710°
Submitted by mrpsychoticstalker 118d ago | news

Microsoft says ditching Kinect allows "10 per cent additional GPU performance".

"Yes, the additional resources allow access to up to 10 percent additional GPU performance," said a company representative. "We're committed to giving developers new tools and flexibility to make their Xbox One games even better by giving them the option to use the GPU reserve in whatever way is best for them and their games." (Microsoft, Xbox One)

Credit url: polygon.com
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mrpsychoticstalker  +   118d ago
There's a lot devs can do with more power! Good moves by Microsoft. I am having fun with the Xbox games as they are, but if this makes them even better that's great news.
#1 (Edited 118d ago ) | Agree(41) | Disagree(130) | Report | Reply
christocolus  +   118d ago
Well a lot of them have been asking for this from the very beginning so let's see what they do it.
#1.1 (Edited 118d ago ) | Agree(28) | Disagree(11) | Report | Reply
Mr Pumblechook  +   118d ago
POLYGON report that the Xbox One is 10% more powerful which is great for gamers and basically means the death of Kinect exclusive games although it will still be used for voice control and OS navigation.

It's funny that Polygon make this their headline story and are pushing the benefits of their preferred platform.
#1.1.1 (Edited 118d ago ) | Agree(68) | Disagree(20) | Report
Volkama  +   118d ago
Not sure what you are getting at Pumblechook, the source is Microsoft.
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NewMonday  +   118d ago
How does this work for those who have Kinect?
Septic  +   118d ago
@NewMonday

I assume it just means that games that utilise the Kinect won't benefit from this added 10% gpu performance.

"With this SDK, we will include new options for how developers can use the system reserve as well as more flexibility in our natural user interface reserve (voice and gesture). "

I don't think you will see any difference between the new Kinect-less Xbox One's and the original ones that shipped with the Kinect.

What is basically means is, ALL Xbox One's will get a 10% boost in GPU performance.
#1.1.4 (Edited 118d ago ) | Agree(30) | Disagree(14) | Report
ZodTheRipper  +   118d ago
I'm glad that Microsoft was forced to ditch Kinect ...maybe they'll overthink their priorities now. I just don't expect any substantial sales growth from this. They actually raised the price for the box itself, it should have been under 400$.
u got owned  +   118d ago
@NewMonday

I dont know if you are serious... Common sense buddy, use it.
ZodTheRipper  +   118d ago
^If if's that easy you should be able to explain it. First the statements that make it complicated:

"Microsoft has confirmed that this boost in performance is in fact due to Kinect being stripped from the package."

"we're releasing a new SDK making it possible for developers to access additional GPU resources previously reserved for Kinect and system functions"

So what if you have Kinect connected but a game uses these 10% additional GPU power? Either Kinect won't work during that game (at all) or the game runs 10% worse than on a Xbox without Kinect or am I missing something?
Eonjay  +   118d ago
@Mr Pumblechook

Polygon's article is extremely misleading and it doesn't do anything for Xbox One. They make it sound like people who already have an Xbox One wont get the power boost. And that is just not true.

They said:

"The upcoming Kinect-less Xbox One will receive a 10 percent boost in its performance due to the stripping out of the peripheral, Microsoft told Eurogamer."

They are just spreading confusion. And then they claim that Microsoft confirmed it. Which is even more misleading. You don't have to buy the new system to get the boost.
#1.1.8 (Edited 118d ago ) | Agree(28) | Disagree(1) | Report
creatchee  +   118d ago
Simple answer: Xbox One games are no longer required to reserve a certain amount of processing power for some Kinect commands. This power can now be used for any other function that developers would like to use it for. It works this way, whether or not you have a Kinect and whether or not it is plugged in.
darkride66  +   118d ago
So will games be automatically dumbed down slightly for Xbox One with Kinect?

My guess is that devs will still develop for the lowest common denominator power wise (the Xbox One with Kinect) and simply let the Kinect-less Xbox One do it's own thing. Realistically, we're not suddenly going to see better games as devs retool their titles to take advantage of that extra sliver of power that's only going to be accessible to some users. It's going to be business as usual for devs, and if you want the extra power boost so games run slightly smoother, you'll just choose to go it without Kinect. That's my thought.
DragonKnight  +   118d ago
So basically Microsoft is perfectly fine with ditching all support for Kinect after saying they wouldn't and once again creating a development environment where there is a fractured userbase of people with Kinect, and people without Kinect.

Can they never stick to even one thing they've said?
Septic  +   118d ago
@Dragon

We've kind of gone past that now. This is about improved performance of the X1 as a result of their decision to ship a Kinect-less X1.
DragonKnight  +   118d ago
@Septic: The point still remains though. If developers do a blanket development process of assuming that Kinect is not being used, then the people who DO use Kinect don't get to benefit from it. Of course, they probably could just NOT use their Kinect, but then they're left with an expensive paperweight.

It all boils down to the fact that Microsoft are still running around like a chicken with their heads cut off, trying to narrow a gap they never will be able to narrow.
NewMonday  +   118d ago
how does the OS operate without this 10%? snap? skyp? chat? multi-tasking?...etc

shouldn't journalists be asking these questions?
alexkoepp  +   118d ago
With Ryse already being the best looking console game ever released, I can't wait to see what more power is going to bring us!
u got owned  +   118d ago
Major Nelson tweet:

"Dear Media: The GPU change was developer facing. Unplugging Kinect does not get you more HP. Devs have to code to the new specs. "

that should clear all confusion.
sinspirit  +   118d ago
I thought they had already done this when they removed the mandatory Kinect connection.

Why would they dedicate any GPU functions to the Kinect anyways? UI voice commands sure, but those don't need 10% of a GPU, the developers should have had control over Kinect resource allocation in the first place.
SilentNegotiator  +   118d ago
@NewMonday

Developers will have to develop games so that it works both ways, shut off Kinect entirely, or not use the supposed 10% boost at all.

Early adapters will get probably get screwed with a bunch of games that don't allow simultaneous "essential accessory" use or else developers will have the extra hurdle of spending more time developing it for two different situations.
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4Sh0w  +   118d ago
-The Devils in the details:

"Yes, the additional resources allow access to up to 10 per cent additional GPU performance. We're committed to giving developers new tools and flexibility to make their Xbox One games even better by giving them the option to use the GPU reserve in whatever way is best for them and their games."

"GPU reserve" means the previous SDK partitioned 10% of the GPU for future Kinect functionality/games, this will NOT affect the current the UI functionality or current Kinect games as it wasn't being used anyway, just intentionally reserved for future Kinect based future plans/games. #1If you remember prior to X1 launch micro already stated that the Kinect based GPU resources along with the OS footprint will be reduced with new SDK's, no different than 360. #2 Again yes this will give devs who want it more power but I am dissapointed that this points to them not exploring bigger more advanced kinect implementation in future games.
aragon  +   118d ago
ok for everyone here wondering if xbone with kinect will be less powerful? the answer no, its now up to developers to develope their games using the 10 percent that was reserved for kinect also prior to launch they already statrd they had an extra 10 percent sitting around for kinect that was not being used and that they would hand it over to the devs. what it means is that all games that were developed before the 10 percent was freed up wont benefit from the extra power, so if u buy a wolfenstein new order with your kinectless xbone, wolfenstein wouldnt have got that extra 10 percent but games that are made with the extra 10 percent will have a little tiny boost, this is all just pr nonsense and polygon and eurogamer are trying to make ms look like even bigger douchebags in the publics eye because there articles insinuate that early adopters will get screwed out of power boost which is wrong. its now up to devs to use the extra 10 percent toward their game if they arent going to use kinect integration with the game they are making
Pro Racer  +   118d ago
As someone who has a PC and is into overclocking, I have to say that 10% is a pretty huge difference. Shame on MS for trying to force the use of Kinect at such an expense to the GPU.

Glad they have finally reconsidered on the mandatory Kinect issue.
BattleAxe  +   118d ago
It's a good move. People didn't like Kinect on the 360, and most people don't like it or need it on XBOX:One. Great news for better game performance on Xbox.
cooperdnizzle  +   118d ago
@Pro Racer. Tell me one thing that 10% would do to one game other than maybe a couple of frames? I have A pc too, I mean pretty much every gamer has a pc gaming rig.

First there would be no way of knowing if your over clocking is actually giving you a 10% boost. Second, I really can't think of anything other then a couple of frames that over clocking helps you achieve. It doesn't give you the option to turn on any other graphical options there already available. Plus overclocking just burns up you graphics cards. Just saying your point is very far fetched.
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RedDevils  +   118d ago
So in other word, Kinect is just another failure gimmick lmao
UltraNova  +   118d ago
aragon got it right.

All games made before this 10% reserve got freed up will not benefit from it, as console games are not coded for scale-ability but for a fixed platform, in short only games after this will benefit or in the highly unlikely case of a dev going back and re-optimizing their original code and release it via a patch.
Wizard_King  +   117d ago
So if the GPU is going to perform about 10% better does that mean Titanfall will be getting a patch to up the resolution from 792p? Or that future games might have a bees dick chance of seeing 1080/60 with AA turned on?

/s

doubt it
DevilOgreFish  +   117d ago
All this means is that future games will be able to utilize more of the GPU. that's great. kinect based games probably won't because they'll require the device.

so pretty much kinect-less games will benefit this.
masonmcglasson  +   117d ago
@alexkoepp

Killzone looks better and plays much better than Ryse.

Infamous is even better. Both Killzone and Infamous have a lot more going on in the environment too.
Copen  +   118d ago
What a lot of people don't know is the majority of this 10 percent has been available since January of this year so this is nothing earth shattering or new. Even with this and DX12 the gap will only widen and MS won't catch Sony sorry it's the truth. MS needs to just stop trying to compete with the ps4 on a power level because it's a battle they simply can't win this gen. They need to focus on other things that set their console apart from the competition because the power difference will remain and the games have shown this is the biggest power disparity between consoles in well over a decade.
Deltaohio  +   118d ago
So because the xbox will will never be as powerful as the PS4 MS should quit giving developers more resource for their games? Yes. Logic at its finest.
Elit3Nick  +   118d ago
Lol how will the gap widen if the X1 is using more of its power and using a technique that the PS4 doesn't have(DX12) Microsoft are masters of software, if you seriously believe that a hardware company can come up with better optimizations, then you are yet another delusional fanboy
scotmacb  +   118d ago
You talk crap the worst one was ghosts everything else you need to pause a comparsion video to tell and some are the same
sinspirit  +   118d ago
@Elit3Nick

DX12 isn't a technique. It's an API. Just like OpenGL. But, OpenGL is less bloated, supports Window's, Mac, and Linux, as well as whatever products are designed to run it, like PS4. DX12 is doing what OpenGL already allowed us to do, but because DX is a leading standard for PC it is holding back OpenGL because not many developers take advantage of it.

Btw, X1 already has a low level API, a modified DX, that already delivers exactly what DX12 is supposed to do a year from now.
M1ST4K3  +   118d ago
I have a PS4 and yet I can say your statement makes 0 sense...
Development should never stop! Improvement shouldn't either.

Perhaps if MSFT didn't announce the DX12 performance boost, Sony wouldn't put team ICE working on an improvement (this is just an example... Improvement leads to more improvement)

Just stop being in pain because the other console got better... what the hell!? It's not that PS4 got worse, it's the Xbox one that got better!
Elit3Nick  +   118d ago
@sinspirit Even the current low level APIs aren't capable of balanced multi-threading, that alone will yield a sizeable improvement in efficiency, but either way, it's still an improvement that will nudge the X1 closer to the PS4, the amount is yet to be determined.

Why are you and the fanboys here so driven to put down anything xbox related, it obviously doesn't concern yourselves if you're bashing, and it's simply ignorance to think that xbox won't have the more efficient optimizations. Think of it this way, an improvement in the X1's performance will yield better looking games on both platforms, since they start with the lowest denominator and scale it up to the others
sinspirit  +   118d ago
@Elit3Nick

Balanced multi-threading? That's one of the benefits of DX12 on PC. It will be improved for X1 of course but it isn't new, so it's not actually a big performance gain. This already exists on consoles. Sony is working on improving their multi-threading on PS3 as well as PS4. I'm not bragging about Sony. I just think you should know that it isn't a Microsoft thing. Seriously, stop finding terms and blindly trying to justify something with terms you don't understand.
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warczar  +   117d ago
@Elit3Nick

"Microsoft are masters of software"

Spoken like someone who has never used Windows NT, Windows Vista, or Windows 8. All perfect examples of how Microsoft sucks balls at software.
jackdaniels  +   117d ago
@war car

and yet MS are one the richest software companies on the planet...man it must pay well to suck balls eh :)
Deltaohio  +   115d ago
@warczar

"Masters" of software not masters of knowing wtf ppl want from software. There is a difference.
miyamoto  +   118d ago | Well said
great news?

So what happened to these?

"Microsoft: "Absolutely no plans" to release Xbox One without Kinect
Phil Harrison squashes possibility of Kinect-less bundle of upcoming next-generation console."

"Absolutely no plans at all," Harrison said when asked if a Kinect-free bundle may be offered. "We think Kinect is an integral part of our platform. All of the magical experiences that you get, both as a games-player and also the way you navigate the system are made even more amazing because of Kinect."

Harrison said that because every Xbox One console will come with Kinect, developers can design projects for the "widest possible install base."

"Xbox One is Kinect," Harrison said at the time. "They are not separate systems. An Xbox One has chips, it has memory, it has Blu-ray, it has Kinect, it has a controller. These are all part of the platform ecosystem."

Source: http://metro.co.uk/2013/08/...

Again.
Microsoft: "no plans" to release an Xbox One without Kinect"

Speaking with Eurogamer yesterday ahead of the announcement of the first Xbox One price cut, Xbox UK marketing chief Harvey Eagle said Microsoft was sticking with Kinect because the company feels it's "integral to the Xbox One experience".

"[A Kinect-less Xbox One] is not in our plans at all," he stressed.

"As we've said from the very beginning, we believe Kinect is an absolutely integral part of the Xbox One experience."

http://www.eurogamer.net/ar...

So what happened to this:

"It was really all about consumer choice," Spencer said in an interview with CNET. "Like we would have said on 360, the best experience was with the biggest hard drive possible. On Xbox One, I think the best experience is with Kinect."

http://www.cnet.com/news/mi...

So how is getting a console with "the best experience" removed, great news?

How about fixing M$'s conflicting PR message disaster and actually growing a backbone...that will be great news?
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creatchee  +   118d ago
@miyamoto

You can still buy a Kinect if you want to. You now just have an option not to if you don't want one. The buyer who chooses not to assumes the liability of not getting the intended "full" experience, but at a lower price of entry. Are we really at the point where having an option is a bad thing?
nix  +   118d ago
@creatchee:

what's the point of buying Kinect if they are planning to ditch it?
Belasco  +   118d ago
Judging from your comment history, you have an obsessive hatred for Microsoft. You seem to be a Sony fanboy I guess, but your comments are 99% about MS or the Xbox One.Question, could MS do ANYTHING that pleases you? Seek help. OT this performance boost is something made available to the devs, Kinect will not be affected, what is so hard to understand about this?
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pyramidshead  +   118d ago
Damn, ice cold.
Gambloid  +   118d ago
@miyamoto

Change the record FFS
gamer7804  +   118d ago
You see. Change happens when you appoint a new head of a division....
jackdaniels  +   117d ago
why so angry ?
Muffins1223  +   118d ago
But I can guarantee you that every Microsoft first party game will use kinect in some way....so there goes that 10% for what games it actually matter for.
imt558  +   118d ago
Microsoft FREED UP EXISTING GPU RESOURCES with new SDK's, NOT ADDED NEW ONES!!!!

Total of 1.32 TFLOPS 10% were reserved for Kinect!!!!

Earth to Xbone fans!!!
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Wizard_King  +   117d ago
Yeha it's not like suddenly the GPU got better or runs faster it's still the same GPU. Microtard just decided to drop the dead in the water Kinect and give the devs the locked up space for it.

Over all everyone who owns a launch unit should be pissed off at this. They bought the machine with MS PR going on about Kinect magic, integral part of the experience, blah blah bullshit. Now that part of the X1 is effectively dead and will see little to no further development. Expect the same cheap dance dance, sports fit and on the rails shooter games that's it.

I would be in favor of a full refund for everyone with a launch unit upset with this, pending a class action lawsuit guaranteeing the refunds to all.
agame914  +   118d ago
I don't understand how ditching a camera adds a 10% boost to the gpu. So does that mean when I have my xbox hooked up with kinect my graphics will be 10% less then a person without kinect?? So when I unplug my camera for my ps4 I'll get a 10% increase???

Obscured
Belasco  +   118d ago
Breathtaking amount of disagrees, must mean it's not true.
Smokeeye123  +   118d ago
The fact that 94 people downvoted your comment shows how much Sony fans makeup this site. N4PO (News for playstation owners)
Welshy  +   118d ago
The problem being, anywhere up to 5 million people already have Kinect since it was bundled with their console.

XB1 is already lagging noticeably behind PS4, are they really going to have those 5 million with Kinect have even WORSE versions of games since they won't have this "10% GPU boost"?

Of course this won't be utilised, if I was an early adopter of the XB1 who was FORCED to have a Kinect, I'd already be pissed that the device I had forced upon me was getting significantly reduced support, let alone being 10% down on performance for future titles.
ITPython  +   118d ago
10% of nothing is still nothing.

Also didn't MS give the devs access to 8% of the Kinects reserves a long time ago? If so, this means devs are only going to see a 2% boost.
Ghost_Nappa  +   118d ago
107 disarees? Seriously people wtf? Is it a crime to like xbox?
imuze  +   118d ago
you just went full retard.
TOTSUKO  +   118d ago
Im going to miss saying "Xbox, Go Home"
aceitman  +   118d ago
Ok so last time they optimized x1 the boost increased by 10 percent, so in other words not much of a difference with and without kinect.
tuglu_pati  +   118d ago
Huh? 10% is a nice boost.This could be used for better framerates or better resolution.
GUTZnPAPERCUTZ  +   118d ago
No, That was Overall system performance boost. This is 10% just for GPU, so it will be noticed more visually in games.
Neonridr  +   118d ago
Interesting news no doubt. Hopefully devs can put that extra power to use.
ginsunuva  +   118d ago
They can't.
Some people will still have Kinect connected, so they have to cater to the lowest common denominator.
kneon  +   118d ago
No, the dev can disable Kinect when their game is running so that they can use all the power available on the device.
marlinfan10  +   118d ago
its already confirmed it has nothing to do with the kinect
snookiegamer  +   117d ago
10% GPU gain can only be a good thing....but surely MS didn't use the term 'Ditched', as that would seem disrespectful to those early adopters would bought into the Kinect vision.
truefan1  +   118d ago
I just don't think anyone reads these days. Phil Spencer as direct as possible tweeted the June update allows for 10% more GPU performance. The way article after article has worded it makes it sound like it's for the kinect less XB1 only.

psycho I know you didn't write it, but the title and premise of the article is very misleading. Below is the exact quote, where does he mention kinect less.

Phil Spencer @XboxP3 · 22h

June #XboxOne software dev kit gives devs access to more GPU bandwidth. More performance, new tools and flexibility to make games better

@kayant Agreed.
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Kayant  +   118d ago
"Phil Spencer as direct as possible tweeted the June update allows for 10% more GPU performance." - No he give no info on the measurable reserve being freed up. All he said was more gpu bandwidth being available.
https://twitter.com/XboxP3/...
It was eurogamer with their inquiry that found it was related to the kinect reserve.

"In June we're releasing a new SDK making it possible for developers to access additional GPU resources previously reserved for Kinect and system functions. The team is continually calibrating the system to determine how we can give developers more capabilities. With this SDK, we will include new options for how developers can use the system reserve as well as more flexibility in our natural user interface reserve (voice and gesture)" - Not all of it is going they still need it for system function (snap, etc).

But yh I don't know why Polygon are being misleading here and putting it only for kinectless Xbox when if they bothered to quote the whole update from eurogamer it's a general thing for all variants of XB1.
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Rockefellow  +   118d ago
I think it's the way they're wording it. It applies to ALL Xbox Ones, but the 10% increase is obtained by allocating resources previously designated to Kinect-- as referenced in that tweet of Phil's. This means that even people with Kinects will be able to get this power boost in games that utilize it-- they'll just have to unplug (or disable) their Kinect.

To most people, that would mean a "Kinect-less Xbox One"; you have Kinect, but it's not being used, so the X1 is Kinect-less. It might be a little hard for some people around here to understand, I know.
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Dudebro90  +   118d ago
No one needs to unplug their Kinect.

Its simple. Microsoft reserved 10% of the gpu for Kinect to be used in all games, even if it didn't use Kinect.

Now that 10% is not forced. Period.
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Brim  +   118d ago
idk why you're getting disagrees .. i completely agree that's the only reason why i clicked on this particular story.
OrangePowerz  +   118d ago
"The additional resources allow access to up to 10 per cent additional GPU performance."

It's not for Kinectless X1 only, but it is resources that are allocated to Kinect previously. So yeah the title is rather wrong.
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GW212  +   118d ago
Yeah, I literally read the title and had a sh*t. So I buy a launch day edition and get screwed for doing so? That would be a complete disaster.

I think you're right though, it will be up to the software developers as to how to use the Kinect bandwidth. I love the Kinect for "out of game" stuff like turning it on, snapping, starting apps, etc. I'm not a huge fan of actual games that use Kinect so I'd rather they "shut off" the Kinect in-game in order to get better performance.
MCTJim  +   118d ago
Trufan, I got it and get it, the new SDK allows you to ignore the reserve for Kinect and utilize it somewhere else. The Kinect can still be used like it always does without affecting performance..ie the reserve for it being used in games..if the game developer doesnt use it, then they gain that %...so easy to understand...but I see on other sites they twisted the words to make it seem like people with Kinect were getting screwed and losing that performance gain. So its not a misunderstanding, its just poor use of wording in articles..with intent to cause confusion and spread FUD.
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incendy35  +   118d ago
Polygon are masters at click bait haha. Using misleading headlines to rise a stir and get users to see their ads. Personally not going to click on it and encourage them, especially since we all know the reserves exist on all Xbox One's.
TheWackyMan  +   118d ago
except no game will take advantage of that 10% power boost.
Dread  +   118d ago
why not?
TheWackyMan  +   118d ago
Because people have the Kinect.
Dread  +   118d ago
well u can turn the kinect off.

@YoMamma

what MS appologists? What is so wrong with a 10% boost? Are u suggesting that it is a bad thing?

It seems to me that u are simply hating on MS and attacking its fans, for no reason.
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Yo Mama  +   118d ago
Exactly. What are Microsoft going to do? Tell people they can't use their Kinect for voice controls anymore? Not happening. And if they do... LULZ
Yo Mama   118d ago | Trolling | show
Shnooze  +   118d ago
I don't really understand how you could form this weird idea that kinect won't work at all without that dedicated power.

Simply put, it's just not forced anymore. There isn't a huge chunk taken away regardless of anything.
Ghost_Nappa  +   118d ago
Like voice controls work anyway ZING!
ricochetmg  +   118d ago
Every year you still see a increase but sony will as well
snookiegamer  +   118d ago
10% gain huh?

...Not bad at all :)
HugoDrax  +   118d ago
According to the couch developers on N4G, the only way the XB1 can become more powerful is through a hardware upgrade.......:-/ Sarcasm

Now developers who have no intention of implementing KINECT features for their games, can utilize the previously reserved 10% resources in other areas.
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realgame  +   118d ago
Well yeah. You can adjust the software for a slight performance boost but atthe end of the day if you want a really good increase you need better hardware.
HugoDrax  +   118d ago
That is true! An increase is still an increase, and is better than nothing. It just baffles me that people dismiss Microsoft as if they aren't one of the largest software companies in the world. And every bit of positive news is always met with a negative spin. Remember this quote from Panello?

""People DO understand that Microsoft has some of the smartest graphics programmers IN THE WORLD. We CREATED DirectX, the standard API’s that everyone programs against. So while people laude Sony for their [hardware] skills, do you really think we don’t know how to build a system optimized for maximizing graphics for programmers? Seriously? There is no way we’re giving up a 30% + advantage to Sony"

I'm just saying, compare the rate at which the XB1's software is updated compared to the PS4? The second time I physically updated my PS4 was yesterday, and I'm not even sure what the update was for? I know one thing, my PS4 save files still have a notification that my saved data couldn't be uploaded to the cloud......
speedforce131  +   118d ago
@HugoDrax

No need to compare to the PS4 because the PS4 does not need constant news updates on how much performance they're squeezing out of the system. The performance is already there. But personally I've seen multiple articles talking about increasing the PS4's performance.

It doesn't matter that MS created DX. DX is good and all, but developers have said that DX only gets in the way. On PS and Apple platforms, they code to the metal.

Finally, every bit of positive news is met with negative spin because they are always talking in low percentages but nobody knows what that means in the grand scheme of things. We're talking 10% boost to the already weak GPU? GPU that wasn't using 100% due to DX? We haven't seen any actual evidence of where these boosts are supposed to be beneficial. So far, all this talk is about, is secret sauce.
HugoDrax  +   118d ago
@Speedforce131

1) "No need to compare to the PS4 because the PS4 does not need constant news updates on how much performance they're squeezing out of the system. The performance is already there."

Are you kidding me? You're saying the PS4 doesn't need constant new updates? So like I said, let's spin Microsofts ability to push out software updates at lightning speeds into something negative.. That's exactly what you're trying to insinuate by stating the PS4 doesn't need constant updates. By that logic, you're saying the ps4 is perfect as is? If it was so perfect, why have fans been asking for DLNA/MP3 support since launch? In the words of Shuhei Yoshida.........

"We didn’t really think about MP3 or DLNA. We thought, “We’re gonna do that eventually, we’ve been doing it with all the products. It’s not like we actively decided, “Yeah, let’s not do this feature so that people will subscribe to Music Unlimited…”

Haven't Microsoft been doing what the community has asked? Why haven't Sony? Oh because they're not one of the largest software companies in the world. They can't update the PS4 at the speed at which MS can update the XB1. Yet, according to you it doesn't need constant updating...

2) "It doesn't matter that MS created DX. DX is good and all, but developers have said that DX only gets in the way."

So developers have said? Which developers? Because the past few months what I have read was that developers are praising DX12, aside from the developers who only program on Sony platforms.

3) "We haven't seen any actual evidence of where these boosts are supposed to be beneficial."

Why is it that when Microsoft says anything, you fanboys demand they present it with evidence immediately? They're one of the largest software companies in the world. They have a resume that dates back to the 80's.
#8.1.3 (Edited 118d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(7) | Report
Walker  +   118d ago
So what about previous xbones with kinects ?
tuglu_pati   118d ago | Trolling | show
PS4isTHEkneesOFbees  +   118d ago
This applies to every xbox..
gamer1138  +   118d ago
I think we are seeing Phil Spencer's first gaff? You can't just dump this piece of information with no context or specifics. I want to know what implications this 10% increase has on my X1 that has the kinect plugged in. Will I see any benefit? Will I lose some of my voice commands or multi-tasking.

One part of this article says MS said that Kinect is mainly a draw on the CPU and not the GPU. Does this mean they held 10% back just incase but now they can get away with giving it back?

In the past both MS and Sony have said it is easier to hold back system reserves first rather than to try and take system reserves back further down the line. Case in point: kinect 1 on 360.

As Jim Carrey said in batman forever; "there's just too many questions!"
Dudebro90  +   118d ago
Its really not hard to understand.

Why in earth would you need to unplug your Kinect? Do you really think Microsoft would alienate their market and just be like, hey to play this game...you gotta unplug that Kinect.

Ita simple. The SDK had 10% of the gpu power reserved for Kinect features, and Microsoft did that because they wanted devs to use Kinect since it came with every Xbox, but they did not force devs to have Kinect features.

So when games didn't use Kinect, the devs were saying, why can't we have that power to use since we aren't using Kinect?

Now devs have complete control over the gpu. Done. No one needs to unplug or anything. Your Kinect will still work.
gamer1138  +   118d ago
Thanks for clearing that up.
HugoDrax  +   118d ago
"Why in earth would you need to unplug your Kinect? Do you really think Microsoft would alienate their market and just be like, hey to play this game...you gotta unplug that Kinect."

Well to be funny.....I remember Nintendo told me something like that, when I was informed I needed to buy their N64 expansion pack to play certain games lol. Some of those games were ......
-The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask
-Perfect Dark
-Donkey Kong Country

I think the expansion pack gave developers access to a whopping 8MB of RAM, as opposed to the 4MB already within the console. Anyhow, I'm glad times have changed for the better :-)
paulogy  +   118d ago
Actually, it won't. If you use Kinect voice commands today to snap in other apps or record etc. then I suspect Kinect will be disabled for the titles that choose to use that 10% resource.

Those resources were allocated for a reason and if you free them up to devote to prettier games, great, but you can't expect the Kinect features to still work too.
#10.1.3 (Edited 118d ago ) | Agree(3) | Disagree(3) | Report
bababrooks  +   118d ago
it's reserved for the system!!! won't affect the Kinect at all. What's not being used wont be missed....If you want to use it for a game for Kinect you can!
johny5  +   118d ago
Wonder if this could have made Ryse run in 1080p...
choujij  +   118d ago
No. A 10% increase does simply equate to a 1080p resolution.
#11.1 (Edited 118d ago ) | Agree(2) | Disagree(2) | Report | Reply
johny5  +   118d ago
seems you didn't use 10% of your brain for that comment...
IrishSt0ner  +   118d ago
Misleading headlines aside, we all knew this was coming. Having used the extra 10% kinect features on multiplats such as BF4 I can safely say we're not losing anything. I would have much prefered that particular GPU power put into the game, really shouldn't have been locked off in the first place, let the devs decide.
Father__Merrin  +   118d ago
still not good enough to overhaul ps4 hardware, but is a welcome boost never the less
tuglu_pati  +   118d ago
Agree PS4 is just a beast but no one can deny that it is a nice boost.
stuna1  +   118d ago
Sure it's a boost and all, but people are just bypassing the issue here. Taking away resource allocated to Kinects to boost the system, and everyone is falling over themselves like this is a good thing! People believing it wasn't allocated for a reason are lying to themselves. Just like people believing taking those resourses back is not going to have an effect are also lying to themselves. This is a perfect case of "Taking from one hand to pad the other!"

We've had all these quote/unquote performance enhancements yet the systems aren't even 7 months old.

1) Up Clock

2) I'm almost positive about 3 months ago Microsoft themselves stated that they had freed up 6% to 8% power allocated to Kinects.

3) DX12 slated to be fully intergrated into Xbox1 by Nov. 2015, yet already have assets enable now. Microsoft said during DX12 unveiling possibly 20% or more performance boost on Xbox1 alone, yet here we have some quoting as high as a 50% performance boost.

4) Cloud Computing!!! Reported to magnify the power of Xbox1 by a magnitude of 3 to 4 times.

5) The present Microsoft allows another 10% GPU performance to be freed up, also allocated to Kinects.

If people can't see a pattern here, they must be truly blind! My opinions is Microsoft has sold many a broken dream! And they are making these promises to try to save face, the problem with these promises is at some point they are going to have to make good on them.
tuglu_pati  +   118d ago
2) I'm almost positive about 3 months ago Microsoft themselves stated that they had freed up 6% to 8% power allocated to Kinects.

Link or it never happened
stuna1  +   118d ago
Just type in Microsoft releases 8% boost from kinect on google, on front page January 26, 2014. And from what the article stated it originally was supposed to be 8% taken from Kinects and leaving 2% for voice control, but Microsoft plans on taking the whole 10%, which will leave Kinect a dead stick.
#13.2.2 (Edited 118d ago ) | Agree(3) | Disagree(0) | Report
realgame   118d ago | Trolling | show | Replies(2)
trenso1  +   118d ago
So they are just going to ignore the other millions of X1s out there? And have some that perform better cause they don't have kinnect while the others don't get the performance boost?
PS4isTHEkneesOFbees  +   118d ago
ugh...no. this is for ALL xboxes.
ruefrak  +   118d ago
This is fantastic news. Now Call of Duty and Assassin's Creed will run in parity with the PS4. 10% boost along with the new DirectX and the PS4 better watch its back. There's a new beast in town.

But that gets me thinking. Aside from a worse UI, what sets the XB1 apart from the PS4 now?
LAWSON72  +   118d ago
IMO the Xbone voice commands and games
rdgneoz3  +   118d ago
PS4 can use voice commands with a built mic that comes with the system and not need a camera for it which costs $100 more.
ruefrak  +   118d ago
But no Kinect means no voice commands :(
AceBlazer13  +   118d ago
Well considering with this new Kinectless SKU, the ps4 is the only 1 that does voice commands out of the box it wins that and games are subjective.
LAWSON72  +   118d ago
@aceblazer
Games are not subjective in this regard, the games are what will set the two systems apart.

I did not say it has better games

Oh and your out of box voice command argument is not really that big of a deal, because I would not want to wear a headset let alone a damn earbud to navigate my OS. It lacks the relevance and convenience of Kinect.

I enjoy coming in my room and saying Xbone on and saying go to Netflix and then select, without finding a remote or controller. What is the point when I have to find my controller, plug in a headset, and do all this with the controller in my hand? IMO it defeats the purpose.
#16.1.4 (Edited 118d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(1) | Report
rdgneoz3  +   118d ago
When the ps4 gpu was stated as being 50% more powerful, a 10% boost is nice but not going to close the gap. DirectX won't be out for another year and a half, though it'll be interesting to see how much it does for the xbone since it'll have the best benefits for comps.

Also, Sony isn't just sitting on their hands with their own upgrades.

http://n4g.com/news/1512050...
ruefrak  +   118d ago
The infinite power of the cloud? Losing the kinect gets you 10%. I'm sure the cloud power can get you at least 40%, right? Unless my internet is down... then all graphics go to OG Xbox levels I guess.
IHassounah  +   118d ago
DX12 is coming out next year , that's not 1 year and a half away
rdgneoz3  +   118d ago
@IHassounah DX12 is Holiday's '15, which tends to mean Nov/Dec. If I'm mistaken that it's basically the beginning of summer right now and by this time next year DX12 will be released, then you are correct.

http://www.shacknews.com/ar...
Bennibop  +   118d ago
@ruefrak what set s the PS4 apart will be better performance/ polish of games. The 10% is not enough to close the gap but its is enough to make some minor improvements. Plus lets not forget that Sony will also be optimising PS4 now that it is the wild so the performance gap will remain.
slutface  +   118d ago
Everyday there is a new performance boost. This is coming from a company who reversed just about everything that came out about the xbox one last e3. I just don't believe it until I see games outperforming their ps4 counterparts!
mydyingparadiselost  +   118d ago
From 'We'll never give up on Kinect' to 'Look how good it is that we gave up Kinect'. Anyway, it's good to know that they can get more out of the system even if it means giving up other things.
#18 (Edited 118d ago ) | Agree(4) | Disagree(1) | Report | Reply
ar00043  +   118d ago
I don't understand how this could work. What about the early adapters with kinect? Does this means people with kinect will be getting a 'downgrade' version of the game..?
HappyWithOneBubble  +   118d ago
So what happen to all that cloud boosting talk or was that a lie? Now removing Kinect suppose to boost performance.
#20 (Edited 118d ago ) | Agree(3) | Disagree(2) | Report | Reply
Muzikguy  +   118d ago
It was a lie in how they said it would work. I like how people didn't fall for it. It's almost like MS is running out of options in how to lure customers in. Clouds failed to materialize, Titanfall didn't do what it was supposed to, Kinect "still" isn't used to its full potential, DRM made people angry... All this changing around isn't going to help MS much IMO. The vision is lost, people see the rapid changes all the time. They could've had this 10% freed up from the very beginning. Oh well, better late than never
scotmacb  +   118d ago
10% will do nicely infinity ward said if they had the extra power the kinect was using up the x1 version of ghosts would of been 1080p
Nine_Thousaaandd  +   118d ago
That 10% could be huge in certain areas depending on how devs use it. What's concerning is Microsoft boosting the Xbox One so fast, CPU over clock to GPU boost....man I don't see much growth left in the X1 after DX12. Not even sure that's gonna be a huge impact once they release it.

Not trolling...just pointing out how fast they are changing X1. I don't recall a console ever changing power reserves so fast within a short period of time after launch. The 10% is boost is great...but the bone shows signs of growth issues over the next several years with so much boosted already.
Illusive_Man  +   118d ago
Power boost will be on demand for owners regardless if they have Kinect or not. Devs will be able to tap into the extra power in their dev kits. This is really simple folks.

The games on X1 have already improved. We haven't had a 720p title since launch. 900p/1080p are the norm. Only Titanfall and Watchdogs are 792p (which is a significantly higher res than 720p). The games between both consoles are looking nearly indistinguishable. It is taking careful analysis by digital foundry to even find negligible differences. X1 doesn't need to match PS4 in sheer power it just needs to get as close as possible without any significant decline in graphical fidelity. I think it is already doing that. Exclusives are going to look fantastic on both platforms so in my opinion this gen isn't so much about raw power and specs but games, services, and unique experiences.

I think the X1 wins on UI, selection of apps, multitasking, social aspects, and rapid update cycle. I also love the exclusives. Recent multiples prove the console is getting better and devs are tapping into its power.
rdgneoz3  +   118d ago
Ground Zeroes wasn't a launch title.

http://www.ign.com/wikis/xb...
corroios  +   118d ago
Old news... This was told months ago. Now they can use the 1.30 TF of the machine and not only 1.180 TF or something like that.
QuickdrawMcgraw  +   118d ago
I will be the 1st to admit I am not the most tech savy person...So tell me this...Well the Kinectless console have better games then the Kinect Xbox1 because of this GPU boost...
Bennibop  +   118d ago
they will be the same, having the Kinect plugged in makes no difference as its a 10% extra system resource that Microsoft are unlocking for developers to use.
mydyingparadiselost  +   118d ago
"Microsoft has confirmed that this boost in performance is in fact due to Kinect being stripped from the package. When asked if the two were related, a Microsoft spokesperson sent Eurogamer the following response:

"Yes, the additional resources allow access to up to 10 per cent additional GPU performance. We're committed to giving developers new tools and flexibility to make their Xbox One games even better by giving them the option to use the GPU reserve in whatever way is best for them and their games.""
kiz2694  +   118d ago
I dont see the point of saying this becuase if that was the case, they would be excluding people who currently own a Kinect and it would be the final blow to Kinect if they were to give people who dont own a kinect a 10& graphical boost.
Dudebro90  +   118d ago
Read above. People who have kinecr will not somehow be alienated. Use your brain.
talocaca  +   118d ago
And then with the power of the cloud!!?...BOOM!...1080p!!
Gamer777  +   118d ago
Deceiving title, game journalism these days .
Deadpool789  +   118d ago
As far as the PS4 goes a dev from naughty dog just made a routine that increases the cpu to 10 - 100 times.Going to show it at e3.
ricochetmg  +   118d ago
The games won't see it because that 10 percent still has to account for Kinect users.
shinrock  +   118d ago
So ur saying the xb1cant just ignore the kinect or disable it automatically?Really? People r really bugging out on this site..
ricochetmg  +   118d ago
It still won't make up for its short comings. There is always the cloud.
Niv  +   118d ago
Xb1 owners already received the extra power earlier this year. So games inherently used it.
Now devs can program fr that 10% and is now in their control.
#30 (Edited 118d ago ) | Agree(0) | Disagree(4) | Report | Reply
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