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Driveclub Would Be Bigger than Blu-Ray if it Wasn’t Compressed: No Compromises Made;More Info Shared

With the news about Driveclub requiring "onliy" 17 gigabytes of disc space, many wondered how that is possible, especially considering the game's visuals, and if Evolution Studios had to make any compromise to reach that small install size.

Game Director Paul Rustchynsky took to Twitter to dispel any doubt and give more info about the game.

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nicksetzer11134d ago

Um, most games this gen would have been. Killzone shadowfall was >250GB before compression.

http://www.slashgear.com/ki...

Don't see what's so impressive about this statement.

Abriael1134d ago (Edited 1134d ago )

The fact that he says no compromises were made, since compression pretty much always involves a degree of compromise, even more so when it's high compression.

I'm quite curious to hear about what compression tech they used.

nicksetzer11134d ago (Edited 1134d ago )

? Are you serious? Games are almost all compressed on their distribution medium, however when the console is running that content it is usually (if not always) fully decompressed. For example, they aren't running all their assets at 1:7 compression in killzone. (It's sad you think they are)

Sure there may be some VERY minor loss, but it mainly comes down to cost in most cases.

It sounds to me like you are confusing "optimization" with compression.

Abriael1134d ago (Edited 1134d ago )

I'm fully serious. And I know how compression works perfectly well.

High compression almost never causes "minor" losses.

Pick up photoshop and play with the JPG compression slider compared to an uncompressed PNG to see it for yourself.

To get high compression with no compromise requires some definitely interesting tech, and I hope Evolution will share.

It sounds to me that you're talking with no real first hand knowledge of the issue.

nicksetzer11134d ago

@abriel you honestly have no clue what you are talking about based on your comparison. I am sure you feel smug with yourself since people who are also ill versed disagree with me. The reality is, just like a compressed rar file, (not like compression of a single jpeg file) compressed data files that these games use to run can be easily decompressed and are.

Again proof alone is shadowfall. With 1:7 compression it would not look that crisp, plain and simple. It gets decompressed.

Sadly you think that all compression works the same. I bet you think youtube works the same as this too right? Sinc3 youtube videos look worse because of compression a game must too, right? Despite that fact that those files are not being decompressed in the same manner.

Abriael1134d ago (Edited 1134d ago )

*yawns*

I'm afraid the only one who is ill versed here is you, Nick.

Of course they can be decompressed. That's one of the main activities the GPU does, but that doesn't mean it's normally losseless, which is why games like Skyrim, which are *extremely* compressed to fit console's memory bottlenecks have textures that look like muddy crap.

You're confusing still looking good with being losseless. They're not the same thing.

KYPRIME1134d ago

you don't know what you're talking about bro

No_Limit1134d ago

I agreed with nicksetzer1.

nicksetzer11134d ago (Edited 1133d ago )

@abriel "You're confusing still looking good with being losseless. They're not the same thing."

Am I? I could have sworn I said.
"Sure there may be some VERY minor loss, but it mainly comes down to cost in most cases."

And in the case of almost every game this gen, I would say "VERY minor" would be an apt description. 100/100 times when a GAME looks less crisp it is due to hardware limitation, not compression.

" games like Skyrim, which are *extremely* compressed to fit console's memory bottlenecks have textures that look like muddy crap."

You have changed the discussion completely. I am refereing to the compression used to fit a game on a specific medium, that compression has ALMOST no effect on the game. You AGAIN have changed the subject to optimization, which generally does involve compression to some extent, but is completely seperate. You even said so yourself "compression to fit memory bottlenecks."

You will try to spin anything, and sadly people on here will buy into anything. You think compression/decompression of a jpg through photoshop is the same and compression/decompression of an entire game. You optimization is the same as compression. You have no clue wjat you are talking about, to the point you have to keep comparing completely incomparable things.

The compression used to fit a game on a specific medium has essentially no effect, but you can believe what you want. (Even though your own words show you are wrong)

@kuv it is pointless, trying to explain anything to them, they are convinced that compression is some mystical being that always damages a games visuals. It certainly cannot be used without losses. Also it certainly always functions exactly the same. Also, decompression is fully impossible.

KUV19771133d ago

I just made that comment a few days ago: Take this string: 00000000000000000000 and it's compressed form: 20x0 which only takes up 20% the space of the original string and yet retains 100% of the information without any loss. It's a very simple example but should demonstrate how losless compression works. You don't really expect Rar or Zip compressed files to lose information, right?

morganfell1133d ago (Edited 1133d ago )

Abriael,

You are confusing the compression of assets on disc which are decompressed on the HDD and then streamed with the type of compression used in, for example textures, when they are compressed. I can take a movie in digital form, compress it with a program, then decompress it and play it alongside the original version and it is lossless.

Its the differnce between compressing an audio file with WinRar versus compressed audio. The issue here is you have misinterpreted what Rustchynsky was saying.

By your definition, the very remark posted by your website would be a walking contradiction: "Compressing the data has massively helped with load times & with no compromise."

Take a song and compress it with WinRar and decompress it and play it. No loss of quality. Now thake that same song and compress it differently - by formatting it as an .mp3, now there is quality loss due to compression.

I normally side with you - check your history - but you are off on this one.

testerg351133d ago

KUV1997, I don't think that's the same. Those type of patterns are usually text files, programs, but graphics (textures) and sound do not have those simple patterns. The majority of games now comprise mostly of graphics and sound

UltimateMaster1133d ago

Blu-Ray Discs can go up to 500Gb in multi-layer.

hay1133d ago

Compression is a triangle function with Quality, CPU time and HDD access on each corner. If you compress much, the CPU needs to work more, but less data goes through disc. Quality is a matter of compression type, be it lossless or not, also different types of data tend to compress differently(it's difficult to compress waveform audio without adequate algorythms, while in comparison bitmaps do not suffer as much with rather generic methods).

He did not provide any details how it was achieved but knowing life, this could have been a zip(zip, gzip, etc) as the game is mostly models which would compress nicely and textures, with acceptable compression ratio.

@Abriael: "which is why games like Skyrim, which are *extremely* compressed to fit console's memory bottlenecks have textures that look like muddy crap"
It's downsampling, not compression.

KUV19771133d ago

@testerg35

Of course it was just a simple example. JPG or MP3 compression works only with quality loss but you can still compress any file lossless, even Audio and Imagery. The patterns and formulas get more complex and the compression effectiveness suffers but my point was rather that the term 'compression' does not automatically mean losing quality.

A game like Drive-Club is going to have tons of Polygons too and I am not aware of a quality-losing compression method for polygons.

Then there is MP3 which is all around and with a decent bitrate(!) most people are unable to recognize the details that are lost. In fact MP3 works exactly like that. It analyzes information you would not hear anyway and excludes them.

Texture and video compression would be the things you can best see negative compression effects, but I don't think anyone really complains about two hours of video compressed on a regular blu ray disc just yet. Leaves textures, and since this is a game where you race around tracks it should be pretty difficult to see some small compression artifacts in the road texture, unlike in first person shooters where you can slowly analyze wall textures. It's not like they compress it down to a 7GB DVD.

+ Show (10) more repliesLast reply 1133d ago
Spotie1133d ago

You may have a point, nick, but what example do you have to support it? Abriael has his.

Skate-AK1133d ago

Uncharted 3 itself was over 1TB before compression.

Paprika1134d ago (Edited 1134d ago )

I think we should get the uncompressed versions as free dlc. It'd be hugely popular for purist console gamers IMO. Even if its negligible differences, I'd rather have games like this in its purist form, no compression. It'd be like using a jpg st 60% quality over one at 100%. I understand why, buy the option would be nice.

adventureghost1241134d ago

I don't think you quite understand what you're saying, nor would you want to go through with it

Paprika1134d ago (Edited 1134d ago )

I'm just assuming compressed might mean less visusl quality and generally worse than uncompressed. Shoot me dead if I'm wrong, I know its a saw subject lol! Its probably compressed to suit there solution 1080p or w,e its retail version is? When devs can probably go much higher with the uncompressed files, which wouldn't run on our consoles? Again.... shoot me down if I'm wrong.

KYPRIME1134d ago

you don't know what you're talking about

WeAreLegion1134d ago (Edited 1134d ago )

Can someone explain why Paprika is wrong to want that? I'm actually curious. Explain why that would be a bad idea, instead of telling Paprika he/she doesn't know what he/she is talking about. I'm not well informed on this subject.

Six8Six1133d ago

When you use Photoshop to compress a picture it does it in a way that looses information. Maybe there are 3 pixels right next to each other and one is one value off, to save space it just makes all the pixels the same color so the code reads the same color value 3 times instead of reading 2 different color values. In doing that you made the code 1/3 smaller or compressed. There is no way to tell what color the pixel was before it was compressed.

When you compress a file after it has been compiled but whatever software. Meaning after you save it, the output is compressed in a different way. When the picture was compressed it changed the values of the pixels to make them a different color to save space and use the same number over and over. In a way lose less compression does the same thing but it DOES NOT CHANGE and values it ONLY makes a short hand for them. For example when you write a text you use short hand "Hey u sup". but when you read it you uncompress it to "Hey you what's up". That's the difference even after compression you know what the original content was so when you uncompress it its there 100% the same as before. Unlike changing the color value of a pixel.

Does that make sense?

WeAreLegion1133d ago

Oh! Lossless compression. The explanation is right in the name. :) Thanks for all the info. That was nice of you to type out. Bubble for helpful!

Ravenheartzero1134d ago

... So yea the games looking pretty good

KwietStorm1133d ago (Edited 1133d ago )

lol the first comment to cut the fat and get right to the point.

PrinceOfAllSaiyans1133d ago

Isn't Sony working on the next gen Blue ray disk ?