Wedbush Securities Senior Analyst Michael Pachter was asked what's his opinion on the possibility of Microsoft selling its Xbox Division and his reply was quite clear cut.
Because Pachter's opinion matters.... /s
You better believe ps4 fans will flock to this article and take his comments for gold, when just a few days ago they said he was an idiot for thinking XB1 could sell 10 million. @Gamba I agree Kinect is awesome and sales have been fine. MSFT should only lower the price if the their goal is to catch Sony in the sales race. Before you call me stupid to some companies profit margins are more important. Also how does 2 kinect sports games sell 7 million if nobody wants a kinect. The hardcore gamer is not the largest demographic. I doubt even a fraction of the consoles care about half the stuff that is argued on these blogs.
He didn't say anything negative though.
Theres always one...
Somebody always has to try and turn these conversations into fanboy wars. For this thread, that somebody was you. Congratulations, here's your cookie crumb.
Meltdown LOL :)
I keep hearing people say that Xbox is being outsold well its obvious one is 13 countries and the other 48 enough with stupid pissing contest. There is no comparison until Xbox decides to launch in other territories.
That came from left field but ok... i get what your saying but your still dead wrong. Sony has outsold ms in every country it has released including the almighty safe haven for ms that is the US. Im sorry bro but ms cant be anything without the us on there side. Just eccept the fact that sony came out swinging and won the brawl. Take a deep breath, get that thought process of yours flowin again and accept facts.
matters more then yours or anyones on here for that matter. he is in the know and we aren't.
I just need to say this. Why does everyone say that the price is this huge problem? I understand its 100$ more but it does come with another piece of hardware that really compliments the console. It is apart of the console, it was made to work with it perfectly. The price doesnt seem like the biggest problem because the numbers we have seen the X1 is selling perfectly fine. Both the X1 and PS4 are both selling extremely well, this doesnt seem like a problem. Maybe i just see things different i dont know.
It's not a huge problem at all. I just believe eventually when they are able to drop the price, you'll see more sells. It's not that it comes with the kinect. It's the some people just don't want to spend $499.99 plus tax on that console. Microsoft got off a rough start but they are doing well now :).
Microsoft hasn't proven it's worth yet. Some people don't care for voice commands and the games that are out for it have been panned by critics and were received poorly.
What games besides Ryse? Forza and Dead Rising had good reviews and I have heard nothing but good things about both.
Aces17, I'm talking about kinect. Not the X1 itself. But I'll answer your question anyways. Lococycle, Fighter Within, and Crimson Dragon were also received poorly. Ryse wasn't the only game. @Syntax-Error, Resogun by itself is was better received than any X1 games, check Metacritic. Critics like it more than Forza and DR3.
So PS4 has proven it's worth? Please tell me why you think so, because last time I checked PS4's launch titles were worse than XBOX ONE's. There wasn't even a fighting title in there to balance out the games released. Go sit in a corner somewhere
er except there was a fighting game , Injustice , one even missing on xb1 so far . And more of those are even announced on ps4 and not coming on xb1 . just pointing that out , for the fighting games part
Sorry dude, Microsoft did not come out with killzone and knack. Lol. They came out with ryse, forza , deadrising and killer instinct . You know, Sony did conceded to Microsoft at E3 saying that " you won the games battle but we got the fans" interesting ! Some people call themselves gamers. I do like my ps4, I just find myself using my Xbox more often.
@baka Are you referring to dropkick ? Lol. I wouldn't brag about that.
@konsoruMasuta Really what games have been panned. Last I looked Forza, Killer Instinct, DeadRising 3 even RYSE did better then the competitions games. Please don't spread lies it does not suit you.
Since Sony's Playstation 4 and Microsoft's Xbox One share such a significant, huge library of next-gen games, Xbox One being priced higher is a problem. Similar to when Sony's Playstation 3 was priced much higher than Microsoft's Xbox 360 because of it's bluray player. Nonetheless, the Playstation 3 was the cheapest bluray player at the time. Additionally, Kinect 2.0 is not built into Xbox One and is not significantly useful within or outside gaming, which supports notions of its uselessness. What do you think?
Microsoft put to much investment into Kinect and it hurts there overall sales with the price being $100 more. To me that is the biggest reason along with other smaller reasons PS4 is out selling X1.
Xbox is more than a hardcore gaming device. Kinect is a big part of why Xbox1 is selling very well, Not the reason why Sony sells more PS4's. PS4 is selling better because it has been accepted buy many gamers as the more powerful machine at a cheaper price. Xbox1 is selling well because it offers features that are different from PS4 or does them better. It also happened to start with a better launch line-up with the promise of some more well anticipated exclusives like 'Titan Falls'. There will be some plenty Kinect games done the line. Kinect was the last piece of hardware to be completed on X1. They are still trying to rap their heads around it. Kinect Sports Rivals will be the first to try and showcase the motion benefits that Kinect2 brings. Right now we only have Xbox fitness, Wave racer part of KSR. Its only been 2 months.
@Bigpappy Understood. Xbox One is selling well because of Xbox, not Kinect 2.0 at all, that's why its forcibly bundled and not sold separately. You wrote, "Xbox1 is selling well because it offers features that are different from PS4 or does them better." Care to elaborate? Outside of an HDMI input, what are the other "features" offered by Microsoft's Xbox One that are different or better than Sony's Playstation 4? You also wrote,"It also happened to start with a better launch line-up with the promise of some more well anticipated exclusives like 'Titan Falls'." That's subjective as is mine. I only like Dead Rising 3 but I like Killzone Shadow Fall's multiplayer and Resogun. Every opinion is different. Nonetheless, objectively, the multiplatform games performed better on the Sony's Playstation 4. About Titan Fall, its available on PC for Windows XP, Windows Vista and Windows 7, in addition to being available on Microsoft's Xbox 360. Any incentive to purchase an Xbox One has been dwarfed by Titan Fall's expansive availability. In fact, if you don't own a console or PC yet, it's cheapest to buy a "used" Xbox 360 w/ cables for $140 to experience Titan Fall, totaling to $200. Titan Fall should have been strictly an Xbox One exclusive to sell even more consoles. Exclude it across the board or not at all because most people will chose cheaper alternatives. You wrote,"There will be some plenty Kinect games done the line. Kinect was the last piece of hardware to be completed on X1. They are still trying to rap their heads around it. Kinect Sports Rivals will be the first to try and showcase the motion benefits that Kinect2 brings." In my opinion, I don't envision any developer ever producing a "great" game for Kinect 2.0. There wasn't one with the first Kinect and not a single Kinect 2.0 launch game as well. Personally, I've watched my younger sister use Kinect 2.0 with Just Dance 2014 and it is...disastrously funny. Fighter Within, which requires Kinect 2.0, is not only an embarrassing game developed by Ubisoft, a great developer/publisher, but its strangely mocking Kinect 2.0 by how truly awful it is. So far, Titan Fall will not use Kinect, at all. The Kinect features in Dead Rising 3 are basically non-existent. What do you think?
Ok. I say the launch line up for X1 was better because of the better verity their offered (Fighter; Hack and slash; open world zombie; Fitness; kids; Kinect game (some really bad). So I really don't see it as subjective at all. Multi plats perform better on PS4. Yes, a benefit of more RAW graphic power. But it would be a much bigger deal if the Xbox versions were no also performing well (when Xbox owners play these games, they look and play very well actually). Kinect has some people who just hate its existence. That's fine, but when people get their X1's, most fully get why it is included and is actually a selling tool for X1. Titan Falls will sell X1's just like COD sold 360's and is still doing so. Console gamers always had PC's, but prefer to play their FPS on consoles. 360 version might be good (I am not familiar with the developer), but the X1 version will sell to those who needed a good reason to upgrade and have the funds to do so. You wrote: " In my opinion, I don't envision any developer ever producing a "great" game for Kinect 2.0. There wasn't one with the first Kinect and not a single Kinect 2.0 launch game as well." Now that was very subjective. Have you ever heard of "Kinect Sports and Dance Central"? Those games and Kinect Adventure were actually all "Great" Kinect games. There are other very good ones too, but I sense you will disagree automatically so...
@Bigpappy " X1 was better because of the better verity their offered (Fighter; Hack and slash; open world zombie; Fitness; kids; Kinect game (some really bad)." Sony's Playstation 4 exclusive retail launch games were Killzone Shadow Fall(Shooter), Knack(Action Platformer), and Injustice: Gods Among Us Ultimate Edition(Fighter). Besides Trine 2: Complete Story launching on Nintendo WiiU, Sony's Playstation 4 exclusive digital only launch games were Trine 2: Complete Story(Action,Puzzle,Co-op,Plat former), Sound Shapes(Platformer, Music Creator, Indie), Super Motherload(RPG, Procedurally-generated, Co-op, Indie), Flower(Indie, Cross Buy for PS3 + PS Vita), DC Universe Online(Free To Play, Massive Online Action Game), Black Light Retribution(Free To Play, Shooter), and War Frame(Free To Play, Action, Shooter, RPG). Sony's Playstation 4 PS+ launch games were RESOGUN(Shoot'em Up, Indie) and Contrast(Platformer). I believe there is more variety on Sony's Playstation 4. About multiplatforms games,"...Xbox owners play these games, they look and play very well actually." You're absolutely right that multiplatform games perform well on Microsoft's Xbox One. Nonetheless, they just perform better on Sony's Playstation 4 with higher resolutions and/or frame rates for $100 less. "Titan Falls will sell X1's" and you're right. What up for dispute though is the quantity. I would have been forced to purchase Microsoft's Xbox One if Titan Fall were truly exclusive to that platform. Its only not on Sony's Playstation 4 and Playstation 3. But I own a Gaming PC and an Xbox 360 as alternative options. Personally, I would have bought an Xbox One to just play Titan Fall, if it were only exclusive to it. Recall that I wrote, it's cheapest to buy a "used" Xbox 360 w/ cables for $140 to experience Titan Fall, totaling to $200. However, I'm renting Titan Fall on Microsoft's Xbox 360 until Respawn releases their initial DLC and if I still like it, then I will officially purchase it on my PC at a discount through Green Man Gaming's website. "Have you ever heard of "Kinect Sports and Dance Central"? Those games and Kinect Adventure were actually all "Great" Kinect games. There are other very good ones too, but I sense you will disagree automatically so..." Yes, I've heard and seen these games but I personally don't like or play Kinect Sports or Dance Central. My younger sister stopped playing Dance Central and Just Dance 2014 for Kinect 2.0. She's 7 and my father nor I talked her out it. She didn't like it. There's literally 100+ only-Kinect games on Xbox 360 and about 99% are truly awful. The first Kinect not only came bundled with a game, much like the Wii console being bundled with the Wii Sports game, but the attachment rate is less than 1:1 for the first Kinect. Which means for every Kinect sold there is only, on average, less than one game purchased for it, because of the bundled game. That's why Kinect 2.0 is forcibly bundle with Xbox One to inspire publishers and developer to invest in attempting to create "good" to "great" only-Kinect games. When most-to-all, non-Kinect games don't need it and only-Kinect 2.0 games turn out like Fighter Within, Just Dance 2014, or the rest of only-Kinect 1.0 games on Microsoft's Xbox 360, then Kinect is useless outside of snapping and browsing the UI, in my opinion. What do you think?
Hey Daddy, I bought an X1 because of Kinect, i loved the first Kinect. I really don't understand it when ppl say there were absolutely no good games for it. I loved loads of them. kinect Sports Kinect Sports 2 Child of Eden Kinect Adventures Gunstringer Tiger Woods Golf There were others I liked too. I still play Golf and Darts on the original kinect.
@akissfromdaddy You obviously don't own an Xbox One, I'm reading all the questions you are posting to bigdaddy and I can't help but chuckle. I have both machines in front of me right now and I've been playing since Atari 2600. Microsoft is a huge threat to Sony.
Talking about the price, you can't tell whether it's good or not by judging the product alone, you also need to look at the competitor's. Because most people will have to choose, they can't/won't buy all the consoles, at least at the same time.
Problem is that they charge $100 more for a less powerful system. They enforce a camera that most people don't want with the system. Make the Kinect an optional accessory if Microsoft will barely utilize it with games.
Too bad sony can't handle the insane demand. But m $ is just stupid if they dropped the price to 400 the consoles Would have frigging flown off of the shelves. Too bad they just COULDN'T sell it without the kinect
i almost agree with Pachter this time it's 2014 and nobody still f****ng wants a kinect ( my condolences if you want a kinect ) seriously MS should just do this 1: get rid of kinect 2: lower the price 3: ??? 4: get the devs on your side ( bribery ) 5: CASH FLOWING LIKE THERE'S NO TOMORROW! now to just wait until a sony fanboy comes knocking on this comment ... ._. it's unavoidable.. i can hear him coming... you there fanboy? okay so let me get this clear i don't even like MS but i do like competition between the 3 because it'll make the consumers life easier... trust me, it does. (arguably gaming on PC will make consumers life the easiest but i'm not gonna go into that today)
Your "fanboy" comments show your insecurity. But I agree with the number statements
what do you expect me to say really? i come from the almighty PC and frankly i'd rather not meddle with the console wars most of the time usually i'll just pick up consoles as exclusives start showing up.. for PS4 it'll probably be MGS for Xbone... don't even know yet O_O; for Wii U it'll most likely be Super Smash.. or LoZ U
Not going to happen...
Everybody keeps saying that "nobody wants Kinect" yet , they keep selling quite a few x1's that (wait for it) .....come with Kinect !!....Ta Da !!.....if people REALLY didn't want Kinect , wouldn't EVERYBODY buy the console that DOSENT have Kinect?
It's crazy isn't it? The first Kinect sold over 24 million units in a few years.' Xbox One is selling quite well. Yet, somehow, people do keep coming to the conclusion that no one wants Kinect. It's funny everytime I see the comment.
Xbox One is selling well because of Xbox, not Kinect 2.0, that's why its forcibly bundled and not sold seperately. However, the first Kinect not only came bundled with a game, much like the Wii console being bundled with the Wii Sports game, but the attachment rate is less than 1:1 for the first Kinect. Which means for every Kinect sold there was only, on average, less than one game purchased for it, because of the bundled game. In my opinion, I don't envision any developer ever producing a "great" game for Kinect 2.0. Personally, I've watched my younger sister use Kinect 2.0 with Just Dance 2014 and it is...disastrously funny. Fighter Within, which requires Kinect 2.0, is not only an embarrassing game developed by Ubisoft, a great developer/publisher, but its strangely mocking Kinect 2.0 by how truly awful it is. Videos of gamers with names such as "Xbox Turn Off" & "Xbox Bing" make it appear hilariously unnecessary, in my opinion. So far, Titan Fall will not use Kinect, at all. The Kinect features in Dead Rising 3 are basically non-existent, in my opinion. What do you think? Also, is there any Kinect only game you're looking towards?
But they are.
hard-core gamers don't like kinect and they think their opinions are everyone's opinion.
EVERYBODY isn't saying it. Unless you're speaking in hyperbole. Of course, if we're going to speak in hyperbole, then we can say that "everybody" is choosing to buy the other console, and by a margin that's only going to increase in the future.
Yep price and Kinect are the only problems
A question to the XB1 owners. On a scale of 1-10 how often do you use Kinect for gaming only?
wrong question. we like to game with kinect when it makes sense. like "Xbox, go to killer instant", "xbox, turn off", etc from anywhere. That is awesome. without kinect, Xbox (or PS4) is a 3-year-old PC, nothing new gen.
PSA: playstation 4 can start games and turn off with voice commands without a camera. i did not buy my xbox1 for kinect. i bought it for the exclusives. i would have preferred a beefier console over an improved camera.
How often? Never lol
I solely use it as a way to control the interface . Quite frankly kinect centric titles sucks imo , aside from dance game that dont interest me . And "hardcore" games barely use it or for tiny immersion things as seen on DR3 . It's to the point that gaming wise , smart glass and anythign tied to touch control with hpones and tablets are is far more useful and promising for gaming on such a console . I'm not shocked or surprised , i never believed in Kinect , never really wanted it , and dont expect a thing from it . it just comes attached with the console . You get the console for the console and set of games , not for kinect . Well at least that's how it is for me , and everyone i know
What are they doing right...? Kinect? No Size, looks, build quality? No Price? No Investing in Developers and growing the Industry? No Thinking about gamers first? No Power? No Lots more can be listed but you we get the picture
It's funny how they can be doing so much wrong yet be so successful at the same time. How does that work?
Blind fanboyism and mass consumerism. MS is doing well in their own back yard. No much so anywhere else. Marketing and constant pushing of the hardware will always mean sales. It has never been about games, quality, variety or gamers for them.
"Blind fanboyism and mass consumerism" Both your comments wreak of blind fanboyism. Thanks for the laugh. Mass consumerism doesn't guarantee success. 1 full year to be the lone next gen console and look at WiiU. " MS is doing well in their own back yard." What constitutes doing well to you? Sales or profit? "Marketing and constant pushing of the hardware will always mean sales." Really...why is the Surface(Microsoft)not doing well at all? " It has never been about games, quality, variety or gamers for them." You're right. Somehow Micro had a higher attach rate during the whole of the PS360 gen and are selling just as must this gen even though the PS4 is outselling X1. What are Xbox owners doing?
You have misunderstood every comment... Wii U has nothing to do with mass consumerism, because although meant for the mass market, the message is misunderstood. People don't know what they are buying as a result of poor communication and marketing from Nintendo. Secondly the Wii fad has died last generation and this will not be rekindled in the Wii U. Marketing is about price, promotion, place and product. The surface is expensive and MS has not done enough to steer people away from iPads and android tablets... Why? The product and features, including lack of apps compared to other devices . It's just not enough. The 360 was released an entire year before the PS3. Meaning no competition in that time. It was the first and only high definition console and people were longing for next gen. In other words it was released in a vaccum with no other compelling alternatives. Plus the PS3 upon release was just too expensive. Both sold over 80 million, with the P3 probably a bit more and will continue to sell.
"You have misunderstood every comment... Wii U has nothing to do with mass consumerism, because although meant for the mass market, the message is misunderstood. People don't know what they are buying as a result of poor communication and marketing from Nintendo. Secondly the Wii fad has died last generation and this will not be rekindled in the Wii U." WiiU has everything to do with the mass. They specifically target the younger/family audience. The masses. Just because Nintendo messed up doesn't mean it isn't meant for the masses. It just means they failed. You contradicted yourself anyway. "Marketing is about price, promotion, place and product. The surface is expensive and MS has not done enough to steer people away from iPads and android tablets... Why? The product and features, including lack of apps compared to other devices . It's just not enough." So in essence you just proved what I meant by advertising dollars not guaranteeing success. (your comment-"Marketing and constant pushing of the hardware will always mean sales.") Microsoft could throw all the dollars they want at the X1..but people still have to buy it. It looks like you know it isn't true, but still applied it because it's Microsoft. Sad really.... "The 360 was released an entire year before the PS3. Meaning no competition in that time. It was the first and only high definition console and people were longing for next gen. In other words it was released in a vaccum with no other compelling alternatives. Plus the PS3 upon release was just too expensive. Both sold over 80 million, with the P3 probably a bit more and will continue to sell." This doesn't mean anything. The 360 still maintained a higher attach rate despite, according to you, not having any games to play. Microsoft even sold more exclusive titles last gen even though Sony released more. Everything you typed is blind fanboyism and flat out untrue. Especially growing the industry...to my knowledge Microsoft was the first to have built in broadband in the OG Xbox. They literally ushered in online play to consoles when Sony and Ninty weren't ready. Other than HD...Online play is one of the biggest things to happen to consoles and Micro pushed it. Yet they don't push the industry forward according to you. Blind fanboyism...it's sad. : )
MS pushing the industry forward is the biggest contradiction in the gaming industry. Why make games when we can buy? Why develop studios when we can pay for the IP. I am not getting an Xbox One off principle alone. Microsoft are the worst anti-consumer company in gaming. They don't even have true 1st parties, they don't build teams off hard work and actually care about the gamers or devs. They just buy whatever they think is hot, then try to pay for as many exclusives as they can. They'd made some of the most horrible type of moves among the console makers, like the crazy restrictions they gave devs about making games perform equal on Xbox or they won't work with them. If devs go with another platform first, they won't work with them. They got away with all of this, not mainly because they have the most money, but because during the 360 era, they had an iron grip on the industry with their console holding the vastly larger amount of users. So, they could give devs horrible profit ratios on games/DLC and the devs would still have to take it, because Microsoft had so much power. Now, with the PS4 being in more homes than the X1, and it being more powerful\easier to develop on\Sony being way easier to work with\much easier self publishing, it's gonna be hard for Microsoft to get away with all their evil ways. So, they're either gonna have to continue to do more 180s on some of those ridiculous policies that still exist, or it's bye bye to even more indies and larger 3rd parties. Alot of devs havn't forgotten how badly they were treated last gen, and that's part of why there's more and more games you hear being announced for PC and PS4 or PS4 only, because they don't want to deal with the aggravation and greed of Microsoft. Not to mention all the locked devices behind Live like Netflix etc. If you can't admit any of the above then it's you who are the fanboy. Odd how quick you can call others that , when not looking at how blind your are to MS's BS. No where have I said Sony are the be all and end all... You on the other hand outright defend MS like they own you. Wonder how may 360s you went the through? 2 for me. Keep buying their policies and their products.
Well, looks like you don't have much of a rebuttal and have strayed completely away from what we were talking about. All of that you just wrote is about your feelings...I'm not gonna debate how you feel.
The debate ended when your fanboyism and fanboy accusations stated. I stated why MS are doing well. Not because smthing is produced for the masses means it had mass market appeal. You also need good marketing. Those were the points. And this applies to the XBONE. My original comment bluntly pointed out what MS did wrong. Then went on to say why they are doing well. I have yet to hear your side as to why they are doing well. It's certainly not games, quality, or power of the console. It's brand loyalty pure and simple, and pushing XBONEs in peoples faces. Fans will be fans, regardless of policies. However, more are coming to playstation. MS refuses to offer value.
Xboner 720p for $249 is the sweet spot. It will have good games and I want KI but I only pay for what it's worth and the GPU is only worth $79 in the PC market for performance.
thats the main reason holding its performance back!
Patcher is right though, the console aint selling badly at all but a price drop between $379 to $399 will boost those sales even more.
He's wrong. The price is right. They're making money and avoiding the billions lost on the PS3 and the original Xbox. The loss leader sales model no longer works for video game consoles.
It's good to be Pachter. Whoever pays you, you lobby for them. The best job. Doesn't matter that he never took controller in his hands...
They should sell it @ $449 and throw in Forza or Dr3, watch it sell like hotcakes
Other than Halo and incredible online functionality, what has M$ done for this industry that was actually good. I only know of the bad things they have done. 1. They flat out destroyed RARE, one of the best companies of all time. They could be Microsoft's Naughty Dog at this point, but, sadly, they have become solely Kinect developers and are force to make casual games. 2. Xbox One is incredibly overpriced. The system isn't as powerful as the ps4, and the Kinect is a useless gimmick. M$ should have more options on the table for the gamers who don't necessarily want the Kinect. 3. They were forcing these god awful policies on their next gen system. They obviously pulled back on them, but I don't trust a company who brought these terrible ideas in the first place. As a gamer, you would have nothing to lose if M$ left the console business. If anything, it would be a celebration if they just left. Microsoft is like Lex Luthor. Despite of all the bad M$ have done, people still believe they can change.
A few people i talked to bought ps4 for titanfall, then they figured out it is xbox-one exclusive, now are returning their ps4's, and these are two of my friends, i wonder how much the number equals. Xbox is the better of the two atm, more variety launch titles, and titan fall out in two months or what ever. Ps4 has second son, but im not a huge fan of the series, im buying it regardless. I have buyers remorse from acquiring my ps4 atm, everyone talks about respgun being fun, i played it, i personally dont like it. I have every game on that system that is note worthy to me, and i still dont play it. I have every noteworthy game on xbox-one and i non stop play that system, and historically i always leaned towards sony side, but this gen im just playing games, play what system has em.
If you actually watch the video he says this in he also says that xbox is profiting quite well which is 100% true. You don't sell your only profiting hardware division. Just wouldn't make sense.
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