Achievement points are an integral part of the Xbox 360 gaming experience yet, the range of difficulty to gain those achievements ranges so much from game to game that this article from 360Crazy asks - are achievement points fair?
i believe the trophy system (so far) has solved this ...M$ could copy them somehow
that they even go after achievement jeez n4g should be changed to news for Sony Jesus this site use to be so good now i just think its anti x box every article is pro ps3 and the disagrees show it
All Seeds in level 8 in PixelJunk Eden is a bronze. Beating Uncharted on Easy is a silver, I believe. Anyone who has played both will tell you which is harder.
They could as easily say, you get a bronze trophy for beating the game on easy or you get 200 points for beating the game on easy. It is up to the developer and its up to the gamers if they wish to take time to complete the achievements. Perhaps there is some truth to the author's statement that "achievement points are pretty useless". My answer is, enjoy the game. If you want to get the achievements, no matter how difficult or easy they may seem, then get them. If you are like me, you just play the game, and don't worry what achievements you get.
Have you seen the Warhawk trophies??? They're so easy to obtain. I'm already at 53% of trophies unlocked and all you need is two controllers and an internet connection to get a ton of the trophies for Warhawk. Some even involve killing yourself or just getting killed.
mindedone lol i bought Eden couz i was interested in the trophy but they are just so difficult
Trophies is just Sony's way of countering Microsofts achievement's... three years to late.
Hapiness has entered this building!
Besides the rank and badge ones all others can be obtained by playing against yourself. They need to patch it to make it so you can only get them when playing on an official server.
And how has it solved it? Achievements/Trophies are completely upto the developer. Microsoft has no say in how much gamerscore should go for each achievement
but Sony's system is more sophisticated and greatly improves the difficulty range.
I thought that Microsoft mandated that all 360 games have an achievement system up no more than 1000 gamerscore per game, while Sony just doesn't care.
I wouldn't say Sony don't care, they just give the developers more flexibility, or at least that's how it looks. We have no idea what goes on behind the scenes.
I think Sony has their own system. They said they are going to closely watch the trophies and levels. We know that PSN games dont get a Platinum trophy. I am sure there are other things about this we dont know. Each game can probably only give you a certain amount of exp.
i.e. you get an achievement for just turning on the Simpsons game but then you have Seriously how does all that work out there should be some kind of standard
Its upto the developer how he wants people to get the achievements. If he's a sadist he'll make one like seriously2.0, if he's a pacifist and wants people to have fun then he'll go with DICE BF:BC route or COD4 route where most of the achievements require the game to be played and not doing something by chance like killing the developer in an online match achievment for GTAIV. Btw trophies suck big time as its being thrown in after 2 years and no developer is taking it seriously. Also how will u know about the experience level of a person by looking at his avatar? counting the trophies? or a numeric value showing how much he's scored overall?
You click on a person's PSN and it brings up a "gamercard" and it shows how many trophies they have, what level they're on, and how many of each type of trophy that person has. Yea, that sucks big time.
I'm talking about small business card size gamer card not a full page article about what the guy's been doing. Does it have any numeric value or will it just show 1000s of small trophies?
sak500 is right in a way...When IN a game, there is no real way to see the level a person is at, unless you add them to your friends list, correct me if I'm wrong...
@4.3 You can look at peoples gamecards in the Add friends thing without adding them as a friend, but it only holds the last 50 people that you met online.
Yeah I know exactly what you mean...Although I do believe there is a flaw with that system. It doesn't work with all games...My list is made up of 49 COD4 players, though I haven't played that game in months. Rock Band doesn't even go in there......
This is exactly what it is. http://www.totallyps3.com/g...
@Eastcoast Thanks first time i'm seeing the picture of trophies looks almost like the gamercard with just trophy part added to differentiate it. I'll stick to GC on 360 which is simpler and easier to understand.
Surely though, Microsoft could set up some guidelines for developers to follow when it comes to putting achievement points into their games. Wouldn't that make more sense than having huge differences in the difficulty of gaining points?
Hot chick in n4g 1000 point
How the crap do you know if she is hot? What is she is like juuken...a dude. Anyways, welcome Girl Gamer. On topic, I think that some games that are hardcore are going to have hardcore achievements. While less hardcore games will have more friendly achievements. I don't think Microsoft should regulate these things. I think the devs do a pretty good job deciding who their game is tailored toward.
My only problem with Achievements/Trophies is the exact method of unlocking them sometimes. Many games require you to do a certain thing online. That's fine and dandy, until you get the Halo 3 type of Achievements where you have weapon specific things to accomplish. I hated getting into a match just to find a bunch of kids who didn't want to play, and only wanted to line up for each other.
I'd rather have the developers decide. Harder achievements are MUCH cooler, not Gamerscore. If you played Avatar & a bunch of movie-based games to get your Gamerscore, then you suck & u r a n00b, & it shows everyone when they view your games. Most every guy i run into that has a high Gamerscore cant match my achievements in Bioshock, Halo 3, Mass Effect, Gears, DMC4, GTA IV, ect. So a high Gamerscore is meaningless to me unless u have beaten hard games. Beating COD4 on Veteran, beating Big games on the highest difficulty, getting a 1000 on Halo 3 or Bioshock, those are achievements worth having. If you put Avatar in your disc drive, then you are a complete & total failure as a gamer in my book. I think they should remove all achievements that you can "boost" a.k.a. cheat with a buddy in MP. I'm all for the harder achivements.
Lol, what they should do is boost your Gamerscore for the harder achievements, like a Bonus ! Beat COD4 on Vet = boost 5,000 in Gamerscore Beat Avatar = boost 25 points in Gamerscore That would be funny !!!
You stole my name Bish! give it back! *steals name and runs off* But on topic. I think that the range in Acheivements/trophies is good, it allowas casual players to take part in the points aspect of games while giving hardcore games ( like myself) a challenge in many games.
More like Beat Avatar = -5000g I should think ;)
just because i have the 1000 points for avatar, doesn't mean i'm not a gamer. i may have a bunch of movie and kiddie games on my list, but i also cover most sports games. as well as all the rest of the other types of games. so i don't worry about that line of thinking. in my case i do it because me and a friend of mine are always trying to stay ahead of the others gamer score. so i'll play anything. if it wasn't for achievements, i prob would never have tried so many games that i have. i used to just play the regular games. basket ball, shooters some rpg's and a few platformers here and there. but now i have played new types of games i previously never touched. and i'm glad i did. alot of them were pretty fun. so don't hate me cause my score is high. thats one of the reasons they made up achievements and trophies. so that those who want to collect them can. don't make anything more out of it.
Maybe just giving out a set range of points, following the PS3 trophy idea so for example there are lots of easy achievements worth 15 points, a few harder ones worth 50 and about 3 very hard achievements worth 75 points. A final big 200 points could be given for getting all the other achievements (like the platinum trophy). There need not be some kind of overlord monitoring, just a simple set of rules that say how many achievements should be given and the number or points they should be worth. Interesting if slightly simply written article.
Do acheivements actually do anything?
Achievements do nothing, apart from giving you bragging rights, However Trophies will become a central feature of Home, You will get your very own trophy room which you can show off to your friends, plus they will also unlock special clothing for your Avatar...and maybe more...the possibilities are endless really.
They make your E-penis larger.
There is no difference between achievements and trophies. There have been achievements that unlocked gamer pics and more already. Both have endless possibilities. The big difference is achievements are mandatory and trophies are not. Home is not mandatory either. Some will use it some won't. The inconsistencies on PSN just show why Live is the leader in online console gaming. Everything is consistent across all games. Complete contrast to PSN.
Some games, such as Mass Effect and Gears of War, give bonuses based on achievements. In Mass Effect, most achievements give you bonuses for subsequent runs, like unlocking weapons/skills or increased exp gains. Gears of War 2 will apparently have more characters playable in multiplayer based on your Gears of War achievements. The way Mass Effect does it should be mandatory/strongly encouraged for most of the harder achievements/trophies imo.
No. Some are stupid. But, then it makes it up with having extremely hard achievements to get.
Achievements don't really mean anything. I guess if you wanted you could use them to challenge yourself. If you completed a game on normal then go back and do it on hard to get the achievement.
By Miles. Sony Innovated the hell out of it and gave us PS3'ers something not even close to being Copied but RE-invented to the moon and back. oh and WOOO i got "that was some bug" aka a Gold in Warhawk!!! woo that was a hard one...
It's obvious...M$ rushed everything to the max...rushed putting their console out early (horrible hardware)...rushed/pushed achievements (see this article)...sigh Sony does it gradually but precisely - quality over quantity
I bet you two I have more trophies then both of you combined. However I could be wrong, I love being proven wrong. *hugs pain*
Who cares if they are "fair" - you just get them to get them. It's not like your gamerscore is actually worth anything. Should we expect an E rated family game to have achievements that are as hard to get as ones in Gears? Of course not - that's just stupid.
You were able to see the status of an achievement before it was completed. For example, if you had to set 15 zombies on fire, you could access the menu to see the current number.
I agree with you there, that was one game that got it more right than some others.
In the case of achievements and trophies; Originally I thought Achievements were a great idea. Which the concept indeed is as a system on a games console. Now here's my complaints; Basically there's far too many games which give Achievements just for completing a level or a section. Now, read all of this before you say I'm BS'ing... When I had Halo 1, because of the in depth engine and the crazy things you could do in it...Me and my friend invented a fun system we would note on paper called 'Style Points' and we set a certain amount of points whenever we did something insane we wrote down in our notes we had style points we gave each other for flipping over tanks, sticking multiple grenades on grunts and judging how far they fly, melees, taunting enemies in buggy elevators etc... Crazily enough, when I heard of the Achievement system for 360 I could only think that lots of people saw the crazy things you could do in Halo on the XBOX and also invented a playful system like me and my friend did and MS took note of that. I think Achievements and trophies should actually only be given just for doing insane things in games, not completing sections or levels, but instead things that were 'happy accidents' or just clever interaction of physics because some Achievements are something for nothing like a simple tutorial or pressing a button and these type of Achievements and in recent times, in trophies are growing. Serious Sam 3 undoubtedly will contain some of the best Achievements and Trophies ever, so I personally can't wait for that because of the insanity of the XBOX version having points for carnage, combos and some fantastic secrets.
Castle crashers is a great example for achievements done well imho. and there is a serious sam 3 in the works? one word, sweet!
Yes, Croteam are also working on a 'realistic military FPS' for Gamecock too. Not heard anything for Serious Sam 3 for a while though, but it was announced a while ago, that game will be the ultimate benchmark for PS3 and 360 if you ask me, lol. http://www.seriouszone.com/... Screenshots of Serious Engine 3...in dev Excited? :D
yeah, it has been off my radar now for a while. Back on it now, was just playing Serious Sam 2 lately on my Xbox 1, I'm still hoping they will make it compatible with the 360 one day.
That really annoys me that MS haven't sorted that BC for SS2 out yet. My XBOX died a while ago and I can't be bothered kitting up a PC just to play it again. BTW, I only ASSUME SS3 will be made for PS3 as it'll be great to see Croteam set foot on a Sony console for the first time (as Next Encounter wasn't developed by them but Climax, still a good game) and its my preference over both consoles I own.
@Guitarded that's lie over here in mongolia xbox live is unavailabe but psn is available just think of it . on topic for me trophy is collectable stuff for me. and achaivment is useless i have many point but nothing to do.
they are both good to have on both systems. they are the same, but also different. be happy we all have one of them (at least). we need to stop fighting amongst each other and just enjoy the games we have. we really need to get rid of all the bs on n4g. i love it, and im on it 569 times a day. there is nothing wrong with joking aroud and having fun with other fanboys (because in one way or another, thats what we all are weather or not we want to admit it.)
about not doing a spell check. im stoned.
then why do half the developers not bother with trophies but ALL 360 games have achievememts? I'd ask Pain to answer but....well you know....the whole lack of bubbles thing
and trophies are still a new upgrade. edit: sorry didn't see below
Because MS force the devs to make achievements for every game, while Sony makes it optional and Achievement points have been out a lot longer than trophies.
For those into bragging rights, trophies / gamer's score also contribute to replaying the game rather than letting it sit in the dust.
I totally agree on this one, the range in difficulty between achievements can sometimes be utterly insane!
either extremely excited because it is high or upset because it is low, you need some help. I like when I unlock an achievement, and will try on occasion to earn one that looks like its worth the effort - meaning I'll have fun trying. In my experience, it is the guys with the low gamer scores you need to worry about in competitive play - these are the guys and gals who will pwn you because they only play one game - Halo 3/COD4/Gears.
a non issues, the moron who wrote that article was just looking for one more thing to complain about. The devs should have the freedom to make the achievements however they want. Why would we want MS to put more requirments and restrictions on devs?
We all love eachother, thats why we visit N4G everyday. It is because we enjoy having our little arguments together, I have been visiting this website a lot, and always check the comments section to see if others have the same view as mine. We 'fanboys' love other 'fanboys' even though we insult eachother. I know for sure everyone has the following people on their love list: TheMart Breakfast PowerOfGreen Nasim and many others! Increase the love people.. Increaseee! Let me be on your list haha :P
this guy is wack achievements give motivation for even the stupidest of games. I remember playing brawl thinking I've been playing this for a long time but there is nothing to show for it except for characters that I unlocked months a before. Achievements are just that achievements something to show you friends or rub it in their faces.
I understand that there is a wide variance of difficulty in obtaining them from game to game. The Internet is filled with hints & ideas on how to boost your score with minimal difficulty. Most "hard core" gamers know which games are hard & which ones are easy. I have found that it's best to have a good mixture of both if you truly care about your reputation amongst fellow gamers. It was a very clever stroke of genious for Microsoft to include them in their games because once you hear the memorable sound of "Achievment Unlocked"-- it's extremely difficult to stop trying to unlock more. Achievements also make the game more interesting because they give you ideas to try something that you might not have thought of while playing the game. For some of us, (not me), that have the luxury of owning both the PS3 & Xbox 360 simultaneouly, the choice of which game to buy is often out weighed by which iteration has the added bonus of being able to increase one's gamer score. Now that I've switched from the Xbox 360 to the PS3, I am looking at the inclusion of trophies with a little trepidation. On one hand, I know how much they can lenghthen / improve / make more interesting the game playing experience-- while on the other, they can take the fun out of gaming when people make themselves crazy trying to accumulate them & then compare one's relative worth based upon that imaginary score that really means nothing when compared to the state of our economy, one's health, and the quality of the relationships one has. For me, I'll collect them as I go along, but I refuse to let them measure me in any real way. I'll admire those with high scores & encourage and help those with low ones. I'll always be somewhere in the middle & I'll be happy to accept that-- because from now on, I'm playing games for fun & not worrying about the "small stuff"...