GC - "Sony has released its financial results for fiscal year 2012 today as expected and they’ve made a profit."
First profit in five years. Back in black! Things will only go up from here.
And just made a profit in the games division despite a console launch coming. That's quite a feat.
good news.. PS3 continues to sell and as the articlesays it will cover some of PS4 expenses. E3 will be awesome this year cause Sony are happy :) Jack Tretton will be on fire!
Great new keep it up Sony, you had fallen but now it's all about the rise from here As your loyal fans we are here, please don't be arrogant again like you were at launch with ps3. Be humble and give us great content and verity which you are known for
@mynd, I think they made a profit a while ago. I remember seeing in the previous or the one before the previous that most of the profits in the division went to R&D. I think the cost of research for the PS4 is complete, now sony needs to worry about the development of the system from here out.
Since PS2 was discontinued Jan 4, '13, FY13 10mill sales are all PS3? https://en.wikipedia.org/wi...
I believe both the PS1 and PS2 made profits as their successors were announced and launched as well.
So that means for this gen. #1 PS3 #2 Wii #3 360 PS3 still selling for the coming 3 years. So its obvious easy selling over 90 million . Wii hardware is really to outdated to sell 1 year more. 360 is already so cheap it can not be sell for $50 so I gues it will be discontinued once the next box come out.
@SHORYUKEN Seriously? you think the PS3 is going to outsell the Wii this gen? I don't think there's any chance of that. Also, even if it did, the PS3 will never earn Sony a profit on the level the Wii achieved for Nintendo. There is already a clear winner this Gen and it's Nintendo. In terms of Sales and Profits, they have demolished both Sony and MS this gen As for the 360, it will likely stay in production for some time after the next xbox system launches. Especially in America where it has nearly a 15 million unit lead on the PS3 and is only about 2 million units behind the wii. I don't agree that the PS3 will "obviously sell over 90 million". in 7 months a new console will be released and the PS3 will become obsolete. (as will the xbox) at that point this Gen will be practically over.(even if the PS3/360 are still on store shelves) Selling 20+ million more consoles will be possible, but with the forward momentum of the 360 and Wii, (even if the wii is not moving at top speed) I doubt positions are going to shift to a great degree before this Gen is completely over. But like you, I'm only offering speculation here.
PS3 Unit Sales (Unit: Million) Code: HW (Ap-Jn) (Jl-Sp) (Oc-Dc) (Ja-Mr) FY LTD FY06 - - (1.7) (1.8) 3.5 3.5 FY07 (0.7) (1.3) (4.9) (2.2) 9.1 12.6 FY08 (1.6) (2.4) (4.5) (1.6) 10.1 22.7 FY09 (1.1) (3.2) (6.5) (2.2) 13.0 35.7 FY10 (2.4) (3.5) (6.3) (2.1) 14.3 50.0 FY11 (1.8) (3.7) (6.5) (1.9) 13.9 63.9 FY12 2.8-PS2 3.5-PS2 6.8-PS2 3.4-PS2 16.5-PS2 80.4 - FY12 PS2 ----------------------------- ------------------ Since people are now skeptical of PS3's hardware numbers. If you look @ Sony Q3 reports each year since 2009, you'll the trend of at least 6 million. Sony ps3 has been selling that since 2009 well before the infamous +ps2. http://www.scei.co.jp/corpo... You'll see that from NOv 16 '06 - Mar 31'12 PS3 sold 63.9 million. Now add Sony Q1,Q2,Q3 (Apr 1st 2012 - December 31st, 2012) 63.9 + Q1(2.8) = 66.7 66.7 + Q2(3.5) = 70.2 70.2 + Q3(6.8) = 77.0 million at the end of 2012 IDC reported this Jan. 8th 2013 http://www.gamesindustry.bi... Quote: "The report also highlights that just this past December, Sony's PS3 managed to surpass the number of Xbox 360s shipped worldwide (about 77 million vs. 76 million), despite the PS3 launching a year later." 77.0 + Q4(3.4) = 80.4 million ps3's sold. I did everything for you. Like I said ps2 are not added to the equation. Who are you going to believe? IDC (multi- million dollar analyst firm) or some xbox guy refusing to accept reality.
PS3+PS2 = 80m how many PS2 Consoles are sold? guess alot, still can't beat X360 Good to know gaming is doing good even IF it's seems like the majority wants a world dominated smartphones...
@Muerte2494 Sorry, I didn't mean to say "I don't agree that the PS3 will "obviously sell over 90 million". Not sure what I was thinking there. I DO agree that it can achieve 90 million, But I DON'T think it can outsell the Wii before this gen is over. Not with the Wii still selling, even if it's not selling gangbusters, it still is inexpensive and has forward momentum. 80.4 million ps3's have not sold. That's how many have shipped. Shipped and sold are not the same thing. Shipped = the number of consoles that have been put on retail shelves. That number counts millions of units on store shelves currently around the world. Shipping numbers just don't count. Assuming that because Sony has sold an average of 6 million units a year since 2009 that those are then numbers they're selling this year and for the next two years is silly. So I'm not really going to talk on that. But I will say this, the PS3 is not the PS1 or PS2. it will not continue to sell like those two did after their successors were launched. Especially without a proper price drop At this point in their lifespans, the PS1 was $99 and the PS2 was 129.99 (after 7 years on the market respectively) The PS3 is still $250 and to top that off, I don't see Sony continuing support for another 2 years after PS4 launches. But I guess only time will tell. Like i said, I'm just speculating.
Profit isn't from business improving, but mostly due to valuable property sale during a bad economy. "The company has made $458 million in net income for FY 12 mainly due to sales of assets." Sony sold buildings worth billions and that is reported as income. You want to look for signs the business itself is improving, such as lowered manufacturing costs and higher sales and not taking money out of your piggybank, but even that isn't good because the money couldnhave been worth a lot more. Basically it isn't good to sell you buildings in a down market, because you have to raise cash to save the company especially when you likely can get more for the building later and you turned an asset into a higher expense because you have to lease the building back. In short, this is actually negative news. Also this could be to general decline, but could be due to devaluing software and cannabilizing sale due to PS+: "Sony shifted slightly less software this fiscal year compared to the last one..." Typically you should have increased software sales due to enlarged user base, but there could be other factors.
They basically sold their building yet are still using the building or something KAZ has started to do a lot right, he is reaching down to people below his position for ideas and is more open as the head of Sony. Playstation brand has been a success for a while, they don't loose money because of gaming or movie division, it's their TV sales which brings everything down Also I think they have 10 or 20 plus billion I think in cash but I could be wrong, I think that's the number patcher provided few months back Also Sony was and in some aspect still struggling due to yen to dollar exchange rate But to say Sony hasn't improved in last 6 months is just flat out untrue, are they totally out of red or he'll no, but when you in in that deep of losing money it takes some long term planning and vision to come out of that and I believe KAZ is the right man for the job
From a business standpoint you're totally correct. But Sony needs that money to finance the R&D, the production and the marketing costs for the PS4.
Property is not a down market right now, selling their New York office made them a lot of money. Sony aren't on the property business, so it's not an important part of their portfolio. Sony stock is at a 52 week high right now. I've not bought into it because I think their TV division is still a crock of shit, and that their phones/tablets still won't compete with Samsung. But these recent results are a positive.
They sold all their buildings at a pretty big profit. Ofcourse software sales are down genius, 2012 was a terrible year for gaming and Sony had a B line up, 2013 is gonna be a whole lot better. You always look for the negatives in any Sony related article. Funny how you never do that with Microsoft articles. Microsoft and Nintendo fanboys are out on a rampage anyone who says something positive gets disagrees.
Leave it to you to spin a good news into a bad one
A 360 fanboy spinning good news about Sony into bad? I am in total shock as this individual has never done that before. /s The title of the article is about sales of consoles, who the hell cares about buildings. Way to go Sony.
"As part of the restructuring process, the firm has sold key assets over the past few months, including its US headquarters in New York and some of its shares in M3, a medical research and marketing firm. The firm has also offloaded its "Sony City Osaki" building in Tokyo. Sony said the sale of all these assets had resulted in gains of nearly $2.5bn during the last financial year - and the figure contributed to the rise in its earnings during the period. Analysts said that given the impact these sales have had on its profit - the numbers were not a true reflection of the firm's success. Gerhard Fasol of Eurotechnology Japan said that these gains "really need to be subtracted from the results, to understand the regular operating results. Mr Fasol pointed out that the firm's results indicated that its electronics division continued to struggle and that the unit had not been turned around yet" Well after selling all those assets I would expect Sony to see a profit -_-
Only in nukeitall's anti-Sony fantasy world could making sound real estate transactions that make the company hundreds of millions of dollars be skewed as a bad thing. I suppose you're also still in denial with the PS3 sailing past the 360's total months ago. (Edit: I just noticed your post below where you're doing exactly that! Priceless!) It's clear to everyone but the anti-Sony zealots that Sony's restructuring efforts are slowing bearing fruit. Everyone out there knew it would be a long road for Sony but it's nice to see continued positive news out of the company. Sony still has a long way to go to turn around it's core, television devision but it's expected Sony will profit this fiscal year by 50 billion yen (without any big real estate transactions on the horizon). You've got to wonder how guys like nukeitall and DiRtY are going to spin that negatively. It's always entertaining to see what they'll dream up next. By the way, to those mentioning it, Sony isn't having a problem with capital. They've been sitting on the largest cash position the company has had in almost 20 years for some time now. When you look at the debt on Sony's books, you have to realize that Sony runs a financial business, and like any financial business the way they operate is by issuing debt instruments. Hell, every single dollar on deposit with Sony bank counts in the "debt" column so as their financial business grows, so does the amount considered as liabilities on paper. Have a look at the debt on the books of any bank and you'll see why you can't compare Sony's debt structure to a company that doesn't operate financial institutions as Sony does.
No surprise at all. The man can't say anything positive about Sony. If you guys are looking for him to say something positive. You best be looking when he is talking about Microsoft. ---***"Sony sold buildings worth billions and that is reported as income. You want to look for signs the business itself is improving"***--- Agreed, but ever thought of the fact that they can now use the profit they gained from asset to help improve business? I'm sure that is Sony's reasoning, but I guess that's a bad thing according to you, not like Sony can do any good in your eyes anyway considering your blind hate toward the company. Sony has obviously been trying to gain a profit for the past couple years and obviously have failed to do so, so a different approach was needed. Selling their building gained the profit they've been seeking for years now, so now this should help start their plans, the plan obviously being to improve business and make profit long term. ---***"especially when you likely can get more for the building later"***--- They need money now. They've been waiting for "later" for several years now. ---***"and you turned an asset into a higher expense because you have to lease the building back."***--- You think they would do that if that was indeed the case. They plan and calculate their decisions before making them you know. ---***"In short, this is actually negative news."***--- It's actually good news, considering good news for Sony is bad news for you and vice versa. ---***"Also this could be to general decline, but could be due to devaluing software and cannabilizing sale due to PS+: "Sony shifted slightly less software this fiscal year compared to the last one..." Typically you should have increased software sales due to enlarged user base, but there could be other factors."***--- I doubt PS+ has anymore of an effect on software sales than passes have on used game sales. Post the full quote please. The drop off isn't large: ---***"Sony shifted slightly less software this fiscal year compared to the last one but the drop isn’t that big which shows that consumers are still buying a lot of PS3 games and it’s still a viable platform."***--- You obviously didn't post the full quote because it wouldn't push your negative Sony agenda. Typical nukeitall.
Tokyo and NY buildings sold for about 2.3 billion. But Sony also acquired Gaikai and EMI Publishing within the same fiscal year which together cost over 2.5 billion. (Among other acquisitions) Sony are still profiting.
Pretty sure this guy is trolling here. Not because this information is false, but because it's information that is brought up EVERY time someone posts an article claiming Sony is making a profit. Apparently Sony has been selling off assets steadily for the past year. The same reason is because Sony is cutting fat. They're simply restoring balance. They COULD have been making a profit all this time if they adjusted their assets YEARS ago when they started losing money, and the industry (world) was showing signs of economic problems. This is simply a "late to the party" situation, and not a cop out. It doesn't mean the only reason they're making money is by selling assets.
The downside - Sony hasn't turned a profit in five years. The upside - Sony just turned a profit for the first time in five years. Verdict - Sony sucks at making money.
Per the news piece Sony real estate turned the profit.
Tell that to the phat cat CEO's flying over your house and looking down at you laughing..
you can look at it like this ( using your logic) Sony made profit for 70 years Sony lost profit for 5 years Sony recently made profit. Sony is Great at making money .
Do people read the entire article? If anyone knows about them as a company... THE LAST LINE SAYS WHY THE PROFIT. they sold off assets. One of the biggest land/building sales ever. And yes, I own stock. I stated this about a year ago. There is signs of looking up, but the profit is not what it seems to be.
"And yes, I own stock." So?
OT You know its funny the hypocrisy of fanboys and the internet, but has anyone read some of the comments on that site? Pure anti-Sony hating fanboys. But according to non-Sony fanboys, only Sony fanboys are fanboys. And only N4G is full of fanboys (cuz the internet believes it to be a Sony fanboy haven). But other sites arent fanboy infested. Damn i hate fanboys
a lot of hate on Sony. All gamers should be glad that the Playstation brand existed and without Sony there wouldnt be great games out there..MS have no new ip games through out the gen..Im glad the PS3 outsold the xbox360 we know it was coming..Sony won the war..
It's disappointing that they are combining PS3/PS2 sales but if the PS2 shipped less than 3 million, the PS3 should have overtaken the 360 worldwide.
Agreed, but I doubt PS2 did anymore than 1 million...
So *officially* we don't actually know if the PS3 surpassed the Xbox 360. Since Sony is combining numbers they are blatantly trying to hide it. I know Sony recently entered PS2 into markets that can't afford PS3's.
"So *officially* we don't actually know if the PS3 surpassed the Xbox 360. Since Sony is combining numbers they are blatantly trying to hide it. " By "WE" you're of course talking about yourself here. I know for sure MS counted refurbished and RROD'd numbers in their total, and no one said sh!t about that.
"I know for sure"... Are you an employee of MS? A finacial analyst with access to their sales figures? Lol...too funny, I am constantly amazed at the amount of experts on N4G. On point, regardless of how it got there I for one am happy to see Sony having positive financial news.
They combined numbers to hide Vita numbers. It would have looked suspicious if they only combined handhelds. A man thought everyone knew this already? A man doesn't see why they would need to hide anything as far as he's concerned Sony is getting a sale no matter what the split. A man also doesn't see PS2 doing 3 million out of nowhere so of course they've passed 360. VGC needs to update PS3 numbers.
No, we don't know who has sold more between the two between the PS2 combining and people who bought new 360s when theirs RROD. But more importantly than not knowing we should not care who sold more. Seriously, everyone who tries to defend numbers either way, get a life.
as some kind of excuse for some time now. Sony can't monitor PS2 sales because they don't ship PS2 anymore. They track they numbers based on how many units they ship. So if it says 80.4 million, then it's completely ps3. Since we all know ps2 is no longer in production. No matter how much you try to spin it. it's still 80.4 million ps3 77.2 million xbox360 Lead is 3.2 million now.
Folks there is a difference between "Shipped" and "Sold" Yes, they have shipped 80.4 million units. and yes, some of those are PS2 consoles. Sure, they have stopped producing the PS2, but they are still shipping them. or is someone here silly enough to think that when they stopped making them, that they emptied out their warehouses and washed their hands of the most profitable and best selling game console of all time instead of keeping a backstock to continue to profit from? Where do you think stores get new PS2 consoles from? LOL Also, since we're talking about units shipped here, you have to recognize how many of those are on store shelves around the world. (same with MS.) They could ship a million more if they wanted and bring that total up to 81.4, but that's not an installed base and those consoles have not turned a profit yet. They do not count. It's sales that matter, Not units shipped. Lastly, keep in mind, when sold, the exact number of PS3 units sold can be calculated. Sales figures are a lot more specific than shipping numbers. In fact, One company can ship more than another and still sell less overall. So please stop getting all excited about shipping numbers, Stop being fanboys, and just enjoy your game systems.
PS3 overtook the 360 in September.
Ps3 hasn't passed 360 yet. Ps3 was at 63.9 million last year they would have needed to sell 13.3 million this year to tie 360 http://www.neogaf.com/forum... Last year ps3 moved 13.9 million and ps2 4.1 million making the 18 million. Unless ps2 dived in sales again ps3 is still behind Sony best year was 14.3 million in 2010/2011 If they would have passed them they would have said 63.9 + 16.5 = 80.4 so no ps3 isnt at 80.4
@DragonKnight Please provide your facts. I would like to know where you got this information. http://news.cnet.com/8301-1... November 16, 2012 Sony announces they pass the 70 million milestone. http://ca.ign.com/articles/... October 19, 2012 Microsoft announce they pass the 70 million milestone. If you don't like Microsoft that's fine. If you don't care about the Xbox 360 that's fine too, but please don't post false information unless you have data to back it up with. There's enough console war fighting going on here, we don't need misleading posts to further that. As of Jan. 18, 2013 Microsoft has sold 75.9 million. Their Q2 release date is actually Jan. 18, 2013. Q3 is April 18 and Q4 is July 18. http://www.microsoft.com/in... After all the arguing and after all the bickering back and forth between Xbox 360 and PS3 fans what did it actually amount to? Not much.
The PS3 overtook the 360 almost 6 months ago when it hit 77m. The 360 was only at 75m.
If they didn't do it today they'll do it next month, or in a few, or they did it already, who knows tbh.
Remember Sony stopped producing PS2's last year. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/t... Numbers would easily be under 1 million.
From your linked article "Sony has yet to say whether it will stop production for other territories as well." I think they still sell the PS2 in some parts of the world. Mostly Southeast Asia, the Middle East, South America. Sony officially started to sell the PS2 in Brazil, it had been a gray market import previously, in November 2009. While those markets could be under 1 million, they could also be above it. Edit: Just looked at a link posted below, and Sony did indeed confirm that they stopped global production. Strange that they stopped when they could continue selling a few more million each year in countries that can't afford the PS3. Maybe with PS4 a PS3 will price drop to a affordable world wide price?
"PS2 shipped less than 3 million, the PS3 should have overtaken the 360 worldwide." remember that IDC report that many on here said was bogus? well they stated their number's for sony's 3rd Q: 2012 was 6.8 and guess what, it was 6.8 million, because for the past 3 years straight look at ps3 shipments: look at 2009 to 2011 Q: 3rd 6.3 million and higher http://www.scei.co.jp/corpo... upto early 2012 the PS3 was seperate, but do people really think the PS3 shipments would have declined that drastic in that sales Q: ? by those shipment number, sony in all likely hood has over taken the xbox360 world wide. as a matter of fact the shipments for ps3+ps2 = 6.8 million so what is the likely outcome of the break down? using the past three years as a guage?
FY 12? This is the wrong Report, we need FY 13 ...
Fy 12 just ended.
Man we're not even half way into 2013 yet lol.
It's not a FIFA game.
PS2 is out of reach for the DS the king stays on its throne. Kaz will turn Sony around just like he did for the PS3 when Ken messed up. @Dj7 So it proves it has more legs then the DS and also better software sales. The fact it stayed relevant for 10 years still selling 4.1 million units a year is never done before the DS sells 2.35 million and would be happy if it remains like that.
DS sold over 154m that 4 years less than PS2 since PS22 came out in 2000 and DS in 2004.
and now it's lost relevance and has dropped off faster. PS2 sold more because it kept selling longer. DS has already become an afterthought while PS2 just kept beasting for over a decade.
@Jaqen_Hghar a man thought getting to the top faster meant it was better. A man sees this as an accomplishment for Nintendo. Sorry, couldn't help myself. Still the DS should be commended for topping "The King" of consoles. I still love my PS2, hell it's still hooked up to my tv, but it is no reason to downplay what the DS did.
Are you guys serious?
something smells fishy
Still won't give Vita numbers separately? lol
The total number is pointless when you include PS2 shipments. Sony has benn mixing PS2 and PS3 up for some time now. It gets impossible to get an idea how much PS2s or PS3s are shipped. PSP / PS Vita forecast is 5 million for the entire year. combined. That means Sony did already give it up.
You boys are desperate to spin the FACTS eh? Before Sony combine the PS2 and PS3 numbers, the PS2 was selling less than a million units a year worldwide. Which is why it has been discontinued and bundled with the PS3's shipment numbers to start with. Of course there's a little bitterness in the winds now that we have factual evidence that the Xbox 360 is dead last, as many others have predicted this entire generation. I guess some of you will have to "Deal with It". Goodnight and enjoy the news boys
I think you're the one trying to spin the facts. "The company has made $458 million in net income for FY 12 mainly due to sales of assets." Did this part of the article just fly over your head?
Did you just say factual evidence? Seems a little redundant...Just saying. Both companies have slightly skewed for different reasons. Personally I believe that the one that sold the most was...who the f*ck cares, these are numbers that have no effect on any of us. Have fun arguing who is in second place, the Wii already won and the minute they stop production on it the gen is over sales competition wise.
IF you still think sales don't matter to gamers then you should talk to the Wii U crowd. They are getting hardly any support come next gen. The excuses have ranged from: "It's not a next gen system" to "Wii U user base is too small". http://pixelenemy.com/just-... This is why sales matter. It determines whether a developers brings their title to your platform. It also means if your install base is huge, a company (Microsoft) would have pay enough to cover for having the exclusive. OFF topic: Little food for thought for you guys defending xbox360. IDC firm said at the end of 2012 that xbox360 has sold 76 million and ps3 77 million. http://www.gamesindustry.bi... Microsoft confirmed that Xbox360 indeed sold 75.9 million at the end of 2012 http://www.gamespot.com/new... Ps3 reports 77 million sold http://gamer.blorge.com/201... "Sony reports that 6.8 million (PS3+PS2s) have been sold during the quarter putting the lifetime PS3 sales to around 77 million, in line with IDC’s estimate earlier last month. PS3 sales continue to surpass Microsoft’s Xbox 360 sales, which is around 75.9 million as reported last month, but still behind Nintendo Wii’s 99 million." Why would IDC make such an accurate prediction using inflated ps3 numbers? But they numbers for xbox360 were dead on. No matter how us slice it, Math doesn't lie. 80.4 million ps3's over 77.2 million xbox360s. VGchartz has sold to retail off by 2 million for xbox360, but 6 million for ps3.
The price drop in Japan was a proven success and Sony has yet to drop the price in the west which will also inevitable improve sales. Why would Sony give up on the Vita at this point?