Digital Foundry: Killzone Shadow Fall PS Meeting demo used 3GB of RAM & FXAA
Damn. 4Gb left since the OS likely uses 1Gb. That's a huge room for improvements over the years.
Just to keep things in perspective, yes, KZ:SF looked great, BUT, I could write a simple game that displays 1 pixel on screen and have it eat up 5GB if I wanted it to. So while the extra memory appears to be getting put to use, keep in mind that the amount of RAM being used isn't the end-all-be-all. Though as someone pointed out, what we saw in February was still alpha so I'll be very curious to see what we get in the Fall :)
Why would you want to put 1 pixel on screen and use up 5gb? Wouldn't you rather put a trillion pixels on screen and use up 1gb?
I curious. How'd you gonna do it? Having one pixel eating up 5GB. Would very interesting to see how how'd you do it.
I imagine it had a lot to do with the fact that the original PS4 spec was 4GB of RAM, the 8GB was added at the last minute. Reserving 1GB for the OS, running it on the remaining 3GB sounds like a plausible explanation. Chances are the next time we see the demo running it will look considerably better. That isn't to say throwing more RAM at the game will magically make all graphics better, but it definitely doesn't hurt.
@Ju 1. Make a model of a cube. 2. Apply a different 65536x65536 texture on each side of the cube. 3. Display the cube so far away in the game world so as it only occupies one pixel. Video RAM required to do this: 96 Gigabytes. I don't see the point of doing this but, as Syngamer pointed out, chewing up RAM is excessively easy to do.
E3 will be the mid-way point showing of Shadow Fall. 2 months later we will see its final version shaping up.
I think it's a safe bet that the OS is going to use more than 1GB, probably 2 at least. The Wii U uses 1 GB, and I doubt they could stream games, do background downloads and all the other things Sony claims the PS4 can do. I think since multitasking is something both Sony and Microsoft will want, these machines will need enough memory to do everything they want, and I personally don't want huge load times on applications or games.
PS4 uses a secondary chip that handles all system functions. I think they confirmed only 1gb.
@jek before the upped from 4GB to 8GB the ps4 was only using 512MB of ram for the os.
Wii U has 2gb of RAM but dedicates 1 for games and 1 for the OS/ background functions. Its 1 of the only specs we actually officially know for it. OT Shadow Fall looks great, I don't really care if its slightly better/worse looking than last light as per the argument above. It looks good and it id a launch game so is only scratching the surface of what next gen is bringing.
you sound really stupid look up the wii u last update added background installs it already did downloading it also supports downloading and installing when the system is off and seeing i can put my game in the background and use the browser or miiverse it's probably multitasking it even works while waiting online for a game of monster hunter i just switch to the browser and watch family guy online switching back every few minutes to look if they are back from the quest The only thing it doesn't do is the game streaming but thats not very special as windows xp already had remote desktop to help someone from another place sounds familiar? you don't need special hardware for that just a good firmware update
FXAA oooooo lol where MSAA 4x the system breaker anti aliasing
What the heck are you trying to explain or convey?
They are using defered render which is incompatible with MSaa So you Have to use a poSt processing efect like Mlaa and fxaa which is Software solution to eleminate or reduce edges
@Hiredhelp Why not? Graphics aren't just about specs.It's about art direction and design.Which most PC games lack, since they tend to just rely on specs alone and make bland games with shiny graphics.
Something tells me you haven't played "most" graphically intensive PC games. Since it shares much of the console'(s) library, are you saying most of their library lacks Art and Direction as well?
i agree with this. console gamers have the best devs and designers pc is not where the money is for games so you not gonna get the best studios and such like you do on the consoles. this is why console games look so good and full of life. there are some cool looking pc games but when you see the gaphics of god of war 3 and uncharteds and such you are like why arent im seeing somethign comparable on the pc. when i see pc games they mostly look like skyrim or fallout with higher res while console games feel like your character can actually interact with the stuff in the world. did you play god of war 3 the intro alone can you feel the life and color and feel of it. the graphics felt real
@DayZ. With respect i never said about spec.... I was nearly getting at KZ is not the best looking game if your wanting to involve PC platform. Yes I've had all kill zones from start the ps2 thankyou.
Whoa...seriously? All I can say is: "damn impressive".
I am kinda confused, I always thought Shadow fall in its previous form was using only 1.5 GB of RAM. Is there new footage or a new reveal that I missed? Serious question here guys. Help a confused brother out.
Devs did think their was only going to be 4GB in the system before Feb 20. So KZ demo taking up 3GB does leave 1GB for the OS.
They're using over 4GB of RAM. If you look at the presentation slides they say they're using 3GB for GPU tasks, 1.5GB for CPU tasks and 128MB for shared functions. So they're using around 4.6GB of RAM. That is more than the rumoured 4GB dev kits would have 'allowed' and means you cannot deduce the system OS.
Yea, saw that after. Thanks.
Lol at the PC fanboys trollingh ahahaha .. come on guys, KILLZONE SHADOW FALL is indeed the most impressive game seen so far.. visually and technologically speaking .. Kilometers of amazing visuals, amazing texture just look at the clothing texture when the enemy comes to kills you after the explosion .. that is as photo realistic as a clothing can get and never seen such a detail in any PC game.. fact! yes they show the game in Alpha stage and some citizens moved weird and did not look as polished as the main characters but I bet it will be polished and if they are not, who cares they are not the main part of the gsmes.. just there for ambient. Don't compare a current gen game running on a high end pc to this PS4 game, you and whoever believe they look better are plain fanboys.. "I have high end pc runing crysis 3" well I have youtube running any game and highest setting and I can tell to I don't need to have the game or a high end pc.. so that argument is useless. I have seen any high end pc game and now that I have seen KILLZONE SHADOW FALL, I'm sorry but they look old gen next to a game like Killzone Shadow Fall.. they the high end crysis or metro do look better than current consoles games except Beyond, sure but not even even to the PS4 games.. don't fool yourself. Do this.. don't touch you PC for a week go watch real life life lol, live the live true life.. enjoy the view and comeback to it and you may be able to see the true. PS4 games do look next gen and this current PC games do not.
YouTube is NOT a valid way of comparison. Look at current in game screenshots of high end PC games then shadow like posted above. While shadow fall does look amazing last light and crysis 3 do look better maxed out. But this is a launch game.
Why is not? The game visuals are been ported in full real time 1080p .. is not like is been showed in low res or compression. Youtube shows the true visuals and I don't need a high end PC to see it.. a fact. And you say a pic it's? Lol so you are going to play a frame? Don't be a fool.. whoever falls for it is a fool. Why don't we pic the pic from the enemy that comes to kill you after the explosion, In where you can see the amazing photo realistic textures of the enemy clothing? And character model.. that picture from killzine you mention is been Photoshop and it looks bad, go watch the actual gameplay pause it there and you will see what I mean, it looks much better.. I call BS on whoever did that pic and a stupid demonstration Is a alpha stage demo running on low virtual technology (example 3rams instead of 8) and not in the final technology .. Many other areas counting the whole city who is kilometers big look way better than that crysis or metro pic.. specially in motion where it meters.
"YouTube is NOT a valid way of comparison" - unless it's a PS4 game. Or did you actually play it?
So I got a bazillion disagrees right after that was shown at the PS4 press conference for saying the game looked about mid-level PC gfx and to expect even better results/visuals by release. Guess I am now justified and proven right by that statement.
lets not go comparing Ps4 to a PC just yet. We dont really know what the Ps4 is capable of so we can't say it can or cant run a better looking game than a high end PC. I know its got some power in it and if an alpha game looked that good and still has 4gb of ram to use, i can only imagine things looking better for not only the release but future games. And devs have said that the PS4 is like a high powered PC so it'll definitely be able to make some damn good looking games. But, just dont compare the two and say 1 can do what the other cant. its silly to compare something we can't prove yet. let the games speak for themselves.
the slides show they used 3GB RAM for video, and 1.5 GB of system RAM (with 500MB+ used by sound alone), assuming 1.5GB is reserved for OS, only 2GB is left http://gimmegimmegames.com/...
Correct - everyone seems to be missing this simple fact. They're using up 4.6GB of RAM. 1.5GB seems excessive for the OS, I think. Especially given the dedicated chips for various functions. I just think it is hilarious that they're using more memory for sound alone than the PS3 had in total!
For you guys that don't know about FXAA; It's a new technology developed by nvidia and it stands for "Fast Approximate Anti Aliasing". Instead of using the video ram for the anti aliasing, the gpu uses its stream processors (Cuda cores for nvidia and stream processors for AMD graphics cards) to do all the processing power and create a "fake anti aliasing effect" that makes the lines less jagged and so it can deliver better looking visuals if done right. Some games can become slightly blurry with fxaa.
From what I've seen in the replies...the both sides (PC and console fans)are still stuck with the old console efficiency vs PC raw power debate. Yes, console games are designed to a specified limitation hence the notion of efficiency while PC versions are horrible mess of inefficiency. BUT, wait! Next consoles are designed with a PC architecture. That would mean any console game that is efficiently designed for the platform would also be efficiently compatible with PCs. This would be great for owners of PCs/laptops that are on par to the PS4's specs (I doubt that AMD would let such tech-a motherboard with GDDR5 slots as system ram-get stuck exclusively on consoles and let it's rivals churn out better versions/alternatives for the PC crowd). I see that some said the Titan card is powerful or that the PC is capable but they are not fully utilized. True but then I see they praised that next gen consoles will fully utilized those capabilities...so what about the PCs that already have those stuff? You know...graphics cards that are NOT Titans. Wouldn't it be strange that if game dev who now can use those unused tech for next gen console still doesn't know how to apply them for the PC even though they exist in almost every PC in the world for years and with the consoles having the same architecture as the PC?
Good to see it taking advantage of RAM. Most games use no more than 2gb. So anything over 4gb of RAM for something used for strictly gaming is overkill and a waste imo. So many people waste their money on getting 16gb and 32gb of RAM when it doesn't affect gaming performance at all.
PC minimum amount of ram is 8gb now 4gb just does not cut it anymore.
@Linwelin You have no idea what you're talking about.
I'm a PC gamer myself and I have a pretty decent PC, I've maxed out Crysis 3 and maxing out Metro Last Light right now, and I can tell you that none of them looks better than Killzone Shadow Fall. They're impressive but they're just half-nextgen games, sure they look better than most of the current gen games but they're not totally nextgen either and you can spot that when you play them. Shadowfall's helicopter chase scene is still unmatched, Deep Down still looks better than anything out there, Infamous Second son still looks like the Samatrian Tech Demo. You can't really compare current (or cross-gen) games with nextgen-only games. You'll be seeing the difference easily once more next-gen exclusive games are announced. Have you seen the new Primal Carnage: Genesis screenshots? That's a nextgen-only game, which is one of the first games utilizing UE4 for the next-gen consoles, and even that game although not being a blockbuster title looks better than anything current gen (or cross-gen) games have to offer: http://goo.gl/z82nm So yeah... Crysis or Metro doesn't look better than next-gen games.
8 gigs of regular ram and 2 gigs vram will get you maxing the latest bleeding edge games. So I imagine the ps4 will come close to mainstream gaming pc standards of today, which I must say is pretty damn nice. Im going to hold out for a bunch of exclusives for ps4, and continue my exclusives and multiplatform games on pc. at hiredhelp down below. The higher end pc games use about 2 gigs regular ram, and 1-2 gigs vram depending on resolution. At extreme resolutions you can even be looking at 3-4 gigs vram if available. The ps4 brings consoles to where pc is right now, its about time.
The graphics do look great but i hope Guerilla games don't get to fixated on it like Crytek. As amazing as the game looks i really hope they focus on improving the story, characters, gameplay and gamemodes. I just hope that they don't do a repeat of what happened with KZ3.
3gb ram thats huge considering majoraty of PC games take about 2gb witch makes me excited knowing next gen PC games be using more memory bigger games.
Yes but you forget that Next generation consoles will bring a new level of gaming. So pc will increase the standard memory used from 2 GB to 3-6 GB each game. Don't forget that they will provide better ram such as DDR4 and GDDR5 for the pc after few years. It's good news for pc gamers for at least 2 years from now :). All gonna be happy ^^ . Only ignorants will complain. There is no limitation for longer time then this generation. Because sony learned their mistake. However let's hope MS don't hold the ps4 and pc.
Killzone Shadow Fall is in development at the studio which is just a few miles away from my house.. no one cares eh?
Same here dude! Herengracht in amsterdam. I see their office everytime I go to work. They have this Helghast statue in front of the window staring at me everytime im on my bicycle to work (Yes! We dutchies ride bicycles). Maybe some day ill break a window and collect as many Killzone shadow fall data as I can.
Pix??:P Big fan of the Higs i look at them like sort of Space Nazis >_<.
Their studio is like 150km from my house haha
for me more like 30 i live in Almere
But if they was pretty much maxing the GPU it doesn't really matter how much surplus ram there was.
Finally someone who understands that having an extra 5GB of RAM to play with doesn't mean the game will look better. The GPU can only render so many things on the screen at one time. The extra RAM is in the PS4 to make developing on it easier, decrease load times, and allow more things to be "open" in the background.
It still seems a lot of people don't know that or don't care and just think more RAM means better gfx this is stupidity on a whole other level . Maybe they'll understand if i say it like this RAM has nothing to do with processing power it's used for temporary saving textures and objects you see in game for fast loading the more you have the less time it takes to load certain areas and if the game is small enough they can almost negate the load times
...The KillZone demo used 1.5GB VRAM. The total was indeed 3GB. Lord knows what it is now :)
If the 3GB include the OS then it's only 2GB used on the game.. I don't know. Someone explain if i'm wrong..
Around 5 GB for KZ:SF; probably around 6 GB of total system memory when you include OS features and stuff. ~1,600 MB for CPU jobs. ~128 MB of shared memory. ~3,100 MB for GPU.
I don't think Sony would let each developer use all of the GB right away would they?
What? You seriously thing Sony's going to introduce artificial limitations on their developers?
You could look at it this way but there are other ways to look at it. Don't think so because the better the games look and play the better reputation. Most people don't know about the amount of ram the ps3 have. So why would they care how much ram the games use. Even if launch games used all the ram doesn't mean developers can't bring better art and gameplay.
Killzone is going to rock the gaming world. Good luck may 21st Microsoft.
Cool, hope it plays well to
PC gamers should get excited for next gen consoles. Finally, devs will stop making scalable game engines to please the console gamers. The new consoles will be capable of performing at a PC level, meaning PC games will finally get to utilize its true potential.
Nice can't wait to see what developers do down the road. Also I don't agree with the comment best looking game on consoles and PC when you can buy a expensive as rig and games will look stunning but for the price range of 400-500 I say it's on par if not better than a PC of same price PC gamers always say oh my expensive PC can make this game 10 times better when at 5 times the cost yes. But if you want to do real comparison than lets compare a $500 PC to ps4/ next Xbox and than lets compare It's unfair to comparing a $1200 PC with a $450-500 console BTW: my PC just went out lol now need to buy a new one price range $500-600 any suggestions specs wise?
:O I don't think any 1st or 2nd party devs have ever used that much ram to date for a game even on PC. I know GG is going to blow sh*t apart at E3 with the visuals and what they showed off at the Feb event will be nothing compared to E3.
I think the main reason for 8gb is that Sony wants devs to bring back the couch co-op, without the need to degrading the graphical fidelity, when the player count increases... Imagine being able to play this very game with four players on one console for single player co-op or even online against other people with visuals that are the EXACT same quality as it would be if it were played with one player... And without the side bars, that fill up the rest of the screen, that I personally hate seeing especially on HD tv...
Uncharted 3's split srceen multiplayer laid waste to a lot of space. lol Warhawk did it right and gave you options.
LOL. 8-3= 5.
I think it uses 3gbs of the RAM because of the design of the APU architecture. Since the GPU and CPU are writing to the same memory more is pushed to the RAM where they can both use it as opposed to leaving things in the L1 or L2 for the CPU. I think it's something that will make the hardware better and better as devs get used to it.
You're on the right on this.
Why do pc gamers feel the need to constantly go on about how much more powerful there pc is? for one we dont care, for two i think half of its jealously because consoles have better games. Ive never heard a pc gamer boasting about how great the gameplay is on pc, just the gfx. bored of heaqring it!
the same way people always taking underpowered this an many rams of that......basically the ranks of gaming.. mobile<handheld<console. <pc..(in terms of power.) and if anybody thinks the ps4 can outperform a hi performance gaming pc... theyve got problems..