Bethesda Have Proven to be the Masters of the Mass Appeal, Grand Scale RPG

Matt Byrd of Pixel Critique looks at developer Bethesda's role in the modern game industry.

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Aloy-Boyfriend1125d ago

Nope. That's CD projeck red. Fallout is just a shooter with RPG elements, not a fully RPG

KarmaV121125d ago

Agreed. I enjoy the world of the Witcher much more than Fallout. There is hardly any story there that grasps me. It's cool and all, but I'm bored of it after 10 hours.

_-EDMIX-_1125d ago

? lolz. That is like saying Witcher is just a hack and slash with RPG elements. Fallout is 100% an RPG bud, I don't know why you thought having a gun in it made it not one.

I don't even play Fallout 3 or 4 as a "shooter" I actually use V.A.T.S most times. You can play Fallout and technically not even play it as a shooter so I don't know what you mean buddy.

Neckbear1125d ago

"Fallout is 100% an RPG bud"

It's actually fallen quite far into the simplified, barely-even-a-RPG category right next to games like ME2/3, or even worse than them.

Fallout 4 has about as many relevant and complex RPG elements as Sunset Overdrive or inFamous. Character building is a joke, dialogue stat checks are a joke, weapon and build variety are a joke, dialogue options and the voiced protagonist are a joke, the writing is a joke, and overall the RPG systems got downgraded far too much from New Vegas.

FO4 only makes me appreciate New Vegas even more...

maniacmayhem1125d ago

"It's actually fallen quite far into the simplified, barely-even-a-RPG category right next to games like ME2/3, or even worse than them."

So the building of characters stats and attributes, the building and customization of sanctuary, choices you make in dialog do have consequences. I don't even know how you think New Vegas is better in comparison to Fallout 4.

I think you are suffering from a case of rose colored nostalgia-itis.

Neckbear1125d ago (Edited 1125d ago )


I was pointing out the simplification and casualization of every system based on RPG elements, but if that's what you want to believe, sure.

For example, character building: the S.P.E.C.I.A.L. system is now a joke. The perk system only makes variety less present, and previous builds less viable. Skills got removed, the point allocation got simplified to hell and back, and now you have a total of eight character statistics instead of the 18 you had by playing New Vegas in hardcore mode. The dialogue and the story are just as bad as they were in 3, but now you have less options (just 4!) for conversation instead of the amount of choices you had in 3/NV. What about the stat checks in dialogue or other actions? Gone. Now they ONLY depend on charisma. And that's just a little example...

New Vegas isn't even my favorite Fallout anyways, that's 2.

Rachel_Alucard1125d ago (Edited 1125d ago )


Being able to talk things out with a Big Bad, offering alternative solutions, using your wits and intelligence rather than bullets to solve problems - is mostly gone in Fallout 4, and it hurts the overall experience. Just because you spam a mechanic in the game doesn't change the what the game is. Who wants to play a 100-hour shooter? Stats also have little to do with the interactions between the player and the other game systems

No STR requirement for weapons.
No Low Int dialogue.
Little to no skill checks
No perk speech checks
Dialogue Wheel and Voiced PC with limited and vague options.
No Skills, every player is same with all weapons.
No Crit Chance. Numbers are scary!
Companion can't die.
No weapon degradation.
No Survival mode.

You cant do anything in a unique way. As a matter a fact, you will probably wind up using the same weapon sets in every play through due to ammo scarcity. Which is a step back. My play through and yours are likely exactly the same with the exception of which ending faction we chose. Being able to build a unique characters stats and having multiple outcomes instead of 2 options to 1 quest adds replay-ability and depth, something F4 lacks, because you can just max out everything and become the unkillable survivor with the only difference being your faction choice and appearance.

It starts out innocently enough, with the entire story of Fallout's alternate history explained to you - war, escalation, annexation, nukes, vaults - leaving nothing to the imagination. But that also leaves the player nothing to discover for themselves. When multiple factions are introduced, any satisfaction is replaced with confusion. What you do never seems to have a real impact on the others until a very clearly marked prompt pops up on screen. Your dialogue options are also limited to no more and no less than 4 options, which are usually vague and you have no idea what your about to agree/disagree with (Sarcastic? is that Sarcastic disagree or Sarcastic Agree???)

Bethesda have a track record of making sandbox worlds first and the game 2nd. In this case it's Shooter first (being that they hired ID and Bungie employees to help with that and the simple fact that criticals are now a button press away instead of a random chance like an actual RPG) and an RPG 2nd.

_-EDMIX-_1123d ago


"Being able to talk things out with a Big Bad, offering alternative solutions, using your wits and intelligence rather than bullets to solve problems - is mostly gone in Fallout 4"

You made it really easy to disregard the rest of any of your post. (or really anything you post on here to be honest) You don't know what your talking about and its very very clear you haven't played the game and if you did, clearly not enough to make such a slow claim.

"Just because you spam a mechanic in the game doesn't change the what the game is. Who wants to play a 100-hour shooter?" Who said its just shooting? I do know it has more weapons then guns right? At this point...I'm questioning just how much you really know about this game vs what you've heard others claim.

"Stats also have little to do with the interactions between the player and the other game systems"

That is as wrong as really anything can be, that is 100% factually wrong. Having perks for night time can give you a boost of life at night, having perks for female interactions can boost being able to persuade a female NPC or even barter well with a female shop owner, you can get a perk that allows animals to not attack you etc. I don't again think you fully know what your talking about so it sounds like you haven't played it or are just going off of what you've heard folks who know just as little as you do have stated..

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ZaWarudo1125d ago

"not fully a RPG"


Fallout 4 is 100% RPG first and foremost. Playing it as a shooter isn't even mandatory, it's optional.

SolidGear31125d ago

It's all about Fallout to me but I do agree that The Witcher is amazing too. I'm always going to choose post apocalyptic or sci-fi over fantasy. I've been gaming since 1990 but Fallout 3 is why I love any RPG / Open world games.

Fro_xoxo1125d ago

Fallout 4 is very much 100% RPG.

The combat may not suit your taste, but it possesses every trait of a WRPG.

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Bigpappy1125d ago (Edited 1125d ago )

Bethesda invented huge opened world RPG's. Witcher 3 is a great first effort and a great game, but it has a long way to go to reach the complexity of the NPC's, and world details in Bethesda games.

Fallout is 100% RPG... just in a more modern setting.

DJustinUNCHAIND1125d ago

Every single side quest in the Witcher 3 is more interesting than Fallout 4.

_-EDMIX-_1125d ago

Agreed. I felt that was likely to happen with Witcher 3 as I played withcer 1 and 2 and felt they would have issues with making it open world considering it would be their first.

Good to know that Witcher 3 is helping them get better at the concept for Cyberpunk 2077 or even Witcher 4 as I'm not really putting them on leaving the series alone lol.

Bethesda in terms of world building and NPCs are just far, far ahead of the game. Its hard to even find any game that is even close to their series in terms of detail, items, NPC, design etc.

AnotherProGamer1125d ago

Please describe these complexities to me

Bigpappy1125d ago

They have jobs and homes, know when to go to bed and when to go to work. They go to taverns to drink and talk. When they go to bed they actually go into a bed. There are many more examples that you wouldn't find in other RPG's, but I know not all will agree, but you can just try and argue with me, then watch the masses gravitated to Bethesda RPG time and time again, because the experiences are more authentic than any other RPG. The words are truly open and move convincing.

AnotherProGamer1124d ago


there are a lot of RPGs or nonRPGs that do that, and in the department of RPG mechanic complexities FO4 is completely dumbed down and streamlined

FallenAngel19841125d ago

They've also proven to be the masters of frequently releasing broken games and still get critical acclaim for doing so.

Vegamyster1125d ago

17 hours into it and haven't had anything break.

ZaWarudo1125d ago

31 hours here and no crashes or serious bugs, Just minor stuff like getting stuck. It's definitely Bethesda's most polished release.

jocomat91125d ago

19 hours in and nothing. You know they havent played it. GOTY IMO.

Rachel_Alucard1125d ago

"There are no bugs as long as I haven't encountered them"

Vegamyster1125d ago


Difference between a broken game & bugs.

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SolidGear31125d ago (Edited 1125d ago )

60 hours and no crashes or bugs on PS4.

_-EDMIX-_1125d ago

Because you know a game that is perfect with no issues? I mean...CDPR's first try at open world is actually still riddled with bugs. The reality is, Bethesda is the only one that has a history with so many bugs, but its also because they might be the ones making the most complex open world concept.

Can you even name a game with such complexity that is perfect with no bugs?

Mind you, they are getting that critical acclaim for making masterful RPGs and amazing complex open worlds littered with items for many, many uses. There is a reason why they are one of the few to actually do such a thing, yet have bugs too. I'd rather have them seek to create a deep open world, then simplify the game to have less bugs.

What is a game with less bugs that is also nerfed and limited due wanting to run perfect?

I'd rather they focus on pushing the boundaries of gaming, then nerf to be simplified and casual to have less bugs.

The millions that buy their games very much shows just how much of a stupid issue it is. Clearly its not enough for people to stop playing, so I'm not sure how big of a deal it really is other then for fanboys to cry over bugs.

Yet the top games this gen, all have bugs in them...

I'd rather have them focus on making the best, they have issues with bugs as who do they have to look at to make such a world? They are PIONEERS in their craft bud, its hard to tell a developer how to make a bug free concept, in a concept that is only done by that developer. If millions who buy it don't care enough to not buy it based on this issue, I'm not sure why you do...

ZaWarudo1125d ago

Lots of salt in here...

TheCommentator1125d ago

Keeps the roads from freezing over.

pandehz1125d ago (Edited 1125d ago )

Lol dont even compare it to Witcher 3. Witcher is on a different level. This is just rinse and repeat. All the good and bad of Fallout 3 are here. Not that much has changed.

Vegamyster1125d ago

They're two very different games, The Witcher 3 nails story, visuals & has decent melee combat mechanics. What makes Fallout's world different is the many interactions with it, the varied locations and gameplay styles.

pandehz1125d ago

''They're two very different games''

You're right. Witcher 3 is awesome and Fallout 3 err i mean 4 is mediocre.

slappy5081125d ago

"You're right. Witcher 3 is awesome and Fallout 3 err i mean 4 is mediocre."
Such a compelling argument. You win brah, *drops Fallout 4 and runs to the store to get the Witcher 3

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