The Witness which was announced at the PS4 reveal conference supposedly wants 5GB RAM, according to creator Jonathon Blow.
So it's basically maxed out the Xbox One?
so hes just speaking the truth. no worries
Cheap??? Ooooooooooo Geeeeeez!
BUT BUT BUT the cloud would add 20gb more RAM in the future! The only one claims that is Microsoft and even PC makers deny the possibility of that. Since they saw there is a majority of people could be tricked, might as well, spend less to make more, even if deception is involved.
Let the tears flow.
360 and PS3 both uses the DDR3 and they were released 8 & 7 years ago. It's fact that DDR3 modules are cheap.
@Enemy Oh, yes. Yes, indeed. http://24.media.tumblr.com/...
@ Enemy Tears are indeed tasty lol.
@badz149 You're kinda off 360 uses 512 ddr3 ram ps3 uses 256 xdr main ram + 256 gddr3 vram
The truth is that his PS4 game is so bloated to be using 5 GB of ram. He should start optimizing his code without hating on MS
@ husomc While I agree with the first part of your comment. I doubt he's "hating on Microsoft" by stating facts.
these words coming from the mouth of a dev who used to back Microsoft might hurt them.. and at the same time they are the only ones to blame. Greatness awaits 4>1
Tears for Jonathon Blow? Lol! No sir, I don't think so.
What?? A game like this uses 5GB of RAM? Hhaha! There's not a single PC game that uses that much (all run at 2 GB) and his"amazing game" is so high tech it uses 5GB? Dude needs to learn how to optimize. I can give you a JPEG file hat is 50 MB or I can optimize it to a loseless 800KB. How about that Jonathan Blow?
BF3 ultra settings on PC use 3gb to 4gb of RAM, The witness cartoon-isn dated graphics use 5gb of RAM, seems legit.
Cartoony graphics and dated graphics are not the same thing.
for those above who are saying the game is badly optimized @husomc and @TheSurg that is the point he said more ram means devs need to spend less time trying to optimise and cram the game in and spend more time making the game better. besides you'd have to be a moron to be given 8gb of ram to play but still try to make it only use 2gb if its there make the most of it. i think the fact that the witness uses 5gb of ram means that the whole map is loaded at the same time.
If game like that uses 5GB of ram, damn, that seems to be not optimized at all, just grinding on the machine's performance.
so why again are some people still buying the xbox one? i dont get it because xbox one sucks pretty hard lol.
@TheSurg Blow actually wrote "The Witness wants to use over 5GB right now". he didnt say his game requires 5GB to run, after being optimized. he basically said the more RAM you have in a system, the less you need to optimize (which is undeniably true). optimization demands time. not having to spend time on optimization, means you can instead spend THAT time on making the game better by polishing it or adding more content to it. btw, how many people do u think work on The Witness? i doubt the team is as big as those who worked on FC3, C3 or BF3. this is an indie game (and it looks damn good) so please quit the BS comparison.
He is definitely hating on MS, has bitched and whined non stop since PS4 was announced... so, ok. Do not develop for Xbox, limit your audience.... simple..
Now, I'm not trying to defend the Xbone, and I am certainly glad Sony went with GDDR5, but it is a highly known fact that Jonathan Blow despises M$ right now. I would take anything he says regarding anything Xbox with a grain of salt.
As far as we can tell from this article though, he didn't say anything objectionable. His game uses 5GB of RAM and DDR3 is cheaper than GDDR5. He may be disgruntled but he's not lying. Though I suppose it's possible he made his game use that much RAM on purpose so he could complain about running out of RAM. lol
He doesn't despise Microsoft. He despises the way they treat indie developers like dirt. On top of that, he despises anti-consumerism. He's no longer sugarcoating his concerns, he's just telling it like it is. He's also calling them out on their "cloud computing" lies. If you follow his Twitter, you'd know he's just waiting for them to tell the truth.
I did follow JB until his anti MS rhetoric became a problem for me.
@enemy That's just more reasons why you can't expect him to be objectionable. His comment may very well be valid. But, you have to agree that this comment would be far more damning if say, Pete Hines from Bethesda said it. At the risk of sounding like an Xbone supporter, I thought it was only fair to point this out. I will not be buying the Xbone, nor would I recommend anyone to. I'd just like some more devs to pony up and proclaim the same.
what he said is factually correct... also I'm wondering how his game is using 5 gigs of ram... my guess is the PC version uses 4... max
not just jonathon blow but all indie devs hate microsoft for the way they treat them when they try to publish their games on the xbox and rightly so. games can't be published on xbox live without a publisher (which defeats the purpose of being an indie dev) and the game has to have sold twice as much at retail then it has digitally which is impossible for indie games.
Look if Crysis and Skyrim can run on ps3's 256mb RAM then 5GB is overkill end of ? And with Havok nextgen u can basically compress 5GB of texture ram to 512MB so all this ram rules is nonsense and graphics can only be as good as your gpu and gpu bandwidth ect more RAM just means zero compression even on huge games,in other words if u make a game using 4GB memory,2GB for textures and 2GB for everything else,it can be compressed using havok down to half a GB easy.
Damn and it didn't even come out yet!!!
Xbox one: obsolete before it hits the ground.
So is the PS4. Guess you forgot to mention that.
@mr_nuts I don't think this game is coming to xbone at launch. @badz149 the ps360 use gddr3,the difference is its faster and graphic specific in comparison to DDR3.
Actually @badz149 is completely wrong and @jivah is partially wrong. The Xbox 360 uses 512MB (shared) of GDDR3 RAM. The PS3 has 256MB XDR and 256MB GDDR3. GDDR3 is basically DDR2 with a few modifications. GDDR5 is based on DDR3. GDDR5 advantage is higher bandwidth and disadvantage is higher latency.
wow Mr_Nuts when you put it that way... that's sad. No offense, the Witness looks alright, but I wasn't impressed... Next thing on XB is COD... 8 bit.
Ha. he called it an Xbone.
Maxing out consoles is a total lie, its never "maxed". I think it was a ND employee that said it best. Its like filling a cup with rocks and saying we filled the cup, but then a dev turns those rocks to pebbles, its more in the same space. Then a dev makes some of those pebbles dirt, then a dev adds water the fill areas, it goes on and on.
There are different speeds of DDR3 ram. Most modules are 1333-1600mhz but you can get ram well above 2000mhz. The main thing is gpu speed. PS4's gpu is the equivalent of a 7880 so its decent in comparison to current commercial gpus. Crysis 3 maxed out on pc only needs 3gb ram so ram isn't everything. The only thing that drags the PS4 down is the weak cpu. Though the console is a mile better than Xbox One.
7880 doesn't exist m8 , it's equivalent to 7850 :D , cheers
I know it doesn't exists but it is basically in between a 7870 and 7890 in performance.
I guess this confirms that the "O' so smart" Xbox One "Surface" UI uses 3GB. So much for being able to watch movies and playing games-while-watching-tv-while watching-another-movie-at-the- same-time, huh?
Wow! Jonathan actually used 5GB of RAM? Seriously? At this point it is pretty damn clear that Blow is a practically a shill for Sony. There is no way there is a need for 5GB of RAM on his shitty game. Blow needs to optimize his game instead of talking smack.
if this guy knew how to code properly this game could have easily run on a PS3.
Seems kinda strange that BF3 on my PC (with ALL of the overhead that comes with windows) only uses about 3.5-4gigs of RAM even when running maxed in stereoscopic 3D but his game running on a console that doesn't go above 1080p resolution is using 5gigs of RAM. Granted my PC doesn't share RAM with the GPU but that still seems like sloppy coding on the part of his dev team. However his statement is still 100% correct. The RAM in the Xbox1 is dirt cheap. I can pick up 8gigs of DDR3 for like $56.00 USD. (and that is the retail price) http://www.newegg.com/Produ...
The meaning of " cheap " In game developers standpoint : Cheap = weak = Old = Not recommended = PS = WTF " I wish you All Great Day Today , E3 starts today ...... and Its historical day today enjoy the Great Gaming News ONLY in NG4 !
Except that "cheap" DDR3 RAM in current PCs is more than capable of outdoing what is in the next gen consoles. The problem with the fact that the "cheap" RAM being in the xbox1 is that the video card is sharing slow(er) RAM with the video card. Using GDDR5 as system RAM is overkill and not needed and in some ways counter intuitive. But since the PS4 is a unified memory system it will benefit the APU better than Microsoft solution. So no. the meaning of cheap does not = weak inherently. Even in this context.
That exactly what I meant !
welll...xbone is going down...
Everybody knows Jonathon Blow is in bed with Sony... can't take him seriously.
MS rattled this Blow guy so hard he's still talking about them. He's like the rattled ex boy friend that was dumped by the hot chick.
but but later the so called cloud is going to help out the now obsolete ddr3 lol like sony cant do cloud has well yeah right Microsoft epic fail
The comment section should be good lol.
? Is there a possibility, of you going ss3 o great prince?
dont hurt his pride dude :P
Why would he when he can just go SS4?
@Dragonknight He can't do it if we take away his Action Replay aka Bulma lol
No he has to go ss god
Hence the bubbles reset. Pour your comment guys!!!
All I'm hearing is a dev who's going to the complaining in a couple of years that the PS4 doesn't have enough power. How he has to work to get anything extra out of it.
But PS4 has GDDR5 and only 1 OS.
And by most counts devs never tapped the PS3's true potential because of the extra effort involved. That's including first party. Just saying its not a good thing hearing devs talking about maxing out a system early.
@Godmars290 I'm pretty sure the first gears used all of the 360's ram when it fist came out so this isn't that much of an issue. What amazes me is that the game requires 5gb of ram that's either very poorly coded or freaking massive
Da memory leaks :D
"But PS4 has GDDR5 and only '1 OS.'" https://mobile.twitter.com/...
I've heard only 6 gigs will be usable... but 5 maybe if you use some of the social features?
I kind of got that vibe too. I mean I'm all for Sony right now, but the Killzone demo they showed was reported to use 1.5GB of ram, which is what the average PC game uses, so I'm wondering what he's putting into all that memory. I mean it may be an interesting game, I'll give it the benefit of the doubt right now, but The Witness looked to be nowhere close to Killzone's graphical level, and him having a small team means it's likely that it has a lot less going on at one time than KZ does as well. Even bloated code can slow down processing, so it doesn't mean memory management can go out the window just because you have a crap load to work with. I know he was talking about a lot of texture effects and stuff, but even still, you can't force the GPU to do more than it can handle, so there are still restrictions on the processing power of the unit. I dunno, maybe he just has huge world that use a lot of culling to pull them off, in which case, yeah more memory could play a part.
If you go back and listen to the reveal Jonathan reveals that there is 25 hours of gameplay.. That is a ridiculous amount of gametime which could help explain the amount of RAM usage..
I suppose if he loaded the entire game in one go sure. But that's not how it's done. Games are loaded in what's called a scene. That scene makes up everything that you can possibly see, and all the script that goes along with it. Basically an entire level is a scene. More often than not, the entire scene isn't rendered at one time, and things like occlusion culling will be used in order to make a world look bigger. What this does is only draw the stuff that you can see. Think of walking through a tunnel in a game. you look to both ends but you can't see the world outside the tunnel. They do this in order to load different parts of the world, although both sides can reside in memory at the same time, just not both be displayed at the same time. If you didn't have some way to break it up, there would be pauses as the graphics processor tries to render both scenes at the same time. I'm pretty sure even the fastest Titan GPU can't render an entire scene with none of these graphical "tricks" that requires 5GB's of data at one time. He did mention some graphics stuff, and obviously more memory will be required for that next gen, but it could be that he has many parts of the world loaded into memory at any given time for quick access or whatever. Anyways, it's all speculation on my part what he's using it for. I haven't seen the game. I trust his word on it, and I'm sure he's putting it to good use for something. He's not a hack developer, and anyone saying he's lazy because of this doesn't really understand how the engine works under the hood when it comes to game programming.