Sure, the vision of more beautiful and bigger games is a great one, but we probably should leave it for now.
No one is realistically expecting the PS5 within the next two years. Sony hasn't given any indications either, It's primarily just the media hype echo chamber that keeps regurgitating the same circular argument.
Except those who claim Sony confirmed it for next year
Probably XB fanboys who argue that Sony needs new hardware to compete with XBX. Delusional indeed.
2020 is the earliest we'll see a PS5 imo . There's too much goodness in store for this gen
The next Playstation will be leagues above the latest Xbox. I don't think there will be much to compete against.
@ILostMyMind You really did losee your mind. I remember when the x came out, so many sany fanboys on this site all of a sudden started talking abut ps5. I swear they could not fathom that xbox was supperior to the ps4pro hardware
If it is out in the next year it will be competing with the XBOX and not Microsofts next gen system which would be a fatal mistake. I don't think we'll see it until 20-21, we need more tech advancement.
You say that like it's true. Sony has indicated that PS4 sales have peaked, and the rest of PS4's major exclusives will be out by the end of 2019. --- I'll re-post a pretty solid comment I saw yesterday from MrSec84 --- http://n4g.com/news/2169314... "New generations come every 6 years, literally the only one that was stretched longer was the PS3 and that wasn't in all regions, since Sony's biggest (Europe) had a 6.5 year gap from PS3 to PS4. PS2 was selling ridiculously well (better than any previous console), but that didn't stop Sony moving forward with the next gen. As for your argument about Sony "Blowing Their Load", they have loads of developers and partners to the point where they could announce a bunch more PS4 games, on top of what they already have announced for PS4 and still bring a decent launch window worth of games for PS5 from Late 2019 and beyond. The company's past calendar windows supports a 6 year gap between PS4's launch and PS5's. PS4 Pro isn't selling as well as the base model, it's branded by Sony from launch as a mid-gen refresh of PS4, not a new start to the 8th gen. That midpoint was three years, November 2019 is 3 more, plus the tech exists to vastly improve on what even PS4 Pro can do, like at least 3X the raw power of that system, in GPU performance alone, with architecture improvements PS5 can easily have at least 5X that level. CPU improvements will be ridiculous, with Ryzen curbstomping the you know what out of Jaguar, Ryzen 2 and 3 are even better. Navi GPUs can offer GTX 1080+ levels of power for around $250, that's retail price, not what Sony will pay for bulk hardware prices. Tech is available for a 2019 to make a huge step up in performance over PS4, for the same kind of price point that system was launched for. Even RAM will see the usual growth in volume of storage and bandwidth increases over PS4. Sony have said PS4's sales have peaked, it's on a slow decline now. Releasing PS5 Fall 2019 wouldn't cannibalise PS4's final years, because it would be targeted at the early adopters if next, PS4 will continue to sell to gamers looking for affordability and a great library of content. Literally every argument for PS5 being more than 2 years away isn't based on any real evidence. The tech is there, costs, volume of parts for production will be, importantly we're well into this generation, a standard length of time for a Sony games console and more importantly developers want a bigger canvas to make their art. Devs have had issues with game performance due to the CPUs, they can do more, with more powerful tech as a baseline and they can't do native 4K, which will be the standard screen resolution soon. There's nothing dumb about this at all, it's dumb to argue against the facts. Unless 7nm hits any issues over the next 6 months we're getting PS5 holiday 2019."
Cheers for the kind words. We heard all this from naysayers, back in 2012, when rumors of PS4 Dev Kits started doing the rounds. Timing fits a 2019 launch, but because a certain few are getting anxious because they only bought a PS4 when Pro launched, they assume the generation started back in 2016. It's been 4 and a half years, Sony never goes beyond 7 years, 6 years is their standard generational gap. I could understand if there were reports about 7nm having production issues, but TSMC has already reported their initial tape out went well and mass production is in full swing. I don't think we've heard about every PS4 game that 1st Party has in the works or 3rd party stuff, but even if Sony announces stuff for 2020 and beyond they support their platforms well into the next-gen. Just wishing a new gen won't happen, doesn't make it truth.
Very well said. I think the currently announced titles also point to a 2019 launch as well, as they all should be out by the end of next year. Unless Sony announces more titles a few years out at this year's E3 I fully believe the PS5 is a Holiday 2019 or Spring 2020 release.
Mr.sec and you get it Ive been saying this for the last year or more I get down voted to hell when I do. Nice to see other people who understand the gaming market.
@Mr.Sec They dont have to wait for 7nm to be in full swing or ready. First gen Ryzen APUs are 12nm they could go with that and move Ps5 midgen refresh to 7nm giving the process an additional 3yrs to mature and work out problems.
Nice post and exited for a new generation of Sony PlayStation soon!!
the big problem right now is that ram is expensive, I imagine the ps5 will have quite a bit of it.
The problem with a 2019 launch is price of hardware needed for a generation jump and cutting PS4 sells short. Even if the ps4 reached its alleged peak, it’s still going to sell around 20m consoles again for 2018. And even if there is a fall off in 2019 it’s still going to be at least 15 - 18m for that year. Launching a PS5 holiday 2019 guarantees the PS4 won’t sell the well into 2020 which could easily be another +10 million in sales if Sony waited until 2020. The PS4 hardware is pure profit at this point, and anyone who runs a legitimate business knows you don’t cut your product / profit line short, and the PS4 is that. A 2020 PS4 launch nearly guarantees another 45m in sales for PS4 for 2018, 2019, and 2020 and a slow crawl for PS4 sells into 2021. It also gives Sony time to create an APU with AMD featuring a 7nm Ryzen 2 cpu + 7nm Navi GPU with at least 12 TFLOPS of performance in a $399 - $499 console without taking a huge loss day 1, and giving the technology enough time to mature so there’s enough supply to meet the demand for not only PS5, but Xbox 4, and the PC market. That extra year matters.
Sony probably would have delayed the ps3 further If the 360 wasn't doing well for the prior year. The parts were expensive on launch, and not easily available to source for production. Then only reason I think 2020 is more likely is because there aren't any dev kits available, and the ps4 itself is still selling quite well. On top of that Sony will want to get most of its current gen released be for marketing a new system Anyhow, while 5-6 years has usually been the typical generation, there is no set rule that has to be the case. On top of that there is the mid gens, and the fact that a new gen isntnreally needed as soon as some people act like it is.
First, a console in 2019 will not be Navi. Sorry AMD isn't even releasing production samples for OEMs until later this year. Which means you won't see $500+ based discrete cards until early Spring 2019. There is no way AMD is going to be ready with an APU based on Navi with the power/heating requirements and at most importantly at a price point of a console within a year of its release. Actually, I take that back it won't be a year it will have to be ready less than 6 months after Navi is possibly released into production for actual GPU cards. Any 2019 console release means that AMD would have to have working Navi based APU and in large-scale production in May 2019 for Sony to release a console based on Navi for a Holiday 2019 release. Not to mention AMD is not going to be willing to cut into there ability to compete with Nvidia at that lucrative actual dedicate card market so early (where they make actual money not scaps from an APU in a console). Just look at scaling now with Vega. AMD can't even get out the Vega-based APU almost a year after that GPU was released running at PS4 levels (only 1.74 TFLOPS for 2400g APU and at $160). AMD's promised better APU has been delayed because of issues. And even that APU only gets to the sphere of the X and at over $250 price tag for the board. So scaling this chips takes time and Navi will not be ready that early. Do not forget that the APU on a console priced at $399 must be around $140 (and that is for both Ryzen and a GPU combined) And bulk-pricing will not cut $100 off a $250 device. So, don't expect that Navi in anything in 2019. Maybe in 2020 if the capability and price point can be reached and of course if AMD can keep on schedule. Also, note the rumors, the rumor states 11TFLOPS for the PS4. That is within the range of the Vega capabilities. And forget Vega is also is being moved downed to 7nm.
^^^ Edit: I meant the rumored 11 TFLOPS for PS5 (obviously not PS4 as I mentioned above)
GDDR6 though... It's only 15-20% more expensive than GDDR5 but no card has it yet. 2020 may be realistic for this, but I wouldn't complain in the slightest if we got PS5 in 2019. 2019 or 2020 is fine with me.
I agree with you Raptor. Very well said, not much I can add.
Yes they are.
i can see them release it holiday 2020, the ps4 would still have some support for the first year the ps5 is available I imagine.
Sony confirmed there's no hardware at this year's E3 and no one has dev kits, I can't see it being announced next year either. 2020 is the absolute earliest we can expect it, I don't know why so many people want it to release earlier.
the only people talking about Ps5 are you journalists. no one else.
I'm talking about it, does that mean I have a lucrative future as a game journalist? Or that I'm just a fan who can't get enough awesome PlayStation
You're right, lately there has been one article after another. It's almost like there's nothing else to talk about... kind of crazy with all these exclusives come out one after another
It started when the rumors started, with a rumor of dev kits and some other rumor which I forgot what it was.
Actually it started at the launch of the XB1x. Still does not change the fact were not going to see a PS5 till 2020 A 2019 announcement would be a 25 year anniversary in Japan, and a 2020 release would be the 25 anniversary for US/other territories. 7nm becomes more affordable and mainstream. A huge parallel launch with TLOU2 in 2020, This makes sense because Days Gone developer said DG would be out before TLOU2 and DG is out in 2019 (probably)
why don't we all just wait till Sony officially talks about it.
Exactly. Sony has never officially confirmed anything about the PS5 yet. Obviously it is just for the clicks
It's too soon, I don't get why we see 3+ PS5 articles a day now. Now that Sony has made clear it won't be at E3, can we focus on the upcoming games now?
Right? It's like people still find a way to circle back to where they want to be. "No new hardware at E3?" "Aha! They must be saving it for TGS!" Sony is in a pretty good position to wait. They're atop the sales. Ninty has a good seller of their own, but it won't match PS4 sales anytime soon if ever, and Ninty has absolutely no reason to introduce another console. MS does. They can use a "reset" on the current landscape. However, they just released the X. They can't keep pushing out new hardware to reinvigorate their base. At some point, the leap of faith their consumers take on their hardware is going to have to be rewarded by exclusive software.
Well it won't be announced on this year E3 for sure but rather it will have it own PlayStation Conference(probably 2019 or 2020 PlayStation Experience) and they will tease the next console starting with next gen controller and showing us another amazing trailer of PS1-PS4 generation, and then announced 2nd/3rd party games partnerships and 1st Party game been work by home Studio.Then on E3 show the console and its game.
Because the market and Sony have admitted Ps4 has hit the peak and is on a downward slide not to mention the power gap between Ryzen and Bulldozer based cpus is night and days. The tech is there, the market conditions are there and whether people like it or not the demand is building from devs and consumers for new tech.
Of course but not yet. 2020 is fine.
The demand from consumers and devs can hold out to 2020 though. Any game that just started for next gen, or even started a year ago based on potential specs, wouldn't release before 2020.anyhow. for Sony at least, they have enough software to carry them through next year. And finally, the consumer demand isn't as high as it would seem on here, because not everyone is chomping at the bit for 4k, or even thinks the actual software has peaked for this gen. Furthermore, the longer Sony waits the less chance ms can one up them with their next console, because ms is in a much weaker position in terms of needing a new gen to reboot their hardware sales.
Ps2 showed a small decline previous to the price cut of which made it sky rocket to the level we all know now. The games still provide unrivaled quality and it is time for price cuts before mentioning a new console. Any intelligence in business knows that is what the first “decline” in any product means... it has peaked within its price range, not quality. As long as Sony goes reverse/forward compatibility, there is no concern if new hardware comes out tomorrow... in the long run in the near future, a cheaper ps4 will do better than a ps5 globally just like the ps2 did to the ps3.
Yes. The barrage of PS5 articles are kind of confusing since Sony hasn't even mentioned or hinted at the ps5 coming out soon.
How about we just enjoy this gen first and wait until official word from Sony.
Ive been enjoying this gen for about 5yrs doesnt mean I cant be excited or ready for next gen.
Way too soon. Give it a few years
2021/2022 release imo
So you think this PlayStation Generation is going to be 8 to 9 years long? You realise that 7 years is the longest Sony's ever done right? That was because it took them longer to gain a return on PS3 hardware (Vs ps2) due to the economy and costly nature of using Blu-ray and the Cell Processor in that system. Even with that being the case there was still only a 6.5 year gap between PS3 and PS4 launching in Europe (Sony's biggest market). PS4 Pro was not the start of a new generation, it was stated outright by Sony to be a mid-gen upgrade, after three years, that means three years after 2016 is when a new generation starts. This fits with Sony's history. The latest PS5 will launch is 2020, if the PS4's American launch is anything to go by, but given Sony recouped costs early, have had years of Profits, PS4 has started to dip in sales, tech is ready for sooner, rather than later and developers are free to be working on games ready for that timeframe 2019 seems the most likely time PS5 will come out.
They have also never done a mid gen refresh like the Pro. Since you're Obsessed with history, how does that fit in?
Nicely said. @jaycptza Like sony said themselves they said they don't want a long generation like last time. So we know it's not coming 2021 or 2022. They also said pro is a midgen which is the keyword halfway into the gen. 3 years of ps4 3 more years with pro which it will be end of 2019. Seeing how ps4 is still doing well they might add a extra year being ps5 in 2019 or 2020. With sony never done a midgen refresh before it doesn't matter it came out with slim just like the previous systems that came out with a slim midway through. Also to note pro isn't flying off shelves like ps4 did. Also to note if and only if the rumor of dev kits is true is another knock of a ps5 in 2019/2020.
It can't be the middle if it's not coming half way between the beginning and the end. Pro would have released November 2017 if the next gen was starting in 2021 or May 2018 if it was 2022. 2016 is not the middle if your console's initial launch is 2013.
The more we wait the better. Because hardware.
Then you may as well never release another console if that’s your logic.
Well there is exciting tech coming in the next year or so. 2020 is most likely I think. That and tech stagnated for a while when Intel and Nvidia had no competition. Plus ram prices are ridiculous at the moment.
We're 4 & a half years into the generation, a standard PlayStation generation is 6 years, besides the gap between PS3 to PS4.
7nm is going to make an AMD GPU with GTX 1080 levels of performance a reality at $250, retail price, for Sony that's going to be at least half that, with a minimum of 8GBs of very fast memory tacked onto that price included. We already have 4 Core, 8 Thread Ryzen 1 CPUs and bigger which utterly destroy the CPU in PS4 for crazy cheap prices, which again would be much less for Sony to buy per unit. Developers are freed up in Sony's camp to have been working on new games for at least the last couple of years right now, Holiday 2019 system release would be easily achievable by Devs who are good at making target dates (eg: Guerrilla Games, Housemarque, Japan Studio, etc). Holiday 2019 is the most likely point in time PS5 will come out. That timeframe has no effect on the late generation adopters, if you think it's too soon, then you haven't been a PlayStation gamer or even a console owner for very long. So many people are acting like this console generation began when they bought a PS4, after it had already been out for 3 years. If you don't want a PS5 in late 2019 (assuming it comes out then), then get one later. Wait until it's at a price point more to your liking, has a bigger library of games that you want to play on it. Don't keep begging for Sony to wait until 2021 or beyond because you think the generation began when you bought a PS4. It makes me laugh that we heard all of this back in 2012, people moaning that it was too soon for PS4, when similar rumors of early Dec kits started doing the rounds, we've already heard about PS5 kits being given to multiple 3rd Party Devs. If it happens, then there's nothing you can do, PS5 will release regardless of when you bought a PS4. If Devs want more capable hardware, to make the games they want to, that run better than current gen is capable of doing and there's a market for that device, then Sony will deliver it, if conditions allow for that. Conditions will allow for a box, with the kind of specs I mention above, to release for $399, 4K Blu-ray Drive, way more RAM (not just 2X PS4), a true generational shift over PS4 to launch Holiday 2019. No it is not too soon, 2018 is, but 2019 isn't.
Yeah, if not Holiday 2019 I could see a Spring 2020 release. I think the PS4 will stay on the market for a while too. The PS3 and PS2 did. On top of that any third party game that can run on Switch will also run perfectly fine on PS4/Xbox One. I imagine we'll see next-gen games on PS5/Xbox 2/PC and then the games that aren't nearly as CPU-dependent will also release on PS4/Xbox One/Switch. With that in mind I can see the PS4 being perfectly well off for a couple years into the PS5's life.
Dont forget if we are hearing about 3rd party devs kits first party will have had devs kits for almost two years now. First party devs usually get first crack.
I wrote a pretty long post, but I did I mention that. Tbh a physical development kit isn't really needed, since Devs can approximate specs with standard PC hardware, then port their next gen games to the real PS5 when the more finalized kits are released by Sony. If EA, Activision, Ubisoft, etc already have theirs then core Sony teams would undoubtedly have had them for longer. There has to be a bunch of developers testing out what's possible on new hardware and provide feedback to the hardware creation team working with Cerny and the ICE Team to create the new OS, API and common Engine (next-gen Phyre Engine or whatever it's going to be called). Along with actually making the completed device at the hardware level, it's the only way these things get done.
you sound like me MrSec. the industry doesnt stop because a select few want then to. It will still proceed on schedule like it always has. A new system does not automatically mean the older is cut off right then and there and many seem to think it does. Sony hasn't done that ever in their console history (MS on the other hand....). I been saying 2019 at the earliest or 2020 if they wanted to wait one more year and go for 20th anniversary of PS2. MS will likely bring out a new system in 2020 at the earliest or 2021 to coincide with og xbox 20th anniversary
I'd personally wait for a PS5 whenever it does come out I waited to get the PS4PRO and good thing I did I would have been pissed if I bought one and they released the PRO they can release an upgrade the PS5. Microsoft released 2 upgrades to the Xbox One the S does 4k with a handful of games and now they have the X is out and neither have really taken off with sales Playstation fans are awaiting the PS5 which will be the worlds most powerful console.
Early... Late... What was the release date that Sony said?
It's never too soon for more PlayStation !
What about Xbox?
Unless some of the forecast of exclusives already announced are actually ps5 launch titles then yes it's too early. You don't end a gen with an excellent lineup like that then immediately eclipse it with a brand new console, it makes no sense.
As long as Sony builds in backward compatibility, it could come out tomorrow and wouldn't matter. Enjoying my X1X, but Sony has the games now and near future. E3 might reveal something new for MS but whatever it is will likely take another year or more to get here. Earliest AAA exclusive by April 2019. Meantime, the multiplatform title resolution bumps are nice for tech heads like me, but in motion, eh not so much to talk about. With a 3 to 1 lead over MS this gen, a better system that doesn't leave PS4 player base in the dust will only entice people to upgrade. I'm thinking we'll see a PS5 release holiday season 2019. If all these wild games just released and coming soon that took 4 years or so to produce play on a shiny new PS5 and run 4K 60fps using the new hardware, forget it. Next gen is already won in that case.
yeah it is, i don't see ps5 before 2020
Enough w/ ps5 stories!! When a credible rumor or announcement is made then post that. These stories are stupid and frequent. I’m going to start failing submissions under “lame”.
PS4 is dominating the market. There is no rush for a new console. They can take their time for research. There is also no competition from MS. 2021 could be the announcement.
its coming Oct/Nov 2020. Mark my words.
By owning the Pro, maybe that's why I'm not that eager for the PS5 release anytime soon. Last gen, I felt the need for a new gen because I couldn't stand the upscaled 720p images with 20+ fps. Today, I'm satisfied when the images are at 1440p with solid 30fps. For next gen, I would prefer a later release date for better tech and price. 4K/60fps is what I look and hope for for next gen.
60FPS is always going to depend on how developers use the resources available. Devs could be given an 8 Core, 16 Thread 3rd Gen Ryzen CPU clocked at 4GHz, pair that with a 72CU Navi GPU, clocked at 1.75GHz with over 16TFlops of raw performance (50% or higher improvement in IPC Vs Jaguar architecture), pack 32GBs of GDDR6, which would be many times faster and still target 1440p 30FPS or even 1080p if they wanted to try using the latest Ray Tracing or funky rendering tech in their games. The good news is that even a 4Core 8Thread 1st Gen Ryzen CPU is 3 about 3 to 4X faster in unoptimized games that are demanding to run this generation, the CPU could still manage 2X+ more performance and run more AI and Physics work loads. Even 10TFlops using Navi architecture would be like having a 15TFlop Pitcairn GPU, with some unique features that weren't in PS4's GPU architecture. With modern momery saving features 16GBs of GDDR5 is likely good to run current gen games, with high to ultra settings at 4K 60FPS locked. Custom tweaks, chucking all of that lower level processing tech on a single die or using Infinity Fabric to connect the CPU and GPU would also eak out more from those parts probably allowing next gen visuals in the range of native 4k down to 1440p Checkerboarded to a 4K output and many games running at 60FPS. Vega may even do on the GPU side, but Sony will use Navi architecture if it's stable and cost effective for them. You won't be getting a machine more expensive than $399/£349 even if Sony makes an 8Core16thread machine, with a 16tflop GPU and a 4K Blu-ray drive in 2019 and that will be possible by Fall next year. What Devs do with it will be up to them. Sony can't mandate Devs limit graphical effects, physics and AI to guarantee X Res or Performance features. Most likely they'll show what's possible pushing their hardware, just like this gen, but I think the above specs have a good chance of doing next gen visuals at 1440/1800p 60FPS, pretty stable. Solid FPS and Frame Pacing should be the main focus when it comes to performance. Resolution shouldn't be as much of a priority, not when new temporal reconstruction technologies can provide great IQ enhancements for little or no cost to hardware resources.
I agree. I understand the balance and sacrifices that goes on in the development of a game between FPS vs resolution vs textures vs AI etc. It's just that looking at GOW, HZD, UC4, etc, I feel that with great jump in power, devs might just add a bit more textures, improved AI, enemies on screen, destructive environments, etc that will take a good hit in the power. But, I totally forgot about lighting - how some fire effects and shadows require more work from this gen. So 1440p - 1800p/ 60fps might be common for next gen.
I'm still holding firm to a February 2019 unveil and a Fall, 2019 release with The Last of Us Part 2, Death Stranding, Anthem, and Cyberpunk 2077 being some of the first PS4/PS5 cross gen titles.