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Why the PS4 will be much more powerful than the Xbox One

The question of whether to buy Microsoft or Sony for your home games console has never been as important. Not only are the Xbox One and PS4 launching at roughly the same time – a first in the history of these series – they are also to sell at a similar price.

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Cpamann1159d ago TrollingShowReplies(11)
M-M1159d ago

The PS4 will be more powerful than the Xbox One because Sony made smarter decisions when it came down to the system's architecture.

SilentNegotiator1159d ago

But...but I.R. lovingz the forced online! I.R. streaming the RAM! It make Xbox One more powerful and definitely not cause worse responses time!

GameNameFame1159d ago

first each data centers are not each server. LOL thats delusional.

Each data center each hold thousands if not hundred thousand. it all varies per location. and MS is building 300k.doesnt have it currently

and you cant run graphics rendering on server. Thats not what MS wants to do. they want to "compute non latency sensitive"

not graphics dear fanboys. meaning graphics gonna the same. Unless u want to do graphics rendering on server. oh wait. that is gaikai.

SilentNegotiator1159d ago (Edited 1159d ago )

You know what? All viability aside, I think there's something more important here:

How many developers would go through the extra trouble to create all of those additional complex pieces of coding just to offload some computing? They have new hardware to work with and already made plenty of great games the last few years, even though the consoles were aging.

What would make doing that so pressing to developers?

PLASTICA-MAN1159d ago

Let's see why: http://www.neogaf.com/forum...

PS4 will use its entire GPU power compared to 90% usage in Xbox One of its inferior GPU.

PS4 will use between 7 and 8 gb of its GDDR5 memory compared to 5 of 8 GB DDR3 with less brandwidth availabe on X1.

PS4 will a dedicated ARM Cortex processor for coding/decoding and will use its 8 faster core (rumoured to run at 2 Ghz each) while XBone will only have access to 6 cores running at 1.6 Ghz each.

This is the comparison, the X1 will have to rely on (cheat with) Cloud Computing to compensate its weakness: http://www.neogaf.com/forum...

SolidStoner1159d ago

This far I wished Xbone to be as powerful, as the ps4, it would at last bring peace to game port differences... but after seeing MS xbone release, it felt in a lost deep, deep black hole, much much deeper that Wii U is now!

So I dont care, even if xbone is now 10 times more powerful than anything else, I still would not buy it! MS is just doing nasty crazy stuff.. they have to rethink the concept from zero, or it can do harm for everyone...

SecondSon1159d ago

Just to clarify something that even this article seems to have missed is that the 32MB eSRAM buffer on the Xbox One which runs at 102GB/s and is used as a dedicated framebuffer. 32MB should be enough for 2 1080p frames to be drawn up.

PS4 doesn't have a dedicated frame buffer but due to the speeding fast 176GB/s GDDR5 Ram it can easily use 102GB/s per second and still be left with 74GB/s to process everything else.

The buffer is used 30-60 times a second depending on the number of frames per second and without it you would get a black screen.

So the result is 74GB/s on the PS4 and 68.3 GB/s on the Xbox One.

Final verdict.
----------------------------- ----------------
Xbox One allocates 5GB of RAM at 68.3GB/s to games.

PS4 allocates 7GB of RAM at 74GB/s to games.

PS4's GDDR5 gives developers the option of choosing how much bandwidth their frame buffer will use up per second (remember the higher the resolution and frames the more will be required).

Xbox One eSRAM is separate and will not be available for much else then buffering frames as its only 32MB.

Slight advantage to the PS4 however GDDR5 has not been used in such a way in previous consoles or PCs so perhaps there are more tricks up its sleeve that we do not know yet. From what Sony has said developers asked for it so no doubt it will be as good or better than a DDR3 plus dedicated frame buffer alternative.

Excited for this gen!

Ju1158d ago

"PS4 allocates 7GB of RAM at 74GB/s to games."

LOL. Whut? Kidding me? This must be the biggest attempt of simple minded math I have yet heard here on N4G. Awesome.

SecondSon1158d ago

@Ju I didn't make those calculations myself but I didn't think they were wrong when I read them. If the GDDR5 is being used as a frame buffer 30-60 times a second around 100GB/s will be required to process the frames. Only a tiny portion of the 8GBs of memory but a substantial portion of the bandwidth.

If 102GB/s were being used as a frame buffer then you wouldn't be able to use more than the remaining 74GB/s.

Please correct me if I am wrong here Ju and tell me why cause I really can't see it. I am just trying to figure some stuff out, I am not trying to deceive people -.-

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fr0sty1159d ago

it's all in the cloud maaaaan. 300,000 servers are gonna make it all ok. who cares if they can only communicate at between 3mbps to 2gbps max, at between 8-200ms of delay per command! the cloud is the magical answer that will make up all the difference. 4K gaming is coming to Xbone from these super-servers!

zebramocha1159d ago (Edited 1159d ago )

Here's a performance chart between xbone & ps4.

@foxdie look at the related image,it's suppose to be a joke.

FOXDIE1159d ago (Edited 1159d ago )

chill, hes being sarcastic!

Freak of Nature1159d ago

....

the 300k server number is worthless since that doesn't mean 300k machines, just a lot of machines running 300k virtual machine instances-enhance the power of the console by offloading calculations to a server which provides a better game experience...

If microsoft figured out how to enhance the power by offloading calculations to a server providing a much better gaming experience they would have been singing this to the high heavens...

Boody-Bandit1159d ago (Edited 1159d ago )

@fr0sty

WAIT A MINUTE!
Are you telling me this cloud thing is just a smoke and mirrors / dog and pony show? Not from MS. Not from the company that brought us the amazing Natal that will have such amazing AI to have experiences like Milo and being able to use are whole body as a controller in mainstream gaming. No way! You are just joking or being overly sarcastic. Oh wait, you are.

You can give a blind mind new eyes but they will see things they way it best suits their needs. Let them line up like sheep and help MS dismantle an industry most of us, including the sheep, love. No biggie, right?

NextGen24Gamer1159d ago

Anyone who thinks that Sony's purchase of Gaikai means that they even the playing field with what MS is doing with their 300,000 servers giving extra power to the xbox ones is living in the clouds...The reality is Gaikai as of 2012 only had 12 datacenters/servers on deck> LOL...LOL...While that's enough for their web based game streaming service...but its not even in the same realm as what Microsoft is doing. Grasp your minds around that...300,000 servers/data centers to Sonys 12. LOL...Which is why the xbox one is future proof and on every BOX it states..."Powered by the Cloud".

Like I said before, even if Sony tried to catch up, they are 7 years behind Microsoft as of now. The bottom line is that xbox one was built from the ground up to be cloud powered and future proof. Sony just basically purchased a game cloud streaming service company for a few million dollars that has 12 measily servers. LOL...But Sony fans always say..."We can do that too"..LOL Funny stuff people!

Here is a quote from Gaikai

So with a single server in a single location we can run our "network" at 100 percent capacity 24/7, but we’ll be turning away tens of thousands of potential players every hour.

"In reality I expect to launch in about a dozen datacenters across North America and Europe to ensure coverage, with the servers un-evenly distributed across them based on population density. We’ll constantly be expanding our network coverage."

PANTHER10301159d ago

These servers are dedicated more for storing and streaming. It's very difficult to have a real time data processing with these servers, because: first you would need a fastest internet connection and second, for contents at 1080 and 60 FPS is unlikely to compute the server's data mixed with console's data without have large loading times and slow reponse at playing.

fr0sty1159d ago (Edited 1159d ago )

@Freak

exactly, they claim that they are going to have 3 servers running on each xbox with 300,000 servers (this is how they backtracked when approached on how they expected a 300% increase in power when using the cloud). If that were true, after 100k players their system would be maxed out and the game would have to run in "standard xbox one" mode for the rest of the world.

Even with these servers, the horribly slow latency and small bandwidth pipe of most internet connections means there are only certain very specialized calculations that would be able to be completed by the server and returned to Xbox One's CPU/GPU in time for rendering of the frame (which at 60fps occurs every 16.67ms).

S2Killinit1159d ago (Edited 1159d ago )

Elite24 just doesn't give up hehehe. Gaikai is the second largest game streaming in the world just for your information. (after Onlive) Look it up. Not sure where you get your numbers, but its irrelevant. There are countless articles and developers going on record about how the whole "cloud will make such and such more powerful" is utter bull crap. Please look it up.
By the way "on every box it says powered by the cloud"? You've seen the box? What does it look like?

b777conehead1159d ago

elite you are full of hot air. sony is not 7 years behind microsoft.

fr0sty1158d ago (Edited 1158d ago )

Then there's the fact that Microsoft flat out lied about having 300k servers running Xbox Live's cloud gaming, when in reality those are virtual machines running on a much smaller number of ACTUAL physical servers. Even the creator of Braid was quick to call them out on that BS.

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Mariusmssj1159d ago

I will not ague specs but it's not that surprising Sony is a hardware manufacturer, While M$ is a software developer.

koolaid2511159d ago

Software makes the hardware work lol

SecondSon1159d ago

Hardware without Software is Hardware.
Software without Hardware is Non-existent.

KimiRaikkonen1159d ago

And my pc is twice as powerful than the ps4 and its going to get even more powerful by the the time ps4 launches and make it look even more dated.

SpinalRemains1159d ago (Edited 1159d ago )

But no one writes articles about, or wants your rig.

Consoles rule gaming.

Always have, always will.

MysticStrummer1159d ago (Edited 1159d ago )

"And my pc is twice as powerful than the ps4 and its going to get even more powerful by the the time ps4 launches and make it look even more dated."

And that means almost nothing for gaming because the vast majority of developers aren't going to spend time and money optimizing their games for bleeding edge PCs that represent less than 10% of the market.

Tr10wn1159d ago (Edited 1159d ago )

Why would they make an article that make sense here in N4G!? no ones care the PS4 is outdated at launch it still gonna rock even if it doesn't make sense.

"And that means almost nothing for gaming because the vast majority of developers aren't going to spend time and money optimizing their games for bleeding edge PCs that represent less than 10% of the market"

I wonder how they come with DX10 and DX11.... hmmm ohhh thats right it was develop on the PS3 and then ported to PC, yeah yeah that make sense, those countless games that took advantage of DX10/11 which they develop on a console are awesome....

titletownrelo1159d ago

sigh*, there are three sides to these kinds of arguments.

PC supremacists: "My PC is...is, OVER 9,000!hamehamehaaahhhh!"

Console Fanboys:"Uhhhh, nuh-uh...

and rich posers:"I've had every gaming console since the history of gaming was introduced to the f*cking Universe!" [Seananner's nerd voice]

nypifisel1159d ago

I too got an expensive high end PC that silicon to silicon would beat any upcoming consoles ass in pure muscle. HOWEVER

My PC wasn't made to be a gaming machine. It's a resource hog for things better left to a game. I'm even unsure whether I've actually even played a game that utilize more than 2 GB of RAM, or more than 2 Cores, I've never seen a game built with DX11 from ground up.. Do you see the pattern?

I don't even own a console, yet I know enough about hardware that your claims are stupid and doesn't mean anything. A game designed for PS4 will utilize all the things PC games haven't yet, like all memory, multiple cores etc.

Try to run The Last of Us on a computer from 2006, it's impossible! PCs needs substantially more powerful hardware than a console cause the PC leaks resources on so many things. I play ALL my games on PC but I know better than being stupid like you.

PANTHER10301159d ago (Edited 1159d ago )

"And my pc is twice as powerful than the ps4 ",then your machine is ready for play GTA V, GT 6, Destiny. Ops....no Pc version, sorry.

AngryEnglish1159d ago

Kimi But nobody cares how proud you are of your masturbation station, this article has nothing to do with that.....

MuhammadJA1158d ago

You're right, my friend. All the responses you'll get will be off topic like. "PC gaming suck, PCs are expensive, console exclusives are better, bla bla bla".

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fullmetal2971159d ago

What are you talking about? They use the same AMD Jaguar chipset. I think you mean they use faster RAM and a better GPU...

Oschino19071159d ago

Not sure what MS has done but Sony def customized the chip to their liking, MS couldn't have the same chip without paying Sony.

Maybe MS did some custom work on it themselves but they were so vague about system specs no one other then MS knows for sure.

waltercross1159d ago

Actually they use the same Chip, but the PS4 uses a custom GPU.

3-4-51159d ago

Sony - " Let's see what the dev's want this console to be. What would help them ?

Microsoft - " ok we invested a billion dollars in this...We have to push A,B,C,D,E, & F and we will throw in G just to keep them happy."

Nicxel1159d ago

LULZ you sir have not read up on their interviews and articles. PS4 is more powerful in the box compared to the xbox. but in some years time the tech inside the box wont matter and the power will be rendered or come from the Azure Cloud. Meaning no more new hardware as the cloud will continue to update the hardware used on their servers while the pS4 will become outdated and Sony will have to have a new investment into make a PS5 to keep up with the specs.

So, out of the box, PS4 is stronger. Over their lifetime, Xbox will be stronger. End of story.

chaos-lockheart1159d ago

there is a limit for cloud gaming graphics, resolution will suck. Raw graphics will be better then cloud graphics. plus there are a lot of downside to cloud gaming. Meaning you will never own the game, bad connections, company goes out of biz no games for you( even the mightiest can fall), server maintenance, etc

kayoss1159d ago

Your internet goes down your cloud gaming is jacked. Sony have cloud gaming but that's just and option for the ps4, all raw power and computing will be done on the ps4. If ms plan on having thier cloud do all the computing for a game your internet goes down your xbox one is a useless paper weight. The 300,000 server ms mention could be virtual servers and we all know virtual servers are crap.

waltercross1159d ago

@ Nicxel

Well, if everything is on the cloud eventually you'll need to be Online 24/7 even in single player mode and if The internet goes out or lags then BAM...your Console is shit, do you really want that?

rainslacker1159d ago

Hurray for cloud I guess. Wonder why Gaikai got so much hate before last week?

Asynchronous off-site computing. Something MS has been doing for quite some time with their cloud system. It works quite well for productivity or consumer software, and you don't even need a super backbone internet to use it.

For a game loop which processes more data than any other type of consumer level software per cycle at 60 cycles a second though? That requires a lot of raw resources on the part of the servers, and a huge amount of internet to back up.

It's good for performing a bunch of small tasks which aren't critical for the game loop to complete...for instance some enemy is far off the screen, but moving towards you, and you could program it's reactive AI as opposed to something simpler in a normal loop model. But for the demanding tasks that go through the CPU/GPU at 60 times a second, it just isn't practical.

The internet doesn't even work that fast by it's very nature, and there's no way to transfer that much discrete date 60 times a second. Claiming the internet itself can handle the amount of power that 3 Xbox Ones could perform 60 times a second is just ludicrous, hence, any advancement in game play isn't going to be real time, which is pretty much how it's handled now if it isn't important enough to add to the game loop in the first place.

SpitFireAce851159d ago

Yeah that's why people upgrade their gaming PCs..
Why not just use the cloud right s/.

DarkHeroZX1158d ago

Lol Sony has a better cloud service available to them dude.

Morpheuzpr1158d ago

Even if "THE CLOUD" was actually a viable way you are essentially telling me that you would buy a presumably $400-500 console just to stream cloud games?

What about the cost of XBL if that's the case? You think that if "THE CLOUD" is basically the hardware and the actual XBONE just a "key" to its content they would keep XBL at the current price.

Maybe that's their plan all along. First get people accustomed to the idea of paying to be able to play the games that they already payed for (XB360) and then make them pay to be able to play the console they already payed for (XBONE). I got to give it to them, that is brilliant.

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50Terabytespersec1159d ago

Simple enough one word we all look at when we buy a GPU card!
BANDWIDTH!!!!!!
The size of RAM is Right but the Bandwidth is Phenominal!!!!
It is a shame there is no ability to Raid0 2 or 3 250MBps SSD drives!! and utilize this !with games installed on the Hard drive OMFG!!!!!
But im happy with old streaming technology and mechanical HD as long as that RAM and Bandwidth is kicking ass!!! I LOVE !!! IT PS4!!!!

DarkHeroZX1158d ago

4 is bigger than 1 that is why.

Kohven1158d ago

As powerful as the PS4 may be...I find it rather funny that it will not play games in 4k...but the "XBone" will.

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Aquarhane1159d ago (Edited 1159d ago )

To me it just comes down to the games, not the power of the console. It has been like that with me for a long time.

InTheZoneAC1159d ago

and with that in mind xbox has never been an option for me

Godmars2901159d ago (Edited 1159d ago )

The Xbox might actually be more powerful, but only when its online.

And more than likely you'll have to have a Gold XBL account.

@Gimmemorebubblez:
I expect Sony plans to use Gakai to wrangle PS+ subscriptions. Stuff its library with BC PS1/PS2/PS3 games.

Also thinking that XBL is going to see a couple of price hikes.

Gimmemorebubblez1159d ago (Edited 1159d ago )

Gakai also has the ability to boost system performance.
And just think considering that OnLive which could run games @ 720p @ 30fps required a fast and stable connection, streaming games in Full HD and above may not be feasible for most people.

sourav931159d ago

Actually, onlive now streams at 60fps (played witcher 2 yesterday; buttery smoothness of 60fps). But of course, the resolution is crap. Just wanted to point that out.

Ju1159d ago (Edited 1159d ago )

Speaking of Gaikai...I think it won't be what it was [when Sony bought it], but (!) they integrated a lot (!) of Gaikai tech into the console - which nobody seems to even remember.

- Custom cpu (a full ARM "computer") doing all the network traffic - which is huge! Network cards with custom CPUs are freaking expensive in current PCs. Those offload all packet encoding/decoding from the OS/main cpu

- HW encode/decode units to actually allow compressed data streaming without CPU load. This again is huge (required for remote video streaming).

Now, we are speaking about cloud. This is a fundamental advantage in cloud computing. And yet, the one who is trying to sell us on the cloud does have none of this.

Makes you wonder. But same ol, same ol. Marketing money beats engineering budget. Didn't work against Apple, did it?

rainslacker1159d ago (Edited 1159d ago )

@sour

Sony has some dedicated codec chip which could theoretically help with the resolution/graphics quality that you speak of. I'm not sure if that's what it's going to be used for, but no doubt they would want to keep traffic as low as possible, and compression is one way to achieve that.

Not sure if MS has something similar, but given what I saw at the conference, it's safe to assume that there may be.

@Ju
It's hard to say what MS has in their system to facilitate all this stuff in their system. They may be using cloud now as an afterthought to the system because Sony is so big in it. The MS cloud was already in place before the Xbox, so this expansion may not be completely xbox related. Assuming all 300K servers will be used for Xbox is even stretching it IMO, since that's a lot of money.

I believe MS cloud is an all in one thing for all it's cloud services. Whether it can do the same in the box through hardware is unknown, because we know so little about the system

Dr Pepper1159d ago

Would the Xbox really be the powerful item then? Or would the power really be at the source of all that streaming data? The Xbox would then just be a middleman, not more or less powerful than it already is.

This talk really reminds me of the Cell when the PS3 was first being talked about. Sure, the PS3 went on to support great, high quality, exclusive games. But it really got in the way for some popular titles as well. I hope MS isn't relying too much on something that most developers will potentially see as an obstacle/hassle rather than a benefit.

Muerte24941159d ago (Edited 1159d ago )

just wanted to point out that the RSX held back ps3 significantly. The CELL was performing basic geometric rendering to lighten the workload of the RSX. Mark Cerny said the people who've gained experience programming for the CELL will be able to do that with PS4 (low-level GPU access). He said this is where developer can really push ps4. They have sort of a tier system for programming by having an entry, intermediate, and advanced.

I don't get here people keep saying the for the most part games on 360 looked the same as ps3. They are not clarifying that this was only the case with exclusive where devs where just porting 360 code. Case in point, BF3 DICE has ps3 as the lead console, and it's xbox360 lagged behind heavily. When it came to exclusives, there was no question which system had more power.

Godmars2901159d ago

If you haven't noticed yet, MS seems more about appearances and what it can get away with. What it can convince people of. Like the Xbox was the cheaper console despite an ongoing subscription and expensive propitiatory HDD.

Right now they're saying that they can do something better than something people already own - cable boxes - but the specific people they're targeting likely have high end cable boxes which perform better.

Want to talk smoke and mirrors? That MS is a technical innovator or leader is the best they've pulled.

Ju1159d ago

The CELL was actually awesome if you look at what we got out from a pure SW perspective - and I am not speaking of "teh zell is so powerful".

- But it created Spurs (and probably other libraries) which for gaming is a different way of working with distributed data: jobs vs. threads.

All this works on the PS4 as well. All those CELL/SPU based job schedulers can now take advantage of an 8 core CPU. While it will require threading (read Guerilla's paper) it pushed data to low latency thread to make scheduling manageable by a job manager to simply reduce "lag" in a gaming environment (so to speak). Jobs are co-operative vs. preemtive threads. But it gives you much better control over CPU caches and per frame real time granularity than pure threads do.

PS3 forced people to think that way and today nobody would doubt that such an approach would not benefit gaming - this works quite well on a traditional architecture as well - as long as you don't flood the cores with x amount of threads.

Morpheuzpr1158d ago

The reason why some devs kept saying that the ps3 was harder to develop for is because the didn't have the luxury of just calling libraries that somebody else had worked their ass off coding (dx style). They had to know how to code to the metal, make there own tools to make the hardware do what they wanted to achieve and lest face it most so called developers are just software operators. That's exactly why licensed engines like Unreal where so popular this gen.

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Transporter471159d ago

When it comes down to it, Gaika is the best company for Cloud.

its_JEFF1159d ago

because... of the cloud?

If you really look at history, Sony did this with the PS3... remember allowing your PS3 to contribute computing power for cancer research? I really do think that cloud computing is a viable alternative... in the future.

MS has their cloud service and so does Sony, remember Gaikai? Yes, Yes I know MS has 300,000 servers. But currently that's just a claim, "Mr. Gaikai" Perry claims their building the "fastest" network in the world. Both companies are making big claims about clouds and networks but that cloud computing tech is still in its infancy. It won't be making a big impact, yet.

If you believe the claims that either side are making, 40 x more powerful being one of the more ridiculous ones, then you've fallen for their PR hook, line, and sinker!

GamersRulz1159d ago (Edited 1159d ago )

you are not serious, are you?

for the sake of argument, I will not put PS4 GDDR5 ram into equation.

Do you really think that MS can negate a 610Gflops difference in GPU power using the clouds, if So then you will be severely dissapointed AND too naive to believe this PR spin.

in case you don't understand numbers, I will make it easier for you. PS3+X360 Gpu power totaled around (430Gflops). So basically:

PS4 1.84TF > X1+PS3+X360 (1.2TF+430Gflops= 1.63TF combined.

So PS4 still has an advantage of 200Gflops over X1+PS3+X360

all that without even mentioning the blazing fast GDDR5 RAM in PS4.

also MS cloud spin was about CPU computations not GPU, they said that each X1 will have three times the CPU performance of X360 which approx 150Gflops, considering that you have blazing fast internet to achieve that. also when you consider the cloud lag and huge latancy, that makes relying on such feature meaningless and very difficult to execute.

Godmars2901159d ago

Course not.

But if MS can make it look they can get away with it...

Also surprised that no one seems to be considering that they're going to be charging for this "Triple X1". That with all they're planning, XBL can't remain at the same price.

SniperControl1159d ago

Took the words right outta my mouth.
It's laughable to think MS are quoting Nvidia GTX Titan(which runs at 4.5 teraflops) power for the XBone GPU via cloud.

sjaakiejj1159d ago

The 184Gbps bandwidth for the GPU is already considered a bottleneck. Use of the cloud would restrict that bandwidth to about 10Mbps for the average household.

Microsoft likes shouting that the cloud is going to make their console more powerful, but it's nothing more than PR nonsense - it's spinning the truth in such a way that people believe games are actually going to look better because of the cloud.

SegaSaturn6691159d ago

This xbox triple powered cloud processing sounds like the nonsensical ranting of a homeless person who has just accidentally sat on their bottle of vodka and is collecting coins to pay for a colonoscopy.

nypifisel1159d ago

Cloud computing is years away from being a reality. And how to implement this when the internet infrastructure is so uneven? Would you see games with "Only for 8 mbit connections and up"? Resources like polygons, particles, textures all need to be local.