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The Technology Powering Halo: Reach

Gameguru writes"Halo: Reach is being propagated as the next game to use technology that packs a wallop and this is what is being discussed as being put into the new engine that is being developed for the game."

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Ausbo2958d ago

i love halo but i agree that the engine needed a change.

gamesmaster2958d ago (Edited 2958d ago )

yea, odst is looking exactly like halo 3, which isn't bad, but the engine could do with a little bit of a face lift. They should push for something new in reach.

we know the 360 can do better than halo3.

FreeMonk2958d ago (Edited 2958d ago )

Good news if it's true. Although the current Halo engine does what it has to do, and does it well, future games do need an upgrade, especially with very pretty games like Killzone 2 and Uncharted 2 arriving on the PS3.

I'm sure we'll see mid next year when the 'Reach' beta starts!

Also, can the X360 do Direct X11? Hmmmm, sounds a little out there, but with all the upgrades and updates that MS push out, maybe they have something secret somewhere in that X360 that may be upgradable. Maybe not, but its a thought.

LONEWOLF2312958d ago

Why shouldnt it be able to run DX11??
Maybe the tech in the 360 GPU was designed for future DX version support.

edhe2958d ago

Bungie are pretty technically minded so i'm sure they'll pull a good engine out their butts for Reach.

They'd better, to be honest.

As for DX11, directx has got nothing to do with consoles. DX is a pc thing - it's more like saying what to do to do something, rather than saying what to do.

You could probably manage features that are listed as 'dx11' on the console hardware - but remember that they are dx9.0c generation silicon so wouldn't be great at doing it.

The Master Chief2957d ago

Wow. I am so stoked for this game!!

Xi2957d ago (Edited 2957d ago )

Except it features a bit more AA, which is pretty much the only thing i think the game could really use.

Halo 3 isn't an ugly game by any stretch but it had some awful AA. The engine is designed for large open maps, and several enemies. Halo 3's the storm and floodgate is estimated as 20km - 30km maps and can feature over 25 enemies at once, more if you include the flood. (and not the fake ones like in gears)

http://www.eurogamer.net/ar...

ThanatosDMC2957d ago

If they can manage a ton of enemies on screen plus lots of particles effects (lasers/explosiion/etc), then maybe they can out do Resistance 2.

Xi2957d ago (Edited 2957d ago )

Well, the difference between halo 3 and R2 is already relatively small.

http://www.cinemablend.com/...

Poopface the 2nd2957d ago

going to be a FPS/RTS hybrid. I doubt it, but itd be cool.

RockmanII72957d ago

Reach is made by bungie, so its a FPS

Dareaver12957d ago

In H3 the game is recording everything that happens, and everything is happening in realtime. you can watch your replays, pause and go check out other stuff that was happening when you were playing. also, the light engine was top notch that MDR/HDR lighting was very impressive.

And let's not forget the impressive AI. There is so much code to their AI, it's not even funny.

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Pandamobile2958d ago

Article is bull.

You can't just add DX11 technology like tessalation and domain shaders to a 2005 DX9 GPU.

free2game3652958d ago

I don't get why you go so many negative thumbs. It's not really possible to do, and even trying to reverse engineer things like that will result in poor performance.

edhe2958d ago

Just because something is compliant to an API doesn't mean it's limited to it.

Shaders are programmable, you can do what you will with them.

Major_Tom2958d ago

Lol edhe you clearly don't get it, you just can't make it DX11. It's not a matter of shaders which the Xbox already had shader model 3 probably 3+.

Xi2957d ago (Edited 2957d ago )

the r500, the chip in the 360, does have the ability to do tessellation as it's built into every ati card after the r500's development, but it's limited by the bios. Feel free to search it up on google.

"The GPU is equipped with an extra feature which is not part of the current DirectX 10.0 specification. It contains programmable tessellation units, similar to those within the [xbox 360] Xenos GPU (codenamed "C1") also developed by ATI."

Maybe this is a feature of the "x-engine" to allow the use of tessellation.

Also, panda the Xenos is actually the first DX10 capable card, developed in partnership between ATI and Microsoft, and is why it can do full hdr.

edhe2957d ago

I didn't say anything about dx11 in that comment, what i said is still entirely correct.

Pandamobile2957d ago

I get so many disagrees because Xbox 360 gamers don't know jack sh1t about technology and think because I said something that is impossible is in fact impossible, that I'm doing it just to attack their precious console.

Xi2957d ago (Edited 2957d ago )

if you weren't so wrong.

You posted nothing that proves you're right. Where I've provided direct proof that the 360 is capable of tessellation a feature that's represented in this article.

The card features the ability to do tessellation with it being built into the card.

Tell us, why is it impossible for the xenos to do tessellation.

DevastationEve2957d ago

Xenos was built off of ATI's plans for its future Direct X 10.1 GPU's, the R600/700. When Xenos was first being talked about people used to call it R500, which was incorrect.

Xenos has features that put it above Direct X 10, it's just that the API in use by Xbox 360 dev kits only exposes mostly Direct X 9.0c features, and a few more more to form Direct X Xbox. By upgrading the API and dev kits they can eventually fully utilize Xenos's power.

N4g_null2957d ago

This is also why some developers need that extra ram to test their new code performance.
Two of the new stages are programmable (the hull and domain shader stages) and one is configurable (the tessellator stage). The xbox 360 is not a brute force chip compared to the tech coming out this year for direct x 11 yet if you watch your resources you can make use of the pooled memory set up the xbox 360 has, which is why so many complain about the rsx set up. You see we told you it was not future proof LOL.

This is really the reason why the PS3 was a let down in so many ways, maybe not to the gamers yet more to the developers. The tessellator is a fix function tech and the cell in the PS3 is not powerful enough to produce the same out come as a true fix function set up. It takes the larrabee 30 cores to do what ati will be able to do in one fix function hardware. Devs will need this extra ram to see what is going on with in their code and set up of this tessellator and how it effects the new programmable parts. The commercial tools are coming in august also!

This is new tech we are playing with but it is not uncommon. To use it before MS's API you basicly had to create your own drivers which is pretty hard to do if you are not MS. MS pretty much tells the hardware guys what to support. I'm glad some one leaked this stuff because directX 11 is going to be fun and the new GPU like cpus are going to be fun also. We will get a little next gen bump right now before the next gen. NDAs are in full effect here. ATI is currently ahead of this game by a few years and nvidia was one of the main reason this tech was left unused. What is funny is even in the PC realm this has been confirmed by gamers and devs. Yet no one supported it because ati was the only guys to do some thing with it. Now you have intel jumping in so nvidia has to answer.

Right now people a debugging stuff and a few things have been shown but if we or other developers get what we want from this new tech you will have almost the effect of real time sub divisions happening along with real geometry with normal maps or with out normal maps. If this new method is faster than normal maps then it would be a superior tech. This will mix texture mapping and high polygon modeling together. There is the possibility that you could achieve better looking texture this way and use less ram. Since this is more of a procedural method.

I'm not sure how people are going to get this running on the PS3 in game. I'm sure they can do a tech demo on the CPU but the two new programmable stages will need more shader power (the hull and domain shader stages) and they do not have super fast access to ram yet the xbox 360 does have that fast sram that PC video card do not even have.

If MS does pull this off or developers do pull this stuff off then it will leave the PS3 in the dust yet we are unable to know how much we can exploit this new api yet. So xbox 360 fan boys should not pull out their fire works yet. What was funny was people would try to use these feature before but the debug coding would get rejected.

For more info and stuff that is not sealed in the NDAs try this location.

http://msdn.microsoft.com/e...

This is why I call SONY's acts chest beating. Every one knows what they are working with and we all know that nvidia was way behind ati when they made these chips for these console. On top of this any benifit that the cell could add would be crippled by the data bus and lack of dedicated hardware. The people that knew the xbox 360d hardware tried to tell these guys that the 360 was no chump.... every one was dismissed as fanboys. Now we have a potential spec update coming from a mere api upgrade LOL and if SONY does not have an answer then we have a problem on top of a looming price drop that would cause sony to loose even more money. SONY would loose the elite crown and get called a high tech dvd player and it would stick this time.

I always said that MS baited sony into this game of HD gaming and the gamer co-signed it. After all of this hype about how the PS3 is so powerful it may not be able to support some thing as important as a api update. Yet we will all be waiting. Yet even if they do support it the nvidia hardware will hold the PS3 back. This could get really ugly for SONY because they claim and hold on to the claim that their tech is better and it warrants such a high price. If you like blu rays then yes but tech wise this is about graphical APIs and even though the xbox dies so much that will not effect it too much once we see what the dev community is able to do with this new api.

Pandamobile2957d ago

Okay, guess I was wrong. I didn't realize ATi's 1xxx series had tessalator units.

iMad2957d ago (Edited 2957d ago )

very true. and this is why MS said in 2005 they made Xenos GPU 2 gen ahead of time. And that's why MS will win this HD gen. I wonder how clever Microsoft is. They know their stuff.

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Natsu X FairyTail2958d ago (Edited 2958d ago )

Yeah Halo could use a New engine! And Less Power Rangers like Colors that always had me saying halo is wack.

Im not a big halo fan but after seeing ODST which looks Darker , I felt like getting into the series so ODST shall be my 1st Halo game I actually buy with my own money.

mrv3212958d ago

I couldn't agree more, I wasn't sure if Halo was a serious shooter, the enemies need an upgrade. I mean yes at first the squeek is funny but your fighting a war, I want some enemies that would scare me... and not be my childs toy.

edhe2958d ago

Colour in games is nice, so's humour.

A good shooter doesn't have to be devoid of character to be good.

GodGinrai2958d ago

agreed...personally i like lots of colour. when i think of video games i think of Ridge racer type 4`s light trails and halos conevenant weapons shooting shards/beams of deadly neon ammo.OKami looks like ink coming to life, jet sat radio looks and feels right.One of the reasons i want a for that patapon game, the art style is just crazy! N+ and mirrors edge have this simplistic ,funtional beauty about them (the way things are cleverly color coded in mirrors edge is what drwas me to still do the time trials...)

There is some thing almost hypnotic about skillfully/narrowly dodging a needlers/plasma rifles and hearing those searing FX while focusing on your targets.It just puts me in this zone where im an unstoppable pwnin machine.COD4 is my current favorite fps..but halo is always near saying "im not done with you!"..

Reach is by far the game i want the most next year. I KNOW bungie are gonna turn the heat up! new tech, and a new take on the halo universe.."color" me impressed :)

deadreckoning6662958d ago

Can't wait for this, Agent, and God of War 3. Id be cool ta see at least SOME Natal implementation.