Are use games sales evil? Check out what Universal's Pete Wanat, Bethesda's Todd Howard, Raven's Brian Raffel, Insomniac's Ted Price, Gas Powered Games' Chris Taylor, and id's Todd Hollenshead have to say on the hot-button issue.
I always wondered why the stores do not give money back to the publisher for the used games sold.
Yeah, that is a good idea
The reason they don't is because they're not legally obligated to. When a company makes a product, they have various legal rights in that game. They have the right to publish, the right to distribute, the right to broadcast (in the case of a football game on TV, for example), and so forth. However, when a consumer purchases that product in some tangible form (software, cartridge, DVD, blu-ray, CD, etc.), that company's rights in that particular product (that particular unit) is now extinguished with some exceptions (i.e., obviously the company still owns the trademark and copyright on the logo, the artwork, and so forth). This means the consumer is free to do nearly anything they want with that product. The consumer can give the product away, destroy the product, throw the product away, keep the product, use it to prop up their desk, etc. The moment that product passes to a consumer for the first time, it can now be resold, traded, destroyed, or whatever an infinite number of times. Of course, there would probably be other legal issues if, for example, the consumer decided to open up a for-profit arcade at their home and charge people to come over and play their games. I sympathize with these game developers much more than I sympathize with companies that make music or movies to be honest. I know it's hypocritical, but I guess it's also partially because I think most movies and music is garbage these days, so I really don't care if, for example, Hollywood and the RIAA lose money. But when a good movie or TV show comes out, I will buy it. I boycotted music after the RIAA started being assholes though, and, no, I don't pirate music either. But for game developers, I feel bad for them for a lot of the reasons they already mentioned in the video. I think it's a good idea for game developers to create incentives for gamers to hold onto their game copies longer, however, I do not think cutting the game into segments and releasing, say, 50% of it online through DLC that gamers have to purchase is the answer. It's bad enough that brand new games cost $60. If you're going to charge us an additional, say, $20 to buy alternate costumes, new maps, new characters, or whatever, then that starts to get pretty ridiculous, IMO, and there's just more incentive for consumers to pirate games, buy used games, or to just avoid games that are clearly gouging consumers like that. For example, another controversial issue is game companies working on DLC before the game is even released. It's one thing if the launch game is so packed with content that you really can't fit much more, but I think that's probably not the case, at least on PS3, given the storage capacity of blu-ray. On the other hand, I don't think developers should become slaves to their old games where they have to periodically always be releasing new free DLC just to discourage piracy and/or people selling their games to places like Gamestop. There needs to be some kind of balance, and I'm not sure what that balance would be. One random idea is maybe game companies themselves could get into the used game market. Think of companies like BMW that sell certified, used refurbished BMWs at discount prices. Gamestop doesn't give a consumer jack **** for what a game or console is actually worth in comparison, so game companies wouldn't have to offer too much more to buy the games from the consumers and re-sell it themselves.Of course, that will cut into the game company's bottom line profits as well though.
an excellent and well stated post, nightelfmohawk. Bubbles. I will say, I am usually against buying used games and/or trading them in. If there is a game I want and I just I don't quite have the money, then I may pick out a couple of games that I no longer play and can't see ever playing again, and trade them in. But mostly, I buy it new and keep them. ...except when it came to Fallout 3. When Mr. Howard from Bethesda said that the PS3 version wouldn't be getting the helpful patch, it upset me. So I grabbed my copy and gave it to gamestop and used the credit towards my K2 preorder. Childish? Yep. But maybe they should take care of ALL the consumers who purchased their product.
I'll give the video a watch on my lunch break but my quick thoughts on the subject: With nearly all products customers are entitled to sell them as pre-owned if they no longer have a use for them. Why should it be different for games. Also some may argue but... if a game is really good then it's less likely to get traded in and so if people will end up buying a new copy anyway, if developers make a poor game chances are you will see alot of pre-orders available for that game. I'd say the biggest scandal is trading a game in to a store, them giving you x amount of money and then selling it for more than double what they paid you for it! I know they gotta make a profit but it's ridiculous.
Slapped in the wall of Text on CDs/Manual is "Cannot be resold"
If games are priced fairly to begin with i'll quite happily pay full whack. For example Killzone 2 and SF IV have both cost me £28 brand new. Of course game pricing will come down to the company selling it on, some companies like Game in the UK who have practically monopolised high street pricing...charging £50 for a game that can be bought online for close to half the price, then charging £40 for it pre-owned...
A lot of gamers here (in Portugal) are using online UK stores to buy new games! New releases, like SF4 and Killzone2, cost around £62 (70Euros). And then, they show up @ Gamestop and Game stores, used for 65E. Games like Hallo 3, MGS4, Lost Odyssey, Bioshock are still priced @ 60~65E used... Even Ps2 used games are sold above 45E... So we, I included, buy games from Uk online retailers... And I'm sure that A LOT of people do this!
A simple but not a total fix would be to change the law so that used games sold at gamestop, gamestation etc have to give some of the profits from used game sales back to the game creaters obviously this doesnt stop places like ebay from selling used games and getting 100% profit but its a start
People will still sell used games to each other. That's not going to end anytime soon. They'll probably just turn to the internet in larger numbers. I remember before the PS3 launched, Sony had a patent for some technology that would imprint games on an individual console so, once it was played for the first time it would be registered to and could only be played on one console and one console only. I shudder even to think of it. Thankfully this didn't make it's way into the PS3. I wouldn't buy nearly as many games if it weren't for the fact I can sell them again when I'm finished or tired of them.
Nickel & dime updates sold as full price games are evil. Looking at you EA, Activision etc.
I try to buy new games as much as I can. If the game is good enough; I pay full price for it. Maybe they should come up with a re-sell license fee for used game sells. Gamestop is making way too much money out of used games. They buy your used game for $25 (if you're lucky), when you paid $60, then they sell again for $55.
Being able to sell a game and then the inclusion of Achievements have turned the majority of gamers into obsessed game score chasers. No one plays a game for the enjoyment, it's all about glitching your way to getting that silly gamer score then racing to the next title. They need to ban used sales and remove achievement scores. Leave achievements in games only to unlock items. Remember the days when you played a game because you loved it? Not because you have to play 393 more ranked matches to get your silly 10 points.
its a hard one to call ,this has been happening for years in the uk,game even does bundle deals for used games,360 games can be like 3 for 15 pounds,ps2 are going like 5 for 20 pounds even the ps3 has 2 for twenty pounds.its a no brainer for them they make more money on second hand games than new so i can,t see them changing there buisness model any time soon.thats why all this dlc content is hitting week in week out trying to get back a few quid on the new and second hand market.
If I buy a used car, I'm not giving money to Toyota If I buy a used computer, I'm not giving money to Dell If I buy a used book, I'm not giving money to Stephen King (or his publisher). What about games that are no longer available retail? I've picked up many old PS2 games that haven't been available as new for years. Should we ban ALL used game sales? In fact, I've picked up games that I then went out and bought a sequel to that was new on the shelf from the same company. That was a used game sale that actually profited the developer. What devs are really complaining about are used games sales right after release when the game is full price. I no longer buy games full price because the price drops so fast so quickly that by the time I get to play it, the price has plummeted. Are publishers going to start telling me I have to buy the game at full price now and not to wait 3-6 months? The rental market is just as much to blame as the used market and perhaps moreso. I don't know why they come down so hard on used but not on rental. Ted Price even mentioned in the video he uses Gamefly and said it's something he has pondered as to whether he should do it or not.
Heres an idea. Publishers : Quit charging so much for new games!!
The problem with this is that the prices of games (at least in North America) have not gone up in price over the last 10-15 years. I just found a box with my old NES and games inside, and there was a box for Super Mario 2, and it had a price sticker on it for $64.99 (I'm Canadian). Games now cost $59.99. However the cost of producing a AAA game has increased exponentially, but the video game market penetration has increased as well. Point is, obviously you want everything cheaper, but I don't think new games cost too much, or else I wouldn't be buying them.
@10.1 Ps1 games were $29.99 - $39.99 PS2 games were $39.99 - $49.99 PS3 games are $59.99 So yes the game price have been going up. The reason NES games were so expensive was because of the cartridge format and were not on CD,DVD or BR which is a much less expensive medium, which is why the PS platform became so popular with devs when it released.
The developers need to give the consumer a reason to buy a game new, instead of picking up a used copy. Used games at gamestop are usually only $5 cheaper than the new version. If a big new release is coming out, how about the Developer release some DLC along with the game's release. The NEW version of the game INCLUDES a redeemable code in the instruction manual so the consumer gets this DLC for free with his purchase of the game. If he later gets tired of the game and trades it in, the code that came with that game is used, so the person buying the used version does not get the DLC for free, but rather has to pay for it. A couple of games have already done this, and I bought a new copy instead of a used version: Rockband 2 (20 free DLC) and COD4 GOTY edition (With the free map pack). It's a little more work for the developers, but if they want to insure people buy a game new, it might be worth it.
but, there are games out there that are fun but, defiantly not worth it, for example, dark sector, I like the game but it is not worth 60.00 I picked it up for 15.00 including shipping from newegg. but, if it was still 60.00 I would have bought it used gamefly or traded it at goozex. I really think that if they had a price scale rather than a blanket price for every new game then a game could be priced properly, as a new release I think that dark sector should have been around 35.00. If you think about it, a developer knows when a game is not the greatest. Legendary is no Killzone 2 and everybody knew it even before it came out. so what would have been the big deal pricing it at 35.00 they would have definitely sold more copies. and probably made more money in the long run because the flaws and gameplay issues are a little easier to swallow when a game is priced properly.
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