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Will Xbox One See A Boost From DirectX 12?

How much of a boost will Xbox One receive from DirectX 12? Some claim that Phil Spencer said XBO will not benefit from DX12. But is that statement true?

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lifeisgamesok971d ago (Edited 971d ago )

Actually Phil has said the Xbox One will benefit from directx 12 people are flipping Phil's words into saying it won't help

No API before has allowed multiple cores to be used by the gpu at one time

Hellsvacancy971d ago

Oh dear, within the very first minute of the video it shows a Tweet from Phil Spencer that states

"It will help developers on XBOX One, It's not going to be a massive change but it will unlock more capabilities for devs"

So actually, Phil says aot of things

XBLSkull971d ago

Anyone who thinks DX12 won't provide any benefits to the X1 is incompetent.

Infamous298971d ago (Edited 971d ago )

@XBLSkull It will provide benefits though not as the legendary benefit that
some fanboys here believe.

Double Toasted971d ago

What legendary ones are you talking about? Do you know something the rest of us don't?

DragonKnight971d ago

*sigh* Look, this has been said MANY times before. DX12 will help the Xbox One do what it does SLIGHTLY more efficiently. Phil said himself there will not be some significant benefit, just some small efficiencies being improved, but it can't unlock some magical hidden power hidden within the Xbox One hardware like Guru did for Gohan in Dragonball Z.

You will never see anyone but Xbox fanboys saying that DX12 is going to make the Xbox One more powerful than the PS4, even Microsoft won't say that.

UltraNova970d ago (Edited 970d ago )

@Dragonknight

Not that Goku needed it but imagine if Guru unlocked his laden abilities!! He would easily max SSJ1 destroying Frieza within minutes. But you know Toriyama is the MAN so I wont complain ;-)

OT: Am I the only one who actually wants DX12 to help the xb1 achieve better results? I mean it would obviously help the ps4 as well since the devs will have to raise the bar on both to keep parity.

Plus this DX12-xb1 bashing is getting old, not as old as the Order 1886's bashing, we have ways to go to reach that level of unsupported bashing.

moldybread970d ago

basically we have xbox fanboys who think it's going to shake the earth and then we have the complete opposite attitude from sony fanboys who say it's going to do very little if anything because they are always waiting on the sidelines ready to comment about anything to do with the xbox platform while acting like they don't care about it.

that's why the truth is always somewhere down the middle when viewing comments from either side. what i find most interesting are those who seem to be opposed to the system getting better tools.

+ Show (3) more repliesLast reply 970d ago
christocolus971d ago

@lifes

The title screams clickbait.There's no need trying to argue with anyone anymore.most of those downplaying this have an agenda,most of them dont even own or plan to buy an xbox one, anything remotely positive relating to MS, Xbox,dx12 or MS cloud compute is quickly downplayed. Everyone knows DXx12 will help Xbox one.Phil, Mike Ybara and even Aaron Greenberg have all confirmed this..the metro redux devs ,brad wardel and a few other have hinted at this in various articles and interviews too yet people keep talking crap. Fable legends looks awesome (going by the latest trailer). its naive to think DX12 wont help the console. all windows 10 devices will get performance boosts(big or small) even mobiles will benefit from it too.

Phil said we will know more at the build conference. lets all see what happens.

Foehammer971d ago (Edited 971d ago )

Well said TheRedDragon

Great to see all the tweets posted in their entirety and in context.

Spells out EXACTLY what's been said

"Full DX12 is coming to X1"

DX12 will effect X1 game development, unlocking more features and making it easier to reach more of the hardwares potential.

A great video, leaving all the, never to be realized, theoretical figures behind, and laying down the truth.

gfk342971d ago (Edited 971d ago )

We are listening to a guy that less than a year ago said that DX12 will double (100% more) the power of the X1!

http://n4g.com/news/1487593...

We all know now that DX12 will provide - IN THE MOST OPTIMISTIC SCENARIO - a maximum of 50% gain in performance for PC GAMING. So X1 will gain much less than 50%.

People, TheRedDragon is the biggest Xbot troll.

jb227971d ago

Seems to me that DX12 & the Azure Cloud is being downplayed because it has yet to be proven. Sure there are fanboys who don't want to hear anything positive about their competition, but it's generalizing to say that's all there is. I'm personally skeptical about anything a company says until it has been proven…show us, don't tell us. DX12 will definitely help the Xbox One, but to expect some mind-blowing difference is setting yourself up for disappointment. Also, we see these kinds of incremental performance increase anyway over time as devs get used to their hardware, so will the boost from DX12 be discernible compared to the jumps that will have been made w/o it? I think many people responding negatively about these things are doing so in response to people who are claiming that these factors will be some kind of special sauce that completely changes the game overnight. I'd expect we will see some fps boosts & maybe more robust offerings on releases due to better time management.

gfk342971d ago (Edited 971d ago )

DX12 may increase the performance of X1 CPU, BUT will not increase its power.

However, even if DX12 achieves the CPU theoretical power, the CPU is so weak that it's irrelevant.

Please look at these numbers:

CPU:
- PS4 102.4 GFLOPS
- X1 112 GFLOPS

GPU:
- PS4 1.84 TFLOPS (which means 1,840 GFLOPS)
- X1 1.31 TFLOPS (which means (1,310 GFLOPS)

The above numbers are theoretical numbers, meaning the maximum value that each console could reach.

Having said that, DX12 WILL NOT increase the theoretical power of X1, but will ONLY help X1 to get close to this theoretical power.

In conclusion, even if X1 achieves (with the help of DX12) its maximum CPU theoretical power, it is negligible compared with the GPU power.

This is the reason why the future of the console games is GPGPU programming; having in mind their power compared with the CPU.

Both consoles are built for GPGPU, namely the CPU task to be taken by the GPU.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wik...

Bigpappy971d ago

People keep taking about DX12 and power. I has absolutely nothing to do with power. Why a you guys posting all this crap about TFLOPS and PS4 power?

This is about using more core more effectively and efficiently. So its more about new tech ability and what developers can now achieve even on cell phone. Not about power at all.

gfk342971d ago (Edited 971d ago )

@ Bigpappy

Well, when all what we hear is that X1 will have a boost in performance, we have to talk of power because performance is in a direct relationship with the power of the X1.

So, the CPU theoretical power gives us the limit of what X1 can achieve.

The theoretical power of 112 GFLOPS of X1's CPU is computed using ALL the eight cores of the console!

In conclusion, DX12 is just a software that helps X1 to achieve its MAXIMUMUM CPU POWER OF 112 GFLOPS (which practically irrelevant as it is very low power compared with the GPU).

Lenrulesdaworld971d ago (Edited 971d ago )

the point is to be able to combine that with cloud compute, once you offset resource it leaves more on the hardware itself to use toward graphics. With more resources on graphics, physics on cloud and cpu running across all cores, the game theoretically should be amazing.

But as of now for all the difference in hardware the game differences have been minor and that's with xbox one not having up to date sdk's at release. Which it seems is the main reason games performed not as well as the ps4 but compare then to the end of last fall and winter.

Big difference from resolution to frames and in sum instances holding better frames than ps4, even if small says a lot. But again i'm not saying it's more powerful, just the advantage isn't that big, even though on paper it says it is.

Double Toasted971d ago

First you say,

"DX12 may increase the performance of X1 CPU, BUT will not increase its power"

then you say

"Well, when all that we hear is that X1 will have a boost in performance, we have to talk of power because performance is in a direct relationship with the power of the X1."

Which means you obviously don't know what you're talking about. Just stop, its the blind leading the blind.

joeorc971d ago

While I get what you are pointing out, what I think many are really saying or implying and this depends on the side of the wall you are on its Pretty much is about DirectX vs OpenGL kinda point. And the fact is both Api's have been updated for years and both work fantastic for the platforms.

Many on the gamer boards want to frame the Argument in a certain way in order to claim an advantage, the point is both Api's will be further advanced and tweaked.

There is many on this forum i see that want to bolster a platforms perception as to be "parity' WITH ANOTHER PLATFORM, while trying to also claim that such power scale of the other platform is no way near as large as its made out to be by another such group, and are using these posted things to try to drive home that point.

I mean this is of course only a cple of lead programmer's saying this and its of course their opinion on the matter, but their experience with directX is noted, so its not like they have not been using such APi's before.

"
Low-level access to the GPU really makes you understand why using DirectX is slow and why it is really just in your way.

Being able to unmap/remap memory pages from its virtual address space while maintaining its contents is absolutely amazingly useful."

Further going into detail:

"I was in that room : ) That session was pure marketing hyperbole. Later DX12 sessions at GDC were more realistic/interesting IMHO."

http://gearnuke.com/naughty...

The thing is you have to take into account is that this is what Api "Microsoft" is pushing!

Remember the Api Sony and say Nintendo or other firms may be using are or may not be DirectX

Example

Naughty Dog Programmers Talk About DirectX API And Optimization For PS4

Naughty Dog have proved their talent in the gaming industry with the work they have done. Their game engines are usually state-of-the-art and most of their games are usually “coded to the metal”. Recently, a couple of Naughty Dog developers had something new to share regarding optimization techniques on the PS4 and DirectX API.

Christian Gyrling, who is the lead programmer at Naughty Dog, talked about optimizing for PS4 API and how low level access to the hardware is better.

Low-level access to the GPU really makes you understand why using DirectX is slow and why it is really just in your way.

Being able to unmap/remap memory pages from its virtual address space while maintaining its contents is absolutely amazingly useful.

Cort Stratton, Sony’s ICE Team member and programmer at Naughty Dog, was also asked to comment on the recent DirectX 12

I was in that room : ) That session was pure marketing hyperbole. Later DX12 sessions at GDC were more realistic/interesting IMHO.

while:

Microsoft is trying their best to push DirectX 12 as increasing the performance for software development on the Xbox One. According to Slightly Mad Studios’ Ian Bell, who are currently developing Project CARS for Xbox One and PC, the move to DirectX 12 can result in a possible 30% performance boost under certain circumstances.

The point being is we have quite a long way to go before this generation ends and we are really just getting started.

Double Toasted971d ago

Naughty Dog doesn't make games using DX12 so anything they say is null and void. The only thing they'll be able to use, if anything, is bits and pieces of it that are freebies MS throw to the opengl community and that's if it happens.

gamertk421971d ago

Power does not equal performance. In cars, power without handling is irrelevant. The world's strongest man probably is not the best at watchmaking. The most powerful pelvis doesn't ensure great sex. Think before you type...

971d ago
JasonKCK970d ago

It's amazing to me how people post lies and make believe stats and try and pass it off as fact. It's FOX news tactics.

Raiden970d ago

i'm going to get flamed for saying this.

1. Naughty Dog are talented programmers yes but how much optimization do they do for each game, the long a game takes to be release once mention the more time can be spent optimizing the kit. Plus point that SONY has is that they have alot of in house/first party departments who will push the hardware further, MS may have some of the best coders in the world, but not all of them are coding for the games environment that is down to the studios like 343 and Turn10.

@GFK and bigpappy

What is power, if you have a device that uses 100% that means it maxed out. But what happens when you introduce something that allows the device to perform at the same level but at 50% of what it was using, DX12 will not change GPU but it will effect the CPU. Percentage wise the less power used to produce something that was already done at 100% the better it is in the long run, who really knows the true power of both consoles, I for one will not look at the power but instead at what is produced, show me proof. don't tell about it, I was to see it, not from in house but from 3rd parties.

970d ago
+ Show (8) more repliesLast reply 970d ago
St0rmbr1nger1111971d ago (Edited 971d ago )

Translation:

Phil says: It will provide a benefit, then tempers expectations by saying the benefits won't be massive.

Fan boys: Want the benefits to be massive (or none at all depending on your bias), so they try to insert meaning in what Phil says. This is the ugly side of confirmation bias, and the hallmark of a true fan boy.

MasterCornholio971d ago

Thats pretty much what's going on. The only one who is claiming that the Xbox 1s power will be increased by a ton due to direct x 12 or those claiming that its a game changer is Mr. X and his followers.

We all know that the Xbox One will benefit from Direct X just like the PS4 benefits from updates to its API. What's true about both is that the updates can't increase the maximum output of the system it can only aid it by making said system more efficient.

AngelicIceDiamond971d ago (Edited 971d ago )

So allot people are still goin by what Phil said 3 months ago.

Its obvious Phil and his team are still working on DX12 unlocks on X1. Things change and progress happens.

So people can't automatically revert to Phils statement like what he says is permanent and any statement made by an MS exec after that is irrelevant, because its not.

So look at this: http://www.gamepur.com/news...

But devs HAVE to make use of it. It isn't automatically processed by devs they have to code for it. Making DX12 from what it sounds like so far will benefit mainly 1st party.

Though DX12 is mainly PC thing X1 still very much has DX12 capabilities. How much exactly still remains to be seen.

Point is, is it so hard to understand that Dx12 is still a work in progress for X1?

rainslacker970d ago

It will benefit multiplats as well. Eventually all devs will have to convert their code to DX12 if they are using OpenGL/PSSL, or vice versa. It's just the way it is in console development. It's not really as big a deal as it would seem, as they have mostly the same functionality, and many times, the engine will take care of it for the dev.

On the console side of things, they already code in a similar fashion to the way that both Mantle and DX12 will require the dev to do, so it becomes even less of an issue. The biggest benefit to the dev is that converting code from console to PC will now be much quicker, as the routines will likely be the same between the PC and the console.

The only real difference between console and PC coding in this regard is that on PC, devs will code their low level code to DX12/Mantle, whereas on console, they will code using the low level API's which may be much closer to the metal because it doesn't have to account for differences in hardware.

In the X1, the biggest benefit that DX12 will bring is from it's memory handling and processing pipeline utilization, which honestly should have been there from day one on the X1, and is actually already available should the developer decide to implement it themselves.

Without getting too technical, I'll just say that's a good thing, and X1 users should be happy about it, and because of that, they don't need to speculate on how much it will improve the games. The improved pipeline management is pretty significant, but it doesn't add up to a major boost in performance. 50% under ideal conditions, but probably not constant or sustained 50% increase.

+ Show (2) more repliesLast reply 970d ago
IGiveHugs2NakedWomen971d ago ShowReplies(5)
voodoogts971d ago

Yes it will.

Does PS4 support DNLA yet?

MasterCornholio971d ago (Edited 971d ago )

No but the PS4 managed to receive an update that enabled shareplay which is more important for gaming than DLNA.

What was your point?

THC CELL971d ago

Yes ps4 is a gaming machine my smart tv dose all my movie streaming what saves me energy bills and no blocks from chavina

jrshankill971d ago

That shareplay thing that developers are hesitant to support?

I lol'd at the freeloading COD crybabies on release day.

MasterCornholio970d ago

@JR

"That shareplay thing that developers are hesitant to support?"

You mean that only a few developers won't support.

95% of games support shareplay.

#dealwithit

Majin-vegeta971d ago

No one is denying DX12 wont help the X1.What people are denying is that some people think that DX 12 will automatically make the X1 stronger than the PS4.Which is impossible due to the hardware.

marlinfan10971d ago (Edited 971d ago )

The vast majority of people just say it'll help. I've hardly seen anyone say it'll be more powerful than the ps4. Please show me some articles or comment sections where there's more than maybe one or two people saying that.

I've seen a lot more sony fans saying it won't do anything than I have xbox fans saying it'll be more powerful than ps4

Or they just troll and post comments like the one right below me

Look at this article for instance, 16 comments so far, not a single person saying it'll be more powerful than ps4, yet 4 comments trolling/downplaying. This is how it is in nearly every dx12 article

ainTgoTTime2bleed971d ago

You sir are wrong!, Phil is dah Messiahsz and he said that dah cloudssz, DX12SSZ and dah Holololennsz will melt the PS4 and I will followsz Phil to the end of timessz...

snoopgg971d ago

Yap Yap Yap, now go bleed!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

971d ago
dazzrazz971d ago

Bla bla bla with dx12 it will do power of the cloud and be like 300 xboxes .....