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COMMENT | 3-1 to Sony? Microsoft need a new console, and soon

But not necessarily that new.

Regardless of whether or not the sales figures for the last financial quarter are of consoles sold or shipped, regardless of the extent to which the PlayStation and Xbox numbers were muddied by last-gen console statistics, one thing is clear: Microsoft are lagging behind. By an alarming factor of three-to-one.

It's early days, of course, in terms of Phil Spencer's tenure at the top. For much of 2014, he's been dealing in damage control, and trying to turn the omnishambles that Mattrick left behind into something identifiable, something relatable, something to do with games rather than every other facet of entertainment.

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iamnsuperman726d ago (Edited 726d ago )

"Put simply, if Spencer is to perform a proper reset of the Xbox One brand and realign the console's focus on gaming, he's going to need a new console to do it. Not a generational console, but an Xbox One trimmed of all the fat. One that gets rid of everything apart from the core system hardware and a big fat hard-drive."

I see your point but these extras aren't, apart from the kinect, really costing Microsoft anything. Getting rid of them seems more anti productive than productive. The best thing to do is to change the focus and not release another completely different SKU. Another completely different SKU increases confusion amongst consumers (which I feel is one of the problems with the Kinectless SKU). This would be taking it a step too far.

Microsoft needs to find a way of making the Xbox even cheaper to start making ground on the PS4 but removing stuff isn't going to help. Remember Microsoft spent a fortune on the new kinect (rumored to be as much as the console). It is something you can't just write off. The damage was already done then (so removing more stuff isn't going to help them that much; we talking about taking very little off the manufacturing price here with these things gone)

zeal0us726d ago (Edited 726d ago )

When MS had announce a kinect-less X1 SKU I thought they would at least sell it ~$350-375. Personally I think the X1 would've sold a lot more if they had priced at $350.

It will be a while before they can recuperate from the development cost of Kinect 2.0. They generation just started so hopefully they will turn things around.

amiga-man726d ago (Edited 726d ago )

MS really dropped the ball coming into this gen thats what you get when business men are in charge of something they do not care about or understand,

they were more focused on pushing through their own agenda DRM always online and kinect were wanted by MS not the the gamer releasing a machine that was underpowered and too expensive was just another slap in the face with gamers proving they are not to be as stupid as they had hoped and turning their backs on the xone.

With Spencer in charge you do feel that at last they do have someone that at least understands gaming but it is too little too late, all that he can hope to do now is try to limit the damage done, but one things for sure this gen they will always be behind the PS4 and they only have themselves to blame.

ShowGun901726d ago

@amiga-man

"gamers aren't as stupid as M$ hoped."

this says it all right there, they built a machine THEY liked, with features that benefited THEM, and hoped we'd all sign on. Too bad that didn't happen, huh? LOL

Minute Man 721726d ago

@ amiga-man
It's the 3rd console curse

Letthewookiewin726d ago (Edited 726d ago )

The X1 should be priced at 299$ especially right now. At it's current price it will keep losing ground to Sony. Especially in September when Destiny hits and people pick up that white PS4 bundle and PS4s in general, then in October when people go to pick up consoles and see that the PS4 has it's exclusive racer out on top of all the multiplats. Sunset Overdrive will not be a system seller but will do good with people that already own the system, the MasterCC will move consoles but I know a lot of people like me who have played all the Halos to death aren't going to go and spend 460$ to do it again. On top of that you take away Kinect 2.0 and drop 100$ but you go and sell it for 200$.

DragonKnight726d ago

Ok, first of all this article is so stupid it hurts. If MS released a new SKU the way this article suggests, it would do more harm than good. Every time MS does a 180, they get slammed for it and rightfully so. They wouldn't have needed to do so many 180s if they'd even TRIED some ACTUAL market research to see that gamers would not like what they were trying to sell.

But this would be the biggest 180 they could make and with it would be the biggest slam. MS would show, once and for all, that they are incompetent in the gaming industry, that they are so out of touch that it's not even funny.

Lowering the price isn't the answer either. That only works on the casuals that don't know any better, and quite honestly their opinions have been tainted by the core's disdain for MS' launch already.

No, the answer for Microsoft is to stay the course and release games. Stop making Rare work on B.S. Kinect games or shovelware, start using older IPs that people ask for, flood the market with GOOD games. Move as far away from the money grubbing, anti-consumer tactics as possible.

MS will not turn it around overnight, and people need to stop expecting that that's going to happen. MS is not in a failure position just because the PS4 is currently selling better, but they aren't in the position they want to be in either. They can turn things around, but it will take time, it will take work, and no matter how many articles come out with their own stupid solutions, there is no instant fix, only band-aid solutions that won't work in the end.

troylazlow726d ago

in Canada the PS4 is $450 and the kinect-less X1 is $400, you cannot find the kinect-less X1 in stores now but plenty of PS4's.

Might just be in Canada but that's what I'm seeing

amiga-man726d ago

DragonKnight: if they'd even TRIED some ACTUAL market research to see that gamers would not like what they were trying to sell.

Gamers were telling them loud and clear they didn't like the direction they were taking, Adam Ord should have been enough but still they pushed through with their plans, it was only when gamers said no to their crap that MS started listening.

It wasn't lack ok market research it was lack of common sense, to try and release a machine with so many restrictions was downright stupid and it has cost them big time.

XBLSkull726d ago (Edited 726d ago )

Hasn't Microsoft come in last place every generation? That doesn't mean they don't have awesome consoles... I own both systems and while I use my X1 every day, just this week is the first time my PS4 has been turned on since February to play (gasp!) a last generation game remaster that I skipped last gen.

VegasDawg726d ago

@amiga-man, Just like Sony did with the PS3. Right? Lets see if your just a fanBOY are you mean what you say.

badboyz09726d ago

@amiga-man

"gamers aren't as stupid as M$ hoped."

Last Gen they were.

Flamingweazel725d ago

@TROYLAZLOW..I am from canada and you are full of crap...kinectless Xboxs are everywhere...lets not pretend demand was ever that high for x1 it was sold out of stores, especially now. Please. Ps4 despite being 50 cheaper is still lagging behind in Canada.

Consoldtobots725d ago

one can choose to look at this gen as Microsoft's failure or one can choose to look at this gen as Sony's resolve to kick Micros head in for the dirty pool they played last gen.

+ Show (9) more repliesLast reply 725d ago
Wizard_King726d ago

When you price comparative parts as the XB1 you get a very cheap system. Seems ludicrous to pay full price now for an under powered gaming laptop with less features.

All_Consoles726d ago

"Less features"
Oh really, name some

ShowGun901726d ago

I think he means less features than a laptop, which is TRUE... can the xbone run powerpoint and word?

jumping to conclusions is so bad on these forums...

Lennoxb63726d ago

It cost more to make the X1 than the PS4. Get your facts straight first.

Consoldtobots725d ago

this is more about Sony hitting a $400 pricepoint with an amazing GDDR5 machine as opposed to what MS screwed up. In other words they never stood a chance.

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MightyNoX726d ago (Edited 726d ago )

But HOW do you propose they make The Bone's production cheaper? The prices for PS4's 8Gig DDR5 will go down allowing Sony to undercut MS and make more proift.

Conversely, the prices for the bone's DDR3 will actually go up.

There is no other component they can take out to cheapen production, no BC or HDD.

strangeaeon726d ago

No offense, but what makes you such an expert on the hardware of X1?

MightyNoX726d ago

@strangeaon: i'm rarely offended by an uneducated person sprouting nonsense without doing research. It'd be like being insulted by an ant.

But as to your question, I am an engineer, i regularly listen to podcasts, interviews, engage on AMA on reddit and engage in hardware discussions on nvidia and amd forums and keep up to up to date. I make it my job to keep up to date with my field of work.

Read, clown, read. It does the mind good.

http://www.extremetech.com/...

Also, read Cerny's interviews whenever you can. Got it? Lesson over.

orakle44726d ago

Wow, Strangeaeon even started his comment with "No offense," yet you still went off on him for no reason at all. You act as if he should have known that you work in the field and do all sorts of research. Even stooping so low as to immature name calling (for no reason at all).

All you had to do was let him know that you work in the field, not that hard to do. But hey this is the interwebs, where you're not cool unless you're putting others down :/

MelvinTheGreat726d ago

You're an idiot to think DDR3 will keep going up once DDR4 release in the near future.

kneon726d ago

Well they can remove the hdmi in port and associated hardware.

strangeaeon726d ago

What does "sprouting nonsense" mean anyway? And why did you fly into a name calling tantrum? My question barely warranted your childish reaction.And congrats, you are an engineer, this doesn't give you the right to lord it over us "uneducated ants". Grow up and learn some social skills, there is more to life than an education.

letsa_go726d ago

I bet you feel so euphoric now that you dropped your knowledge on strangeaeon! Good day, gentlesir!

slasaru01726d ago

Ps4 has not DDR5, it's GDDR5, it's not going to be much cheaper

Zhipp726d ago

Isn't GDDR5 basically modified DDR3? Why would the price of DDR3 rise when GDDR5 drops? They're both going to be obsolete in a few years with DDR4/GDDR6.

Omegasyde725d ago

@nox...Wow such doucheness in one reply. Your credits mean crap.

AMA's are as knowledgable as wikipedia. You say your an engineer but of what kind? I build networks and application systems, yet I don't go arround touting I am an engineer. Do you work at micrsoft or one of the chinese factories?

Strangeon called you out and you gave a rude, fake, and defensive reply. Just by that reply, I can tell you know nothing but what you read off the internet.

rainslacker725d ago

Not to defend either side here, but why is everyone ganging up on Nox? Strangeaeon didn't even reply to Nox's actual comment. If strange has knowledge that refutes Nox's statement he should have offered that instead of not offering a reply at all. Strange asked for credentials, Nox offered them, more or less, and then everyone attacks Nox.

Does anyone who replied have an actual replay to what Nox said? Because I do.

All memory prices fluctuate for any number of reasons. Nox offered a article as to one reason why. This is independent of any kind new technology that is coming, and can even affect GDDR5 or any other part, right down to a capacitor used for the power supply.

DDR4 is the next big thing, but DDR3 is still going to be commonplace for the next 5-6 years at least. As DDR4 starts to ramp up, DD3 actually becomes more expensive to produce, as factories are retooled for the new memory that will be in demand, so there is less available factories making the older memory to supply as they are getting ready for the next big thing. The manufacturers are going to want to make as much off the old product as possible as well, especially since it becomes more of a niche product(for lack of a better term).

It's happened this way for every change in memory architecture for the past 30 years. The prior gens memory prices spike until the supply is eventually dwindled with only a oddball producer of it here or there for things that are likely still going to be needed for a while.

Luckily, for MS, DDR4 isn't going to be the next big thing soon enough for the prices to spike high enough to make a difference for the current gen, and prices will likely go down before they spike and the spike won't be as much as they're spending now.

On the other hand, there is no GDDR5 replacement for the foreseeable future, which means that demand is going to remain constant, or increase, which will drive prices down as factories can produce more at the same or cheaper price.

This is of course barring some factory burning down, or some natural disaster in production areas, so in the end it could go either way.

All this being said, the memory architecture of both the X1 and PS4 are well known. You don't need to be an engineer to know this stuff, just have to have an interest and desire to find the information. For everything else, almost every other part of the X1 has been identified and priced. The only things not known 100% are how much MS may have paid for each individual component in bulk, but guesses can be made based on current market trends. Those breakdowns are easily available, and quite detailed, on the net.

Why o why725d ago

Thanks rainslacker. Well said.

insomnium2725d ago (Edited 725d ago )

Well said rainslacker. The answer to YOUR question of "why is everyone ganging up on Nox?" is that he acted like a major deuchebag for no good reason. That's it. Just read strangeaeon's question and Nox's reply again and you'll see how high of a horse he is riding on with that reply. He overreacted like a mofo.

+ Show (10) more repliesLast reply 725d ago
Jughead3416726d ago

It's crazy how sony's doing so well, they're making Microsoft seem like they're not. In actuality, xbox one is selling ok, but compared to ps4, (3 to 1), they seem like they suck. This is what happens though when you make a machine that no one asked for, and the competitors machine is all about the gamer

FanboyKilla726d ago

so you guys feel more secure about having a ps4 because alot of other people have it. lmfao talk all you want that ps4 isnt getting any better. or there would be articles about that. lol sony cant believe you guys are buying it. so they rolling with it. outsells xbox, yea yeah, 1080p too.

lol what about the lack of features? if you listed the things xone can do and the things a ps4 does, asked a honest man with no previous knowledge of them, im betting xone. sony and their fans have resorted to talking about things that dont matter to a gamer. like quarter reports, and sales figures.

no news on any games? what about an update to your horrible software. no? you do realize xone updates every month right? how can you be the best, when everyone else is getting better? how about that ps now, have you changed it from a arm and a leg yet? no?

lmfao you sony fans here are only talking to each other here on n4g. no one else can hear you. just a bunch of sony fans patten themselves on the back. lol n4g is like sonys propaganda site. sucka ducks.

you can fool some of the people some of the time, but not all the people all the time. its just a shame how many they can fool though.

they can sale one to everyone on the planet, right now, my ps 4 sucks. and has been confirmed it will suck at least untill 2015. ps 4 are you serious. their software looks like it was in the walk-man. xone to ps4 is rewind. lmfao i got a ps4, you cant fool me, i know what you got. lmfao it sucks in its current state point blank period. read my old post. i told you the only gap between them will be software and ms came out winning that. now its just getting ugly.

xones gotta update coming soon. watch sony be like me too. firmware 1.80 coming soon. lol i mean they are claiming dynasty warriors as an exclusive win. lmfao all the while, you wont find 500 people playing that game. its hilarious. the best thing we got is a port from last gen. and the crowd goes wild. wait, can ponies be in crowds? or is a herd or something.

letsa_go726d ago

Walkmans never had software.

mike_honcho726d ago

apparently the consumers generally think it's better if it's selling 3:1.. that's usually how these things work.. and also you forgot to put a b in "xone"

DoubleM70726d ago

Dude I can care less. I have converted 4 people into getting themselves and XBOX1. The general public don't know what this sucker can do. I never herd people talk about everything else but games.

N8726d ago

That's all Sony has to do is me too. They are in the lead. The XB1 came out a me too console and if they would have stuck with DRM it would have been 5 to 1 by now.

SoapShoes726d ago

@DoubleM70... Well the only ones talking about games are Xbox fans and by that I mean trying to downtalk PS4 games. The reason people tend to not talk about X1 games is it hasn't had anything since Titanfall that is exclusive to it while PS4 has had 4 retail exclusives(not even talking about indies here).

reko725d ago

@lamefanboy

bruh you lame gtfo here lol

ThanatosDMC725d ago

Xbone also got WiiUed (multiplatform games not releasing on the console).

+ Show (4) more repliesLast reply 725d ago
ITPython726d ago

Like MS does with it's OS's when one fails, they will likely be releasing another console soon (a year or two, possibly around the 2015 Halo launch).

If they were smart, it would be a console that is much more powerful than the PS4, easier to develop for than the PS4, priced the same if not maybe even a little cheaper, and it would need to be fully reverse compatible with all XB1 games.

Then they would be wise to offer some kind of trade-in program so people with XB1's can trade those in for either a large discount for the new console, or a full blown swap at no extra charge. Yes MS would lose a bit of money doing this, but often in the business world you have to spend money to make money. And perhaps they could salvage parts from the XB1 to use in the XB2.

As it stands now the XB1 has zero chance of recovering and will just keep drifting further and further away from the PS4. It will probably come to a point where multiplat third-party devs may even stop supporting it. MS absolutely has to release a new console if they want to be around for another generation, otherwise they will suffer the same fate as the Dreamcast.

iamnsuperman726d ago

There are two problems with you idea. One it will confuse customers. They have just had a big push for the Xbox One. Saying here is the Xbox 2 would just confuse them. Secondly third party confidence would take a nose dive. It is one of the reasons a cycle needs to be 5+ years. Developers spend years tailoring a game for a console. For a manufacturer to turn around and and say ignore that new console here is a newer one will destroy their faith that the manufacturer is committed to their product. The only way to combat this is to some how build it like tablets and mobile phones have were older version can play never version games..... but again this runs into issues

SoapShoes726d ago

Well they completely abandoned the original Xbox when the 360 came out simply because there was no saving it(among other things). If X1 doesn't do well I expect a new console in 3-4 years with them ceasing all production of the X1.

liquidhalos725d ago

Millions of people haven't switched to current gen yet, i think we need to give the consumers time to switch before we judge. Lets see what happens over a couple of holiday seasons after the big games have dropped. People will start upgrading soon enough.

ITPython725d ago (Edited 725d ago )

@iamnsuperman - I agree on the first part, it probably would confuse customers. But MS loves spending millions on advertising and getting the word out any way they can (such as sweepstakes, giveaways, events, mentions in youtube videos and any and all other possible ways to advertise), so if anybody could pull it off and lessen the confusing blow to customers, MS could with their immense advertising budget.

The second part I actually already had a solution for that problem in my post, which is to have the XB2 be completely reverse compatible with XB1 games. This way devs who worked on a XB1 game for so long wouldn't get screwed over because the game won't play on the new machine. And this also means older XB1 games already made won't be affected either, as XB2 players can still buy and enjoy them.

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Gamer1982725d ago

MS are making a lot of extra income from branching out it seems with rumours of Halo master chief collection coming to STEAM and a more gaming centric windows. Seems MS really want a piece of that windows gamer pie aswell. I mean why not? they don't have to supply any hardware for PC gamers and costs of releasing on that platform are historically lower. Plus releasing on two platforms increases income by a substantial amount. Of course it give you less reason to buy an Xbox but only if you want to go the PC gaming route not everybody wants a PC for gaming.

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ArchangelMike726d ago

Good article, really enjoyed the read.

I think we all know that the 'slim' version of consoles will come out, not sure if it will be next year or in 2016. But even if we assume Microsoft release the xboxone-slim in 2015, trimmed of any excess fat, and at a further reduced price; we know that Sony are in a position to do the same, and potentially still have the cheaper, but still more powerful console.

Microsoft needed a killer app that demonstrated the integration of Kinect, media and gaming, to really show their vision for the xboxone. I was really keeping an eye on Quantum Break, because it promised to bring all three components together for a true next-gen experience. But now that kinect has been unbundled, and xbox entertainment studios has closed, I'm not actually sure Microsoft can still fulfill that vision in the same way.

First party exclusive games are what can bring Microsoft upto par, but even that is not necessarily going to bring new converts to the console, but will help migrate the last-gen adopters to the new gen. It seems Sony on the other hand have been able to bring in new converts into the playstation ecosystem, if the 3-1 statistic is true.

Bottom line - Microsoft have tried a re-launch by unbundling Kinect from xboxone, now they need to show up strong on the games front going forward. That's really the only way they can get back up to par.

cfc78726d ago

In terms of games and getting back up to par Microsoft would have to deliver the best games line up a gen has ever seen,with Sony's ever growing quality line up of games and the stronger hardware i just don't see it happening i think Microsoft will finish behind Sony what ever they try and i think even Ms knows that,hopefully the race will be closer next time.

Hanuman726d ago (Edited 726d ago )

Halo (something) should have been a launch game, alongside Forza and some teasers for a new Gears. Now that, would make me get one at launch. The new IP's Ryse and Titanfall, were horribly marketed and both felt rushed to me. Going Kinectless was a great move and Halo 5, pour moi, will seal the deal. It's all I expect an Xbox to do. The rest is gravy..

ScorpiusX726d ago

That would be crazy , but if they do so am ready to buy me a new one when released.

chrissx726d ago

Ms is not releasing any new console atleast for the next 5 years

harrisk954726d ago

He is not literally talking about a "new" console -- an "Xbox Two" -- he is talking about the launch of a slimmed down version of the XB1 for less money. Usually slim versions of consoles don't come out for a few years after launch, but in this case, it might help the perception problem that MS is currently having. Hell, MS has lost the mindshare of the mainstream media in the U.S. with the XB1, which is not good for them.

ShowGun901726d ago

...god i hope the next xbox isnt called the "xbox two"

LOL

Artista 726d ago (Edited 726d ago )

And, the solution is to release a new console within about 10 months of releasing the ONE, knowing there a many projects in development for it. There are 26 countries that have yet to receive the ONE.

I understand that it's you're job to blow sh!t out of proportion to get hits but, damn.

SlavisH2726d ago

Articles like this only make it on n4g. From a business perspective this is the dumbest things I've read so I guess i need to look at it from a fan girl perspective.

All_Consoles726d ago

This is why 90% of articles on n4g are a joke

MysticStrummer726d ago

Did you read the article? It's just suggesting that they release a cheaper XB1, not a completely new console.

iamnsuperman726d ago

The article talks more about releasing a new sku than a brand new generation

harrisk954726d ago

I don't necessarily agree, but the article is talking about a slim version of the XB1, not the "Xbox Two".

Additionally, your assumption that the release in those 26 countries is going to miraculously help the XB1 be competitive is without any basis in reality. These are countries that the 360 was not very competitive with the PS3 last gen. Why do you believe that somehow these countries will now embrace the XB1? There is a reason that MS chose not to launch XB1 in those other countries for the first year of its life.

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