Digital Foundry on the business case and the production realities.
"Removing Kinect may please the core gamer, but the peripheral is there for a reason. Microsoft sees it as the key component in its media integration strategy." Kinect is one of if not the main reason why the Xbox One costs so much. I get that Microsoft wanted to push the device on every console so developers would use it but as of right now, it's simply a navigation tool for many. I believe it would have been smarter for Microsoft to release a Kinect bundle at launch for $499 AND a Kinectless bundle for $399. If the Kinect bundle didn't sell nearly as much as the other, then that should be really telling.
They'll get rid it "they don't call us the 180s for nothing"
You are right. I believe they should have gone that route,doing so would have given consumers more choice. They will announce a version for 399 or less. Not sure what they will drop but gamespot says they were informed by an insider that the current version(with kinect) will drop to $399.which means the rumored discless version(with kinect) may be well below that price maybe $359.
Don't think they will get rid of the kinect in the first year, because: It will fragment their market. It is main differentiator between the two consoles. Promised to developers that every x1 console will have kinect functionality. Hdmi in (console) and ir blaster (kinect) are important to media functionality of xb1. mass production allows them to reduce cost of kinect. X1 sales are still doing well, though ps4 sales are doing better. Removing kinect from xb1 will most likely result in another marketing fiasco. Gamers will see it as a sign of weakness. The name 'one' will make even less sense. It will still be the weaker console but without the advantages of kinect.
But the console was built around it. They can't just flip a switch.
@Applejack I completely agree, the one thing I'd say differently is it would be smart to remove Kinect at least a year later, than at launch. If Kinect is Microsoft's vision, then having it mandatory for the first year means that however many console sales they sell that's a guaranteed number of Kinects out there, which will help them gain support somewhat. Eventually Kinect is going to have to come out of the XBO, but I don't see it happening until holiday 2015 - holiday 2016 at the earliest (they should have 20+ million sold, and that should be a good amount to get people supporting Kinect). Also by 2015 price cuts should be happening for the PS4 if Sony decides to, and MS is going to have to react. A $300 - $350 PS4 vs. $500 XBO isn't going to happen, because the PS4 will destroy it in sales if a $200 price gap ever occurred. My current guess for MS plan with the XBO is: Holiday 2014: (Holding out to see if market share breaks away from them) $499 console bundles with 1 game, an extra controller, 1 - 3 month(s) of XBL Holiday 2015: (DDR3 price drop as DDR4 mass production begins which means a $50 price drop at most, but they may have to bite the bullet and do a $100 price drop, and take a loss) $449/$399 console bundles with 2 games, an extra controller, 3 - 12 months of XBL. Holiday 2016: (Sales should be over 30 million meaning Kinect can finally be sold separately, APU production cost drops, DDR3 being phased out, this basically means MS is making full profit off the console from now on.) $399 Kinect bundle + 1 game and an extra controller $299 Kinect-less SKU
How about they not remove Kinect and people who don't want to pay $500 don't buy it, problem solved. MSFT is about profit margins, if they truly wanted to outsell ps4 they would have undercut the price from the start.
That doesn't solve the problem of people who want an XB1 but don't want the Kinect, or people who don't want to spend $500 for the system. You're right about one thing, though: Microsoft is all about profit. Moreso than any other company in gaming. It's actually one of the (many) reasons so many gamers take issue with them.
@Hicken They all about profit if they were not they would be in bussiness.
For me to purchase one I hope it gets redesigned (I'm not in love with the cable box look), and the camera taking out with a lower price. If they somehow remove the blu ray drive I will definitely not be purchasing the system. Let's hope those rumors remain just that rumors.
Remove Kinect and make the price $350 and I'm in
With all the shit you talk about xbox I doubt you are ever gonna buy an xbox! But yeah a $350 Kinectless sku would be nice.
but if the rumors are true like Halo 2 aniversary and gears of war in 2016... MS is going to remove the bluray disc instead of the kinect and thats a no no....
It makes sense as well since its less powerful than the PS4. Doesn't mean that its a bad console though just an overpriced one.
Personally, I'd get an xbox one if kinect was removed. I was hardcore 360 last gen and there's still a few stragglers on my friends list that went x1 instead of ps4 as the majority of my friends (local friends) did. I picked up the astro a50 the other day for $300 but personally I cannot justify spending $500 on a less powerful console that includes a peripheral I'd never use
And this is the voice of myself and many right here. Only difference is my PS3 and 360 were loved about the same. 360 took home the first couple of years, PS3 took 2009 then on.
Remove Kincet give me a 1TB HDD and make the price the same as the PS4 and I'm in.
You have to wonder Microsoft is reading forums and the Internet because it seems the people do not want to Kinnect. I have an Xbox 1 and the gimmick of connect last about 2 days. MS is going to lose a lot of gamers this Gen.... And once someone buys one next Gen console... Really no sense in buying the other.... Unless you have time and money to burn. Make an Xbox One without Kinnect for $399 and sell Kinnect separately..... Or just drop the price to $399 altogether.
The reason that the Kinect will not be removed is because it is a part of the console. If they took Kinect away I would just buy a PS4. It defines the console. It is also only 3 months after launch. There will be games and apps for it and not just fully motion games. Lots of games and apps will be able to use it to add nuance to the game while still using the controller for the main play mechanics. Here is a good example of a simple idea that could be taken up by a developer and brought to maturity. http://ca.ign.com/articles/... As far as MS reading the forums they would be foolish to do so. The vast majority of the purchasing public do not read forums or care to read them. They get there information from traditional media. We as forum readers are a subculture and represent a very small minority. The Kinect is going no where despite what the few core gamers want. I know many people who have bought an Xbox One and 8 out of 10 say that they love the Kinect after getting used to it and would not like it if it was removed and that really represents the majority of people who buy consoles not the forum trolls who would not like it if it spat money out at them every day.
Well... As of now... I only use Kinext to turn my Xbox on. That's it. And I understand Kinect is integrated into the system.... And it would be hard to sell one without it.... But like I said. MS is going to lose a lot of costumers this gen..... Because the majority don't care for it. Edit * And the video you posted.... Just wack. Looks cool, and would be cool to try.... For about 5 minutes.
Agreed. I'm sure Microsoft is working on apps and games to utilize Kinect and perhaps find that one killer application that will make Kinect a must have.
@etownone You fail to understand that there isn't even a majority of Xbox One owners on N4G that don't like the Kinect let alone the majority of non core gamers that will buy the console (note I said Xbox One owners, not PS4, 360, WiiU, etc. owners). Yes, there are some people who don't like it. Some people don't like spaghetti either but that does not mean others don't like it. The majority of owners (not bloggers, websites, etc. looking for clicks) but owners happen to enjoy using the Kinect. I happen to use the Kinect for Dead Rising and BF4 and it works great. The leaning in BF4 works well but I admit that turning your head is kind of useless but so what. I use the features that work for me. I agree that the game looks cool and also agree that I would get annoyed with it after a few minutes. But neither you or I are the target audience for that game and it was developed in 48 hours by an Indie. The point of me posting that video is the possibilities that no one has even thought up yet for the Kinect. On top of that we have Twitch coming soon and it will let anyone insert video of themselves into their streams without purchasing anything else. Not everyone will use that feature but that is OK because it is not the only feature.
Agreed bin Kinect
Yeah, kill kinect, keep Blu-ray they are games I want to play, but I refuse to pay £430 for it considering I've got PS4 that is currently doing better on the multi plat front, I could go out and buy it, DR3 and Ryse right now if I wanted to, it's not that I can't afford it I just refuse to, but I will get it for Sunset overdrive and quantic break (hopefully it'll be cheaper by their launch) I won't buy second hand. Edit: having just read it, Infamous and Drive club are coming soon as well, so I don't agree titanfall will come out as this major AAA game that will smash the sails up, what would you do? £470. or £30-40 for it? I'd pay the latter (for me, on PC).
Who cares? It won't sell, people want retail physical discs, period. Only time I buy digital is when their cheap.
I buy digital when there's no other option, but I'm not sending a good message because sometimes when those all digital titles come to disc later I buy them again.
Recall all units slap an intel cpu and nvidia gpu jobs a goodun. keep it at the same price point as the PS4.
you are a true moron
Lol.. keeping it the same price as PS4 with intel and nvidia parts....
It would be cheaper if Microsoft developed a steambox. :)
ROFL... You gotta be kidding right?
I love how the same people who love to point out the resolution differences for multiplats say they will buy a kinectless xbox for the same price as a ps4. Why would you buy lower spec system for the same price?
"Why would you buy lower spec system for the same price?" For the same reason why most people visit this website... GAMES!
Breeze, I dont think Jew was downing xbox! But the guys who are Xbox haters using Kinectless argument to stealth troll! And yes the reason I'm buying an XB1 is for the MS exclusives games. Not worried about 1080p/60fps or Kinect!
Yes, it happens all the time! These people have no intention of ever getting an XB1. Yet they always on every Xbox article with something to say!!
... actually, you're wrong on that. A lot of people, myself included, were at least receptive to buying an Xbox this generation. You can blame Microsoft for pushing DRM and forcing the Kinect for a LOT of people's current disinterest in the console. Oh, and the fact that it's weaker but costs more. A lot of people wouldn't mind buying the system, but they don't want to pay for a peripheral they have no desire to use. Likely, they'd only use it for Microsoft's exclusives- since the specs Mike mentions would lead one to the logical conclusion that you'd buy those on PS4- but they have to get past a device they don't want and the high price it influences before they could even get to owning the system. Making blanket statements about how they "were never gonna buy the XB1 in the first place" is just an easy way for you to ignore that Microsoft has screwed up and put people in a position where they don't want the whole package MS is selling.
I like the halo series and other scifi shooters but the resolution problems bother me.
They can in 12 months from now...but a newer SKU at this point is a disaster. MS would be wiser to take a hit on each unit by reducing the price to the equivalent of £399 worldwide. Within 12 months from now MS need to find ways of reducing the units size. It's just too big for the power it has, and Japan/Asia don't like massive bulky devices.
Next E3 they will probably release a new SKU. Now the SMART sku they should release is a $350 Kinectless XB1. A dumb thing they would do is upgrade the HD to 1TB and drop the price of the 500gb to $450. All the reports of a discless XB1 for $399 I believe is nonsense because blu-ray drives are not worth 100 bucks lol... more like 20-30 which that difference in price gets offset by the 1TB upgrade. There one and only good option is to remove Kinect.
The blu ray is probably less than $20 seeing as they get a manufacturers discount for buying bulk!
The thought has crossed my mind to get a Xbox One mostly because PS4 is always out of stock and X1 is readily available everywhere, but I just can't bring myself to pay more for a console knowing there is a more powerful console for $100 less with better games coming out this year in my opinion. It also doesn't help the fact that the Kinect is meant to enhance the Xbox One's media functions, yet I still feel like PS4 is the better media server as well and made more simpler.
what better games, I'm curious? I'm not a fan of infamous and besides that none of the big name exclusives have been confirmed for this year.
Well just about every game that comes out this year will be in better resolution and have a better frame rate on PS4. Also graphically the games are more superior because Xbox One gpu is closer to Radeon HD 7790 which is entry level and PS4 is on par with HD 7870 and PS4 is indeed 50% more powerful even if it's not immediately noticeable at launch. Maybe you don't understand what all that means but those are the facts. So to answer your question I guess all games on PS4 will be better.
No Kinect and no disc drive. They could probably do $300 like that. Just would be an even worse console.
I know we all say we can do with kinect. But most of us were sold on the xbox one for the features that only kinect can provide.
discless drive will only meet a small market and those people probably aready have an xboxone.
Its appears Microsoft shot themselves in the foot with the xbox 1
Everyone is acting like Microsoft is on the verge of bankruptcy because of the Xbox One. Don't forget guys that the XB1 is also breaking records along with the PS4, both consoles are selling more then ANY of their predecessors. It is an amazing feat. Just because Sony is selling more PS4's than MS is XB1's doesn't mean they need to go to threat level midnight....... And if all this stuff ends up being true, then MS is REALLY pathetic.
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