Kotaku- Final Fantasy aside, Japanese role-playing games simply don't command the respect (or sales) they once did in the West. You may have an opinion on this! That's great. So do BioWare.
With Mass Effect and Dragon Age both leading the way as far as Western RPGs are concerned, they're a company well-placed to know what's good, and what's not so good, about the Japanese entries in the field.
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"This is all pretty funny considering that Bioware shamelessly ripped Dragon Age's tactical combat features directly from Final Fantasy XII" LOL
It is real funny how bioware are so arrogant. Dragon Age's is a good game but no evolution like most fantasy WRPGs here's the formula elves, dwarves, or humans. The Witcher is my favorite WRPG.
It seems to me Bioware while trying to hype ME2 is getting a bit uppity and Turning 10.
Doesn't help that Square is almost sacrificing their company to get people to buy the 360.
"Aren't you gonna buy the new Final Fantasy?"
"No, I hear the JRPG's are not commanding the respect they use to; If I buy it, people may think I'm not cool!"
Ahh! not really.
I don't know why the sudden hate for JRPGs, they never did a good job in NA(other than FF) in the first place, and there have been some really good ones lately.
i'll play WKC , SO4 , FF13 and atelier rorona this year
Yeah yeah Jrpgs are on the decline ... yet FF13 has sold 1.5M already in 4 days ...( japan only )
Wait where is the decline again ?
I loved me my final fantasies. But Mass Effect was better than FF 8 and 10.
Definately a title that will be built upon like Final Fantasy has.
JRPG's no longer interest me like they used to. The weeboo's here at N4G I'm sure will defend JRPG's to the death. Seems there's plenty of them
There was a time when probably more than 95% of all console RPG's were developed in Japan and then translated for sale in other countries. As games have become more sophisticated and voice acting has replaced on-screen text it has become more expensive and time consuming to localize games. Meanwhile western developers have started making games that are as good as the typical turn-based stuff that used to be pumped out of Japan, so interest has waned.
Personally I was never a fan of JRPG's. The only one I really ever liked was FFVII. But I've been a huge fan of BioWare's stuff. They make awesome games that sell multiple millions in countries around the world. So they should be respected as such.
i'm glad you're happy with the genre of rpg you enjoy ..disliking something doesn't mean it's suddenly crap ...
people can dislike one or the other or both just like someone like me can enjoy FF13 AND DRAGON AGE .
What some of you don't get is that Jrpgs and Wrpgs aren't opposed .. both can coexist ...
I also fail to see how liking Jrpgs makes you weaboo...
my conclusion : ...inform yourself more before speaking ...
How many RPGs have been released on the HD consoles this generation.
Then tell me how many of those RPGs have been released on the PS3, where the JRPG fanbase is.
Then tell me how many JRPGs have been released on the Wii, PSP, or DS.
Exactly, JRPGs haven't really made the jump to HD consoles yet. FFXIII is only the beginning.
I still think western rpgs suck. Japanese rpgs are the way to go
Kotaku is doing a duplicate story on the same qoute taken from Biowares interview with Destructoid, it says so right there prior to the qoute, and the Destructoid story was already posted on n4g.
If you read the original interview Destructoid repeats a familiar concern about JRPG's the idea that JRPG's are in decline, this isn't a new idea, many have said it, including Japanese devs, so Destructoid ASKS Bioware why they think its happening, there answer is their opinion, you may disagree but its generally what the public thinks, sure alot of hardcore jrpg fans may think jrpg's are still the best thing, but Bioware along with many others are simply giving their opinion, I see know reason why all the hate and talk of them being arrogant, they aren't flat out bashing jrpg's or saying they suck, just giving their honest impression, but I guess some of you would rather they lie and say they think jrpg's are on the rise and have very new an exciting gameplay to make you feel better. Grow up gamers, criticism is good, they sure took alot of it about the elevator and framerate issues in ME1 and did what any good dev would do, address it and try their damm best to fix it.
~r-evolution~
The thing is, the fact that they said this proves they never were much of JRPG fans. The fall of JRPG has nothing to do with their lack of evolution, ask any true JRPG fanboy, we actually WISH they STILL played like they did on PSX. JRPGs just aren't nearly as well made as they were in previous gens. It hasn't nothing to do with their lack of evolution, rather their failed attempts to evolve the genre is contributing to the decreasing quality.
The Jap devs are no longer making their games solely aimed at the Jap market, problem is that the Japanese culture in their games was part of its appeal. Now that they have been trying to aim at different markets, they've changed the soul and DNA of what a JRPG is. The end result is something that lacks its original appeal, and just doesn't have the same quality or passion from the devs.
The shifted influence on the gaming industry from Japan to now the West is what ruined JRPGs, and partially Japanese gaming as a whole. The Japs are still producing excellent games, but not at the rate they used to.
PS: It's not Bioware complaining that it doesn't sell, it's Bioware saying the games just aren't that good anymore. So keep your fanboy crap for the Open Zone.
Don't forget they took no shame in making the Dragon Ages and their other titles copy locked.
The favorite part of RPGs for me is growing and becoming a bad arse. Unfortunitly, those are short lived when you lose 100's of hours of work because DRM.
i'm not knocking bioware, they seem like a solid enough studio but to say that jrpg's aren't evolving is a little silly to me. 90% of the stuff out right now is either recycled stuff or sequels. I'll take a solid jrpg any day over a cover system tps game (or a bioware game for that matter). You can't take a jrpg and turn it into an all out action game, it wouldn't be a jrpg. Jrpg's have a very dedicated fanbase, somewhat niche, but very dedicated.
Also, i don't think it's all that fair to judge the state of jrpgs right now in the game industry. For one, they do great on handhelds and two, the ps3 has hardly any rpg's in it's software line up. I bet if the exclusive rpgs square made for the 360 were multiplat at launch or sony exclusive the sales figures would have been completely different. The 360 isn't a system that people bought to play jrpgs on.
WHAT???
People still believe that lol
Is not going to Happen
Video gamers are generally the people that western culture least appeals to... except maybe the culture of war!
played morrowind, was great for about 100 hours
played oblivion, kinda boring
played mass defect, boring
played dragon age, even more boring
FFXII is the best in the series since FF6
I love playing games where you cannot tell if the character is a guy or a girl because everyone looks exactly the same with spiky, emo haircuts. /s
It's one thing to criticize Turn 10, but Bioware is one of the BEST developers there are. You can call them arrogant snobs, but Bioware delivers consistently.
but it plays a lot like KOTOR with FFXII gambits...lets be real
i mean really, who ever says mass effect, Kotor, dragon age and jade empire dont feel like the same game they r liars, lol, lack of evolution, and its sad cuz its from one company thats doing this.
always starting off in some acedemy, journey is always interuptted by some big orginization and it seems hopeless. besides that all the gameplay feels the same. dragon age is kotor in fantasy settings
Dragon Age is not KotOR in a fantasy setting.
Mass Effect sold about 2 million on the 360, quite likely barely enough to recoup even half of their investment (though PC sales would have helped), less than what FF13 has sold in Japan alone in 1 week - though that may be shipped rather than sold, still impressive. Also less than what LBP sold on the PS3 on a smaller install base, with 1/10th the development cost. Mass Effect, Lost Odyssey (< 1 million), Too Human (< 1 million0 and Forza 3 (about /10th of a GT game sales) are probably the biggest commercial flops of this generation, considering hype, advertising, developer pedigree and development costs were all massive for these games.
But I bet you it was 10-20mil!
The Rapid Decline Of Bioware
"Their acquisition by EA will be the reason for their decline."
I couldn't possibly disagree anymore than I do now. They used to make 1 game every few years, but up until recently, they were working on Dragon Age, ME2, and Star Wars: The Old Republic, all at the same time,
but what do I know, apparently making a lot more games = less profit, here I was thinking it would mean more money for them and EA
I don't know, I still play Japanese RPG's a lot, and play only select WRPG's. Oblivion has outdone anything Bioware did this gen IMO, Bioware doesn't make me wet like the rest of the WRPG lovers out there. I really don't see the appeal in their *NEW* games.
Edit: I guess I should just state a couple things here. To me, games are a timeless form of entertainment. If a game wow'd me years ago, I don't suddenly forget about it and look to the next best thing to throw my money and time at. It's got to DO something big for me when I pick it up and play it. I still play and love the games I enjoyed in the past, regardless of the generation they hail from. From my experience playing Bioware games, I really haven't be wow'd by what they've done so far this generation, and don't see why so many people are rushing to crown them as the kings of RPG's. To be honest, it's really baffling. We've got Bethesda, Bioware, and what.. Silicon Knights? Then a trillion nameless MMORPG'S sitting under Blizzard's WoW. Decline? how? I don't see it.
Listen PS3 Fans...
YOU AREN'T 12 YEARS OLD ANYMORE.
Chrono Trigger was awesome.
Phantasy Star was legendary.
Xenogears was fun.
And Final Fantasy set the standard.
But that was generations ago. The world has moved on.
The West has taken over the RPG Genre and it kills you. It only further cements the proof that is right in front of your faces:
The Playstation Name is dying.
And it's assisting in dragging down an entire genre of gaming.
The PS1 and PS2 consoles were KNOWN for its great collection of JRPG's. And no one wants them anymore. (Japan notwithstanding.)
New IP's fall short on the PS3 regularly.
And the West is putting out better products regularly.
Yes, JRPG's have gotten away from standard turn-based fare by incorporating real-time fighting sequences to speed along the games.
But the result is still the same.
Pretty boys, CG cutscenes, and hours upon hours of voice-acting and orchestral music. We get it. And it's over.
That generation is dead and Final Fantasy XIII is the last gasp. Yes, Final Fantasy XIV (according to your logic, a multiplat) is coming, but NO ONE CARES. Final Fantasy Versus is coming. NO ONE CARES.
Your childhood nostagia is blinding your rationale. Let it go.
Oblivion is PERFECTION.
Fallout is AMAZING.
Mass Effect is INCREDIBLE.
Diablo
Baldur's Gate
Knights of the Old Republic
Fable
World of Warcraft
The list goes on and on.
Jump on board.
And of course... "Jump in". :-)
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Japans problem is not knowing what good sh!t is, which is why they prefer the Ps3 over the Xbox360.
They need to study the west more, learn from them.
honestly to the dude that said oh jap rpgs arnt cool so im not gonna buy it or however you word it. i dont any serous gamer would say that its an rpg a freaking nerd fest.
jrpg are the most boring pos on gods big ass green earth.
pokemon was about all i could handle. and guys hate it all you want ill pick oblivion over ff 7 anyday its hella of alot more funner. and in a since does require alot more tact. but jrpg put my ass to sleep. you know i never really got the gist of how someone could just run in a bunch of grass and have a little video pop up where 3 guys and a girl are dancing with jappy techno running . and the play you attack i attack you attack oh im injure ill take up a turn by healing this guy . you attack ive died. you attack ive died
BOOOOORRRRRRRRRRIIIIINNNNG Zzzzz.
To Much Hate ?
Really?
1. Combat is most always the same, classic turn based
2. Terrible voice acting.
And a bonus third thing
3. Similar art styles(they always seem to have an underlying,organic look). I mean really, there is something about them that makes them contain similar traits visually.
Tales of Vesperia says hi!
What exactly are you saying "Hi" to?
It really irks me when these "articles" pop up professing the death of JRPGs.
The illusion of the decline of JRPGS can be explained by the following:
1. The dearth of AAA JRPGs on the PS3, which has a much lower install base in the U.S. where the majority of these ill-informed articles are conceived. This should change next year when FF XIII and WKC are released;
2. The idiotic decision of Square Enix to support the 360 early in the console cycle in a feeble attempt to expand their market to a user base that likes to play Halo and Gears of War;
3. The idiotic decision of Square Enix to westernize their JRPG games, which has resulted in incongruos JRPG/WRPG half-breeds (e.g. Last Remnant);
4. The desire of western gaming media to rhasodize anything that is ostensibly "innovative", even though the widespread success of various generic franchises seems to suggest that innovation is not critical to success (e.g. Call of Duty, Madden, Halo, etc.)
It all boils down to personal preference. I got bored of Fallout 3 and Oblivion after about 20 or so hours. The free roaming aspect of these games is cool, but can be a bit overwhelming at times.
I prefer the tight, linear gameplay of Valkyria Chronicles, which is in my opinion the best RPG of this generation.
Unfortunately, since it did not the generate the sales/critical acclaim it must not be as good.
/sarcasm
Tru
This new Final Fantasy seems to be more westernized, but that really just means "normal". They don't have any JRPG out in Japan right now with graphics and characters that look as good and believable as the screens of FF13 show. The storyline will still be garbage probably, but they definitely tried to cater more to normal western people.
Stop trying to infect us with your terrible art style then maybe you will sell games again.
At least japanese folks wont hide they are biased against wrpgs , and prefer their own stuff .
Just admit the same , you prefer western style over japanese ones , wich would be perfectly ok and fine , and keep moving on ...
Dont pretend you were once ever interested , but suddenly lost interest cause of some pseudo lack of evolution
PS3 is still waiting for JRPG here in NA, and the Wii only has 1 so far in ToS2.
Also JRPGS have done phenomenal numbers on DS. So they can say so far that JRPGs have not done good business on 360, but as a whole JRPGs are doing just fine.
Ive been saying this for a while, you want great JRPGs get a DS. 18 JRPGs on DS have sold over a million units, so how is that a fail??
He's right about JRPGs not being accessible to casual gamers, by not hiding the numbers 'under the trunk.' Having a lot of stats all over the screen screams complex and scares most casuals away.
Being more open ended isn't completely necessary though, he's wrong about that. A game can be either, most people realize a more open ended game means less polish. Choose your own adventure books don't dominate the books marketplace for good reason, letting the author choose the best, most well thought-out ending and giving you that is usually a better choice.
Fanboyism aside, what JRPG lack now is FREEDOM!!! For WRPG you are free to be bad/ good, free to explore, free to choose your upgrade path, free to choose your sex orgination, etc. On the other hand, JRPG will not give any freedom to the player. Just look at FFXIII ! Even some Japanese think it is too liner! After experiencing a great freedom from Fallout III, Dragon Age, KOTOR, etc, it is really hard to go back to the liner, no-freedom form of JRPG.