Gameondaily's Gaz Lehri offers his thoughts on why he is disappointed by the recently announced Forza Horizon 2 being a cross-gen title.
When you're, what, 3-4mill units on your next gen hardware, you don't cater for the last gen, you give them insensitive to upgrade. FULLY agree with this guy, with this an HD ports of HD games.
Damn Septic, that was fast! Lol. I know your p***** off, but will adding an extra platform really impact the game that much? Perhaps the X1 is the lead platform and is the absolute priority, and the 360 version just gets scaled down and down until it's playable? At the very least, wait until we see footage. I think there will be a very significant difference between the 360 version and the X1 version. I can't see this turning out like Assassins Creed 4, for example, where the only difference was the resolution and a few extra small bells and whittles.
LOL. It IS a Septic article. I was reading it and thinking: this writing style looks familiar ...
Lets not forget how much better nba 2k14 looked on xbox one and ps4 then it did on xbox 360 and ps3. I think the game will look great on both
Mate, I'm so annoyed at this (I'm at work believe it or not lol). Scaled down or not, we've seen what cross-gen constraints can do to the end quality of titles. Take damage modelling for example. You sure as heck can say goodbye to realistic damage modelling because, something like that needs to designed from the ground up. I might not be a developer but I know that its not simply a case off locking-off damage modelling on the 360 and activating it on the X1. Cross-gen just leaves such a bitter taste in my mouth. Even Destiny's cross-gen constraints have me worried. Colour me very disappointed.
IGN Ryan McCaffery tweeted that the 360 verion is being developed by FWIW and the XB1 version will be developed by Playground only. You all will have to find another way to downplay more postive XB1 news. FM5 engine, weather cycle, HUNDREDS of cars, drive-a-tars. FH2 will be the premeir racer this fall.
I agree we haven't even seen gameplay yet, but some people are getting their knickers in a twist, already. The game line up for the fall of 2014, looks to be solid for Microsoft with Sunset Overdrive, Forza Horizan and the rumoured Halo Redone. Evolve a third party title also coming out this fall.
cross gen 1st part game after 1 year means the XB1 has trouble giving returns on software. just think about it if MS can't make efficient financial returns from 1st party software how can they expect the same from 3rd party publishers.
Septic, we've also seen examples of how cross-gen games can be done properly. Fifa 14 (and probably other EA sports games) use an entirely different engine to the old-gen counterparts. BF4 is very different between platforms, and still stands as one of the most impressive "next-gen games" available. I feel weird referencing EA games as positive example of how a publisher can handle a cross-gen release. MS should surely be able to do better, right?
"Perhaps the X1 is the lead platform and is the absolute priority, and the 360 version just gets scaled down and down until it's playable?" The business decision re: 360 version will not have been taken lightly and is highly unlikely to be a minimal-effort quick port with IP as strong and important as Forza. When you consider there's an existing codebase on 360 that's working and proven, it's very unlikely they would abandon that in favour of something entirely new and a backport. It'll be more along the lines of making a game and it's HD/remaster at the same time if you want to put it in a current game context. Much more likely is that the game will be created within the confines of what is possible on 360 and embellished as much as possible for the one. That might well be 1080P, 60fps rather than 30 or both and all the usuals such as better AA, textures, filtering etc. "I think there will be a very significant difference between the 360 version and the X1 version" Highly probable in some respects, but the extent of that is more likely to be in areas mentioned above rather than any gameplay-defining differences. They will be the same game with different visuals essentially. It's possible that additional features might be present on the one and that might make better longer term business sense but I can't see them being revolutionary or such that they would make the 360 game pale into insignificance, otherwise why even make that 360 game if you're going to offer such a compelling reason to play the other version? I can understand why people would wish for that, but essentially making two games is not the way studios are run and not the way to make money. It's very unlikely to be a situation similar to that of titanfall's that you imply... the chances that two full and distinct teams are in place to create two entirely different solutions to reach the goal are minimal, but not entirely out of the question. EDIT: Ah, there we have it: "Development is being handled primarily by Horizon 1 studio Playground Games, though the team is collaborating closely with the Motorsport team at Turn 10 Studios; the two teams share a technology pipeline as well as select key personnel."-IGN Game being made by the existing Horizon team and using Turn 10 presumably for the drivatar tech and models.
N worries about been cross gen. The game will be developed by different. FWIW is doing 360 and Playground is building XB1 version off FM5 engine.
@truefan Awesome. That makes me even more confident that there will be a huge difference, and that quality won't be sacrificed with the X1 version. That is exactly what i was hoping for, that there would be dedicated teams working on each version separately. Great news. " You all will have to find another way to downplay more postive XB1 news. " Cmon man, don't ruin a perfectly normal comment with your typical trademark bitterness. No one is downplaying anything, some people have doubts and disappointment, others don't and see this as great news. Leave that crap out of here and stop fanning non-existent flames.
@Tuglu "FWIW" stands for "For what its worth". It isn't the name of the dev studio :)
One other thing i wanna say, it's awesome to know that 'Drivatars' are being used in this game too. The AI in F5 acted so naturally, so realisticly. I wish every racing game used them. It was so cool knowing that my racing habits were being saved and put into other peoples races. You simply can't beat racing against AI that are composed of real peoples skills, habits and tactics.
@Lukas_Japonicus "separate studios" doesn't mean "separate development", the base code and assets will be the same and designed to scale, the second team will just be porting code, their is a reason why some games like BatmanAK are next gen only. "designed to scale" is the problem with cross-gen games.
They obviously feel there is a market for the game on the previous platform. It is being handled by two teams and each will make the version that they feel defines that platform. This is a win win for both 360 and xb1 players. 360 owners who dont have the xb1 will get to play it. And xb1 owners will get the better version to play on their platform. Now, the bigger question is...will they be cross compatible? It would be sweet if 360 and xb1 players could race against each other.
Remeber that time when mlb the show was on ps3 and noone complained?
That would be a good outcome, but the issues I'm having with devs is they're putting resources into, lets face it, a decade old hardware, and new hardwares losing resources to improve it's performance and catering need to old hardware is reducing the new possibilities in games the extra RAM, CPU, and in in MS case Blu-ray can offer. I'd take content over uncompressed textures anyday. Okay, so do these games come with exclusive game play options, say like another 5-10hrs of game play? No. Yes they've graphics etc but they're the same content and same lack of oh you can destroy everywhere, go everywhere etc. thats what I'm talking.
Sony releases MLB 14 on PS3 and PS4... No one peeps a bit... And spends their time porting Fl0w, Last of Us, and Flower to PS4 and life is still great. And gets a bunch of re-released indie games from PC land and "everything is awesome". Which company is really holding back this generation? MS releases Forza Horizon 2 on 360 and X1... The sky is falling... PS: They also announced that the game is being handled by two different studios for 360 and X1. So, this is going to be like Titanfall. A next gen game ported back to run on an older console. It doesn't matter what MS does, the headlines are always negative from "supposed" journalists.
*not necessarily directed at this article* The irony here is that, over the years many have bashed MS for abandoning old hardware, and now that they're supporting that old hardware with a new game, everyone is bashing them for supporting that old hardware because it will seemingly hold the new game back on the new hardware. I think what's been established here is that MS simply cannot do right in some peoples' eyes - they drop the old, they get bashed. They support the old, they get bashed. Me, I never cared about support for old hardware. I'm a launch day buyer of new hardware. Once I got my XBO/PS4/Wii U, I have no need for 360/PS3/Wii games. Personally I wish Horizon 2 was XBO only. I, too, expect that Horizon 2 will suffer due to having to support now ancient hardware. Just thought I'd point out the irony in the reaction.
damned if you do and damned if you don't.
lol dont forget that all this 'BASHING' made them take this course of action including the countless 180's... p.s the irony here is that whatever cockamamie thing m$ does it ALWAYS please 'some people' id rather they release a separate game for 360 and xb1 but yeah wait.. theyre out of ips
Flame bait BS. Horizon 2 is developed by Playground for Xbox One SOLELY using the FM5 engine. A different developer is doing the 360 version.
"Flame bait BS" - Seeing as this was written before that news. It really isn't and a fair concern at the time in how much they can push the XB1 version. @Dudebro90 To be fair I agree to a point but IGN could have easily put it in their announcement post rather than it only coming out after speculation. @IrishSt0ner Fair point there.
And that's the difference between a journalist and a wannabe blogger. A journalist finds the facts first, then writes their opinion. A blogger is someone out for ad revenue and will write a stupid headline to generate clicks. This right here is the perfect example of what's wrong with gaming journalism.
So it's okay to say "Slamming the brakes on progress" without any evidence, but it's not okay to call out Flame bait BS. While I understand it was a fair concern.... shit like "Make no mistake about it; the Xbox One version of Forza Horizon 2 will be one that is compromised by the limitations of the Xbox 360" kinda sets up the Flame bait argument.
Haha, these sites constantly make themselves look stupid. Their hate blinds them from reality :D
Lol, you should probably take a look at Septic's comment history before talking about blind hate. He's easily one of the most level-headed and unbiased guys on here. Your blind hate for anything that appears blindly negative towards Xbox/MS is blinding you. I find it embarrassing that someone can't even voice their opinion on a game without being called out and accused of being a hater. People are so unwilling to accept other peoples opinions. No one is asking you to agree with him, hell...look above, you will see that i don't agree with him myself, but at least be understanding of other peoples opinions and why they feel the way they feel. No wonder the media thinks we're all a bunch of immature basement dwellers......
Sorry but i have to also call him out regardless of his comment history. I am not saying he is a troll, but the fact is that he made very specific comments without having all the facts. If he had waited a few hours he would have known that the xbox one is the lead platform and that a another studio is porting the game to the 360. knowing that, he can still have the same opinion, but at least it would be better informed and less controversial.
That's good to know. For me this is why the bubble system is broken, you get disagrees, even when you state the 360 version is being done by a different developer. Why are you getting disagrees? People on N4G want x box games to fail. No reason for you to be getting disagrees for stating facts.
No flame-bait at all mate. This is really me offering my thoughts on it. Even considering the fact that a different studio is developing it, can you honestly tell me that last gen considerations won't hamper the overall design of the game? "shit like "Make no mistake about it; the Xbox One version of Forza Horizon 2 will be one that is compromised by the limitations of the Xbox 360" kinda sets up the Flame bait argument." I stick by this comment until I see proof to the contrary. I understand what you're saying but trust me, I'm not here to get clicks. I don't give two s**** about how much money those measley adsense adverts on my site make. As for being a 'wannabee blogger', I'm not a wannabee anything. Some of these so-called journalists make me laugh. If they even had half the back-bone some of us 'wannabee bloggers' have... But of course, we have to start somewhere. Feel free to take the opinions of the likes of IGN and Gamespot more seriously than mine. Just remember my name mate. I've bookmarked this thread for future reference.
I've been reading your commments for months now, and I've only just noticed you have a Quake 3 avatar. Some was say this comment is off-topic, so.... erm cars and stuff. Vrooooooom.
@Volkama Haha ye, Quake 3 almost ruined my life lol. I loved (and still love that game). Oh yeah and err...yeah cars and stuff! Anyway, the backlash was expected I guess (I'm always in the firing line no matter which side of the fence I happen to sit at) but my view still stands. Turn 10 (different studio I know) a few months ago stated that next big jump for car sims is realistic damage modelling. Now I can almost guarantee you, that won't really happen with Forza: Horizon 2 (or won't happen as well as it could) because of considerations for the 360 version of the game. Unless the 360 version of the game is a whole different beast, my pessimism remains. I'm not trying to hate on this at all though. Just look at my comment literally a few minutes before the announcement was made.
Yea mate that's fair enough. A valid concern although I still do not think, in hindsight, you would have used as strong a statement... and if I'd have read your article prior, I wouldn't have made the accusation. No intention to disrespect your integrity with a knee-jerk reaction, grounded more in general annonyance. You're clearly not pushing advertising, with nothing showing at the landing screen, and I'll say your site is well developed, clean, and interesting. I'll concede you were not intentionally flame baiting, although concrete positions tend to get hard responses. I only take empirical evidence seriously, opinion is just that, but know I prefer hearing yours over mainsteam outlets. I don't like the connotation of your last two sentences, not my game; but I applaud your effort and wish you all the best with growing a good userbase.
Cheers for the mature and understanding response mate. It is appreciated. In hindsight, it does seem too strongly worded but, my opinion piece reflects my disappointment that I felt at the time. Right now, I'm a bit more optimistic and yeah, separate studios working on the game is a good thing. I'd be lying though if I said I wasn't disappointed that its coming to the 360. I know its an unpopular opinion and people want support for the 360 and fair enough. But I just want devs to go all in with the X1. I'm growing weary of cross-gen titles. They always dampen my hopes. But I really do hope Forza Horizon 2 is as great as it could possibly be.
There is a different developer doing the xbox 360 version than the xbox one version. https://twitter.com/DMC_Rya...
Was about to post that so there shouldn't be too much to worry about looks likes a TF situation. We will just have to wait and see at E3.
This is good to know.
It's not just Forza. It's Watch Dogs, Destiny, Titanfall, everything. Even MKX is apparently on last gen, and it's a 2015 release.
theyre not exclusives
except for titan fall of course... and see how that looks... and to people who say 'buh it has nexgen gameplay' then if it plays same on xb360 then u dont apparently need a new hardware to play it... its all in the idea and programming
This is the same as the Titanfall situation as the main developer and Turn 10 are developing it on XB1 and the X360 version is being contracted to a third party. Nothing to worry here as I am sure this game will look and play great judging from the first game. update: https://twitter.com/DMC_Rya... "I've woken up to worries over Forza Horizon 2 also being on 360. FWIW another studio is doing 360; Playground is bldg XB1 ver off FM5 engine" Also, Horizon will add in the first ever weather system for a Forza game...now imagine the smooth engine of Forza 5 with weather...now I can't wait. I suspect it will most likely be 30fps like the first game but could you imagine if they could pull of 60fps, 1080p, and also include a weather system!?
Give it a rest. No matter what Microsoft does people like this will find the negative.
... Except this was written by Septic, who is a HUGE Microsoft fan. Geez, man. Xbox fans eat each other alive...
https://twitter.com/DMC_Rya... Another studio is doing the 360 version, Horizon 2 is being built off the Forza 5 engine.
so this is Septic? lol that guy is pretty angry at the news lmao he was going off in the other article as well.. if Septic cares so much about not being held back he should get a $3,000 PC that maxes every game. Project Cars maxed out would've blew Forza Horizon 2 out of the water even if it was exclusive to Xbox One. also, Xbox One version will obviously be far more superior than 360 version so I'm not sure what he's complaing about. it will be a fun game regardless. the only thing you can get out of making a car game next-gen only is better graphics, the size of the tracks/world will pretty much remain the same.
I totally agree with the article, it does hamper progress. X1 version will obviously be superior, but in an up-scaled higher textured kinda way. I totally get that X1 sales (around 4 million) are the reason behind the cross gen decision with 360 having 81m sold. MS have all that money, they should have went all out, concentrating the entire budget on X1 hardware to make people believers. Sony were smart how they got gamers to make.believe ;)
Well...the way I see it, the X1 is a huge leap over 360. Cross development means that FH2 is gonna be held back by old gen. Not saying the game will be bad...I've enjoyed them over the years, but 360 shouldn't even be considered. FH has a huge fan base, some of those fans have yet to upgrade to X1. Forbid they are close in parity...another reason not to upgrade to X1. Without seeing footage and I'm almost certain that X1 version of FH2 to fail in comparison to DC now. X1 should have main priority this round. I agree with this guy as well. Hope it turns out great though for Xbox fans...FH has been an amazing racing game over the years.
Whoa...have to reply to myself on this one...now seeing that 2 different teams are making the game and FH2 will be using Forza 5 engine...this game may shine after all. Wait and see what happens tomorrow before passing judgment on FH2 for X1. Though I'm skipping Xbone this gen...I'm still a huge fan of the series and wish it the best!
You can all stop crying. The 360 version is being dev'd by a different studio. You people would be the first to bitch about a lack of 360 support if it wasn't coming out on 360.
i never heard about any1 crying over an xb1 exclusive not cmin to 360..
"You people would be the first to bitch about a lack of 360 support if it wasn't coming out on 360." Nope. When has anyone ever went into an article about an X1-only game and whined that it not being cross-gen? Why didn't they care about the millions of 360-only gamers then? But now with a game that was presumed to be an X1 exclusive, turning out to be cross-gen, people suddenly care about the tens of millions of 360-only gamers? Give me a break. As i said above, don't think the fact it's a cross-gen game will negatively impact the game at all....but im just pointing out the hypocrisy of some people saying that it's important not to forget about the millions of 36-onoly gamers.
Wow, talk about a knee jerk article. Game was announced about an hour ago and this guy already has a last gen holding it back article up. edit: Reading further into the article... "I am sick of cross gen holding back progress". How about good for MS to put out some support for last gen consoles still? This transition period is always tough from last gen to next gen but lets not jump to conclusions not in evidence. It has a weather system in it... that is progress over the first game.
Just to update everyone the 360,version is being made by another studio and Play Grounds will be making the x1 version using the FM5 engine
He doesn't now what he is talking about since the x360 version is developed by an other company.
WOW! talk about perfect timing, I literally just commented about this game 19hrs ago in another thread hahahaha... http://n4g.com/comments/red... "The concept seems like it will make for some fun online racing with friends. Looking forward to more on this at a later date, although Driveclub and the rumored Forza Horizon 2 may be out by then."
Xbone has been out 6 months and there's already two Forza titles? Haha wow.
umm horizon not coming out till autumn. unless MS PORTED over a LAST GEN game over to the xb1.. /s lol
Stay out of our threads McLovin.
Great stuff MS was popular on 360 so its good its coming to both Kudos.
Outdated article... It's been announced that the 360 will be "ported" by another studio. This game will be next-gen indeed.
So if Microsoft drops support for the 360 for major games, will we the see headlines like "Microsoft snubs 80 million gamers" or " MS ditches last gen hardware way too soon...again"?
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