Submitted by Abriael 413d ago | news

Phil Spencer: DirectX12 Not a "Massive Change" For Xbox One; Explains 1st Party Studios Expectations

Xbox Head Honcho Phil Spencer gave a realistic assessments of what you can expect from DirectX 12 on Xbox One, and about his expectations from first party studios as opposed to third parties. (DirectX 12, Phil Spencer, Xbox One)

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ErcsYou  +   413d ago | Well said
Phil just crushed somebody's dreams. Lol
xHeavYx  +   413d ago | Well said
Pretty much what everyone else who's not an Xbox fan has been saying
#1.1 (Edited 413d ago ) | Agree(228) | Disagree(28) | Report | Reply
truefan1  +   413d ago
No that is false, Xb1 fans haven't really mentioned DX12 that much. You can search all my comments related to DX12, and you won't find one comment saying it will double XB1 performance. I did say it will be nice to have a 50% more efficient CPU, which is still unverified. And I got that information from the slides of that GDC conference earlier this year.

It's pretty funny this statement will mean more to ps4 fans than Xb1 fans. Don't believe look at the main ones commenting saying this will shut xbots up. lol Matter of fact there are only about 5 or 6 true XB1 fans on this site, so really where are all these xbots commenting talking about the cloud and dx12.

@LeBruset that was a poor attempt to call me out, keep searching. In you 2 quotes where do I mention how well DX12 will help. i just found it odd an opposing developer cared so much. As for your deal, we need to sweeten the pot a bit, if you can get a couple more of your ps4 buddies like Kingthrash, New Monday, Lukas, and Heavy to join in it's a DEAL. I'm Kind of a big deal on these gaming blogs, TRUEFAN is a worldwide name now, whether you like me or hate me.

@LeBruset it's starting to look sad that you are still trying. Keep on searching though, I'm sure I slipped up once. I basically control you, if I can get under your skin that much. It really shouldn't mean that much to you, video games are just toys.

@LeBruset stop proving my point, look at all the research you are doing. PS I never said you shouldn't have fun commenting on your hobby, which is what I do. You are clearly irritated. I get personal messages all the time, but I think it's funny people get so upset. Nothing said on this site could make me go out of my way to privately message someone lol. Not saying you have messaged me, but you keep researching trying to find some ammo. Let it go man.
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KNWS  +   413d ago
Ready the actual tweet.

Person who asked. This might be random but will dx12 be a game changer for xbox one????? And how? why ?

Phil@ It will help developers on XBOX One. It's not going to be a massive change but will unlock more capability for devs

Phil confirms it is for x box something Sony fans deny on N4G all the time.

Hes wording massive. It still going to be good for xb1.

Directx12 unlock more capability for devs.

So the API is going to help out the xb1.
LackaJaKane  +   413d ago
Yeah, and he just fulfilled everyone else who's not an xbox fan dream with that statement.

they're all probably high-fiving eachother.
#1.1.3 (Edited 413d ago ) | Agree(38) | Disagree(13) | Report
Audiggity  +   413d ago
Or not... Good attempt at igniting yet another pointless console flame war.

Anyone who thought DX12 would bring massive, game changing enhancements to the X1 is just, not very intelligent. Hardware is hardware. There is no magic here.
Eonjay  +   413d ago | Well said
To be honest, Microsoft has been very honest from the beginning. You have to listen to what they say and block out others. One of the system architects at Microsoft explained it a long time ago and people wouldn't listen. DX12 brings some of the advantages from consoles to PC. It also has an advantage of making cross platform development ubiquitous across Xbox One and PC. The major benefit is its ability to get better results from modern multicore CPUs much in a way that the Xbox is doing now.

People were claiming miracles would occur but that is not what they said. They even gave a demo showing how DX12 was more efficient than DX11 with CPU time.

I seriously fail to see how Microsoft misled anyone.
MEGANE  +   413d ago | Funny
@truefan. Do u really think some one here is gonna waste time looking at u comment history!(BTW is must be very short with one lonely bubble).
I am actually surprise I took the time to replay to ur comment.
Pogmathoin  +   413d ago
'Pretty much what everyone else who's not an Xbox fan has been saying.'

Pretty much they are the only ones that ever commented on it.... Half the time the 'non' xbox fans would even post the story and then comment first, too excited like a fat kid who found a smartie.

@ megane, well, its better than those with 10 bubbles, with 10 times the trolling BS.
#1.1.7 (Edited 413d ago ) | Agree(22) | Disagree(51) | Report
Eonjay  +   412d ago
The only person who got crushed was MisterX.
For the second time by Phil himself.
I think people like that make Phil's job more difficult but promising things that are irrational and unrealistic.
tuglu_pati  +   412d ago
Its great that Phil is upfront with this. I like the fact that he's been honest.
Lukas_Japonicus  +   412d ago | Well said
Woah! Am i suddenly in a different universe? I can't believe what im reading here from some people....

You guys were saying for months how much of a game changer DX12 was for the X1, how you can have the audacity to sit there and act all humble and move the goalposts in an attempt to redirect any shame from themselves is pitiful. You guys acted like DX12 was the absolutely saving grace for the X1, and that the power increase would be HUGE.

I hate to say i told you so, but i did tell you so. I said again and again that DX12 wouldn't have as much impact as people were hoping for, that it was mainly for the benefit of PC's, and that pinning all your hopes onto it was just setting up yourselves for disappointment. And any time someone chose to doubt DX12, or question it in *any* way, like i did, we got labelled as trolls and downplayers.


"Phil confirms it is for x box something Sony fans deny on N4G all the time. "

Hahaha....what? Stop moving the goalposts, no one said that. I heard many people say that it would benefit PC much more than the X1, never did i see someone say DX12 wasn't for Xbox, everyone and their dog knows that the 'X' in 'Xbox' is because of Direct X. Stop making things up, because you are one of the guys who thought DX12 would be a game changer, don't make me show people the PM's i have from you about DX12.

"It's not going to be a massive change"

That part of the quote goes directly against what ive been hearing from Xbox fanboys for the past few months. Maybe this will be a lesson learned about counting your chickens (and bragging about them) before they have hatched? Probably not.....
#1.1.10 (Edited 412d ago ) | Agree(98) | Disagree(22) | Report
AngelicIceDiamond  +   412d ago
So it won't help the X1 in a massive way. But it will benefit the X1 regardless.

That's good to know.

What's also good to know is that this DX12 argument should be put to rest finally.
4Sh0w  +   412d ago
No, check my posts, like most X1 fans I've always said DX12 is just another tool/asset, plus many more to come that will improve X1 over the years which is typical of how ALL consoles/software works, all the secret sauce talk is from that mister guy and ps fanboys who hope X1 doesnt constantly improve. lol, which is so silly, I mean micro is a software giant so you would expect them to QUICKLY build better tools, SDK'S to improve their platform.

-Tell 'em Phil:

"It will help developers on Xbox One. It's NOT going to be a massive change BUT will unlock more capability for devs."

"I don't think it's about a specific genre, more about creating exclusive franchises, taking some risks 3rd parties might not take." -Phil Spencer

Phil is doing a great job, it's ambitious but realistic talk like this that I enjoy.
#1.1.12 (Edited 412d ago ) | Agree(14) | Disagree(41) | Report
Kingthrash360  +   412d ago | Well said
Check my previous comments....I've been saying that since February.
Hardware is hardware. Software helps but its not gunna "even" things out.
Truefan ..lol. OK whatever man.
#1.1.13 (Edited 412d ago ) | Agree(34) | Disagree(16) | Report
Saigon  +   412d ago

You are right they did not, but every developer and wanna-be-developer said other wise. +b. That is the reason why the DX12 message is scrambled. Its good that MS has said something confirming what some of us already knew but it still does not change the fact that some still think there is some secret sauce. So I guess the next thing we will here for a while until confirmation is that the cloud will make a difference once Crackdown 3 is shown using the tech.
LeCreuset  +   412d ago | Well said

"Matter of fact there are only about 5 or 6 true XB1 fans on this site, so really where are all these xbots commenting talking about the cloud and dx12."

And just what is your extreme standard for judging someone a true XB1 fan? Is it making extreme and hyperbolic statements like you engage in?

You engage in illogical hyperbole routinely and refuse to be accountable for it. That's pretty disingenuous to challenge people to find in your comment history where you said that DX12 will double XB1 performance. xHeavYx didn't imply, directly or indirectly, that anyone did. What was being called out was the illogical hyping of DX12, and hyping is something you and others are quite guilty of. Kind of like when you said XB1 won't lose to PS4 more than 2/7 months from June on. So speaking of challenges and being accountable for outlandish statements, I'm still awaiting your response.

IVanSpinal  +   412d ago
Maybe Xbox Fanboys, but fans?
Stupid fanboys war
ziggurcat  +   412d ago

"No that is false, Xb1 fans haven't really mentioned DX12 that much."

*cough*BS*cough* you, out of everyone here, have consistently yammered on about DX12 ever since they announced it...

This just confirms what everyone who isn't deluded have been saying for months now - that it won't benefit xbone as much as PC. And it comes from your saviour, too.

Despite being proven wrong (again), you continue to move those goalposts, and try to pin the blame for the false hope of DX12's impact on playstation fans? Wow...

I'm looking forward to whoever it is to post every single comment you've made talking about an exponential increase in performance because of DX12.
#1.1.17 (Edited 412d ago ) | Agree(39) | Disagree(7) | Report
Kayant  +   412d ago

"I seriously fail to see how Microsoft misled anyone." - Yep it was the fact someone people were going with this misleading article http://n4g.com/news/1487034...
and the PC benchmark here comparing PC DX11 to PC DX12 "Tested on GIGABYTE BRIX Pro (Intel Core i7-4770R + Iris Pro Graphics 5200)" that people got the up to 50% improvement when MS has never hinted at that metric for XB1 none does it make that much sense looking the the low-end multi-core processors in both consoles.
alexkoepp  +   412d ago
Xbox has been steadily closing the gap between the systems when you look at current multiplatforms compared to launch ones. Even just a little performance boost from DX12 is going to close that gap completely or put X1 ahead.
xHeavYx  +   412d ago | Well said
Wishful thinking much?
spacecat5050  +   412d ago
It truly was the sony fanboys making it a bigger deal than it was. No one said DX12 would make the x1 more powerful. Xbox fans and fanboys said it would make development easier and improve design.

Sony fanboys kept going on and on about how dx12 wouldnt do anything while misquoting fans about how dx12 was a saving grace. There is no doubt Xbox One was built with DX12 in mind and I am positive developers will be happy once they get their hands on it for making xbox games.

I love how the sony fanboys are having a party in this artcile. Stay classy guys.
#1.1.21 (Edited 412d ago ) | Agree(11) | Disagree(53) | Report
LeCreuset  +   412d ago | Well said

I would pretend to be amazed at your comment, but I talked to a couple of XB1 owners over the weekend that actually believed the XB1 is already ahead of the PS4, even in sales.


Remember when Naughty Dog tried to warn about hyping DX12 for XB1 to unrealistic levels and you responded with:

"ND must be threatened to issue this statement, especially saying pure marketing hyperbole. He sounds like all of you, this must be pre June 2nd damage control. Also sony execs sure worry alot about what MSFT is doing, saying DX12 will do nothing and planning a reactionary E3.

"This guy must be privileged to get access to DX12 this early lol. This damage control excites me, because if it was nothing the ICE TEAM wouldn't care. #1.1.4"

MysticStrummer  +   412d ago | Well said
@truefan - "Xb1 fans haven't really mentioned DX12 that much"

Holy **** did I just read that???????????????????

Edit - Nice job johndoe. I wasn't going to bother, but that's a good representative sample. People who disagreed with statements like those were labeled trolls and haters. "Fear" was another word being thrown around if someone was sensible enough to argue with that crap.
#1.1.23 (Edited 412d ago ) | Agree(47) | Disagree(4) | Report
LeCreuset  +   412d ago | Well said

The call out demonstrated exactly what it was meant to: that you are immune to reason and prone to illogical statements. Not only could you not accept what Naughty Dog was saying about DX12, but you went so far as to insist that they were afraid. Yet, do you take any accountability for being proven wrong, again? Nope.

As for that deal, let's inject some reality. You have one, well deserved, bubble. I have five. Going by that, I already have more to lose than you. Now you want to involve others as well,including Lukas with his 10 bubbles? That's up to them whether they want to get in on that action, if they want to demand some of your ilk get in on it too, or whatever. The only thing in our control is you and I accepting the deal. So man up and stop trying to hide behind ridiculous conditions that are beyond my lone ability to consent to. Have some accountability for what you said, since you were so sure of it.

Btw, I hope Phil has now made clear to you the "true power of DX12."

"I hope June 2nd they reveal the true power of DX12 and show what the XB1 can do. I just refuse to believe MSFT spent all that money on a customized GRU for nothing."


"Say what you want, but the ps4 is already getting maxed out. It has essentially peaked and if you noticed their first party games are running 30fps, infamous, drive club, and the order. XB1 had been more frame rate focused and is expected to get better with DX12. XB1 already has a faster CPU, and a 50% utilization reduction could be huge. For all that 50% more powerful ultra computer, not one game has even looked 5% better.

"For XB1 There Is just so much potential with titled resources using the esRAM and cloud computing. I'll take the jokes in the now, but by time Halo comes out you will see the complete package and see which was built for the future. Maybe even Remedy will be the first compete package by year end.

"PS boyd said near future, E3 perhaps, I have a feeling some "cloud" "DX12" presentations are in order for the biggest gaming stage. MSFT leadership knows what's at stake, they know the skepticism, they are just putting it on people's radar."


"Don't be mad at him, he is just mad the ps4 has already peaked, what you see is what you get. What has been said about DX12 scares him."

" http://n4g.com/comments/red...
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johndoe11211  +   412d ago | Well said

Alexxkoepp – “DX12 is going to be a game changer.” http://n4g.com/news/1512546...

Georgenoob - “you just can't deny the huge leap in performance it will bring.” http://n4g.com/news/1512546...

Morepowerofgreen – “DX12 could allow XB1 to do things no other console can hope to achieve” http://n4g.com/news/1512546...

KNWS - directx12 full features will be coming to xb1 http://n4g.com/news/1532306...

Lifeisgamesok - Directx 12 and by what Nvidia, Intel, and AMD are saying will be one of the biggest tech advances in some time http://n4g.com/news/1495045...

A lot more i can post but I'm too damn lazy to do all that writing.
#1.1.25 (Edited 412d ago ) | Agree(80) | Disagree(1) | Report
Wh15ky  +   412d ago | Well said
How on earth does truefan get a "well said" for that drivel. Who should be banned for the amount of flaming lies he just spewed
#1.1.26 (Edited 412d ago ) | Agree(40) | Disagree(3) | Report
xHeavYx  +   412d ago | Well said
What I'm going to say are not facts, just assumptions, but if there was a mod who liked Xbox more than PS, and if that mod were to rate a comment by, let's just say, Truefan, it would automatically show as "Well Said"
Wh15ky  +   412d ago
Thanks heavy, I always wondered about that as there are quite often some very dubious "well said" and "intelligent" comments. Does he not get another bubble now though?
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MightyNoX  +   412d ago
@Heavy: I've suspected this for a while, thanks for giving this theory some credence (the 'well said' theory, I mean)

@John Doe: Excellent research, my good man.
LeCreuset  +   412d ago | Well said

"it's starting to look sad that you are still trying. Keep on searching though, I'm sure I slipped up once. I basically control you, if I can get under your skin that much. It really shouldn't mean that much to you, video games are just toys."

I don't need to keep trying. Herb Dean has already jumped in to stop the fight. It really wasn't difficult. You provide a lot of material, which I just copied and pasted in the rest period between bench press sets. I guess my holding you accountable is getting to you, as you've gone from trying to pretend my comments don't exist to laughably trying to dodge that challenge by trying to involve people that had nothing to do with the claims you made directly to me, while delusionally referring to yourself as a world brand. And you're obviously keeping that one post of yours alive to be edited so you can respond, so that's a fail for your attempt at reverse psychology to get me to back off of criticizing your hyperbole. Oh, and thanks for the ammo:

"I basically control you, if I can get under your skin that much. It really shouldn't mean that much to you, video games are just toys."

My account — The only one I have ever had. Can you say the same? — with 5 bubbles, has 831 comments, including this one. You, with one bubble, have 710 comments, which doesn't take into account the edits you use to get the most out of that bubble. I've gone months without commenting, outside of the giveaways where I simply typed an ellipses to be eligible. How about you? Can you even say you've gone a week? A day (Bans don't count.)? Here's another stat for you: My join date is 21 May 2013. Yours is 06 Jan 2014. Your account is 7 months and some change newer than mine, mine has 5 bubbles vs your 1, yet you are already at 710 comments — NOT COUNTING YOUR EDITS! — versus my 831. Goodnes, Truefan1. It really shouldn't mean that much to you. Video games are just toys.
#1.1.30 (Edited 412d ago ) | Agree(34) | Disagree(3) | Report
Volkama  +   412d ago
One of those articles that makes you wish N4G had a better searching tool, so you could pull up certain users' comments that mention Dx12.

Or maybe that would just cause things to get out of hand. Not many people like to be shamed :)
Wh15ky  +   412d ago

Wow! Comment 3hrs ago, last edited 12mins ago.

Still keeping this comment alive after 3 hrs!

You may as well be PMing him, he's obviously managed to get "under your skin that much", why else would you keep your comment editable?
#1.1.32 (Edited 412d ago ) | Agree(26) | Disagree(3) | Report
Eonjay  +   412d ago | Well said

How embarrassing. Have some dignity.
choujij  +   412d ago
I think I'm starting to like Phil. He just made a ton of Xbox fanboys eat crow.
#1.1.34 (Edited 412d ago ) | Agree(28) | Disagree(6) | Report
pyramidshead  +   412d ago | Well said
you know full well that this article has crushed lots of xbox fanboys dreams when truefan1 is the 3rd comment down and it's almost the size of an essay excusing everything away. Fantastic! :P
#1.1.35 (Edited 412d ago ) | Agree(28) | Disagree(0) | Report
MRMagoo123  +   412d ago
Everyone but hardcore misterxmedia fans and the delusional xbone fans on here knew this, the whole point in dx12 is to make pc gaming as efficient as console gaming, who ever thought it would do much for console is just stupid.

@LeCreuset and johndoe11211

LMFAO you guys ate the troll alive.
#1.1.36 (Edited 412d ago ) | Agree(27) | Disagree(1) | Report
GiggMan  +   412d ago
Oh my god this this whole reply thread is hilarious!
dantesparda  +   412d ago
You MS fanboys are right, Phil is an alright guy. He just squashed the delusions/beliefs of all you MS fanboys. We've been telling you this all along.
And I love how Truefan thinks he's a big name, but doesn't realize that people know him for being a big joke.
#1.1.38 (Edited 412d ago ) | Agree(22) | Disagree(0) | Report
SilentNegotiator  +   412d ago
Quick, my X-brethren! Help me move these goal posts before it's too late!!

"Graphics don't matter!"
"The Kinect changes and cloud will be enough to bridge the gap!"

Whew! That was close!
imt558  +   412d ago
Lol MisterXmedia! Just lol!


@LeCreuset & johndoe

Well, well done. I just wrote similar shit in post bellow and get lots of disagree votes.
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UltraNova  +   412d ago

You really have to learn when to back off, especially when your are full of shit.

We all read the comments about the second coming aka direct x 12 and the cloud both of which turned out to be 'of some help' and dedicated servers respectively.

Trying to downplay your blind reaction/support on both those xbox1 'upgrades' (both officially debunked) is embarrassing to you and all Xbox supporters out there.

Just be quite for a change.
fr0sty  +   412d ago
lol, truefanboy got owned.. repeatedly. I almost feel bad for them... but I don't.
XBOTTOX  +   411d ago
Not really, he didn't even mention anything in regards to power or performance. He said it wouldn't be a big change, and im sure he was referencing the API for developers.

But ofcourse this is n4g and this thread is already nearly 200 posts deep. Let the fanboys revel in their victory lol
--bienio--  +   413d ago
Hehe exactly👍
Abriael  +   413d ago
He's being honest and realistic, which is what some people tend not to be. Gotta love that.

Remember the dude (which is actually a developer) that said it's gonna double the power of the GPU?
Ausbo  +   413d ago
I dont think that developer had access to it yet. He spoke too soon.
Abriael  +   413d ago
@ausbo: The funny thing is that he seems to be developing a demo for it.
Eonjay  +   413d ago
Well, their word should have been taken for a grain of salt. Officially, Microsoft never made those exaggerated claims. But by the same token, we have to trust Phil when he says that the Kinect reserve will boost performance, which also seems realistic on a per title basis.
sinspirit  +   412d ago
I've been saying the same thing for weeks. Consoles already have that "to the metal" aspect that DX12 is trying to bring to PC.

So glad someone finally cleared it up. Nothing like having a good chuckle at all the people that argued self imagined misconceptions about how this was going to work and then being shot down by their own favored company.

I just hope they take advantage of DX12 and start porting some games over to PC, even if it's a year after the console release. My most anticipated game is a new Fable, but not the Fable Legends spin-off, I want a story-oriented one like before and I want it to really have passion put into it.
Volkama  +   412d ago
The whole "makes xbox 50% more powerful!" claim stemmed from a ****ty gamingbolt article that stuck some slides from a presentation together without the correct context. It was never actually what Microsoft said.
AussieBadger  +   412d ago
Abriael we know dx12 is not going to double the performance but I can guarantee that it will increase the performance by at least 15-20%. So it is great news anyway.
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MRMagoo123  +   412d ago

If you really think its gonna be anywhere near a 15% increase you need to see a DR, the xbone will at most get a 5% increase, its an update that basically just does what the xbone already does, nothing new, all it does is help pcs be as efficient as consoles when programming software for it.
Bigpappy  +   412d ago
Taking risk can usually includes financial risk. Most indies can not afford to showcase the full ambition of their intended design.

What Phil has done hear is quail the expectations of some fans who may have expected DX12 to blow PS4 away performance wise. But he still leaves open that fact that improvements are to be expected.

@Eonjay: good sensible commenting. So many people here go out of their way to tray an insult or degrade other because of their choice of a GAMING console. So what if a few X1 fans had high hopes for DX12. They are not the developer and are getting info enforces those excitements.

Boy will be boys though and of course this is going to be used by many to say X1 is trash and will remain trash. But it is not trash and is already performing even better in upcoming games.
Am-No-Hero  +   413d ago
I've told some fanboys that but they did not listen to me lol

Good job Phil you just Smashed hopes lol
BallsEye  +   413d ago
Big changes are not massive changes. They've already demoed big changes that dx12 brings . Massive would be achieving graphic level of Blizzard's CGIs which is ridiculous to even think of. 30% boost? Sure. They've already showed 50% boost in cpu load on PC thanks to dx12 and that's what we should expect. That's still pretty big, especially for a console like XBOX ONE where you can snap browser/videos/skype calls and whatever else in the bg. That's CPU heavy.
Nekroo91  +   413d ago | Well said
do you even understand how Dx 12 works for pc?! Phil Spencer "console like API" its going to reduce the latency from cpu to gpu. its going to be huge for pc but almost nothing for console because they are built with that in mind
XiSasukeUchiha  +   412d ago
Phil basically prove to everybody that DX12 won't magically powerup but just give it a boost.
tgunzz  +   412d ago
Phil Spencer is a pretty smart fella indeed.... DX12 impact on xb1 is going to interesting.
AngelicIceDiamond  +   412d ago
So it will be a standard boost for X1. Meaning X1 will still benefit from it in some way.

I'm glad Phil's honest and isn't giving us a PR circle now we can move along.
choujij  +   412d ago
"So it will be a standard boost for X1."

What exactly is a standard boost?

"Meaning X1 will still benefit from it in some way."

Yeah, the main benefit for Xbone, is that it will help Xbone developers port games from PC (and vice versa).
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rainslacker  +   412d ago
The boost comes from better allocation of the memory bus/controller and better overall use of processing threads within the APU itself. DX12 gives developers API's to do such abilities as routine things, instead of having to make up workarounds to get it to work.

I explained it in detail once a while back(can't find the comment now) and got a lot of disagrees, even though I was saying it would improve things some. Probably because I said there's no way those things would add up to doubling X1's processing power...which was the current assumption at the time.

Otherwise, this was good of Phil to clear the air about. Seen way too many assumptions on this subject, and way too much hyperbole while I was at it. It's never a good thing to set the customers expectations to an unachievable level, which was done more by a few very passionate Xbox fans.
user3050031   412d ago | Spam
corvusmd  +   412d ago
Not really...EVERYONE has been saying this same thing. The only people saying otherwise is really just PS fanboys trying to build a strawman argument...and a few Xbox Fanboys...other than that everyone else was being much more realistic. Please stop making up arguments to try and make others look stupid for things they haven't said.

Everytime DX12 comes up we are reminded that X1 already has a low level API...we all know this, and the advantage will be more about tools that it can give devs...everyone with half a brain has been saying this as soon as it was revealed.

Every little bit helps, I just hope that is makes using the ESRAM much easier for Devs to take advantage of, that's what I've more so been concerned with the whole time. Either way, it's already looking like with the June SDK, there is less need for a "massive" boost in performance.

@skydragoon To be fair..the "delusional arguments" have always been from the PS4 side of the camp on this issue. I keep hearing Sony fans say that Xbots are saying this will change the world, but I typically only see Xbox Fans saying that it will help, but it's more about giving tools.
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johndoe11211  +   412d ago | Well said
Alexxkoepp – “DX12 is going to be a game changer.” http://n4g.com/news/1512546...

Georgenoob - “you just can't deny the huge leap in performance it will bring.” http://n4g.com/news/1512546...

Morepowerofgreen – “DX12 could allow XB1 to do things no other console can hope to achieve” http://n4g.com/news/1512546...

KNWS - directx12 full features will be coming to xb1 http://n4g.com/news/1532306...

Lifeisgamesok - Directx 12 and by what Nvidia, Intel, and AMD are saying will be one of the biggest tech advances in some time http://n4g.com/news/1495045...
MysticStrummer  +   412d ago | Well said
"EVERYONE has been saying this same thing"

Come on man…

You're on N4G enough to know that isn't true.
MasterCornholio  +   412d ago

Holy crap. You just owned the biggest Xbox Fans on N4G plus you made them look like a bunch of fools in the process by using their Idol against them.

The Xbox fans that I respect should do something about them because they are only ruining the image of Xbox One owners.
MightyNoX  +   412d ago
@Johndoe: Giving you another bubble, just because~
pyramidshead  +   412d ago
I implore anyone who is anyone to screen cap @johndoe11211 for future ownage of said users that are mentioned in his comment.

Truly a sight to see and now we have all resident xbox fanboys now denying that they were even banking on DX12 being a massive game changer.

Holy lord this is a fun day on N4g. The hypocrisy is flowing green today!

edit: Corvusmd you just got served sir.
#1.9.5 (Edited 412d ago ) | Agree(15) | Disagree(1) | Report
Volkama  +   412d ago
@MasterCornholio "The Xbox fans that I respect should do something about them because they are only ruining the image of Xbox One owners."

Do something like what? I have yet to find an exorcist that is up to the task.
Volkama  +   412d ago
Oh and for what it's worth, Corvus didn't "get served" there. Right at the start of the comment he acknowledges some XBox fanboys have been saying it:

"The only people saying otherwise is really just PS fanboys trying to build a strawman argument...and a few Xbox Fanboys..."

Why did N4G get rid of the old "open zone" anyway?
kenshiro100  +   412d ago
You keep digging that hole there.
dale_denton   412d ago | Trolling | show | Replies(1)
Magicite  +   412d ago
truefan1 is always there behind the corner ready to defend exbucks
rainslacker  +   412d ago
Revisionist history usually goes to the victor.

I'll give him props for trying though.
Guwapo77  +   412d ago
We've been saying this since it was announced. You've won brownie points with me bud and earned my respect for your integrity. Thank you Phil!
assdan  +   412d ago
Well, it's nice to finally see confirmation that everyone who wasn't an xbox was right. But I'm sure that xbots will say he's wrong. Maybe they'll try to say he isn't a programmer or something funny like that.
And I almost forgot to say this! Phil spencer further proves why he's the only one I like at xbox.
#1.13 (Edited 412d ago ) | Agree(7) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
solar   412d ago | Offensive
showtimefolks  +   412d ago
we all knew this but some xbox fansboys were in full denial mode just like they are about cloud stuff

these consoles are what they are and ps4 is a bit stronger than xbox one, nothing will change that. But that doesn't mean games on xbox one will be bad by any means. It will just take few years for developers to get use to both ps4 and xbox one, and also to know how to utilize the ps4 and xbox one to their strengths

I am liking phil spencer, no mixed messages anymore. Just a straight shooter. Also he took a picture with Uncle Jack Tretton so i kind of like him lol
slivery  +   412d ago
Not like everyone with common sense didn't see this coming miles away. Just like every other delusional dream that has been put to rest about the Xbox One.

I have said this for ages, I won't act like Microsoft hasn't mislead people in the past but a huge majority of this misinformation is completely due to most their delusional fanbase who can't accept for the life of them what their console actually is.

Now I can add yet another dream to my list of those crushed. /s

Really not that rewarding though in all honesty, most the time I seriously feel bad for how deluded some of these people here on N4G are. I won't specifically single out Xbox fans only because it happens from ever side of the fence.

I just honestly question how some of these people even make it through life, I guess it's too easy these days to stay alive. No more natural selection to weed out the morons.

Had to edit this and add what I think is a important ending note. Although I have had my trouble with Phil in the past, I gained a huge amount of respect for him right now, just for being completely honest about this.

If this continues, who knows just maybe I might actually be a bit more trusting of the Xbox brand. My lack of trust in Microsoft in general has always been the problem, I don't dislike their games, I never disliked their consoles either, I was heavy into the 360 but that is when they lost every bit of trust I had in them.

So this type of honesty is very refreshing.
#1.16 (Edited 412d ago ) | Agree(4) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
r1sh12  +   412d ago
people really need to have more perspective, Yes DX12 will improve X1 - by how much?

So if we take the 10% unlocked from the removal of kinect, and add the 10-15% of the DX12 update it should hopefully get it closer to the PS4...
How much closer to the PS4?
Only real results will tell, from all my technical reading it will significantly close the gap, but I reckon the PS4 will still have a slight performance edge.

Any progress with either console is good progress, I understand many people will want to defend their console and really shovel it to X1 adopters, but both consoles have very similar parts and different architectures.
jessupj  +   412d ago
I've always had a wait and see approach for directx12, but I have suspected that it wouldn't make a huge difference to the xbone.

I really have to admire Phil's honesty. It's just so refreshing to see. Instead of beating round the bush and dodging the question, he came right out and told the truth.

4 months ago I would have fell on the floor laughing if someone told me a MS executive was capable of such honesty and integrity.
#1.18 (Edited 412d ago ) | Agree(3) | Disagree(0) | Report | Reply
ChickeyCantor  +   412d ago
DX12 was mostly meant to provide low level access on pc's. Developers on consoles already have that low level api.

He isn't being "honest" in that regard. He is just saying what was rather obvious.
ChickeyCantor  +   412d ago
DX12/Mantle were mostly targetted for PC. Whoever hyped it for the xbox is an idiot.
otherZinc  +   412d ago

It's still going to make a difference. Not "a massive difference".

M$ doesn't need much, as they have "The Only 1080p 60fps" "Next Gen Console Game On The Market" in Forza Motorsport 5, Period!

Forza Motorsport 5 is "ONLY" on a next generation console. You can't find Forza Motorsport 5 on the PS3, 360, or Wii.

Maybe SONY should get something like "Direct P4-13" to give the PS4 a small boost in performance of about 5-15% (not a "massive boost") to help Drive Club reach 1080p 60fps like Forza Motorsport 5.
Help Drive Club (exclusive for PS4) add weather effects at launch instead of a post launch patch...especially after a year delay! You know, like Forza Horizon 2 has right now, delivering an open world with weather at launch.

Also, "Direct P4-13" may help Drive Club get rid of those invisible walls we had with the Atari 2600. Forza Horizon 2 doesn't have invisible walls & that's without Direct X 12.
#1.20 (Edited 412d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(8) | Report | Reply
kenshiro100  +   412d ago
Gee Phil, what a way to crush a typical XBox fanboy's wet dream of Direct X12...
mrpsychoticstalker  +   413d ago
PHIL for president, the future of Xbox is in great hands!
DoubleM70  +   412d ago
Yup! Keep telling the truth. It's Marathon not a sprint. I been enjoying my Xbox tremendously thanks Phil.
madjedi  +   412d ago
Funny that has been sony's stance since the ps3 launched.
R0n0rve  +   413d ago
Glad he's being honest and realistic about it. I wasn't expecting massive gains from it either, but it's good that he still says it'll help devs by giving them more capabilities. We'll just have to wait and see. Good news nonetheless.
#3 (Edited 413d ago ) | Agree(24) | Disagree(1) | Report | Reply
christocolus  +   412d ago
You are right, Phil is a great guy, the gains might not be massive but he says it will unlock more capabilities, can't wait to see what the talented devs do with it. I also love what he had to say about first and third games&the fact he is taking risks with new ips is great. I always send him pms and tweets and the guy actually replies. He also played forza 5 online with a friend of mine some weeks ago.he is a very nice person and the right guy to be heading the division.
MasterCornholio  +   412d ago
I agree with you. Out of all the people from Microsoft's Xbox division Phill seems to be the most honest one litnof all of them. Panello needs to go though after the crap he tried to pull on Neogaf.
skydragoonity   413d ago | Trolling | show | Replies(5)
0P-Tigrex   413d ago | Trolling | show | Replies(2)
zsquaresoff  +   413d ago
Straight from the horse's mouth. Hopefully, that you shut some of the xbots.
KNWS  +   413d ago
Why he hasn't denied it benefits the x box 1 you're reading it the way you want it to read.

Directx12 is an API its not hardware. But its a far better API than the one currently used. The x box 1 will get performance gains from it, and the tweet acknowledges devs making games for xb1, will have more unlocked capability.

X box fans don't have to shut up, because it does help the xb1. Something Sony fans have denied it did for months.
#6.1 (Edited 412d ago ) | Agree(15) | Disagree(45) | Report | Reply
MEGANE  +   412d ago
Negative, No one here say that but, some people here and some game developers made it look like if there was going to be HARDWARE improvement.
Remember this sentence; " from Perfect Dark to Halo 4 improvement".
Dude they all improve all the time but when all the news came about Xbox1 been inferior to the PS4, MS star talking crap!.
I got mad cuz thats "misleading information"
#6.1.1 (Edited 412d ago ) | Agree(19) | Disagree(7) | Report
mkis007  +   412d ago
No one denied an improvement. But we were seeing double-quadruple gpu performance rumors. Huge cpu gains. People were trying to explain that most DX12 gains were already implemented in the xbox one because it is a game console and has to be closer to the metal. Other people wouldn't have it.
joshuatobi  +   412d ago
Even sonys ice team said that dx12 wasn't gonna do much for Xbox 1 and laughed at developers who said it would
AngelicIceDiamond  +   412d ago
You are right Xbots can stop talking about massive change but the console will benefit from it regardless still.

can't ignore that.
Spotie  +   412d ago
But no one has ignored that. That's the thing.

There have been fanboys left and right have been trying to use the gains hinted at for PC as being evidence that the XB1 would be able to catch up to the PS4. But there haven't been any people, that I've seen.

The crazy thing is how many of the fanboys who claimed large gains are now changing their tunes.
soandsoz  +   412d ago

"You are right Xbots can stop talking about massive change but the console will benefit from it regardless still. Can't deny that."

The primary party whom can't deny the gains of DX12 are developers. It's them who are to benefit the most. DX12 makes their jobs a lot easier in many situations. Xbox gamers aren't going to play a game developed with DX12 and think to themselves, WOW look at the fruits of DX12.

So, to a certain extent (Again, unless you are a developer) the benefits are invisible to Xbox gamers!

tinynuggins  +   413d ago
Massive? No. Reasonable, I expect so. I don't think anyone was expecting it to double the performance.
kayoss  +   413d ago
Have you ready GeorgeNoob's comments? If you havent you should try. Its entertaining.
Sayburr  +   413d ago
Thanks for the realistic expectations.
moscardini7  +   413d ago
Sorry haha haha
chrissx  +   413d ago
Phil just broke some ppls hearts lol. Its good he's setting the records straight
#10 (Edited 413d ago ) | Agree(25) | Disagree(18) | Report | Reply
Belasco  +   413d ago
No dreams crushed here, these were my expectations all along. I would like to point out that just because he said the improvements won't be massive doesn't mean they will be insignificant either.
torchic  +   412d ago
it will definitely feel insignificant the way some Xbox fans were going on...

just like Microsoft's E3 conference they hyped this upgrade up and made it seem as though DX12 was going to be the end-all be-all of all software upgrades... so much backtracking going on in these comments ahaha
Belasco  +   412d ago
Where was DX12 during MS's E3 conference? And no one is backtracking. If you actually look at ANY article on DX12 the past few months, the vast majority of the comments are from it's detractors, not it's supporters,save for a few goofy Xbox fanatics. Where are all of these legions of people blowing Xbox One improvements out of proportion? Because I mostly see the polar opposite.
rainslacker  +   412d ago
That's the thing though. MS itself hasn't been touting DX12 as a major game-changer for the X1. It's mostly been a cult group of their fans doing so.

MS has released some rather detailed information on what it does different, and kept some back as well. That information isn't hard to understand for those that work with this kind of stuff.

However, this cult group has been going around outright saying people that have explained what changes would be made, and how it would improve things, but not cause a "significant" increase are just wrong. They then add in that it will greatly improve the hardware's efficiency to cause the hardware to be able to operate anywhere from 50-200% better than it already is. That's just not how programming works. Hardware is set, and the current DX would have to be highly inefficient(which it isn't) to see that much of an improvement.

Anyhow, these huge assumptions being touted about the increase in power, presumably to say it will be better than the PS4, are only going to cause people's expectations to be elevated to the point that there is no way any developer could achieve what people expect.

The realistic fact of the matter is is that as the efficiency of API's increases on any given hardware, the noticeable improvements decrease. It's a matter of diminishing returns.

Think of it this way. Even with Naughty Dog's talent, no one on here can say that TLOU looks 50-200% better than the first Uncharted. Maybe 10% from UC1 to UC2, 5% from UC2 to UC3, another 2% from UC3 to TLOU.(numbers used as an example, not making any value judgement). It's reasonable to assume that between the development of UC1 and TLOU, that Sony improved their API's as much as DX12 improves over DX11.

There is absolutely no way to make a processor of any kind do more than it's meant to do, no matter how good the API's are, or even if you write the code in assembly bypassing them. The code just becomes more efficient, which causes a better game, perhaps a better frame rate or resolution, etc. But never will that processor be able to outperform a more powerful processor with equally efficient API's.
Kavorklestein  +   412d ago
Okay so your last paragraph you said the code gets better allowing "perhaps a better frame rate or resolution" isn't that the key to catching up to the PS4? Notice I said catching up, not outperform. I never expected the xb1 to outperform the PS4
#11.2.1 (Edited 412d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(3) | Report
rainslacker  +   412d ago
From a programming standpoint, maybe, maybe not. One thing about programming, when doing something, the answer on how to do that is always, "It depends".

But lets break it down to see if that is the key to catching up, as I assume you actually meant performance parity when you say this.

Let's look at one title between both systems being equal, where performance/content(on screen visuals) parity is the case. By performance we'll say 1080p/60fps.

In the case of parity, then to the user, yes, this would be key. But on a software and hardware level, the cold hard truth is that the PS4 will simply perform the operations faster(possibly not better API wise...but I digress). Unless the API's for Sony are simply terrible and cause A LOT of overhead, then the processor will always outperform. However, Sony's PS API's have been applauded for quite some time now, and they have a really solid tool-set.

Now, lets say that performance parity only applies to 1080p/60fps, and that what is actually displayed at that resolution and frame rate has no parity.

The PS4 is simply able to handle more on the screen at any given resolution/FR, due to it being more powerful. 50% more powerful on paper, meaning that it can perform 50% more operations per clock cycle, again on paper. In the PS4's case, the GPU is simply able to handle more on screen at that resolution on a hardware level. More can be better textures, better lighting, better particle effects, etc.

Even nowadays in the age of GPU compute, Physics could even be much better on one system than the other, although that would be unlikely as it's a actual game play factor...however, the PS4 would not have to give up as much on screen to process those physics. Those compute units make a difference if a dev decides to use them.

Anyhow, increasing processor efficiency, increasing bandwidth, increasing threads, unlocking cores, etc does improve the number of processes that a GPU/CPU can physically do per cycle. It may affect how quickly they can perform them, or how much resources are needed to process them. But a 10% increase in processing power does not necessarily translate to 10% increased number of actual processes that happen per cycle. It's not a 1:1 ratio. There are just too many factor's that go into it, and even more, on a programming level, more often than not you can't just brute force code through and expect it to work for a game scenario. There's a lot of intricacies and dependencies to make something happen, so it becomes a matter of where is the weakest link?

The value of new more efficient API's is that they remove overhead, but in a console environment, that overhead is already extremely low in many cases. However, reducing processing overhead by 50%, does not translate into a 50% increase in processing power, as the basics of what is being done still has to be done at some coding level. Even writing directly in machine code(which no one does) would not see a vast improvement over assembly which is close to the metal programming which bypasses almost all overhead.

In the end, it really depends on what the developer decides to do with it. Bungie decided for frame rate parity among PS4 and X1 for Destiny. From what I've seen of the game, there's no reason why it couldn't be a higher frame rate on the PS4, or why the visuals couldn't be better on the PS4 at that resolution/FR. There will probably be some developer(if there isn't already) that decides to just do the best product they can on both systems, and not worry about performance parity.

People should just play their games, and if they have the choice between the two, look to the one that they think delivers what they want for whatever reason.
#11.2.2 (Edited 412d ago ) | Agree(1) | Disagree(1) | Report
Kavorklestein  +   412d ago
Okay. So I agree that everything is and always has been dependent on the situation/what the devs decide/what they can manage to squeeze out of the hardware.
I also agree that having the best graphics or most raw power isn't really important in the long run, so long as devs make PLAYABLE and fun games.
Which, this gen, they are striving for more than ever, especially when we compare it to last gen when certain games were piss poor on either system for various reasons.

I Am simply saying, that it really doesn't matter in the long run, and I guess I should have been a bit more specific and say I think the Xbox one may catch up to where the PS4 is NOW, although the PS4 will likely have it's own improvements down the road.

This is a given in the gaming world like GTA V for example being so massive and involved on a last gen system is impressive, and would have never been dreamed of being possible at the beginning of the generation.

I hope you didn't take my comment as attacking you, I was just trying to say it's perfectly reasonable to think the two platforms will be getting closer to each other graphically as we go along, but that it is not a static situation for either console, and both have potential to "Get better as they go" especially as you have said, as devs gett better at using the hardware, and coding their engines on both platforms.
#11.2.3 (Edited 412d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(1) | Report
rainslacker  +   411d ago
I didn't take your reply as an attack. It was a fair question.

And yes, in the long run it won't really matter. Devs will squeeze everything they can out of both systems by generations end. A good game is a good game regardless of the raw power behind the graphics.
True_Samurai  +   413d ago
Well... "DX12 is going to leave OpenGL in the dust" -valve developer
Fishy Fingers  +   412d ago

The consoles already run low level API. PCs don't. That's where Dx12 will yield the biggest gains.

From the presser, it seemed to me the biggest xb1 advantages will be freeing up CPU and cross porting games between PC and xb1.

http://www.gamingonlinux.co... Read the quotes, he's not talking consoles whatsoever. Not his fault you fell for the sensationalist headline.
#12.1 (Edited 412d ago ) | Agree(21) | Disagree(7) | Report | Reply
snookiegamer  +   412d ago

Not on Xbox One it won't! Try again.

Don't you fanboys ever read? LOL
urwifeminder  +   413d ago
Looking forward to it have been since its been announced any gains on pc and console will be sweet thanks MS.
--bienio--  +   413d ago
Dx12 will certainly be a beneficiary of Pc, I admit I enjoy it very much, Pc have a bright future...:)
DanzoSAMA  +   413d ago
Thanks Microsoft.
I love my Xbox ONE so much.
headshotfrosty  +   413d ago
Seems like there will be some efficiency enhancements which might lead to faster loads, slightly better textures, and more locked in FPS overall. Not massive but stabilizing. Any upgrade is welcome regardless. Love my X1 getting my PS4 once Uncharted or God of War is further along.
mkis007  +   412d ago
Stabilizing. I like that word to describe this.
AutoCad  +   413d ago
We are already seeing major games being announced in 1080p for the xbox with the 10% boost..
DX12 will just solidify that 1080p will become the norm for the xbox.

And than guess what?

we get to talk about games on this site.
tuglu_pati  +   412d ago
Im not quite sure about that but any boost the Xbox can get is good for gamers.
BG11579  +   412d ago
If they are using scalling engines like in Wolfeintein than it doesn't count as constant 1080p.
I would still wait for the games to come out before assuming anything, because there has been a lot of downgrade lately.
bleedsoe9mm  +   413d ago
understated and humble normal phil spencer
SoulSercher620  +   413d ago
Thank God for Phil being realistic while others tend to be ignorant.
ats1992  +   412d ago
I hope you mean all fanboys not just xbox fanboys. Because phil spencer confirms here that DirectX 12 will benefit the xbox one despite what sony fanboys say. Plus he confirms it will not be a massive leap but it will improve stuff on the xbox one.
#19.1 (Edited 412d ago ) | Agree(11) | Disagree(20) | Report | Reply
SoulSercher620  +   412d ago
Well I'm referring to anyone saying this was going to be a HUGE performance leap as if it was the second coming of Jesus. I already knew it would improve stuff on XB1. That's undeniable, but there were people that took it WAY out of hand and turned it into an unrealistic power debate.

These people are what my message is referring to.
rainslacker  +   412d ago
What Sony fan boys were saying that DX12 wouldn't benefit the Xbox? Any comment I've seen they admit it will, they just question the 50-200% claims that some people were making.

What Phil says in that tweet is pretty much what I've been reading those "Sony fan boys" have been saying for months now...myself included.
BlackTar187  +   412d ago

Please find one comment where a PS fanboy has said DX12 will do nothing for Xbox one.

Every comment i've ever read said it will do something(Undeniable) but not what the xbox fanboys have been claiming since the reveal.
Bonkerz  +   413d ago
Did you guys even read it? He says "It will help developers on XBOX One It's not going to be a massive change but will unlock more capability for devs." Anything that can help devs make better games is a win in my book, if you thought it was magically going to make games 500% better you were obviously wrong, but dont try and flip this into him saying that its not going to help at all.
stuna1  +   412d ago
No one is making it seem like it's not going to be beneficial! Even now those on this thread who obviously got a llittle heartbroken over this bit of news are still in denial. I say their in denial, because instead of being accepting of the truth, they're still trying to point fingers saying PS Fanboys were saying DX12 wasn't going to have an effect on Xbox1.

There's a medical classification or term for this! It's called "Projecting", but more importantly, it's systematically associated with "Denial".
BlackTar187  +   412d ago
need to repost my comment here in hopes of getting those ps fanboys who said DX12 will have 0 benefit

Please find one comment where a PS fanboy has said DX12 will do nothing for Xbox one.

Every comment i've ever read said it will do something(Undeniable) but not what the xbox fanboys have been claiming since the reveal.
0P-Tigrex   412d ago | Off topic | show | Replies(1)
imt558  +   412d ago
Xbone already has "coding to the metal", from the very beginning. DX12 will just make Xbone easier for developing. What the hell Xbone fans expect?

I will just quote some words from one thread which KNWS wrote :

"...Uncharted will look good, but you guys need to tame your expectations...."

"....x box fans don't react like that...."

Oh, well, tame your expectations for DX12, Xbone fans.
#22 (Edited 412d ago ) | Agree(20) | Disagree(17) | Report | Reply
Gamer777  +   412d ago
He's basically saying that DX12 will allow developers to more effectively use the available hardware.
Pixolator  +   412d ago
Phil is a great guy, he's right to the point and no playing around, since he's in charge he fixed many issues.
GamersHeaven  +   412d ago
Well there you have it just enjoy your console for what it is.
KakashiHotake  +   412d ago
At least Phil's being honest, that's really all everyone's been asking Microsoft since the beginning. People aint so much had an issue with the hardware behind Xbox One, the issue has been how they try and bounce around the truth.
WeAreLegion  +   412d ago
I respect Phil's honesty.
hadouken007  +   412d ago
lol they all like is wasnt me it wasnt me!
quenomamen  +   412d ago | Funny
Course DX12 aint boosting the X1s power greatly. That's Teh Cloud's job.
Gore-Content  +   412d ago
Bye bye to all the hopes for betta graphics.
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