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“GTFO” – A Documentary about the harassment of women in gaming

Matthew Beard writes "First off, let’s face one thing: everyone who has played online games has experienced some form of harassment. The internet in general is a place which harbors hostility toward those who use it. The question is whether the online trolls are especially hostile toward women. Shannon-Sun-Higgonson, the film’s director, would argue that yes, the gaming industry (and the trolls within it) is particularly hostile towards women."

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Activemessiah986d ago

We gamers can't be held accountable for a minority of psychopathic dudes with violent tendencies... there's no arguing that harassment does happen and no one is really supporting that kind of behaviour... but I sure as hell don't have to be associated with it just because it involves gaming.

TheSaint985d ago

This, the majority of us are normal human beings, it's only the gutter dwellers that behave this way.

annoyedgamer986d ago (Edited 986d ago )

So what about all those men who were issued death threats? Do they get articles where the author makes N4G account to submit their "journalistic" pieces?

I love how these SJW ladies love getting their name out there, if the community was so hostile shouldn't they be fleeing for their lives? They seem awfully bold touting their names in every article I see...

XTGN986d ago

Same old rhetoric.

You can phrase it how you like, dress up your views however you wish. The fact is that it comes down to one simple belief.

- Is it right that women playing online are threatened in this way?

Unless you;re a moron, the answer is quite clearly a resounding "no".

annoyedgamer986d ago (Edited 986d ago )

I think your little rant is the "same old rhetoric". Is this a political debate or a moral one?

Only in liberal lala-land can you whine about words on the internet when women all over the world are being actually victimized. But let's pretend that world does not exist for a moment.

Keep popularizing some incidents and shoving the others under the rug. People are on to your little games and nobody is buying it any longer. Notice how you completely ignored my reference to Gabe Newell receiving syringes in the mail with a message "kill yourself". I guess since he is male, white, straight and cis-gendered it does not matter.

Go back to playing your "feminist, gender-blind utopia" Dragon Age and let us know when you get of the Crack cocaine.

Meanwhile I will advocate REAL human rights and what is my name? It does not matter what my name is because I am not an attention seeking juvenile looking for cheap fame and a quick buck.

XTGN985d ago (Edited 985d ago )

Dodgeball eh?

Your lengthy burning missive spews forth so many points yet completey manages not to answer the simple question posed earlier.

There are many things wrong in this world but it seems as though you don't mind adding to them by just ignoring this issue because there are bigger problems you wish to compare it to.

Either you think abusing women online is ok OR you are total agreement with me.

(For the record I'm a 44 year old male, and though I added the previous article you mentioned to n4g - a cursory check would probably confirm I didn't write it)

Do, however - have a nice day! (Whatever your name is. Though I wasn't aware I asked , or indeed that I even interested)

Mikeyy985d ago

Cry me a river XTGN, every single one of us have been verbally assaulted while playing online.

that is a fact, unless you are deaf, then you missed it, but it happened.

kingdip90985d ago

Its an issue that anyone online gets harassed.

men and women...

focusing on only half the problem cant possibly fix it. if you really want some kind of change you would recognize that the problem as a whole needs to be tackled.

focusing on women is a mistake and is also quite sexist as it pre supposes women cant handle it as well as men can and need some kind of special treatment.

as someone who believes men and women should be treated equally I find the notion that women need to be swaddled in cotton offensive, please take that sexist, harmful narrative elsewhere. its unhealthy to women.

rainslacker985d ago

No, it's not right that women playing online are threatened in this way.

Clear enough?

Here's a question for you.

Is it right to condemn an entire community because the trolls**, treat women this way?

**your words, not mine...although I call them that too as well as the majority of anyone trying to make the point it's a small group and not the whole.

That's what's been happening to the gaming community since Leigh Alexander decided to post that gamers are dead up on GamaSutra.

The fact that when we ask simply, "What about men who get treated this way?" we get the brush off like it's not important because....well because why?

Can you tell us why it's not important to end ALL HARASSMENT regardless of gender, race, ethnic origin, religious beliefs, or sexual identity?

Discrimination doesn't recognize any of those things, and no matter where it comes from, or who it's aimed at, it's still harassment and/or discrimination...or in the vast majority of internet cases...trolls who just want to upset others because they know some people will get a rise out of it.

I haven't seen the documentary, but what facts show that women have it worse off than men when it comes to online harassment or threats? You start the description of this article off that anyone who plays online has received this kind of stuff. What do you, and the documentary use as evidence to prove the assertion that women have it worse than men? It's it factual statistical data, or all completely anecdotal , unverifiable threats of dubious veracity?

EliteGameKnight985d ago

When one attacks a person's character it falls within the "ad hominum" fallacy. As many of us know, committing fallacies will only serve to make those who will recognize them turn away from our argument, not growing but instead staying in our perceived idea of ignorance.

Completely shutting out his voice because of what he believes, claiming that it is simply "old rhetoric" and proceeding to call him a moron only makes him, as well as others, see you as the fool. This is not to say that you actually are by any means, we all see ourselves in the right, but that is what may be seen due to the lack of respectful behavior.

This is of course not to say that AnnoyedGamer didn't do anything to trigger a negative response, but by initiating the reply, you are put into a much more vital position to set the tone of the argument.

Insults thrown from both you as well as AnnoyedGamer just results in a petty squabble where there is no growth in knowledge and reason. And if this perceived issue of female harassment is truly important to you, then this is probably the worst way to defend it.

DragonKnight985d ago

XTGN 1: Is it only women playing online that are threatened? Is it right that ANYONE is threatened in this way? Every SJW says they are against harassment, death threats, etc... but they always focus on women. As though women are weak and can't take care of themselves, but men have to suck it up and take it because who the hell cares right? They probably brought it on themselves because of their toxic masculinity right? I mean it's not like women threaten other women all the time right? Oh wait, they do. And they even do stuff like this.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/new...

XTGN 2: A 44 year old man who's been dragged into a corner to such a degree that he spends a lot of time typing a lot of words but saying nothing, and then strawmanning.

It is not an indication of consent to harassment to bring up the correct point that women are not the only ones being threatened or harassed. It's a fact. You can cry about it all you want to, but your tears don't wash away people being mailed knives with the words "kill yourself" printed on a post-it attached to the knife.

As for this documentary, it's another load of sensationalist SJW tripe designed to make women look like they're so weak they can't handle a single day of living in the world without everyone protecting their delicate feelings. It's a load of horse manure and only members of the SJW echo chamber will take it seriously.

Cueil985d ago

Is it right that they get free shit given to them in MMOs or that they are treated better by most players and only treated horrible by a stupid few. The internet has never been a place for those easily offended and it continues to prove this out time and time again

creatchee985d ago

I love how people willfully ignore the difference between simply being a target of harassment and being the target of harassment because you belong to a distinct group.

Do any of you even understand the concept of a hate crime? How targeting somebody BECAUSE of their race, gender, disability, religion, or any of a number of different distinctions is INHERENTLY different from being the victim of one that does not share that reasoning?

Oh wait, you probably think that categorizing something as a hate crime is bad too. Professional victims being victimized and all of that. Never mind.

kingdip90985d ago

@ creatchee

If people are playing call of duty and the hate is spewing from there it comes from a place of competition. its a part of the game to get into the head of your competitor to make them screw up. baseball players do this all the time. every group is picked on in this forum for that reason. "faggot" "Nigger" "Bitch" "cracker" "retard" "whore" ect. these are all words used to demoralize a player... its aimed at women because they are women sure but the other insults are also group specific and are equalily laden with bias.

the same holds true with criticism of online comments. I stand by my earlier comment.

if you believe women are especially vulnerable to this kind of language than other groups such as racial or lbgt then you are insulting women by placing them in such a way that they come off as weaker. that sexist nonsence has to go.

Dee_91985d ago (Edited 985d ago )

"Either you think abusing women online is ok OR you are total agreement with me. "

Yea like how if you're against internet feminist, then you're automatically against equality, despite the fact their definition of equality is only things that benefit women?, of course only until that specific point gets broughten up.

@XTGN
pls respond?
oh none of that matters right? this is solely about if you think its okay or not for women to be abused online?.. well we want it to be about general abuse online, thats real equality.You ignoring us because we are men is sexism.How can you be a SJW if you're not for equality and exercise sexism ?
What you see here is real SJ.Not the " i only do this because my friends do it and think its cool, so I can't present an argument that holds any water against people with actual sense because I really have no idea what i'm doing, but I think I do" SJ.
pls respond?

@creatchee
If said person that committed this hate crime committed the same crime on everybody else, it wouldn't be a hate crime wouldn't it?
I here racism and misogyny playing games quite often but not nearly as much as I hear general s#it talking online.The people that trash talk online trash talk everybody, regardless of race religion or sex.
You people are making it seem like normal dudes online just normally chatting then a female comes in the lobby then stupidity commence... Well a form of a stupidity usually does commence but I dont think it can be classified as abuse, more so thirst.

XTGN985d ago

I probably shouldn't be surprised. It's amazing that having decided to have an opinion enough to actually comment, that everyone manages to argue in the face of a very simple concept. Skimming through the replies (apologies if i missed one) I fail to see anyone say that abusing women online is a bad thing. Sure you argue this, that and the other (in roughly equal proportions) but you all stop short of condemning it.

As has ever been the case, debating under such conditions is very much like masturbating using a cheese grater.

Mildly amusing, but ultimately painful.

Spotie985d ago

@XTGN: I'm gonna say this:

Why single out women?

Are you saying it's right for men playing online to be threatened in any way? Because that's just as sexist as your claim that people believe it's okay for that to happen to women.

That would be like me saying it's okay to discriminate against white people because they're not black. No, white person, you can't throw racial epithets at me, but I can insult you all day long.

That's utterly stupid. It's not equality in any measure. But that's what you and so many others are trying to argue: that it's okay for men to be bullied and harassed online, but women are off-limits. Even worse is what someone else mentioned: that the driving force behind all this is, apparently, a desire to be treated equally.

Well, if I'd kick a dude in the crotch, it's only fair that I do the same or something equivalent to a woman, right? Then that's being fair, yeah?

Welcome to the internet, where everyone's crotch is a target. Deal with it or GTFO.

creatchee985d ago

@kingdip90

"if you believe women are especially vulnerable to this kind of language than other groups such as racial or lbgt then you are insulting women by placing them in such a way that they come off as weaker. that sexist nonsence has to go."

Nice straw man. Not only did I not say that at all, you're deliberately misinterpreting my point to try and peg me as the sexist idiot. Nice try, but I didn't say "vulnerable" - I said "targeted". They are two completely different things.

@Dee_91

"If said person that committed this hate crime committed the same crime on everybody else, it wouldn't be a hate crime wouldn't it?
I here racism and misogyny playing games quite often but not nearly as much as I hear general s#it talking online"

The difference in a hate crime and a regular one is the targeting of the victim due to a bias on the part of the perpetrator. If I went and punched 10 random people of all races in the face, then said: "I'm going to go find a Black person and punch them in the face because I hate Black people," then guess what? The 11th punch is a hate crime.

Also, sure there is a lot more general sh#t-talking online, but that doesn't make their instances of targeted harassment any less despicable.

@Spotie

"Why single out women?

Are you saying it's right for men playing online to be threatened in any way? Because that's just as sexist as your claim that people believe it's okay for that to happen to women."

No, XTGN is not saying that at all. Why would you even make that failed leap in logic (well, other than to attempt to discredit the point)?

Following that logic, Jerry Lewis says "kids with cystic fibrosis can suck it because my telethon is for muscular dystrophy."

Similarly, The United Negro College Fund obviously thinks that white, Latino, Asian, and other kids don't deserve an education because they only give scholarships to Black kids.

Or that Gamergate doesn't believe in ethics in all forms of journalism because they only focus on ethics in gaming journalism.

Oh wait - scratch that last one. Terrible example. :/

Dee_91984d ago (Edited 984d ago )

@XTGN
Boy that "its just an opinion scapegoat never gets old.You admittedly just skimmed through but you said no one stated the obvious that abuse is bad...You're a clown sir.Your blog will not last long.I'm disappointed, I wanted a real response..

@creatchee
So what you're saying is that when men abuse other men online then decides to also abuse women online, they have to specifically say they hate women for it to be hate crime ?
Keep grasping at those straws, you might just find one that makes sense..

"Following that logic..."

Jerry Lewis doesn't try to make it seem like kids with muscular dystrophy caused other kids to have cystic fibrosis.
The United Negro College Fund doesn't blame white Latino and asians for the lack of funds blacks have for proper education

Gamergate does vaguely focus on other journalism genres.Because the lack of ethics in journalism in general plays a major roll in the lack of ethics in gaming journalism.

You should scratch them all.. reevaluate.

rainslacker984d ago

@XTGN

I don't accept your apology for missing me clearly stating that abusing women online is bad. I don't need to say I condemn it. Many people have said they don't condone abuse of any kind for months, yet no one on the SJW side wanted to accept that we actually believed that. Never once did the idea that trolls were behind the abuse ever matter despite the huge outpouring of condemnation on abuse in general, regardless of gender. You yourself admit it's trolls, yet still make it into a community issue.

What I see here is a bunch of comments wondering why you and the film makers are making this into a gender issue, instead of an overall internet social issue, which is what it is.

You have failed to answer anyone's questions posed to you as the author of this article, and as such have done nothing to support your argument in any way.

So, instead of skimming the comments, why not actually read them and respond to those who pose serious questions...such as myself...instead of just spewing off insults that we are bad people because you believe it to be true, and we happen to disagree with you.

I don't know what you expected from posting this here, and subsequently insulting the users here, but the only thing I can see you as is a troll trying to rile people up with a controversial topic. If you aren't that, then you are nothing but a bigot who decided to post this here and take all criticism as validation that you are correct because you lack the ability to see that others may be willing to hear your side of this issue by posing questions.

For months, we've been waiting to hear the other side's answer to these questions, and it is rare for a SJW supporter to make their way into what I guess they see as enemy territory. But it would seem that those questions are meaningless to you, and given the nature of the questions, that makes you nothing but a sexist, because to you, women are somehow more important than men in the discussion of abuse and equality.

Prove me wrong...I beg you. Show me you have the intellectual capacity to discuss this issue in a meaningful way.

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Killa78985d ago

Write about all those men then? Women are the minority, remember that.

Don't move away from the issue that women are looked down upon in gaming, and people more readily abuse them.

Sexism in gaming is an issue and just because no ones writing to support you, doesn't mean you can step on others.

Tiqila985d ago

I think sexism in gaming is not an issue and I do not personally know a single gamer that is looking down on women. Everyone I know respects women in real life as much as in gaming.

Where people might look down upon is self-righteous feminists who are generalising call of duty lobbies, 4chan and personal blogs to the gaming industry.

rainslacker984d ago

The only people outside trolls who look down on women in gaming are SJW. Sounds weird doesn't it? SJW have gone and made it seem that women are not welcome in the community. SJW have gone and made it seem that women have abuse and harassment thrown at them at every turn. SJW have made it look like gamers are a bunch of bigots who actually care about a person's gender when playing games. Was this a thing before Anita Sarkeesian came around? Was it real and just hiding in the backwaters of online communities? Yeah, I don't think so. So what catalyst caused the gaming community to suddenly become so hostile towards women...according to SJW. They won't consider the fact that Anita started this whole thing, because she's some sort of saint I guess.

Before Anita Sarkeesian came around, I only heard about random stories where women looking for attention from gamers were told to shove off because they were trying to get attention from gamers instead of actually sharing in the community.

Was there hostility before Anita Sarkeesian? Yes, in the form of trolls. Those trolls target anybody and everybody. They have for decades, but suddenly it's become a huge issue that never actually existed in the manner in which SJW make it out to be.

I've never met a single gamer who cared who they gamed with so long as the person they were gaming with shared similar interests in the games. If they didn't, they just didn't play games with them. No hostility, no abuse, no harassment. I would even go so far as to say I actually know more people who would love to play with a female gamer given the choice between male or female, because they tend to be a bit socially awkward around women, but that's a different thing.

Are females getting more attention and abuse now? Probably. Why? Because a few people who want to speak for all female gamers are condemning a community who never once saw sexism or misogyny as an issue. Gamer's have grown tired of the condemnation and push back, so it looks like we're hostile. 99.9% of us I would say aren't hostile towards women in general, just towards the ideologies which are being pushed on the community so some people could bolster their own reputation and make a ton of money.

Ripsta7th985d ago

Dumb article
Its not just women! And its not just in gaming
Anywhere you can say something without consequence (internet)

arbitor365985d ago (Edited 985d ago )

The more they pump out this propaganda, the more gamers are going to stand up against them and their agenda. When your average joe gamers turn on the news and see headlines like "gamers: Misogynistic terrorists?" They are going to be rightfully pissed off. Here they were, just enjoying games with their friends, and then the feminists swoop in to tell them how evil, ignorant, and privileged they are and how games need to change to meet their sensibilities. That is how you make enemies out of gamers. It has nothing to do with us hating women.

Elda985d ago

There's immaturity everywhere including some of the commentors here on N4G.

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