A 15-year-old US boy was sprayed with rubbing alcohol before being set alight by a gang in what one police officer said was "the most heinous crime I have ever seen".
That's f'ing terrible.
Bring those kids here to Texas and let them stand trial as adults.. hell, bring the parents too. When I read that some of the kids who did this were laughing about it I ... I... I better stop now. People can be sick!
It wouldn't take the police and a judge, we take care of stuff like that up here in Montana. Thats why we don't have any crime, at least very little. Especcially no violent crimes. It is a sad state of affairs going on when a group of punks would do something like this. I have always thought some people were just born bad. I grew up in a bad area of Miami, FL and saw many awful things. This might be the worst.
How could they do that? There's something wrong with these younger generations now. I'm only 17 but I've noticed it where I live too, people are loosing the respect for life. Reading this makes me sick. Why does it seem like people turn their thoughts into actions so easily now?
wow. that is so horrible.
way too far for 43 dollars... I take it they kill you if you owe over 100 dollars..... And I wonder if the parents are going to bail them of of jail now, especially after lighting someone on fire.
TV is dominated by MTV, Disney channel, etc but the much of the real America is more like the show Cops or America's Most Wanted. Luckily, it's easy to avoid those areas if you have a job and can afford to live in a better town. America's murder rate is higher than France, UK, Germany and Japan combined!
reading the article it seems like the incident was more a response for snitching than owing money !
Capital punishment for all! Seriously when you do something like that it's going to take 50 years of therapy or an execution to make sure they never harm society again.
see this is why I could NEVER be a cop, because I would literally have taken those 5 [email protected]
I think it's disgusting how some of the comments are suggesting that the perpetrators be killed or tried as adults. They did a terrible thing, and should be sent to Juvie for it, but they should not lose their lives due to an error of judgment. They should have a chance to learn from their mistakes and become productive members of society.
so the guys get out at 18, when the kid has to live with burnt skin for the rest of his life? You're talking about irreparable harm here. Just imagine 2nd degree burns on 80% of YOUR body or your kid's body. It doesn't take a XX year old person to realize the harm you could do by setting another person on fire. This XX year old threshold is just an arbitrary number. It's not like a major spell is cast on you by age of 18 where you realize wrong and right. Truth is it should depends on each case. I think sentencing to die is a bit harsh, but they should be tried as adults.
You really believe these people can become productive members of society? They SET a kid on FIRE, and LAUGHED. One of them showed remorse--he'll be in therapy for the rest of his life. The other ones, they deserve the worst they can be given.
oh jesus another bleeding hear liberal an "error" in judgement is shoplifting, sleeping with a 17 yr old girl when ur 18, getting into a fist fight over one, things like that. what these "kids" did is PURE EVIL, people like that don't deserve rehabilitation. My 11 yr old kid would know better than this, but thats because he has a good heart and wouldn't harm a fly. BIG DIFFERENCE to those who see no "big thing" with nearly killing another child.
I have to agree with Darkstorn. Some of your responses show that you are not to far off from these kids. With that said, I am not suggesting what should or should not be done...but I do know the death of these kids will not change what already has happened to the victim. @Blaine These kids could be productive in society, there is plenty of research that shows what can happen to people under group dynamics or other circumstances.
hasn't worked and never will work. The numbers back me up on this 100%. It doesn't even save money (as if that should ever play a role in determing someone's life). Capital punishment actually results in our taxes being used to kill innocent people by the government. When an innocent man is executed for a murder he didn't commit, should we then prosecute the judge, jury, and prosecution for homicide? How many innocent people are you willing to kill to satisfy your emotional need for vengeance? The culture of death in America is one where killing is considered a rightful punishment for crimes and the wrongful killing of innocents is considered a small price to pay for the ability to kill the guilty. There's a certain joy those kinds of people take in the death of others. It's no different from these kids. They too took joy in the boys death. I don't want my tax money to go towards killing a single innocent man or woman.
the main reason i think these animals shouldpay is the fact that some of them laughed about it later. the joy someone gets from doing this is so disgusting and its sickening to think americas youth can be this way. instead of killing them off though, i think it should be an eye for an eye, make these kids, who think they can do whatever they want, pay. make them feel what its like to be on the other end of torture for a little while, at minimum, shoot out a knee cap and watch them cry,at maximum light them on fire as well. then to make it sink into their heads, laugh at them like they laughed. put the fear of god into them that if they ever abuse the power to hurt again they will die. i domt think thats going to far and its not at all "being one of them" thats what people say who are afraid to get things done by extreme methods, i say when extreme methods are deserved or necessary, by all means do it. saying that doing this as punishment would make you like them, thats like saying a guy that defends himself for getting jumped, by punching the attacker in the face, is just as bad as the one who idd the jumping.
No. Not at all... But an example needs to be set. These dumbass kids thought that they could get away with setting someone on fire. This is a complete failure in parenting and societal boundary setting. I mean come on. If someone owes you money, you kick their ass, you don't set them on fire! A massive and haunting punishment is more then warranted in this situation.
You act as if 90% of the people incarcerated are innocent.I'm not going to pay taxes just so that some degenerate behind bars can get three square meals a day and a warm place to sleep in at night when I can barely afford to do that for myself.Corporal punishment would not only save us the money that would be spent feeding and housing criminals, it would make people think twice about their actions.You act as if humans aren't animals.If a wolf attacked you, would you sit down and talk with it or would you fight back? @RememberThe357 Yeah, they should be set on fire so that they can understand the effects of their actions.
MNicholas "How many innocent people are you willing to kill to satisfy your emotional need for vengeance?" You hit the nail on the head here. Emotion gets in the way of logical action. Take what Supaplaya said: "Just imagine 2nd degree burns on 80% of YOUR body or your kid's body." Yes that would be terrible and if that happened to my son I may become outside myself and become furious or even vengeful. However, we must rely on justice to make the right decision; to cast aside emotion and give him/her a sentence that's just rather than getting emotional and even illogical. Consoldtobots: Save the political name-calling, it's counter-productive and makes you look less credible, unless that's what you're going for.
Anyone want to point out, as terrible the crime was, he WASNT torched over the damn video game? He got set on fire because he snitched on the guys stealing his dads bike. They related it back to videogames anyways
The one thing 90% of the people in the world seem to lack, including the writer of the article; since the title shows that he/she obviously didn't get the gist of his/her own article. I even hate to say this, but it even seems like the bike might have been stolen because of the owed money (which still wasn't the reason [and no excuse] to why they burned that poor kid).
do onto them, what they do to others...i think killing may be going a bit too far, but i think they should be sprayed with rubbing alcohol and light on fire then get laughed at, just like they did themselves a punishment fitting for the crime
is that we don't actually do it. A person is convicted of a crime, sentenced to death, then he has appeal after appeal. Then he sits on death row for years, and years. There are some that have been on death row for 20+ years. Also the way we put people to death is humane. They are drugged up and don't actually feel anything, regardless of what some people say. I am not a huge proponent of the death penalty. It won't work for some that have so much hate inside them that death is the only relief that they will feel. I say do away with the death penalty in its current form. But to say it doesn't work, you must point out why it doesn't work.
the fact that were even able to read about something like this happening - its completely ludicrous. Alot of bad things happen but you don't ever expect to hear about youths burning other youths and finding it funny. Its as though some of us are psychologically devolving back into primates. Luckily this doesn't represent 90% of the human race, but it's still incredibly hard to put into words the gut wrenching feeling I got whilst reading this. To people who are that sick in the head, I cant be sure there is a suitable punishment. Im not sure any amount of pain would suffice to get through to them. I agree the point of killing them or burning them, although very tempting admitedly, is mute. By doing that, in a sense your almost sinking to their pathetic level. Unfortunately at the same time, I agree in certain senses people like this don't have enough fear in them of the law to keep them in line. I speak with calm words now, but i do know that if it was my child they had done that too, there isn't anything on the earth that could stop me from seriously hurting them in ways not really suitable to think about.
thought they could get away with it? societal boundaries? wow some people are CLUELESS, look this is VERY simple, either you are CAPABLE OF EVIL OR YOU ARE NOT. This isn't something that's taught in school. Normal people are born with a moral compass, short for COMPASSION if you like. YOUR HEART tells you when are doing something cruel evil and wrong. The fact that they went ahead and did it anyway is reason enough to rid the world of this devilspawn. try to spin it with statistics about the death penalty, crime in america, the phases of the moon all = BULLCRAP do you think that child or his family care one bit about the politics of capital punishment? All they know is that their little boy has had his life severely altered by a bunch of callous evil punks. If I was that kids father I would be in jail for VICIOUSLY murdering those little bastards. There is such a thing as RIGHTEOUS violence, such as when violence is committed to rid the world of those COMMITTING EVIL ACTS. some of you people need to get a clue and wakeup from that victim mentality.
I think it's time for a Kira.
Absolutely. Here in Texas they would be sent to Huntsville, Eastham unit. Lockdown and no A/C in the cells year round. No ice for your drinks either.
As for some of those claiming "Juvie" No way. These peole are incapabable of being productive in society, they demonstrated that, clearly. And I must say. Those who feel this way and live in the U.S. this is part of the problem with our country now. You don't fight a wolf wearing wool.
I am a case manager for a Foster Care Agency and I see kids of all kinds. But the ONE thing I don't see in this line of work? CHANGES IN KIDS BEHAVIOR.
If the kid is a crazy, he will ALWAYS be crazy. These kids may never do anything like this again, but they will most likely ALL be hoodlums and drains on society for the REST OF THEIR LIVES!
You can take that to the bank! Might as well throw them in prison now and get it over with.
who were wrongly convicted of crimes they didn't commit. There's no way to have death penalty and not kill wrongly convicted innocent people. The only way to prevent this is to get rid of the death penalty. To me, even killing even one innocent person is murder. 1) What to you is an acceptable ratio of Innocent:Guilty for executions ... 1:10, 1:100, 1:1000? 2) Should the judge, jury, and prosecution at the trials of those who are wrongfully executed be indicted for wrongful death or perhaps negligent homicide?
Save it. Your propaganda isn't going to work here. We have a death system and we'll keep it too. It is sad that innocent people die. You know what it happens everyday.
So what do you propose then for cop killers and serial killers and the like. People who would not hesitate to murder you and your family if need be or even for the fun of it? Should we set them free because they are "people" too? I think not. Should we keep them in prison and pay for their screw up, we shouldn't have to. Our tax money could be used for better things, not housing prisoners like that.
Highwayman Do you even know what Propaganda is? He isn't saying anything remotely resembling propaganda. He raises a very legitimate concern and a huge downfall of capital punishment. You also say he should "set them free". Death Penalty and jail time are two different things. Just because he opposes the death penalty does not mean he opposes conviction and time in prison. consoldtobots BORN with a moral compass? Are you serious? People are taught morality at a young age. Unfortunately, it would appear these kids had bad/no parents to look up to and to teach them what matters most in this world. Can they change? I don't know. Do I have the right to judge death upon them? No, and nor do you. Don't act like you know what's best for everyone, especially when it comes to committing the ultimate penalty upon them.
Propaganda? Hardly. Are you afraid to answer those two simple questions? Opinions are meaningless unless you've thought about the consequences. If you've really thought through all the pros and cons of capital punishment and honestly believe that it's the best policy choice for dealing with all people who would be convicted of crimes that, under current law, qualify for the death penalty then you should have no problem answering the two questions I asked earlier. Here they are again: 1) What to you is an acceptable ratio of Innocent:Guilty for executions ... 1:10, 1:100, 1:1000? 2) Should the judge, jury, and prosecution at the trials of those who are wrongfully executed be indicted for wrongful death or perhaps negligent homicide?
so would those kids be tried for first degree man slaughter? whatever it is, that's messed up man. at least the kid didn't die, though i bet he feels like crap right now.
You're absolutely right. No one is born knowing right from wrong. That's something that, ideally, one learns as a child. The real question is why does America produce violent criminals at a higher rate than France, Germany, UK, and Japan combined?
Obviously the kids should get a harder sentience than this guy http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id... But none of this is really gaming news.
"Do you even know what Propaganda is? He isn't saying anything remotely resembling propaganda."
Are you an illiterate? Go and read the definition for propaganda. It is propaganda.
"You also say he should "set them free"."
Now I am really beginning to think that you are an illiterate. Notice how I asked him, I did not state if he should or should not. Is it really that hard to read, Jim?
The last part of your comment does not merit a response. You should have read what I said.
"Propaganda? Hardly. Are you afraid to answer those two simple questions? Opinions are meaningless unless you've thought about the consequences."
Propaganda, definitely. No I am not. Are you afraid to answer my questions?
1) What is an acceptable ratio. This is a moral conundrum.
There are really way too many variables to make this a simple question. Complexity is simplicity multiplied.
These innocent people. What is to say that they would live if the capital punishment was not in place? If they had been set free a month earlier what is to say that they do die in an accident? Too many variables indeed.
However, I will answer. 1:100.
For your second question, yes and no. The jury could be at times held accountable. There is evidence that proves some jurys hastily make a decision so that they can get back to their normal routines. That is wrong, yes. As for the Judge, no. Believe it or not their job is a difficult one.
Are there cons to capital punishment, yes. There are cons to everything. No system is perfect, it is nonexistent.
Also, some food for thought. We as humans are predators. We are primitive.
-Highwayman I'm sorry that you feel so jaded about life on this planet. Yet, just because you don't trust your fellow man does not mean that a handful of misguided boys should lose the natural rights of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness for a decision they made in a split-second. Those kids are obviously terrified out of their wits right now, and they ARE able to change, given they are reintegrated into society in the correct way. I should add that in all of Europe, the only countries that still have the death penalty are Belarus, Lithuania, and Estonia. And that's INCLUDING Eastern Europe. Does that mean that they aren't 'naturally violent' people? Of course not, but they're society is not as gun-obsessed, greedy, or individualistic as the U.S.
I say set them on fire for a period of time and have a fire man put them out. .....Let them feel the same pain that boy felt..... "Do Unto Others As You Would Have Them Do Unto You - Matthew 7:12"
...and people wonder why I left Florida. "it's all sunshine there, and beautiful!" well I say BS to that. I'd say more like "98 degress of heat and 100% humidity. Not to mention little kids running around setting other little kids on fire".
For the love of God, they deserve the worst
1:100 is fine with you? You willing to have your friends / family be the sacrifice every 100 guilty prisoners put to death? I'm definitely not. But if you truly feel that way, then you should be okie dokie. Prison is a damn scary and miserable place, I took the class visit to 5 Points - maximum security prison in NY, and that shizz is insane. If someone killed me, or heaven forbid torched me like this poor fella, I'd rather them rot in there.. Or one of those overly maximum security prisons where they're literally in solitude all the time. That's my vote.
It's clear that you did not read the article. Those kids you speak of were not "terrified" they were in fact laughing about the incident, now you would have known that if you had takin the time to read the article.
Can you please point out to me where I once said in this whole thread that those kids should die? I clearly did no such thing. I said prison.Then, MNicholas the propagandist in here started the whole capital punishment argument. Again you should read before you post.
I disagree, Those kids aren't going to change. They're around the age of 15. I have a cousin. One who thought he was a gang banger when he was 15. We all thought he would change. He was raised well. Well...he's in prison now for life for 1st degree murder. They won't change.
"Gun obsessed" I like that. Just because we in the U.S. value our 2nd amendment does not make us "gun obsessed" I believe someone called you a liberal earlier? I belove their word were well placed.
So, just because you went on a class trip to some prison you're now an expert on the subject? Clearly you seem to think this. You are wrong. Criminals who are crazy such as these kids thrive in prison. Of course they would all prefer to be on the outside, but really they get along fine inside. they sell drugs, murder other inmates and the like. Prison is scary for folks like ourselves because we are not crazy. If it didn't phases we would all gladly commit crimes.
Yes, I am "okie dokie" Consider this. That 1 innocent person who dies, could very well in fact die regardless. They could be murdered, die in a traffic accident, could be a very bad reaction, heart attack, poisonous snake bite. The list is endless. Granted they could have lived. What you seem not to understand is that, our world is not all kittens and rainbows, but you would know that if you had any law enforcement experience. Innocent people die every day. It's called life.
And there are supermax prisons that they are in solitary for 23 hours a day, with one hour of outdoors time, which involves going out into a cage for the majority. I would rather die than live like that, and most people would, which is why it's a much worse punishment than death. Complete isolation 100% of the time, you get food thru the slots. There's no social interaction - everything is soundproofed. Also, how can you be fine with that? Say you have a child, they get wrongfully convicted, and put to death. Your logic says "oh, he could have died within that week anyways, good riddance"??
"Nope, took classes, dumbass."
Oh, well that clears everything up. You're an expert. (note the sarcasm)
"And there are supermax prisons that they are in solitary for 23 hours a day, with one hour of outdoors time, which involves going out into a cage for the majority."
Can you please point out to me where I ever claimed that no such thing exists?
"Complete isolation 100% of the time, you get food thru the slots. There's no social interaction - everything is soundproofed."
As far as my knowledge goes a prisoner is only kept in a 23 hour lockdown if they misbehave badly enough. I don't believe they're kept in their like that for the rest of their sentence. I know that there are prisoners who are kept in there if their life is in grave danger in some cases. And you would not mind having to pay for their medications and food, etc...?
Also, you do realize that most prisoners aren't kept like this, yes? I know that most prisoners are kept in the general populace of the prison.
"I would rather die than live like that, and most people would, which is why it's a much worse punishment than death."
So, we would get rid of the death system and replace it with this? Brilliant! Now those innocent people can live like that as opposed to dying! And you wish to speak about my logic?
"Also, how can you be fine with that? Say you have a child, they get wrongfully convicted, and put to death. Your logic says "oh, he could have died within that week anyways, good riddance"??"
How can I be fine with what exactly? Reasoning the loss of innocent lives in return for a greater number of scum who lose their lives? Easily. When you've been around for awhile you'll see why...or maybe you won't...I can tell that you're young and an idealist. That's fine. Idealism is good in some ways, yet harmful in others.
As for the hypothetical scenario you place. I would rather see my wrongfully convicted child be put to death as opposed to your alternative, after all even you claim to choose death over it yourself. You also seem to think that capital punishment is easily handed out. It is not.
Shall we continue this debate, Danielle?
I would like to also say that I am almost out of bubbles. (A very idiotic system if you ask me) so I propose that after my last bubble we continue this debate through PMs?
Here is the downside to capital punishment. He was proven to be innocent after being found guilty by a jury. I have been for the death penalty but stories like these make me reconsider. http://www.caller.com/news/...
On another note our tax dollars would be better spent if we stopped putting non violent drug offenders in jail for so long. If we stopped making drugs into a horrible crime we wouldn't have over populated prisons. Violent/sex offenders get off easier than say a drug dealer.
what a wonderful world...
It's only right that the family member gets to spray alcohol on them and set them on fire. Eye for an eye.
In ancient times, think Rome, it would be considered fine and even recommanded to do so. Afterall, when an architect made plan for a building, if the building was flawed and killed the owner's wife and kids, it was considered appropriate to kill the architect's wife and kids.
Sadly enough that system of justice is waaaaaaaay outdated.
I agreed, set them or their parents ablazed too, see whether they can still jokes about it. if my kids do this horrible crime, I will disown them immediately.
If only you guys realised that "an eye for an eye" is the reason he was set on fire to begin with... (read the article). An eye for an eye is the dog eat dog world solution, which is also indecently one of the big reasons we have a dog eat dog world... circles don't end unless broken. Take a look at the Israel-Palestinian situation and consider it for a moment. The phrase itself is even used out of ignorance most of the time. Basically, the phrase is most commonly known from the bible, but in the same book, Jesus says that it is wrong. You'd imagine the word of Jesus would be the highest authority in the bible, but I guess not, huh? Revenge is always an empty and very temporal satisfaction, which doesn't in any way actually undo the first wronging. As the saying goes, two wrongs don't make a right. In no way am I trying to undermine the severity of the incident, I just think that the lynch mob mentality is something humanity if better off without. While the alternatives might be difficult to see, they will remain so if people just keep doing the same thing.
An eye for an eye will make the whole world blind ;)
Wait till someone burn you first, then see if you can act like jesus. Talk is easy but to be Jesus is really impossible.I seen a lot of people who talk like Jesus and act like normal people.
I did not suggest that everyone should act like Jesus, I merely wrote that paragraph to illustrate how things are justified by ignorance; people often justify an eye for an eye because it says so in the bible, ignoring the fundamental teachings they supposedly believe in. Edit: @ phantom disagrees: care to argument why? Everyone stands to benefit from different points of views.
That wasn't really an eye for eye ... I mean the boy who did get burn didn't set them on fire......If he had then that would be a eye for an eye..... "Do Unto Others As You Would Have Them Do Unto You - Matthew 7:12"
"It's only right that the family member gets to spray alcohol on them and set them on fire.
Eye for an eye"
I believe in "Devine Justice", but that gang deserve the worst in the world and I'm not talking about death, I'm talking about pain
I would not have objected to running out and giving those kids the business end of my cavalry saber. It would be an act of Darwinism, at best.
The fittest survive.
this article is False!!! the kid was not torch due to a videogame. the reason was because the other kids were trying to steal his dad's bike and he told everyone bout it!!! then the other kids seek revenge and torched him!! and among the five kids,yes, there was a black kid.
True, it is due to the fact that the kid's father's bike was stolen in retaliation and the kid reported it.
SO now its the black kid's fault? Uhhh huhhh, see what I did there.
Just kidding man, but kids have gotten out of hand today for sure.
"among the five kids,yes, there was a black kid" im probably missing something but where was the need to mention this? the sooner we all realize ANY AND ALL RACES commit crimes the better
I'm guessing the mention of the black kid was in reply to Whut's debacle at comment #3: "you just know the kids who did this are white because There's no picture of them. they are underage you say but they always show the black kids faces when they do crimes on tv. and thats true facts. as they say snitches get Stiches lmao"
I think that's right. I saw this story on MSNBC and Huffington Post and neither mentioned video games. Actually, only Fox News' article stated that a video game was in the mix.
That makes my heart sink. I hope he and his family pull through okay.
That is just beyond revolting.. How anymore could ever do something so sick & twisted to a person blows my mind.Death by electric chair wouldn't even be fitting enough for that "Gang"
A firing squad?