Ragnar Tørnquist, creator of Dreamfall and The Secret World, explains that the Sony team has been great with them, contrarily to Microsoft.
Ouch. MS needs to improve relations with developers, the last thing they need is bad press from someone other than themselves. Im being harsh, but i should mention that they are doing better lately.
"Unfortunately the same can’t be said for @ID_Xbox. We’ve been having a really difficult time getting any response from @Microsoft." Get your act together Microsoft. Actions speak louder than words. Sentiments like this simply should not exist if you keep touting how you are now supporting indies.
It seems to me that for every dev that does praise the ID_Xbox and changes made we get one that doesn't. Lets be honest here, MS can't get back to every single dev in the world, some will slip through the cracks. And for these little devs to tweet some inconsistencies between companies and especially MS is not only unprofessional but it seems to be the popular thing to do.
hope Sony is "proactive" enough to bring over Yakuza Ishin
That's been our experience as well getting setup with the @ID_Xbox program. Sony contacted us almost immediately after we filled out our initial applications and our manager walked us through all the forms necessary to become a registered developer. The communication was great and they were very hands on to get us setup and I don't think I ever had to wait more than a few hours for a response when I've had any questions thus far. Contrast this to the @ID_Xbox program, we filled out the initial application for developer status back when it was first launched. Nothing happened for two months. Then we received a form letter inviting us to some event in Chicago. This was the first communication we had and we still had no idea if we were accepted into the program or anything about it. In the months following all we've ever received have been the monthly newsletters (usually starting with an apology from MS that processing applications is taking so long) and invites to events in other countries. I asked the rep on Twitter (as my emails were never returned) and they said if we're seeing the newsletters, we're in but probably still being processed. That's it. No details about the program, no personal contact. Nothing. It's actually nice to hear that it's not just happening to us. You can say "Well, probably lots of people are applying," but I'm sure they're applying to Sony as well, and Sony seems to be handling it. There's no excuse for MS not to be as well. If MS was serious about working with indie developers, they'd be putting resources behind building relationships with them and getting tools into their hands as soon as possible. Nothing's going to change unless developers speak out about this. Kudos to these guys for adding their voices to other developers who've expressed similar frustrations. They only way MS is going to change is if developers make their voices heard. I mean honestly, what are they supposed to do? Continue sending emails that go unanswered? Like Cog said below, the squeakiest wheel gets the grease. If you're too "professional" to make any noise, don't be surprised when you continue to be ignored. I can't believe there's Microsoft defenders here acting like the developer themselves is somehow to blame in all of this. Just unreal. Could you imagine if each day you went into your bank with your business, and the bank teller just ignored you day in, day out when you're just trying to get your job done, and then someone has the audacity to tell you that actually YOU'RE to blame, not the bank or the bank teller. I'm sure they're very busy, or maybe you're annoying to them. Don't make any noise to attract attention, just be quiet and get nothing done. Unreal...
It seems to me that if MS rejects a developer or if MS is not jumping hoops for them them MS is evil. MS has said that they don't want to clutter Xbox market place with every game available! Just the best they can get. I commend them for that. Remember, 35% of steam games haven't been played . If there is a game that I want and MS doesn't have it then I'll get it from PSN. But this guy seems very unprofessional, you don't trash someone else's business in the net like that.
@redwin. Microsoft still has the ultimate say on what's released on XBL and what's not. If they want to reject a game due to quality concerns, they're well withing their rights to do so. Good developer relations is another thing entirely. Nobody said anything about devs being "rejected". Given the fact that Microsoft were starting every single [email protected] newsletter with "Sorry application processing is taking so long" it's not about developers being rejected, it's about MS not dedicating the resources to making sure developers are registered and given the chance to start working on making games for the Xbox One in a reasonable time frame. I don't see how you could construe what he did as "trashing" MS. He said they had good support from Sony and they've had a hard time getting a response from Microsoft. Oh snap! Oh no, you didn't just say MS wasn't responding to your emails! That's such trash talk! /s This is a simple statement of fact for them. Sony's been good, MS won't respond to them. There was nothing inflammatory said (unless you think comparing levels of support between two competing company's as inflammatory), there was nothing derogatory said, it was just a simple statement. I can't get over how many on here are acting like this guy "went off" over his twitter account against MS. Enough with the rhetoric. He did no such thing.
@Redwin, how can MS know what the best games available are if they can't even get developers beyond the initial application process?
@maniac "It seems to me that for every dev that does praise the ID_Xbox and changes made we get two that have something bad to say about it" - Fixed. It's not 1:1 good and bad reception and you know it. "And for these little devs to tweet some inconsistencies between companies and especially MS is not only unprofessional but it seems to be the popular thing to do" - Could you be ANY bigger of a fanboy? You're seriously saying developers that call out MS for bad policies are "unprofessional"? And why would bashing a potential business partner be the "popular thing to do"? Are you seriously so out of touch that you think that developers are bashing the second fastest growing 8th gen console manufacturer for PUBLICITY?
So, you are selling a product to different stores and you publicly state that one store is proactive and the competitor is not that's why you are not selling your product there. Sounds to me like bad etiquette. Its possible that MS has resources allocated in different areas and they are doing what they can
We'll lets be fair though.. Ms can't get to every dev. Respawn didn't get much response or help from sony either that doesn't mean they are bad, they probably just had there eyes on something that they thought would be better.
Oh maniac, you try to act intelligent by having good sentence structure, but you're so bias and so out of touch with reality it's just not funny any more. Lets be honest here. Considering how we're all reminded on this site most days about how much money MS has, maybe they could use that money to actually invest into games. Yes? Since they've been telling us how their for the gamer now and they investing heavily into games I would have thought we wouldn't be seeing these kinds of complaints from DEVELOPERS. (not fanboys with an agenda, but developers who's lively hoods depends on good relations) It seems MS is just focusing on the things they deem "important" and that will garner more good will with gamers and forgetting about the rest. This is why I support sony so much. Because they genuinely push the industry forward. They don't need to be so supportive and accommodating of the little guys for their current success, but they do. The MS apologists on this thread sadden me. It's truly mind boggling how anyone can defend this.
@air1 'Ms can't get to every dev.' It looks to me that its the developers that go to MS and get ignored while Sony doesn't and if memory serves me its Sony that reduced their personnel by 50% the last 3 years and not MS. Whats MS's excuse? I believe this is just another case of being taken granted by MS. 'Respawn didn't get much response or help from sony either that doesn't mean they are bad, they probably just had there eyes on something that they thought would be better.' The whole Respawn-Titanfall-Sony thing is so fishy I can smell it form here. I dont get how being under the helm of EA, and their bank accounts, and still need help works...We dont know what truly happened and I dont buy for a minute the assumption of Sony passing on such an opportunity (Titanfall)when everybody praises them for their fast and proactive support. Open your eyes people, they talk so much nowadays we just need to read between the lines.
Where do you think Indies came from? It all started at MS (MS DOS/Windows) Xbox is fine and doesn't need Indies, that's what PCs are for. Don't forget Live was doing this way before Sony were. Also note Sony looked pass Respawn so no company is perfect. But honestly who cares. Indies can make games on PC if they cant cut it into Consoles. If there successful then they cross over. Like Outlast. I can tell you one thing. I didn't buy a next gen console so I can play Indie games.
Strange I was hearing positive sounds about @ID_xbox.Here is an example were to respond to a tweet of an indie dev offering their help to get their game on xb1. http://www.reddit.com/r/xbo... Obviously Microsoft is at fault not giving dreamfall guys an hand hope they will improve their program and invite them to their program.
I'm sure most devs are pleased with it, they're just the silent majority. But it's their job to take care of the whiners because that's all people will hear.
This is no different from respawns article about bringing titan fall to ps4... Good example to compare bias, or unbias..... Capybara who is working on below for xbox one has high praise for ms support of their indie game, but where is that article???
The positive stories about XBOX don't get page views, silly.
Eh. Not everyone is going to get the same level of support. And, the best way to get support is sometimes to go on Twitter and make a big deal out of it. I'm sure Microsoft will be giving them the best of support now.
I disagree, I think that is the last thing any company who wants to be professional should do. We have seen a lot of companies and especially people go to Twitter and it backfire because they didn't get the whole story or fully understand the situation.
maniac, I don't think it's the right thing either, but that's the reality of business (not everyone gets the same level of support all the time) and social media (squeakiest wheel gets the oil).
I agree that not everyone gets the same level of support. That is the nature of the beast and it sux, but taking it to social media won't make those wheels turn any faster. Only that paper green seems to move that machine faster. A business like this should try their best to make this game as fun and popular as possible and put it out only for the PS4. If it becomes a success then go to the media with those facts. I'm sure MS will take notice then.
@maniac: Twitter is partly responsible for MS removing their draconian DRM schemes from the XB1. Making a noise affects PR which translates into dollars.
@Dragon Twitter is also greatly responsible for many of people losing their jobs. There's a difference between public and fan outcry of a product and a person crying on Twitter. Especially since we don't know the full story on either side.
"We have seen a lot of companies and especially people go to Twitter and it backfire because they didn't get the whole story or fully understand the situation." "Deal with it."
lol @ squeakiest wheel gets the oil. Gonna jack that quote. Hit the nail on the head mind you.
Microsoft needs a culture change, and fast.
The value of the corporation says otherwise. http://www.forbes.com/compa... They don't need to change anything if they're still making money, hand over fist. "IF IT DONT MAKE DOLLARS, THEN IT DONT MAKE SENSE"
Developers are the main pillars of gaming.
Microsoft has definitely been slow to appease developers lately. Something they really should work on. Nintendo too. Sony's the only one of the big three that really played their cards right with devs this generation.
This is almost as bad as how Sony treated Respawn. Its tough to keep up with all these indie devs coming out of the woodworks. I'm sure some amazing games will come out of this and some will slip through the cracks. However, when you start treating AAA Developers like this...then it's a real issue. I'm sure MS would love to give every indie dev in the world their full undivided attention if they could...it's not really feasible. But somehow everytime one of them says something negative about MS it becomes headline news here. Just keep it fair people. Indie Devs are great, but at the same time...think of them as like new rockstars signing their first major deal. Their heart and soul is REALLY into the project, which is great, but also makes them overly sensitive when it isn't treated like the best thing in the world...understandable, but simply not returning a phone call at this stage could be the difference between getting called "proactive" and "non-responsive". I've worked around enough new "rockstars" (and old ones) that I can spot this psychological behavior miles away. Reality will set in soon. @ Mystic Strummer "How many dev complaints does it take for you to see a pattern?" When it's more legit devs than people leaving Naughty Dog.
Sony treated Respawn by saying they weren't interested in funding the game. That's not unusual and not a big deal. People leaving devs is also not a big deal and happens all the time.
Sony treated Respawn the same as other 3rd party debs: they weren't discussing PS4 with anyone.
Respawn wanted Sony to fund a multiplatform game published by EA aka Microsoft's b*tch. Who would do that? Besides i don't believe a word of that from respawn. You telling me all these indies got Sony's support butrespawn didn't ? Nothing seems fishy there?Only 1 thing kept TF off PlayStation and that was Microsoft's cheque book.
I don't know why I keep clicking on these. We get that sony has better relations, let's move on.
Cool....... why are you replying to me about it?
This is just another one of these articles to announce themselves.... Who had really know much about this ragnar and developer? Now you do....... Seems to be a story like this every week.....
Who? Another small time complaining about MS?
better in what way exactly? i see no difference than the announment of ddrm way back then
better in that their PR blunders are few and far compared to last year. Plus the promotion of Phil is a good decision
concertoine honestly regardless of who is in that position the same agenda is going to stay in place. The way i see it, if microsoft look as if things are changing from the outside people would believe it. just like the same way people believe the cloud will make the console Xamount times more powerfull. Its all a bit of a sham if you ask me. Good entertainment box, but for games the ps4 is the console. and i was a 360 fanatic. so no biased opinion im just saying how it looks. but it would be good if x1 came out with a new "hybrid" before the sony price drop, but ofcorse that would change the hardware completly and with still so many x1 unsold it wont happen. sony has this one wrapped up ...
It seems like they didn't improve so much after all, not yet at least. Dreamfall Chapters will be a unique kind of game and it would be disappointing for many Xbox gamers if Microsoft didn't help the devs porting it to Xbox One.
seems like a lot of these indie developers wants to be coddled. and sure it will be disappointing to lose out on these developers and games for some xbox gamers, but it's not a deal breaker to me.
You're satisfied with Microsoft actively allowing LESS content? Also indies need all the help and ease they can get given how hard and expensive game development can be.
it's not about having less content, i prefer better quality over more quantity. If I could get one stellar AAA or mid-major game release vs 10 indies, I'd take that any day of the week.
This sums up why Sony and Ps4 will win this gen hands down
Because some no name dev is blabbing gibberish?
How many dev complaints does it take for you to see a pattern?
apprently it only works when it's EA , wich is odd considering everyone hates them . Joke aside , there is no winning "a generation" , especialyl so early after launch for both . Sony fans and fanboys especially should remind themselves that the ps3 was "doomed" at first , yet caught up over the years , and in the end
First of all, this guy is established, not a "no name". Second, how do you think the big names got where they are? They all started out as nobodies. Ignoring the nobody little guy is how you miss out on the next Minecraft. Those sort of things come out of nowhere over night.
People talking about "winning generations" now? How pathetic and childish is this industry? Do knuckle heads not understand that competition is good? If either company ever "won" it would be for the worst.
There's no room for logic at N4G!!!! Take your common sense elsewhere!
So will you call MS childish when they have said "we will kill Sony this gen" or "we will win this gen" or will you retreat and prove you're a paid astrosurfer?
yeah that is why the PS1-PS2 days are bad right?
Competition is good. Just wish it was someone other then M$. To this Day PS1 & ps2 are the best systems with some room for argument obviously SNES NES and N64. But really competition is needed and that's a fact. The level of competition needed is yet to be defined though.
Competition means winners and losers, even if only in relation to each other.
Microsoft has switched focus to setting up more first party studios, to make games. Microsoft welcomes indies but the focus is more on bringing AAA games to x box 1. Sony dues to its financials supports indies more than Microsoft. That's just the reality for next gen.
MS has switched focus for sure, but games don't have much to do with it.
E3 will tell us how focused they are on games, not long of wait now.
Very true. It's gonna be good all around this year I think. New consoles have that effect.
Sorry knws but sony have been building their 1st 2nd party relationships for 2 gens now. Ms are playing catch up. The evidence of that is last gen. Look at the fall off for such a 'cash rich' company..... last gen too many flip floppers were screaming exclusives didnt matter and when they were winning goty awards its was then the 'ps3 owners dont buy games' nonsense. Now you see ms finally talking about 1st party growth, some assume sony is resting on its laurels. They have tackled their indy issues of last gen head on and have come out better for it so now indies are predictably downplayed. 'Indystation'.......li ke some how having more of both is bad... some of you guys just can't make up your minds Oh,.....Thanks for the easiest 3 points we've earned at the Emirates in ages
Why o why, It's so true the flip floper on the MS fence are so tiring and annoying. Last gen you had Exclusives don't matter casue MultiPlats sell the most. A missing shadow on a multiplat was the ZOMG 360 version is so much better Indies are awesome and amazing and xbox supports them like crazy so they are awesome and amazing. This Gen Exclusives are all that matter. Xbone has 1 count them 1 retail exclusive more then PS4 and it's so huge now. Less resolution and missing effects don't matter anymore at all it's all about the gameplay. Indies suck boooo These are just 3 of the 20+ goalposts Xbox fans had last year. Sick of them moving it's getting old.
Could be worse. Once upon a time their focus was only on TV and DRM. Now it seems like it's going to be a lot of things, and E3 may very well tell us that games will be a big part of that.
Sony secured their first parties last generation with studios like Media Molecule. Yes, they were idiots for getting rid of Liverpool (WipEout) and Zipper (Socom), but the investment they've made has secured them a good number of first party studios and IPs. It isn't far off to say that they have possibly one of the best first party lineups for this generation. The studios everyone knows and loves in Nintendo, including Game Freak (Pokemon) and HAL (Kirby) are actually mainly second party and not owned by Nintendo, so that's kind of out of this particular discussion. Microsoft on the other hand, often need to resort to, like last gen, moneyhatting third parties for exclusives. Dead Rising 3 is an example of this, which could have easily been on any other system. Something like Deep Down, however, which also involves Capcom, is being co-developed by Sony. It's safe to say that Microsoft have the weakest first party lineup this generation. They've lost Bungie, which is replaced with the inferior 343i. Lionhead have taken into a new direction with dungeon crawling and have no plans on a "proper" Fable 4 (Which would currently be the only thing that would make me want to buy an Xbox), and the key figures of Rare have pretty much left, and now we're stuck with them making Kinect games. Aside from this, they have literally nothing left. Don't get me wrong, I'm happy that they're going to be improving their first party lineup, it was abysmal last generation. But if you're looking for AAA first party titles, you're less likely to see it on the Microsoft front for the while, and more like to see it on the Sony front that have the party resources and IPs to support this.
Micrososft funded the development of dead rising 3 which is why it was exclusive. The way you hate on xbox and defend sony like your getting paid to do it supposively the playstation has games so why dont you go play them instead of trolling and looking dumb in the process.
343i inferior??..really..bungie moved on,.they wanted to branch out and not do halo,..and personally i am glad for them,..weather destiny will prove amazing is to be seen,..but i think it will be..time will tell. A proper fable 4....complain about a game,..once its released,..and you have played it,..surely this makes sense,...you might be surprised?? key figures at rare have left??....yet is it not so that key figures are leaving sonys studios..(you know ......the ones they have left after having to sell them to keep afloat in such turbulent financial problems)..naughty dog etc...yet this is ok as for resources,..microsoft Have the resources,.and begore anyone blabs about microsoft buying devs up and stranglehold talent etc etc,..well im pretty sure the devs are big boys that know what they are getting into,..o and how much richer they will be,..like it or not,..money talks in all walks of life.
Sony has more studios and AAA games in development than MS. Also Sony supported indies better already 3 years ago. You are making the assumption that Sony is paying the indie devs, but all they do is provide support to get the games released and most of them are multiplatform.
Both Sony and Nintendo support the self-publishing model. Why it's taken Microsoft so long to get with the program is beyond me.
Well we have both PS4/X1...and a Wii U, so indies & AAA FTW!! :)))) ...True dat a ton of developers have said less than positive things about Xbox One, that can't be ignored, just like PS3 suffered the developer criticism. I guess we have to deal with it ;/
If i were ms i wouldnt want to work with a company that publicy blasts me either