about making games that we don't know about. Even though many of us claim to
iFLOWLIKEWATER  +   2048d ago
I thought it was obvious, but fanboys will stand by their favorites. I got a few articles for the major fanboy side on n4g that will get me 1000 disagrees, lol.
Michael-Jackson  +   2048d ago
540p? and I thought 576p was bad...

blackmamba707  +   2048d ago
Flopbox hits new low
540p...just wow

and I find it amusing especially when you link it to AMAZING new Flashlight Simulator screens emerge news :]
ELite_Ghost  +   2048d ago
Last gen was 480i
360 gen is 540p, what do we have like 60 more pixels? LOL
Hidden Star  +   2048d ago
I don't really care about resolution tbh. Aslon as the game runs smoothly and nicely and looks good - then i'm set.
AliTheBrit19  +   2048d ago
Lol here we go, watch people make a big deal out of it.

Despite the resolution number, the game will still look amazing and thats what matters - All games have flactuating resolutions.
AliTheBrit19  +   2048d ago
LMFAO 10 disagrees already, blimey I'm Mr. popular with the PS3 fans huh?
buying1999   2048d ago | Spam
keyserhitman  +   2048d ago
yh it looks amazing for 540p?
or 576p..lol

cutscenes in, upscaled 720p?

garanteed that on the back of the box it will say

720p 1080i 1080p

lol what a joke!
#8.3 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(13) | Disagree(1) | Report | Reply
AliTheBrit19  +   2048d ago

Come on fanbrats! you can do better than that!
Microsoft Xbox 360  +   2048d ago
The fact that Uncharted 2, GoW3, and the year old Killzone 2 can run at NATIVE res and still be called the graphic kings, says a lot about the PS3. The 360 has to shamefully downgrade its res to even compete with the PS3.

PS3 graphically superior is now a proven fact.
#8.5 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(11) | Disagree(2) | Report | Reply
karan8624  +   2048d ago
He just comes here to create a mess and tick people off

Either ignore him or Ali, stop being a douche
Erotic Sheep  +   2048d ago
This wont end well >.>
Dance  +   2048d ago
Can you not read?
fishd  +   2048d ago
Everyone grab your swords and shields...we are going to WAAAAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRR!!!11
BeaArthur  +   2048d ago
We need to stop approving crap like this. They are as bad as the console war articles. They are posted specifically for the immature audience that uses this website in order to fuel the flame war.
Dance  +   2048d ago
Article is fine,its just the trolls cant read

Beyond3D appears to be somewhat confused as well. Most consider the opaque geometry framebuffer to be the "game resolution," which is 960x540 in the case of Alan Wake, but they do agree that there is more to Alan Wake than just that, which makes this entire situation sort of complicated... It isn't strictly 540p. But it isn't strictly 720p either.
#12.1 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(4) | Disagree(7) | Report | Reply
lokiroo420  +   2048d ago
So explain how finding that "the graphical masterpiece" isnt running in HD is fueling the fanboy war? I would classify this as an actual news piece, kind of rare actually.
BeaArthur  +   2048d ago
lokiroo420...of course you would classify this as an actual news piece since you don't own a 360 (somehow I don't think that is a coincidence). I bet it wouldn't be news worthy if the situation was reversed and this was about a PS3 game. Maybe it is news worthy but that is not the reason it was posted and we both know it.
lokiroo420  +   2048d ago
LMAO, wow, the 360 owners are really getting sensitive, when they find the truth about the masterpiece. No matter how bad it makes you feel, no matter how much you cry about this game, no matter what you think the intentions of the submittal are, this is REAL NEWS GET OVER IT. AND WHERE WERE YOU WHEN THE GAME WAS TOUTED AS THE BEST GRAPHICS EVER SEEN? THAT IS THE FANBOY ARGUMENT, "BESTEST GRAFIX EVAR!!!"
#12.4 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(17) | Disagree(10) | Report | Reply
BeaArthur  +   2048d ago
lokiroo420...I'm not even sure what you are trying to say but I haven't even been slightly interested in this title until about 2 months ago when I saw some gameplay footage. Personally I don't care how it looks as long as it doesn't look bad. Gameplay will always trump graphics. If you are so concerned about grahpics and how things look maybe you should stick to movies and leave the gaming to the rest of us. I don't know how this game is going to look or play when it is finally released so right now I am just waiting. Oh and I'm not sensitive, I don't actually really care because I play what I want to play; I'm just tired of watching people like you immaturely troll articles.
Dacapn  +   2048d ago
As for what resolution it runs at, 90% of the people who buy this game will not know or care what resolution it is. The argument here is basically against the 360 fanboys who hyped this game to the absolute maximum. Most games don't live up to expectations so stop hyping them and just be pleasantly surprised when they're released, or else you looking like a backtracking fool.
Goldsack   2048d ago | Spam
jjesso1993  +   2048d ago
this grpahics talked starting to drive me crazy we known for long time 360 is not able to do some of things remedy promiced 30fps 720p 4xaa thats what they said but it was never going happen i think that the people who really care about this should just go out buy ps3 or pc if not shut up this game looks like its got good gameplay good story so what if its not the best look console game to date you would fool to think the 360 is able to claim a title like that.
iFLOWLIKEWATER  +   2048d ago
For graphics just get a pc because if this news hurts people feelings then another console won't be helping their needs.
Foxgod  +   2048d ago
Pretty impressive work they delivered to crank out 720 using so many different render targets.
You can tell from this article they really took their time to optimize the graphics.
#15 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(7) | Disagree(18) | Report | Reply
Erotic Sheep  +   2048d ago
After your idiotic comment of saying Gears 2 looks better than Uncharted 2 it's EXTREMELY hard to take your words serious. But sadly I still agree with you, because no matter what resolution this game is, it still looks good and will make me buy a 360 for it.
MexicanAppleThief  +   2048d ago
Holy sh!t, did Foxgod really say that GeOW 2 was graphically better than U2?
Tito08  +   2048d ago
Not only that
But Foxgod also said there are more RPGs than shooters on the 360, the dumbest thing he ever said!!!!
Dutch Boogie   2048d ago | Off topic | show
Imalwaysright  +   2048d ago
Why do people care so much about the resolution of games? Does anyone really chooses wich game they should buy based on its native resolution?
Games4M - Rob  +   2048d ago
Simple - They care because its indicative of a consoles power.

People like to defend their console of choice, whichever console can output the best graphics is one factor in the debate over which is the best console.
Parapraxis  +   2048d ago
So the text is legible and doesn't look like a complete mess on a large 1080p HDTV maybe. ;)
Chris_TC  +   2048d ago
I don't buy DVDs anymore solely because the resolution is awful and they look blurry on a big screen.

And I don't remember the last time I've played a game at less than 720p. I don't do consoles btw, so most of the time I go 1080p.
ThanatosDMC  +   2048d ago
Gamers want their games to look their absolute best when they play it.
zeddy  +   2048d ago
there could be one instance where there is 720p but they would smack it on the box anyway.
NotoriousWarrior  +   2048d ago
lol 360 fans seems to allow MS play with them, I mean 540p games in 2010 when 3D is becoming available is sad.

Keep saying to yourselves that such resolutions are alright and soon you won't see a game hitting 720p pathetic. It's sad how fanboyism is holding back technology and then they come out and say that competition is a good thing. you want Sony to compete with such quality we wouldn't be seeing games like GOW3, UC2 and KZ2.

Why don't you all email MS and say thank you for making "Next Gen" games 540p.
Dance  +   2048d ago
Its misinformed trolls such as yourself holding back gaming for everyone
Strikepackage Bravo  +   2048d ago
Now your just babbling, you really need to be in the other zone >>>

Its pretty clear you are just one massive fanboy.
cyborg6971   2048d ago | Spam
i3eyond the Circle  +   2048d ago
ratchet and clank says hi

so does mgs4 and its online.

so does resistance 2s multiplayer
Dutch Boogie  +   2048d ago
Umm ok why did my first comment get deleted? Why is it that 360 games lately have been coming up short in the resolution department? Don't get me wrong i know the game will be great but how come the competitions console can keep a constant native resolution but the 360 fails at that?

This is becoming a trend that i'm afraid i don't want to get used to.
#20 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(14) | Disagree(6) | Report | Reply
Strikepackage Bravo  +   2048d ago
from the way it sounds all modern games are rendered this way, with layers of different resolutions combined to make one or some crap, I have no idea exactly what he was talking about LOL. All I know is the game looks great, they did something right.

As for PS3 games, a Sony dev would NEVER tell you if they were using these techniques, Sony is far more hush hush on how they do things,(mostly because they have an agenda) but most likely, like he said ALL modern games are doing it this way.
cyborg6971  +   2048d ago
And what agenda does Sony have stikefarce?
Consoldtobots  +   2048d ago
the answer is simple

back when the Ps3 first came out and I was part of many tech convos about the capabilities of the PPE and SPUs once people learned how to use them properly. It was surmised that given the 6 available SPUs and their 128bit vector cores the PS3 would reach the point where it would be a graphical monster mainly by it's insane ability to crunch through terflops of floating point calculations and thus aid the RSX in MASSIVE TEXTURE PROCESSING AND MAPPING OPERATIONS. Thus PS3 graphics keep improving by generational bounds while still maintaining HD resolution.

The scary part is I think most devs have only learned about 40% of the Cell + RSX rendering architecture. This means that when fully developed and mature engine pipelines come about we will see 1920x1080@120hz without breaking a sweat.
Goldsack   2048d ago | Spam
Basil-Rathboner  +   2048d ago
To get the best visuals for Alan Wake on xbox 360.

Please use an Etch a Sketch.
PLAYstar  +   2048d ago
It looks like coming to a trend whereby the lower the resolution gets the better visual the 360 would display. Says the developer and game journalist for claiming it to be so..

booni3  +   2048d ago
I knew that AW wouldnt have constant 720 resolution. I KNEW THAT NO GAME WOULD HAVE A CONSTANT RESOLUTION AT OR ABOVE 720. It is impossible on current hardware, or the process has not been engineered yet. Framerates drop and jump, textures vary almost continuously, and most people cannot tell the diffrence between something 720 and 1080. I'll bet it would be found a fact that most people cant tell the touted diffrence in 520 to 720 when they've been upscaled. Nothing is natively 720 CONSTANTLY, its all upscaled on an HD set. In spite of this however, people take these feeble and truly unimportant numbers, most of which the average fanboy doesnt even understand, and use them to badger and belittle a game. its nonsensical, unfair to developers and supports the idea that if high resolution is your main concern, you should just watch HD programming and movies since you wont have to deal with any...oh, what was that again...oh yea, gameplay. so you wont have to deal with any of that, yuck.
#24 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(5) | Disagree(8) | Report | Reply
Strikepackage Bravo  +   2048d ago
No surprise
it took a 360 dev to explain this. PS3 devs have to push the lie that all PS3 games run at 1080p 120fps all the time LOL.
thor  +   2048d ago
No, you're wrong; if you read what Remedy said you'll see that Alan Wake doesn't vary its resolution - it's always sub-HD.

And there are PLENTY of games that have a native resolution of 720p. You seem confused and keep saying "CONSTANTLY" when in reality, 99.99% of games don't ever vary their framerate, not even Alan Wake.
Valkyre   2048d ago | Spam
thewhoopimen  +   2048d ago
Where did you come up with that delusional crap? You think people in digital foundry or beyond3D don't analyze multiple frames to determine resolution?

How do you think they caught WipeoutHD fluctuating between 1280 x 1080 - 1980 x 1080? You fanboys will try to make up BS just to feel better.

There is nothing in that forum posting by Remedy that says frames are constantly fluctuating between 540p -720p. It says that the composition of the final frame is a composite of different resolutions materials. However, in the end it is the output frame we are looking at and that is 960 x 540~7p. Unfortunately that resolution doesn't fluctuate over any number of given frames.
#24.4 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(3) | Disagree(1) | Report | Reply
The Wood  +   2048d ago
'PS3 devs have to push the lie that all PS3 games run at 1080p 120fps all the time LOL. '
do u knowingly make urself look as stupid as the people u criticise.....show me that article and ill make some sense of it for ya *sigh* I remember some company pr guy talking about a 'sweet spot'....guess some of ya didnt see that.

Anyway the res wont decide whether this game is great or not but from a technical standpoint its not quite up there in some aspects....see its simple. I saw a load of people beating their chests in the 720 CONFIRMED article and the gave as good as they got but it seems they now have to take it again. I wont bother Ill just say that the ps3 with the help of terrific devs have pushed the console more than MS's devs have this gen. IF the 360 is SOOOO easy to dev for and dvd<9 isnt an issue WTF are all the masterpieces????

In defence of the console thats 'so easy to dev' for, if devs like naughty dog, santa M, GG, MM were to work exclusively for the 360 im sure we'd see a higher amount of better games from a technical standpoint......

Ill finally like to state that we ALL love technical excellence when it comes to gaming in the HD era. Too many hypocrites on n4g especially some of those that were here when Gears 1 and bioshock were the graphical kings...yeah, that long ago, but now its all about gameplay and teh salez....lol Exclusives define consoles, the technical excellence of those exclusives is a fair gauge of its power more so than sales.
Consoldtobots   2048d ago | Spam
Tito08  +   2048d ago
@ thewhoopimen
Digital foundry and B3D are useless dude!!!!!
What Would Kratos Do  +   2048d ago
This is getting a bit tedious.

I'm old enough to remember when games were judged on how fun they were.

When I had my ZX48k my imagination combined with my nostalgiavision made all my games 1080P at 60FPS. i.e I don't remember the resolution, I only remember the fun.
lokiroo420  +   2048d ago
The argument was bestest grafix evar for alan wake, this kind of gives that argument a blow to the side of the head.

@ below

I wasnt on the side saying best graphics ever, just so you know. Hell I wasnt on either side, its just fun to see those going back on what they said.
#25.1 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(7) | Disagree(6) | Report | Reply
thor  +   2048d ago
Yeah but your argument means, "OK guys, I admit, Alan Wake doesn't have the best graphics and it IS sub-HD." Which means, you just lost the graphics argument. Whether it matters to you or not is another issue - but it matters to some people. If it doesn't matter to you, why are you reading this article and writing a comment?
Ju  +   2048d ago
You know, I think everybody can agree that AW looks great, I would even say phenomenal.

But like other - mainly PS3 games - have bee criticized that hype will destroy the games, AW was hyped as the end it all for graphics discussions.

Well, and I think it does. In favor for the PS3 now. It's that hype which made it to what it is.

It's a pity. Market the game for what it is. And be honest about it. Why is that not possible anymore these days ?
AKS  +   2048d ago
720p to 540p looks fantastic if you watch it from a "comfy couch."


Yes, I'm still bitter the PC version was cancelled so close to release.

But in all seriousness, it's not necessarily a huge deal if the game is a bit below 720p or whatever resolution standard. I actually thought GTA IV looked better on PS3, as did the majority of people before the pixel counters showed that it ran at different native res. Then everyone else suddenly said they could tell all along that the 360 version looked MUCH better. LOL. You're best served viewing it on your screen and seeing how it looks for yourself. I know from tinkering around to find the optimal settings on my PC for games like Crysis that just the resolution or whatever individual setting doesn't automatically make it look or run the best. Remedy found that this setup worked the best; I'm curious to see how it turned out. The game looked pretty good in the trailers, although you'll find in my previous comments that I certainly did not agree that it was far and away the best looking console game. I always need to see the game running in my own home theater setup before I decide what I think about it.
Goldsack   2048d ago | Spam
mcnablejr  +   2048d ago
pixel counters can have their fun.
while enjoy GOOD games on my 360 and my ps3 stays dusty ;);););)

@ below.. ha! my ps3 isn't good ;)
#28 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(3) | Disagree(34) | Report | Reply
cyborg6971  +   2048d ago
Yeah right like your trailer has enough room to hold a 360 and a ps3. Might I suggest upgrading to a double wide. Dbag.
cyborg6971  +   2048d ago
Mc I don't know what games you like to play but surely you could find one to dust off your ps3 for. At least your not as annoying as the other trolls.
mcnablejr  +   2048d ago
Tony Montana  +   2048d ago
I just don't get it
WHY the hell would someone be so happy and jump with joy when dust is covering their console that they spent their hard earned money on?
are you a retard?
rezzah  +   2048d ago
Your pretty stupid to have a sysem laying around if your not gona use it. Go sell it and buy another 360, isnt two better than one?
mcnablejr  +   2048d ago
ive said this before.
i use it for blu ray movies occasionally, mabye the occasional muck about on mgs4, (usually offline because of the horrible stacked up updates). Things get dusty when you dont give em a clean every now and then. Im just telling you the truth...Anyway it looks cool amongst my setup.

Dont cry about it. ;)
#28.6 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(1) | Disagree(5) | Report | Reply
Tito08  +   2048d ago
@ mcnablejr
"i use it for blu ray movies occasionally" That tells me you don't have a PS3, so please don't LIE!!!!
Sky Sentry  +   2047d ago
Dusty console does not means lack of use. In fact it is the opposite since having power on will attract more dust. I play my PS3 often and it is very dusty since I also has less time to clean it up! Maybe you use your PS3 more than you think?
Zero 007  +   2048d ago
i feel so sad for Fools here !!!! Remedy says 720p , read full comments than talk --&gt; fools
myabe foools forgt about GTAIV

X360 version runs on 720p
PS3 version runs on 540p looooooool
the-warriors  +   2048d ago
Maybe fools cant understande english...yaa i know. my english is bad but ill understand wats Remedy said on forum comments more than all here loooo...
grow up Kids

cyborg6971  +   2048d ago
@ zero
Yeah but this is exclusive to the 360 and how longhas it been in development? Nice try douche. And it's nice to see you with one bubble.
#29.2 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(12) | Disagree(4) | Report | Reply
the-warriors  +   2048d ago
^^^ all PS3 exclusive runs on 720p but only one game (Haze) running on 540p loooool

Blurry NOT for use anymore
#29.3 (Edited 2048d ago ) | Agree(6) | Disagree(7) | Report | Reply
InFAMOUS1  +   2048d ago
you should only feel sorry for yourself because you delusional... IN GAME will run at 540p will the PRERENDERED yes P-R-E-R-E-N-D-E-R-E-D cut scenes will be 720p... If you were more then a 14yr old who only started gaming this gen, you might actually have a clue as to what you're talking about!
CrapStation 3   2048d ago | Spam
Tito08  +   2048d ago
@ CrapStation 3
I'm changing your name to Crapbox360, I hate when assholes like you say "it's better than all PS3 games" 1-It's not a Racing game 2-It's not a fighting game 3- Not a sports game.... Have you ever played the game???? No, right??? so don't come with stupid conclusions because it's a new IP & better wait for the game to be released, buy and then play it, then say all the trash you want, loser!!!!!
InfiniteRetro   2048d ago | Spam
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