Nintendo Is 3rd Party Publishers’ Worst Nightmare – Diego Arias

PE freelance writer Diego Arias has penned an interesting article discussing Nintendo and third-party support. He discusses his (well researched) opinions as to why 3rd parties have been hard on Nintendo all this time. What could be the possible cause(s) as to why 3rd party support in Nintendo systems have been lackluster?

*Warning* If you are somehow unable to at least keep an open mind about this opinion piece and/or only look at the title and comment without CHECKING the article, I suggest you close this page or find another article.

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gerbwmu1438d ago

I think there is a little bit of truth to what he is saying but it isn't as much about being anti Nintendo as it is about being pro profit. The average player, not someone on this site, probably buys 2-4 full price retail games a year. If the 4 best games on Wii U each year are made and published by Nintendo then that doesn't leave a lot of room for 3rd party sales.

Also let's not insult MS or Sony fans by saying they will buy any old crappy game. We all make a bad purchase now and again but for the most part the games that sell are the ones that are good, fun, ever you want to phrase it. It's just that it seems there is less competition from the console maker (and even that is debatable).

LOL_WUT1438d ago

I really can't take PE seriously ever since they started banning users for trying to submit news on why Iwata should get axed.

3rd parties have done great so far without supporting Nintendo and with the PS4 and X1 doing well I doubt much will change. Much like when Nintendo was monopolizing the gaming industry.

I don't see why Nintendo doesn't do something about it like offer some incentives to 3rd party devs to develop for the WiiU after all there sitting on billions of dollars... ;)

randomass1711438d ago

Posting the same news over and over again isn't news.

OtakuDJK1NG-Rory1438d ago

" Iwata should get axed "
Isn't news it just an opinion piece

gpturbo811437d ago (Edited 1437d ago )

they dont need to offer 3rd parties anything.

KwietStorm1438d ago

"The average player, not someone on this site, probably buys 2-4 full price retail games a year. If the 4 best games on Wii U each year are made and published by Nintendo then that doesn't leave a lot of room for 3rd party sales"

Well they also don't have the same third party games to choose from at the same time. Obviously Nintendo makes quality products, but to say the 4 best games on Wii U each year are Nintendo published, that's at least partially because the best third party games of the year are only available elsewhere.

gerbwmu1438d ago

It definitely is a 2 way street and has been since N64 really and to an extent SNES. As a Nintendo fan you do miss out on some great 3rd party content or you get lesser versions and it's been that way for some time.

It really is a chicken and egg scenario IMO though. Both sides can be argued pretty easily.

ABizzel11438d ago

There is definitely some truth to 3rd parties dominating the console space, but that's moreso due to the fact that all together their studios vastly outnumber what MS, Sony, and Nintendo can produce annually, so if you want your console to have a steady stream of games then strong 3rd party support is a must. So in that sense Sony and MS are somewhat bound by 3rd parties (one more than the other), to keep their game libraries full annually, and to win over the majority of gamers.

I agree that 3rd parties don't want Nintendo on top, but between MS and Sony they don't care who wins.

Everything else in this "article" I find to be borderline delusional.

As far as 3rd parties not wanting Nintendo to win, I agree with that being somewhat the case. This is IMO because they learned a hard lesson with the Wii when it was the sales leader. The type of games 3rd parties generally make, simply don't sale to the Nintendo audience (who for the most part are more than satisfied playing only Nintendo games). It has nothing to do with the quality of any games, and more to do with the fact that Nintendo fans buy Nintendo games.

To say Rockstar wouldn't put GTA on the WIi for fear of being outsold by Mario is one of the most ridiculous things I've ever read in the gaming industry. They don't put it on there because driving around cities committing crimes, trafficking, and murder is not what the average Mario loving Nintendo fan wants to do who prefer light-hearted, fun, almost Disney-like gaming experiences. There are gamers like that who exist (I'm one of them), but for the most part they are very different people.

As far as hardware goes, Nintendo just isn't up to par for moving gaming forward "TECHNOLOGICALLY" (not in general, just based on technology and hardware). So for developers who have a multi-million dollar budget for an epic adventure that you want to nail giving the player the sense of traveling through the universe, seeing tons of alien races with advanced AI, beautiful graphics with pseudo realism, etc... Nintendo hardware simply can't handle it, which is why there is a need for a higher-end console to bridge the gap between Nintendo and PC. This is why their consoles are cheaper, less demanding hardware has a lower price and that's how it always been. Now when a game gets a PS360 port and no Wii U port, then by all means that's where the technology card is BS, but more than likely that has everything to do with games not selling with the best example being Assassin's Creed 4 which was a good Wii U port (it was ported to all consoles) which sold a measly 200k copies vs 450k retail (PC), 840k (XBO), 1.73m (PS4), 2.7m (360), 3.1m (PS3). When you spend 2 years making a product, and you barely break even or worse take a loss on a single platform, any company is going to give that platform the axe, that's just business.

ABizzel11438d ago

Now it's time for knocking.

Nintendo online infrastructure isn't to the same level and PSN and XBL, which is part of the reason those services charge, in order to improve them (and make money).

DRM fiasco, Wii U had nothing to do with, because it wasn't even selling at that point with only 5 million sales in it's first year. Wii U was struggling for the same reason 3DS originally was, people are use to Nintendo offering cheap hardware (console usually $199 / $249, and handheld usually $149), so when you launch a $299 / $349 console and a $249 handheld your audience isn't going to rush and buy them.

There's also several articles and reports from developers about how working with Nintendo is a nightmare (especially at launch), because Nintendo's development tools were in their infancy causing developers to program and code their own techniques just to get games up and running, Nintendo was slow about assisting with tools, their development manuals are Japanese and poorly translated so when you call for help you have to wait for Nintendo America to reach Nintendo Japan translator to reach Nintendo Japan coding team to respond to the issue to reach Nintendo Japan translator to reach Nintendo America to finally get the workaround back to the developer (hence why there is a bunch of Japanese 3rd party support, but little Western). No one has time for that, and the developer who made these claims stayed somewhat anonymous, but considering all that was said in that Eurogamer interview and how they had to delay the game it was likely Criterion who ended up making what is still the best racing game on Wii U Need for Speed: Most Wanted (excluding Mario Kart) which sits at a messily 140k sold, and that experience alone has them questioning if it's worth investing in Nintendo anymore.

The blame isn't just on 3rd parties, much of this is also Nintendo's fault. The only truth to come from those last several paragraphs is "It’s time for every Nintendo fan to accept that the Wii U will not get most current gen or even last gen games (Assassin’s Creed Rogue) from 3rd parties. Not because it can’t handle those games, but because they don’t want to support the console."

And they don't want to support Nintendo, because their games aren't the games Nintendo's audience buys in masses, Nintendo doesn't make it easy to developer for their console, the chances of making a profit or simply breaking even have several examples of big frnachises failing outside of Nintendo franchises, and they can make more money elsewhere.

There's a reason Xbox and PS fans say Nintendo makes the same games each generation (which they do), and that's because that's what their fans love and enjoy, so Nintendo has little reason to do more because the majority of their sales come from introductory gamers, and their fanbase. And until their fanbase vocally as a large unified group demands more, Nintendo will continue to do Nintendo.

And this is what they think of vocal fans who logically bring up wanting more games from their various franchises.

Metallox1438d ago

"Assassin's Creed 4 which was a good Wii U port."

It's not a good port, its frame rate ruins absolutely everything, I don't know how Ubisoft was able to launch a thing like that.

N4g_null1437d ago

ABizzel1 the power issue is false. You don't needs a translator to figure out the api... everything is referenced on Wario ware and the indie site clearly. You just don't use fixed function calls everything is gpgpu based. No one did this during the port process. Yet the ps4 and xbone require it also.

You don't know much about technology admit it. Yiu seem to only know what ign and a few other video game sites know. Nintendo was the first to use gpgpu tech, wireless screen with stylus tech, they got motion control right tech wise and software wise and still support it. They are using nfc and talking about a unified platform that could be scaled in power and not break backwards compatibility. This would give nintendo a platform where pc games could be possible yet scale all the way down to handheld. Using apus is going backwards when they simply are not ready nintendo api is clean... no x holding it back. I'm sure they will get there but arm is actually better for gaming more than apus. Notice how Intel is not following. The power pc is still the better chip for gaming. If it is not an i7 x86 wise then look forward to over heating consoles once the gpu and apu are pushed.

Nintendo does not have a drm worry because no one sales their games back in droves. They make games that people want to play years later. This is why ms sony and ea needs you all to get that subscription. That is the only drm you guys will accept along with paid online access. What is sad is your game servers will be closes down years after yet you will still be paying for online.

the aliens adventure you long for is in xenoblade it's coming out 2015. I'm sure metroid is coming also. The ps4 and xbone are not even close to bridging the console and pc gap. Expect another huge leap in tech next year! Stacked dram is coming!

It could be that 3rd parties just don't see the corner they are painting themselves into. You see nintendo makes all types of games. Most 3rd parties only make one to two types of games. Once that franchise dies that is it. Last gen a lot of great development teams lost their jobs. EA fired tons of people along with others. Many went indie to salvage their talents.

What I'm saving is 3rd parties can't afford to not make fans on a Nintendo platform. Instead of porting mega budget games why not experiment with gameplay and even story telling. When and if Nintendo does unify the console and handheld it would be a good idea to know the wiiu in and out. The console is setup to be shrieked into a miniature power house.

What is funny is 3rd party might want to have a plan for when sony folds or when ms is done with gaming in a console form.

N4g_null1437d ago

YET if you are just not good at game play then yes you should stay far away from the wiiu nintendo will eat your lunch and rightfully so. Let 3rd parties stay on other machines I can afford all of the system and only wait for exclusives or the best versions of what I want to play.

if you are blind to game play and just can't afford a pc then the 3rd party is a mediocre heaven of hype. To say nintendo makes the same game over and over ignores game play. Slaptoon is a great example of what nintendo does yet stuff like asscreed is a clear example of the very problem you are putting on nintendo. Gta v is exactly what you did in the last one, cod, the last of us will be the same even my favorite god of war. The only real reason this is brought up is due to legacy. It's like people not liking the fact animation has taking over adult movies Japanese styled animation. Yet that earlier flood of gems will continue to make more fans. While new stuff will age as soon as it is released due to new tech making stuff obsolete. That bar raising will bankrupt you unless you have some thing with substantial entertainment value other than fetch quests game play required skills. I can not list all of the games on the other systems that don't require skill it is pretty boring.

we all know power isn't the problem. 3rd parties still would not support it. The tools are not the problem ethier just note how everyone announced ps3 games just to find out all of their games had to be reworked to work with the cell. Remember when the ps2 was claim to be more powerful? Or how the cell was going to realize it's full potential when it was only a really beefy codec decoder for blu ray? Remember how sony choose not to use the cell yet nintendo is still using ngc tech just way better versions of it.

3rd parties know nintendo gamers ethier demand better playing games and graphics. I really don't think they can deliver both at the level graphics enthused gamers expect.

Even you admit that is the purpose of the ps4 and xbone, yet many gamers and engine makers will say they fell short. It is just going to get worst when you see the tech coming next year.

Big Publishers are trying to make huge moves and needing nintendo is just not part of the plan, ms and Sony will be next on those lists. Just like how sega fell when ea finally pulled support for the dreamcast.

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N4g_null1437d ago (Edited 1437d ago )

Nope the article is very on point. It's called the low hanging fruit. These development teams know that the modelers and rexture/shader designer and FX guys sell their games. Not the game designer. The colleges reflect this actually. A game designer is starting to just be a story designer.

Then there is the dividend in programming. For some reason nintendo produces quality coding while others do hack jobs that are unresponsive. The struggles stem from graphics having priority rather than game play.

Look at starhawk.... no sequel why? Not enough realism?

The problem is what happens when nintendo makes a saving private Ryan of a cod game and takes over the fps genre with a really great story? What happens if the guys that made pans tower and last story knock a home run this gen and rpgs... the original story based games make a comeback?

3rd parties are threaten by nintendo only because of the talent pool.

Look at dead red... most of these companies have no idea what to make any more. Many really believe that sony was going to release a unreal engine 4 ready console. Then they didn't. Many maybe wondering what is taking so long with these new games?

First of all gpgpus where fought against. I believe crytek was the only engine ready for it. Epic, ea other teams and everyone else hated the idea and fix function shaders where all the rave.

Sony was prepared with translator apps and ms is at the same level. Nintendo just makes it stupid easy to port with their api... which is why no one optimizes on the wiiu and it still runs great.

So you have two camps game play makers and er yet candy sellers. Drm did not work so subscriptions will have to do. Once this happens your story based games are just another cable service where you watch your extremely easy game play in front of you.

If sony knew gamers where going to rush out and get the ps4 they would have up the price and specs. Then you would have seen a real jump in graphics.

One reason why indies go to nintendo is because they can't afford high end 3d modeling so bye bye story or realism games.

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aarondejohnson1438d ago

Nailed it. It is a possible that 3rd parties don't support the wii u because of yeah Sony and Microsoft rely on there support so they can survive but nintendo on the other hand don't need them because of there IP's they had for over 30 years so if nintendo had 3rd party support to the fullest than they would shit on playstation 4 right now.

slivery1438d ago

This point always just flies over my head, because I've never known a person in my life who buys a console for third party games. No matter what console it is.

I thought everyone bought consoles and even handhelds for their first party exclusives. Otherwise you could just stick to playing games on PC if that is the case, not much sense in buying a console at all if you buy it for third party games.

Literally makes no sense when you think about it, that is one of the whole points in consoles being separate from PC's anyway is their exclusives.

randomass1711438d ago

I'm actually with you on that. I like having more games to choose from on PS3 or on PS4 or whatever console I choose but the exclusives are always my first priority and Sony's are the best in my humble opinion. I wouldn't want to spend the money to play Assassin's Creed if I wasn't already enjoying The Last of Us.

iamnsuperman1438d ago (Edited 1438d ago )

Yes exclusive make you choice a system but so does other support. The problem the Wii U has is a consumer looks at it and goes oh look A looks good but it won't get X Y Z and these other two systems will. That is a big problem. The biggest titles are third parties. Exclusive make you choose between the systems that have that

Also being a PC gamer is a lot hardier to get into for the average consumer. There is a lot of technical know how to PC gaming. That is what separates the two. Not games

Chrischi19881438d ago

You act like PC has no exclusives, even though the whole RTS genre is considered one of the healthiest.

And of course, the most bought a PS4, because of 3rd parties in mind. They bought it, because they thought, whatever special game there may be in the future, it will probably come to the PS4 and will look better than on Xbox1. Do you want to deny that?

iamnsuperman1438d ago

Make no mistake Nintendo needs them. If the last year has taught us anything is Nintendo struggled to release their games often enough to push sales. Third party lessens the burden on the platform holder

iceman061438d ago

Agreed. I think that they could "live" without them. But, it's kind of a quality of life type question. As you said, they need something (whether that be 3rd party, indies, whatever), to lessen the burden during the lean times.

MasterCornholio1438d ago

I agree. Nintendo can survive without them but they will do better with them. I don't understand why some people think that 3rd party support is a bad thing.

SpiralTear1438d ago


I completely agree. The fact that Nintendo is still selling the system right now shows that third-party publishers do not solely dictate a console's future. However, if Nintendo had third-party support secured, then they wouldn't be stumbling right now.

N4g_null1437d ago

If the console and handheld platforms are merged then nintendo can easily keep the games coming and will be forced to come up with new ip simply because the staples are done and out in the wild.

The biggest problem is 3rd party software game play seems to be getting worst. All they have is good graphics. Sega had this problem also. I'm all for better graphics but where is the game play.

Also after this summer of Micheal bay I'm starting to feel gamers will start thinking cod and the so called realism on consoles isn't going to cut it pretty soon.

On top of it all phones are tablets are about to be able to run direct x 11 level graphics which is why all publisher want to go mobile and ditch the console wars all together. Tablet and phones have the price advantage. They can cost 1200 and just attach a service plan. Sony and ms can not do this. A new psp would have to come out every year.

truechainz1437d ago

Arguably if Nintendo wasn't cutting their focus between handheld and console games, and pushed harder for indies, then Nintendo could match the pace of releases of the other two consoles, a larger percentage of which would be exclusive to Nintendo. At that point it wouldn't be a matter of quantity of releases like it is now. Only problem would be the popularity of certain 3rd party games that gamers want wouldn't be on Nintendo platforms, but that is happening now too anyways.

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SpiralTear1438d ago

How can this be resolved? If people who own Nintendo consoles usually invest their cash in Nintendo games over third-party games, what can be done to mend that? Is it more promotion and marketing of these third-party games in collaboration with Nintendo? Is it offering more third-party exclusives to combine with Nintendo's original offerings? I really don't know.

I understand the problem at hand. I'm just really not sure what the best course of action here is to fix this.

slivery1438d ago (Edited 1438d ago )

Easy the answer is simply options, just give your fans options. As I said no one buys any consoles specifically for third party games as it makes no sense to do that anyway.

Publishers also have to understand you can't just delay games and release them on every other platform and expect it to sell well on the Wii U. I blame both Nintendo for allowing this and publishers for getting away with such bad business practices.

Nintendo just needs to work on getting better third party support, better communication in general so things like this don't happen anymore. The fact they barely acknowledge it or ever say how much they are trying, is a bit worrisome.

They should let their fans know they are doing the best they can, because the lack of third party support on the Wii U is probably some of the worst in history.

I can't even count all the games the Wii U is not getting on one hand, let alone two and that is pretty bad especially when nearly all these games are also releasing on PS3 and Xbox 360.

Third parties have pretty much completely abandoned this system and I can't help but think there is more to it than just every publisher being greedy. The lack of support from almost every major third party publisher shows there is much more to this than we probably know but regardless that is Nintendo's job to work on it.

mcstorm1438d ago

The one thing people forget is the market the Wiiu has. The reason why developers are still giving the 360 and ps3 games is because there are still over 160 million of them being used. Also they know there games will sell better on the Xbox one and ps4 than the Wiiu too. But the flip side is how you look at it. COD BO2 sold over 300 thousand copy on a console that had 3 million sales in 3 months. Now no one was going to buy a wiiu for cod and it was also a half assed port of cod too but that said those numbers were very good.

EA put back NFS on the Wiiu and I have to give it to them the Wiiu version looked amazing but it came out 6 months after the 360 and ps3 versions and was at full price. If they sold it for £30 it may of sold better.

At the end of the day it really dose depend what game you are into to what you buy. Most gamers are going to look to carry on getting games like FIFA, NHL, NBA, cod, bf and AC year on year and get it on the console there mates get and if the Wiiu has not got these games there is less chance of the Wiiu sales picking up for 3rd party.

I also think Nintendo have enough to cope on there own but next time they release a console they need to come with some big IP's as the 3ds and Wiiu did not have too much in the 1st year and the 3rd party games let them down. Nintendo do have enough IP's to not need 3rd party games but Nintendo need to start brining them back. Stardom, fzero, Diddy Kong racing, super punch out are just a few I can think of off the top of my head that Nintendo need to look at giving Wiiu users.

SpiralTear1438d ago

"I blame both Nintendo for allowing this and publishers for getting away with such bad business practices."

This. This is not entirely Nintendo's fault, nor is it entirely the publishers' fault. I always remember when Criterion was interviewed about NFS: Most Wanted on Wii U and how they said that neither Nintendo nor EA gave them any legitimate support or marketing. Both sides were at fault. I wish more people understood that.

wonderfulmonkeyman1438d ago (Edited 1438d ago )

There's a few things third parties could do;

1: start prioritizing the wii u over last gen consoles when developing new multiplatform ip's, so that they get parity in both content and release timing.

2: Focus solely on exclusive new ip's for the wii u, instead of multiplats.(New ip's are a risk regardless of console so they aren't taking a bullet here)

3: Do the same thing for Nintendo's multiplats that they sometimes do for multiplats on the other systems: create exclusive DLC content that is catered with the tastes of that fanbase in mind.

Any one of these three options, when combined with large advertisement efforts, would help third parties do much better on the wii u in the long run.

iamnsuperman1438d ago (Edited 1438d ago )

The biggest question is why should third parties take the risk when Nintendo directed their consoles, over many years, into the situation they are in right now. Nintendo needs to lessen the risk by spending cash while in the future making a system that shares similarities with the other platform holders

wonderfulmonkeyman1438d ago (Edited 1438d ago )

That wouldn't do anything in the long run, because the power of the system won't change the most important, key, factor:
Third parties have lost the trust of the fanbase with the way they've done their multiplats on the wii u.
That's not something that Nintendo can fix because it's a problem with the fanbase's desire to support the games, which stems from the multiplats not having anything to entice them, or reassure them that they'll get equal treatment from third parties.

Nintendo's can't just say "hey, here's third party multiplats, buy them!" Then slap on a few commercials and expect to change the minds of gamers who have been betrayed by third party multiplats on this line of systems for a long time.

Third parties are the only ones that can do that.
The change HAS to start with the way they approach the platform, or they will never sell on it.

Chrischi19881438d ago (Edited 1438d ago )

The reason why people with Nintendos plattform buy Nintendo games is not because they dont want to buy 3rd party games or because they only have money for Nintendo games, it is more like because there hasnt been 1 3rd party game, that hasnt had its fair share of problems and Nintendos games are the only ones, that for obvious reasons dont have these problems.

Delays, missing features, no DLC, overpriced, no further support. We dont care for worse visuals, but we care for features. Like Call of Duty Ghost, it only had 1 Extinction Mode Map, this is a joke, hmm, why hasnt it sold? It is obvious and anybody who denies that, is a hater or never actually looked at the kind of stuff we have to put up to. There has not been 1 game, that wasnt gimped in a way, so it couldnt be a success, name me 2 games, that were totally ok, but still didnt sell. I say 2, because I want to have room, because there are always exceptions, but in general, there has not been 1 game.

I would gladly support the new CoD on Wii U, if it had all features, not meaning achievements with this, because I never cared for them, but stuff like Maps, for something like the Extinction mode.

Chrischi19881437d ago

How can you guys disagree? Do you have a Wii U? I have one, the ones on board here, that have one say the same thing as I do, how can somebody, who doesnt own one know better, why we dont buy 3rd Party games, then we, the owners do?

This is illogical and hilarious. The disagree mirror the big fanboyism and nintendo hate on this site. Dont use logic, only hate and dumb stubborness^^

Emanno1438d ago (Edited 1438d ago )

Third party support ain't a waste of time for Nintendo.

Geekman1438d ago

Never thought about it that way. If this is the case then Nintendo has the ability to win a gen with one move, and that's actually making hardware 3rd parties can support.

Not now, though. I'd be angry if they dropped Wii U support.

randomass1711438d ago

As would I having only gotten mine a couple of months ago. Nintendo will make as much money as they can on software and be done with it. The launch of their next system will hopefully be a smarter one.

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