Phil Spencer addresses the possibility of a deal that holds back technical performance.
"I'm gonna struggle to not get myself in trouble on this one," he said. "I'll just say: I don't know anything about other development deals. You mentioned some things around clauses and stuff that I don't know anything about. But if anybody was to do a deal to hold back technical innovation on a video game anywhere else, that doesn't feel good for the industry to me." Thats how everyone should feel.
The guy from Gamepsot thinks there is some deal with Sony and Destiny 2 that might be holding back Xbox One X but Phil didn't want to get into it because he doesn't know and wants to believe its not true. What he does say with confidence is Xbox One X is much more powerful than Pro. It's just too bad Bungie wont push for 60fps on it even if they had to lower the resolution, https://www.youtube.com/wat...
"The guy from Gamepsot thinks there is some deal with Sony and Destiny 2 that might be holding back Xbox One X but Phil didn't want to get into it..." FALSE No one THINKS there's a deal that holds back Xbox One X. They are asking about the scenario if it were, which is why Phil danced around the question since it's hypothetical. Xbox One X has a hard enough time getting its own first party games to 60fps, so I'm gonna say that it's hardware limitation again. PC is the place to play it if you want the best version.
Well who knows what kind of deals Sony could be entering to protect its investors. I really hope they wouldn't stoop so low, I mean they don't need to surely with such a massive lead? Who knows though.... The BEAST must break off all the chains!
I'm so sick of this mold and septic it's like there brothers or some wannabe crime fighting team for the X. Almost every article I see them the same crap from there mouth.
It's got nothing to do with the ps4 and Sony that destiny 2 is 30fps on xbox one x The developer has done it so the 30 million xbone owners playing 30fps don't have a disadvantage playing online with the xbox one x owners playing at 60 fps. The only way they could do it is if the xbox one x owners have there own lobby but that want work until millions are sold.
@ Septic The "beast" will never brake it's chains because the only thing that's really holding it back is MS and their refusal to make games exclusively for their systems and fully utilise the power that they have. Until MS start putting in the effort themselves your "beast" will stay toothless. Ever wonder why multi-platform games never look as good or run as well as exclusives? When you are developing games for multiple systems like the creators of Destiny you can't spend extra money or time it takes to squeeze all you juice out unlike exclusives. For example Gears of War 4 is a multi-platform game which runs at 30fps in campaign and 60fps with adaptive scaling on multi-player. Is Sony holding back Gears of War from running at true 4k at 60 fps?
Only stupid people think there is a deal. Destiny was 1080p/30fps on PS4/Xbone even though it could have been better on PS4. Destiny 2 is 1080p/30fps on PS4/Xbone and 4k/30fps on Pro/Scorpio for parity across family platforms. Bungie isn't going to give a small percentage of users a competitive advantage because they ran out to buy a Pro or Scorpio. That's not what console gaming has ever been about. Scorpio isn't a PC, it's a console. Phil needs to just STFU and focus on getting better 1st party studios, and stop thinking that 6 terflops of power is going to somehow manage to turn around the xbox brand.
CPU is weak and the only strength it gains is when games are developed with direct x12, in mind. No dx12 then you still have the same weak as CPU as both the original ps4 and bone.
@Septic Yeh who the Fu*k knows... But if enough people people throw sh*t some of its gonna stick aye ;-). So keep it up. Hopefully some of it lands on your head.
Honestly, Destiny 2 should be 60 fps on both platforms. Both machines (X and Pro) have that capability now. It is the original PS4 and Xbox One possibly holding that back. Again, Spencer taking shots across the bow of everyone but him. Arrogance supreme.
@spaceranger: I read from 3 different sources about the same deal. It's obviously out there for some reason regardless if it's true.
@thekhurg Precisely that. Btw. Phil Spencer probably forgot that his own Xbone console is holding back PS4, Pro and XOX. And also, how in the whole world Pro can hold back XboneX in Destiny 2 if Sony has a deal, but that asshole Phil Spencer forgets that Bungie choose a parity in Destiny 1 between PS4 and Xbone even with deal with Sony. Bungie also upped Xbone version from 900p to 1080p. And did Sony hold back X1 then? Nope!
@thekhurg Then please explain how Destiny 2 can run at 60fps 4K on PC builds weaker than XBX. GTX1080Ti running at max settings https://www.youtube.com/wat... Shut up and stop being a fanboy.
I think XBox One, S is holding back the X.... Reason: Not alienate One or S users. X will shine once One and S is not a factor. Same goes for the Pro. Getting the muscle out of these machines is being stopped by initial consoles.
Oh, give it a rest. People who actually work in the industry aren't this petty. Stop propagating the notion that this was even a possibility.
@jrshankill Maybe because PC doesn't have a crappy Jaguar CPU. Bungie devs said that CPU is holding back to be a 60 fps.
@blackblades sure, once you get rid of them this site can be exclusively for playstation fans
Septic, you need to cool it with all the "BEAST" comments, I think. You are only hurting your own position. It reminds me of 3-4 years ago when every article had like 30 people saying "Greatness awaits" in the comments". Gag....
Once again it's the og x1 holding back the x1x in destiny 2 that way og x1 owners aren't at a huge disadvantage in mp
I wish I could live in the same, fantasy, world as some of you posters on here... this world of intrigue and espionage. The truth is, if you believe that this is happening there has to be a few things happening: A. Sony/MS has to be dirty enough to propose this deal and be confident enough that the other party doesn't turn around and run off to the competitor, or blow the whistle on this practice and B. The Developers are as dirty and really have no moral and really don't care about the gamers. Yea, I threw MS/Xbox up there too, people were saying this same shit during the PS3/360 era... come on, you guys remember, nothing came of it.
@seanpitt23 you're 100% right. It's because the one X shares the same network as xb1 owners. Everyone else claiming it's a deal with Microsoft or that one x is a failure is grasping at straws and sounds like a total moronic fanboy.
@jrshankill LOL You make it sound like something with a 1080Ti is a weaker build when that GPU is packed with 11 teraflops. Regardless, Xbox One X is going to have cases where the CPU will bottleneck the GPU with frame rates. Compare 8 jaguar cores to the Ryzen equivalent, that's 2.3Ghz vs 3.2/3.7 at turbo Ghz speed. The thing is using 2014 components and thus, $500 was born. Expect more 30fps games where Sony has no deal involvement in or are they co-publishing Crackdown 3?
It's this same stuff over and over again. Assassin's Creed, Destiny, both opted for parity on the PS4 and Xbox One even though the PS4 was stronger. People questioned Microsoft's Marketing rights at the time, thinking the PS4 was being held back or prioritized less. Fast forward and they have the marketing rights again with stronger hardware and Ubisoft are going for the same thing. Assassins Creed, Destiny; Parity is just how these devs operate in regards to utilizing the power of the systems. Content is definitely influenced by money though and I do agree with Phil there.
Erm framers team it's clear has been held back by cpu rather than gpu in most cases. The one x I has same cpu just slightly (0.3GHZ?) faster clock k speed as ps4 pro's cpu. Also consider destiny is an online only game and as it also has to run on Xbox one and Xbox one s they may well infact be holding back both the pro and one x versions of the game because of the Base model of each respective console.
Of course that is how everyone should feel, just don't get why people even think this is happening without any evidence whatsoever. Worse even when you realise that these silly thoughts came about because some people somehow thought the One X would be way more powerful than it actually is...
Destiny 2 isn't exactly a spectacular looking game and I'm sure both the 1X and Pro could push 60fps. I think it's the original X1/PS4 that's going to hold things back, especially with online focused games as 60fps players will have an unfair advantage.
Phil is a shithead, they as long as they had the partnerships dictating the games last gen and the beginning of this gen, now they want to cry and complain cause they don't have the power they used to have in the industry because their platform is trash, sounds just like America if you ask me.
Step into my office..... YOU'RE FIRED!!!
Damn dude. I would say I totally agree with you on all that. But seriously, why you gotta bring the great old u s of a into this? Sure we're not perfect, mostly scared individuals being "led" by an orange racist shit head, but still man, damn.
XB is under different leadership now. It should be judged on their actions today. Not only on the actions of the past. And by the way, Sony has become the money hatter now... They have marketing deals galore. And MS does have the money to do those deals. They are just choosing a different path now.
Did he just say he doesn't know anything about others deals? Oh yea, he just said that.
I'm not sure Sony would need to pay Bungie to stick it to Microsoft. I would bet Bungie feels Microsoft stuck it to them so they are going to get revenge where they can.
Bungie was forced to work on Halo well past their desire to keep making Halo. Even after they separated from Microsoft they still had to continue making Halo. Microsoft retained minority ownership. Bungie was a huge part of what established Xbox. Microsoft made hundreds of millions from Halo. They should have given them more freedom while at Microsoft. Expanded the team so that they could work on more than one title at a time. I also read Bungie had to pay Microsoft some money when they left. I assume so that they could keep their name since that carries value too.
Agreed. Bungie no likey Microsoft.
Here we go 🙄, no fucking idiots. The xb1 is going to hold your own new "beast" back. When its time to release an exclusive?? You have to cater to both xb1 and xb1x so you fucked your selves in a corner the moment you made that disaster console made for "tv". I hate when companies do that. Blame others, how about you man up and say your own fuck ups
Didn't Xbox have a parity clause previously? Phil is butt hurt.
Why would the PS4 Pro hold the Xbox One X back when the weakest current gen console is the Xbox One S? It's 2017 and still struggles to play games at 720-900p.
Uhm did you see the interview, the guy NOT Phil, they guy said he was told X1X could do 60fps but Bungie didn't want to do that because of their marketing deal with Sony. I don't know if it was a hypothetical he made up or what but Phil was trying to be diplomatic with his answer. I don't think it's true at all, just folks trying to stir up trouble.
"But it's unclear if that framerate is the result of hardware restrictions or because Sony..." Just folks trying to stir the pot. The Xbox One X has a hard enough time with getting first party games to 60fps.
SpaceRanger, I actually agree with you, while I'm convinced X1X is very powerful and we will see more native [email protected] games, I'm still not delusional enough to think most games will push that, especially for large open world games. I watched the interview on youtube and it sounded like the guy was looking for controversy. On a side note X1 won't hold back X1X because the dev tools are specifically made to optimize on X1X first then scale down easily to X1, where there will need to be parity is most likely in the multiplayer fps so that X1 and X1X multiplayer base won't be split.
"But it's unclear if that framerate is the result of hardware restrictions or because Sony..." SpaceRanger, right. Gamespot is not saying that Sony is holding anything back, or even that Sony has any sort of "parity" agreement with Activision here. It's pure innuendo to get Phil riled up, which frankly surprises me, coming from GS. If they had any facts on such a "parity" deal, they would have disclosed them right here. They didn't, which means the insinuation is rather disingenuous.
Just because you have the power doesn't automatically mean all devs are gonna use it. Sad but true.
Yeah. Imagine game stop trying to garner support for Microsoft. Didn't they get into some stuff over saying or doing something unethical to support Xone when it was released?
"... Phil was trying to be diplomatic with his answer..." except he started it off with saying he was going to struggle with not getting into trouble on his answer - why would he struggle with saying that that was insane to even insinuate that kind of garbage? how would denouncing an outlandish claim get him in trouble?
No the vanilla X1 is the most inferior and Mike Ybarra said their own vanilla console will not hold back scorpio https://www.gamereactor.eu/... So what's your dodge and excuse now
Dodge and excuse? It's a suitable assumption with the sort of performance Xbox One hasn't gotten over the years (and currently has).
Shannon Loftis, boss at Microsoft Studios, replied with an interesting point: "As a developer I would bet no one chooses different framerates for MP games ever." So while single player experiences will likely be enhanced on Scorpio, nobody should be at a disadvantage when playing online. It's right there in writing from the Xbox studios boss. Single player games will likely be enhanced on the X, but multiplayer games should not be. Phil Spencer was asked a question about Destiny 2 on the X1X. Destiny 2 is a multiplayer game is it not?
Of course the original XB1 will hold back XB1 X. XB1 X is not allowed to have exclusives. All games must run on the original Xbox One. That's what you would call the original holding back the X. It's common sense. Anything else is just a PR spin to get you to go out and buy another Xbox.
Everything Phil says is to promote Xbox. They just want to keep it in the news in some way since its getting its butt kicked by the PS4 and outsold 2:1.
PS4 Pro,Xbox One and PS4 are holding back the X1X. The reasonable decision is to cancel those three previous consoles and leave only X1X and PC. Oh wait,cancel the X1X version since it holds back the PC version. This industry is bonkers.
Basically. The ones coming up with this ridiculous excuse and idea are blowing my mind that it's Sony's fault Xbox one x won't have high frame rates on every game. Or native 4K. PC has potentially more power, developers and modders spend more time on their software, and it shows. Consoles aren't holding PC back. PS4 showed it has more power under the hood than Xbox one and S and it shows in the software. PS4 Pro shows it has more under the hood than PS4 and it shows. To think Sony's systems will hold back Microsoft's Xbox one X mid gen update shows that some just don't know about game development. It's a third party developer's choice on what they do with their games. But a smart developer will not split it's base by pushing the limits of animation, physics, A.I., frame rates, etc on one system if they have to play *online* with gamers who can't have that in their game. It creates a disadvantage. Off line? Sure. Online, there has to be a parity if both consoles will be playing the same game. And that's Xbox one s and Xbox one x. Same with PS4 and PS4 Pro. Sony was smart in demanding developers keep the online community together. It's only smart for developers on Xbox to do the same. But gamers who want to not use common sense who want to blame a console, blame the original Xbox one. Or blame the developers. But we told you guys don't expect 4K/60fps in all games. Because some developers are concentrating on graphics over frame rates or their game engine can only do 30fps with what's going on on screen. Use your heads people.
I need to know one thing.. Since all xbox one x is from the same xbox one family... wouldn't a 60fps on X be a problem for 30fps on Xbox one specially during Online gaming?? Also i dont think Pro is the problem here... Xbox fanboys needs to calm down.. If that was the case then i would say Ps4 suffered becoz of xbox one being weak... The point here is the dev is the problem i said it then when 4k30fps was announced on PS4 PRO and saying it now .. But xbox fanboys didnt listen and was claiming scorpio to do 60fps... lol!
"pushing the limits of animation, physics, A.I., frame rates, etc " What about the chemistry and biology?
Right, and also cancel support for all graphic cards that are older than 1 year, because they are holding back their newer high end counterparts.
....I'm actually okay with this lol
PS4Pro and XB1X are a mistake. This mid gen update is BS. Both consoles are going to be held back by the PS4 and XB1. PS4Pro sales are low and I don't expect XB1X sales to do much better. Sony and Microsoft should have waited and released a new console gen by 2019.
It's an upgrade OPTION, how can that be a mistake? Seeing this from a PS owner, I have no problem with a better version coming out for the pro because it doesn't affect my version. As and when I get an HDR 4K set, I'll consider the pro if we aren't too close to a PS5 release, but even then it's still only an option. There is no mandatory requirement for me to upgrade. I'm not getting a diminished library on my base model. Surely options are a good thing.
same , there is no reason for me to upgrade my ps4 and ive only played about 10 games on my ps4 in 3 years, everything else that is multiplatform i would buy on pc most should wait till 2018 for a 4k tv set becuase thats when hdmi 3.0 comes out with 4k 120hz
I'll take those options
@Makish If you are going to wait another year to purchase a 4K/UHD TV I would suggest waiting till 2019/20 for an 8K display. If you are an early adopter or have more money than sense you can get an 8K monitor now for the cheap price of $5000 USD http://www.144hzmonitors.co... Admittedly this display has only a 60 Hz refresh but give it two years. After all who wants a low-resolution 4K display when 8K is only a year or two away. 🙂
well according to reports The PS4 PRO sales are doing good and did push the ps4 to cross its sale to 60mil. Also the gap between the PS4 and Pro is less compared to the gap between the Xbox one and X... So The xbox one x is totally next gen when you compare the specs... PS5 will come around 2020 and Pro will do just fine till then... so will the PS4.. The GOW at E3 was running on the stock PS4 and it looked beautiful... so did Days gone. ..
They are not mistakes...they just aren't for YOU! These consoles aren't meant to be platforms of their own. They are meant to ADD functionality to the original platforms. In the past companies used "slim" models to continue momentum in the middle of a gen. Now, they've added "slim" models AND an upgrade option. The assumption that we won't see consoles before 2019 is a bit silly. There wasn't a ton of money wasted in R&D for these mid-gen consoles and the components are fairly straightforward. Plus, imo, these are more indicative of what each company wanted to release originally. But, price prohibited it. I don't own or plan to own either upgrade. But, I certainly understand why they exist.
PS4 Pro sales are not meant to be "high". The Slimmer, cheaper Slim PS4 will always sell the most. That was always the case and anyone who thought otherwise is a fool. PS4 Pro and XB1 X are for the HARDCORE gamers who want the best of the best. It's not for the casual gamer who just wants to play some Call Of Duty.
That would be MS's problem, not Sony's. MS wanted the bigger p**n to swing because they were feeling small. It seems like MS thinks that it's power that will get the third party support back and favoring xbox. I guess we'll just have to see.
It seems you have no clue what the interview was about. Thanks for stopping by. Jesus man At least tie in your opinion to the interview.
In all fairness, it's called a transition period, and it happens in all technology fronts. Somewhere, something is holding back something else during the transitional period. Media holds back TV capabilities, etc. etc. Nothing really new to see here. Will PS4Pro "hold back" XOne X? Possibly, if devs and pubs choose to do so, but to a very, VERY marginal degree. It's not like we're comparing PS2 to PS1 caliber differences here.
What does the pro have to do with Xbox one games?!!! PS4 over here with their coding... Xboxone one over here with their coding... They are not using PS4 copies of the games on the x. Sony has also built and provided useful tools to take advantage of their hardware that they share with developers... something I still have not heard about from microsoft. I can not believe Microsoft is going full trump. Never go full trump.