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Halo 4 designer brands "sexy" MGS5 character "lazy and exploitative"

343 Industries designer David Ellis isn't too chuffed with Hideo Kojima's "erotic" - or as Kojima would now prefer to word it, "sexy" - Metal Gear Solid 5 character Quiet.

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KingKelloggTheWH1441d ago (Edited 1441d ago )

While I agree the design is pretty terrible, the art and design in Halo 4 was pretty generic and bad too.(making everyone angry here)

Also "Sexuality can be used for purpose. I actually thought it worked in Bayonetta, for example. This feels lazy and exploitative"

Oh, I see he has already played the game and knows her personality and back story.

Also, I like how they Just focus on the women in the game and dont mention that Liquid Snake, and Raven were both Shirtless in Alaska, snake was naked in his briefing and shirtless in his torture scene, not to mention in MGS 2 Raiden was naked for a whole playable sequence.

The sexuality in MG does not go one way, heck just look at the Boss, she wasnt portrayed sexually at All.People need to quit excluding stuff and look at the games portrayal of people as a whole.

Septic1441d ago (Edited 1441d ago )

" the art and design in Halo 4 was pretty generic and bad too."

You are kidding me right? Halo is known for it's unique design, with really weird Forerunner structures and beautiful sky boxes. How on Earth is it generic? "Pretty generic and bad" are possibly the worst descriptions of it and couldn't be further from the truth. Have you played the game? I'm assuming you're talking about the art style in general because your comment was very vague.

Regarding your point about the male characters 'exposing' themselves, there is a context to it.

What is the context of a sniper fighting in a bikini? It seems silly but I wouldn't make as big an issue as Ellis did.

"People need to quit excluding stuff and look at the games portrayal of people as a whole."

Yeah and that's why Quiet's clothing (or lackthereof) doesn't make sense in the context of who she is supposed to be. Again however, I don't think it's that big an issue.

But also, look at Cortana with her massive jugs. Was that really needed for an A.I construct? I don't know...

JustPlay41441d ago

It isn't bad but it became pretty generic after halo 2 or 3 came out, after that it just the same game over and over again but fans don't care, it still a good game

abzdine1441d ago (Edited 1441d ago )

i agree with Ellis, the idea of making stupid sexy characters in MGS just to sell more copies seems a little desperate.
This changed my vision on MGS5 now. I hope Kojima focuses on delivering some solid gameplay and chara design instead of destroying woman picture more than it is already just to sell his game.

i dont wanna play Metal Gear: Dead or Alive edition!

jimbobwahey1441d ago

I wouldn't call Halo's design unique to be honest. For example, see the well documented copying of designs from the movie Aliens.

minimur121441d ago

Bayonetta, lol, think about it, who would buy a game where some ugly women beat up monsters :)

KingKelloggTheWH1441d ago

Im a huge Halo fan, but 4's art was a huge step back for the franchise it lost much of its identity and took much of its base aesthetics from other franchises rather than from previous titles, its especially noticeable if you look at it compared to the masterpiece that was Reach.

As for Quiet, Im trying to hold back my judgment until the game is released, for all we know that could be under clothing she is wearing for a small part of the game from after she escapes the torture stuff.

Septic1441d ago (Edited 1441d ago )

@KingKellog

"Im a huge Halo fan, but 4's art was a huge step back for the franchise it lost much of its identity and took much of its base aesthetics from other franchises rather than from previous title"

I have to completely disagree. Halo 4's art style carries on the legacy of original Halo:CE and takes it to a whole new level. It's what lingers on the most in my mind. It's look and feel is in a class of its own.

Compared to Halo Reach, I think it shines through even more. Halo 4's level designs in terms of art style were the best ever since Halo:CE in my opinion.

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.

Regarding Quiet;

"for all we know that could be under clothing she is wearing for a small part of the game from after she escapes the torture stuff.

And then chooses not to clothe herself afterwards? That seems like quite a stretch of the imagination, even for a Kojima title. Hideo might add some context to it later on but the core reasons for it are apparent now. But should it detract from the experience of the game? I don't think so.

KonsoruMasuta1441d ago (Edited 1441d ago )

Halo does look generic. Nothing about it is really that great.

And as another user stated; why didn't you have a problem with the cortana model in Halo 4?

Septic1441d ago (Edited 1441d ago )

@KonsoruMasuta

"And as another user stated; why didn't you have a problem with the cortana model in Halo 4?"

If you're directing the question at me, look at my first post.

Clarence1441d ago (Edited 1441d ago )

There is nothing unique about halo character design. It's very generic and boring, just like the game.

The artist for metal gear Yoji Shinkawa would easily out design all the character artist for halo.

http://www.vg247.com/2013/0...

Clarence1441d ago

Well why not make Cortana, a old over weight AI? This guy is a hypocrite.

Septic1441d ago

@Clarence

Yeah because that will really enhance the affinity between the player and Cortana right?

Look at Halsey for proof.

snipes1011441d ago

Why are people surprised that the Japanese are making something exploitative? Look at half the shit that comes out of there: Rumble Roses, Dead or Alive Beach Volleyball, most fighting games - they love exploiting women. I don't agree with it, but it's hardly shocking to see another game do it.

Also, this isn't the first time that MGS has done this with women. Remember all those tit shots of Naomi in 4? What about all the bosses in that game that were dressed in those tight ass body suits? This isn't the first or the last time we'll see something like this.

As a side note, for someone to call Halo 4's art generic, I don't agree. Of course it was inspired by Alien - the developers have said so in the past. I don't see anything in the Alien movies that resembles the forerunner structures, though. Also, I have seen people say "Alien and other sci-fi franchises" do any of these people want to be specific, instead of making generalizations?

Withdreday1441d ago

To be honest with you, a guy of this caliber has no business going after Kojima.

Imagine if a production designer of some Transformer movie all of a sudden came out and said questioned a guy like Steven Spielberg and the direction of his latest film. He'd get puzzled looks all over the industry. That's exactly what's happening here. Some small potato going after a legend over his creative choices.

To me, this is more than likely 99% this guy trying to make a name for himself than him actually being offended by the character design, make no mistake about it.

Also, how will this effect future MGS games on Xbox if you have guys from your first party studio ripping the guy that made it?

Could MGS6 be a PS4 exclusive? I say that likelihood just increased 10 fold.

pedrof931441d ago

Because 343 are the best right ?

What about Cortana ?

spicelicka1441d ago

Even though I don't like cortanas sex appeal, there's a good reason and context for her being that way. According to the story shes a very high ranking A.I. and her creator designed her like that intentionally so that when she gave orders or whatnot, the soldiers would listen, specially the males tend to be a lot more receptive to orders if they're given from a sexy female.

Beyond that, cortana is a hologram, her appearance can be anything and 343 dont post half naked models of her just for sex appeal. Its fine if there's a reason for these models to be like that in game, which i doubt, but kojima is clearly advertising her sexuality.

And for the people saying theres shirtless males too, well instead using that justification, why dont u just argue sex selling is wrong either way.

TheDevKit1441d ago

I'd just like to remind you that you're on N4G.

extermin8or1441d ago (Edited 1441d ago )

Hahahahaha I'm sorry but it might play well and is very popular but halo has for me and I'm sure many other become synonymous with "generic space marine design" the only game I'd say fits a generic stereotype is gears of war which has the whole generic steroid addled marine hardman/women thing going on with giant guns to compensate for...other things :p Although Quiets clothing I agree makes no sense, infact when me and my mate watched the E3 trailer we both burst out lauhing when we saw her because her attire was so rediculous. But tbh MGS isn't known for it's realism now is it? :p I doubt this hs been done JUST to sell more. There will be some story reason or symbolism in the way she dresses. Although I suspect she doesn't dress like that before she's tortured (see E3 trailer)a s that trailer suggests the electric current torture is what ruins her tights... but whatever. It's not like it's only the women in mgs that have this weird hyper sexuality thing accross the games... I mean did no one ever tell vamp to put a bloody shirt on for starters. Or liquid for tat matter who I seem to remember sheds half his clothing before the final fight in mgs4?

roboteye1441d ago

I wouldn't call Halo 4's blatant inspiration from Tron "unique" ;)

JD_Shadow1441d ago

So, let me see if I got this straight. Females can't CHOOSE to use the freedoms they are given to want to bare their midriff, or be sexy or whatnot? Please tell me we're not shoving morality down throats here. We should tell females, then, that it's not okay to let their hair down and just be themselves if being themselves means showing off? If a female is strong willed and smart, then she can dress however the hell she WANTS to be dressed, and any author has the right to show that she HAS that freedom to do whatever the hell she wants to do and to dress however she wants to dress. We're pushing for females to be presented as equals in games, yet we want to force them into a situation where they can't dress "sexy" if they choose to dress like that while men can be near naked? C'mon!

For the record, 343 doesn't know how this character will act, what her personalty is, or any of that.

dmeador1441d ago

@darkpower
So, let me see if I got this straight, if a woman doesn't choose to be strong willed, and is stupid, then she CANT make her own decisions on how she dresses?

Dont put words in peoples mouths, and get off your soap box. Most of peoples points are that woman should not be portrayed as just images to get guys going, and that their personality/character dev shouldn't be watered down.

And yes a woman can dress how she wants, but dont expect her to be taken seriously if she is just trying to get a certain reaction from the male population.

And to get on MY soapbox: It is ironic to me how some feminist use their sexuality as a way to show they are "equal" to men, when the very nature of it is to gain power over them

Deadpoolio1441d ago

Uh OH butt hurt Halo Xbot...Yes Halo is generic....Halo seemed to somehow get even more generic when Bungie left and 343 made 4....Halo has been generic since 3

cyclindk1441d ago

Skyboxes... Really? How about the more prominent designs, like BMX bicycle body armor yay!

TheBlackSmoke1441d ago

Halo is not generic, dat masterchief poncho changed the game.

Ps4marksthespotnotX1441d ago

It's a game the designer can do whatever they want, isin't that what games should be about creativity and fun. Why should all games have to cohere to this as real as possible approach, look what it did for GTA IV, nothing!

Ritsujun1441d ago

Says the girl that designed Heylow 4. LOOOL.

ChrisW1441d ago

As I said before... Typical Japanese marketing!

dantesparda1441d ago (Edited 1441d ago )

"Halo is known for it's unique design, with really weird Forerunner structures and beautiful sky boxes. How on Earth is it generic?"

What!? WTF are you smoking Halo is very generic and always has been. And also Reach a masterpiece? I can barely stand to play the game and the graphics suck and i really liked Halo 1 and like Masterchief (corny name though), but since then the series has just gone downhill for me

Evilsnuggle1441d ago

Loved halo1 and 2 Halo is lame and has jumped the shark NUFF SAID

1441d ago
Evilsnuggle1440d ago (Edited 1440d ago )

Hideo Kojima

Metal Gear Solid 5 >HALO 5 NUFF SAID

JD_Shadow1440d ago

@dmeador:

Who's putting words in whose mouth again? I didn't see me saying that anyone CAN'T dress how they want if they didn't possess strong will and determination. I didn't even imply that! You're trying to find a way to incriminate something I said...why, exactly? Do you think women SHOULDN'T be allowed to dress however they want without the morality police knocking on their proverbial door? Hey, you implied that I said something! How does it feel when the shoe's on the other foot?

You know what I was saying. Of course some people that get on their own soapboxes (like you did before you said you were getting on yours, not seeing that you were already ON one) are going to say "how dare you dress like that" or "you're just contributing to the male patriarchy" when the people bitching might as well be contributing themselves. If someone doesn't like women being able to dress like that, then they should move to a country where women would KILL for such a freedom!