740°
Submitted by dasbeer88 257d ago | news

Rare Ltd. Talks About Microsoft Mismanagement

It was a sad day in the early 2000s when Microsoft bought out childhood-memory-makers Rare Ltd, the company behind Donkey Kong Country, Battletoads, Konker's Bad Fur Day, Donkey Kong 64, Banjo Kazooie, and much, much more. Since their acquisition, the company has slid into obscurity, and while it is no secret that a major reason for that was poor management of the developer by Microsoft, a recent issue of Retro Gamer magazine shed a bit more light on the subject. (Industry, Microsoft, Rare, Xbox, Xbox 360, Xbox One)

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Lukas_Japonicus  +   257d ago | Well said
Wow, so MS stopped Rare working on titles that people loved, to focus more on crappy Kinect games? Why doesn't that surprise me? Talk about holding back a developers talent.
#1 (Edited 257d ago ) | Agree(183) | Disagree(8) | Report | Reply
gamesR4fun  +   257d ago
yep very sad to see or not

I mean imagine what they could've done if they had the freedom to make the games we love
Nitrowolf2  +   257d ago | Funny
lol, this is what I picture
http://www.youtube.com/watc...
abzdine  +   257d ago
Rare have been greedy and they followed $$ and now they are nothing but the direct result of their greed.
Rare in 90's was like today's Naughty Dog, everything they touched turned to gold.

EDIT: Rare is dead!! They already got the chance to work on non kinect games on 360 and xbox original but they turned into poo all of them. I blame Microsoft but blame especially Rare for their rare efforts they have shown
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JimmyLmao  +   257d ago
@Nitrowolf2

wow, that was brilliant. lol
FriedGoat  +   257d ago
All the talent left rare before Microsoft even got them. Does nobody remember timesplitters?

The talent are now called Crytek UK, formerly known as Free Radical.
#1.1.4 (Edited 257d ago ) | Agree(19) | Disagree(3) | Report
Bigpappy  +   257d ago
You guys are so melodramatic. You are cheering for another Crackdown and Kameo 2. I am not saying these games should no be made, but do you realize that Kinect Sports sold more copies that either of them? Kinect Sports is the BEST selling stand alone game for Kinect.
BitbyDeath  +   257d ago
@Bigpappy, any game can sell millions when it's bundled with hardware.

The game was pushed to sell no matter what.
cyclindk  +   257d ago
@nitro

Holy crap funniest thing ever, new family guy right there! I dont watch television but if that came out as a new series i would totally watch.

Very well made.
ShinMaster  +   257d ago
Most of the talent that we knew and loved from Rare has left.

It's why they gave KI to another developer.
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nukeitall  +   257d ago
@Bigpappy:

The Kinect Sports franchise has sold more than 8 million copies. Most likely more than Kameo, and Crackdown has sold combined!

Seems to me like MS did the right thing there....
bviperz  +   257d ago
@bigpappy

Some of the greatest games out there have the crappiest sales figures. Hell, one of the most popular game in the world, League of Legends, is free. So please don't insinuate that 'sales equals good' crap.
inveni0  +   257d ago
This is why Sony has better exclusives. They let the devs chase their passion.
SilentNegotiator  +   257d ago
Certain people (delusional fanboys) love to claim that because people left, Rare didn't have any talent left when the generation started. To those people I refer to Kameo and Viva Pinata.

Before Microsoft shoved XBL down poor Banjo's throat and then Kinect up Rare's behind, Rare was giving us quality games.

"Kameo 2 was given the go-ahead and was looking very promising when, after a further three months in production, it was abruptly shelved. The reason? Microsoft decided to focus all of Rare's attention to its great waving hope, the Kinect"

No Kameo 2 because of Kinect. Sigh...
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Ritsujun  +   256d ago
Xbosh'd.
Death  +   256d ago
@SilentNegotiator

Rare doesn't have the same talent they used to have.

Kameo and Viva were the last games released before the Stamper bros left. We haven't seen any "great" games because the creative forces that used to drive Rare have left the building.
gaffyh  +   256d ago
You know I very rarely put the tinfoil hat on, but looking at Bigpappy and nukeitall's comments in this thread, I can't help but feel that they must be hired by MS to do social media interference. If not, they are really not gamers, because Rare of old was fantastic, and the new Rare is absolute shite. Anyone arguing against that is a complete idiot or corporate shill.
SilentNegotiator  +   256d ago
"Kameo and Viva were the last games released before the Stamper bros left"

And after the Viva sequel, it was Nuts and Bolts, where MS ruined our chance at a new BK platformer by making them create an XBL-integrated game. Then it was Kinect, Kinect, Kinect.

Two people leaving isn't going to wipe out all talent in a company. Terrible restrictions that keep them from making interesting games will.
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Death  +   256d ago
Silent,

The Stampers were not just two people. They were the founders of Rare and the creative force behind their games. After they left the studio struggled along for a few years before it was restructured. There really isn't much left of the studio Microsoft purchased. It was a very expensive lesson learned about the downsides of buying first party studios.
UltimateMaster  +   256d ago
Microsoft ruined Rare.
H0RSE  +   256d ago
@bviperz

"Some of the greatest games out there have the crappiest sales figures. Hell, one of the most popular game in the world, League of Legends, is free. So please don't insinuate that 'sales equals good' crap."

You're right. Popularity =/= quality. It kinda puts a new perspective on PS4 having more pre-orders than X1...

On topic, although I can see where "having masters," can have its downfalls/shortcomings, Yes, Rare has made many great games, some of which likely make up some of our greatest childhood gaming memories, and if left to their own devices, perhaps they could have continued this legacy, but I can't help to realize that things change, whether it be people, the business or whatever.

Look at other great developers like Bioware and Blizzard. Although they are still hugely popular and successful, they are not like they used to be - because things change. People leave, business deals are made, design philosophies shift, etc. This happens in other facets also, like music. You see it all the time - a band comes out and you love them, and as time goes on, the music changes, the musicians taste's shift, and you're left with they typical "sell out" rhetoric.

Yes, Rare was a great company that made really good games, but I don't think that their track record would have remained consistent, regardless of intervention of MS, simply due to how real life works.
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SilentNegotiator  +   255d ago
@Death

They were gone for like, 2 years before Microsoft came and planted a Kinect flag in Rare's ass.

Between the Stamper Brothers leaving and Kinect, they had only sequeled Viva Pinata (with positive reception), remade 2 classic games, and created BK:N&B because MS canceled their BK platformer for a racer (and then canceled that for a "hybrid").

They had the talent when MS bought them, they had the talent when the Stamper Brothers left, and they had the talent when they left. Microsoft's restrictions are what killed RARE.
XB1_PS4  +   257d ago
This is actually my biggest gripe with Microsoft. They ruined one of my favorite Devs just to support the Kinect..
itBourne  +   257d ago
They ruined Ensemble too = (
Never will I get an AoM 2....
thisismyaccount  +   257d ago
Karma is a bitch, Rare!

Next time, before jumping ship from a well-known console maker to >something else<... maybe you should do a "double check/history" before agreeing to a "take over" and get "·@#$%!

Conker 64 was great on the N64, it ended there... Nintendo knew this and made some extra cash by selling Rare.
mohuzas  +   257d ago
How can you sell something you don't even own?
mickaelmc  +   257d ago
You are amazingly uninformed.
thisismyaccount  +   254d ago
Hmm... Mocosoft gave Nintend about $400 Mio. pennies and got Rare for that. As far i recall, Rare never released a game on any other System than a Nini-one (8/16-64bit era).

So.. why am i wrong with my "thesis"?¿

Nintendo minus Rare = $$$$$ for Nini. was a great move! Conker 64 didnt sell much and was prolly (due its nature) not well-recieved at the highest floor at NINI-headquaters.

You would have expected them to release more games... but they didnt (partially thx. to M$). So... they had a great run (Conker, D.Kong) and that´s Rare resumée at the end.

$400 Mio. or mediocre sales (below 1mio. when it was released) of Conker 128bit version on the GameCube ? :)=

Best Deal Ever for Nintendo!

http://www.nintendolife.com...
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come_bom  +   257d ago
After reading the article and knowing about all the games Microsoft shot down, Yep, Microsoft really ruined Rare. Bungie was smart to leave Microsoft otherwise they would be making Halo's for the rest of their lives. Now only if Rare could leave Microsoft like Bungie did...
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amiga-man  +   257d ago
the real Rare left M$ a long time ago.
Lwhit6  +   257d ago
I hate to say this, but Microsoft is very closely resembling a communist regime.
Veni Vidi Vici  +   256d ago
They are resembling a money hungry business. It has nothing to do with communism. How do you even come to that conclusion?
Lwhit6  +   256d ago
Veni Vici Vici
Well, in relation to this article, taking someone and their talents and forcing them to make other games because they need Kinect games is exactly how China is. The government will take say.. a master blacksmith and force him to become a factory worker because they need another factory worker.

Microsofts old policies of requiring always online are another example. (And oh you better believe they're still going to do it in the future). They're going to force us to go all digital just because THEY THINK that's where "the future is going". I hate downloading games! Thats why i wamt a tangible product that i can hold and call my own and know that its mine to sell/trade/gift or even destroy!I Don't want some imaginary 2-hour download thats locked behind a paywall and covered in restrictions. Forcing something onto the consumer/citizen by policy/law without the consumer's/citizen's consent is just like communism!
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H0RSE  +   256d ago
You need to actually know what Communism is before you can attempt to explain it...

What you talk about sounds closer to Fascism.
davidDIRK  +   257d ago
I don't get why they push that kinnect shit. Its soooo insignificant. If Xbox tanks or is sold off I wouldn't be surprised they spend their money on stupid stuff like kinnect, timed exclusives, early call of duty map packs. Oh yeah and that fruit loop Larry herb 100k a year salary to give his opinion on Xbox live...that's money well spent.
ajax17  +   257d ago
Just imagine if Sony had bought Rare.
Misaka_x_Touma  +   257d ago
typical sony fanboy response
ajax17  +   257d ago
@Misaka_x_Touma
Yeah, because Sony doesn't give their developers complete creative control
/s
BOLO  +   257d ago
@Misaka_x_Touma

Typical butt-hurt Xbot retort...Rare was a class act developer in their day when Nintendo backed them...Killer Instinct to Jet Force Gemini to Blast Corps to many others. It was your beloved M$FT that put a full stop to Rare's creativity.
H0RSE  +   256d ago
Many publishers give studios creative control, including the nefarious Microsoft and EA, among others. Sony does not hold exclusivity on giving developers creative control.

When Bungie was initially with MS, they were a 1st part studio, wholly owned by Microsoft. After the restructuring at MS, they were 2nd party, meaning MS owned a stake in the company and would help finance Bungie's future games in the interest of retaining exclusivity with the studio.

If Bungie worked on new IPs, they themselves would maintain creative control and ownership despite whatever financing MS gave them. However, if Bungie works on MS owned IPs (like Halo), MS would maintain all rights and could exert a certain amount of creative control, but Bungie still had a degree of creative control in those instances.

As for EA - http://www.escapistmagazine...

As far as Rare is concerned, it isn't just the fault/mismanagement of MS that is to blame. Rare is responsible for their downfall as well.

Taken from a Eurogamer article "Who killed Rare?": http://www.eurogamer.net/ar...

"However, in time it became clear that everyone had underestimated how much of the studio's success was down to Nintendo's gentle steering. "It seemed like Microsoft was really a novice in the games industry and for some time they left us to try and see how things worked," Cook explains. "They wanted hit games for their console and since they weren't sure how to go about it they trusted Rare to do what was necessary. The problem here was that Rare was a very long way from the very corporate structure of Microsoft and when Rare had made games it wasn't in isolation from Nintendo but as a creative partnership."

- So it seems MS left Rare to their own devices, and had problems delivering the goods. MS did give Rare freedom and control, which is why we have games like Grabbed by the Ghoulies, Viva Pinata, and Banjo Kazooie Nuts and Bolts, which may have been decent enough games, they weren't very successful, so essentially, Rare made a series of commercial and/or critical failures and in this regard, Rare killed Rare.

They were "in control of their own destiny," so to speak, and started pumping out games people didn't want to buy. When it was evident that they couldn't quite cut it without the assistance of a corporate body working with them, Microsoft put them to work on Avatars and Kinect games, where they've likely haven't been as successful since Banjo Tooie.

I don't doubt that MS had/has a part in Rare's downfall, but I also don't doubt Rare had a hand in it's own fate.
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Lykon  +   257d ago
The arrogant blinkered pursuit of Kinects success by MS really harmed gaming. They wanted a slice of the wii profit pie instead of listening to what gamers wanted. MS get what they deserve.
Azzanation  +   257d ago
Lukas_Japonicus your an idiot and so are the rest of you fangirls. Do your research first. Rare made Perfect Dark Zero, Conkers Bad Fur Day HD, Banjo Kazooie Nuts n Bolts, Grab by the Ghoolies etc. They all failed. No wonder MS put them on Kinect, Rare lost the plot since Star Fox Adventures on the Gamecube. Nintendo sold Rare I believe for these reasons, they knew Rare didn't have it anymore.
However Rare on Kinect have made massive leaps in sales and made Kinect what it is today. The fastest selling device in the world. And with games like Kinect Adventures which sold over 20million copies (something Sony hasn't done since they started gaming 15 years ago)
DestinyHeroDoomlord  +   256d ago
BK:Nuts and bolts, viva piñata:tip are some of my best games this gen
MoveTheGlow  +   256d ago
I hope you all read the article, because there are two out-of-touch companies in this case: Microsoft and Rare. Microsoft throwing the broken Kinect at companies was awful, and yes, if Rare were left to their own devices, games would have been made, and probably decent ones. Their initial efforts, as listed above by Azz, were compromises to that new audience - even Ghoulies - and they were out of their element. Bad Fur Day HD hardly counts - it was a remake.

Rare's underestimation of their fans is rampant throughout the interview. They just assumed they had to make games for a different audience, so guns and robots it was - seriously, if they really made a great Banjo game on there, the fans would have flocked to the 360. They would have had Nintendo's older audience. Microsoft screwed up by way of the Kinect, but Rare left their history behind before Microsoft made it happen, too. It's a royal mess. If Rare is ever to make a great game again, they need to lose their management.
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-Foxtrot  +   256d ago
LOL...and MS said they don't force Rare to make Kinect games

This proves they do
Lunarassassin  +   256d ago
This is going to sound strange but i really want another Banjo Kazooie games based around vehicles. There was something about Nuts N Bolts that really made me play it for hours.
GentlemenRUs  +   257d ago
You tell them RARE!

*misses you*

EDIT: Rare, You could always tell M$ to go shove it and come into the world of the Playstation :P
#2 (Edited 257d ago ) | Agree(22) | Disagree(15) | Report | Reply
sigfredod  +   257d ago
that's how one of the most talented developer went to waste under M$ claws
scott182  +   257d ago
I used to love their games, I'm bummed how things turned out for them.
MMEHTA  +   257d ago
I Certainly Hope MS stop being bitches and just let Rare, develop games they want.......
I assume that Don Mattrick was the dev's at Rare into Kinect; now that he's gone......I'm hoping for the best.
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twinspectre  +   257d ago
is Microsoft's Faul , the truth is this they don't care about gaming guys , Microsoft don't give a flying Beep about Gamers #DealWithIt
xDHAV0K24x  +   257d ago
No
Shinox  +   256d ago
xDHAV0K24x

Wake up derp , they become Anti-Gaming !

Haven't we forgot may 2013 ?
MisfitsInc  +   257d ago
sounds about right
MightyNoX  +   257d ago
The writing was on the wall the moment Microsoft thought they owned Donkey Kong by purchasing Rare.
DigitalRaptor  +   256d ago
I'm sick of the lies spewing from Microsoft cake holes on a consistent basis.

http://n4g.com/news/1384945...

Who supports a company that lies and lies and lies and lies and lies, to you face?
CAB1802theWiiUdefend   257d ago | Trolling | show
iNFAMOUZ1  +   257d ago
They never had talent, microsoft gave them talent!
Burrito26a  +   257d ago
Really? Is that so?
Lukas_Japonicus  +   257d ago
Kinect Sports is a shining example of talent being put to good use.

Is there a need for /s here?
twinspectre  +   257d ago
it seems you and the other guys who agree don't know nothing about Gaming History
this hobby isn't for you
Seafort  +   257d ago
Microsoft is the opposite of talent creators.

They suck the life out of developers and spit them out a shadow of their former selves.

Why can't people see this? When you buy an Xbox you are supporting everything that is bad about gaming.

I hope MS next CEO gets his way and sells off the Xbox division.
nix  +   257d ago
where's the Delusional button when you need one?
Jeedai Infidel  +   257d ago
I can't find that button, or the one that filters most of the teens' and early twenty-somethings' immature and thoughtless ramblings about things that are out of their realm of understanding. I may need to face reality and start quoting the great Roger Murtaugh, "I'm getting too old for this sh*t".
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jcnba28  +   257d ago
So you are more impressed with games such as Kinect Sports and Kinectimals instead of Goldeneye and Banjo Kazooie? I think not.
310dodo  +   257d ago
Your gamer card is gone.

Rare made some of the best games ever created.
go back and play some of there N64 gems
Wizziokid  +   257d ago
are you joking?
Shinox  +   256d ago
K e e p - S u c k i n g - M $ - Dxxx

Derp !
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mhunterjr  +   257d ago
Yeah, I love my 360, and I was happy to see Rare join MS, but it's hasn't been a match made in heaven.

in MS' defense, rare's attempts at making core games for 360 were less than stellar. Perfect Dark Zero was trash,Kameo didn't realize it's potential, and neither did Banjo Kazooie. The only commercial success rare brought to this gen had been Kinect sports.

My hope is that now that MS doesn't have to sell Kinect as a stand alone device, rare will be allowed to revisit some of those titles. Kameo is deserving of a sequel, and xbox needs a good adventure/performer. And perfect dark needs a new proper entry.

Oh and jet force gemini, bring back jet force!
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MrCastle  +   257d ago
Oh god yes! Jet Force Gemini was one of the best ever! I haven't found an emulator that can rock it though. :(
Jeedai Infidel  +   257d ago
Funny, I thought "Oh God yes!" as soon as I read Jet Force Gemini, then scrolled down to your comment. Great minds, and all of that.
karl  +   257d ago
didnt MS comment a while ago about them letting RARE do whatever they wanted

and if they did kinect games was not because of MS?

EDIT:

it was really easy to find
here it is

http://n4g.com/news/1384945...
#10 (Edited 257d ago ) | Agree(9) | Disagree(4) | Report | Reply
Saints94  +   257d ago
Here is a former Rare saying Microsoft cancelled games they wanted to make.

http://www.giantbomb.com/ra...

Is a quote.

Direct interview:
http://www.notenoughshaders...
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stuna1  +   257d ago
Yes you're right about Microsoft saying they let Rare create the games they want! But there-in "LIES" the problem, because we all know Microsoft are good.....well you know liers.
My_precious  +   256d ago
of course they let rare do whaterver they want, but can everything but kinect game, simple logic, derp
karl  +   256d ago
well, i guess u cant trust this guys...

poor rare.. its really sad to see a dev go this way..

im sure they thought MS with all their money was financing the games they always wanted to make..
sprinterboy  +   257d ago
Black widow sounded interesting
Sitdown  +   257d ago
Kameo 2?!?!?! If this is the case, I am thoroughly disappointed.....I loved the first one.
Bolts-N-Rays1109  +   257d ago
Phil Spencer said on Podcast Unlocked a couple of weeks ago that this isn't true and that Rare wanted to work on Kinect games. Oh Microsoft..

Edit: Also, he said they were working on some non-Kinect game ideas.
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TwistingWords  +   257d ago
If you dance with the devil, the devil don't change. The devil changes you.
Trekster_Gamer  +   257d ago
Spoken like a typical troll...
Go away..
infectedaztec  +   257d ago
Rare should stop acting like children. When a company buys you they assume control. MS did what they thought was best for,MS, which they are entitled,to.
Priority number one for MS and Sony is to make money
Jeedai Infidel  +   257d ago
Stop with the logic, this is 2013, we think with emotions now, not with our brains.
DestinyHeroDoomlord  +   256d ago
*sheds tear*
Hicken  +   257d ago
That's not entirely true.

Usually, when and if a company buys a developer, it's because they recognize not just the talent, but the talent in the type of game they've already made. A smart publisher recognizes this, but I guess that's not who Rare got bought by.

After all, you don't buy an FPS studio and set them to work making puzzle games.
infectedaztec  +   257d ago
Yes I suppose your business know-how trumps MS
Hicken  +   256d ago
Considering the missteps they've had in the gaming industry recently, it appears that I do, indeed, know that business better than they do, at the least.

Besides, rather than business sense, isn't this common sense? You hire somebody for their previous work, and set the to work doing something similar for you. I guess, though, you and Microsoft would contract an architect, then have him rebuild your car's engine.
joeorc  +   256d ago
@Hicken

"Besides, rather than business sense, isn't this common sense? You hire somebody for their previous work, and set the to work doing something similar for you. I guess, though, you and Microsoft would contract an architect, then have him rebuild your car's engine."

see you have brought up a very valid point, iT WILL ONLY WORK IF YOU LET THEM BE WHO OR WHAT MADE THEM SO GREAT IN THE FIRST PLACE!

IF YOU STEP ON THEM, YOU MAY HAVE AN ADVERSE EFFECT , INSTEAD!

Ed fries, worked @ Microsoft for 18 freaking years, was one of the people that brought up to Microsoft higher Ups to push for the xbox as a platform to even be a reality, he's not only a developer. More important he is a gamer @ heart..and his response to why he left speaks about the problem @ the core over @ Microsoft, adding this and the other 9 key xbox platform gamer execs and its very clear, this is not the xbox platform that was made for Gamer's by Gamer's.

Microsoft's exec's in charge now are so far north what i would call , the core founding idea of the xbox, and have changed it for the worse, you do not loose all 10 of your key execs in under 10 years if there is every thing going all fine and dandy!

There is a real problem, its not about the Money, that's not the issue, Microsoft has a very large Pile of it..its a problem of what the current people in charge have done to the xbox as a platforms Direction.

example:

The Change up over @ Microsoft and why Hard core gamer's may be worried

http://forums.n4g.com/The-C...
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Zodiac  +   257d ago
Why didn't Microsoft just have another studio make the rare games?

I can't imagine that just because Rare made some N64 games, that only rare is allowed to touch those ip. Microsoft owns them, so have someone make those damn games!

There could have been a treasure trove of amazing exclusive 360 games if microsoft just handed the games to another studio.
barb_wire  +   257d ago
You've also got to remember that the people there at Rare in the late 80's & 90's, left the company years ago, many of them left (almost immediately) when MS bought Rare.. the Rare of today, is a cracked shell of a company that it used to be.

Sad but true.
Seafort  +   257d ago
Yup I compare Rare to Infinity Ward. They are both developers in name only.

None of the talent that made those 2 developers great are working for them anymore.
Mills93  +   257d ago
@seafort So true, the major guys from IW are at Respawn now

Epic is becoming a shell of what it once was when it comes to the Gears team, Rod is at 2K and Cliff is off being Cliff

Don't even know where the Rare guys are
from the beach  +   257d ago
They also made games like Viva Pinata and Nuts & Bolts which were as good as much of their back catalogue, and Kinect Sports: Rivals seems to be shaping up.

It's probably better not to know about shelved games from ANY company because you'll always wonder, without ever actually knowing what the game was like.

That 'grown up' Kameo 2 artwork though.. yeah..
justSumDood  +   257d ago
Glad someone finally mentioned Viva Pinata!
NoWayOut  +   257d ago
This is one of the reasons I don'r like MS. They don't care for what the gamers want. That's why I hope MS get out the gaming business soon.
PSWiiKing  +   257d ago
Rare, just ask for your resignation, and go back to Nintendo.
Jeedai Infidel  +   257d ago
Nintendo seems to be fumbling around in the dark, trying to figure out what the gaming world wants at the moment, so I don't think that would be good for anyone.
PSWiiKing  +   257d ago
I can guarantee you that Nintendo needs Rare more than their abusive bosses at MicroSoft.
mohuzas  +   256d ago
Is that why the 3ds has been outselling everything?
mohuzas  +   257d ago
Rare is a shell of its former self, they'd only make Wii Sports T-T
Edsword  +   257d ago
I hate MS, at least Sony treats their first parties right. I have never heard from geurilla or naughty dog that Sony makes than do this or that. I think they pretty much get to make their own decisions. I am sure there is some approval process, but let the devs do there jobs and you typically end up with the better product.
christocolus  +   257d ago
lol...hate ms?when your 1st party dev makes good returns you have no option than to love them..you just mentioned all sonys best 1st party devs...dont be ignorant do a research and find out how many devs have been laid off by sony and how many studios sony has closed..its a business sometimes you have to make some drastic deceisions and hope for the best.....ms actually kept rare relevant..their sucess with kinect sports brought them back and might have saved the studio cos all their other titles didnt do really well except viva pinata and kameo..kinect sports sold millions( i think over 4million copies)..rare has been on a hiring spree for a while now and they are now under better management and they are even helping to incubate new ms studios too..they seem more relevant this time around and ken lobbs has been very vocal about the new and positive direction of rare..from interviews you can tell how confident they are.they have a number of unannounced titles and im looking forward to more of their work this time around.
Jeedai Infidel  +   257d ago
The emotional thinkers disagree, me thinks.
Trekster_Gamer  +   257d ago
Funny the disagrees you get from sonybots...
They can't STAND the truth!!
Edsword  +   256d ago
Closing studios and forcing them to work on crap for Kinect is two different things. Business is business, the developers should be allowed to make the games they feel passionate about. That is what makes great games. Maybe my emotions came out a little because Rare was my favorite dev back in the N64 days. I'm not going to say that Sony is perfect and only MS has bad practices, but from everything I have seen and heard, Sony did not force any studios to make games for Move.

MS kept Rare relevant? Who's the fanboy here? Rare games were jewels on SNES and N64. Viva Pinata? Really? Kameo was okay at best. MS doesn't even have Rare working on the new KI.

@Trekster_Gamer - I'm not a sonybot, but I do not like MS as an organization and never have. I actually will probably end up buying both eventually, but yes, I hate what has happened to Rare since they were bought out by MS. Of course I think many of the employees have since left. Wasn't the Timesplitters dev. formed by former Rare staff?
#21.1.3 (Edited 256d ago ) | Agree(1) | Disagree(0) | Report
XabiDaChosenOne  +   256d ago
MS loved bungie but I guess the feeling wasn't mutual apparently, I wonder why.
"laid off by sony and how many studios sony has closed"
You mean unproductive studios get layed off? YOU DON'T SAY!
When talent like naughty dog and GG willing leave Sony than you will have a point.
christocolus  +   256d ago
@edsword

yeah. dude i too like rare alot and i want them back in top form but there is alot you need to know..the rare founders (the stamper brothers ) were already on their way out when nintendo sold rare and a lot of good hands left with them..prior to the ms acquisition, rare was managed more as a community of close friends than a studio..it was cool and all but after the stamper brothers left alot of the guys left too..at first ms left rare to do their own thing initially i.e grabbed by the ghoulies, kameo, conker live and reloaded,pdz, viva pinata.these titles didnt do very well and ms was loosing money so they decided to take charge..remember they spent over 300mil aquiring the studio if these guys wernt going to make the money back they would close the studio up..rare finally made kinect sports and it sold amazingly well...over 5milion copies.imo that game was rares saving grace...as a business owner would you allow them keep making games they are passionate about even if those games are not selling? or would you push them into a more lucrative business ?dude you may not agree with me but kinect sports helped rare cos now with its sucess ms has invested more into rare and are now even willing to take chances on some new unannounced ips(not kinect titles) once again ..phil spencer stated that recently in an interview.....
.yes many of the guys in the time splitters team are ex rare devs but rare has hired so many new talents in the last couple of years..i wouldnt be shocked if some of the old guys are back. ken lobb ( directed and produced many rare clasics from the past) is back in full force..rare now has a larger and even more talented team ..i was almost giving up on them but not anymore..killer instinct is being co developed with rare and its amazing and so is kinect sports rivals..infact the former ki guys and ken lobb are still overseeing it. and i wouldnt be shocked if ms acquired double helix...believe me rare has great talent now..u just wait and see you will be surprised.

@kobe357

bungie wanted to remain independent..some studios like that you know...if tomoro naughty dog decides to become independent sony will have to let them go too..and about taking low jabs at ms remeber the co founder of nd left with some of his team members just after the release of uncharted.. also remember the creator of god of war left sony and recently the head of team ico(working on the last guardian). socom and wipeout what hapened to those devs?they werent the only studios sony closed down but it did it mean their games werent good? nope.the truth is that the games were not selling well enough...dude both ms and sony loose talents from time to time stop making it seem like its only ms who does...its strictly business.
Misaka_x_Touma  +   257d ago
that explains Sony closing 5 studios in 2012
christocolus  +   257d ago
well rare has been on a hiring spree recently..they still have some of the best talent in the industry there and the new guys theyv got are from some of the best studious out there.phil harrison has helped alot..they seem more confident now..some of their top guys are even heading other smaller ms dev teams in uk...phil spencer stated in a recent interview that rare showed him prototypes of titles they wanted to make and he was very amazed and gave the go ahead..so i guess ms has actually realised their mistakes but for now they need to green light kameo2 .i really loved the first game and ms should hire this guy back.
#22 (Edited 257d ago ) | Agree(3) | Disagree(10) | Report | Reply
Soldierone  +   257d ago
By the time MS said "do what you want" Rare was dead and all the developers pretty much left. Its like getting ND with no talent left in it, do you expect them to still churn out uncharted and the last of us?
My_precious  +   256d ago
MS doean't in position of "do what you want" anymore, the last time i check they are in massive negative point of un-benefit brand and thier new boss even consider to sell them of as well as Bing now

they are the black sheep of MSFT, and if they don't act soon, oh well, maybe we will have whatever-box in futute depend on which company will buy them
Soldierone  +   256d ago
It's because of moves like this. MS would spend money in the wrong ways. "here is millions for timed exclusives" why? Why does every third party title needs timed exclusive stuff? Why not spend that money improving Xbox, putting games on it that will only be found on Xbox?
ninjagoat  +   257d ago
They should have stayed with nintendo.
Misaka_x_Touma  +   257d ago
they would if Nintendo brought them out
GusBricker  +   257d ago
Lets see, they had PD0 and Kameo at the 360 launch and they both sold poorly. Then they put out Viva Pinata and Nuts and Bolts with Viva Pinata the only one that sold...moderately well.

Then they started on Kinect games and they actually sold well.

Imagine that, good sales finally from Rare from Kinect titles. Of course they're going to continue making Kinect games.
#25 (Edited 257d ago ) | Agree(2) | Disagree(3) | Report | Reply
jmac53  +   257d ago
No mention of Goldeneye or Perfect Dark in the article. That is pure blasphemy!
Belking  +   257d ago
Not surprised the source is gaf...lol rare wasn't even profitable until they were bought by ms. That's something that he mysteriously left out.
Lukas_Japonicus  +   257d ago
All you ever talk about is profit/finance of both companies.

People still loved their games, regardless of profit. Gaf being the source isn't relevant, the quotes in the article are. I think ill take his word over your opinion.
#27.1 (Edited 257d ago ) | Agree(4) | Disagree(1) | Report | Reply
TheKayle1  +   257d ago
the title is misleading...isnt rare ltd talking is Phil Tossel ex rare now Nyamyam Ltd.

i think rare is happy to be where they are
Relientk77  +   257d ago
Wow, Black Widow, Crackdown 2, and Kameo 2

would have been better
jcnba28  +   257d ago
For the people saying for Rare to go back to NIntendo, there is not point most of the developers that worked on those SNES and N64 classics have left Rare. I think I remember reading only 5% of of the old Rare developers are still at Rare whereas the rest of them have left the company to start their own projects.
ritsuka666  +   256d ago
Old Rare devs are now on Crytek.
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