Analysis: Microsoft have made an outstanding success of this generation of game consoles. However some of the things they have been saying recently are very worrying indeed. Are they starting to lose their way?
3D in the home is something that microsoft isn't in a position to pioneer like Sony. There's no need for a new console yet, as the current gen consoles still have a ways to go before genuinely being maxed out, and Apple isn't going to try to jump into a crowded gaming market when they don't have any developer or publisher support. None of the third parties wants to learn how to develop games for a whole new system right now.
Sonys 3d tech is worse and have more limitations then Samsungs and other companies. Samsungs C9000 can convert any 360 game to 3D without glasses. Sony’s 3d tv's still needs a glases. So MS no need to worry. They will have 3d on 360 and next xbox with ease. Sony went a wrong way with their 3d. 3D without glasses is a future. Next xbox is in a final design stage and it is a beast. AMD&Microsoft&parthers are cooking a surprise for Sony for allready about 4 years. Sony can go bankrupt to cath them. next xbox will be in 2011 with backward and forward compability.
Every report I've read on Samsung's tech states that it requires specifically designed images and that it's very painful to watch, so no, it won't make any Xbox game 3D, and if it could make any xbox game 3d, it could do the same thing for any Playstation game. I don't mind the glasses, especially if they're comfortable and fashionable. And what Samsung can do has nothing to do with what Microsoft can do. I was saying that it doesn't make sense for MS to invest in the tech, but it does make sense for Sony to do so. Why? because they are different companies in different industries. Sony is involved in every aspect of 3D because they not only make projectors, TV's and Game systems, they actually own movie, game and television studios. Sony has no choice but to invest in this type of technology. Why wold MS invest in developing a technology that they don't need to utilize until other companies have implemented it? MS has said a million times they don't intend to rush the next generation. What you can't seem to understand is that I'm not dissing MS, I'm actually defending them because this article claims that those are strange statements when in fact they make perfect sense. You're such an Xbot you can't even see when someone is on your side. How retarded are you exactly?
" Sony can go bankrupt " lol good luck with that
Sensible and intelligent commentary there from exnihilonihilfit on an article that seems to lack a full understanding of both MS and Sony Business models. I think Bruce is being a little short sighted with his comments in this particular article. @iMad – I think exnihilonihilfit clearly highlighted that finishing school is your first priority rather than giving extreme views on subject matters you have no real understanding of. exnihilonihilfit – Bubble+
"Sony can go bankrupt"? What, from the PS4?! LMFAO! You know nothing about businesses then. There is more chance of Microsoft going bankrupt because 90% of the business in 3 products: Windows, Office Suite and ermmm... oh yeah, support for those two!!! Sony's business are far more widespread to withstand a downturn! It takes one rival, who can run Windows designed programs for free without the need of an emunlator, to destroy Microsoft. Fanboys of the 360 are blind to this reality! Sony don't sell TVs... no matter, they get their fingers in much wider ranging products. Don't sell PS4's so what... samething. Microsoft don't sell Windows... crash! Microsoft don't sell Office... crash!
yes you are but not mad in the sense your going to rip some heads more like padded room mad what a fewl
They lost their way when the Wii and PS3 came on to the scene, since their console can't compete. It's why they forced their console out the door, even though it wasn't finished and incredibly faulty (the most faulty mass produced piece of technology in history, that's a fact, look it up), just to beat the PS3 to the market. Otherwise they wouldn't even have lasted this long.
Aaron Greenberg: “there’s a lot of challenges about 3D in the living room. I don’t know about you, but when I play games or watch TV, I’ve got my phone, I’ve got all kinds of things going on. I get up, I get down, I’m looking outside at the weather and it’s…I’m not in a dark theater, wearing glasses, staring at a screen. I think it’s just a different environment.” I guess Greenburg won't be playing NATAL then: “there’s a lot of challenges about NATAL in the living room. I don’t know about you, but when I play games or watch TV, I’ve got my phone, I’ve got all kinds of things going on. I get up, I get down, I’m looking outside at the weather and it’s…I’m not in a circus, playing monkey, fapping at Milo. I think it’s just an Eyetoy.” XP
Not to mention Natal probably won't work in the dark
If you look up Bruces earlier posts, he has some delightful praise for the 360 making N4G label him a MS fanboy. Just glad to see he can see MS faults too... http://www.bruceongames.com...
reading that though he screams out fanboy saying things like Sony are on the backfoot right now compared to MS when in reality they are almost on track and in fact a lot more future proof than 360. That was a very fanboyish comment by him. He is a total fanboy don't try to stick up for him it doesn't suit you.
The 360 praise article is a bit much, I was just pointing out the irony in the disparity between his newest post and his older one. I'm sure we can look forward to some more MS praising from Bruce later...
it does work in the dark... there's plenty of previews from independent news sites saying so o.O
Natal uses an ACTIVE Infra-red camera. What does that mean? It means it produces its OWN light for the 3D camera, but as the light is infrarred, you'll never see it (You might if you view it through a phone or camera, similar to how you can see light from your average remote control). Or to put it another way - it works in the dark. If you disagree with this, you obviously have a minute understanding of how light works, the electromagnetic spectrum, basic science or are quite simply an idiotic fanboy who presses disagree on anything they don't like the sound of. If you really wanted to bash Natal, you should say that due to it working on infrared, it has a bigger chance of not working in direct sunlight than pitch blackness - but that would also be unsubstantiated.
That was arguably the best comment on N4G EVER.
This reminds me that Microsoft has no soul. All there games are generic and they are sticking to the xbox 360 for the next few years which is already been maxed out.
touche! Well played sir. MS really shouldn't run their gums. Im happy for sony to perfect 3d and ms to perfect physical motion and gesture capture. Life is good with choice. It's stupid disregarding comments like this that legitimately cause the opposing camp to justify its repulsion towards its rival. MS just be proud of what you are achieving with this generation of gamers, dont rag... its not a good trait.
"Natal works in the dark" Natal doesn't even work in the light! Ever see the bottom of an Xbox avatar's foot... Bam there it is!
theres no footage anywhere of Natal working in the dark.
I beg to differ... The reason the Natal knows what you are doing and where you are on cam is because it uses both an infra red camera and a normal camera. Without both of these together it doesn't work and there is no way the normal camera is going to see you in the dark.
And Natal is designed to distract you from that, so you'll be all excited about your 360 again, cause the systems abilities have been virtually exhausted. It's actually quite obvious. Listen, the 360 had and still has plenty to offer, but it's a dated machine struggling to keep up with its competition. The only reason it has done so well thus far is smart short term business practices; saturating the market during their year long head start and delivering in games via deep pockets, it was enough to distract from shoddy hardware. I think Natals success will depend on how willing MS' customers are to settle for a possibly decent distraction and a dated system in lieu of a new console capable of competing with the, well, competition.
I see two classes of people here. One interested in the truth, the other interested in ridicule and... looking like fools by way of leaving their pants on the ground.
PPL here on N4G aren't making any cash from it so LET IT GO.
"I have predicted in the past that eventually Microsoft’s Xbox/Live/Zune business would grow to become bigger than their PC business." The Xbox is a halo project (no pun intended), windows is a money making project. Whoever wrote this is stupid.
Actually the only success in consoles this gen in Ninty.Why?because success can only be measured in profit and MS need to re coup something like 9 billion dollars before they are successful in any way.Sony have 4 billion to make up although 2 hugely successful generations for them has been a success.MS have had no success yet.
Success isn't only measured by wealth.
You spewed numbers but id like to know where u got the info from.
A bank robber, drug dealer and pimp can be wealthy. Doesn't mean their success is actually worth anything. Corporate success might be measured by wealth, but considering the companies consumer success has to be measured too.
Microsoft isn't running a charity for gamers. They're in it to make money. No other reason. In the short term it might be about building a base or establishing a new brand but both of those are goals designed to make money. At the end of the day, that's what it's all about. If it's over a console generation, or two, or even over a period of only a year the goal is the cash. That's it.
Actually darkride, the only reason Microsoft got in the console business is because they were afraid that one day Sony might take over the media space with the PS.
But I'm still going to go with money. In my decade of working in the brokerage industry, years of pouring over research reports, company forecasts, forward looking statements and financial updates it's always about the money. Someone in the board room might have once said "Hey, we might want to make sure Sony doesn't use the PS to dominate the media space." And you know why? Because Microsoft saw that as a potential future way to...you guessed it, make money! Why is Microsoft going after the casuals right now with Natal? Is it more to make sure Nintendo doesn't corner the casual player, or is it more about going after the mountain of cash the casuals will bring in? It's probably a bit a both, but a lot about making money. If you go to your board/shareholders and say, "We want to enter this space because we're afraid Sony might corner the market," the board/shareholders will say "So? How does this make the company, and us, more money?" And that's the question that always has to be answered before any new venture goes forward. I can't believe that anyone could come on here and with a straight face say that Microsoft's business decisions aren't motivated by the pursuit of profit, first and foremost. Everything else is simply a means to that primary goal. And if it isn't, you need to fire your execs and make sure that it is because that's your primary responsibility to your shareholders.
Xbox 360 has about 4 billion in debt on its shoulders, thanks to the failure of the original Xbox and the 360's warranty issues (red ring of death). Sony spent about half a billion developing the PS3, and lost another half billion during the console's first year on the market, but has erased that through the PSP and PS2's profitability, as well as the PS3's incredible profitability as well.
Well then by that logic if Sony got out of the red with PSP and PS2 im sure the $ MS got from LIVE helped out them too. I love how people spew numbers but never say where from. Like when MS bought SE to bring FF over. Wheres the proof or a pic of big check getting handed out?
mfwahwah illustrates how to change the criteria for success when you don't like the results...
Natal will work in the dark but with standard one person lag at 200 ms plus the normal 100ms lag on a 30fps game,my question is more will it be good enough at all?I think it's a lot of hype and many of the die hard 360 MS mugs will buy into whatever their told.
And people like you who are naive enough to think that Microsoft and all those developers are so stupid as to overlook something like that and not even consider whether the thing works or not, or whether it is fun, are the biggest idiots of all. I mean, seriously?
beat me to it. short term memory over there.
You should stop being so niave Starchild. This is the way I see it: The 360 is most 3rd party developers console of choice this gen, easy to develop for and their software sells well on it. Microsoft are using Natal to try to tap into the casual market as Nintendo have shown there is big bucks to be made here. Whether Natal works as advertised or not is not really a concern for Microsoft or the developers, the fact that it will appeal to the casual crowd is. It should sell like hot cakes based on how marketable it appears to be, the interest it's garnered since E3 is evidence of this. You see, the Wii doesn't work as well as advertised (sword fighting on red steel springs to mind) yet it stills sells at an unbelievable rate because of it's marketability. Alot of 3rd party developers have tried and failed on the Wii so they are now switching their attention to Natal.
@starchild Really? I mean seriously bro? How old are you? You really think MS as a company cares about you? This is a business son, they are not your friend. They will and have put out a product that DOES NOT work as it should. Vista? The first batches of 360's? C'mon man! Wake the fuk up! Be a gamer, not a mindless sheep. If it means making a quick buck from suckers who will buy anything and everything NEW, they are quick to get it to the consumer. Natal COULD be the same way. I don't know enough about it so I can't say for sure. But I won't be surprised either way. STOP BEING THE SHEEP
On the contrary, I have every intent on playing a demo of Natal before shelling out for it. And it's funny how not I, the... ahem.... "die hard 360 MS mug", am not the one really pumped for it. That would be my wife, the die hard Wii Nintendo mug. And don't call my wife a mug!
Remember 10 years back, Samsung/LG and other electronic companies? They have nothing Sony or Phillips was always the best and still the best companies in the world for TV/gaming/and other electronic stuff. When Sony/Panasonic and Phillips take there plants to China for produce cheaper stuff they also lost great technology, because China is corrupt and pass all the info to other company's like Samsung or LG. In less than 5 years Samsung has all the stuff what Sony/Panasonic has, very strange that a Korean company has nothing and suddenly when the LCD technology came and Samsung become the biggest in 5 years with there lcd TV's. Samsung also stole technology from Nokia and Ericsson to try make good mobile phone, Sony invent and samsung copy and past and sell it cheaper to the dumbest people like you. And now Samsung and Sony work together with in some area's like LCD panels, Sony can't ignore Samsung even samsung has stole Sony's IP's and cannot proof it, just like Microsoft stole the Windows from Amiga and reprogram it and put a patent on it. I know i get allot disagreem but the fact is where was Samsung 7 years back? nothing and suddenly in number one. LCD TV from samsung is not better than Sony made LCD TV's, because they are cheaper will mean better.
Sony worshipers like you are funny. I bet you think they invented the internet too. Yes, yes, Sony invents everything and then companies like Samsung and Microsoft just steal it. But you are wrong. Samsung earned where they have got, and so did Microsoft. Forget it, you are to deluded to even talk to.
For me your post is another proof that Japans can't lose. They lose dirty. Sony is a prime example with their PS3. Go cry another place.
Amiga was the first with a open cource OS, Bill gates use Amiga's windows to copy and reprogram it with different bron codes and stole the windows from Amiga. The fact is, when Japanese/Dutch and even USA companies setles in China because it's cheap to produce and suddenly couple of years after Korean company's like Samsung has the same copy like Sony has/ camera/TV and even mobile pfone from Nokia and Ericsson. I know there are no proof, but there is a link about it between China and Korea and China is corrupt, look at google what happened? and that's is just a start ;)
crap!.... i clicked on the link before i realized that its from from bruce on games
Bruce should be removed from the internet, with force.
Bravo!!! Microsoft keep the Xbox360 because it's perfect as it is. Sony is desperately trying to do something new because they see Microsoft power and they fear.
but when Sony does it, its out of fear? Wow, you have double standards like no one i've ever seen do you also wear your underwear on your head?
sony always has done new things even before your beloved xbox came out and by the way Natal is a bad clone of eyetoy. i am glad sony still tries out new things, the 3d-tv push is a brilliant idea.
"Sony is desperately trying to do something new because they see Microsoft power and they fear" Sony have always tried new things and taken chances thats why they are one of the most successful companies in the world. PS1 for e.g. Sony entered a market that they never had entered before, The risk was that there was already 2 major console brands on the market SEGA and Nintendo. Sony though executed there plan well though resulting in sega packing up and sicking to software only. Then they took the risk with the ps2 because at the time the system that they tried to launch was far ahead of its generation and with the cost of it could well of put sony out of the market. It didn infact it made Sony the biggest console brand in the history of gaming FACT! now Sony are taking a chance with 3d. you only have to take a look at hollywood and treaters to see its taking off. Titanic was the biggest selling movie ever avatar. Avatar came along with its 3d version and absolutely destroyed box office records. The proof is there that 3d will sell, it already is (Nvidia 3d vision) Sony ain't stupid, they do their market research unlike Microsoft. When Microsoft do things well they are exceptional but when they don't put the effort in you get something crappy that don't work properly. Xbox 360 and windows Vista. If any one needs to take a chance it has to be Microsoft because otherwise they will end up flat on there face and i don't think natal will be the key they need to succeed afterall Sony had this tech years ago with the ps2. it didn take off. If anyone is scared its Microsoft NOT Sony
Where were you and your asinine comments when Eyetoy came out?...
"I was at CES and I spoke with a lot of people about 3d gaming, every one had the same comment that there was no way they wanted to wear glasses while gaming or even watching tv. For the record Samsung had the best, Sony and Toshiba had the worst. The flicker was so bad that 5 minutes and everyone got a headache." Why Sony can't make a 3D without 200$ glasses like samsung?
it's a begin, not final. Philips and Sony working years to this technology.
3D has a ways to go, but I think in 5 years we will see it in home gaming. Movies like Avatar are already getting the idea significant mind share. What is disappointing is that 3D and motion controls would be better together - like chocolate and peanut butter.
sony are pushing for 3d games as well, they may even combine it with their motion controls, but no one knows yet, they are keeping lots of secrets so they can surprise us all, I am sure of it.
Sony has an interest in pushing 3D not because of it's gaming division, but mainly because of it's TV division. All TV manufacturers need to introduce new rounds of tech in order to convince us to stay on the upgrade bandwagon. HDTV has been successful, but now they need a new sensation to make that 1080p plasma you just bought look old. 3D is it, for now. If that doesn't take off it will be something else.
Capitalism - It only needs your money.
Thats the thing I hate about this generation of technology, they come up with newer things faster than I can blink and before I know it my current tech kit seems like from the 90's. But one thing is for sure, I'm not going to buy any of these 3D Tv's until they are the new standard. The only thing I regret not buying at launch is the PS3( as it had the PS2 BC and now my ps2 is dead)
Mate, you can pick up PS2s(fat or slim) for less than twenty sheets here in the UK with tons of games and extras preowned so I just don't see the lack of BC in current model PS3s as any real issue my friend. For that matter there aren't any big PS2 releases anymore(the last real ones you needed, or I did, my BC for were the last two Personas really-so is it much of an issue anymore? You could also get a 60gig off Ebay reasonably these days, no? Just make sure you get the like for like insurance(like CP used to offer-I'm luckily still with them as my policy was running before they shut it down because of people using loopholes)if you go that way though.
Not interested in 3d yet. Waiting to see if it will be another fad or become something for years to come. 3d gaming won't be common place until at least the next generation of consoles, so that gives me time to wait and see what happens. Besides there is no point wasting all that money on a 3d tv now, when in three or four years time they will be 70% less in price.
That's exactly how I feel.
Yeah I'm going to wait a little bit for the price to come down, but I am interested in 3D gaming. I imagine it'd be a blast to have some friends over and play some 3D games. In real life I don't really know too many people who would complain, get pissy, and call it all a gimmick like how the internet does.
Agreed, there is so much room for improvement in other areas before 3d is introduced, like maybe all games running at a solid 60 fps? Better animation? No clipping? Just saying.
Yeah 3d would be quite fun for a bit. But I can't see it taking over. It'l be something you get out every now and again. When it's not expensive though people won't be coming round to play it because chances are they will have 3d too, and untill it's not expensive I won't be caring about it.
How was the xbox designed for long life when it dies 1 year in? I have a broken jasper collecting dust in my corner because I am not calling up a stupid indian call centre and then probably being told I am supposed to pay for it. Also, lol 3d.... no