"The Xbox One hasn't been having a good time as far as graphical prowess goes - several months after its release and it's still faltering behind the PlayStation 4 in terms of high resolution textures, output resolution and frame rate."
if X1 graphic card can support it and MS made it exclusive to their console , then the competition will be on fire between sony and MS xD
If the XB1 hardware was capable of anything more than what we've seen in real world games Microsoft would have shown it off long ago. People clinging to the 'magic SDK update' are just setting themselves up for disappointment. This is just another SDK update for the XB1. No different than any other SDK update that consoles always get through their lifetimes. Microsoft would have had this latest XB1 SDK version running on their own internal development kits for a long time now. If there was some 'magic' unlocking of power they would have been holding press conferences or releasing demo footage showing off these amazing new XB1 graphics features a long time ago.
That's some faulty logic you've got there. It's very very simple. The X1 and Ps4 will improve as the software improves. Their hardware will not get better, but Software always comes after hardware. My GPU supports DX9, 10 and 11. When DX10 came out, suddenly my GPU was pushing out better looking games. Uncharted 1 -> Uncharted 2 -> Uncharted 3. Very simple example of software progression versus hardware. What Fanboys call 'optimisation' is very much more to do with game engines and software improvements. PC gpus were not 'optimised'. But naturally software upgrades came out and older GPUs can take advantage of them too. I'll give an example again, Oblivion versus Skyrim. Same systems, same FPS. Yet PC tech that could run oblivion, also had no problem running Skyrim. Just like the X360 and Ps3 DX12 is a step up from 11. There is literally no reason X1 wouldn't improve from it. Sony don't use DX at all. So no they won't be using it. They'll have their own upgrades with OpenGl. You just have to get that DX12 is not exclusive to one devs skills. It's a system wide improvement for the Xbox 1 Edit - No, what Uncharted 2 had over 1 was much better graphics. Resolution, FPS, graphics. ND managed to increase the graphics without sacrificing the FPS. There's literally nothing you can say to deny that man. Just let it go, you're wrong. Face it. I like how you're picking on Resolution as the deciding factor towards 'next gen'. Again I have to point out Killzone SF's Multiplayer ran at 1080i. Resolution is not the only factor in terms of processing power. Hence Ryse and The order Cause thats exactly what I said right grimlash? I'm simply responding to a guy trying to say DX12 won't improve the X1's graphical capabilities. Because for some 'strange' reason he has to come into an X1 article and downplay what could be and likely will be the X1's first big upgrade in software/ Again I state, their is no reason at all DX12 would not enhance how games will look on the X1. There is simply no argument that can say DX11 is as good as DX12. Well actually, there is one thing I can think of/
Did Uncharted 2 run at 1080p compared to the first Uncharted's 720p? No. Of course not. If Microsoft had this 'magic SDK update' they would be showing off amazing improves in Forza over the massively downgraded game they released or they would be letting the Titanfall devs have early access to it and showing off how the game no longer is stuck rendering at a last gen 792p resolution. These stories and desperately hopeful posts about imminent 'magic SDK updates' are just making the massive graphical power advantage the PS4 has over the XB1 all the more obvious in the eyes of gamers. And it makes it even worse when the inevitable 'magic SDK updates' fail to deliver and XB1 fans switch to the 'we never cared about graphics' damage control.
I agree to a extent, however MS still has something up their sleeve that will enhance the X1
I don,t pretend to know what this means, I don't believe the "OMG dat secret sauce" hype nor do I think microsoft is going to sit on their hands and not continue to upgrade X1 software, SDK, dev tools, etc. I don't understand what the problem is, I'm not sure how much DX12 will improve X1, maybe it will be a small SDK upgrade or something more interesting but I don't understand why some people get pissed off at the idea microsoft is improving the X1???
You wanted Microsoft to show anything the X1 is capable in the first few months after release? That's impossible. The same thing goes for Sony; this gen just started.
No. They would have loved to have shown the full potential of XB1 from launch. However it is very obvious the XB1 was not anywhere near ready for launch. MS were caught off guard by Sony, PS4 wasn't fully ready either for that matter. They have been rushing through the updates and tools to get the Bone to where it should have been from day one. I don't understand why some people are upset by this. I would have thought this is a very good thing that the XB1 is going to get better.
We need a chalkboard for all of the "____ will bring graphical parity to the XBox One". First it was "the hardware gap is not noticable", then it was "Cloud", then it was "blazing fast 32M esRAM", then it was "fine-tuned hardware balance" and "we invented DirectX", then it was "Dev kit upgrade will improve games", then it was "stereo drivers" and whatever else MisterX spews. Now it's "DirectX 12 will improve the X1 graphics".
You sony fans don't realize how scared your comments make you seem. bottom line no one outside of microsoft really knows what the xbox one is truly capable of. So stop with this isn't going to make a different crap, and just say what you rally are thinking. Which is damn I sure hope this doesn't make the Xbox as good or better then PS4... which is where the fear comes in.
Grimlash, I want to carve something out of stone, witn a hammer and a carving chisel. Basic tools, everyone has access to them, but it is very hard, and results are not pretty.... Now I got a CNC machine, with diamond tip coated chisel..... Makes amazing carving.... Point is, tools improve, end results improve.... Why is it that games at end of a consoles generation look as good as next gens first games? You think thats a fluke every time??? Ahhh typical dedicatedtogamers. Never ever brought something new, or even positive to any post. Please change name to dedicatedtobitterness, and when you get upset, post another blog about Xbox fanboys, why they make you cry all night....
Some people are so desperate to believe this is some scecret sauce. Sad fact is, console dev can already "code to metal" that is far more effective. Dx12 is just general api and is not efficient. So no. This isnt magical secret sauce. Yes x1 will improve over time, but so will ps4 if not more since it does have that huge power gap.
@Grimlash Can't wait for Nintendo to put out a new SDK for the Wii U so it can put out Xbox One level graphics. Right??? Sure, if Wii U supports the new API DirectX12 or something similar hidden within its specs like MS supposedly does then yeah. Or if Wii U has a build coming up showcasing its capabilities on how Wii U's power can be tapped further in some fashion. It's obvious you weren't paying attention. I'm attacking your seriously poor logic because Nintendo aren't software engineers experts/engineers like MS. So that's a fail statement right there.
How can they show it off ages ago when no one bot even insiders knew dx 12 was coming
@Angelic Ice No it cant. Lolol. How are you that desperate? WiiU hardware is too weak. Just like X1 hardware is too weak. DX11 stuff cant even get used on X1. Look at tesselation. Cant run on x1. Also, Dx11 and Dx12 stuff will be on ps4 as well. It is just software thay gets ported. Go google "opengl tessellation" and goofle "dx11 tessellation" It is pure delusion that somehow reduce graphics power gap. Lol
@Pogmathoin the analogy that you stated seem to make sense but the one thing you forgot to mention is the type of rock you are carving into. The tools do not matter depending on the type of rock. Such as trying to carve into Marble. I guess my point is is that if the hardware is difficult it doesn't matter what tool you use. New tools can make a dent but it doesn't mean it will carve perfectly.
@gameon1985 Really kid? no one outside of Microsoft really knows what the Xbox one is truly capable of? Really? cuz i think we all know what its capable of, and its lower res and lower performance consistently! Talk to us when you come back to reality. Also, you must be scared, bring up fear. @AngelicIceDiamond Really? you didnt get the analogy? really? Talk about bad comprehension abilities.
wow i have visions of a kid with his fingers in his ears "NAH NAH NAHHH I CAN'T HEAR YOUUU!
sorry deleted my comment . It seems that the bubble snatchers are at play
Seems that way at least for specific threads like these. I said the most horrible thing imaginable in a WiiU watchdogs thread that earned me my first trolling mark in the 3 or so years I've come to this site. I simply said you can't blame ubisoft for the delay as games of this type do not sell well on the WiiU. Not sure what your comment was but if it's anything close to the truth but negative , you'll lose a bubble. This site is a horrible place for conversation.
Yea I said "is this the animal hospital? Cause there's so many butthurt ponies"(in another thread)And I loose a bubble. I don't even know how to get more lol It was just a funny joke,, I have nothing against people who love Sony or gaming, if u love gaming then your ok in my books lol
Yes, if the Xbox One can do Ray Tracing then this will be one fierce console war Ray tracing creates photo realistic visuals by simulating light unlike anything currently available on consoles Phil Spencer has already said they're experimenting with it and that basically confirms that this is no low range gpu in the system Sony forced Microsoft's hand and MS weren't ready to ship last year and that's why the slight difference in multiplats is there
What makes you think that Ps4 wouldn't be capable of ray tracing ?
I believe Killzone uses some type of ray tracing methods on some of the surfaces. I remember it being mentioned in the slideshow they showed way back comparing it to Killzone 3.
The drawback on ray tracing is the amount of processing power that is needed. Not saying this is correct, but in theory Microsoft would be able to pull off ray tracing (and Sony wouldn't) is because of 'the power of the cloud' and Microsoft's 300,000 servers for xbox. Take that with a grain of alt. .but that's at least what Microsoft has been angling.
I thought the PS3 did ray tracing for games... What makes this new?
@Scott the only I think to pull it off was warhawks for the clouds.
Forget about raw Ray Tracing. Ray Tracing requires HUGE AMOUNT of procesing power. Even today the high-end PC's SLI Titan's CAN'T run Ray Tracing in full force. Xbox One logo is ADDED FEW DAYS LATER after DX12 announcement for GDC. This is original picture : http://ngxn.files.wordpress... I believe that is just marketing for Xbone to hype Xbone fans.
having experminted with raytrace software it is very powerful but also costly in resources mainly as it resolves over time as more rays are cast, apis will help but there are 6 less cu in xb1 then in ps4. no software will fix that, in the same way that no software will make a gt450 run like a titan
Its only logical, from the way things have played out. I feel Microsoft has always been aware of their software strength which they always had as indicated with x360. The GPU of X1 definitely seems different to ps4. Thus its just the flip side to what happen last gen when implementation of similar development process on x360 and ps3 didnt benefit the ps3 at all and needed its own approach. Time will tell either way but i like the direction of things. At the end we the end users benefit the most.
My calender alarm went off today reminding me of a Xbone announcement, is this it.
I'm assuming that's the reason why MS went with the cpu overclocking and such
Would make sense seeing as they've solved the CPU overhead problem that Mantle touted it had finally accomplished.
Show the games, please stop with technical fantasies, aka power of the cloud The same to sony, stop overhyping the ps4 architecture anddeliver the games
If true this confirms Microsoft indeed had a secret deal with AMD to produce a low/mid GPU direcx12 ready graphic card. Its looks like for Microsoft was caught of guard by Sony when they announced early the PS4. Directx12 is a genuine sign Microsoft has not revealed everything about the capabilities of the console.
oh god.. Please stop.It's guys like you with the wild conspiracy theories that will keep this xbox one secret sauce dream going all gen.Just when things were finally starting to settle down and the rabid PS fanboys were content with their gloating the fire is being re-ignited. Let me just enjoy my xbox in peace
Its logic friend not a conspiracy. A video card that doesn't support the DX12 APIs will not be able to run the DX12 APIs That's a well known fact to PC techs! The card in the x box 1 is supposedly a 7000 series Radeon card with directx11 support. You can't a patch directx12 to a 7000 series card! as the card would not be suitable. So your left with the believe AMD must have customised and designed a new graphic card for Microsoft, that can handle directx12 features?
@KNWS How dare you rebutt fanboy dreams with fact?!
First of all, no one actually knows if DX12 will require new hardware. Second of all, DX12 is so far touting decreased CPU overhead, a problem which is nonexistent in the Xbox One and even PS4 because the developers can program direct to metal from the start. The Xbox logo in the DX12 poster is possibly because DX12 is a derivative from the DX11.x (Xbone's low-level API). Third, DX12 is geared towards PCs, because PCs are the ones with problems with CPU overhead. Sorry to burst your bubble, but the possibility of the Xbox One getting some magical API upgrade and outperforming the PS4 are slim to none. There could be some SLIGHT improvements, but nothing as major as being able to render 1080p all of a sudden.
I havent seen one person state that this update would help the Xbox One outperform the Ps4, the fact that YOU stated it speaks volumes, and also explains the reason behind all the salt from you people.
**Correction** PC's with weak processors like those using Intel i3's. Real world data benchmarks with Mantle API vs. DirectX 11 API show that Intel i7's are actually so powerful that they bottleneck the GPU under DirectX 11! Even with all the overhead issue,the power of i7's overcome this and feed data to the GPU's to the point that the GPU is at 100% utilization at all times. What this new API will allow, is for people who cannot afford i7's to be able to use cheaper processors that are weaker, but can allow greater utilization of a more powerful GPU. That is why we PC guys talk about "system balance". A balanced system as an example for the high end is an i7-3930K paired with an AMD R9-290X. This model i7 or larger is the only CPU's capable of feeding that video card such that the video card is always at 100% utilization. A PC newb might screw up by using an i5 series and run into a situation where the video card is only being 70% used. The good news is that with these new API's, system balance will not longer by such a big issue because of reduce CPU overhead. This should help bring about cheaper PC gaming systems. Because let me tell you, an i7-3930K is EXPENSIVE!!!!!!!!!!!!! You can buy almost two PS4 for the price of this processor!!!
A new version of DX isn't going to do anything which a new version of PS4-optimised OpenGL couldn't. The hardware is what it is. Both platforms will see steady software/dev kit progress.
Can we please stop that the PS4 uses OpenGL. It doesn't. It runs a proprietary Sony API which is beyond DX11. If anything it probably is already on DX12 level (that said, it includes an additional GPGPU stage in the render pipeline). Dx12 is just an API update which probably integrates some XO extensions into a new version (12). And that's that. It sure doesn't improve what the XO can handle.
@Ju It uses a custom branch of OpenGL. Just like the PS3 did, in my understanding. It's based on the same OpenGL source, trimmed down and made more console specific. Where are you getting your info?
Gotta love that Xbox secret sauce! First it was the cloud, then a secret chip in the console, now it's DX12 that's going to make up the difference between the specs for fanboys.
You realize the only idiots who are clamoring about this DX12 being "Secret Sauce" are you idiots right?
@jmac It's pretty funny actually. And once they get it through there head that this isn't going to make the xbone as powerful as the PS4 they will make up some other junk.
Grow up please.
I will grow up and when I look at you I will throw up, and when your mom comes around the corner she can lick it up.
what what what? How old are you jmac exactly? My guess is 15-17yo.
Software-wise it is certainly a great thing if Microsoft can use new techniques and get more from the Xbones GPU, but it will never change the amount of shadercores and ROP's and those are the among the real limitations and the importance of that won't show for some time yet, but it will show.
I heard Dx12 cures cancer and hiv.
Anything xbox can do playstation can do better due to opengl can use features thats on dx12
If true, great news for the Xbox One, but I won't believe it until I see it.
"Microsoft apparently has a deal with AMD but it means that the 7000 series Radeon isn’t what the Xbox One is packing." - It's Sea Island like the PS4's. Which is a rebrand of the 7000 series. "Just like our friends we're based on the Sea Islands family. We've made quite a number of changes in different parts of the areas. The biggest thing in terms of the number of compute units, that's been something that's been very easy to focus on. It's like, hey, let's count up the number of CUs, count up the gigaflops and declare the winner based on that." http://www.eurogamer.net/ar... The co-processors could be what the update will enable to be better utilised. Like MS said they took a different route to Sony and this could be what it is. Sony went with GPGPU compute for their customisation of their GPU. http://www.vgleaks.com/worl... Anyone thinking it's activating dormant hardware to make it 3-4 times more powerful than PS4 is in for disappointment. You think MS would sell their console at the price it is considering they have already said they were close/breaking even with each console and the fact we know from cost estimates that the XB1 cost more to manufacture mainly due to kinect estimated at $75. Low level access to the GPU *code to metal* has been on the XB1 for a while so you can scratch that off as secret sauce or major thing with this update for XB1. It's major for PC/Mobile/Tablet if MS's teaser for the session is to beleived --> http://www.neogaf.com/forum...
The Agree vs. Disagree ratio on your comment makes me lol. Only on n4g...
First Cloud Azure gonna make Xbox One 4x faster, powerful and 4x memory through cloud. After that, SDK update magical gives 1080p on all games, but now DX12 shall make X1 games better than PS4 in terms of framerate and resolution output on multiplatform games. Which of these is gonna be? Im tired of this cloud can do this, SDK update that and now DX12 is the Xbox One savior and yes I own a Xbox One, PS4, Wii U and PC. I believe it when I see it.
Why do you even care? If you don't believe it, why not just ignore it?
Its funny to observe. The detractors have all the cards at the minute because the proof is on their side. The x1 hasn't matched the ps4 on multiplats and its only 1080 exclusive was downgraded. Since the start, there have been a numerous amount of levelers that have been touted by fans and more aggressively by fanboys. I've heard the same guys saying resolution doesnt matter clamouring to every article like this professing the gaps closing and not only using them as theory but as proof. Sorry people, the only proof is in the pudding no rhetoric can change that. If its true then massive egg on the detractors and non believers' faces, myself included. If its some more ol bs, LIKE ALL THE OTHERS, then its another disappointment for the guys who will say they didn't care and resolution doesn't matter AGAIN. Like I said... funny to observe
The plot thickens....whatever all this means we will finally get to know when all will be revealed at GDC and E3. The DX team are definitly keeping a tight lid on this till GDC..according to their tweet the relationship between dx12 and xbx one will be revealed at GDC, so guys pls stop trying to downplay this, there is no way Ms would build Dx12 without making sure the xbx ones architecture wasnt fully compatible with it. I also believe at that event MS will show off an xbx one game running on DX12.
I'd love to see Halo 5 or Quantum Break being demonstrated using DX12 technology at GDC
i am actually looking forward to it in that respect. Imagine the glory.. but hey not to get on the hype train yet i will hold my expectations till i am sure before i "jump in"
why people are so stupid, if dx12 really can improve xbone's graphics abilities, you think they will wait until now to utilize it? Let PS4 has a great head start over them and sell tons more? They need to reduce the xbone's price if it is really more powerful?
Maybe because DX12 isn't ready yet?...
"why people are so stupid"
Might i add that it's rumored from anonymous developers that the xbox one is in fact faster than the ps4 when it comes to raytracing. "“Let’s say you are using procedural generation or raytracing via parametric surfaces – that is, using a lot of memory writes and not much texturing or ALU – Xbox One will be likely be faster.” http://gamerant.com/differe...
I don't care... The xbox has been much more fun than my ps4 easy. I'm sorry but for now the ps4 is just no fun. I beat tomb raider on ps4 and had a chance to play the xbox one version, I wasn't blown away by the difference, if someone didn't point out specific areas I would have never known, and even though I've seen it, I think it's possible there was no difference it might have just been in my head. With that said, if it's that small of difference I pick the system with much more functionality and (for now) many more games.
I doubt only microsoft will use direct x 12 to make games. Why do people not think devs won't use the software across all platforms?